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EVE Online service restored after unexpected downtime

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 16 post(s)
Selena Rayne Minmatar Obsidian Conclave	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:21:00 - [121] A Dev got hit with a keylogger and they used his account to change item spawns to get over 6k officer mods? Is this true or one of the many rumors going around atm? How the hell does a dev get hit with a keylogger in the first place if this is true Pretty scary...
Basileus	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:22:00 - [122] OK, ** happens I suppose (allthough a philosopher of sorts once said ** takes effort). Hope the lesson is indeed learnt and the website will run more independantly from the game.
Sentinel Eeex Caldari DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:23:00 - [123] Originally by: Razer Morphis Edited by: Razer Morphis on 20/10/2007 00:05:50 2 cents from someone working in security: Security breaches are best taken care of... when they are non-existent. It appears you should focus on more security before **it happens, instead of damage control for the brown nosed. You must be a CISSP certified door guard, with such a great amount of knowledge. Ever worked for a really really big company, with your logic? Thought so. CCP did the right thing, glad to know at least they actually monitor things.
Sharupak Minmatar Knights Of the Black Sun Rule of Three	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:25:00 - [124] Edited by: Sharupak on 20/10/2007 00:26:30 Edited by: Sharupak on 20/10/2007 00:26:01 Originally by: CCP Spielmann At 10:25 GMT today we discovered an anomaly in the EVE Online Database indicating a potential exploit. Our policy in such cases is to mobilize a taskforce of internal and external experts to evaluate the situation. At 12:57 that group concluded that our best course of action was to go completely dark while an exhaustive scan of our entire infrastructure was executed. What we discovered was an indication that one of our databases was being accessed through a security breach. While some may feel that such a drastic reaction was not warranted, it is always our approach to err on the side of caution in order to protect the players. We of course understand the effect and disruption this has had for our players and apologize for not having been able to explain to the community what was going on. In these cases it can often be counterproductive to containment to give out information while we are in the process of evaluating the scope of the problem. Our taskforce quickly found the security breach and prevented that from being used. We subsequently found three cases of database actions being performed through the security breach but none of those affected other users than the one doing the actions. We can also confirm that no personal details such as usersÆ credentials or credit card numbers were exposed through this incident. We had to save BOB from losing another Titan. The servers were brought back online at 22:00 GMT and we will of course continue to monitor the situation closely over the weekend and the following week. Again we sincerely apologize for this disruption. Regards, -J=n H÷r=dal Chief Operating Officer, CCP I KNEW IT! j/k Thanks for the quick actions to save our accounts from being hacked. _______________________________________________ RuntimeError: ChainEvent is blocking by design, but you're block trapped. You have'll have to find some alternative means to do Your Thing, dude.
K Kinnison Gallente Galactic Patrol Industries	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:26:00 - [125] Originally by: CCP Wrangler #eve-chaos, #eve and #eve-radio. We also set up a special channel called #eve-announce where people could be sure that what was said was the official news and no rumors. OK... took me a while to google and figure out that's on irc.coldfront.net, but thanks!! K K.
Juniper	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:30:00 - [126] Originally by: Phantom Slave I'm very happy the server is back up, I'm even in doing missions and stuff. For those people complaining about not getting information, we're paying customers too, and I'm not sure if you noticed but in the EULA it says that there's no guarantee the servers are going to be up 23/7 (scheduled downtime excluded). Deal with it. The rest of us have. For those that lost skill points, that sucks horribly, and really proves that there needs to be some type of skill queue to ensure that problems like this don't happen again. Unless of course, your second skill finishes during an unexpected downtime, but at least it wasn't totally wasted. And those that are complaining about the entire server being shut down because of a security breach, you're kidding right? Somebody broke into the database and possibly changed some stuff (not sure if there was stuff changed or not). 'Hotfix it!' I hear you say, and my answer is NO! Shutting down the server was the best damn thing they could have done. Why? Because there was a security breach, and they didn't know how far it had spread. Luckily they caught it and it was just in the server database. It could have spread to billing, or who knows where else. Would you really want the servers to stay online while somebody was peeping through your credit card info, just so you can play a little longer? Hell no. /end rant I'd agree with this except the issue of letting customers know when something like this is happening. Taking the game down to prevent further damage is one thing. Going completely radio silent for 6+ hours is something else entirely. Wrangler says that there are plans in place to seperate the forums from the game servers. Sorry, but we've been hearing that for years now and nothing ever gets done. I doubt it very much that it ever will, without a complete re-write of the myeve site. Which means never, in reality. There are thousands of hosting sites available CCP. Just pick one. IRC, bless its ancient little cotton socks, is not an acceptable alternative to getting information out there to the masses. ... I just make things.
