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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
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CCP Navigator
C C P C C P Alliance
1079
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog. CCP Navigator -Community Manager |
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Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
2018
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:39:00 -
[2] - Quote
reserved The Sarcasm is Strong with Me GÇó Member of CSM 5-7 GÇó Blog |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
1657
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard. Vote Two step for CSM7 CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog |
Meissa Anunthiel
Redshift Industrial Rooks and Kings
1202
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
Regrettable... Member of CSM 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 |
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
52
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
Such a shame.... |
Seleene
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
1441
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
This was an unexpected development and we are now working toward resolving both the issue of Mitten's 10k voters and figuring out the process for CSM 7 Chair. Seleene's Sandbox - My Blog, where I say stuff. Follow Seleene on Twitter |
RDevz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
38
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
You've disenfranchised 10,058 voters. Good job. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3723
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
10,058 paying customers totally ignored and disenfranchised. Good work, CCP. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
446
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[9] - Quote
reserved www.noirmercs.com Now Recruiting CSM7, CSM 4 |
Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
429
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
Now that was a silly thing to do Mittens.
WTB: Less drunken alliance panel next year. Dominique Vasilkovsky Mashie Saldana Monica Foulkes |
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Anela Cistine
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
149
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP, will you also be censuring the moderator who allowed the supposedly EULA breaking activity to pass without comment? How about the employees who broadcast and rebroadcast the pannel without bleeping out the offending bits? |
Rick Maken
Secure Space Test Alliance Please Ignore
18
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[12] - Quote
Storm in a tea cup, not a day goes by when I don't hear the words kill yourself in University or online.
Sperging publords making a massive shitstorm over literally nothing have ruined the CSM, and potentially ruined the game.
Thanks guys. |
k'ryn
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
4
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
~10058~
Where's my representation on the CSM now!? |
Innominate
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
147
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[14] - Quote
This is incredibly stupid in so many ways. |
Shigsy
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
0
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:45:00 -
[15] - Quote
HEH
Eggs in one basket goons |
The Crimson Invaider
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
41
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[16] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog. ARE YOU ON COKE OR SOMETHING JESUS CHRIST 10,058 VOTES JUST GONE POOF, 10,058. LET THAT SINK IN. |
JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
139
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[17] - Quote
In before chest beating I suppose? |
Kilylol
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
6
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[18] - Quote
:frogsiren: |
IntegralHellsing
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
69
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
pussies. |
Pattern Clarc
Aperture Harmonics
376
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[20] - Quote
Indeed. Let's move on. Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction |
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Nano V
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
53
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[21] - Quote
This is disgusting, people make mistakes. 10,000 votes wasted. Run the election again and unban The Mittani. |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
92
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[22] - Quote
~10058~ |
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
111
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[23] - Quote
**** this ****, you discard 20% of the voters in one swoop, an out of game action is not bound to the TERMS THE GAME SERVICE |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
784
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[24] - Quote
Man I really hope the CSM comes together on this. Who the **** cares about Issler and Darius, but the rest of them actually have a brain and will see this for the bullshit ridiculous move this is on CCP's part.
Not only have you disenfranchised 10,058 voters, but you've once again taken a step back into the same dung-filled pit that Mittens himself helped pull you out of.
Jita's gonna burnnnnnnnnn |
Levy Break
Martyr's Vengence Test Alliance Please Ignore
18
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[25] - Quote
forfeited his right to serve on CSM 7
What. |
Jean Leaner
Kickass inc Nulli Secunda
52
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[26] - Quote
And CCP thought the Jita protests were bad. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
313
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[27] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog.
I assume we get to recast our votes then? |
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
111
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[28] - Quote
also, free mittani |
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
6
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[29] - Quote
nice |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
49
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
1/6 th of all votes disregarded. Is CCP back a russian sounding abbreviation again? I hear they like to manipulate votes in plain sight there too.
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Bayushi Tamago
Tribuo Quod Victum The AirShip Pirates
30
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[31] - Quote
The Mittani should not be completely removed from CSM. Also, what about the 10k+ votes that were cast for him? I suggest that the election be redone if you are not going to allow him to remain as part of the CSM |
Ampoliros
Aperture Harmonics K162
20
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[32] - Quote
there is not a big enough psyduck in the world
well done, ccp, i eagerly await the next week of forum rage |
LtTysander
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
11
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[33] - Quote
This is bullshit CCP good job putting all our votes to waste. You guys are insufferable way to throw Mittani under the bus hey do us all a favor and throw yourselves under one also. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1682
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[34] - Quote
Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Tomiko Kawase
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
4
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[35] - Quote
In the eternal words of dhdbot:
Quote:dhdbot: THAT IS A ******* BAG OF DICKS JESUS CHRIST |
Heathkit
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
62
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[36] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
570
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[37] - Quote
CCP Violates Integrity of CSM7, cowtows to obvious Sockpuppet harassment. |
Pinkamina Diane Pie
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
14
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[38] - Quote
Let Jita burn. |
digi
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
78
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[39] - Quote
A dangerous precedent for EULA/TOS interpretation. You might have asked him to step down from CSM but this will become a landmark issue.
Also, can someone tell me who owned that video stream and did attendee's know in advance that real life actions would fall under a EULA/TOS?
|
Banderlei Shiiba
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[40] - Quote
Wait, so you admit that you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? And then lied to the press about it?
WELL PLAYED CCP WELL PLAYED |
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Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
216
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[41] - Quote
So you've applied your video game's TOS and EULA to the out of game actions of a person? I assume you'll begin to ban me as well everytime I make insulting comments about my enemy's on kugu.com? Does CCP at any point plan to make well thought out decisions or is it company guideline to pick the most extreme option in every case?
Regardless, you've just robbed over ten thousand of your customers of their voice. Good work! |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
784
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[42] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Go back to pretending to be a dickgirl tia. |
FalconX Blast
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
13
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[43] - Quote
10058 of us want a chance to re-vote if CCP is forcing our representative out of office. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3723
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[44] - Quote
Check this out.
http://i.imgur.com/YHmSE.png "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2195
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[45] - Quote
Reserved. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Wibla
Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team
49
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[46] - Quote
I demand a re-election for CSM7, as CCP has de-facto invalidated a big chunk of the votes cast. CEO Tactical Narcotics Team |
IntegralHellsing
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[47] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
note "media". I laugh at you. |
Kitfox Mikakka
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:48:00 -
[48] - Quote
Holy moly 20% of the votes gone just like that. Awesome, CCP. |
Skye Aurorae
No Bull Ships
212
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:49:00 -
[49] - Quote
Well this is ridiculous.
If this is how things are dealt with then CCP needs to be consistent and remove all CSM council members who have violated the letter of the EULA.
Will be cancelling my credit card authorization over this, sorry CCP, this is unacceptable. Skye Aurora is a 7 year old Girl Who Wants to be on the CSM! Unfortunately, the Lawyers say you have to be 21, so.. Vote for Scott Manley / Skye Aurorae for CSM 7 An Expert in Dealing with Childish Arguments Over Toys. http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=458 |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
115
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:49:00 -
[50] - Quote
Banderlei Shiiba wrote:Wait, so you admit that you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? And then lied to the press about it?
WELL PLAYED CCP WELL PLAYED knock them out.
What's the point of voting if CCP doesn't like the players? |
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BiaXia
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:49:00 -
[51] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
You ran an internet brothel.
That's proof enough that you don't know a good decision from a sack of worn out assholes. |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:49:00 -
[52] - Quote
Skye Aurorae wrote:Well this is ridiculous.
If this is how things are dealt with then CCP needs to be consistent and remove all CSM council members who have violated the letter of the EULA.
Will be cancelling my credit card authorization over this, sorry CCP, this is unacceptable.
Quoting this HAHAHAHAHA |
Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
402
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[53] - Quote
CCP didn't want that community-voted CSM anyway. Let's get back to $10k pants. |
Kerensky White
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[54] - Quote
Shigsy wrote:HEH Eggs in one basket goons
Almost like an alliance that depends on a single shiptype as a crutch. |
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
38
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[55] - Quote
Kitfox Mikakka wrote:Holy moly 20% of the votes gone just like that. Awesome, CCP.
And don't forget less than 10% of the player base
This is strictly a troll, but let this end. If you cancel goodbye. |
Ispia Jaydrath
Reib Autonomous Industries
39
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[56] - Quote
If your goal is to make the CSM meaningless, this is a good first step.
As a voter and a player I am not happy about this, and will be reducing my number of accounts. |
Tuatha De
List Processing Inc Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[57] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
570
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[58] - Quote
Banderlei Shiiba wrote:Wait, so you admit that you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? And then lied to the press about it?
WELL PLAYED CCP WELL PLAYED
The sockpuppets went after the CCP / Sony deal by starting to harass CCP's new Sony overlords, they had to do something at that point.
Expect the next year's fanfest to ban all drinks and be sponsored by Sony. Sony to buy CCP in 5 years. |
Major Spag
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
105
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:50:00 -
[59] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
:Condi: |
ButterNut
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[60] - Quote
Glad to see CCP back to making awful decisions. The CSM is now back to being a joke. |
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Infinimo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
456
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[61] - Quote
:ccp: Theta Squad best squad. Monocle crew represent~
10,058 |
BrendanSO
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[62] - Quote
This is bullshit, **** CCP... |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
207
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[63] - Quote
please do it!
oh and can i haz your stuff?
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
53
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[64] - Quote
Seleene wrote:This was an unexpected development and we are now working toward resolving both the issue of Mitten's 10k voters and figuring out the process for CSM 7 Chair. I'm Sure Darius 3 will release details to EN24 and twitter soon. |
LtTysander
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[65] - Quote
CCP you guys have no backbone and I'm just going to let my subscription run out you guys advertised a game with a harsh universe and now you set a precedent like this? You can keep you carebearing, rock shooting game. |
Xayder
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
102
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[66] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ I don't always post, But when i post I do it with my main |
Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
29
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[67] - Quote
Shenanigans I tell you |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[68] - Quote
U ok bro?
I know it meant a lot to you.
DO NOT kill yourself. |
Eli Grange
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
19
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[69] - Quote
Darius III told me to go kill myself after commenting to him about his breaking of NDA, I demand he be removed from the CSM |
Ajita al Tchar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
173
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[70] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
+eleventyone
I agree for many reasons though I wasn't among the 10058. |
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Infinimo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
456
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[71] - Quote
riverini is on the csm now lmao Theta Squad best squad. Monocle crew represent~
10,058 |
Kalunmaar
SUNDERING Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:51:00 -
[72] - Quote
I am utterly disappointed in the way this is being handled. What about all of us who voted in support of this candidate? This is a slap in t he face to all of us who have been supporting CCP for years. Rather than under reacting, I believe this is a gross overreaction. If our votes are going to count for nothing, why hold an election in the first place? |
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
250
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[73] - Quote
Good job CCP. EULA/ToS violations are serious business. And one lawyer need to know what a contract is.
Mittani is survived this without serious consequence (It could be worse) so be happy and do not attack CCP for the right right (and light) verdict. |
Joepopo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[74] - Quote
If mittens goes, riverini is on this CSM.
Unacceptable! |
Truce Billis
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
39
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[75] - Quote
Infinimo wrote:riverini is on the csm now lmao lol |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
79
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[76] - Quote
the CSM is now a joke |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3723
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[77] - Quote
Oh crap I forgot that my other account was still subscribed.
Not anymore lol "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Win Sui
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
46
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[78] - Quote
CCP you approved the slides. Nice ******* backbone. HTFU indeed. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
79
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[79] - Quote
Infinimo wrote:riverini is on the csm now lmao
ahahaha |
47Magnum
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
29
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:52:00 -
[80] - Quote
CCP, you guys ****** up. |
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MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
207
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:53:00 -
[81] - Quote
Wibla wrote:I demand a re-election for CSM7, as CCP has de-facto invalidated a big chunk of the votes cast.
you are just a goon... your vote/opionion does not count... run along pubbie
nice 5th page snippah! |
School Nickname Worldmonkey
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:53:00 -
[82] - Quote
CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. |
Derrick Munroe
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
39
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:53:00 -
[83] - Quote
Nicely done CCP, out of the frying pan and into the fire. As I've stated in another thread, I didn't even vote for Mittani. But the fact that CCP is so quick to dismiss over 10,000 customers is inexcusable.
Also, Riverini is now on the CSM. Look what you've done, CCP. |
Machine Delta
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:53:00 -
[84] - Quote
You swept away >10k votes and put Riverini onto the CSM.
I don't...
I don't even.
**** dudes. |
k'ryn
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:53:00 -
[85] - Quote
Good thing CCP ousted Mittens when they did, now we can all go back to sitting in station and buying pants!!!! I'm so happy!!!!
Note: The above is intended as sarcasm and the solely the views of the poster and not the views of Black-Mark. |
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:53:00 -
[86] - Quote
Isn't karma such a *****? |
Jacob Kelbrand
Quantum Horizons C0NVICTED
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[87] - Quote
CCP I am disappoint. |
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
7
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[88] - Quote
why you lock my thread bro
|
Mistress Lilu
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[89] - Quote
Only 30 day suspension. Are you kidding me. CCP you have lost your ways. |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
558
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[90] - Quote
I have heard much worse said on these forums than "Incidentally, if you want to make this player go kill himself, here is his name"
I have heard WAY WAY WORSE than that on these forums that weren't censored.
This is blatantly absurd. Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |
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Bella Rugente
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
21
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Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[91] - Quote
Way to crap in a cup, CCP.
On the brighter side, I guess we'll have to have a second party in Jita to celebrate the return of Mittens.. |
Zhentar
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[92] - Quote
This is an incredibly poor decision, especially considering how mere hours ago the situation appeared resolved internally through the CSM. |
Joepopo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[93] - Quote
CCP, you may resume doing the worst possible for these games.
Now, back to this $2000 pair of pants... |
V'raak
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[94] - Quote
~10058~ Burn Jita |
Sidus Sarmiang
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
156
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:54:00 -
[95] - Quote
Stop whining about quitting goons.
Lets focus on making other people quit. |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
584
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[96] - Quote
Win Sui wrote:CCP you approved the slides. Nice ******* backbone. HTFU indeed.
Not only did they approve the slides, they provided the drinks.
What the **** did they THINK would happen if you got a bunch of professional assholes drunk and put them in front of a camera? Homoerotic Poetry? :ccp: |
Htrag
The Carebear Stare Hydroponic Zone
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[97] - Quote
Wow that's unfortunate.
Tough decision though. Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game. |
Heath Ornitz
List Processing Inc Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[98] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ |
School Nickname Worldmonkey
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[99] - Quote
Also Riverini is now on the CSM, what the Christ have you people done? |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[100] - Quote
Daviclond wrote:the CSM is now a joke again FTFY |
|
Camilla Camaro
Empire Criminals.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[101] - Quote
This is ******* bullshit.
Nothing he did was agains the law, and nothing of what he did had anything to do with the CSM.
I want a new election or i cancel my 3 accounts, end of story! |
bestposteringoonfleet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[102] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Wibla wrote:I demand a re-election for CSM7, as CCP has de-facto invalidated a big chunk of the votes cast. you are just a goon... your vote/opionion does not count... run along pubbie nice 5th page snippah!
Yes. Saying a person has a non-equal vote worked so well for white people throughout history...
(This is a reference to how black people in the US used to have a 3/5 vote... this was obviously wrong and immoral)
Please do not spread such hatred in these family oriented forums! |
Infinimo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
465
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[103] - Quote
jita will burn Theta Squad best squad. Monocle crew represent~
10,058 |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
94
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[104] - Quote
nerf titans |
Zendon Taredi
ZT Bank
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:55:00 -
[105] - Quote
Tough, but fair. |
Velanda Omani
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[106] - Quote
The entire "situation" was calming down after Mittani's resignation post and now you reignite it by removing him from the CSM
What are you smoking CCP?
|
Major Spag
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[107] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:Good job CCP. EULA/ToS violations are serious business. And one lawyer need to know what a contract is.
Mittani is survived this without serious consequence (It could be worse) so be happy and do not attack CCP for the right right (and light) verdict.
Fun Fact: Real Life comments are not reflective of any EULA/TOS agreement. Sorry, but if I say racial slurs in real life, that does not mean I am banned from all of the online games I play. |
ButterNut
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[108] - Quote
Oh well I was looking for a good reason to quit this game anyway. |
Yuki 0nna
The White Rose Conventicle
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[109] - Quote
Slow in coming, but well done.
A strong firewall against further damage if this story has legs. |
Methicone
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[110] - Quote
CCP, you are seriously all screwed in the ******* head. |
|
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
675
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[111] - Quote
Alex thought he was untouchable. He stepped over the line and the proper punishment has been issued. He should be grateful he was not perma-banned. Just keep in mind he is not the victim of anything but his own ego.
Thank you CCP for doing the right thing.
|
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
207
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:56:00 -
[112] - Quote
School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes.
why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember...
and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine...
two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple...
your brosefs....
deal wit it!
|
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[113] - Quote
Major Spag wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Good job CCP. EULA/ToS violations are serious business. And one lawyer need to know what a contract is.
Mittani is survived this without serious consequence (It could be worse) so be happy and do not attack CCP for the right right (and light) verdict. Fun Fact: Real Life comments are not reflective of any EULA/TOS agreement. Sorry, but if I say racial slurs in real life, that does not mean I am banned from all of the online games I play.
Fun fact, the fucks ccp give about your what is and is not on the TOS/EULA just left building. |
i hatechosingnames
SUNDERING Goonswarm Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[114] - Quote
Does this call for another CSM emergency summit?
I want my votes back! |
Caellach Marellus
Nephtys Ventures inc
476
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[115] - Quote
So close to 1/6th of the total votes are null and void before the term really starts, and instead of Mittani (who I didn't vote for) we get the f##king Riverini (who NO ONE should ever vote for)
This whole thing should be resolved with a re-election containing all candidates except Mittens. (Yes unfortunately even Riverini and S##tposter the III'd) Enjoy your gaming.
http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com |
Hatsumi Kobayashi
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
77
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[116] - Quote
ccp more like badcp CAUTION
SNIGGS |
Major Spag
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[117] - Quote
Heath Ornitz wrote:~ 10,058 ~
Not empty quoting
|
Louis deGuerre
The Dark Tribe Against ALL Authorities
242
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[118] - Quote
Free Mittani
Haters gonna hate FIRE FRIENDSHIP TORPEDOES ! Louis's epic skill guide v1.1 |
Infinimo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
465
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[119] - Quote
it's cool that you can break the eula of a videogame while not even playing that game Theta Squad best squad. Monocle crew represent~
10,058 |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
584
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[120] - Quote
We had better get a new election at the very least or CCP can go to hell. They waited until Mittani chose to do something, then intentionally twisted his words to make themselves look bigger. Pathetic, spineless cowards. |
|
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
307
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[121] - Quote
aw **** the forums will be gold in the next days
~deal with it~ |
Machine Delta
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:57:00 -
[122] - Quote
You guys should ban me because I am sitting in my room saying EULA/TOS breaking things out loud in front of the monitor.
|
Kaurk Eregnar
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:58:00 -
[123] - Quote
The rage in this thread is too good. CCP will redo something, you can bet on it. But seeing post after post of Goonswarm raging makes me
Goonswarm lol at players overreacting to the incident, then overreact to this themselves.
I think we all need to remember it's just a game above all. |
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:58:00 -
[124] - Quote
Major Spag wrote:Heath Ornitz wrote:~ 10,058 ~ Not empty quoting
A pebble in the sand. |
Raneru
Euphoria Released 0ccupational Hazzard
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:58:00 -
[125] - Quote
One minute you're back on form after a successful fanfest, the next, you're back to Jita riots....
Never a dull moment in Eve. |
Corelin
The Fancy Hats Corporation S I L E N T.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:58:00 -
[126] - Quote
/me grabs popcorn.
|
Major Spag
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[127] - Quote
Nylith Empyreal wrote:Major Spag wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Good job CCP. EULA/ToS violations are serious business. And one lawyer need to know what a contract is.
Mittani is survived this without serious consequence (It could be worse) so be happy and do not attack CCP for the right right (and light) verdict. Fun Fact: Real Life comments are not reflective of any EULA/TOS agreement. Sorry, but if I say racial slurs in real life, that does not mean I am banned from all of the online games I play. Fun fact, the fucks ccp give about your what is and is not on the TOS/EULA just left building.
