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New Dev Blog: Speed Rebalanced by Nozh

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 15 post(s)
Lily Cole	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:49:00 - [211] Imagine... the rapier will have to put 2, maybe 3 of his 5 webs on a nanoboat now... oh the humanity.
Slade Hoo Amarr xPlaguex	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:51:00 - [212] I like the changes...its pure balance. And anyone who says "minmatar got nerfed to hell" have no clue about minmatars potential with ABs...we haven't even tested it yet. i noticed a nice sentence in the dev blog: "It could also create a scenario where smaller ships would prefer to use an afterburner and scrambler, instead of a MWD, webifier and disruptor. Who knows?" I know...Retribution pilots won't fit any of these combination cause of only one med slot ;-)
Alpha Type Gallente Childhood's End	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:51:00 - [213] This is a great change. Finally some semblance of balance in the way that ship speeds are determined by class. The amount of bitter tears by people who have had their i-win-button removed is hilarious.
Pushtan Ministry of Destruction Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:52:00 - [214] i want to post 'LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLNANO' But, it'd be nonconstructive. but, nontheless LOL @ the people who specced in nano's and DIDNT see this coming....seriously, just invest in BC 5 and go pvp in a proper decent ship. Even IF this doesnt come into effect, it should open some eyes to how fragile their '1337' position is. Seriously, one aspect, just like the torps is getting cut back again.... As Evolutions' saying goes ''Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolution.'' appropriate, eh? ITT: Scared, scared people
Franga NQX Innovations	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:54:00 - [215] Originally by: techzer0 Like a few other people have said, one step at a time CCP! Mass changes like this is only asking to break something, change one... wait... change another. Multiple annoying "hotfix" downtimes to "fix" the last "fix" 0are a bit ****ed and we've been through it with almost every large patch that changes a lot of stuff at once. The nano-whines have gotten so ridiculous lately, I've been accused of speed-tanking in an afterburner fit plated Rifter, and my plate Rupture! I think that there is a large portion of the EVE community that has no idea what they are talking about when they say "Nano"... Do I have to use a 5bil Machariel that does 16km/s as an example? Most "nano" ships are not even all that fast, and rely on some sort of ECM to get in and really do some damage. These two paragraphs seems to stick out to me. The top one because that seems to be a fairly sensible thing to do. One step at a time rather then en-masse changes. The second paragraph because I think it's true also. Alot of people seem to think nanoing is putting a MWD on your ship. And it is true that the nano-whines became insanely thick and stupid just after FW began. I think the changes have been coming (and needed imo) for much longer then the genesis of FW, however. But doing about 5 things that would appear to me to be rather large changes to several different things all at once? Not sure that's a good thing. Originally by:** Rachel Vend ... with 100% reliability in most cases ...
Ryn0 Cruoris Seraphim	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:54:00 - [216] No, stop it.
Sophitia Elit	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:55:00 - [217] Quote: As to risk vs. reward; I run around in a ship worth 3-400 mill, with a billion worth of implants in my head, I'm willing to take the risk, while the "zoot zoot, omg speed tanking is lame"-crowd is unwilling to sacrifice a highslot that can save their ass. This Topic is in my opinion completly missing in the hole dev blog thread, sure you can get "Ludicrous" Speed. But that ship will cost a lot. And those guys flying those ships aren't invulnerable, they do die. And when they die they ISK worth a lot of standard Ships. Quote: Then there is also the size/price factor; why would I spend ISK on a sleek, fragile interceptor (thatÆs lithe and quick, supposedly), when I can just spend the money on a more durable heavy assault cruiser and reach even greater speeds? And after reading this passage i have to think, that CCP isn't really aware of that. How can anybody set the price of a fully fitted Interceptor in relation to a heavy assault cruiser which reaches only the same speed? It will costs a multiple times more ISK as the Interceptor (which i can too fit with faction stuff to make him "ludicrous" fast) I'm not saying the system is bad, but put ISK in your considerations when comparing setups. Sure, there a players who don't care about ISK, but for the main Playerbase they do care.
