EVE Search - Goons: a field study in community relations

All Channels

Corporation, Alliance and Organization Discussions

Goons: a field study in community relations

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .. 23 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Illaria POS War Deserters	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:21:00 - [1] Edited by: Illaria on 29/10/2007 11:20:51 Dear CAOD reader, you've probably read about Goons and even more from Goons, but all these sources show a terrible lack of comprehension for the "Goon situation" that dominates so much of EVE politics for so many months now. As I have said in my The common grunt in the Great War article I had the opportunity to study the Goons for a good two months in their natural habitat, much like Jane Goodall studied primates by living among them. Recently the Goons posted a Response to the Vaccum video of BoB announcing the retreat from three regions in the south. This response video was interesting, as it was one of the rare occasions of Goons trying to explain themselves. This self explanation contains some truths but carries also the taste of cheap excuses. It's the topic of this post to shed light onto Goons and their relationship with the rest of the EVE community. "We are the monsters you created..." This sentence from the aforementioned Response vid, embodies, more than anything else ever said and written, the very core of the Goon self-conception. Goons see themselves, as well as Red Alliance, as victims of the EVE community. Shunned, harassed, hunted to the brink of extinction, they don't feel like paying respect to enemies, that have never granted it themselves. They are ruthless, because their enemies didn't take prisoners either. They ridicule the established EVE community, because the old chaps were patting each other on the back for going after some newbs in T1 frigs. Now that they are strong, they're eager to pay back for all the slights suffered when they were small and weak. Especially in regard to BoB. Killing BoB, not just defeating, but killing every BoB assest within their reach is their raison d'etre, their ultimate goal in this game. The day after BoB collapses, so will also Goonswarm, bereft of their sole reason of being. This really has to be stressed: There will never be peace between Goons and BoB, there will be no mercy, and no measure will be judged as too excessive. Their war is a total one. The question of course is whether their own self conception is correct. The excuse "society made me do it" is as old as it lame. Indeed a lot of the Goon behavior can be explained simply by the immature and puerile attitude. A lot of them just like being a jerk, and in general Goons don't make for very pleasant company. This doesn't make them unique; they are like countless of unknown low sec corps, full of immature people, that romanticize their social ineptitude, as being pirates and hardcore PvP'ers. The Goons are just bigger. But taking a look at the EVE community is also worthwhile: EVE is a game with huge barriers to entry. It has a very unfriendly newbie experience, and due to the "real time skill system" an almost impossible hurdle to catch up for new players. Couple this with one of the most condescending "old boys club" attitudes of the MMO world ever, and you might find that the Goons are perhaps not entirely at fault for the current situation. EVE is not overly complicated. Within two months you basically know 95% of all things there are to know about this game, yet there's the overwhelming attitude of the "old community" that newbies shouldn't be in 0.0. You should earn the right of being in 0.0 by first spending months in Empire doing mind numbing mission running, or pointless low sec ganking before you are experienced enough to set a foot in 0.0. This is bull**** and the Goons called the community on it, and the old boys decided to punish the newbies for their insolence. So indeed there is some truth to the Goon claim that the community itself is responsible for their irreverence of it. If the community wants to stop the Goon blob, they need to come down from their high horse. The Goons can blob because they have the pilots. Just sayin...
Iron Zarkasm Gallente Zarkastic Disease	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:31:00 - [2] Can't believe I'm first
Natas Dog GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:33:00 - [3] I don't think you 'get' Goons _______________________________________________________________ He who laughs last is usually the one the joke was about.
Grimpak Gallente Trinity Nova KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:37:00 - [4] Edited by: Grimpak on 29/10/2007 11:37:59 Originally by: Natas Dog I don't think you 'get' Goons but then a more deep question comes arround: Besides the goons themselves, can someone 'get' goons at all? also posting in an Bob/BoB pet alt thread. --- planetary interaction idea!
Zion Lior	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:38:00 - [5] Edited by: Zion Lior on 29/10/2007 11:41:44 No. stop posting, leave. we control your game now. like we control your forums. -Zion Lior
Elohe GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:38:00 - [6] Goons are jerks, Bob is just roleplaying
Fred 104 New Justice	Posted - 2007.10.29 11:52:00 - [7] Originally by: Grimpak posting in an Bob/BoB pet alt thread. Doesn't strike me as very pro-BoB for a BoB alt thread.
The Mittani GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:01:00 - [8] society made me do it
Cringeley GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:02:00 - [9] No we're really just a bunch of jerks. Goons would beat their own grandmothers to death with a stick if they thought she had some lolz inside her.