Fun Fact: You need to stop posting before you seriously injure yourself.
|
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
219
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[128] - Quote
The Mittani isn't even gone for a day and CCP's management is already making bad decisions. |
Anishoara
Federal Institute Industries
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[129] - Quote
Another statue to burn ? lol. |
Infinimo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
465
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[130] - Quote
Machine Delta wrote:You guys should ban me because I am sitting in my room saying EULA/TOS breaking things out loud in front of the monitor.
i just told some guy in jabber to kill himself, I think i broke the EULA?? Theta Squad best squad. Monocle crew represent~
10,058 |
|
Moon Kitten
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[131] - Quote
As one of the voters for Mittani I am -extremely- disappointed by the actions of CCP. Apparently my votes are now meaningless. I don't appreciate being punished by CCP for something I had nothing to do with. If another vote is not forthcoming I will be .. displeased. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
792
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[132] - Quote
Infinimo wrote:jita will burn
|
Aryth
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[133] - Quote
CCP, let me lay this out for you. I get you cannot go back on this decision without looking bad.
You bring people to Iceland. You encourage them to get roaring drunk, you stream this in HD while profiting off it. Then you punish them for out of game actions at said event.
Did you not forsee something like this happening? Really?
What all players should gain from this. Fanfest is not a safe environment to interact with fellow players. It has in-game consequences. I hope you are clear on future fanfest purchasing pages that any actions at your events have in-game consequences. |
Ilarra
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[134] - Quote
So griefing now qualifies as breaking the EULA, but you can get off scot free for breaking the CSM NDA. |
Rex Augustus
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[135] - Quote
First - Jade, you're a joke, and you need to DIAF. Where's my ban?
Secondly, this is an overreaction and severe overstep. TOS doesn't apply to OOG activities, and it's CCP's responsibility to filter even commentary in a unscripted Q&A. If that means the broadcast needs to be delayed 30s for editing, alcohol consumption limits imposed on presenters, whatever, then do it.
CCP is disenfranchising 10,058 votes with this move. The ban is unacceptable enough as it is, however removing from the CSM the single largest vote recipient in the history of CSM over OOG statements is just mindboggling stupid.
Jita will Burn. If you thought the Jita Protest were bad, they were nothing, NOTHING compared to what will be done now. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
315
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[136] - Quote
Yuki 0nna wrote:Slow in coming, but well done.
A strong firewall against further damage if this story has legs.
More like another chance for CCP to get raped in the media. Literally invalidating ten thousand votes? THAT's going to make them look wonderful, isn't it. |
Schwa Nuts
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[137] - Quote
I can't say GO **** YOURSELVES loud enough to clearly express my thoughts. |
Infinimo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
465
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[138] - Quote
free the mittani Theta Squad best squad. Monocle crew represent~
10,058 |
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:59:00 -
[139] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember... and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine... two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple... your brosefs.... deal wit it!
Yet that isn't how a electoral system works.
Cripes, can't believe how many pubbies have little to no brain cells to comprehend how an election works. |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
56
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[140] - Quote
I was abroad last year and missed all the Jita riots fun.
Something tells me this may be even more fun.
Mittens to his credit, (having made a t*t of homslf in Iceland) has acted with considerable decency since his return.
He as publicly and privately apologised to the person concerned and has taken 'step two'
Is it now up to the Goons to behave and act as well as their leader has. |
|
Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
405
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[141] - Quote
Typical CCP problem solving, bad press? Ban everyone, ask questions later.
How cool that you have big plans for expanding on war and combat, when an (admittedly bad, but still a) joke told out of game gets people banned. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
207
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[142] - Quote
Xython wrote:We had better get a new election at the very least or CCP can go to hell. They waited until Mittani chose to do something, then intentionally twisted his words to make themselves look bigger. Pathetic, spineless cowards.
no you do not get a new election you voted for a idiot who broke eula/tos... your fault not mine... |
Li Malak
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[143] - Quote
Bull-*******-****.
I am schocked and disgusted by CCP's decision to ban The Mittani from serving on CSM 7. The Mittani received over 10,000 votes; more than the next two highest vote-getters COMBINED. To throw him off of the CSM 7 is a travesty. CCP's actions harken back to the days of teh t20 scandle, and the unjust destruction of those who spoke up on the issue. CCP and all CCP employees should feel a deep personal shame over today's actions.
~10,058~ |
Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[144] - Quote
Machine Delta wrote:You guys should ban me because I am sitting in my room saying EULA/TOS breaking things out loud in front of the monitor.
Not emptyquoting |
Steamgrind Meatroller
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[145] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:Alex thought he was untouchable. He stepped over the line and the proper punishment has been issued. He should be grateful he was not perma-banned. Just keep in mind he is not the victim of anything but his own ego.
Thank you CCP for doing the right thing.
I wish you'd do the right thing now. I think you know what I'm saying. DO THE RIGHT THING. |
Oliver Duncan
Kick B0rt Test Alliance Please Ignore
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[146] - Quote
The alliance panel is not governed by the TOS of the Eve Client. You let them drink on stage, you let them get out of hand, and now you kick out Dear Leader for actions that you did nothing to stop. Way to disenfranchise 20% of your most active players. CCCP is at it again. |
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
248
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[147] - Quote
Every action has a consequence. Maybe he should have thought about the 10058 people he represented before putting his foot in his mouth rather than after.
Also, I must say for a group of people dedicated to extracting tears, they are doing a great job of shedding them themselves. To the whiners :-áCCP Soundwave "Incursions are not a big issue in terms of isk globally" CCP Recurve "However, Incursions are not the biggest ISK faucet, bounties are"
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[148] - Quote
V'raak wrote:~10058~ Burn Jita
|
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[149] - Quote
Major Spag wrote:Nylith Empyreal wrote:Major Spag wrote:Avila Cracko wrote:Good job CCP. EULA/ToS violations are serious business. And one lawyer need to know what a contract is.
Mittani is survived this without serious consequence (It could be worse) so be happy and do not attack CCP for the right right (and light) verdict. Fun Fact: Real Life comments are not reflective of any EULA/TOS agreement. Sorry, but if I say racial slurs in real life, that does not mean I am banned from all of the online games I play. Fun fact, the fucks ccp give about your what is and is not on the TOS/EULA just left building. Fun Fact: You need to stop posting before you seriously injure yourself.
This would be the part where we start saying umad, but because we both know this profession I will save you the time and repeated posts. But you are a insignificant number amongst the masses of EVE's entirity. So by all means quit, I bet after the year is over they will have MORE subs. |
DelightSucker
Perkone Caldari State
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[150] - Quote
This is The Mittanis own fault not ccp, blame him for this issue. |
|
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[151] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Xython wrote:We had better get a new election at the very least or CCP can go to hell. They waited until Mittani chose to do something, then intentionally twisted his words to make themselves look bigger. Pathetic, spineless cowards. no you do not get a new election you voted for a idiot who broke eula/tos... your fault not mine...
Again mr.hurr-durr. That isn't how an election works. If part of the votes are considered void, then a do-over is required. |
Skye Aurorae
No Bull Ships
213
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:00:00 -
[152] - Quote
Subscription cancelled
http://imgur.com/soaxM,HMZgg#1
http://imgur.com/soaxM,HMZgg#0 Skye Aurora is a 7 year old Girl Who Wants to be on the CSM! Unfortunately, the Lawyers say you have to be 21, so..
|
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
115
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[153] - Quote
so does saying vulgar things on mumble now constitute a 30 day ban? |
Dirk Action
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[154] - Quote
BROTHERS IN ALLAH: MOHAMMED'S GLORIOUS PROPHET the_mittani HAS PLACED A FATWA ON jita. GOD WILLING, WE WILL DIE IN GLORIOUS JIHAD. ALLAHU AKBAR. |
School Nickname Worldmonkey
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[155] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember... and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine... two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple... your brosefs.... deal wit it!
DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY DEMOCRACY.
This argument literally works IRL, why not try it here.
For a better argument, Riverini, will literally be on the CSM. |
Xython
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
584
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[156] - Quote
I am actively calling for people to harass The Wis. Not because he is suicidal, but because he is an Ice Miner Bot running 23 accounts. |
db T
SniggWaffe EVE Corporation 123566322353
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[157] - Quote
Sounds like 10 058 people should have voted for a better candidate. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3727
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[158] - Quote
Li Malak wrote:Bull-*******-****.
I am schocked and disgusted by CCP's decision to ban The Mittani from serving on CSM 7. The Mittani received over 10,000 votes; more than the next two highest vote-getters COMBINED. To throw him off of the CSM 7 is a travesty. CCP's actions harken back to the days of teh t20 scandle, and the unjust destruction of those who spoke up on the issue. CCP and all CCP employees should feel a deep personal shame over today's actions.
~10,058~
Moaning about this is useless. Unsubscribe and they'll listen. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
94
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[159] - Quote
Look at all these goons talking about cancelling their accounts like their titans just got nerfed lma0 |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[160] - Quote
Does the EULA give refund in case of provider voting fraud? |
|
Sara Sue
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[161] - Quote
CCP disregarding the voices of 10058 Players and loosing one of the best csm members all over some drunken ramblings. CCP really likes to screw over its player base by removing one of their voices from the csm.
|
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
147
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[162] - Quote
Jita will burn. |
Kaurk Eregnar
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:01:00 -
[163] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:Look at all these goons talking about cancelling their accounts like their titans just got nerfed lma0
Yea, reading through the thread makes me |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
207
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:02:00 -
[164] - Quote
Lenrir Andven wrote:MeBiatch wrote:School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember... and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine... two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple... your brosefs.... deal wit it! Yet that isn't how a electoral system works. Cripes, can't believe how many pubbies have little to no brain cells to comprehend how an election works.
care the cite the president in internet spaceship democracy that supports a re election clause when a csm breaks eula?
as i remember when akcnabobited broke tos there was no reelection.... |
Nalha Saldana
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
188
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:02:00 -
[165] - Quote
Reelection if anything! |
bestposteringoonfleet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:02:00 -
[166] - Quote
db T wrote:Sounds like 10 058 people should have voted for a better candidate.
dislike
CCP PLEASE DO NOT BAN ME!!!!!! |
Leykan
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:02:00 -
[167] - Quote
Yuki 0nna wrote:Slow in coming, but well done.
A strong firewall against further damage if this story has legs.
So apparently ignoring 10,000 votes without recourse is a "firewall"?
:golfclap: |
Ni Cho
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:02:00 -
[168] - Quote
So.
Yea.
Instead of going for a middle of the road approach, CCP decide to go hard to port.
|
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[169] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Lenrir Andven wrote:MeBiatch wrote:School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember... and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine... two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple... your brosefs.... deal wit it! Yet that isn't how a electoral system works. Cripes, can't believe how many pubbies have little to no brain cells to comprehend how an election works. care the cite the president in internet spaceship democracy that supports a re election clause when a csm breaks eula?
I would contest you, but your poor grasp of grammar and spelling just ruins it for me. |
Raivi
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[170] - Quote
I strongly disagree with this choice.
Mittens made a very poor choice and crossed the line with that comment, but enforcing the TOS that strictly in an out of game context is overkill.
Accept his apology and resignation of chairmanship, make it clear that fanfest is covered by the TOS from now on and stop broadcasting the parts of fanfest that traditionally come close to the line (alliance/csm panels and quiz show). This decision makes me a sad Raivi. |
|
Heathkit
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[171] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ |
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[172] - Quote
DIAF CCP, kthxbai |
Acwron
Meet The Fockers Vera Cruz Alliance
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[173] - Quote
You gotta be kidding me...30 days? Perma ban is the right decision. Being friend with CCP employees is priceless, lets you go free. 30 is nothing for what damage he's done to the game. I'm really disappointed. |
Steamgrind Meatroller
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[174] - Quote
Xython wrote:I am actively calling for people to harass The Wis. Not because he is suicidal, but because he is an Ice Miner Bot running 23 accounts.
I hope he pods himself. |
Twistator
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[175] - Quote
Way to invalidate the entire CSM. How are we supposed to take the representation seriously now.
Where will this lead, will you ban people for talking **** on other sites? In RL?
Whats the point of the election if the losing part of the election (and lets face it thats all these ($%&/ here complaining) whine about some stupid thing later to because they despicse him so much, not because of what he did just because they hate him in game and his giant Ego. Thats all this is about and not about the miner dude ...
anyway ... its what we "do" right? Ill sacrifice my sec status in Jita soon .... it will burn. You have given this a whole new meaning!
|
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
791
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[176] - Quote
just started 10 more 10 hour hero accounts with my scam winnings
isboxer timeeeeee |
Serena Hennessy
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[177] - Quote
It is quite a shame to see that despite our giving Alex over 20% of the votes cast he won't be sitting on the CSM at all.
I'd suggest some serious work needs to be done to revise the architechture and electoral process of the CSM if it is possible to simply discard the will of 10,058 paying customers in this manner.
In a true Democracy, an action such as this would likely force the entire election to be set aside and a new election called.
I'd imagine there's just over 10000 people who would like another opportunity to decide what our next CSM will look like; to call this "The Conclusion" is a gross misnomer.
A solution that discards the will of 20% of the voting customers is no solution at all. |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:03:00 -
[178] - Quote
Infinimo wrote:it's cool that you can break the eula of a videogame while not even playing that game
|
Grogoth Drem
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[179] - Quote
Number of PL CSM members: 2 Number of Goonswarm CSM members: 0
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
(in game) |
Bill Banner
State War Academy Caldari State
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[180] - Quote
RDevz wrote:You've disenfranchised 10,058 voters. Good job.
I voted for Nixon too. |
|
Sernum
Total Mayhem. Northern Coalition.
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[181] - Quote
(INSERTS DRAMA) |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[182] - Quote
Infinimo wrote:it's cool that you can break the eula of a videogame while not even playing that game
Anyone have me a book about weird abominations in Icelandic law speaking? Inquiring minds want to know.
|
Steamgrind Meatroller
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[183] - Quote
Acwron wrote:You gotta be kidding me...30 days? Perma ban is the right decision. Being friend with CCP employees is priceless, lets you go free. 30 is nothing for what damage he's done to the game. I'm really disappointed.
What damage is that exactly? Oh right, the vein sticking out on your forehead. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
211
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[184] - Quote
Sara Sue wrote:CCP disregarding the voices of 10058 Players and loosing one of the best csm members all over some drunken ramblings. CCP really likes to screw over its player base by removing one of their voices from the csm.
or how about how stupid that only 15% voted for csm! thats 85% disregarded by a stupid policy! thats like 300 000 disregarded players every time they do csm... |
Leykan
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[185] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:
care the cite the president in internet spaceship democracy that supports a re election clause when a csm breaks eula?
as i remember when akcnabobited broke tos there was no reelection....
Care to cite where in a EULA/TOS applies out of the game client/world? |
Kitfox Mikakka
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
91
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[186] - Quote
Every cfc member in this thread whining about canceling their accounts is badposting like all hell, stop it you guys. :colbert: |
bestposteringoonfleet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[187] - Quote
This is definitely not due process!
I thought EVE Online: A Spaceship Game was not a pure dicktatorship! |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[188] - Quote
ButterNut wrote:Oh well I was looking for a good reason to quit this game anyway.
Why? |
Adrenalinemax
The Graduates RAZOR Alliance
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[189] - Quote
So, EXACTLY where do TOS/EULA end?
I want my votes back....
Re-election |
Radelix Cisko
The Adjustment Team
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:04:00 -
[190] - Quote
Looks like Eve found its Nixon.
Apparently assisted in making game better, gets fired for bad decision. Such is life |
|
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
86
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:05:00 -
[191] - Quote
Florida? |
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:05:00 -
[192] - Quote
Kitfox Mikakka wrote:Every cfc member in this thread whining about canceling their accounts is badposting like all hell, stop it you guys. :colbert:
Because we know how far the titan pilots got with their rage quits amirite? |
Banderlei Shiiba
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:05:00 -
[193] - Quote
THIS IS A STRONG MOVE BY CCP TO PROTECT THEMSELVES
*admits to being fine with making fun of suicidal players* *allows raging drunk to make said presentation* *lies to press about vetting presentations* |
bestposteringoonfleet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:05:00 -
[194] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Sara Sue wrote:CCP disregarding the voices of 10058 Players and loosing one of the best csm members all over some drunken ramblings. CCP really likes to screw over its player base by removing one of their voices from the csm.
or how about how stupid that only 15% voted for csm! thats 85% disregarded by a stupid policy! thats like 300 000 disregarded players every time they do csm...
People who do not take the time to vote do not have the right to complain when the election does not go the way they want it. |
Revii Lagoon
The Foreign Legion Test Alliance Please Ignore
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:05:00 -
[195] - Quote
The CSM has worked so hard to be built up to what it is today, now only to have the person who made it all possible removed from the CSM over some drunken statements. What does this mean? Future CSM's will need to be very very cautious about anything they say, because if they make themselves look bad they may just get the banhammer. So how will the CSM clearly state their intentions if they are not the "popular" view?
You thought the jita riots were bad, wait till you see the **** storm that this mess brews, you literally just **** all over the CSM. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
211
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:06:00 -
[196] - Quote
Lenrir Andven wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Lenrir Andven wrote:MeBiatch wrote:School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember... and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine... two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple... your brosefs.... deal wit it! Yet that isn't how a electoral system works. Cripes, can't believe how many pubbies have little to no brain cells to comprehend how an election works. care the cite the president in internet spaceship democracy that supports a re election clause when a csm breaks eula? I would contest you, but your poor grasp of grammar and spelling just ruins it for me.
sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right! |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:06:00 -
[197] - Quote
I was planning on going to FanFest next year, but now not so much. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:07:00 -
[198] - Quote
here's to a year of every CFC forum ***** shitting all over jita park and the CSM as a whole |
Vhaine Vhindiscar
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:07:00 -
[199] - Quote
10000, CCP. |
Stephen Haags
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:07:00 -
[200] - Quote
Well the removal from the CSM is utter bullshit. My an 10057 other votes have with that move evaporated into thin air.
Either we get re-elections or dissolve the entirety of the CSM b/c w/o those 10058 votes that CSM is damn worth nothing!
FREE MITTENS!
|
|
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:07:00 -
[201] - Quote
So, with this ruling, one can surmise that one's actions at Fanfest are covered under the game's EULA? Could you point out where in the EULA this provision is?
Sounds like a great reason to skip Fanfest next year. And maybe the year after that. |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
128
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:07:00 -
[202] - Quote
Can I have your stuff ? |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
211
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:07:00 -
[203] - Quote
bestposteringoonfleet wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Sara Sue wrote:CCP disregarding the voices of 10058 Players and loosing one of the best csm members all over some drunken ramblings. CCP really likes to screw over its player base by removing one of their voices from the csm.
or how about how stupid that only 15% voted for csm! thats 85% disregarded by a stupid policy! thats like 300 000 disregarded players every time they do csm... People who do not take the time to vote do not have the right to complain when the election does not go the way they want it.
or how about you just voted for the cfc leader cuss you were told too... instead of reading about the other CSM peeps and voting with your head... you voted like a good drone... and now you are paying for it...
get a grip mate there is always next year! |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
82
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:08:00 -
[204] - Quote
Solo Drakban for runoff CSM candidate |
Leykan
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:08:00 -
[205] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right!
Still waiting on you to explain the whole TOS applicable in a RL situation thing here...
|
Captain Trousers
Thunderwaffles Goonswarm Federation
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:08:00 -
[206] - Quote
You now have 10,058 suicidal voters, I ask that you please step down from game development. (too late) |
Dirk Action
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:08:00 -
[207] - Quote
BROTHERS IN ALLAH: MOHAMMED'S GLORIOUS PROPHET the_mittani HAS PLACED A FATWA ON jita. GOD WILLING, WE WILL DIE IN GLORIOUS JIHAD. ALLAHU AKBAR. |
Radelix Cisko
The Adjustment Team
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:08:00 -
[208] - Quote
Vhaine Vhindiscar wrote:10000, CCP.
He got the job but then he pulled a stupid. |
Sala Cameron
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:08:00 -
[209] - Quote
man, really?
and another shitstorm begins v0v |
Hikaru Kuroda
Shimai of New Eden
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:09:00 -
[210] - Quote
Almost everyone wants bots to be banned, but suddenly no one thinks that cyber bullying should be punished. |
|
None ofthe Above
147
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:09:00 -
[211] - Quote
This must have been an extremely difficult decision to make.
CCP must have known that it was not going to please very many.
I still think Alex/Mittani could have taken the high road and possibly avoided this, but since his response was more "I want to be free to do worse," I can't say I blame CCP.
Have to say I applaud the courage, and hope it turns out to be the right course for the game in the long run.
|
Hydrogen Hydrogen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:09:00 -
[212] - Quote
DariusIII, I'm offended by your existence and you want me want to kill myself by existing.