Kirjava Lothian Quay Industries Zzz	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:30:00 - [127] Originally by: Selena Rayne A Dev got hit with a keylogger and they used his account to change item spawns to get over 6k officer mods? Is this true or one of the many rumors going around atm? How the hell does a dev get hit with a keylogger in the first place if this is true Pretty scary... Keyloggers can happen to ANYONE. Dev does not mean invulnerable - many people have lost eve accounts to keyloggers ripping away isk/assets and throwing charecters on ebay. Let's be glad they didnt decide to do anything major.... Originally by: CCP Morpheus Post with your alt.
Gragnor Ordos Humanitas	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:30:00 - [128] Originally by: Matthew When you're dealing with a security breach on your business-critical systems, you shut it down, and you don't bring any part back up until you're sure you know that bit is safe. Customer communication comes a distant second to protecting critical systems. I agree and disagree with this statement! This was a business interruption. Taking down the servers was a simple function of isolating the damage so it could be repaired. I have no problems whatsoever with that because once security has been breached, you are in agony no matter which way you turn. But communication was not the best. The loss of the forums prevented CCP from broadcasting what had happened and that has to be thought about as it is not acceptable to drop all communication with your clients when a disaster strikes as it just feeds the rumours. The comment that customers come second in these circumstances is simply wrong. I mean, I pay CCP's wages, so be nice to me or I won't do it any more. If anything, this incident shows the strength of the forums for communicating with the eve client base. Maybe that is a thought for CCP, can we put the forums on a separate server so an incident like this can be isolated and we maintain the ability to communicate quickly with clients. Personally, I would rather CCP erred on the side of caution when these things happen as its much simpler to apologise for a loss of service than explain how credit card details got compromised; then CCP are in REAL trouble as their corporate revenue base will be shredded.
Carsidava Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:32:00 - [129] Originally by: elider Originally by: Ratzap While not impossible that someone outside broke in, most breaches tend to be inside jobs or social engineering attacks on inside people. Someone coming in entirely cold is not the most likely scenario but can always happen (given enough time and determination). It'll be interesting to see if there's any follow up posts explaining more clearly what/how (doubt it but meh, curious). Ratzap As linked by anothere post on this thread: Jesus God stop posting the stupid "leaked" Sharkbait IRC. It's fake.
Minerva Vulcan Caldari The Nexus Foundation	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:34:00 - [130] I don't think anyone will be canceling their accounts over a few hours of lack of communication. You're just whining. You get what you pay for.

Harkwyth Mist Caldari The Black Ops	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:35:00 - [131] Originally by: Madelchai I don't know why people think they're entitled to constant up to the minute responses. . . Having them update you every 15 minutes isn't going to help get it fixed, or make the problem(s) and less severe. I dont expect an update every 15 minutes. however i DO expect to be told there is a problem and that it being worked on. When there are problems with a flight i've booked, i can quickly and easily find out there is a 2-6 hour delay before boarding. When there are problems with a train i have a ticket for, i can quickly and easily find out the train is running several minutes/hours late. Spot the difference with todays events ... I am not complaining about the servers being down, or about losing training time (because i didnt), but i do have a complaint with the total breakdown of communication from CCP regarding the matter, and in todays multimedia based society i feel that this is totally unnacceptable from a technology orientated company.
dedica allestremita	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:36:00 - [132] yay i got my skill changed!, I rang up my mum who was at home... hmm reminder try to get someone who at least knows how to turn on a computer. I asked her to turn the computer on and she asked how she did that! oh well bout 30min later i finally got a skill training again! so its not too bad only lost 3 hours of skill time.. cant complain really. But yah try explaining to someone over the phone how to change a skill ... its really not fun!
dedica allestremita	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:40:00 - [133] Quick question but is it just me? i cant see my own charactar face.. i just get an explanation mark... can anyone else see me?