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:55:00 - [218] Rage... Congrats CCP, really. This is ridiculous. This nerf will kill Blasterboats (Yes they do have trouble tracking unwebbed similar sized targets). Kill Skirmish warfare. Be very dangerous to anyone trying to make a push into 0.0. Hello bubbles! All these 'ways to travel too fast'. What % of nano pilots own a High Grade Snake set, T2 Polys, fly with a maxed out Command Ship Pilot and use boosters? Looks like someone has been playing with EFT more than the game. Also, X-Instinct nerf? LOL. It had better be a huge sig radius reduction due to the borked scanres/sig radius relationship of turrets. WTS Poly Vaga, Poly Rapier, Poly Ishtar, Poly Crow, Poly Scimitar Assumption of Risk
Nexus Kinnon SniggWaffe	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:55:00 - [219] Originally by: Franga Originally by: Nexus Kinnon hey this is pretty stupid Thanks. Insightful stuff. My two cents: Not totally convinced about the webber thing, but as the more stable element of the community have said, let's see what happens on Sisi. PS: Hilarious to see XxAngelxX getting rather upset about how this will kill small-gang warfare against the blobs. You've seen your own corps and ex-alliances vids, right? How will it affect your nano-blob warfare? Thanks, your post was pretty insightful too. I see you pointed out something that hadn't been brought up before and totally provided some valuable feedback for CCP to consider.
Anahid Brutus TunkbwahCorp GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:55:00 - [220] Edited by: Anahid Brutus on 25/07/2008 13:01:32 parks 30 pulse apocs 100km off gate bubbles gate wins eve \o/ wait, even better, 3-4 titans sitting 230km off the gate. i take back what i said about small scale pvp being dead, now that you dont have to worry about dictors and shit like, mwd'ing places, then you can just dd snipe 24/7 oh yes, a new era is here edit, i like how it buffs carriers as well, people mwd'ing away from my fighters or out of my point range made me so sad ;_; this will be great. if you thought the caldari roleplayers were whining loudly about nanos, wait until they're met with titans and carriers everywhere they go, and with no way to effectively disengage.

Miyamoto Uroki Caldari State Protectorate	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:56:00 - [221] Thank you CCP. Finally... Not saying it's all perfect, lets see what play testing brings to light. Of course there will be other ubar ships after this nerf, but it's a needed nerf nonetheless Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face
Joakim Wasyl Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:56:00 - [222] Cool, a boost to missiles. Caldari cruisers / BC's may become useful for something other than ECM.
Plague Black 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:56:00 - [223] Originally by: Space Flyer THANKS CCP for killing the only way that we all had to fight blobs outnumbered in this game... really THANKS! Comming from someone who takes 50 nano snipers to roam You just won me a bet, I said that PL will whine hardest and there you go, bring me 100m isk with your post, thank you. As for changes: BRING IT ON CCP! Took you long enough to wake up and realise that ships should not be faster then missiles. What was next, shooting while cloaked or dodging bullets modules? Your next step should be to ban cloaks on battleships and caps. Then we will have an interessting EVE again. Still plenty of broken stuff here so get back to the drawing board.
Marsaac Lone Starr Corporation	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:57:00 - [224] Atlast a working nanonerf. My only concerns is about the Minmatar recon ships. Removing the target painter bonus and replacing it with a bonus for web velocity affection would make them worth flying after the patch. Same with the Hyena.
Martin Mckenna D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:57:00 - [225] stealth chicken boost ---------------------------------------------
Mr Mozzie Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:57:00 - [226] This is very fair for those people who have spent billions on snake sets, officer speed mods etc. The value of their investment will be destroyed overnight. Perhaps these people could keep their old version mods unchanged, but they would no longer be spawned. The new nerfed mods could then be introduced in their place. The old modules etc will dissapear from the game gradually through attrition, and the old ones will become very prized items. Or they could get a cape for their character in ambulation.