Ban him and remove him from CSM please.
|
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:09:00 -
[213] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:bestposteringoonfleet wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Sara Sue wrote:CCP disregarding the voices of 10058 Players and loosing one of the best csm members all over some drunken ramblings. CCP really likes to screw over its player base by removing one of their voices from the csm.
or how about how stupid that only 15% voted for csm! thats 85% disregarded by a stupid policy! thats like 300 000 disregarded players every time they do csm... People who do not take the time to vote do not have the right to complain when the election does not go the way they want it. or how about you just voted for the cfc leader cuss you were told too... instead of reading about the other CSM peeps and voting with your head... you voted like a good drone... and now you are paying for it... get a grip mate there is always next year!
HAHAHAH.
Are you really trying to tell me Darius III is a fantastic choice?
Come on, I want you, the horse's mouth, to tell me Darius III would be a fantastic CSM.
|
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
221
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:09:00 -
[214] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote: Is it now up to the Goons to behave and act as well as their leader has.
We're going to make every last one of you pay for this. Kiss your favorite market hub good bye. |
bestposteringoonfleet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:09:00 -
[215] - Quote
[q uote=MeBiatch]Lenrir Andven wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Lenrir Andven wrote:MeBiatch wrote:School Nickname Worldmonkey wrote:CCP, you literally better give me my assfucking vote back. I'm Irish and can legitimately live with the illusion of democracy where my elected representative makes no decisions, but deposing the people's King of Space goes too far.
I propose that you give all those who voted for Mittani their votes back, which will now become STV votes. why not every player voted... only 15% of the player base voted remember... and you voted for a person who broke eula/tos... thats not ccps fault... you voted for a idiot... thats your fault... not mine... two step is now the logical chioce... and the next person inline who did not get voted in should now be the 14th csm... plain and simple... your brosefs.... deal wit it! Yet that isn't how a electoral system works. Cripes, can't believe how many pubbies have little to no brain cells to comprehend how an election works. care the cite the president in internet spaceship democracy that supports a re election clause when a csm breaks eula? I would contest you, but your poor grasp of grammar and spelling just ruins it for me.
sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right![/q65uote]
CCP please ban this guy! His huge wall of non-important quoted text offends me and made my Canadian kickboxing girlfriend talk about moving out. She I am not suicidal yet, but she is the only thing that is keeping me together!!!!
|
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
680
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:10:00 -
[216] - Quote
k'ryn wrote:~10058~
Where's my representation on the CSM now!?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ubw5N8iVDHI
|
Kyle Myr
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
204
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:10:00 -
[217] - Quote
As a participating voter, I find this unacceptable, and I didn't even vote for Mittani on every account. This calls into question the legitimacy of this process and the CSM as an organization elected by players. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
210
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:10:00 -
[218] - Quote
Leykan wrote:MeBiatch wrote:sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right! Still waiting on you to explain the whole TOS applicable in a RL situation thing here...
fanfest feed is linked to the forums...
official ccp broadcasts are subject to tos...
by breaking tos you loose your right to be on this years CSM and get an auto 30 day ban...
no if and or butts about it!
|
Senorita putatita
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:10:00 -
[219] - Quote
So u guys had to agree to abide by the TOS/EULA to enter and speak at fanfest? |
Zagdul
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
487
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:11:00 -
[220] - Quote
CCP of old never would have made this decision.
The guy who got dudes to sing their national anthem and posted their name all over the panel. Is he banned too?
It's not Rocket Surgery |
|
sweetnbullet
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:11:00 -
[221] - Quote
FREE THE MITTANI !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
Wolfgang Helm
Valar Morghulis. Gentlemen's Agreement
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:11:00 -
[222] - Quote
March 22 - The Mittani makes an ass of himself at Alliance Panel - attended by CCP - broadcast by CCP
March 24 - CCP announces results of CSM elections and introduces new CSM
announcing "Congratulations to the delegates. Alexander Gianturco (The Mittani) has re-won the chairman position having won the most votes of the delegates this election. He is also the first candidate to exceed the 10,000 vote mark. This CSM will take office on April 4th, and their first order of business will be to decide upon the vice-chair, secretary and vice-secretary positions."
March 26 - CCP announces "internal investigation" of events that happened before their own eyes but was irrelevant until the press gave them trouble
March 28 - CCP bans The Mittani, strips him of CSM 7 position and disenfranchises the "first candidate to exceed the 10,000 vote mark."
Interesting timeline? Where was the outrage on Mar 23 CCP?
Ban yes, remove from chair yes - removal from CSM was too far.
|
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
639
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:11:00 -
[223] - Quote
the right decition a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked |
Abyss Azizora
The Red Sun Empire
20
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[224] - Quote
First time in years I've heard such WONDERFUL news on the eve forum. I think I'll do a little dance.
On a sidenote, I really don't care about what happened, I see that as "normal" in eve honestly nowadays. But if that thing got a goon rear end firmly parted by a boot on his way out the door... Then it's a freaking celebration to me. Where's a party emoticon when you need it? |
Madlof Chev
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[225] - Quote
You might want to invalidate that CSM election seeing as you just removed over half of the votes. |
adam smash
University of Caille Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[226] - Quote
Everyone crying about you 10k idiots who voted for him.
Hey, go vote for a CSM style person in ANY OTHER GAME.
You can't? What?
Ya STFU and HTFU that CCP even ALLOWS this voting. I'd just remove the CSM at this point if I was ccp.
You all know you won't quit over the removal of the worthless CSM.
Bunch of babies should not even be allowed to vote. |
Gabriel Anjelos
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[227] - Quote
We should probably remove scamming and suicide ganking from eve too, I'm sure those aspects of the game will generate some bad publicity for CCP at some point.
Hell, remove everything that could offend anyone. Darius 3 for CSM chair. Ron Paul for president. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[228] - Quote
Acwron wrote:You gotta be kidding me...30 days? Perma ban is the right decision. Being friend with CCP employees is priceless, lets you go free. 30 is nothing for what damage he's done to the game. I'm really disappointed. DON'T NERF MY TITIAN CCP! |
Panda Name
Republic University Minmatar Republic
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[229] - Quote
this is pretty dumb. i didn't vote him because he has a soul patch, but 10 thousand votes is sort of a lot in this small community.
banning him for 30 days on top of it all is equally stupid. why not just be complete cowards and ban alcohol at fanfest? it's about as lame.
anyone who would potentially play the game known as eve online isn't going to be drawn to it because of this coddling you now hear about in the press. they, like everyone else here, was drawn to the game because of its utter cruelty and praise for such acts.
oh well.
in case anyone from ccp who has a brain actually reads this: consider this compromise: make mittens shave off his chinstrap soul patch, and all will be forgiven. |
Whatayoke
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:12:00 -
[230] - Quote
So the great dictator gets 30 day ban, and others who did something similar (you remember the "die in a fire guy"?) get perma banned. Good job CCP. |
|
Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
205
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[231] - Quote
10,000 people didnt vote for a jackass with a big mouth, they voted because he had done a good job before. He slipped up, everyones human, but theres a lot more humans to pick from the player base that dont have big stupid mouths.
Hans for chairman.
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
Radelix Cisko
The Adjustment Team
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[232] - Quote
Wolfgang Helm wrote:
Interesting timeline? Where was the outrage on Mar 23 CCP?
Drunk at fanfest |
DelightSucker
Perkone Caldari State
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[233] - Quote
Wolfgang Helm wrote:
Ban yes, remove from chair yes - removal from CSM was too far.
you are aware that the Ban is what makes him getting kicked form csm right?
|
Degotoga
Galactica Armada Fidelas Constans
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[234] - Quote
Oh god this is going to be good.
Hope you didn't want Jita sock puppets. |
SuperBeastie
Martyr's Vengence Test Alliance Please Ignore
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[235] - Quote
hold a new election or reinstate mittens. ~10058~ people agree with me. |
Corelin
The Fancy Hats Corporation S I L E N T.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[236] - Quote
http://www.evenews24.com/2012/03/24/csm7-and-the-winners-are/
18k+ votes for other candidates that didn't win. He was speaking as the leader of Goonswarm at an EvE event, about actions to take in-game. It's not exactly an Olympic-caliber leap to connect that to the EULA.
Kvit yer Kvetching. |
Captain Trousers
Thunderwaffles Goonswarm Federation
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[237] - Quote
Bienator II wrote:the right decition
But not the right spelling! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3728
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[238] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Leykan wrote:MeBiatch wrote:sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right! Still waiting on you to explain the whole TOS applicable in a RL situation thing here... fanfest feed is linked to the forums... official ccp broadcasts are subject to tos... by breaking tos you loose your right to be on this years CSM and get an auto 30 day ban... no if and or butts about it!
shut up you bleating moron
no game company should disenfranchise a large group of vocal customers with TEN THOUSAND accounts between them
that's not a bold move that's a stupid ******* move "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
MyBoy friday
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:14:00 -
[239] - Quote
I am one of the astounding 17% of the electorate who've had their votes taken away from them by this knee jerk reaction. I demand the right to apply my vote to another candidate of MY CHOICE. |
adopt
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
356
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:14:00 -
[240] - Quote
This is outrageous, 10,058 players who bothered voting are now left, with a euphemism I use without a light heart, pissing in the wind. Most of the bandwagoneers so to speak probably didn't even vote in the CSM election, why on earth should their opinions be voiced and leading to the banning of a highly influential player, who has been a great asset to the game and CCP.
This is an outrageous crack in the folds of democracy. I do hope CCP compensates those TEN THOUSAND AND FIFTY EIGHT voters with a fair and quick solution. Shadoo > Always remember to fit Cynosural Field Generator I, have 450 Liquid Ozone in your cargo and convo a friendly Pandemic Legion member if you have a capital or super capital ship tackled.
FREE XOLVE ~ THE HERO TEST NEEDS |
|
Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
869
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:14:00 -
[241] - Quote
Joepopo wrote:If mittens goes, riverini is on this CSM.
Unacceptable!
oh god...
... kill me now! My homeboys tried to warn me But that butt you got makes me so horny |
buck herrick
101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:14:00 -
[242] - Quote
perfect.
:popcorn: /tears/ ~drama~
i am glad i took the day off. |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
95
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:14:00 -
[243] - Quote
I DONT SEE MITTANI POSTING IN THIS THREAD. |
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:15:00 -
[244] - Quote
CCP. Good move. Confidence restored at this point.
|
Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
869
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:15:00 -
[245] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:I DONT SEE MITTANI POSTING IN THIS THREAD.
Im not sure if you heard, but he got a week long ban My homeboys tried to warn me But that butt you got makes me so horny |
Isabella300
FinFleet Raiden.
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:15:00 -
[246] - Quote
Well done CCP .. But you really did not have any other choice :) |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3730
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:15:00 -
[247] - Quote
Valkyria Caeli wrote:10,058 people were denied nothing. 10,058 made their choice and it turned out to be a poor one. 10,058 people choose a person to represent them who through his own action made himself unable to fulfill that role. Perhaps consider voting for one of your own who displays more restraint. Good luck finding such a person.
Totally untrue and that's a terribly ignorant opinion. But hey, forum alt. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Jagga Spikes
Spikes Chop Shop
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:15:00 -
[248] - Quote
well, wouldn't mind him stay on CSM7, just not as chairman. EVE deserves Goons, and Goons deserve The Mittani.
then again, a year is not long. |
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:16:00 -
[249] - Quote
buck herrick wrote:perfect.
:popcorn: /tears/ ~drama~
i am glad i took the day off.
Your corp name is a disgrace to the true heroes. Go biomass yourself. |
Tig Ole Bitties
State War Academy Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:16:00 -
[250] - Quote
The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
|
|
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
309
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:16:00 -
[251] - Quote
Skippermonkey wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I DONT SEE MITTANI POSTING IN THIS THREAD. Im not sure if you heard, but he got a week long ban that was the joke |
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:17:00 -
[252] - Quote
Andski wrote:Valkyria Caeli wrote:10,058 people were denied nothing. 10,058 made their choice and it turned out to be a poor one. 10,058 people choose a person to represent them who through his own action made himself unable to fulfill that role. Perhaps consider voting for one of your own who displays more restraint. Good luck finding such a person. Totally untrue and that's a terribly ignorant opinion. But hey, forum alt.
Yes...choices.
http://greedygoblin.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/millionaire-next-door.html
Reasonable man this guy
'Oh my! Most of the candidates are idiots, "vote for me, I promise you the Moon" PR whores and wannabe tech support guys.'
Even if he knows that most of the CSM Candidates are a waste of space. Should of kept the Mittani. |
seugah
Boob Heads Test Friends Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:17:00 -
[253] - Quote
Next thing to happen will be all the high sec gankers will face law suits from the pubbies crying in local and threatening to get mercs on their asse's. Pirates will be forced to give back their plunder or face criminal damages.
Make jita burn.
|
Angelus X
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:17:00 -
[254] - Quote
lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee |
Frocke
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:17:00 -
[255] - Quote
lmbo |
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:17:00 -
[256] - Quote
Tig Ole Bitties wrote:The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
ROFL so true! |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
83
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[257] - Quote
check to see if i've been banned
e: woop |
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
42
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[258] - Quote
Andski wrote:Valkyria Caeli wrote:10,058 people were denied nothing. 10,058 made their choice and it turned out to be a poor one. 10,058 people choose a person to represent them who through his own action made himself unable to fulfill that role. Perhaps consider voting for one of your own who displays more restraint. Good luck finding such a person. Totally untrue and that's a terribly ignorant opinion. But hey, forum alt.
Name calling is the sign of a person who has lost their argument. Aren't you going to unsub in protest or continue to **** and moan to deaf ears on a forum? |
JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
139
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[259] - Quote
seugah wrote:Next thing to happen will be all the high sec gankers will face law suits from the pubbies crying in local and threatening to get mercs on their asse's. Pirates will be forced to give back their plunder or face criminal damages.
Make jita burn.
Don't stop at jita; burn ALL the hubs. I'm not sure what else to say, this is really really /really/ dissapointing. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3730
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[260] - Quote
Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee
$150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
|
Dregol
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[261] - Quote
Skippermonkey wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I DONT SEE MITTANI POSTING IN THIS THREAD. Im not sure if you heard, but he got a week long ban
30 day. HTH
Horrible decision CCP, you've taken sperging to new heights. |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
47
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[262] - Quote
Nice sledgehammer to a nut...
Can I have my vote back please? |
Gabriel Anjelos
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:18:00 -
[263] - Quote
Wolfgang Helm wrote:March 22 - The Mittani makes an ass of himself at Alliance Panel - attended by CCP - broadcast by CCP
March 24 - CCP announces results of CSM elections and introduces new CSM
announcing "Congratulations to the delegates. Alexander Gianturco (The Mittani) has re-won the chairman position having won the most votes of the delegates this election. He is also the first candidate to exceed the 10,000 vote mark. This CSM will take office on April 4th, and their first order of business will be to decide upon the vice-chair, secretary and vice-secretary positions."
March 26 - CCP announces "internal investigation" of events that happened before their own eyes but was irrelevant until the press gave them trouble
March 28 - CCP bans The Mittani, strips him of CSM 7 position and disenfranchises the "first candidate to exceed the 10,000 vote mark."
Interesting timeline? Where was the outrage on Mar 23 CCP?
Ban yes, remove from chair yes - removal from CSM was too far.
Why are you blue to me? Get the hell out of my coalition you pubbie piece of ****. |
Alf Retardo
State War Academy Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:19:00 -
[264] - Quote
well rules are rules and they got broken, **** happens ;)
btw: so the main reason why goons now whine is all the tech billions wasted on making new accounts and reactivate accounts to win the election (8200 votes less then 30days old)
karma is a ***** |
Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
211
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:19:00 -
[265] - Quote
Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee
hahahahaa...
wait srs?
Mittens ruining the game for his alliance and making them quit would be so juicy and awesome that my head might just explode.
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
213
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:19:00 -
[266] - Quote
Andski wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Leykan wrote:MeBiatch wrote:sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right! Still waiting on you to explain the whole TOS applicable in a RL situation thing here... fanfest feed is linked to the forums... official ccp broadcasts are subject to tos... by breaking tos you loose your right to be on this years CSM and get an auto 30 day ban... no if and or butts about it! shut up you bleating moron no game company should disenfranchise a large group of vocal customers with TEN THOUSAND accounts between them that's not a bold move that's a stupid ******* move
dude over 300 000 get "disenfranchised" every damn time there are CSM elections...
untill CSM elections are mandatory based on loggin... you will never have a Representative vote...
there are plenty of left over csm peeps who are more then qualified to represent your collective voice cfc... the rest of the 7 are smart people and have my confidence... |
k'ryn
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:19:00 -
[267] - Quote
Taihbea wrote:CCP. Good move. Confidence restored at this point.
I hope you enjoy your Pants Online game.
On a side note...if you value anything more expensive than a newbie ship I would avoid Jita for the next 31 days, as it stands I believe the CFC is making the great migration to High sec as I type. Expect 100% TiDi and an overview clogged with the wrecks of the wretched.
GG CCP, and can I please have rainbow spaceships nao? |
Rossitz
Lost Souls Corp STR8NGE BREW
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:19:00 -
[268] - Quote
Taste those Goon tears.
I do, however, think this is harsh. |
Pallidum Treponema
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
88
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:19:00 -
[269] - Quote
It's regrettable it had to go to this, but I support the decision by CCP.
I understand that others may not approve. I can only recommend that said people protest these actions by voting with their wallets. |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[270] - Quote
Tarsus Zateki wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote: Is it now up to the Goons to behave and act as well as their leader has.
We're going to make every last one of you pay for this. Kiss your favorite market hub good bye.
How are you going to make me pay?
Mittens admitted his error of judgment. There had to be a penalty.
A warm glass of milk and a good nights sleep and you will feel better in the morning.
Oh, and please publicise the date and time for the 'sacking of Jita', I want to make sure I am logged on to witness it. |
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[271] - Quote
Muad 'dib wrote:10,000 people didnt vote for a jackass with a big mouth,
Says you.. |
Ricky Roma
x13 Raiden.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[272] - Quote
[quote=Taihbea][quote=Tig Ole Bitties]The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
I came whit you.
GG mittens and CFC tears best tears,
|
Nex apparatu5
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
239
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[273] - Quote
Threadnaut of the year ~I was there~ |
Nvee
EVE Bookies
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[274] - Quote
Tears.
Glorious goon Tears.
Look at all the little goons "unsub" & " lawyer up" , poor little guys.
30 day ban is really nothing. It should be a perma ban. They have banned people for a lot less.
|
Torak Dakos
The Restless Masquerade Hedonistic Imperative
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[275] - Quote
it's regrettable but i see nothing wrong with the decision |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3730
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[276] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:dude over 300 000 get "disenfranchised" every damn time there are CSM elections...
Those 300,000 chose not to vote. It is not our problem that they choose to remain apathetic. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
316
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[277] - Quote
Taihbea wrote:Tig Ole Bitties wrote:The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
ROFL so true!
So tell me about your ideal EVE, with a panties dropping button, $1000 jeans and even more empty rooms to walk slowly in! |
Katarina Reid
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
148
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[278] - Quote
so when u go to fanfest u have to sign or agree to a eula/tos? where in the eula/tos does it say about eve events? thought it was just about ingame stuff and there forums. can i see the names of all the botters in eve that have been banned? oh wait there not a scapegoat. can i revote with the other 10k? temp ban is ok, losing chiar fair enough, but why remove from the csm way to **** off 10k voters. he got 2x more votes than anyone does it mean nothing? |
Angelus X
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[279] - Quote
Andski wrote:$150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal
heh you do know CCP can see just how many accounts go unsubbed everytime goon coons get all emotional like this, riigghttt?
|
Leykan
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[280] - Quote
Tig Ole Bitties wrote:The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
We're not on about the banning or the removal, we're on about the 10,000 voted which are now worthless. Unless of course you're really into that who voter disenfranchisement thing... |
|
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
99
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:20:00 -
[281] - Quote
rexi_calhoun: jesus **** you f*****s posting on eve-o are as bad if not MORE spergy then the pubbies |
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
253
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[282] - Quote
Alf Retardo wrote:well rules are rules and they got broken, **** happens ;)
btw: so the main reason why goons now whine is all the tech billions wasted on making new accounts and reactivate accounts to win the election (8200 votes less then 30days old)
karma is a *****
SOOO THIS!!! |
Revii Lagoon
The Foreign Legion Test Alliance Please Ignore
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[283] - Quote
**** it, we don't want our vote back. We want the person who we rightfully elected to be on the CSM. |
Tanaka Aiko
ICE is Coming to EVE Goonswarm Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[284] - Quote
okay so after the 1000$ pants wasted we have the 10058 votes wasted ?
how can you consider the CSM as something serious if you decide to fire the winner, who have already taken measures by himself to apologize ?! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3730
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[285] - Quote
Nvee wrote:Tears.
Glorious goon Tears.
Look at all the little goons "unsub" & " lawyer up" , poor little guys.
30 day ban is really nothing. It should be a perma ban. They have banned people for a lot less.
