Ehm, so just because it's an exploit to you, it is an exploit to CCP to even when they havent said a single word about being an exploit?

And the fact that this mechanic have been like this for ages (yes i know how most of the game mechanics works since i have been playing EVE since early 2004), it would absolutely have been decleared an exploit a long long time ago IF this had been an exploit since this kind of things about the log off mechanics was being talked about many many times earlier until CCP changed it and everyone was happy about it.

And if someone like you would take that as an exploit long time ago, then why would no one declear that as an exploit earlier when it's so obvious by you that it's an exploit now?

Do you really think that you are the only one to know how those mechanics works just out of the blue sky?

Why would no one else declear this as an exploit earlier when it's pretty easy to understand the whole mechanics behind all of this?

EDIT: And the fact that you compare the log off mechanics with the web tactic that prevents us from warping out is kinda funny. Because when someone does the web exploit, the targets can't do a damn thing to prevent them from dying, while a freighter that logs off in low sec before he gets agressed doesn't prevent you from killing it at all, for 1 minute that is.

All it prevents you from is to kill it if you have to few DPS ships available in that 1 minute moment.

So at the end of the day, bring more DPS ships so no freighters can get away.

Is that so hard?

The fact that the mechanic exists as it does does not therefore mean use of it in this way is not an exploit. It's not hard to imagine a case where something is unfair, but hasn't been brought to CCP's attention. A dev has said they will look at it, which indicates it may be an exploit.

I'll say again, CCP doesn't appear to like it when people log off to save their ships when tarped, and has included mechanics to prevent players from doing so. I believe the "JUST BRING MORE DPS NOOB" argument was used in regards to Titans logging out as well.

Kinda funny that it would gets into CCP's attention now just because of this topic?

I'm pretty sure that this would be taken up ages ago if it had been such a problem.

And if the titan logs off before he gets an aggression, then he have no aggression and SHOULD disapear after one minute. It's that simple.

If this was changed, how would freighter pilots change their behavior? Simple: stop going into low sec. If the freighter does not go into low sec in the first place, it cannot be killed in low sec. Then instead of getting kills by bringing sufficient firepower, you get none at all.

Im fine with that. Thats how it should be.

Yes. This topic brought it to their attention. That was my point.

You misunderstand. Titans were able to log off under aggression and would always disappear after 15 minutes. This was abused by Titan owners to save their Titans when they were trapped and had a chance to live through those 15 minutes. So basically the same thing as this freighter/gatecloak logoffski but with supercaps. This was deemed unfair, and changed so that it is no longer possible to log off a Titan under aggression to save it.

So you mean no one was smart enough to bring it up to CCP's attention before?

I mean, come on, use your brain. If this had been such a problem, this would be taken up to CCP's attention ages ago.

It has been raised, countless times, in the features and ideas discussion section.

Also, CCP if you haven't noticed ignore some things because they're simply tricky to fix. They tend to get round to it only after a fuss is kicked up about it. Sometimes that takes a while.

WTF !!!

Any other ship you feel shouldn't be low sec?

It has been raised, countless times, in the features and ideas discussion section.

Also, CCP if you haven't noticed ignore some things because they're simply tricky to fix. They tend to get round to it only after a fuss is kicked up about it. Sometimes that takes a while.

How would it be tricky to remove the 1 minute timer totally?

Because that's what the OP is crying for.

It would take CCP 5 minutes to remove that from the game.

Again, if this had been such an issue, it would be fixed a long time ago by CCP.

The thing here with the OP's suggestion is that we can't log off in space without letting our ships disapear after 1 minute. What he want is to let every ships in EVE even after logging off safely to be in space for 15 mins.

Therefor most players wont support this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USepJOINZKk&feature=g-u-u&context=G2a828a3FUAAAAAAAAAA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USepJOINZKk&feature=g-u-u&context=G2a828a3FUAAAAAAAAAA


Guy jumps a freighter into low sec.

He logs out before even loading the system.

His freighter decloaks.

One of our guys point it. Thinking we have 15 min to kill it.

Warp in and start shooting it and less the a minute with only 15% hull or so left if that, it just vanishes.

If this is working as intended CCP can get bent.

From the wiki

PvP Log Off Timer (15 Minutes)

The PvP log off timer is triggered by any aggressive action a pilot takes or is taken against him. If a pilot with an active PvP log off timer logs out from the game, his ship will remain in space for at least 15 minutes afterward. If the pilot is shot again after logging off within the 15 minutes, the timer will reset to 15 minutes. This timer will renew for the capsule, should the ship be destroyed.

The wiki indicates its an exploit.

