Originally by: Vily

---

2) only time delay dmg dread

---

Originally by: Vily

---

7) only dread with damage type related bonus

---

Originally by: Koyama Ise

---

Originally by: Vily

---

2) only time delay dmg dread

---

Yes and no don't forget the Naglfar which uses 2 citadel torps.

Originally by: Vily

---

7) only dread with damage type related bonus

---

I believe you haven't met Revelation. Say hi to Revelation he only get's a damage bonus to EM and Thermal.

---

-

Originally by: Vily

---

Originally by: Koyama Ise

---

Originally by: Vily

---

2) only time delay dmg dread

---

Yes and no don't forget the Naglfar which uses 2 citadel torps.

Originally by: Vily

---

7) only dread with damage type related bonus

---

I believe you haven't met Revelation. Say hi to Revelation he only get's a damage bonus to EM and Thermal.

---

yes but the revelations damage bonus is to its weapon type, not to a damage type

---

Originally by: Meridius Dex

---

I could actually fit a Thorax WITH LASERS and get better DPS, better speed, better tank and - wait for it - better cap stability

---

Originally by: CCP Casqade

---

Please refrain from making assumptions on game mechanics and then presenting them as facts before testing them yourself.

---

Originally by: Vaal Erit

---

This is actually quite a big issue in capital on capital warfare. Quite disturbing to be in an awesome cap vs cap battle and realize on every killmail you are in a Phoenix doing 0 damage.

Cit torps should never be shot down by smartbombs, if you by the good grace of god actually got cit torps to hit another capital ship then you deserve to do some damage.

---

-

Originally by: Vaal Erit

---

This is actually quite a big issue in capital on capital warfare. Quite disturbing to be in an awesome cap vs cap battle and realize on every killmail you are in a Phoenix doing 0 damage.

Cit torps should never be shot down by smartbombs, if you by the good grace of god actually got cit torps to hit another capital ship then you deserve to do some damage.

---

Originally by: Vaal Erit

---

This is actually quite a big issue in capital on capital warfare. Quite disturbing to be in an awesome cap vs cap battle and realize on every killmail you are in a Phoenix doing 0 damage.

Cit torps should never be shot down by smartbombs, if you by the good grace of god actually got cit torps to hit another capital ship then you deserve to do some damage.

---

Originally by: Vily

---

well if we are on the issue, the simple fact that the pheonix needs a master buff could be addressed too.

but between,

1) hardest to fit dread cpu wise
2) only time delay dmg dread
3) shield tanks vs. armor tank prevelancy and accompanying remote reps
4) CITADEL TORPEDOS GETTING OWNED BY SMARTBOMBS.
5) pre-siege torpedo's dissappearing
6) post-siege torpedo's dissappearing
7) only dread with damage type related bonus

would be nice if i could get some motion on just one part of that problem

---

Originally by: Vaal Erit

---

This is actually quite a big issue in capital on capital warfare. Quite disturbing to be in an awesome cap vs cap battle and realize on every killmail you are in a Phoenix doing 0 damage.

Cit torps should never be shot down by smartbombs, if you by the good grace of god actually got cit torps to hit another capital ship then you deserve to do some damage.

---

Originally by: Koyama Ise

---

Originally by: Vily

---

2) only time delay dmg dread

---

Yes and no don't forget the Naglfar which uses 2 citadel torps.

Originally by: Vily

---

7) only dread with damage type related bonus

---

I believe you haven't met Revelation. Say hi to Revelation he only get's a damage bonus to EM and Thermal.

---

Originally by: Bronson Hughes

---

Edited by: Bronson Hughes on 02/06/2008 20:39:50

Originally by: Vily

---

well if we are on the issue, the simple fact that the pheonix needs a master buff could be addressed too.

but between,

1) hardest to fit dread cpu wise
2) only time delay dmg dread
3) shield tanks vs. armor tank prevelancy and accompanying remote reps
4) CITADEL TORPEDOS GETTING OWNED BY SMARTBOMBS.
5) pre-siege torpedo's dissappearing
6) post-siege torpedo's dissappearing
7) only dread with damage type related bonus

would be nice if i could get some motion on just one part of that problem

---

1)-3) aren't really issues that need to be fixed so much as they are properties of Caldari ships in general.