Riho Gallente Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:58:00 - [227] welcome to blob online... because theres no counter for it .. except a bigger blob :P time to train falcon and RR BS and thats it trashing my snake clone whit all the rogues too and getting slaves :P ---------------------------------- Fighting for Minmatar o7 Yes... this is my main. Extreme Troll Slayer...
Hul'ka Minmatar MicroFunks	Posted - 2008.07.25 12:59:00 - [228] Originally by: Meissa Anunthiel Go for it! I'm a matari pilot, the speed rebalance will hit us the most, but I say go for it! At least flying something else will become an option again rather than "BS or fluff" duopoly. flying "something else" is flying what exactly? BS or "not so fluffy duopoly"? --------- I want to phew phew
Max Teranous Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:00:00 - [229] Originally by: Arcane Carnage Originally by: Deros *WORDS" ...it simply become a case of more ships wins. D deros promoted to head of PL tactics. recruitment now open must be able to fly a drake t2 tank and missiles. And you laughed when I cross trained to Caldari Max
Tobias Sjodin Ore Mongers Black Hand.	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:00:00 - [230] Originally by: "CCP" * Speed must never reach ludicrous speed, which is defined as speeds where missiles and drones don't intercept the class of ship they were intended for. * There should be a significant and meaningful difference in speed between the ship classes. * Speed should not permit a larger ship to perform the role that a smaller specialized ship was intended for. * Afterburners should be a viable module selection for PVP. * Guerrilla warfare must remain a viable combat tactic. It seems like your goals aren't bad, but your means to achieve them are, here are my main concerns: 1. How this affects minmatar recons. Unless they get a web-amount bonus, I think they will become the new rook (especially the huginn that even now is used by very few) 2. How this affects blaster-battleships. If you fly a megathron you need to get in range, but one arazu could effectively make you a useless sitting duck. Either boost the falloff or make so that the Arazu's bonus only affect disruptors. 3. Thus far I've not seen you address the concern about skirmish small-gang warfare. It's as if every change you make is to make blob-tactics the better option, all at the same time that the server can't handle that type of warfare. If you want to nerf nano like this, at least consider other options to evade blobs BEFORE you nerf nano. 4. Making caldari ships that more effective. To effectively get a damage reduction from eg. a drake or a cerb when you're in a nano:ed HAC/RECON you have to be able to get up to the max speeds you can get to with todays t2 speed mods + polys. All at the same time you're unable to do any damage to the target while you are at that speed, so the speed is basically the option to get away from the fight, not be invincible. Reducing that max-speed actually increases the efficiency of missiles. It seems you didn't consider all the effects of your changes - while the vision seems solid enough, there are many things that get affected by your changes here. And it seems again that they're in the favour of the blobs. Black Hand.

Tareen Kashaar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:00:00 - [231] These changes will be very interesting to see. I'm going to love finding new ways to exploit vulnerabilities, work contrariy to people's expectations, etc. This will make scramblers a viable alternative. Maybe their range needs to get slightly boosted, seeing how they only affect mwding ships, not abing ones, whereas webbers affect both... I'll have to see what it's like when it hits sisi, but from the numbers it looks to me like ABs will need to have their speed boosts increased to really be a viable alternative to MWDs. This is a step in the right direction! I say that, and I fly plenty of nano ships. ____________
Rastadeen Minmatar The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:02:00 - [232] How about not slapping on ALL these nerfs in 1 single go. Start with 1, the work from there. Changing this much straight away is bound to fail. And the last point in your blog really gave me a good chuckle.