Nobody cares about the ban. The fact that he was removed from the CSM despite 10,000+ accounts backing him is the issue here. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Tango Zulu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[286] - Quote
Cross-posting for relevance.
Jade Constantine wrote:bloody hell, I step away to have a corp meeting and its another 30 pages :)
Anyway I'm glad he has gathered his courage and resigned from the role of chair of the CSM (which is the absolute minimum he needed to do really). For the moment I'm satisfied with this and we'll see what develops really. I'm sure the story isn't completely finished but I hope we've all learned some valuable lessons.
Congratulations to everyone on my side of the floor, this day we won a victory for some standards of ooc camaraderie and mutual respect in eve online.
I might agree with you if this had to do with the CSM, but it doesn't so the "absolute minimum" he needed to do was apologize, if he personally felt responsible to do so. If he had said every word he said in Jita local to an audience of 1500+, no one would have blinked an eye about it. In the end this was The Mittani saying something about The Wiz (or whatever his name is) with regards to EVE at an EVE event. He didn't find and give everyone his real name and address, he didn't mail him anthrax, he didn't even say "Good, kill yourself." The panel show was how people react to our actions in game. You can try to say he's a representative of the player base, but that doesn't mean that he needs to have infinite love and respect for what people say over the internet. (For the non-goons in the audience, he's the third person in recent memory that mentioned self-harm after losing their assets. We hear it often enough by people who want stuff back from scams/want sympathy for losses.) In American politics you do not need to love and agree with the religious right to run as a left-leaning democrat.
What we are seeing is people who despise goons writing the most eloquent posts they have in years trying to close the deal with his stepping down, while goons and allies ask, "What does it have to do with the politics of EVE?" and independent-minded people (including most of the CSM who actually know him) saying, "You can (and sometimes say should) apologize, but don't step down because you've brought good changes about." |
Bill Carney
54th Massachusetts Volunteer Infantry
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[287] - Quote
Well that is 3 accounts you just lost, I will reinstate paying you when you reinstate the Mittani. |
Demon Azrakel
Bite Me inc Exhale.
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[288] - Quote
Can someone quote the EULA and clearly explain what he broke and how he broke it. While you are at it, be sure to not quote something out of context.
(Apparently people take a rather wide view of CCP licensed software. Either way, can you imagine the decline in users if we petitioned everything that everyone said to us in EVE that would violate that EULA. People get mad and say things that, in most cases, would, if petitioned, result in the person being ganked being banned.)
Quite frankly, I still do not see a huge problem. No one should be immune to ridicule and contempt for their actions in EVE, nor for their attempt to bring their own ****** life into EVE. In every post scam/gank conversation you have in EVE, you will usually assume that someone is lying for pity or to make you feel bad.
No one should change their playstyle for a whiny player who cannot deal with the harshness that is EVE. Not even the CEO of the biggest group of griefers and assholes (no offence intended, EVE would be a much worse and more boring place if you were not) in EVE. Remember the hats issue. You were hearing The Mittani, CEO of Goonswarm, not the (current) CSM chair, nor the future CSM member.
Aside from the potential for Sony to distance itself from CCP and this incident giving the US government more incentive to go on their crusade to label games as bad and violent (as if that makes a ******* difference in any way, shape, or form to sales; just look and what age people play M-rated games), I almost see this as any press = good press. Hell, this may attract some more real assholes to the game, and, lets face it, EVE has thrived on that phenomena.
I now ask all suicide gankers and griefers to be sure to petition any threats, libel (untrue things said about one's mother, for instance), indications of incoming suicide, and harsh language that results from the incoming destruction of Jita. Don't just destroy their ships, destroy their EVE careers. |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released 0ccupational Hazzard
553
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:21:00 -
[289] - Quote
Nylith Empyreal wrote:Andski wrote:Valkyria Caeli wrote:10,058 people were denied nothing. 10,058 made their choice and it turned out to be a poor one. 10,058 people choose a person to represent them who through his own action made himself unable to fulfill that role. Perhaps consider voting for one of your own who displays more restraint. Good luck finding such a person. Totally untrue and that's a terribly ignorant opinion. But hey, forum alt. Name calling is the sign of a person who has lost their argument. Aren't you going to unsub in protest or continue to **** and moan to deaf ears on a forum?
What planet are you from? Since when is forum alt naming calling?
I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
128
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[290] - Quote
Your stuff can I has ? |
|
Lenier Chenal
Meritoc Industries Inc. SRS.
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[291] - Quote
Fail decision. QQ CCP. |
Joepopo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[292] - Quote
Ayeson wrote:Machine Delta wrote:You guys should ban me because I am sitting in my room saying EULA/TOS breaking things out loud in front of the monitor.
Not emptyquoting
I am also watching p0rn in my local. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[293] - Quote
Alf Retardo wrote:well rules are rules and they got broken, **** happens ;)
btw: so the main reason why goons now whine is all the tech billions wasted on making new accounts and reactivate accounts to win the election (8200 votes less then 30days old)
karma is a ***** less than 60 days old and you can't vote... |
Radelix Cisko
The Adjustment Team
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[294] - Quote
I'm looking forward to goon Jita riots.
I recommend Sobaseki 1 jump over as the temp hub |
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
309
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[295] - Quote
Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal considering its not even 3% of eves total subscription i'd say no, its not :) |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3730
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[296] - Quote
Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was banned for RMT, was not removed from the council. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
42
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:22:00 -
[297] - Quote
Leykan wrote:Tig Ole Bitties wrote:The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
We're not on about the banning or the removal, we're on about the 10,000 voted which are now worthless. Unless of course you're really into that who voter disenfranchisement thing...
And you voted wrong, you too a risk expecting a huge reward and you failed, isn't this how that whole risk reward works? Not like Nixon got to come back despite all those who voted for him, or Clinton. |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released 0ccupational Hazzard
553
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:23:00 -
[298] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council.
Well, he is practically asian so no real surprise there. I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
Andrea Griffin
204
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:23:00 -
[299] - Quote
Wow cool, I didn't know there was a CCP Salmon. Salmon is delicious and healthy, and a favorite food for bears up in Alaska. CCP Salmon, you are not replacing CCP Sreegs as my favorite developer, but you ARE my most flavorful!
Yeah, this post is totally off topic. So sue me. : > CCP Sreegs is my favorite developer. |
Heathkit
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:23:00 -
[300] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ |
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3730
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:23:00 -
[301] - Quote
Jack bubu wrote:Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal considering its not even 3% of eves total subscription i'd say no, its not :)
your titan's still getting nerfed :)))))) "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
211
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:23:00 -
[302] - Quote
Jack bubu wrote:Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal considering its not even 3% of eves total subscription i'd say no, its not :)
For the greater good...
the greaaaater goooooooooooood http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
db T
SniggWaffe EVE Corporation 123566322353
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:24:00 -
[303] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council. you should look up the word forfeit |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
99
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:24:00 -
[304] - Quote
Andski wrote:Nvee wrote:Tears.
Glorious goon Tears.
Look at all the little goons "unsub" & " lawyer up" , poor little guys.
30 day ban is really nothing. It should be a perma ban. They have banned people for a lot less.
Nobody cares about the ban. The fact that he was removed from the CSM despite 10,000+ accounts backing him is the issue here.
TOO BIG TO FAIL |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:24:00 -
[305] - Quote
1/6 th of the votes thrown away. 1/6th of the ENTIRE Eve community that can even be arsed to actually throw a vote.
Good job, very good job. 1/6th of the most active most interested people in the game disenfranchised. Words fail me to even trying to describe how utterly hasted and inconsiderate that was. |
GunslingerBob
Rim Collection RC Test Alliance Please Ignore
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:24:00 -
[306] - Quote
I can't be bothered to read this entire threadnaught, but I'll have you know this:
Unless CCP does the correct thing and holds a re-vote for ALL positions, I will be dropping this game like a steaming pile of elephant dung.
For a company that spouts about democracy and whatnot, they sure do love to pull one over on their customers. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
85
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[307] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council.
|
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
309
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[308] - Quote
Andski wrote:Jack bubu wrote:Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal considering its not even 3% of eves total subscription i'd say no, its not :) your titan's still getting nerfed :)))))) hahahahaha just keep thinking its a nerf :'D |
Axhind
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[309] - Quote
Go to hell CCP. I reactivate 2 accounts and come back to this **** game due to what MIttani did and you ban him and kick him of CSM after he saved you. Way to go.
What he did is not in good taste but same thing happens many times every day in eve and nobody cares. Not to mention you vetted the presentations and didn't react at all until the pc crowd started making a stink for no reason what so ever. If even the "victim" didn't think much about it than that the hell are you doing? Don't forget that you have the customers that stick with you because eve is tough, not because it's just another wow clone for idiots.
We voted for Mittens and we want him. You remember the alternative from the summer and your idiotic decisions that almost sunk you as a company until he pulled you out. |
Zealc
Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[310] - Quote
You can love or hate him as a goon, I don't care.
But as CSM chairman he did an excellent job, especially after the Incarna debacle.
What was said at the fanfest was as a goon, as part of the alliance presentation. They were talking about what their alliances did, not CSM or CCP related. I don't agree with what he said but it was directed at an 'ingame' character. And he was drunk.
Over-reaction by CCP to the hysterical masses. |
|
Alf Retardo
State War Academy Caldari State
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[311] - Quote
Townsend Harris wrote:Alf Retardo wrote:well rules are rules and they got broken, **** happens ;)
btw: so the main reason why goons now whine is all the tech billions wasted on making new accounts and reactivate accounts to win the election (8200 votes less then 30days old)
karma is a ***** less than 60 days old and you can't vote...
Age in days / Frequency / Cumulative 30 / 8447 / 14,29%
according to devblog stats http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=28529 |
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
251
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[312] - Quote
So what goons are saying is that 10058 votes gives people the right to break rules/laws/ethics amirite? To the whiners :-áCCP Soundwave "Incursions are not a big issue in terms of isk globally" CCP Recurve "However, Incursions are not the biggest ISK faucet, bounties are"
|
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
42
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[313] - Quote
I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool.
In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate.
In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines.
EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet.
Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587
I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable.
Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. |
Anvil44
Independent Traders and Builders MPA
61
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:25:00 -
[314] - Quote
As our society changes and learns to cope with online bullying such as this, it is good to see CCP taking it seriously. If anyone thinks they went too far, also consider that not only was the Eve character name of the offender used by CCP but, in joining the CSM he was using his real life name and speaking as someone who is associated with CCP. As such, he must answer to his actions, including in however CCP feels is the best way to deal with this type of situation.
If this were 'real' life, the actual person could be charged, depending on which country you are on. Think about having someone commit a real-life crime being associated with your product while committing that crime.
I really think a 30 day ban is weak but in the offenders defense, he did make a formal apology, which is a step in the right direction.
He's out, let it go and lets learn from this. As so many have said, CCP made a proper decision. I may not like you or your point of view but you have a right to voice it. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
213
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:26:00 -
[315] - Quote
Andski wrote:MeBiatch wrote:dude over 300 000 get "disenfranchised" every damn time there are CSM elections... Those 300,000 chose not to vote. It is not our problem that they choose to remain apathetic.
those 10k chose to be a good drone and vote for the cfc guy instead of the other 49 people running for office... as i said before your fault for being a drone... not mine and not ccp's!
|
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
59
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:26:00 -
[316] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Taihbea wrote:Tig Ole Bitties wrote:The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
ROFL so true! So tell me about your ideal EVE, with a panties dropping button, $1000 jeans and even more empty rooms to walk slowly in!
The one where there are no cyberbullies. I hate that kind. |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
86
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:26:00 -
[317] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to.
I'm not reading all of that, just saying Florida |
Montevius Williams
Eclipse Industrial Inc Order of the Void
240
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[318] - Quote
RDevz wrote:You've disenfranchised 10,058 Goons. Good job.
Fixed. |
Corpesthorn
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[319] - Quote
So instead of coming up with a viable solution CCP took the easiest way out..? 10,058 |
Revii Lagoon
The Foreign Legion Test Alliance Please Ignore
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[320] - Quote
So if griefing is now a TOS violation, shouldn't the vast majority of EVE players be banned? |
|
Nylith Empyreal
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[321] - Quote
GunslingerBob wrote:I can't be bothered to read this entire threadnaught, but I'll have you know this:
Unless CCP does the correct thing and holds a re-vote for ALL positions, I will be dropping this game like a steaming pile of elephant dung.
For a company that spouts about democracy and whatnot, they sure do love to pull one over on their customers.
Congratulations welcome to the real world, honestly you think you had any true say in all of this? Like the rookieship changes, the name changes, the titan changes(not for you in particular), etc. So yes what has actually been hidden in regards to pulling a fast one and ccp? |
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[322] - Quote
Don't you all love the bans for "posting while goon"?
Way to go CCP, you were turning that game around and then NOPE |
Grogoth Drem
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[323] - Quote
Andski wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Leykan wrote:MeBiatch wrote:sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right! Still waiting on you to explain the whole TOS applicable in a RL situation thing here... fanfest feed is linked to the forums... official ccp broadcasts are subject to tos... by breaking tos you loose your right to be on this years CSM and get an auto 30 day ban... no if and or butts about it! shut up you bleating moron no game company should disenfranchise a large group of vocal customers with TEN THOUSAND accounts between them that's not a bold move that's a stupid ******* move
oh no, 3% of our playerbase BAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW |
Mafia Matt
Helljumpers Hades.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:27:00 -
[324] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
Two Step.
Honestly, I cannot believe that statement from yourself. It was a terrible thing to say, its against the law let alone the elua and the tos. Tbh he got off lightly. Supporting this behaviour is terrible!
Correct decision was made. |
Brusanan
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:28:00 -
[325] - Quote
While I fully support suicide for any reason or no reason at all, what Mittens did was stupid. With the amount of negative attention this incident was getting from the video game community, there was no way CCP could ever let it slide. |
recurrsion
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:28:00 -
[326] - Quote
Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal
LOL 10,000 plex paid (or bought) subscriptions going to unsub. Little less talk, lot more action please.
Before you unsub please send me your stuff. |
Melanie Pointer
Hedion University Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:28:00 -
[327] - Quote
To all the GOONS and FRIENDS bemoaning their "Leader's" plight - CRY ME A RIVER. Unsubscribe. Do whatever. You make statements asking for sympathy but you yourself and Alex (Mittens) are the embodiment of A LACK OF SYMPATHY. You can cry all you want but you pushed it too far this time and you are still pushing it too far by trying to do what GOONS do best, BULLY. Bully CCP this time. Go quit - THE GAME WILL GO ON WITHOUT YOU.
The Galaxy will be a FAR BETTER place without the likes of the GOONS and their immature attitudes.
CRY ME A RIVER.
Give someone a long enough rope they will hang themselves with it ---- and I don't mean Mitten's insensitive remarks towards suicide rather his own ironic twist of events and how his inhumane comments and tactics have come round to bite him in the ARSE. He got too cocky with his "landslide" victory and the old axiom of "power corupts" finally got the best of him. And I for one say...
IT SERVES HIM RIGHT.
I have said for years and I maintain it today, he needs to grow up as do the followers who think that behavior is acceptable in game or out. They are the first to bemoan EVE's so-called similarity to life yet they themselves can't take their own medicine.
Thank you CCP for sticking up on behalf of this player. Thank you for banning him for 30 days.
I will also say thank you Mittens for OWNING UP and doing the right thing. I am not sure you have learned your lesson, TIME and ACTIONS will tell (again - aptly like you ask CCP to own up while shaking vehemently your fist!)
In the mean time too I think the CSM will be better without him while he figures out how to be an adult with his 30 days off from the other world he lives in.
Mittens - I hope you learned that this is not meant to chide you but those that haven't learned like you that life is different when the shoe is on the other foot.
|
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
316
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:28:00 -
[328] - Quote
Taihbea wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Taihbea wrote:Tig Ole Bitties wrote:The Goons crying over something that they think is unfair???
SAY IT ISN'T SO?!!
An ENTIRE thread FILLED with NOTHING but GOON TEARS!!!!!!
I think I just came all over myself...
MOAR!!!!
MOARR!!!!!!
ROFL so true! So tell me about your ideal EVE, with a panties dropping button, $1000 jeans and even more empty rooms to walk slowly in! The one where there are no cyberbullies. I hate that kind.
Literally everything in eve can be considered cyberbullying. |
Addrake
Origin. Black Legion.
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[329] - Quote
I dislike goons as an organization (how it rallies the cfc around it to form yet another Northern Coalition, BoB, IT, etc.) That being said mittens isn't half bad, I certainly didn't vote for him, but he isn't half bad and actually has been a solid CSM.
The ban is ********, he said some **** out of game, which by the way isn't even nearly as bad as what people say in game. How people don't realize that 90% of the game is trolling the **** out of your opponents so they'll actually fight..
Kicking him off the CSM is ********. The first time I heard about this 'incident' was his apology, which didn't sound like a Rush Limbaugh apology at all.
My only conclusion, is that Mittens somehow has trolled us all here.
Bravo sir, Bravo, and **** ccp yet again. Just when you have me liking you again thinking 'no one can be that stupid THREE times in a row' they go and swing for the fences. |
Bojan Z
Kernel of War Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[330] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool.
In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. [...]
Since when is Iceland in the EU???
|
|
Hareka Darine
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[331] - Quote
GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS |
Kerensky White
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[332] - Quote
What's more dangerous than thousands of angry, motivated goons. |
Leykan
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[333] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to.
Iceland's not a part of the EU. Your move. |
KillLoco
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[334] - Quote
Anvil44 wrote:As our society changes and learns to cope with online bullying such as this, it is good to see CCP taking it seriously. If anyone thinks they went too far, also consider that not only was the Eve character name of the offender used by CCP but, in joining the CSM he was using his real life name and speaking as someone who is associated with CCP. As such, he must answer to his actions, including in however CCP feels is the best way to deal with this type of situation.
If this were 'real' life, the actual person could be charged, depending on which country you are on. Think about having someone commit a real-life crime being associated with your product while committing that crime.
I really think a 30 day ban is weak but in the offenders defense, he did make a formal apology, which is a step in the right direction.
He's out, let it go and lets learn from this. As so many have said, CCP made a proper decision.
Oh back to reading the Daily Mail.
|
Htrag
The Carebear Stare Hydroponic Zone
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:29:00 -
[335] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to.
What you say makes sense.
It's just a sad day when political correctness comes to eve.
In the past, CCP always had the courage to go against the grain.
(I have an inbox full of similar fanmails, and they always made me laff.) Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game. |
Revii Lagoon
The Foreign Legion Test Alliance Please Ignore
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:30:00 -
[336] - Quote
http://i.imgur.com/0rsuC.jpg |
Caius Sivaris
Dark Nexxus S I L E N T.
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:30:00 -
[337] - Quote
I for one, welcome CCP newly found backbone. |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:30:00 -
[338] - Quote
Andski wrote:10,058 paying customers totally ignored and disenfranchised. Good work, CCP.
U mad? |
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:30:00 -
[339] - Quote
10,058 idiots lol |
Jonathan Malcom
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
74
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[340] - Quote
http://i.imgur.com/0rsuC.jpg |
|
Aelder
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[341] - Quote
CCP, what happened to HTFU?
This is a vast overreaction and CCP should be ashamed. |
Stephen Haags
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[342] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council.
This! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3736
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[343] - Quote
John Maynard Keynes wrote:Andski wrote:10,058 paying customers totally ignored and disenfranchised. Good work, CCP. U mad?
oh look another worthless npc alt "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
SPAECMARNIES
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[344] - Quote
Kerensky White wrote:What's more dangerous than thousands of angry, motivated goons.
10058 angry, motivated goons.
fakesnipe |
Tango Zulu
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[345] - Quote
Abyss Azizora wrote:First time in years I've heard such WONDERFUL news on the eve forum. I think I'll do a little dance.
On a sidenote, I really don't care about what happened, I see that as "normal" in eve honestly nowadays. But if that thing got a goon rear end firmly parted by a boot on his way out the door... Then it's a freaking celebration to me. Where's a party emoticon when you need it?
Case in point. |
Ni Cho
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:31:00 -
[346] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council.
I am just quoting this because it is a supremely valid point, and it needs to be repeated.
Endlessly
|
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:32:00 -
[347] - Quote
Rick Maken wrote:Storm in a tea cup, not a day goes by when I don't hear the words kill yourself in University or online.
Sperging publords making a massive shitstorm over literally nothing have ruined the CSM, and potentially ruined the game.
Literally a few people have managed to kick up enough **** to get a bunch of idiots bandwagoning.
Thanks guys.
Yeah, Mittani and Test CEO managed to do exactly that for the last 12 months or so... |
Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:32:00 -
[348] - Quote
Revii Lagoon wrote:http://i.imgur.com/0rsuC.jpg
.