Kayna Eelai Gallente GNATHIC	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:40:00 - [134] Originally by: Kirjava Originally by: Selena Rayne A Dev got hit with a keylogger and they used his account to change item spawns to get over 6k officer mods? Is this true or one of the many rumors going around atm? How the hell does a dev get hit with a keylogger in the first place if this is true Pretty scary... Keyloggers can happen to ANYONE. Dev does not mean invulnerable - many people have lost eve accounts to keyloggers ripping away isk/assets and throwing charecters on ebay. Let's be glad they didnt decide to do anything major.... wrong. if in my company a keylogger would happen, they would first fire the guy in charge of that computers security (me in that case) and secondly fire the guy who browsed websites he should not, while at work. i really hope (actually i dont hope, i BELIEVE) that the keylogger thing is just a rumour, because i doubt CCP has some1 with so high database access and so stupid to get hit by a keylogger. fixed to 23.15 kB (23710 bytes)
Bimjo Caldari SKULLDOGS	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:42:00 - [135] Wrangler , thanks for the headsup on IRC also big thanks to all at CCP
Knock Knock	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:47:00 - [136] Was it Starscream?, he didnt die or get dumped into the ocean at the end of the movie. c/d?
TomParad0x Caldari Silver Snake Enterprise Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:49:00 - [137] Edited by: TomParad0x on 20/10/2007 00:54:15 Originally by: Harkwyth Mist Originally by: Madelchai I don't know why people think they're entitled to constant up to the minute responses. . . Having them update you every 15 minutes isn't going to help get it fixed, or make the problem(s) and less severe. I dont expect an update every 15 minutes. however i DO expect to be told there is a problem and that it being worked on. What? You couldnt tell there was a problem? I thought it was fairly obvious given the servers were down when they were not supposed to be, and the forum / site (As well as CCPs site) was down / not responding. Do they have to stamp it on your forehead? Originally by: Harkwyth Mist When there are problems with a flight i've booked, i can quickly and easily find out there is a 2-6 hour delay before boarding. When there are problems with a train i have a ticket for, i can quickly and easily find out the train is running several minutes/hours late. So.. your comparing real life items, that people DEPEND on to get places for their jobs / events / etc, to a game that you pay a very SMALL amount of money to play? Got news for you, EVE is not a train, plane, or any other heavily used transportation device / service, it is a game. Originally by: Harkwyth Mist Spot the difference with todays events ... I am not complaining about the servers being down, or about losing training time (because i didnt), but i do have a complaint with the total breakdown of communication from CCP regarding the matter, and in todays multimedia based society i feel that this is totally unnacceptable from a technology orientated company. Total breakdown of communication? What do you think IRC is for? Perhaps they could have stuck the info for the IRC on their site, but that was down. I really don't see how they are going to communicate info to you if the servers that they use to communicate this information are down due to a security breach. About the only thing I can think of is sending out a mass e-mail giving information that the server was down (Though the e-mail server was prob down too), but given it was a security problem, I feel they did the right thing in not informing people until it was fixed. Though, I tell you what, they might update you more if you pay them as much as you do for a plane ticket, or train ticket, every month. Im fine with their communication, especially given the type of problem. common sense will tell you theres a problem, I dont think they need to wrap it all nice and pretty for you to tell there is a problem.
shinsushi	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:49:00 - [138] So, can't even dignify most of us with a response? All we are asking for is 1 skill long queue. Not the moon, reimbursement, or someones head on a platter. I guess any type of a response is just too much to ask eh?
Madelchai Gallente Stimulus	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:51:00 - [139] Edited by: Madelchai on 20/10/2007 00:52:14 Originally by: Harkwyth Mist I dont expect an update every 15 minutes. however i DO expect to be told there is a problem and that it being worked on. The server was down. There was your indication that there was a problem. I think it should go without saying that CCP was working hard on it, as they're not in the business of having their server down without reason. Still not seeing a problem yet. Originally by: Harkwyth Mist When there are problems with a flight i've booked, i can quickly and easily find out there is a 2-6 hour delay before boarding. When there are problems with a train i have a ticket for, i can quickly and easily find out the train is running several minutes/hours late. Spot the difference with todays events ... The differences... Let's see... It's a lot easier to get info on a train or plane than it is to find and fix the cause of a database security issue, and a lot easier to predict a new schedule for it. For a plane or train ticket you pay in the hundreds of dollar. (Assuming a long distance train ride. Obviously commuter rails are much cheaper) You pay $15 a month to CCP. Grand total spent during these precious 6 hours was what, 16 cents? You get what you pay for. CCP handled the problem and handled it well. ------ Fighting is like sex. The dirtier the better.