4)-6) should be addressed ASAP.

7) is a non-issue; it's the only Dread with two damage bonuses to the same weapon system. Don't forget about that 5% RoF bonus that it has in addition to it's 5% Kinetic Missile damage. No fixing needed.

EDIT: Forgot to quote. Clarity FTW.

---

Originally by: Ruah Piskonit

---

train revelation

---

Originally by: Vaal Erit

---

This is actually quite a big issue in capital on capital warfare. Quite disturbing to be in an awesome cap vs cap battle and realize on every killmail you are in a Phoenix doing 0 damage.

Cit torps should never be shot down by smartbombs, if you by the good grace of god actually got cit torps to hit another capital ship then you deserve to do some damage.

---

Originally by: Relyen

---

Another issue with Citadel torps.

If you fire any torp before entering Siege mode, and then enter siege mode, any torps you fired do absolutely no damage what so ever. If you fire a torp in siege mode and then it ends, the torp that you fired in siege mode does absolutely no damage.

Consider it can take 30 seconds to nearly 2 minutes for a citadel torp to hit it's target, can we get this fixed please? Because depending on how far away the dread is from their target, they are losing that much time of their siege cycle.

---

Originally by: CCP's genius factory

---

Exploits

What, you didn't honestly think we were going to list the exploit fixes before the patch, did you?

• Launching citadel torpedoes then entering siege mode will resort in the torpedoes' warhead becoming inert (i.e., will inflict no damage).

---

Originally by: Chi Quan

---

srsly, make pre siege launched torps do normal damage and siege launched do siege damage, regardless of the dreads current status. it is the most reasonable solution, game balance wise as well as fictional and logical wise..

---

Originally by: CCP's genius factory

---

Exploits

What, you didn't honestly think we were going to list the exploit fixes before the patch, did you?

• Launching citadel torpedoes then entering siege mode will resort in the torpedoes' warhead becoming inert (i.e., will inflict no damage).

---

Originally by: Cata Clysms

---

/push
An official responce would be nice...

---

Originally by: Arcadia1701

---

Hmmm I predect new skill - Missile Durability - 10% Bonus to all missile HP per level - rank 2

---

Originally by: Aurix Lexico

---

You caldari dread pilots must have it so hard. You want to talk about below average? Look at the naglfar.

---

Quote:

---

4) CITADEL TORPEDOS GETTING OWNED BY SMARTBOMBS.
5) pre-siege torpedo's dissappearing
6) post-siege torpedo's dissappearing

---

Originally by: Ulstan

---

Edited by: Ulstan on 30/06/2008 19:43:12

Quote:

---

4) CITADEL TORPEDOS GETTING OWNED BY SMARTBOMBS.
5) pre-siege torpedo's dissappearing
6) post-siege torpedo's dissappearing

---

These all affect the nalfgar too, so, it's definitely an issue CCP should address.

---

Originally by: Siege Module I Description

---

An electronic interface designed to augment and enhance a dreadnought's siege warfare abilities. Through a series of electromagnetic polarity field shifts, the siege module diverts energy from the ship's propulsion and warp systems to lend additional power to its offensive and defensive capabilities.

---

Originally by: Koyama Ise

---

Originally by: Vily

---

7) only dread with damage type related bonus

---

I believe you haven't met Revelation. Say hi to Revelation he only get's a damage bonus to EM and Thermal.

---

Originally by: Kagura Nikon

---

People that suggest postign in Assembly hall and usign CSM .. for once and for all the CSM is NOT FOR THAT! CSM is nto a whinning delegation to ccp, its a delegation created to give transparency into how CCP does thigns and to discuss the player/company relation, originated as damage control for the "dex haxor, exploits" case of end 2006/start2007.
Even a lot of CSM members have no idea what their were elected to do! They are anot a commision to balance ships or demand game design changes!