I have a mechanics question for you pro guys out there:

What happens is you log out with one char (close the client) and than log in with the same account with a different character? Would that have no effect on the previous character log in, or could that be what happened when that agressed freighter disappeared?

I'm still hoping for the promised CCP reply. I'd like to know if they are not only aware that this a commonly used tactic (they probably are) but also if they like it that way (meaning it's an intentional situation) or if it was a side effect of a design decision.

Are there plans to change ("correct") this? Will it stay this way, because not only are the rules enforced correctly by the server but also those rules are like this on purpose? Will this be revamped in the process of the 'Crimewatch' overhaul that is underway (as it has to do with flagging this is actually pretty likely) and will it be reimplemented like it is or like it logically should be?

A word of caution though for all those low-sec'ers who wish to shoot more freighters: This might have a worse impact on you than you think, as it will likely stop or at least reduce trade to your region, forcing you to go to high (either with main or alt) for shopping more often. Not all traders (or rather only very few of them) can afford or have at their disposal protection personnel sufficient to protect a freighter on a lowsec trip...

Things are getting a bit heated in this thread, so I wanted to say that while I can't give a definitive answer to the question of this behaviour changing or not, I can promise to raise it tomorrow morning with the design guys and get an answer for you.

Pirates are cowards...

This is the 230th reply to this topic.

EVE is supposed to be hard and there are risks to playing the game. This includes going to low/null sec. Pirates, being the cowards you so describe, are risking thier ships just as much as anyone else. If you don't like PvP don't play EVE.

Simple isn't it?

The solution is to not be so ******* obvious.

"Oh, a massive gate camp, eh? Do current game mechanics allow me to log off here? Yes. Does my ship disappear within a minute if I log off now? Yes. Is this intended? Yes. OK, then I will log off and cross my fingers"

It's the current implementation of game mechanics that this is working as intended. You can't, by definition, call it an exploit until CCP has ruled on it - and then you're not allowed to talk about it. So stop calling things you don't like an exploit.

Next time, use two sodding brain cells and set up a decent trap. Get your ships out of system and off grid. Then just have one stealth bomber decloak and lob a torp to gain aggro.

Then he's done for, because if he logs off he is aggroed, and whatever else he tries he will be too slow getting into warp to escape. Unless he's warping to station, I guess.

You got outplayed, because knowing he could safely log off was smarter than your gatecamp. Sorry.

What ******* country are you from that you can't talk about something that is thought to be broken? You are, by the words stated above, just in a flock of sheep that needs to be taken where your shepard says you must go. Get a clue. Screw it...here is one...if you log off to avoid PVP and can escape the 15 min timer...that is an exploit and it will be called as such (at least by me) until CCP says otherwise.

Do as you say and use your brain cells!

Screw it...here is one...if you log off to avoid PVP and can escape the 15 min timer...that is an exploit and it will be called as such (at least by me) until CCP says otherwise.

The Fact that CCP has said in the past that it's not exploit is not enough of a proof to you? Note how the dev commenting in this thread, talks how he cant answer whether this behaviour (aka 1 minute logoff without aggression) will be changed or not, but will bring it up for discussion. That along with https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=165121#post165121 goes to prove, that at this time, it's not considered exploit by CCP.

Why? Because CCP says xyz is exploit, instead of listing ALL the possible interactions in eve that are NOT exploits. You're basically claiming, that 0.01 isk games, ship bumping, target locking, smartbombing in empire, corp hopping, ANYTHING is exploit until CCP comes down and says "No, this instance number 7559042 is not exploit."

Protip; Old alliance dec shield against wardecs was exploit, they announced it, they acted against it. Then they reversed their decision and it no longer is exploit. Same can happen here, this is not exploit at this moment, it COULD be exploit tomorrow, that's what the CCP guy is saying when he talks about bringing the issue up for re-evaluation.

The Fact that CCP has said in the past that it's not exploit is not enough of a proof to you? Note how the dev commenting in this thread, talks how he cant answer whether this behaviour (aka 1 minute logoff without aggression) will be changed or not, but will bring it up for discussion. That along with https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=165121#post165121 goes to prove, that at this time, it's not considered exploit by CCP.

Why? Because CCP says xyz is exploit, instead of listing ALL the possible interactions in eve that are NOT exploits. You're basically claiming, that 0.01 isk games, ship bumping, target locking, smartbombing in empire, corp hopping, ANYTHING is exploit until CCP comes down and says "No, this instance number 7559042 is not exploit."

Protip; Old alliance dec shield against wardecs was exploit, they announced it, they acted against it. Then they reversed their decision and it no longer is exploit. Same can happen here, this is not exploit at this moment, it COULD be exploit tomorrow, that's what the CCP guy is saying when he talks about bringing the issue up for re-evaluation.