(you misspelled virginity, though) |
Axhind
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:32:00 -
[349] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to.
As another European I can freely call you fascist dog. Europe has benefits but fascist **** laws for censorship of speech are not it. At the same time as you have to ***** foot around serious issues we all get butt raped by our dear politicians but hey they are at least preventing us to say thing they don't like. This is one thing where europe should take after US instead of introducing just more and more idiotic censorship laws. |
Caellach Marellus
Nephtys Ventures inc
476
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:33:00 -
[350] - Quote
I understand the player broke the rules and was banned for it.
But seriously CCP, you realise you're punishing the rest of us by replacing him with the Riverini right? Enjoy your gaming.
http://northern-goblin.blogspot.com |
|
Atomic Option
Taggart Transdimensional Virtue of Selfishness
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:33:00 -
[351] - Quote
Total overreaction on all sides.
The only person reacting appropriately (by not reacting) is The Wis himself, the noble miner "victim" whose opinion does not appear to have been consulted.
People always tell each other to kill themselves in online games. It comes with the territory and anyone who takes it seriously is a douche. That it happened in public doesn't make it worse or different.
If you can't take a joke, **** you. |
k'ryn
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:33:00 -
[352] - Quote
Kerensky White wrote:What's more dangerous than thousands of angry, motivated goons.
nothing. |
Vinny Grinn
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:34:00 -
[353] - Quote
Ni Cho wrote:Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council. I am just quoting this because it is a supremely valid point, and it needs to be repeated. Endlessly
Not empty quoting. |
May O'Neez
Flying Blacksmiths
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:34:00 -
[354] - Quote
The "funny" (sad, actually) things about raging of 10k people is that: - these players have certainly lots of alts, - the accounts are probably paid by PLEX therefore don't have any actual money value for a big bunch of them, - the people tend to easily forget that CSM members are representatives, therefore are less tolerated of commiting errors
/rant
Now I perfectly aggree that it is a bad news and his value in CSM was very great, that makes everyone in a very unpleasant mess. But we should also consider that CCP had no choice but enforce rules like these, and I'm pretty sure they are aware of the consequences (wouldn't surprise me that we forecome emergency meeting and other not-dev blogs).
I also aggree to the analysis that since fanfest players are being watched on, this is both good and BAD. Realtime streaming sucks. Please don't do realtime diffusions when you can't face the consequences, CCP ! |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
61
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:34:00 -
[355] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool.
In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. :words:
Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. 1- You're a political tool 2- Please explain how remarks made live via microphone can by CYBER bullying? 3- Does the EU Have laws against bullying? Are they EU Wide 4- I take back #1 you're just a tool. |
Dirk Culliford
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:35:00 -
[356] - Quote
All aboard the fail train, destination unknown! |
Nirnaeth Ornoediad
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:35:00 -
[357] - Quote
Bullshit. The CSM is not space democracy: it is a customer advocacy group. CCP decided--wisely--that due to its disparate customer base the best way to have a representative sample of their customers was to: get a representative sample of their customers.
I used my vote not for political purposes, but as a business transaction: The Mittani was going to make my $15/month go further than anyone else (only Seleene would come close).
My problem is that, as a customer, CCP promised me a voice in their customer advocacy group. Now they are taking this away.
EULA breach is a bullshit argument. The EULA covers the use of the software, not attendance at a customer function. CCP would be well within their rights to say "We think this person has alienated a large enough portion of our customer base that we do not believe he will provide a good interface with our customers." Instead they go with some weasely bullshit about EULA breaches.
What's next? I'm on Teamspeak and trash talk some alliance mate. Is CCP liable? Absolutely not. (If I did it on EVE Voice, that would be different).
I'd have more respect for CCP if they manned up and said "We think Alex is bad for business, and we're running a business." Instead they want to play Space Lawyers and Space Democracy.
WTF |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:35:00 -
[358] - Quote
May O'Neez wrote:The "funny" (sad, actually) things about raging of 10k people is that: - these players have certainly lots of alts, - the accounts are probably paid by PLEX therefore don't have any actual money value for a big bunch of them, - the people tend to easily forget that CSM members are representatives, therefore are less tolerated of commiting errors
/rant
Now I perfectly aggree that it is a bad news and his value in CSM was very great, that makes everyone in a very unpleasant mess. But we should also consider that CCP had no choice but enforce rules like these, and I'm pretty sure they are aware of the consequences (wouldn't surprise me that we forecome emergency meeting and other not-dev blogs).
I also aggree to the analysis that since fanfest players are being watched on, this is both good and BAD. Realtime streaming sucks. Please don't do realtime diffusions when you can't face the consequences, CCP ! Hey Moron, Plex doesn't appear out of nowhere, someone, somewhere pays for it. |
Oliver Duncan
Kick B0rt Test Alliance Please Ignore
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:35:00 -
[359] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council. |
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:35:00 -
[360] - Quote
Leykan wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. Iceland's not a part of the EU. Your move.
No its not part of the EU yet, Its going though the process of joining the EU since its application was accepted provisionally a couple of years ago. That proccess has involved bringing the Icelandic legal system in line with the rest of Europe. Its judiciary and fundemental rights of the individual have been brought in line with European law. |
|
Derrick Munroe
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:36:00 -
[361] - Quote
May O'Neez wrote: - the accounts are probably paid by PLEX therefore don't have any actual money value
If PLEX had no monetary value CCP wouldn't be making money selling them. |
Tanaka Aiko
ICE is Coming to EVE Goonswarm Federation
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:36:00 -
[362] - Quote
so CCP, is the problem a possible EULA breach, or your old self wanting to come back ?
this PR move really feels like pre-incarna CCP, it feels like a Jesus PR move. a PR move against his current subscribers, but for future potential customers...
have you already forgotten what happened last year ? does only the 20% guys who were fired are the ones who remember ? |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
131
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:36:00 -
[363] - Quote
Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council.
Should have been IMO, explains a lot tbh. |
Kingston Black
Indiscipline Incorporated
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:36:00 -
[364] - Quote
This is a regrettable affair perhaps goonswarm could get another member to represent the 10k goon votes.
May I suggest Kartoon as a replacement? |
Drahgo
Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:37:00 -
[365] - Quote
~10058~
CCP trying to look tough...when in reality all they're doing is kowtowing to a bunch of asshats. |
Shoot2kilI
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:37:00 -
[366] - Quote
Remember that time that CCP made you sign a EULA/TOS when you landed in Iceland to participate in the alliance panel?
Yeah. Me either.
Make up your mind CCP. You are either going to be that terrible company from 6 months ago that made me unsub in the first place, or the company that you were last week which had me convinced that re-subbing my 8 accounts was going to be worth it. You seem to fail to understand that "news" outlets like massively do not care for Eve Online. Eve is not World of Warcraft, and those faggots cannot keep their cheetoh stained hands on the keyboard long enough to remotely understand this game. You guys are always going to have a bad public image because of YOUR attempt at MT. Unironically throwing the person under the bus who arguably helped patch this sinking ship is... narcissism in it's own way.
ITT CCP is killing itself. |
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:37:00 -
[367] - Quote
GunslingerBob wrote:I can't be bothered to read this entire threadnaught, but I'll have you know this:
Unless CCP does the correct thing and holds a re-vote for ALL positions, I will be dropping this game like a steaming pile of elephant dung.
For a company that spouts about democracy and whatnot, they sure do love to pull one over on their customers.
Mang you really need to grow up an HTFU. Don;t cross lines you are not allowed to and ALL WILL BE FINE...
Now... Goon tears are so ******* awesome!! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3745
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:37:00 -
[368] - Quote
The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Regrind
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:38:00 -
[369] - Quote
Way to far CCP. |
Joepopo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:38:00 -
[370] - Quote
J3ssica Alba wrote:So what goons are saying is that 10058 votes gives people the right to break rules/laws/ethics amirite?
You're a NPC alt. Get out. |
|
Lenier Chenal
Meritoc Industries Inc. SRS.
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:39:00 -
[371] - Quote
Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable.
This. |
Arrs Grazznic
Poena Executive Solutions
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:39:00 -
[372] - Quote
Rather interesting to see that those against this decision are goons and pets. Ignore those partisan postings and the general consensus is 'well done CCP'.
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:39:00 -
[373] - Quote
Abyss Azizora wrote:First time in years I've heard such WONDERFUL news on the eve forum. I think I'll do a little dance.
On a sidenote, I really don't care about what happened, I see that as "normal" in eve honestly nowadays. But if that thing got a goon rear end firmly parted by a boot on his way out the door... Then it's a freaking celebration to me. Where's a party emoticon when you need it? Aww.... did someone get scammed? |
OninoTimmo
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
50
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:40:00 -
[374] - Quote
:popcorn:
keep it coming, goonNOOBS, i've almost reached climax |
Panda Name
Republic University Minmatar Republic
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:41:00 -
[375] - Quote
please don't let riverini get a csm spot due to this.
please. |
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:41:00 -
[376] - Quote
Joepopo wrote:J3ssica Alba wrote:So what goons are saying is that 10058 votes gives people the right to break rules/laws/ethics amirite? You're a NPC alt. Get out. I am not lol 10,058 GUUD FIGHT |
Lenier Chenal
Meritoc Industries Inc. SRS.
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:41:00 -
[377] - Quote
Arrs Grazznic wrote:Rather interesting to see that those against this decision are goons and pets. Ignore those partisan postings and the general consensus is 'well done CCP'.
I'm neither, but I think this is ******* pathetic. CCP letting fail gaming sites and Darius's pets ruin the best CSM head ever? Not good. |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
131
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:41:00 -
[378] - Quote
Corpesthorn wrote:So instead of coming up with a viable solution CCP took the easiest way out..? 10,058
It's not the easiest way out, as I pointed earlier in another thread, it's the ONLY way out.
CCP cannot give in to a power block of players like goon specially when a very serious unethical behavior of a public figure and press figure related to the game was made publicly and on live stream.
It's either that or they will be opening an exception everyone will call upon in the future and they'll also be labeled as someone who can be manipulated by a mass of players that actually fail on the objective side of reasoning.
Be bullies, bada**es, whatever you want, in game, in character, you do that in public, to a miriad of a crowd you face the consequences of social ethical bounds. |
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:41:00 -
[379] - Quote
Townsend Harris wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool.
In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. :words:
Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. 1- You're a political tool 2- Please explain how remarks made live via microphone can by CYBER bullying? 3- Does the EU Have laws against bullying? Are they EU Wide 4- I take back #1 you're just a tool.
1. predictable 2. under the EU data protectin act "when information and communication technologies are used to harrass individuals it is cyber harrassment. A live stream on the internet classes as a communication technology. 3. Yes the EU has a number of laws against bullying that are EU wide. 4. Thank you to your matire response to a serious issue both in society and us as a gaming community. |
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:42:00 -
[380] - Quote
also can we start a titan buff thread now? |
|
Jim Luc
Rule of Five
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:42:00 -
[381] - Quote
This is ridiculous, and I'm very sad for CCP right now. This had nothing to do with some guy using "suicide" to implore pity, but rather people who personally hate Alex, and Goons in general. I could care less about the Goons in-game or out - but honestly I'm very disappointed in CCP that they would not see through this charade. |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
559
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:42:00 -
[382] - Quote
Only part of the TOS that i'm seeing relevant here.
Quote:You may encounter and converse with people who are rude, offensive, belligerent, and who may use indecent, obscene, and/or threatening or harassing language while playing the Game. You may report any instances of such behavior to CCP. CCP will investigate and take such measures as CCP, in its sole judgment, determines are reasonable under the circumstances. CCP does not guarantee that you will not encounter behavior of others that you may view as insulting, demeaning, offensive, threatening or harassing. You assume all risk associated with playing the Game, and CCP assumes no responsibility for the conduct of any other players, and shall not be liable to you or any other person for their conduct.
And that says that CCP will not be responsible.
Quote:You will report out-of-game issues regarding harassment, such as threatening phone calls or correspondence, to your local law enforcement officials or Internet provider. CCP will not reveal personal information about its subscribers to unauthorized individuals. We are not responsible for actions taken by our subscribers that occur outside the jurisdiction of our game servers or web site.
Arguably :
Quote:You may not abuse, harass or threaten another player or authorized representative of CCP, including customer service personnel and volunteers. This includes, but is not limited to: petitioning with false information in an attempt to gain from it or have someone else suffer from it; sending excessive e-mails, EVE-mails or petitions; obstructing CCP Employees from doing their jobs; refusal to follow the instructions of a CCP Employee; or implying favoritism by a CCP Employee.
But he actually didn't THREATEN the individual himself. He said something stupid about other peoples choosing to do so of their own volition. Which should be handled on a case by case basis.
I understand CCP is all powerful in this matter. But seriously...
Removing him from the CSM is out of line.
Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |
Acadia Reina
B0rthole Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[383] - Quote
Atomic Option wrote:Total overreaction on all sides.
The only person reacting appropriately (by not reacting) is The Wis himself, the noble miner "victim" whose opinion does not appear to have been consulted.
People always tell each other to kill themselves in online games. It comes with the territory and anyone who takes it seriously is a douche. That it happened in public doesn't make it worse or different.
If you can't take a joke, **** you.
This is exactly right. This entire storm is apparently built entirely on principle, taking no account of the reality of the situation. The supposed victim is nonplussed and generally indifferent. The apology was made and restitution given. Situation solved.
Everything I see now against The Mittani is just meta-gaming by his enemies. Maybe it will be effective, but it's also disingenuous to The Wis and to the supposed ethical right that so many people are chest-beating about.
People and CCP need to HTFU. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
213
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[384] - Quote
Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable.
no its only 3% of the voting base!
get over your self goon...
seriously!
one year and then its all mittenz again... yay
|
Khanh'rhh
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
971
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[385] - Quote
CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choose what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[386] - Quote
Kingston Black wrote:This is a regrettable affair perhaps goonswarm could get another member to represent the 10k goon votes.
May I suggest Kartoon as a replacement?
this CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Hulemand
x13 Raiden.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[387] - Quote
Joepopo wrote:J3ssica Alba wrote:So what goons are saying is that 10058 votes gives people the right to break rules/laws/ethics amirite? You're a NPC alt. Get out.
You're a Goon. You should get out as well! |
The Crimson Invaider
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[388] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:Only part of the TOS that i'm seeing relevant here. Quote:You may encounter and converse with people who are rude, offensive, belligerent, and who may use indecent, obscene, and/or threatening or harassing language while playing the Game. You may report any instances of such behavior to CCP. CCP will investigate and take such measures as CCP, in its sole judgment, determines are reasonable under the circumstances. CCP does not guarantee that you will not encounter behavior of others that you may view as insulting, demeaning, offensive, threatening or harassing. You assume all risk associated with playing the Game, and CCP assumes no responsibility for the conduct of any other players, and shall not be liable to you or any other person for their conduct. And that says that CCP will not be responsible. Quote:You will report out-of-game issues regarding harassment, such as threatening phone calls or correspondence, to your local law enforcement officials or Internet provider. CCP will not reveal personal information about its subscribers to unauthorized individuals. We are not responsible for actions taken by our subscribers that occur outside the jurisdiction of our game servers or web site.
Arguably : Quote:You may not abuse, harass or threaten another player or authorized representative of CCP, including customer service personnel and volunteers. This includes, but is not limited to: petitioning with false information in an attempt to gain from it or have someone else suffer from it; sending excessive e-mails, EVE-mails or petitions; obstructing CCP Employees from doing their jobs; refusal to follow the instructions of a CCP Employee; or implying favoritism by a CCP Employee. But he actually didn't THREATEN the individual himself. He said something stupid about other peoples choosing to do so of their own volition. Which should be handled on a case by case basis. I understand CCP is all powerful in this matter. But seriously... Removing him from the CSM is out of line. Thanks for clearing that up. CCP ****** up. |
Tsalaroth
BRG Corp Acquisition Of Empire
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:43:00 -
[389] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Wibla wrote:I demand a re-election for CSM7, as CCP has de-facto invalidated a big chunk of the votes cast. you are just a goon... your vote/opionion does not count... run along pubbie nice 5th page snippah!
What about mine? And no, this isn't a goon alt.
No matter who did what, I do not like the fact that 10,000 votes ceased to matter. They either need to bone up and reverse that bit - maybe claim it was a typo, we'll never tell - or let those who voted for him cast a new vote. |
Daelorn
State War Academy Caldari State
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:44:00 -
[390] - Quote
Are you guys being ******* serious right now?
I'm all for harsh EVE, nasty language, I don't care about racial slurs or anything of that nature. But basically telling a player to kill himself is over the ******* line. All of you butthurt over your ******* votes are idiots when we're talking about a person's real life here, in the end this is all a stupid internet spaceship game. I don't care if you tell a person to go kill themselves IRL to a person that isn't suicidal and would never do it, it is still over the line.
CCP handled this perfectly in my opinion and I applaud Mittani for what he did in stepping down and apologizing too, but still he needs to be punished. |
|
Sentient Blade
Walk It Off Imperial Ascension
300
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:44:00 -
[391] - Quote
**** move, IMO.
Mittens needed a most severe smack to the face, but I agree with the other comments that over 10,000 people were disenfranchised by this turn of events and that's going to have repercussions on every future CSM, who, by the way CCP, saved your ass last year.
I didn't vote for Mittens, as I wanted my vote to be used to ensure the success of another candidate which subsequently got on, but I wholeheartedly believe Mittens kicking ass was beneficial for the game.
What this needed was a hammer to the kneecaps, what you gave us was a bullet to the head. |
Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
215
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:44:00 -
[392] - Quote
If he said all this before running for CSM would he have had 10,000 votes?
You bet your horrible fat ass he wouldn't have. http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
Harold Tuphlos
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:44:00 -
[393] - Quote
BURN HISEC
10,058 |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3747
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:44:00 -
[394] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable. no its only 3% of the voting base! get over your self goon... seriously! one year and then its all mittenz again... yay
Nope. Representation or bust - that's the way we roll.
"WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Hulemand
x13 Raiden.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:44:00 -
[395] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it.
What legal precedence do they need? None! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3747
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:45:00 -
[396] - Quote
Muad 'dib wrote:If he said all this before running for CSM would he have had 10,000 votes?
You bet your horrible fat ass he wouldn't have.
He might not have reached the 10,000 mark, but he would still have more votes than any other CSM delegate. hth "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:45:00 -
[397] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable. no its only 3% of the voting base! get over your self goon... seriously! one year and then its all mittenz again... yay
AFAIK accounts that have action against em are not allowed for CSM CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
1274
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:45:00 -
[398] - Quote
This is not an acceptable solution.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
|
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:45:00 -
[399] - Quote
Acadia Reina wrote:Atomic Option wrote:Total overreaction on all sides.
The only person reacting appropriately (by not reacting) is The Wis himself, the noble miner "victim" whose opinion does not appear to have been consulted.
People always tell each other to kill themselves in online games. It comes with the territory and anyone who takes it seriously is a douche. That it happened in public doesn't make it worse or different.
If you can't take a joke, **** you. This is exactly right. This entire storm is apparently built entirely on principle, taking no account of the reality of the situation. The supposed victim is nonplussed and generally indifferent. The apology was made and restitution given. Situation solved. Everything I see now against The Mittani is just meta-gaming by his enemies. Maybe it will be effective, but it's also disingenuous to The Wis and to the supposed ethical right that so many people are chest-beating about. People and CCP need to HTFU.
So you must be a super alien or something cause you're a pony sissy crying on interwebz.
By your own (very good by the way) advice... HTFU! |
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
129
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[400] - Quote
Hi CCP, while I appreciate that when all is said and done you get to set the rules, I'd appreciate if you didn't try to spin the decision to remove The Mittani from the CSM as an inevitable result of his ban. Your own whitepaper clearly states:
Quote: also, players with a serious warning22 or ban on any account in their possession can be excluded from candidate eligibility. however, in-game behavior, regardless of play style, will never be a criterion for candidacy unless the rules of the eula and/or tos are violated.
Note the use of "can" not "will" or "must". Trying to portray this decision as unavoidable rather than a choice you have made smacks of cowardice and removes any confidence I had in your promise to not regress to the bad CCP of old. |
|
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[401] - Quote
Hulemand wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. What legal precedence do they need? None!
CCP gives precisely no fucks. |
xXv1c10usXx
Alchemy Corp
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[402] - Quote
I am thinking their basis for their decision is total horseshit. Even better than replying here, if people to speak where is hurts corporations the most, in their revenue stream.
how about the removal of $1.8M US in revenue from their P&L. That would be a strong statement.