---

Originally by: Relyen

---

Edited by: Relyen on 23/06/2008 15:43:55
Edited by: Relyen on 23/06/2008 15:41:09

Originally by: Chi Quan

---

srsly, make pre siege launched torps do normal damage and siege launched do siege damage, regardless of the dreads current status. it is the most reasonable solution, game balance wise as well as fictional and logical wise..

---

QFT.

Originally by: CCP's genius factory

---

Exploits

What, you didn't honestly think we were going to list the exploit fixes before the patch, did you?

• Launching citadel torpedoes then entering siege mode will resort in the torpedoes' warhead becoming inert (i.e., will inflict no damage).

---

As a developer. I would have to say this is just bad programming if this is CCP's solution to such an issue. Obviously missile code as a whole needs to be reworked and upgraded. This plays into the same issue that when a missile ship enters warp the missiles stop doing damage. While at the same time a gun ship can still do damage while warp aligning. Missiles seem to be a hack job on coding, so the only solutions seem to be bad and stonewalled.

---

Originally by: Blazde

---

Edited by: Blazde on 02/07/2008 21:14:58
Another good example of citadel torps all getting smartbombed: http://morsus-mihi.net/kb/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=93917

There's a lot of things wrong with citadel torps and various ways they could be fixed but I can't help thinking the easiest short term solution is to give people the choice to avoid them:


- Give the Naglfar +2 turret hardpoints so it can fit 4 projectile weapons

- Give the Phoenix +3 turret hardpoints and modify it's bonuses to:
5% bonus to Capital Hybrid Turret damage per level
7.5% bonus to Capital Launcher rate of fire per level

- Both dreads would probably need a bit extra pg too.


In turret form the Pheonix would perform like a Moros without the imba drones, in launcher mode it's dps would be a bit lower at level 4 using any flavour torp compared to a current Phoenix using Rift and at level 5 almost identical to today, but without the kinetic restriction.

Interestingly the Elder Naglfars in the Empyrean age trailer were firing 4-volleys of citadel torps

---

Originally by: Blazde

---

- Give the Naglfar +2 turret hardpoints so it can fit 4 projectile weapons

- Give the Phoenix +3 turret hardpoints and modify it's bonuses to:
5% bonus to Capital Hybrid Turret damage per level
7.5% bonus to Capital Launcher rate of fire per level

- Both dreads would probably need a bit extra pg too.

---

Originally by: white kight

---

What does it take to get a dev response around here?!!!!

---

Originally by: Blazde

---

Edited by: Blazde on 02/07/2008 21:14:58
Another good example of citadel torps all getting smartbombed: http://morsus-mihi.net/kb/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=93917

There's a lot of things wrong with citadel torps and various ways they could be fixed but I can't help thinking the easiest short term solution is to give people the choice to avoid them:


- Give the Naglfar +2 turret hardpoints so it can fit 4 projectile weapons

- Give the Phoenix +3 turret hardpoints and modify it's bonuses to:
5% bonus to Capital Hybrid Turret damage per level
7.5% bonus to Capital Launcher rate of fire per level

- Both dreads would probably need a bit extra pg too.


In turret form the Pheonix would perform like a Moros without the imba drones, in launcher mode it's dps would be a bit lower at level 4 using any flavour torp compared to a current Phoenix using Rift and at level 5 almost identical to today, but without the kinetic restriction.

Interestingly the Elder Naglfars in the Empyrean age trailer were firing 4-volleys of citadel torps

---

Originally by: BiggestT

---

Originally by: Blazde

---

Edited by: Blazde on 02/07/2008 21:14:58
Another good example of citadel torps all getting smartbombed: http://morsus-mihi.net/kb/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=93917

There's a lot of things wrong with citadel torps and various ways they could be fixed but I can't help thinking the easiest short term solution is to give people the choice to avoid them:


- Give the Naglfar +2 turret hardpoints so it can fit 4 projectile weapons

- Give the Phoenix +3 turret hardpoints and modify it's bonuses to:
5% bonus to Capital Hybrid Turret damage per level
7.5% bonus to Capital Launcher rate of fire per level

- Both dreads would probably need a bit extra pg too.