Madelchai Gallente Stimulus	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:52:00 - [140] Originally by: shinsushi So, can't even dignify most of us with a response? All we are asking for is 1 skill long queue. Not the moon, reimbursement, or someones head on a platter. I guess any type of a response is just too much to ask eh? No. ------ Fighting is like sex. The dirtier the better.

vanBuskirk Caldari	Posted - 2007.10.20 00:52:00 - [141] I really did wonder what was going on. Fortunately for me neither of my accounts lost any training time, which is the main problem when you have an unscheduled downtime. OK so far. However, communication could have been better. I didn't know the forums and website are on the same server, BTW. How about this solution? I am sure that billing (which I sincerely hope is on a different, more secure system) has everyone's email address. Is it possible to set it up so that whenever a major problem like this happens, an automatic mail is sent to every subscriber? Of course, one would have to pre-announce the fact that this was set up, so people know where to look for info. I didn't have a clue what was happening; the only way I did find out what was happening was to go onto my alliance forum, which was purely by coincidence. Not everyone has one of those. ---------------------------------------------- "Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent."
Wallstreet Susan	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:02:00 - [142] Originally by: Neth'Rae Edited by: Neth''Rae on 19/10/2007 22:54:12 Ok, but still.. Why are the forums and TQ on the same database? I have often wondered this myself.
Cadela Fria Amarr Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:04:00 - [143] Originally by: Kayna Eelai Originally by: Kirjava Originally by: Selena Rayne A Dev got hit with a keylogger and they used his account to change item spawns to get over 6k officer mods? Is this true or one of the many rumors going around atm? How the hell does a dev get hit with a keylogger in the first place if this is true Pretty scary... Keyloggers can happen to ANYONE. Dev does not mean invulnerable - many people have lost eve accounts to keyloggers ripping away isk/assets and throwing charecters on ebay. Let's be glad they didnt decide to do anything major.... wrong. if in my company a keylogger would happen, they would first fire the guy in charge of that computers security (me in that case) and secondly fire the guy who browsed websites he should not, while at work. i really hope (actually i dont hope, i BELIEVE) that the keylogger thing is just a rumour, because i doubt CCP has some1 with so high database access and so stupid to get hit by a keylogger. The keylogger is a rumour, which was widely spread by mr. DigitalCommunist and NTRabbit on coldfront in the #Eve-online channel. Who originally fabricated the false chatlog is something entirely different..have no idea who did it.
Bistot Kid The First Thing You'll Ever See	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:08:00 - [144] If anyone thinks losing a day of training is any form of issue whatsoever, it's time to step away from your computer for a while and get a breath of fresh air. It doesn't matter. One little bit. --------------------------------- Dyslexics of the World Untie! ---------------------------------
Ulviirala Vauryndar Gallente Cohortes Stellaris YouWhat	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:17:00 - [145] <Malynwa> were the servers hacked by a trojan... thing? <Ulviirala> nope <Ulviirala> spartan <Ulviirala> jita local dropped to 300 Unfortunately, your signature is not 22239 bytes, it exceeds the 24000 byte limit allowed on the forums. -Darth Patches I fail, regards to Cortes - Ulvi
Cadela Fria Amarr Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:18:00 - [146] Originally by: Kayna Eelai Originally by: ISD Rauth Kivaro As a security wonk in my real life: In a security breach situation, it's pretty much standard practice to shut down and say absolutely nothing until you're totally certain you have the situation in hand. Any leak of information can potentially magnify the problem. It may seem draconian but when you have as much at stake as there is here, it's logical. 1) if you're such a security wonk, how comes your system was not secure enough? 2) I doubt that it's a "much standard practice" to shut down. it depends much on situation, what company you are and what customers you have. as we've seen in this post, there is many people they don't really give a flying crap about customer service or how many hours they were left without the service they pay for and/or without communication... but other companies might think different and prefer to stay online to give service and have a expert security team hotfixing the problem. one of my companies customer is one of spains biggest insurance firm. if they have a security breach i am pretty sure they would not dare take the system offline and have all their offices and customers without "system" or without "info". they will take the risk, keep running, their expert