All persons that had their votes stripped unsub and let CCP feel that pain for a bit and have to layoff some developers and have the game go the SH!T. Oh wait, it is already headed there, so that $1.8M will escalate fairly quickly in to some sizable loss of revenue. |
Lakshata Chawla
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
23
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[403] - Quote
At this rate, all the goons will unsub, This is the best decision CCP has ever made.
I still wish Mittani could stay on CSM, he WAS a productive member. |
Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
1274
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[404] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
This.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
|
Lotta Mullarkey
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[405] - Quote
May O'Neez wrote:
Now I perfectly aggree that it is a bad news and his value in CSM was very great, that makes everyone in a very unpleasant mess. But we should also consider that CCP had no choice but enforce rules like these...
CCP did however have a choice weather or not to continue supplying alcohol during the alliance panel even though it was clear that half of the panellists were plastered. They failed in their responsibility to help prevent this.
IGÇÖd go along with their decision were it not for the fact that they are removing a CSM from his position while hiding behind their EULA/TOS themselves instead of admitting that they were part responsible. Mittens apologised for what has happened. I think now is the time for CCP to do the same if they want to justify their decision. Otherwise itGÇÖs an epic fail on their part. |
Myz Toyou
Bite Me inc Exhale.
39
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[406] - Quote
Kilylol wrote:CCP didn't want my subscription anyway.
Your T1 stuff, can I have it ?
|
Craystorm
Goonswarm Federation Human Resources Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[407] - Quote
~ 10,058 ~ |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[408] - Quote
Arrs Grazznic wrote:Rather interesting to see that those against this decision are goons and pets. Ignore those partisan postings and the general consensus is 'well done CCP'.
So...if we ignore the vast majority of posters, your side is right? That said if we ignore the large amounts of anti-****'s, ****** was right. You sir are literally ******. EDIT: DAT WORD FILTER! |
May O'Neez
Flying Blacksmiths
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[409] - Quote
Quote:Hey Moron, Plex doesn't appear out of nowhere, someone, somewhere pays for it.
You've got a point, my bad. But I stay polite :) I did'nt want to offend anyone. Still I'd be curious of the ratio generated / paid / etc, but it's kinda out of context. My background remark was mainly: CSM voting system is not an actual image of the player base.
Quote:If PLEX had no monetary value CCP wouldn't be making money selling them.
They don't do it for money, they do it to fight against RMT ... |
Bumrush
Helljumpers Hades.
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:46:00 -
[410] - Quote
This is a business for CCP, they can do what they want. They made the CSM and will always have final control of it.If you don't like the way CCP runs it business then leave. If you do can i have your stuff. |
|
k'ryn
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:47:00 -
[411] - Quote
Muad 'dib wrote:If he said all this before running for CSM would he have had 10,000 votes?
You bet your horrible fat ass he wouldn't have.
You're right, he'd have closer to 20, 000 |
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:47:00 -
[412] - Quote
Stephen Haags wrote:Andski wrote:Krutoj, a CSM 6 alternate who was temp-banned for RMT, was not removed from the council. This! you are stupid,( In game) and well tbfh rl also, but they don't temp ban for rmt |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1695
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:47:00 -
[413] - Quote
When you think about it this really was a decision about who makes the decisions and calls the shots on Eve Online management and press relations: CCP Iceland or Something Awful forums. CCP made the right choice.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:47:00 -
[414] - Quote
Lakshata Chawla wrote:At this rate, all the goons will unsub, This is the best decision CCP has ever made.
I still wish Mittani could stay on CSM, he WAS a productive member.
Unsub? With all your tears yet unharvested? Never, sir, never! We'll just make YOU quit. |
Ines Fy
Heroes of the Past Goonswarm Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[415] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog.
You are all idiots, you just thrown gasoline into a fire that was almost out...
How bunch of ungratefull bastards you all are. The guy pratically saved CCP from falling into a clift last summer, he went to the emergency summit to save your asses and calm down all the eve players that were at your door step with forks and torches ready to burn that **** to the ground... and this is how you say thanks?!
Everything you did since last summer that gain me over to this game after I unsub, just went down the garbage... to me CCP is now with the same popularity pos incarna... FY
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3747
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[416] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:AFAIK accounts that have action against em are not allowed for CSM
Krutoj made no secret about his temp ban for RMT which did _not_ lead to his removal from the CSM. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Richmond Kings
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[417] - Quote
Despite everything that has happened, the comments that were made were over the line. However, CCP still profited from the stream. After inviting people, giving them alcohol to provide content, they made money from the comments about a clearly depressed person.
Where are the calls for resitution him? CCP seemed to have just glanced over this. They are too concerned with making cash, rather than the feelings and well being of the person the comments were aimed at.
CCP should donate all proceeds they made from this complete shambles to him, so he can get help he needs. You can't condemn these actions, then turn around and count all the money you made from it. This isn't the action of a concerned company, it's the actions of disgraceful human beings. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[418] - Quote
Lakshata Chawla wrote:At this rate, all the goons will unsub, This is the best decision CCP has ever made.
I still wish Mittani could stay on CSM, he WAS a productive member.
By your own (very good by the way) advice... HTFU! CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Akelorian
FinFleet Raiden.
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[419] - Quote
The tears! They are delicious! OMG 10k votes gone to waste? yes wasted on voting for The Mittani anyways, he did this to himself and has forfeited his position in csm 7, so in reality your votes were wasted by him and him alone, you casted your vote, it counted, till he was dissqualified from said position for breaking the eula. |
Wolfduke
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[420] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog.
A resounding **** you is warranted here.
**** you. |
|
Sasha Azala
Blood and Decay
153
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[421] - Quote
Been reading through about 14 pages of this,
And to me it seems some people are more worried about losing their little power base in the CSM than anything.
If that is all the CSM really means to people then you might as well just get rid of it. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3747
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:48:00 -
[422] - Quote
Rebnok wrote:you are stupid,( In game) and well tbfh rl also, but they don't temp ban for rmt
Ask Krutoj about that. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Grogoth Drem
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:49:00 -
[423] - Quote
Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable.
you mis-typed 3% of subscribers
it is your own dumb fault for not vote splitting and EASILLY getting 3 csm spots
(in game) |
Nirnaeth Ornoediad
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
85
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:49:00 -
[424] - Quote
OninoTimmo wrote::popcorn:
keep it coming, goonNOOBS, i've almost reached climax
Sexual harassment is against the EULA. Please stop posting this material. "The Mittani isn't even gone for a day and CCP's management is already making bad decisions."
THE MITTANI for CEO of CCP |
Khanh'rhh
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
971
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:49:00 -
[425] - Quote
Hulemand wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. What legal precedence do they need? None!
Yeah, because that line works well when a lawsuit lands.
Stop trying to think, you're in Raiden. - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |
buck herrick
101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[426] - Quote
any more? |
Katarina Reid
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[427] - Quote
so does the eula/tos cover ts/mumble/vent cuz i might have a few recordings to sumit. what about the fanfest Audience if i record them at the event. can i get them banned? is it just the ccp event, ingame stuff and forums? what about other places does it cover me talking to someone at my house?
i think the eula/tos need to be made clearer. if the eula/tos cover something people should be made to sign it before there allowed there. u have to sign before u get ingame and to use the forums but do u have to sign before fanfest? ccp are using the eula/tos to ban but this is out of the scope of the eula/tos. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[428] - Quote
May O'Neez wrote:Quote:Hey Moron, Plex doesn't appear out of nowhere, someone, somewhere pays for it. You've got a point, my bad. But I stay polite :) I did'nt want to offend anyone. Still I'd be curious of the ratio generated / paid / etc, but it's kinda out of context. My background remark was mainly: CSM voting system is not an actual image of the player base. I want to offend you. You're dumb. PLEX. NOT. GENERATED. The only time it appears out of thin air is for buddy program subscriptions. EVERY other plex in game is bought, with real money. If CSM voting doesn't reflect players maybe those other players need to....vote maybe? Quote:If PLEX had no monetary value CCP wouldn't be making money selling them. They don't do it for money, they do it to fight against RMT ... I'm not sure you understand how this whole business thing works.... |
Wolfgang Helm
Valar Morghulis. Gentlemen's Agreement
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[429] - Quote
DelightSucker wrote:Wolfgang Helm wrote:
Ban yes, remove from chair yes - removal from CSM was too far.
you are aware that the Ban is what makes him getting kicked form csm right?
actually - just checked the rules - violating the EULA or being banned does not require kicking from CSM |
Grogoth Drem
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[430] - Quote
Andski wrote:Rebnok wrote:you are stupid,( In game) and well tbfh rl also, but they don't temp ban for rmt Ask Krutoj about that.
I did, he was temp banned DURING INVESTIGATION, found innocent, freed.
we ALL know what mittens did
(in game) |
|
Javier McPoopbeard
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[431] - Quote
This is pretty shameful on CCP's part. |
Oliver Duncan
Kick B0rt Test Alliance Please Ignore
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:50:00 -
[432] - Quote
Lakshata Chawla wrote:At this rate, all the goons will unsub, This is the best decision CCP has ever made.
Nope, we're all going to stay, because we love you so much. Love you enough that we will suicide gank your ships and ********************************************************* yourself. |
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:51:00 -
[433] - Quote
Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. As another European I can freely call you fascist dog. Europe has benefits but fascist **** laws for censorship of speech are not it. At the same time as you have to ***** foot around serious issues we all get butt raped by our dear politicians but hey they are at least preventing us to say thing they don't like. This is one thing where europe should take after US instead of introducing just more and more idiotic censorship laws.
clearly I disagree with you, so does the law fortunatly, did you think the muamba sentence was unfair then?
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:52:00 -
[434] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:Hulemand wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. What legal precedence do they need? None! Yeah, because that line works well when a lawsuit lands. Stop trying to think, you're in Raiden.
that would be the funniest lawsuit ever filled stop acting like a ....
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:52:00 -
[435] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:
When you think about it this really was a decision about who makes the decisions and calls the shots on Eve Online management and press relations: CCP Iceland or Something Awful forums. CCP made the right choice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
100
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:52:00 -
[436] - Quote
Lakshata Chawla wrote:At this rate, all the goons will unsub, This is the best decision CCP has ever made.
I still wish Mittani could stay on CSM, he WAS a productive member.
I bet not even 10 percent of them unsub.
|
Xorv
Questionable Acquisitions
206
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:52:00 -
[437] - Quote
The whole thing from beginning to end is very lame. A grown man that needs to get his life together and grab hold of some semblance of perspective, The Mittani's boorish behavior and making an ass of himself at the Panel along with a few other drunks, The over the top silly ramblings of the "stop cyber bullying" crowd encouraged of course by opportunistic anti Mittens/Goons people, and finally CCP caving into nonsense and promising nanny state political correctness at future Fanfests. ..I and the rest of the space ship nerds are waiting for some real solid info on Inferno instead of reading about this bullshit. |
Javier McPoopbeard
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[438] - Quote
Grogoth Drem wrote:Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable. you mis-typed 3% of subscribers it is your own dumb fault for not vote splitting and EASILLY getting 3 csm spots (in game)
They said 20% of voters, dumbshit, not 20% of subscribers. |
End Of Time
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[439] - Quote
CCP only Banned him... He stepped down of his own will.
The Mittani wrote:Though I have received many letters of support (my inbox is full of these, and for them I thank you) and the major bloggers have called for me to remain on as Chair, there are still some who doubt the sincerity of my apology to the player concerned, who - unlike those attempting to make hay from my mistake - is the person that matters here. I said that I would resign; to demonstrate the sincerity of my words and my apology, I will do just that. With the increasingly high profile of the CSM in the wake of the Incarna Emergency Summit and the amazing turnout we had for the CSM7 elections, I have come to the conclusion that my two roles in EVE - that of the Chairman of the CSM as Alexander Gianturco, and the leader of Goonswarm as "The Mittani" are increasingly incompatible. It is, fundamentally, a problem of hats. As the leader of Goonswarm I must be willing to make ruthless decisions and take actions that many players find objectionable - griefing, ganking, scamming, 'dishonorable' fleet tactics, espionage, metagaming, blowing up everyone who tries to mine Gallente Ice, sponsoring Hulkageddon, et cetera - whatever it takes to defend my people in this, the most exceedingly hostile galaxy to grace the internet. As Darius JOHNSON, the previous Goonswarm leader once said, "[Goonswarm] is not here to destroy /the/ game, but /your/ game. Yet as Chairman of the CSM and Alexander Gianturco, I need to put a good face on CCP's experimental player democracy and keep my nose clean. Inevitably, these two roles conflict with one another; when Goonswarm does what it does in EVE, this reflects on the CSM as a whole, purely due to my position as both Chairman and alliance leader. If I abandon the brutalist tactics of an alliance leader in hopes of keeping the CSM's image pristine, I hamstring my people ingame and do a disservice to the line members who rely on me. In addition, the enemies of Goonswarm assault the CSM and CCP itself unfairly due to the in-game actions of our alliance. After the successful restructuring of CCP, I am convinced that most of the hard work of the CSM is already done - CCP is now focusing on spaceships instead of avatars, and the success of CSM6 has led to a solid and competent crop of player representatives in CSM7 with a much greater turnout, demonstrating ever-more faith and trust from the playerbase in the concept of the CSM. This changes things for the CSM, as well as the Chairman title During Goonswarm's highly successful Gallente Ice Interdiction there were calls for my resignation as Chairman; those calls increased when Goonswarm began to use false supercap sales as a method of closing the gap between us and our in-game enemies' supercap fleets. We are now planning an attempt to destroy Jita itself. All of these actions are entirely legitimate within the brutal world of EVE, yet, in the coming months, if I continue to hold the title of Chairman, CCP will be enduring one PR nightmare after another as Goonswarm's in-game actions unfairly reflect back upon the CSM as a whole through the Chairman title. It is increasingly important that the Chair be a GÇÿgood citizenGÇÖ in the game itself - and I cannot be a good citizen and simultaneously lead my alliance of magnificent bastards. With CSM7's term beginning on April 4th, I now exercise my right as the winner of the election with 10,058 votes to decline the office of Chairman. It will then be up to CSM7 as a group to decide how to proceed regarding the Chair. As a member of the CSM without a title, what I do as the leader of Goonswarm will no longer unfairly reflect on the CSM as a whole - leaving me and my people free to do as we please without needing to consider corporate, political, or media ramifications every time we make a **** joke, offend someone, or sell a supercap made of vapor.
|
Selyna Ferenzcy
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[440] - Quote
You guys are seriously riding the Drama Llama. Get over it. When a public figure makes an ass out of themselves, sometimes they have to eat their own sh*t. Your idle/pathetic threats are laughable and a waste of the arm strength it took to type them.
I do feel the apology was enough and we should just chalk it up as a mistake but you guys are taking it way too far. I used to think that the average age of EVE players was a bit higher... |
|
Jim Luc
Rule of Five
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[441] - Quote
According to this liberal interpretation of the EULA/TOS then 98% of EVE players would have been banned a long time ago. |
Sasha Azala
Blood and Decay
153
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[442] - Quote
Mafia Matt wrote:Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page Two Step. Honestly, I cannot believe that statement from yourself. It was a terrible thing to say, its against the law let alone the elua and the tos. Tbh he got off lightly. Supporting this behaviour is terrible! Correct decision was made.
You can't? Two Step is TEST seems normal to me. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3747
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[443] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:Lakshata Chawla wrote:At this rate, all the goons will unsub, This is the best decision CCP has ever made.
I still wish Mittani could stay on CSM, he WAS a productive member. I bet not even 10 percent of them unsub.
I was already unsubbed because of PLEX
(in game) "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Axhind
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:53:00 -
[444] - Quote
Rebnok wrote:Joepopo wrote:J3ssica Alba wrote:So what goons are saying is that 10058 votes gives people the right to break rules/laws/ethics amirite? You're a NPC alt. Get out. I am not lol 10,058 GUUD FIGHT
nah just a pathetic loser who was going to kill himself after that titan nerf. CCP should ban themselves for trying to get PL to commit mass suicide. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3755
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:54:00 -
[445] - Quote
Sasha Azala wrote:You can't? Two Step is TEST seems normal to me.
You misspelled AHARM.
in-game "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:54:00 -
[446] - Quote
If all or many of the Goons cancel their subs, have they not in effect, thrown in the towel?
In effect the meta-gamers will have been out meta-gamed by those who have exploited the unfortunate event in in Iceland.
|
Zena Zayn
Sleep Walking
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:54:00 -
[447] - Quote
End Of Time wrote:CCP only Banned him... He stepped down of his own will.
Reading comprehension is definitely not your friend.
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3755
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:54:00 -
[448] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:If all or many of the Goons cancel their subs, have they not in effect, thrown in the towel?
In effect the meta-gamers will have been out meta-gamed by those who have exploited the unfortunate event in in Iceland.
it's a form of metagaming you see
(in-game) "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Valkyria Caeli
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:54:00 -
[449] - Quote
You know, we shouldn't jump to any conclusions in this. We should still hold open the possibility that Mittens had planned all along to nullify 10k+ Goon votes by getting drunk, saying something crazy and then apologizing and resigning his seat only after the results were finally announced. He does, after all, lead the way in scamming people for the lulz. |
Derrick Munroe
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[450] - Quote
End Of Time wrote:CCP only Banned him... He stepped down of his own will.
He stepped down from the chairman position. Not from the CSM in its entirety. |
|
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
130
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[451] - Quote
Also CCP, while I have your attention, perhaps you should consider the repercussions of publically allowing the CSM to come to their own decision on this then even more publically overriding it. That doesn't look to me like the actions of a company who takes their playerbase seriously. |
Jim Luc
Rule of Five
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[452] - Quote
If he stepped down as CHAIR only, why did this devblog state that he was stepping down from CSM6 and subsequently CSM7? Did I read the blog correctly, or am I mistaken somehow? If so then I think quite a few others are also mistaken here lol |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
151
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[453] - Quote
CCP you just created a Martyr. |
Jonatan Reed
Momentary Lapse of Reason. STR8NGE BREW
42
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[454] - Quote
Right, No.
This is a crock of ****. If your removing and giving him a 30 day ban, you might as well ban everyone else that has every scammed, trolled ,or otherwise trashtalked someone. |
Golar Crexis
the boltzmann experience Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
20
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[455] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here).
I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers.
If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[456] - Quote
i'm loving this, this shows ccp is fair and treats all its customers the same if i had said what The Mittani said people would be looking for me to be band.
being the head of an alliance or the chair of the csm should not give you more rights than anyother players
yes i know he was drunk and it was a drunk stupid mistake but then again so is drink driving and having an accident.
lets remember he was encourging players to break the eula/tos as well (any player that did do that should be baned as well)
to those that say the eula/tos do not apply does that mean if i'm not loged into the game and tell people on ts3 how to exploit the game that wil make them 50b isk right away is that an ok thing to do? i didn't sign the ccp eula or agree to the tos on ts3 right?
now with that said i hope ccp will rerun the csm election with the mittani removed from the list.
|
Schettino
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:55:00 -
[457] - Quote
All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP. |
Nemo deBlanc
Phoibe Enterprises
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:56:00 -
[458] - Quote
Couldn't possibly care less about Mittani. But holy s-¡hit are these Goon tears hilarious. The only thing that's going to be more hilarious is the griefing wave that is surely about to wash over high sec. |
Steelradio
BOAE INC GIANTSBANE.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:56:00 -
[459] - Quote
The amount of people in this thread that say "oh people tell each other to kill themselves on eve all the time and they don't get banned" amuses me. He didn't just tell someone to kill themselves, he provoked other people to try and harrass this guy into suicide.
Yes alright, stuff like that happens all the time in EVE but he was a CCP representative. He most likely has his own contract with them that covers things like this. Yes is sucks for him and for Goons but as far as CCP are concerned they had to do it. Both from a "these are our own rules" point of view and a "we're a business" point of view.
CCP are in a big deal with Sony, they also have their own image as a company to look out for, their hands were pretty much tied to this decision.
Not taking sides in this as my personal opinion doesn't make a difference, but from a business point of view, I can understand why CCP did it. Even Mittani himself admitted he should resign because of this and he was ashamed of what he did. I don't think he is raging too much about this, so why is everyone else?
The bigger deal people make of this, either showing support for CCP or raging at CCP, the longer it will be before the dust clears and CCP can rethink their decision (if they decide too) without too much political/business bull crap exploding from their actions.
TLDR: Calm down and get on with things and let CCP and Mittani sort this out between them. I'm sure if Mitanni wants to fight this, we'll hear it from him himself. |
kong Thiesant
NorCorp Enterprise No Holes Barred
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:56:00 -
[460] - Quote
This is just stupid. **** off ccp. |
|
Astroniomix
EliteTroll
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:57:00 -
[461] - Quote
2.5% |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3755
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:57:00 -
[462] - Quote
Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP.
wrong "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:57:00 -
[463] - Quote
Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000.
ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:57:00 -
[464] - Quote
Jim Luc wrote:If he stepped down as CHAIR only, why did this devblog state that he was stepping down from CSM6 and subsequently CSM7? Did I read the blog correctly, or am I mistaken somehow? If so then I think quite a few others are also mistaken here lol cause ccp axed him , as they should .. 30 day ban is a minor thing
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
215
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[465] - Quote
Andski wrote:Sasha Azala wrote:You can't? Two Step is TEST seems normal to me. You misspelled AHARM. in-game
hmm seems like your fault for not having 3 cfc run for csm... like you did last year
jokes on you i guess...
live and learn...
|
Vatek
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[466] - Quote
Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP.
Sorry, no. There needs to be a system in place so that people who voted for candidates who either resign or are removed are still represented. Mittani's actions do not speak for the 10,058 people that voted for him. |
Axhind
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[467] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. As another European I can freely call you fascist dog. Europe has benefits but fascist **** laws for censorship of speech are not it. At the same time as you have to ***** foot around serious issues we all get butt raped by our dear politicians but hey they are at least preventing us to say thing they don't like. This is one thing where europe should take after US instead of introducing just more and more idiotic censorship laws. clearly I disagree with you, so does the law fortunatly, did you think the muamba sentence was unfair then?
OFC it was. Who cares what some dude writes? Far better to allow saying few things that might make someone upset than to start banning anything that might make someone upset. For anything you say there will be someone who will give you **** for it.
UK especially is ******** to hell and back with it's laws about speech. Even more than germany and france who are both already bad enough with the laws controlling what people can say about ww2.
It never ends. Just more and more things get censored until you will not be allowed to open your mouth for the fright of breaking some idiotic law. |
Sasha Azala
Blood and Decay
153
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[468] - Quote
Andski wrote:Sasha Azala wrote:You can't? Two Step is TEST seems normal to me. You misspelled AHARM. in-game
Yeah, I realised and altered it to ... |
Saiphas Cain
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[469] - Quote
Lets think realistically for a moment and not mince threats and rage.
What is a likely outcome of this?
Considering that most large scale goon actions are aimed at ISKmaking, and the remaining are aimed at giving a writhing colony of army ants something to do so that they do not begin eating each other; what do you suppose will happen when the main coordinator of that swarm cannot distract himself by shooting things in an internet spaceship?
Does anyone really think Patton would have made a more effective tank commander than General?
There is a big difference between goons and friends doing things out of economic interest, and doing things out of spite.
I wonder how many concord ships it would take to tidi the entire cluster into oblivion? At the very least CCP would have to change some code or start issuing rapidfire bans very quickly. When one shoots "innocents" in highsec concord shows up and they stay there awhile. There are many places to do this. Would such a campaign amount to ingame terrorism? Possibly. Think of the TEST Jita tidi recently. Now apply that to every solar system. Goons used to specialize in Rifter-terrorism. Are those days really so far gone?
Who amongst you doesn't think that ten thousand people are thinking of things far more hideous and irritating than that right now.
|
Flyinghotpocket
Amarrian Retribution Amarr 7th Fleet
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[470] - Quote
now we can focus on real game aspects, like faction warfare |
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3755
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[471] - Quote
sakurako wrote:ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here
bolded for emphasis "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Oliver Duncan
Kick B0rt Test Alliance Please Ignore
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:58:00 -
[472] - Quote
Riverini for CSM chairmen. I'm starting a petition to get all 10k of Mittani's votes transferred to Riverini. |
Revii Lagoon
The Foreign Legion Test Alliance Please Ignore
44
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:59:00 -
[473] - Quote
sakurako wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here
We do not want a rerun, we want the person we rightfully elected to CSM to actually be on the CSM. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:59:00 -
[474] - Quote
Selyna Ferenzcy wrote: Your idle/pathetic threats are laughable and a waste of the arm strength it took to type them.
Here, here Xorv SO wait I've been reading hundreds of pages of your utter BS and pressuring CCP and that was all " idle/pathetic threats" that were " laughable and a waste of the arm strength it took to type them" Man I've wasted so much time, I think I'll kill myself...so very sad.... =( |
Sam McCausland
Pax Mortis Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:59:00 -
[475] - Quote
Let's be rational here, you all knew this was going to happen, Mittens dug his own grave with his abhorrent display at the panel and subsequent "deal with it" comments. If you seriously believe CCP had another choice in this matter after the PR shitstorm he caused, you're pretty naive.
I'm almost pissing myself reading through all the "I WILL UNSUB" rage. In reality, we all know you will all stay and STFU after a few days and continue being meaningless drones for your dear leader...
After the dust settles, the majority of EVE will realize that today was a good day for EVE. |
Mortuus Adamo
Wipe Corp.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:59:00 -
[476] - Quote
95% of ppl crying are from the Deklein Co. No more making the game go your way like the old NC. I guess thats dramatic for you and better for everyone else. So much drama.
CSM should be disolved, and CCP should open an open devblog to post feedback. That way they won't only be taking into account the CSM opinions. Everyone hates politicians except those who get power from them. Everyone is mad by those things.
If CCP wants to take some ppl opinions into account they should ask them directly like in most games and thats it. Not so much stupidity with a council that no one is OK with except the ones that win.
Just to say, i never had any problem with Dek Co. But i guess your "game trolling" is kinda getting over the line.
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:59:00 -
[477] - Quote
Vatek wrote:Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP. Sorry, no. There needs to be a system in place so that people who voted for candidates who either resign or are removed are still represented. Mittani's actions do not speak for the 10,058 people that voted for him. isuggest Remedial (sp)
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
OninoTimmo
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
50
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:00:00 -
[478] - Quote
I'm conflicted. On one hand I think this is unfair and overboard and Mittani deserves to be on the CSM. On the other hand, goon tears taste so good. |
Mistress Lilu
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:00:00 -
[479] - Quote
Heath Ornitz wrote:~ 10,058 ~ lol, out the door, and by his own doin. go complain to mitardi.
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1699
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:01:00 -
[480] - Quote
Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000.
You voted for a guy who couldn't hold his drink and used the CSM chair position and privileged position on the alliance panel to call for a fellow eve player to be trolled into suicide.
I'm sorry you wasted your vote but next time choose a better candidate.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
Htrag
The Carebear Stare Hydroponic Zone
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:01:00 -
[481] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
In effect the meta-gamers will have been out meta-gamed by those who have exploited the unfortunate event in in Iceland.
That's exactly what it is.
This chapter is kind of ironic...
Goons got a taste of their own forum spam tasting medicine...
and CCP got to finally retaliate against someone who has been so brutal and effective at pointing out their flaws in the past. Whatever "dev" it was that removed the pod squish sound probably never even logged into the game. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:02:00 -
[482] - Quote
Jim Luc wrote:If he stepped down as CHAIR only, why did this devblog state that he was stepping down from CSM6 and subsequently CSM7? Did I read the blog correctly, or am I mistaken somehow? If so then I think quite a few others are also mistaken here lol You read it correctly, CCP is just being CCP. |
Simone Bataille
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:02:00 -
[483] - Quote
Way to communicate with your CSM. They have a long discussion and announce a course of action with Mittens standing down as chair but continuing as a CSM member, and two hours later you release this statement.
Wasn't that the whole point of the CSM, working with player representatives prior to unilateral decisions like this? |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3755
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[484] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. You voted for a guy who couldn't hold his drink and used the CSM chair position and privileged position on the alliance panel to call for a fellow eve player to be trolled into suicide. I'm sorry you wasted your vote but next time choose a better candidate.
I'm sorry about how wrong you are. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1699
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[485] - Quote
sakurako wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here
Previous CSMs have been kicked out of the CSM while still technically in office for breaking CSM rules and there is no precedent of a re-run. Just as previous CSMs have gone afk during the process also wasting the votes entrusted to their run.
Sorry to be blunt but next time entrust your votes to a more stable candidate who knows how to behave in front of the cameras.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jim Luc
Rule of Five
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[486] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Jim Luc wrote:If he stepped down as CHAIR only, why did this devblog state that he was stepping down from CSM6 and subsequently CSM7? Did I read the blog correctly, or am I mistaken somehow? If so then I think quite a few others are also mistaken here lol cause ccp axed him , as they should .. 30 day ban is a minor thing
I see... yep - this whole thing is CCP's fault. There never would've been stupid articles (and I enjoy reading Brendan Drain over at Massively, but his article was completely dumb), there never would've been any of this had CCP not released a completely moronic press release acting as if Mittani had actively threatened someone. I've got to say this just ruins all of the fun and excitement that FanFest was. I really hope that the rest of CSM is able to convince the morons at CCP to find some common sense... |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[487] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. You voted for a guy who couldn't hold his drink and used the CSM chair position and privileged position on the alliance panel to call for a fellow eve player to be trolled into suicide. I'm sorry you wasted your vote but next time choose a better candidate. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
May O'Neez
Flying Blacksmiths
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[488] - Quote
Quote:I want to offend you. You're dumb. PLEX. NOT. GENERATED. The only time it appears out of thin air is for buddy program subscriptions. EVERY other plex in game is bought, with real money. If CSM voting doesn't reflect players maybe those other players need to....vote maybe?
0.0 economy is kinda special, I was told in fanfest that people gain more that in incursions and titans were built out of drones salvages, but I'm not sure this is really for truth. Sorry, I try to participate and understand, and still think that the 10k people were not 10k. I definitively agree that we need more votes to have a better shape.
Quote:I'm not sure you understand how this whole business thing works...
I'd gladly read any explanation on the matter. I allways learn, that helps being a dumb moron, you can allways progress ! |
Mioelnir
Cataclysm Enterprises Ev0ke
59
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[489] - Quote
(a) delicious tears (b) the established procedure has in the past been to replace the CSM candidate with an alternate, so this is consistent (c) the CSM has never been an independent entity that CCP has to answer to. They mostly do, but not because they must. It goes the other way around. This is plain obvious from the fact that CCP decides eligibility which is completely orthogonal to independence. (d) Mittani is, as a CSM6 member, still also under NDA and whatnot. There may be additional clauses there about public appearances in an official function? If not, I guess there will be in the future (e) if the broadcast is equaled to the forums, where such a remark is not allowed, and such an incident would have rendered one ineligible for candidacy if done before the election, this move is consistent. There is no diplomatic immunity for CSM members as far as I know. (f) it is sad for the 10k accounts (3k actual players?) that placed their trust in him, but this is eve and trust gets betrayed in curious ways (g) it is curious how everything every CSM so far did and built up is attributed by so many to one person in one CSM term. sheep.
Best of luck to the remaining original CSM7 and congratulations to the alternate. Your job didn't get any easier. 10k accounts will now, and for another year, always tell you that Mittani would have done it better. Regardless of what you do and how you do it. |
Golar Crexis
the boltzmann experience Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
20
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[490] - Quote
sakurako wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here
Oh no I agree with the sentiment that mittens should be held accountable. I can even accept CCP punishing him fo violating the Eula/tos (harrasment). But to remove him from csm 7 is just such a kick in the face. |
|
Rebnok
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[491] - Quote
so if any of you 10,058 have titans or aeon / nyx's holla at me, i can get you in a proper alliance with a couple fine csm reps.
no troll no scams, Just proper csm representation.
Titan buff coming m8's |
ForgottenStar
Valar Morghulis. Gentlemen's Agreement
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[492] - Quote
Let me get this straight. So one twilight fan got upset because someone hurt his feelings, and all the other twilight fans got their panties in a knot and started posting with self medication tips and checking into therapy.....
Man up and move out of your moms basement, shes tired of doing your laundry.
Welcome to the world where the slighted minority rules the world with a butter-knife made of hurt feelings.
Iceland, your viking ancestors are ashamed.
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:03:00 -
[493] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:sakurako wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here Previous CSMs have been kicked out of the CSM while still technically in office for breaking CSM rules and there is no precedent of a re-run. Just as previous CSMs have gone afk during the process also wasting the votes entrusted to their run. Sorry to be blunt but next time entrust your votes to a more stable candidate who knows how to behave in front of the cameras. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:04:00 -
[494] - Quote
So many delicious Goon tears... Give me more... |
needwaffles
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:05:00 -
[495] - Quote
I request that goneswarm make living in high sec for the Term of CSM 7 to be unlivable.
I demand an all ice interdiction. I demand Jitia camps I demand lvl 4 systems to be ganked I demand smash and burn. |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
362
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:05:00 -
[496] - Quote
Lol @ goon pleb nerd rage
Why blame CCP? All they did was enforcing the TOS/EULA and gave Mittens a temp ban. You all know they had no other choice.
He resigned from his position as CSM chair, probably because he felt it was the right thing to do. Read his apology again if you are unsure about his view on the events. I find this unfortunate and I'm sorry Mittani, but not for this ridiculous bunch of whining hypocrites..
If you feel betrayed, maybe talk with him about it? Or you can also just
~deal with it~ |
Contorted
Kriegsmarinewerft Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:06:00 -
[497] - Quote
Since when is it possible to remove someone from a democratic elected position without a motion of no-confidence? |
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
44
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:06:00 -
[498] - Quote
Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. As another European I can freely call you fascist dog. Europe has benefits but fascist **** laws for censorship of speech are not it. At the same time as you have to ***** foot around serious issues we all get butt raped by our dear politicians but hey they are at least preventing us to say thing they don't like. This is one thing where europe should take after US instead of introducing just more and more idiotic censorship laws. clearly I disagree with you, so does the law fortunatly, did you think the muamba sentence was unfair then? OFC it was. Who cares what some dude writes? Far better to allow saying few things that might make someone upset than to start banning anything that might make someone upset. For anything you say there will be someone who will give you **** for it. UK especially is ******** to hell and back with it's laws about speech. Even more than germany and france who are both already bad enough with the laws controlling what people can say about ww2. It never ends. Just more and more things get censored until you will not be allowed to open your mouth for the fright of breaking some idiotic law.
Or maybe we start treating each other with more consideration and respect, maybe we start to look past issues of gender, race sexuality, etc and actually learn to empathise.Freedom or speech is not without consequenses nor is it an absolute right in the EU. When I look at our past its pretty obvious why these principles are enshrined in European law or can you not see that? |
Valkyria Caeli
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[499] - Quote
GunslingerBob wrote:I can't be bothered to read this entire threadnaught, but I'll have you know this:
Unless CCP does the correct thing and holds a re-vote for ALL positions, I will be dropping this game like a steaming pile of elephant dung.
For a company that spouts about democracy and whatnot, they sure do love to pull one over on their customers.
So wait, you mean we might be in danger of loosing 10,058 Goons and their friends over this
.......
wait..., help me here, what was the down side? |
Ebon Rue
The Incursion Career University
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[500] - Quote
There was no need to throw Alex under the bus like this. CSM6 is the reason I gave enough of a **** to vote this year for CSM7, now you're dropping the ban hammer on my vote too?
Alex has gone above and beyond in taking ownership for his actions. He even took ownership over the fact that he let himself get intoxicated enough to say something like that, he hasn't shirked a single gram of responsibility for his actions.
You went too far. I want the guy I voted for given his voice back on CSM7. He was an influential part of the CSM6 team that Got **** Done. |
|
Dirk Culliford
Aliastra Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[501] - Quote
Rebnok wrote:so if any of you 10,058 have titans or aeon / nyx's holla at me, i can get you in a proper alliance with a couple fine csm reps.
no troll no scams, Just proper csm representation.
Titan buff coming m8's
You should buy me a Titan you space rich bastard.
Also, cripes jade constantine still posts? Oh well.
Half of you people should stop raging so much tbh. Go outside, have a beer! |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[502] - Quote
Revii Lagoon wrote:sakurako wrote:Golar Crexis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Its a very fair decision from CCP and will gain a large degree of respect from the wider gaming media I believe.
Well done CCP, I am very impressed.
Excuse me for this but **** you, Seriously go **** yourself (in game RP terms here). I voted for the mittani and this is not what I want to see, its not what the 10000 supporters wanted to see. I understand you are unfamiliar with democracy (coming from earlier csm's were the vote count was so low as to be non-existant) however I am completely shocked that CCP would ignore the wishes of over 10000 paying customers. If you had any sense of fairness you'd be joining us and asking CCP about the 10000. ccp are being fair and treating him as just any other player, but i do think a rerun of the election with out him is in order here We do not want a rerun, we want the person we rightfully elected to CSM to actually be on the CSM.
wait you want someone that broke the rules "stated by ccp" and told others to brake them aswell to still be on the csm. can't face the punishment don't break the rules
10k+ players didn't break the rules he did and has to be punished taking him of the csm is a punishment
if he broke the nda would you want him on this is the same thing he broke rules/agreements |
Golar Crexis
the boltzmann experience Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
21
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[503] - Quote
[Jade Constantine wrote:
Previous CSMs have been kicked out of the CSM while still technically in office for breaking CSM rules and there is no precedent of a re-run. Just as previous CSMs have gone afk during the process also wasting the votes entrusted to their run.
Sorry to be blunt but next time entrust your votes to a more stable candidate who knows how to behave in front of the cameras.
I respect those opinions and the facts that yes this has happened to previous CSM's.
What I find absolutely disgusting though is your (and other peoples) attitude and demeanor and opinions about the people who supported the mittani.
|
Mortuus Adamo
Wipe Corp.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[504] - Quote
Contorted wrote:Since when is it possible to remove someone from a democratic elected position without a motion of no-confidence?
Since that democratic elected position is under overlords. aka "Kings" in history. and CCP is EVEs King. Not goons. |
xXv1c10usXx
Alchemy Corp
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[505] - Quote
somehow, some of the posters presume I am in some way part of goons swarm. I am an independent griefer and and quite regularly tell people in local chat to crawl in a hole an die.
I am simply standing up for what is BS and those that think they are being white knights saving some poor SOB from his drama queen self is somehow a good thing. Maybe we should all get on the band wagon so he never can undock again, keep those locator agents busy if that is the case. That is just part of the game. Be a douche bag, people target you. It happens. And Wis being a drama queen is being a douchebag.
Don't call it a sandbox if you are going to turn it in to a litter box CCP.
At least I am not hiding behind a brand new alt, come at me Bro. I can perma target you until you want to kill your self too. Oh wait, that was a hypothetical, non serious situational dramatization. This is too much stress. I may have to Kill myself now. I just can't take it anymore! |
Khanh'rhh
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
971
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:07:00 -
[506] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:Hulemand wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. What legal precedence do they need? None! Yeah, because that line works well when a lawsuit lands. Stop trying to think, you're in Raiden. that would be the funniest lawsuit ever filled stop acting like a ....
CCP have removed his ability to use the service he is paying for, without him violating the contract.
That's not funny, it's the majority of civil lawsuits. - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |
Karasu Zed
EVE University Ivy League
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:08:00 -
[507] - Quote
The effect I take from this is that over 10,000 paying subscriptions are worth more than the life of one player. A 30 day ban is laughable, if this were a regular, unknown player in EVE that publicly made thse comments, they would not have received such kindness from CCP. A permanent ban would have been appropriate. It's obvious to me who runs EVE Online now, the players, as cruel and immature as they can be. |
Jim Luc
Rule of Five
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:09:00 -
[508] - Quote
Roime wrote:Lol @ goon pleb nerd rage
Why blame CCP? All they did was enforcing the TOS/EULA and gave Mittens a temp ban. You all know they had no other choice.
He resigned from his position as CSM chair, probably because he felt it was the right thing to do. Read his apology again if you are unsure about his view on the events. I find this unfortunate and I'm sorry Mittani, but not for this ridiculous bunch of whining hypocrites..
If you feel betrayed, maybe talk with him about it? Or you can also just
~deal with it~
You seriously think he harassed someone to the point of violating the TOS? The 30 day ban is ridiculous. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
70
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:09:00 -
[509] - Quote
Roime wrote:Lol @ goon pleb nerd rage
Why blame CCP? All they did was enforcing the TOS/EULA and gave Mittens a temp ban. You all know they had no other choice.
He resigned from his position as CSM chair, probably because he felt it was the right thing to do. Read his apology again if you are unsure about his view on the events. I find this unfortunate and I'm sorry Mittani, but not for this ridiculous bunch of whining hypocrites..
If you feel betrayed, maybe talk with him about it? Or you can also just
~deal with it~ Its not the resignation its the being completely off the CSM. Just now I have shouted 30 cuss words, encouraged a few alliance bros to **** sheep, and given suggestions on how to counterfeit Aerosmith CDs. I have violated the CCP EULA. Ban me? |
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
688
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:09:00 -
[510] - Quote
We love it when you are banned.
|
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1699
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:10:00 -
[511] - Quote
Contorted wrote:Since when is it possible to remove someone from a democratic elected position without a motion of no-confidence?
When they break the rules of the Process by getting drunk and misusing position and panel appearance as a sadistic bully-pulpit to call for somebody to be trolled to suicide.