In turret form the Pheonix would perform like a Moros without the imba drones, in launcher mode it's dps would be a bit lower at level 4 using any flavour torp compared to a current Phoenix using Rift and at level 5 almost identical to today, but without the kinetic restriction.

Interestingly the Elder Naglfars in the Empyrean age trailer were firing 4-volleys of citadel torps

---

WOW that wld be like an aweosme buff :D
Give rokh pilots something to train to for their hybrid stuffs rather than just cross-training moros

---

Originally by: Lord Fitz

---

Looking at the listed HP of Citadel torps, this should not be possible, but on the test server it is, so something is wrong, something with supposedly over 2300 HP is being brought down by 600 damage. You only need 2 smartbombs to do it, you should need at least 5.

The pre/post siege thing, unfortunately that was an exploit fix. I remember the good old days when you used to be able to drive a phoenix or three outside a POS shield, let off 3 volleys, re-enter the POS shield and hit siege, with torps doing full siege damage, and your phoenix's able to insta pop another dread (pre HP boost) while immune to repercussions. Mind you at that point POS's were a little more nasty to small ships, so it wasn't as easy to be tackled on your way out and back in.

I can't think of any good way to fix that, you shouldn't be letting them off pre-siege, and expecting anything (maybe at most normal damage though this may be harder to calculate), and post-siege again, yep, you lose damage, one reason I guess to not single cycle siege, risk/reward etc etc.

---

Originally by: white kight

---

Back to the top. Cmon can we get a dev response plz?

---

Originally by: BiggestT

---

Edited by: BiggestT on 18/08/2008 13:27:52

Originally by: white kight

---

Back to the top. Cmon can we get a dev response plz?

---

check my post above theres ur response, in case u want it again,
linky:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799

edit: added it to sig too :D

---

Originally by: Vily

---

Originally by: BiggestT

---

Edited by: BiggestT on 18/08/2008 13:27:52

Originally by: white kight

---

Back to the top. Cmon can we get a dev response plz?

---

check my post above theres ur response, in case u want it again,
linky:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799


edit: added it to sig too :D

---

im not gonna let it rest until they respond in THIS thread to THESE issues.

why citadel torpedo's do zero dps in almost all fleet engagements. the rest is gravy, but citdael torpedo's vulnerability to smartbombs is an issue that MUST be addressed

---

Originally by: Vily

---

Originally by: BiggestT

---

Edited by: BiggestT on 18/08/2008 13:27:52

Originally by: white kight

---

Back to the top. Cmon can we get a dev response plz?

---

check my post above theres ur response, in case u want it again,
linky:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799

edit: added it to sig too :D

---

im not gonna let it rest until they respond in THIS thread to THESE issues.

why citadel torpedo's do zero dps in almost all fleet engagements. the rest is gravy, but citdael torpedo's vulnerability to smartbombs is an issue that MUST be addressed

---

Originally by: Lord Fitz

---

Looking at the listed HP of Citadel torps, this should not be possible, but on the test server it is, so something is wrong, something with supposedly over 2300 HP is being brought down by 600 damage. You only need 2 smartbombs to do it, you should need at least 5.

The pre/post siege thing, unfortunately that was an exploit fix. I remember the good old days when you used to be able to drive a phoenix or three outside a POS shield, let off 3 volleys, re-enter the POS shield and hit siege, with torps doing full siege damage, and your phoenix's able to insta pop another dread (pre HP boost) while immune to repercussions. Mind you at that point POS's were a little more nasty to small ships, so it wasn't as easy to be tackled on your way out and back in.

I can't think of any good way to fix that, you shouldn't be letting them off pre-siege, and expecting anything (maybe at most normal damage though this may be harder to calculate), and post-siege again, yep, you lose damage, one reason I guess to not single cycle siege, risk/reward etc etc.

---

Originally by: Sir Substance

---

no you cant get a dev response. sit down in the corner like a little kid. you really think your thread will get more or less attention from devs because you ask for it in the title? if anything, they will avoid it, just to spite you for thinking you are important enough that they should come running because you ask.

pah!