Calimor Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:04:00 - [10] Edited by: Calimor on 29/10/2007 12:04:26 This is absolutely one of the worst, worst "goon analysis" I've ever seen. The one from the Lotka Volterra guy was infinitely superior in every single aspect (and obviously that's why no one in LV listened). Stop posting. Also, el-oh-el at: Quote: The day after BoB collapses, so will also Goonswarm, bereft of their sole reason of being Hahahaha I posted the other day on the general forums that I don't believe, if we win the war, the RSF would rule EVE for more than 2-3 years because of the way this game is dynamic. At best we would just get bored and leave some stations behind so we could go to another war front. With that said, I think you really lack of a brain when you say we'll end when we're done with BoB. Do you even know why the hell did we get to play together? Long before the war we had stuff to do, with a much worse and boring leader on top of it. If we kill BoB you can be sure we'll have things to do to, because at worst we'll be calling out a hunt on dorks like you. ------------------------------------ [i]Originally Posted by DBP: We command your game now. As long as you remain in GoonSwarm, we make you play our way and nothing you say will really conv
WoHen Nankan Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:15:00 - [11] Bah there's no right way to explain things so I give up trying to write a post to do so. Who can explain 5000 people with various levels of dark humor? Nobody gets anyone else, but you can keep trying if you like.
Dafuzz Gallente Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:17:00 - [12] Originally by: Illaria text First BoB main in a BoB/Pet alt thread. tl;dr -- -If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets..
Qual Gallente Cornexant Research	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:19:00 - [13] OK, your argument is self defeating. The avarage EVE player stays in the game for 7 months. The Goon/BoB conflict has gone on for way longer than that. ALas Goons are by all means old boys by now. So the fact that it took so long for them to actually be able to hold and conquor 0.0 space kinda only reinforeces the notion that n00bs really cant survive in 0.0, and not that n00bs can take 0.0 easily... "The short version: Qual is right." -Papa Smurf
Nlewis GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:19:00 - [14] I honestly think that a lot of Goons will quit after the fall of bob because what else is there to do. we just beat the game
WoHen Nankan Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:25:00 - [15] actually went and read your other thread. if you hate 0.0 warfare so much why stay?
Relaria Hossin GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:26:00 - [16] to understand the goon, you must become the goon
Dagam GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:28:00 - [17] Originally by: Relaria Hossin to understand the goon, you must become the goon ~sun tzu
WowZilla The Leeroy Jenkins Project	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:32:00 - [18] Edited by: WowZilla on 29/10/2007 12:33:42 Originally by: Illaria ...and in general Goons don't make for very pleasant company. This doesn't make them unique; they are like countless of unknown low sec corps, full of immature people, that romanticize their social ineptitude, as being pirates and hardcore PvP'ers. The Goons are just bigger. So your Bob/Pet main is being beaten by a bunch of imature people? Gross generalisaion from you, if you really knew goons like you think you do, you'd know they are the complete opposite of what you just described. They just present the image of being r-tards, cos they know it really winds up guys like you. Originally by: Illaria EVE is not overly complicated. Within two months you basically know 95% of all things there are to know about this game WHAT? Have you EVER undocked from the n00b station you spawned in? Originally by: Illaria If the community wants to stop the Goon blob, they need to come down from their high horse. The Goons can blob because they have the pilots. Just sayin... The community doesnt want to stop them. A large section 'get' goons, more are learning to 'get' goons. Those who dont 'get' goons, like you, fail. Goons are changing the community landscape of Eve from that stuffy officers club into something better. I applaud them for that, and they will burn me for it too. Now how cool is that? ____________________ I am the worst poster
Illaria POS War Deserters	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:37:00 - [19] Originally by: Qual OK, your argument is self defeating. The avarage EVE player stays in the game for 7 months. The Goon/BoB conflict has gone on for way longer than that. ALas Goons are by all means old boys by now. So the fact that it took so long for them to actually be able to hold and conquor 0.0 space kinda only reinforeces the notion that n00bs really cant survive in 0.0, and not that n00bs can take 0.0 easily... Goons have been a lot younger when they first ventured in 0.0 space and left their mark so to speak. But it's not really about them being able to conquest 0.0 space from established alliances that earned them the wrath from the old boys, but that they even dared to try. Look there's no hard reason for newbies not going into 0.0. It's just the elitist attitude of the old guard to teach them a lesson. Originally by: WoHen Nankan actually went and read your other thread. if you hate 0.0 warfare so much why stay? I honestly dunno. I like the accompayning politics I guess. vv Besides I couldn't stand Goonfleet anymore. Doesn't mean I'm a BoB/BoB Pet/Alt btw. My sympathies for BoB are limited to individual persons only, much like with Goonswarm.
Zion Lior	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:37:00 - [20] Originally by: WowZilla Edited by: WowZilla on 29/10/2007 12:33:42 Originally by: Illaria Goons are changing the community landscape of Eve from that stuffy officers club into something better. I applaud them for that, and they will burn me for it too. Now how cool is that? PLEASE TELL ME MORE