team "counter-hacking" and hotfixing, and afterwards they'll take all responsabilities that have to apply. be it leaked information, lost data (which due hot-backup is easy to recover anyways) and fire whoever they have to fire. so... i don't think it's a "general strategy" to turn off. I'm sorry I have to say it like this, but there are limited alternative ways to, so: You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, meaning; * You don't understand what's common practice in the case of a security breach, otherwise you wouldn't be saying what you're saying. * You clearly don't know what it's like to face a security breach and deal with it as effectively as possible and as quickly as possible. * Obviously you don't understand the concept called "containment" in regards to the "no information provided" move done by CCP. * EVE-Online is not, nor will it ever be a one of the biggest insurance firms in Spain, so how you compare them leaves one again thinking you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. * "expert team" doing "counter-hacking" and "hot fixing", saying things like this is one way proof that you have absolutely NO clue whatsoever about what you're saying. Again, I'm sorry I had to say it like that, and I mean absolutely no offence, but it's quite apparent that this particular area is not your "thing" so to speak.
deathlords	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:18:00 - [147] Originally by: elider CCP you want me to belive that: -An EVE-Online player connects from his little laptop and hacks your firewall -Then he magically knows the internal structure of your networks and finds the database server -Then because he is such a genius , he is able to hack the security of the database server too... - Then he is able to figure out in some minutes the structure of such a complex database so he finds his wallet entry and puts there some ISK Just LOL!!! I bet most of your programmers are not able to do that from his desk in CCP office It is not difficult to do. Trust me. Any database worth 5 cents has some internal integrity. The CPP is not "incomprehensible". It just just a bunch of tables related to each other. For example, you have a player table. You have some items table. You have a transaction table as well as your wallet table (maybe a view?). This is just some basic layout that has to be there. This is an SQL database, not some weird binary file. Most of the actions are done through stored procedures. The problem with the above is getting access to the database, not doing stuff in the database once you have access.
Dred'Pirate Jesus Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:23:00 - [148] LMAO.. Was away from the computer for a day and Eve goes belly up for a few hours.. With the result of.. A) Kudos to CCP for the obviously quick responce time to an unauthorized hack into the database and resultant lockdown of the entire system to fix it befiore the perp could do even more damage.. B) OMG what a field day for the trolls.. They haven't had this much fun since T20.. Originally by: David Hackworth ò If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly.
infraX Caldari Endgame.	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:26:00 - [149] Not only that, but what makes you think that this 'hack' took place within minutes or even hours? Whatever was done and by whom may be the result of many months of effort and planning. All you see is a few minutes of mayhem before servers are shutdown for several hours and assume this wasn't premeditated and happened instantly. Trust me, this isn't how system breaches go down.
Ray Shroff	Posted - 2007.10.20 01:27:00 - [150] Originally by: Bistot Kid If anyone thinks losing a day of training is any form of issue whatsoever, it's time to step away from your computer for a while and get a breath of fresh air. It doesn't matter. One little bit. I always see posters like you and laugh on their posts, looks like you are having lots of fun in RL enjoy it, seriously if any one wants to raise the issue about skill training time lost due to incidence like this people like you come and say bla bla you don't have RL , you are whining and stuff but that doesn't mean some one is having less RL enjoyment, or is whining. Someone who lost their skill training time like this and want some thinking from CCP towards this problem and it is not first time this sort of thing happened and nor will be last. Some people say train for longer skill training time while patch is deployed or some scheduled work is going on, it is perfectly fine and people should set longer skill training time. But in case of "long" unexpected shutdowns like this CCP should think about it after all it's not our fault for problems like this and if it is discussed there might be some ways to counter it. Honestly i think many CCP guys are wise and they know this is a problem but none is coming forward to answer any post or at least say why it is not possible to even discuss about it. Now start flaming my guys, but it has to be said.



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