---

Originally by: white kight

---

WOW that sucks. CCP don't think that Cit. Torps are broken.........They obviously have never looked at the killmails that we post, EVERY SINGLE ONE WITH PHOENIX'S/NALFALGARS NEAR OR AT THE BOTTOM BECAUSE OUR FING TORPS GET BLOWN UP!!!!!!!!! Thank CCP for allowing me to train for something that doesn't even work properly, 4 bil later and still nothing has been changed. Cheers for that. The Phoenix in terms of all the other dreads is shit at the end of the day. It tanks the least, and does the least amount of damage on another capital than any other dread, or most battleships for that matter. CCP need to look at this instead of them trying to say that they are right all the time and never make a mistake.

/rant

---

Originally by: Sheriff Jones

---

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: Hello and w

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners...*goes back to reading*

---

Quote:

---

3 months old thread already now and not even a comment.

---

Originally by: Kel Nissa

---

Quote:

---

3 months old thread already now and not even a comment.

---

Thats the reason for my proposal: ISK donations to get devs looking into specific ideas

---

Originally by: Sheriff Jones

---

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: Hello and w

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners...*goes back to reading*

---

Originally by: Milia Jenius

---

Edited by: Milia Jenius on 23/08/2008 03:34:22

Originally by: Lord Fitz

---

Looking at the listed HP of Citadel torps, this should not be possible, but on the test server it is, so something is wrong, something with supposedly over 2300 HP is being brought down by 600 damage. You only need 2 smartbombs to do it, you should need at least 5.

The pre/post siege thing, unfortunately that was an exploit fix. I remember the good old days when you used to be able to drive a phoenix or three outside a POS shield, let off 3 volleys, re-enter the POS shield and hit siege, with torps doing full siege damage, and your phoenix's able to insta pop another dread (pre HP boost) while immune to repercussions. Mind you at that point POS's were a little more nasty to small ships, so it wasn't as easy to be tackled on your way out and back in.

I can't think of any good way to fix that, you shouldn't be letting them off pre-siege, and expecting anything (maybe at most normal damage though this may be harder to calculate), and post-siege again, yep, you lose damage, one reason I guess to not single cycle siege, risk/reward etc etc.

---

Possible Solutions to Citadel Torpedo Issue


1. Citadel torps before/after siege cycle do 0 damage

To prevent the "fire and hide" exploit, add a piece of code in the siege module to Disallow entering siege mode inside POS shields, and fix a dread's location in space to disallow bumping back into POS after "Siege & fire". There is no point entering siege mode in a POS anyways.

For the similar modules, changes can possibily be done too. Who enters triage mode in a POS shield? Similar changes can be done but there is no much point doing it. The industrial core is fine as it is, just leave it


2. Citadel torps easily destroyed by smartbombs

Missile destruction should be in the domain of defender missiles, leave smartbombs out of the equation, they are for drones & fighters.

The simple solution to this is simple (Ooops! )

- Increase the HP of ALL MISSILES by 10 folds

- Increase the damage of DEFENDER MISSILES by 10 folds

This will allow the defender missiles to do its job while leaving missiles close to unkillable to smartbombs. Smartbombs won't be affected as they can still kill drones and fighters.



These issues affect 2 out of total 4 dreads in EVE and possibily those who decide to mount citadel torp launchers on their titans, PLEASE get this fixed or at least gives us a reply ASAP


Just my 2 cents

Don't think you need 10 fold increase. Enough to survive 2 hits from Smartbombs would be enough for citatel torps. SWo you can stil defend yourself from them, but to do so you need to use 3 modules. (think its fair since the phoenix is firing with 3 modules on you..)

- Milia Jenius

---

Originally by: John Zorg

---

Hi All,

I havn't got my pheonix yet but I have been playing around with the Dread on the test server. What a waste of time :\ I have changed my training entirely because of this reason.

Please can it be looked at.