Naughty Cat Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:02:00 - [233] Originally by: CCP Wrangler Speed Rebalanced[/url]. Nice to hear, but may I ask you, when are you going to fix fleet lags? Thank you -----------------------------------------------
Liteik Rage and Terror Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:02:00 - [234] Edited by: Liteik on 25/07/2008 13:05:21 Edited by: Liteik on 25/07/2008 13:03:07 You can do with a speed that you want, just nerf amarrian BS (cloze BS with pulse and rang 70-100km) and plz nerf carriers and their fighter-lagz, after that you can change speed. If t2 scrambl = will disconect , for that rapier/hugin ?
ParMizaN Body Count Inc. The Requiem	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:04:00 - [235] Fantastic Superfast HACs and so on are a real detriment to the game: Nano fitting means they cannot, and will not, engage similar sized groups, and no group can catch them. This relagates their usefulness to massive ganking while remaining almost invincible; clearly broken. Thank you, thank you and so on
Sexy Traderin	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:04:00 - [236] Originally by: Viper **zIe Originally by: Verite Rendition It's been a long time coming. I'm glad to see that speedtanking will no longer be the only effective way to fight in small groups. Yeah, now there will be no way to fight effectively in small groups. Great change. omg vz you are the biggest whiner i have ever seen... adapt or quit, kkthxbye
Plave Okice Universal Securities	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:05:00 - [237] For those of us who were proud of fighting outnumbered and actively tried to fly in as small a group as possible pvp just got taken away from us, speed was our only option in fighting numbers 2,3,4,5 times ours. Biggest blob wins eve pvp, let's not bother with any variation or options, just who has most wins, much simpler. Would you like to know more?
Franga NQX Innovations	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:05:00 - [238] Originally by: Nexus Kinnon Originally by: Franga Originally by: Nexus Kinnon hey this is pretty stupid Thanks. Insightful stuff. My two cents: Not totally convinced about the webber thing, but as the more stable element of the community have said, let's see what happens on Sisi. PS: Hilarious to see XxAngelxX getting rather upset about how this will kill small-gang warfare against the blobs. You've seen your own corps and ex-alliances vids, right? How will it affect your nano-blob warfare? Thanks, your post was pretty insightful too. I see you pointed out something that hadn't been brought up before and totally provided some valuable feedback for CCP to consider. Originally by: Rachel Vend ... with 100% reliability in most cases ...
Roland Childe	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:06:00 - [239] Oh dear, i have a bad feeling about this one. I kinda foresee 2 years of matari training going down in what they're worth. I am what many of the forum warriors would call a "nano***" because i like to go fast. Doenst stop me from getting killed every now and then tho. Contrary to commom belief there are backdraws of going really fast. At this point i don't see why a genuine speed adjustment, yeah, lets call it that, nerf sounds so harsh , would help an awfull lot. there are ways to encounter it with existing game mechanics. I can see why alot of people whine about speedtanking, but changing it to a degree where it wont work properly anymore will take away some of the variety of this game we all seem to like so much. I do have a caldari/gallente char, so i know both sides of speed tank vs "normal" tank. Also i quite like the minmatar, and it makes me cry a little when i see how they're treated. I dont want to turn this into a boost minmatar thread, i just wanted my to voice my concerns about the announced chances. One thing on a very specific item: deactivating my mwd when i get hit by a scam? How can this even be considered. Imagine a situation on a gate, i am in my lovely nanoboat, with a nice blob waiting for me and scrambling me, now i cant even try to reach safety nor can i do much as im rather fragile in my nanoship and cant tank em to take even 1 with me, nor can i reach the gate to get to safety. In this case i dont see how this change will give me more options really. I guess that at the end of the day, we all gotta wait how the testing on sisi will turn out. In general i dont complain alot, but this time i thought i add my 2 cents. Regards
Pinky Denmark The Cursed Navy	Posted - 2008.07.25 13:06:00 - [240] I hope this really fixes the situations I though CCP fixed last time. Note the Warp Scrambler shuting off MWD's might not help a lot. The REAL PROBLEM with nanoships is actually getting close to them... - I'm a nice guy!! But plz hook me up with some pew pew...



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