Roger Albany Koshaku Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:39:00 - [21] The problem for Goons is that they now themsleves are one of the old buys clubs. The goons that mostly raided the ISS constellations in Estoteria were not noobs in tech 1 ships - they were experienced players all in expensive tech 2 HAC's and recons. So I think that Goons at some point will have problems recruiting new members, because somehow I do not see the "old" goon players setting up structures that help new players over the entry barriers. For me it is just a matter of time before we see GOON 2.0 - a new corp that that hates goons and all the other "old boys" just the same and which will be able to recruit the noobs much easier. And lets face it - we need new players in EVE - bot the game and the alliances needs more players all the time to replace older players moving on to other games.
Qual Gallente Cornexant Research	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:43:00 - [22] Originally by: WowZilla The community doesnt want to stop them. A large section 'get' goons, more are learning to 'get' goons. Those who dont 'get' goons, like you, fail. Seems to me that most of the community dont care about Goons nor BoB. I find it funny that msot times I meet people how I discorver play the game they hardly know about them, much less care one way or another about them. ("BoB? Oh, didnt they like win a tournament or something?", "Goons?") It much depends on how you define "the community" though. If its the players playing the game, im sure you are wrong. If "the community" are the loud mouths of the forums, im sure you could have a point. "The short version: Qual is right." -Papa Smurf
Bishop 5 Gallente The Flying Tigers	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:47:00 - [23] Forums are more enjoyable to read now. ------------- meh
Khorian Gallente Omega Fleet Enterprises Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:48:00 - [24] Originally by: WowZilla Goons are changing the community landscape of Eve from that stuffy officers club into something better. I applaud them for that, and they will burn me for it too. Now how cool is that? The funny thing is that the SA community as a whole would probably laugh at the EvE Goons for being nerds in a internet spaceships game. Also, while I agree that E-Honor is a little bit over the top, respect is very important in MMOs. While most alliances do what they do to gain recognition by the community, goons just want to play wild sow. If they ever become a major player on their own I doubt it will be for the better of EvE tbh.
WowZilla The Leeroy Jenkins Project	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:50:00 - [25] Originally by: Qual Originally by: WowZilla The community doesnt want to stop them. A large section 'get' goons, more are learning to 'get' goons. Those who dont 'get' goons, like you, fail. It much depends on how you define "the community" though. If its the players playing the game, im sure you are wrong. If "the community" are the loud mouths of the forums, im sure you could have a point. there's a game too? wow ____________________ I am the worst poster
Illaria POS War Deserters	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:50:00 - [26] Edited by: Illaria on 29/10/2007 12:51:46 Originally by: WowZilla They just present the image of being r-tards, cos they know it really winds up guys like you. May I ask where the difference is between "presenting an image of a ****" and being one? If you constantly act like a ** to wind people up, well, then you are indiscernible from one. Originally by:** WowZilla Originally by: Illaria EVE is not overly complicated. Within two months you basically know 95% of all things there are to know about this game WHAT? Have you EVER undocked from the n00b station you spawned in? What concepts are so complicated, that you couldn't learn them in two months of dedicated gaming and reading up a bit on forums? It's not really rocket science you know. No MMO is.
WowZilla The Leeroy Jenkins Project	Posted - 2007.10.29 12:59:00 - [27] Originally by: Illaria What? I've changed my mind. I dont think you 'get' Eve, let alone goons. ____________________ I am the worst poster
terminal mehmet GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 13:02:00 - [28] Originally by: Nlewis I honestly think that a lot of Goons will quit after the fall of bob because what else is there to do. we just beat the game Spread chaos and disorder, of course.
Scavok GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.10.29 13:07:00 - [29] Edited by: Scavok on 29/10/2007 13:07:33 Originally by: Khorian Originally by: WowZilla Goons are changing the community landscape of Eve from that stuffy officers club into something better. I applaud them for that, and they will burn me for it too. Now how cool is that? The funny thing is that the SA community as a whole would probably laugh at the EvE Goons for being nerds in a internet spaceships game. Also, while I agree that E-Honor is a little bit over the top, respect is very important in MMOs. While most alliances do what they do to gain recognition by the community, goons just want to play wild sow. If they ever become a major player on their own I doubt it will be for the better of EvE tbh. Most of the SA community also laughs at anime nerds, druggies, and gun nuts, but there are popular forums dedicated to each of those on SA. So what's your point again?
Redbad Minmatar Mean Corp	Posted - 2007.10.29 13:08:00 - [30] To the op: There is not real truth about what defines a Goon, there is only perception. Their response to the video of BoB was merely to have the perception of many altered in a more favorable way to their scheme. I.e., they are messing with your mind and made you write this without you even realizing it. On the other hand, this is only my perception of things, they might have pulled the trick on me too. RB

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .. 23 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.