JZ

---

Originally by: Sheriff Jones

---

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: Hello and w

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners...*goes back to reading*

---

Originally by: John Zorg

---

I havn't got my pheonix yet but I have been playing around with the Dread on the test server. What a waste of time :\ I have changed my training entirely because of this reason.

---

Originally by: Ignition SemperFi

---

whats sad is CCP pretending like this isnt a problem atm, and moving it to this board which hardly gets looked at.

Thats like saying we understand we did something with unforseen consequences, but when you bring them up... its not a problem, its just a feature


come on!

/resigned and back to the top

just because all of eve isnt yelling like the nano nerf doesnt mean this is any less of an issue. Having a 1.8b+fittings ship have its entire weapon system(the only reason its in the game is weapons) nulled out by 2 sub 1mill costing items or 1 faction item, fitted on any ship that can fit large smarties... let alone the capital ships it was entended to kill.

This is in no way right. The evidence is there CCP, ignoring it isnt an option

---

Originally by: Sheriff Jones

---

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: Hello and w

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners...*goes back to reading*

---

Quote:

---

devs dont need isk Neutral

---

Originally by: BiggestT

---

Originally by: white kight

---

WOW that sucks. CCP don't think that Cit. Torps are broken.........They obviously have never looked at the killmails that we post, EVERY SINGLE ONE WITH PHOENIX'S/NALFALGARS NEAR OR AT THE BOTTOM BECAUSE OUR FING TORPS GET BLOWN UP!!!!!!!!! Thank CCP for allowing me to train for something that doesn't even work properly, 4 bil later and still nothing has been changed. Cheers for that. The Phoenix in terms of all the other dreads is shit at the end of the day. It tanks the least, and does the least amount of damage on another capital than any other dread, or most battleships for that matter. CCP need to look at this instead of them trying to say that they are right all the time and never make a mistake.

/rant

---

if ONLY u cldve said that in the topic where the dev repsonded before he locked the thread..
THAT wldve been v.nice to see

---

Originally by: white kight

---

Edit: You can say shit on the forum??? Still not allowed to say ****pit tho

---

Originally by: Sheriff Jones

---

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: Hello and w

*ding ding!*

Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners...*goes back to reading*

---

Originally by: aldarrin

---

Signed. I'd rather see smartbombs do zero damage against missiles.

---

Originally by: Kagura Nikon

---

Originally by: aldarrin

---

Signed. I'd rather see smartbombs do zero damage against missiles.

---

don' t think zero. But citatel torps coudl have their speed doubled. So a single smart bobm woudl not be able to get most of them.

---

Originally by: white kight

---

Originally by: Kagura Nikon

---

Originally by: aldarrin

---

Signed. I'd rather see smartbombs do zero damage against missiles.

---

don' t think zero. But citatel torps coudl have their speed doubled. So a single smart bobm woudl not be able to get most of them.

---

Most???? Try all of them. A phoenix's main dps in a fleet fight is drones........until the smartbombs get them too!!!!

---

Originally by: BiggestT

---

http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=774603

lol yet another post in game development that was replied to by casquade, who insists that it shldnt be in the forum coz its not a literal "bug" (but doesnt say a word about all the boost ship X and boost module X topics which arent about "bugs")

Not happy jan

---

Originally by: white kight

---

Originally by: Kagura Nikon

---

Originally by: aldarrin

---

Signed. I'd rather see smartbombs do zero damage against missiles.

---

don' t think zero. But citatel torps coudl have their speed doubled. So a single smart bobm woudl not be able to get most of them.

---

Most???? Try all of them. A phoenix's main dps in a fleet fight is drones........until the smartbombs get them too!!!!

---

Originally by: white kight

---

Edited by: white kight on 29/08/2008 16:21:18
Edited by: white kight on 29/08/2008 16:10:40
Edited by: white kight on 29/08/2008 14:40:40
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=857880
We have our response guys. It appears that CCP are looking into this we just haven't had a response saying that they are.

EDIT: I FAIL AT LINKING - Check Game Development Forum to see what i mean lol

White

---

Quote:

---

CCP Casqade
Posted - 2008.08.29 10:19:00 - [5]

The current mechanic is that torpedoes gets blown up if they take too much damage. This can be done by using a smartbomb or defender missiles.

This is not a bug, since it is by design.

If you think that the design should change, then you are welcome to make a suggestion in the "Features and Ideas discussion forum".

If you want to talk about bugs, then you should bug report the issue after which you are welcome to make a thread about it here.

Again, calling game mechanics you do not like "Broken" and saying that they should be "Fixed" is not the right way to go.
Making a thread in the "Features and Ideas discussion" where you state what the problem is, why it is a problem, how you suggest it should be changed/balanced is constructive.

---

Quote:

---

CCP Casqade
Posted - 2008.08.29 11:06:00 - [7]

What I am saying is this: It is not a bug, therefore it should not be in this forum.
I am also saying this: It might need to be balanced, but this is not the correct forum for that. Suggestions go to the "Features and Ideas discussion" forum.

---

Quote:

---

CCP Casqade
Posted - 2008.08.29 11:27:00 - [9]

Yes, exactly that. Which is a thread I've linked everyone to that believes that this is a bug so far.
But people seem to insist that smartbombs affecting Citadel Torpedoes is a bug and keep making threads about it in the Game Development forum.

Previous thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799

If you know bugs that affect the Citadel torpedo, I'm very willing to look into it and discuss them here.

---

Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab

---

And if they 'buff' the citadel torpedo HP enough to withstand 2-3 SB's, it'll still suck in major engagements as you might pass through the sphere of SB of more than just one or two carriers/MS's...

If we're going to have a weapon-system that is this easily disabled, it should at the very least do _MORE_ damage that other dreadnoughts when you get in hits.

---

Originally by: Kel Nissa

---

Quote:

---

3 months old thread already now and not even a comment.

---

Thats the reason for my proposal: ISK donations to get devs looking into specific ideas

---

Originally by: Ragel Tropxe

---

/signed

another example seen today in 111. Virtualy all the cap kill mails had Phoenixes doing zero damage.

If this is "working as intended" then why not give Citadel launchers the same r.o.f buff that normal siege launchers got , then at least Phoenixes would do a good amount of dps if they managed to hit something.

---

-

Originally by: CCP Mitnal

---

Cleaned.

Please note /signed posts are considered spam and will be deleted and are subject to forum warnings and subsequently bans.

Devs may respond in any number of threads but hunting for all the ones on a common theme would take them away from fixing problems so please do not be disappointed if they do not post in any particular thread.

---

Originally by: CCP Mitnal

---

Cleaned.

Please note /signed posts are considered spam and will be deleted and are subject to forum warnings and subsequently bans.

Devs may respond in any number of threads but hunting for all the ones on a common theme would take them away from fixing problems so please do not be disappointed if they do not post in any particular thread.

---

-

Originally by: RedLion

---

buff citadel torpedo hp and speed.
buff citadel torpedo damage.

Bring phoenix on pair with the other dreads. (except from scrap metal one)

---

-

Originally by: CCP Navigator

---

Thread Locked.

Please note that the General Discussion area is not....

Oh who am I kidding - Continue

---

Originally by: CCP Zulupark

---

Nozh is going to look into this issue, he'll probably post something here later.

---

Originally by: CCP Zulupark

---

Nozh is going to look into this issue, he'll probably post something here later.

---

Originally by: CCP Zulupark

---

Nozh is going to look into this issue, he'll probably post something here later.

---

Originally by: RedLion

---

Originally by: CCP Zulupark

---

Nozh is going to look into this issue, he'll probably post something here later.

---

/me cancels Amarr training
/me starts Caldari training
/me hopes he is not let down.

---

Originally by: Puupuu

---

dude... your face

---

Originally by: CCP Zulupark

---

Nozh is going to look into this issue, he'll probably post something here later.

---

Originally by: CCP Navigator

---

Thread Locked.

Please note that the General Discussion area is not....

Oh who am I kidding - Continue

---

Originally by: Nova Fox

---

Wonder when Nozh is going to reply.

---

Originally by: CCP Nozh

---

Ok.
Everyone happy?
Oh, and I'll get faction XL Torps authored as well.

---

Originally by: Vily

---

great stuff. i'd like velocity increaed as well ;p

but im happy to just have acheived this minor success.

---

Originally by: Blazde

---

Good stuff Nozh


Now let's have some of those 4-launcher hardpoint Elder Naglfar bpc drops.

Yea I know, give us an inch we'll take a mile...

---

Originally by: Aprudena Gist

---

That still doesn't give them a realistic chance at hitting a titan so its totally a worthless change aside from dread fights but even then they get there so slowly that by the time they would do damage the fight is 1/2 over. There should be a larger change to Citadel Torps although what you've done Noz is a good start.

---

Originally by: CCP Nozh

---

Everyone happy?

---

Originally by: CCP Nozh

---

Everyone happy?

---

Originally by: Pan Crastus

---

Originally by: CCP Nozh

---

Everyone happy?

---

I'm sure we'll get more Caldari whines when people realize that they still won't be doing full damage on Caps/Supercaps that are moving (at typical speeds 80-100m/s) ...

---

Originally by: Puupuu

---

dude... your face

---

Originally by: Tarron Sarek

---

Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 03/10/2008 02:18:01

Originally by: Aprudena Gist

---

That still doesn't give them a realistic chance at hitting a titan so its totally a worthless change aside from dread fights but even then they get there so slowly that by the time they would do damage the fight is 1/2 over. There should be a larger change to Citadel Torps although what you've done Noz is a good start.

---

Hmm, maybe, maybe give Citadel Torps a x2 speed bonus when in siege mode.
After all sieges have always been a thing about range (catapults etc.) and increased speed would be a reasonable siege mode measure to account for that.
The torps would still be slower than those of a Raven.

---

Originally by: Miyamoto Uroki

---

Originally by: Pan Crastus

---

Originally by: CCP Nozh

---

Everyone happy?

---

I'm sure we'll get more Caldari whines when people realize that they still won't be doing full damage on Caps/Supercaps that are moving (at typical speeds 80-100m/s) ...

---

uh what? 125m/s explo velocity clearly is enough to deal full damage. So what are you refering to?

---

Originally by: CCP Nozh

---

Ok.

Some basic info:

Citadel Torpedo HP: 650
Normal Torpedo HP: 240
Large Tech II smartbomb damage: 300 DMG

Other factors:

Number of launchers
Speed (It's "almost" impossible to destroy normal Torpedoes with smartbombs)

So to my conclusion:

The Citadel Torpedo HP vs. Damage is a bit low compared to normal Torpedoes if we fix that the HP of the Citadel Torpedoes is boosted to 960 HP. This would also translate directly over if we were to "ever" introduce XL-Smartbombs (doubt it).

Lets not stop there. The Raven, king of torpedoes can mount 6 launchers, but the Phoenix can "only" field 3, this of course makes every missile more vulnerable. By doubling the HP of Citadel Torpedoes we can rectify that.

So end result: Citadel Torpedo HP: 1920

Other things this effects:

One advantage of fitting smartbombs to your capital ship is removed.

Everyone happy?

Oh, and I'll get faction XL Torps authored as well.

---

Originally by: CCP Navigator

---

Thread Locked.

Please note that the General Discussion area is not....

Oh who am I kidding - Continue

---

Originally by: Aprudena Gist

---

Originally by: Tarron Sarek

---

Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 03/10/2008 02:18:01

Originally by: Aprudena Gist

---

That still doesn't give them a realistic chance at hitting a titan so its totally a worthless change aside from dread fights but even then they get there so slowly that by the time they would do damage the fight is 1/2 over. There should be a larger change to Citadel Torps although what you've done Noz is a good start.

---

Hmm, maybe, maybe give Citadel Torps a x2 speed bonus when in siege mode.
After all sieges have always been a thing about range (catapults etc.) and increased speed would be a reasonable siege mode measure to account for that.
The torps would still be slower than those of a Raven.

---

A 2x Speed flight bonus in siege would almost do it the damage is still ridiculously delayed tho.

---