Its in the CSM guidelines. Do something seriously bad and you will get expelled. Alexander Gianturco knew the rules but chose to break them anyway because he figured he ran CCP.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
70
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:10:00 -
[512] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Contorted wrote:Since when is it possible to remove someone from a democratic elected position without a motion of no-confidence? When they break the rules of the Process by getting drunk and misusing position and panel appearance as a sadistic bully-pulpit to call for somebody to be trolled to suicide. Its in the CSM guidelines. Do something seriously bad and you will get expelled. Alexander Gianturco knew the rules but chose to break them anyway because he figured he ran CCP. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
Vatek
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:10:00 -
[513] - Quote
Roime wrote:Lol @ goon pleb nerd rage
Why blame CCP? All they did was enforcing the TOS/EULA and gave Mittens a temp ban. You all know they had no other choice.
He resigned from his position as CSM chair, probably because he felt it was the right thing to do. Read his apology again if you are unsure about his view on the events. I find this unfortunate and I'm sorry Mittani, but not for this ridiculous bunch of whining hypocrites..
If you feel betrayed, maybe talk with him about it? Or you can also just
~deal with it~
Please find a section in the EULA that states that you will be punished for actions outside of the game and the EVE official forums, and then find me people who were asked to sign TOS/EULA agreements before being allowed into the building at fanfest. I'll wait. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1699
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:11:00 -
[514] - Quote
Vatek wrote:Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP. Sorry, no. There needs to be a system in place so that people who voted for candidates who either resign or are removed are still represented. Mittani's actions do not speak for the 10,058 people that voted for him.
This has never been the case for previously expelled CSM representatives. Why are you asking to be a special case?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:11:00 -
[515] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:Hulemand wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. What legal precedence do they need? None! Yeah, because that line works well when a lawsuit lands. Stop trying to think, you're in Raiden. that would be the funniest lawsuit ever filled stop acting like a .... CCP have removed his ability to use the service he is paying for, without him violating the contract. That's not funny, it's the majority of civil lawsuits.
keep telling that to yourself
and imagine Alex (the RL guy ) making the judge watch the video showing the video why he was banned
Alex isnt an idiot , you on the other hand , im not sure CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
70
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:11:00 -
[516] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Vatek wrote:Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP. Sorry, no. There needs to be a system in place so that people who voted for candidates who either resign or are removed are still represented. Mittani's actions do not speak for the 10,058 people that voted for him. This has never been the case for previously expelled CSM representatives. Why are you asking to be a special case? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
Alidean
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:11:00 -
[517] - Quote
And suddenly 10,000 angry neckbeards have law degrees. |
Midge Mo'yb
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
127
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:12:00 -
[518] - Quote
Vatek wrote:Roime wrote:Lol @ goon pleb nerd rage
Why blame CCP? All they did was enforcing the TOS/EULA and gave Mittens a temp ban. You all know they had no other choice.
He resigned from his position as CSM chair, probably because he felt it was the right thing to do. Read his apology again if you are unsure about his view on the events. I find this unfortunate and I'm sorry Mittani, but not for this ridiculous bunch of whining hypocrites..
If you feel betrayed, maybe talk with him about it? Or you can also just
~deal with it~ Please find a section in the EULA that states that you will be punished for actions outside of the game and the EVE official forums, and then find me people who were asked to sign TOS/EULA agreements before being allowed into the building at fanfest. I'll wait. NEQ |
Panda Name
Republic University Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:12:00 -
[519] - Quote
it's crazy to think that i'm on the side of the goons on this. they are in the right, and history will remember them this way.
all you raiden dorks and jade constantine, you long winded harlot, are in the wrong and it's pathetic that you cannot see it. |
Schwa Nuts
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:12:00 -
[520] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote: clearly I disagree with you, so does the law fortunatly, did you think the muamba sentence was unfair then?
I do think that sentence was unfair actually. But then I am an American, and we have Constitutionally protected rights to freedom of speech. |
|
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:12:00 -
[521] - Quote
Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:AFAIK accounts that have action against em are not allowed for CSM Krutoj made no secret about his temp ban for RMT which did _not_ lead to his removal from the CSM.
QFT |
Meno Theaetetus
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:13:00 -
[522] - Quote
I came to this game 6 years ago from SWG, took them six years but Sony finally caught up and destroyed another game that I loved. |
Istyn
Tactical Knightmare
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:13:00 -
[523] - Quote
Tarsus Zateki wrote:The Mittani isn't even gone for a day and CCP's management is already making bad decisions.
BAM |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
817
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:13:00 -
[524] - Quote
Aryth wrote:CCP, let me lay this out for you. I get you cannot go back on this decision without looking bad.
You bring people to Iceland. You encourage them to get roaring drunk, you stream this in HD while profiting off it. Then you punish them for out of game actions at said event.
Did you not forsee something like this happening? Really?
What all players should gain from this. Fanfest is not a safe environment to interact with fellow players. It has in-game consequences. I hope you are clear on future fanfest purchasing pages that any actions at your events have in-game consequences.
not empty quoting |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:13:00 -
[525] - Quote
Panda Name wrote:it's crazy to think that i'm on the side of the goons on this. they are in the right, and history will remember them this way.
all you raiden dorks and jade constantine, you long winded harlot, are in the wrong and it's pathetic that you cannot see it.
please tell us how we are in the wrong? |
Javier McPoopbeard
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:13:00 -
[526] - Quote
FREE MITTENS 2012 |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
362
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:13:00 -
[527] - Quote
Jim Luc wrote:Roime wrote:Lol @ goon pleb nerd rage
Why blame CCP? All they did was enforcing the TOS/EULA and gave Mittens a temp ban. You all know they had no other choice.
He resigned from his position as CSM chair, probably because he felt it was the right thing to do. Read his apology again if you are unsure about his view on the events. I find this unfortunate and I'm sorry Mittani, but not for this ridiculous bunch of whining hypocrites..
If you feel betrayed, maybe talk with him about it? Or you can also just
~deal with it~ You seriously think he harassed someone to the point of violating the TOS? The 30 day ban is ridiculous.
My opinion is as irrelevant as yours, but Mittani admitted that he did something so horrible that he was disgusted with himself. Maybe that convinced CCP as well? |
Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
873
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:14:00 -
[528] - Quote
HEY GUYS.... 26 PAGES AND COUNTING OF DISCUSSING MODERATION
WE ARE ALL GONNA GET BANNED! My homeboys tried to warn me But that butt you got makes me so horny |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:14:00 -
[529] - Quote
Panda Name wrote:it's crazy to think that i'm on the side of the goons on this. they are in the right, and history will remember them this way.
all you raiden dorks and jade constantine, you long winded harlot, are in the wrong and it's pathetic that you cannot see it. I'd just like to say that long winded harlot would be a great name for a band |
static zero
Power of the Phoenix
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:14:00 -
[530] - Quote
He has also resigned from his position as Chairman of CSM 6 and has forfeited his right to serve on CSM 7.
Was it CCP that made the judgment that The Mittani may not serve on CSM 7? It's unclear from this statement.
-static |
|
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:14:00 -
[531] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:We love it when you are banned.
Okay, I laughed. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1700
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:15:00 -
[532] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:Hulemand wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:CCP,
Can you confirm you were also holding everyone who just happened to be on camera at fanfest accountable to the TOS/EULA? Family members / spouses who don't play the game .. the press .. ?
I am struggling to see how you can possibly think your terms of service apply to what someone says out of game, on camera when it is YOU and your providers who choice what is broadcast and when.
There is absolutely NO legal precedent for it. What legal precedence do they need? None! Yeah, because that line works well when a lawsuit lands. Stop trying to think, you're in Raiden. that would be the funniest lawsuit ever filled stop acting like a .... CCP have removed his ability to use the service he is paying for, without him violating the contract. That's not funny, it's the majority of civil lawsuits.
come on there man, its not as bad as all that
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
k'ryn
Void.Tech BLACK-MARK
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:15:00 -
[533] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. As another European I can freely call you fascist dog. Europe has benefits but fascist **** laws for censorship of speech are not it. At the same time as you have to ***** foot around serious issues we all get butt raped by our dear politicians but hey they are at least preventing us to say thing they don't like. This is one thing where europe should take after US instead of introducing just more and more idiotic censorship laws. clearly I disagree with you, so does the law fortunatly, did you think the muamba sentence was unfair then? OFC it was. Who cares what some dude writes? Far better to allow saying few things that might make someone upset than to start banning anything that might make someone upset. For anything you say there will be someone who will give you **** for it. UK especially is ******** to hell and back with it's laws about speech. Even more than germany and france who are both already bad enough with the laws controlling what people can say about ww2. It never ends. Just more and more things get censored until you will not be allowed to open your mouth for the fright of breaking some idiotic law. Or maybe we start treating each other with more consideration and respect, maybe we start to look past issues of gender, race sexuality, etc and actually learn to empathise.Freedom or speech is not without consequenses nor is it an absolute right in the EU. When I look at our past its pretty obvious why these principles are enshrined in European law or can you not see that?
If we did that we'd turn into WoW. |
Megalift
The Executives Executive Outcomes
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:15:00 -
[534] - Quote
Hmmmmm what......! over 10,000 votes and they guy has to resign. I would like to see a new election in that case. Those that voted for Alex are being cheated their votes. |
xXv1c10usXx
Alchemy Corp
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:16:00 -
[535] - Quote
Javier McPoopbeard wrote:FREE MITTENS 2012
Not empty Quoting. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3761
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:16:00 -
[536] - Quote
Meno Theaetetus wrote:I came to this game 6 years ago from SWG, took them six years but Sony finally caught up and destroyed another game that I loved. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:17:00 -
[537] - Quote
SolusLunes wrote:Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:AFAIK accounts that have action against em are not allowed for CSM Krutoj made no secret about his temp ban for RMT which did _not_ lead to his removal from the CSM. QFT
as someone allready told you he was suspended, found not guilty and case closed btw RMT will get you permabanned anyway CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Darker Domain
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:17:00 -
[538] - Quote
CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:17:00 -
[539] - Quote
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:18:00 -
[540] - Quote
Darker Domain wrote:CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. 70 dollar monocles was dumber than this, but not by much. |
|
dooplex
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:18:00 -
[541] - Quote
Holy sh!t You need a ******* canoe to get hrough this sea of goon tears.
I am feeling warm inside. |
Shiroi Okami
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:19:00 -
[542] - Quote
Man, look at all those goons sperge.
Poor babies.
Mittens did something ********, in his arrogance never even thought that he'd be punished, CCP (Rightly) punished him.
Not big surprise.
You should be taking up your wasted votes with mittens, he's the one that scorned you all by consciously deciding to throw them all in the dumpster. Then again nobody except goons and test really care about the invalidated votes so vOv My Latest Video: Freestyle II |
Saiphas Cain
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:19:00 -
[543] - Quote
Alidean wrote:And suddenly 10,000 angry neckbeards have law degrees.
I thought that's where law degrees came from. Grow a neckbeard, complimentary pass on bar exam. When did this social contract change? I feel like I've been lied to! ... and like I need a shave. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1700
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:19:00 -
[544] - Quote
Townsend Harris wrote:Darker Domain wrote:CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. 70 dollar monocles was dumber than this, but not by much.
Tell me that isn't you Alex?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
xXv1c10usXx
Alchemy Corp
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:19:00 -
[545] - Quote
Skippermonkey wrote:HEY GUYS.... 26 PAGES AND COUNTING OF DISCUSSING MODERATION
WE ARE ALL GONNA GET BANNED!
Not empty Quoting |
Magnus Orin
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
152
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:20:00 -
[546] - Quote
Aryth wrote:CCP, let me lay this out for you. I get you cannot go back on this decision without looking bad.
You bring people to Iceland. You encourage them to get roaring drunk, you stream this in HD while profiting off it. Then you punish them for out of game actions at said event.
Did you not forsee something like this happening? Really?
What all players should gain from this. Fanfest is not a safe environment to interact with fellow players. It has in-game consequences. I hope you are clear on future fanfest purchasing pages that any actions at your events have in-game consequences.
This is a good post.
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:20:00 -
[547] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Townsend Harris wrote:Darker Domain wrote:CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. 70 dollar monocles was dumber than this, but not by much. Tell me that isn't you Alex? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs I'm getting a lot of mileage out of this youtube clip |
Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
1275
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:20:00 -
[548] - Quote
And there I was getting used to CCP being CCP instead of :CCP: .... Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
|
Flette
Rosen Association
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:21:00 -
[549] - Quote
This needed to happen. If anything, this is a pretty light punishment.
First, and foremost, the action that lead to the punishment could be viewed as breaking the law in many countries in which CCP operates. Also, because this action was broadcast by CCP, the company becomes liable for that content. Those of you that enjoy Eve need to recognize this threat of potential legal action against CCP.
Secondly, the player in question resigned of his own free will as near as I can tell, so you can't really blame CCP for that.
Also, for those of you that think what was said, and how it was said is no big deal, try something similar at your next office party, or at your neighborhood pub and see how far you get.
Inciting harassment against someone in a public forum by name is a big deal indeed.
Now though, something does ned to be done about those votes.
This was the right thing, the only thing, and it's a good thing that CCP didn't wait any longer. |
Buzz LiteBeer
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:21:00 -
[550] - Quote
Forum protests are funny =P
There was a young man of Lake Placid Whose prick was lethargic and flaccid. When he wanted to sport He would have to resort To injections of sulphuric acid.
not as funny as that though |
|
buck herrick
101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:22:00 -
[551] - Quote
Alidean wrote:And suddenly 10,000 angry neckbeards have law degrees.
sir,
i ####**$ hate PL. but you got my like and made me chuckle.
now get lost!! |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:22:00 -
[552] - Quote
Andski wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Leykan wrote:MeBiatch wrote:sweet using logical fallacies to avoid the fact that i am right! Still waiting on you to explain the whole TOS applicable in a RL situation thing here... fanfest feed is linked to the forums... official ccp broadcasts are subject to tos... by breaking tos you loose your right to be on this years CSM and get an auto 30 day ban... no if and or butts about it! shut up you bleating moron no game company should disenfranchise a large group of vocal customers with TEN THOUSAND accounts between them that's not a bold move that's a stupid ******* move But around 50k players have actively voted for other candidates and thus against mittani. They are quite happy about this decision...
And again..
U mad? |
Bumrush
Helljumpers Hades.
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:22:00 -
[553] - Quote
Vatek wrote:Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP. Sorry, no. There needs to be a system in place so that people who voted for candidates who either resign or are removed are still represented. Mittani's actions do not speak for the 10,058 people that voted for him.
No there does not, if you vote for a president in RL and they do something wrong and leave or get kicked out they do not do a re-vote, the person under him steps up |
Cynosoreass
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:22:00 -
[554] - Quote
Fair and just action on the part of CCP, Thank you!@
|
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:23:00 -
[555] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog.
This is the most disappointing decision by CCP in nearly a year. |
xXv1c10usXx
Alchemy Corp
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:23:00 -
[556] - Quote
dooplex wrote:Holy sh!t You need a ******* canoe to get hrough this sea of goon tears.
I am feeling warm inside.
Hide behind new alts much... lolz |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:23:00 -
[557] - Quote
One person shooting at the monument in Jita.
Jeez, come on Goonies you can do better than that. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:23:00 -
[558] - Quote
Flette wrote:This needed to happen. If anything, this is a pretty light punishment.
First, and foremost, the action that lead to the punishment could be viewed as breaking the law in many countries in which CCP operates. Also, because this action was broadcast by CCP, the company becomes liable for that content. Those of you that enjoy Eve need to recognize this threat of potential legal action against CCP.
Secondly, the player in question resigned of his own free will as near as I can tell, so you can't really blame CCP for that.
First- It only matters for where it was says I doubt any country claims its cyber bully laws have universal jurisdiction. Second, not resignation but booting from CSM entirely. |
Rebecca Aventine
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:23:00 -
[559] - Quote
I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3761
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:24:00 -
[560] - Quote
John Maynard Keynes wrote:But around 50k players have actively voted for other candidates and thus against mittani. They are quite happy about this decision...
And again..
U mad?
I didn't vote "against" Two Step or the other CSM candidates I generally agree with, hope that helps! "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
|
Omnathious Deninard
M'Tar Logistics Division Night Sky Alliance
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:24:00 -
[561] - Quote
Goons keep talking about the 10000 + players who voted to the mittani, but are completly disregarding the 32000+ votes that were not for him. Something to think about. |
J Kunjeh
384
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:25:00 -
[562] - Quote
Wow, Eve never gets stale does it? Been watching from the outside for a few months now (not much free time in RL to play) and thought I'd resub today to show my support for CCP's awesomeness displayed at FF2012. Couldn't have picked a more interesting time to resub.
Sad to see Mittani booted, even though I think he's an asshat for a million reasons (the most recent one being his douchebaggery at FF2012), but he was a terribly good rep for our Eve...
Interesting times ahead! "The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5)-á |
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:25:00 -
[563] - Quote
Goons are like little kids that go nuts when they see a lolipop. Then they demand more and more and then they cry the **** out when they are put in place with the rest.
You guys are the biggest whiney bunch of sissies I have ever seen.
All your "bad ass" look is now just a LMAO subject.
Go camp rats on belts buahaha |
Revii Lagoon
The Foreign Legion Test Alliance Please Ignore
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:25:00 -
[564] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:One person shooting at the monument in Jita.
Jeez, come on Goonies you can do better than that.
Shooting the monument is for pubbies, we are going to make Jita burn. They will need to put up a monument for the massive amount of wrecks that will blot out the gates and the undock of 4-4 |
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
690
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:26:00 -
[565] - Quote
Ni Cho wrote:So.
Yea.
Instead of going for a middle of the road approach, CCP decide to go hard to port.
Wrong. Hard to port would have been a perma-ban. Which he rightfully deserves tbfh. Just remember this is a game and your vote went to someone who lost sight of that. Perhaps you should be taking your beef to him?
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:26:00 -
[566] - Quote
goons and pets, unsub if you will, disband if you will, blow jita up if you will
The Mittani made a unacceptable mistake, he apologizes and takes the punishment accordingly. Why you all suddenly turned into QQ pubbies?
You guys are not making things looking better for him, you know how many potential Eve players are disgusted by this event? that's at least 10 folds of your meager 10058 votes.
I made 50+ votes for The Mittens alone and he wasted my votes, not CCP, if not for me he'd not get passed the 10k mark for this election. |
Atomic Option
Taggart Transdimensional Virtue of Selfishness
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:26:00 -
[567] - Quote
The funny side to this is that CCP itself just guaranteed that "Kill yourself" will be the most common insult in the galaxy for the next six weeks. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3764
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:27:00 -
[568] - Quote
DNSBLACK discussed entering Jove space, which is considered an exploit unless moved for the Alliance Tournament. I demand that this is investigated. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Flette
Rosen Association
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:27:00 -
[569] - Quote
Townsend Harris wrote:Flette wrote:This needed to happen. If anything, this is a pretty light punishment.
First, and foremost, the action that lead to the punishment could be viewed as breaking the law in many countries in which CCP operates. Also, because this action was broadcast by CCP, the company becomes liable for that content. Those of you that enjoy Eve need to recognize this threat of potential legal action against CCP.
Secondly, the player in question resigned of his own free will as near as I can tell, so you can't really blame CCP for that.
First- It only matters for where it was says I doubt any country claims its cyber bully laws have universal jurisdiction. Second, not resignation but booting from CSM entirely.
I'm no lawyer, but it may also matter where the victim is. |
Li Ter
Me Shoot Laser You Eye
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:27:00 -
[570] - Quote
Banderlei Shiiba wrote:Wait, so you admit that you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? And then lied to the press about it?
WELL PLAYED CCP WELL PLAYED
it was after the presentations that his comments were made.......well done
|
|
Urenna Naari
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:28:00 -
[571] - Quote
Hisec will burn. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:28:00 -
[572] - Quote
Andski wrote:DNSBLACK discussed entering Jove space, which is considered an exploit unless moved for the Alliance Tournament. I demand that this is investigated. close your eyes and it will happen
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
Radelix Cisko
The Adjustment Team
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:30:00 -
[573] - Quote
Bumrush wrote:
No there does not, if you vote for a president in RL and they do something wrong and leave or get kicked out they do not do a re-vote, the person under him steps up
In the US the Vice President takes the sitting presidents place should s/he resign and a new VP gets picked from the cabinet or somesuch. No revote since the logistics would be a nightmare here. |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:30:00 -
[574] - Quote
Andski wrote:John Maynard Keynes wrote:Andski wrote:10,058 paying customers totally ignored and disenfranchised. Good work, CCP. U mad? oh look another worthless npc alt So u still mad? |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1706
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:30:00 -
[575] - Quote
Townsend Harris wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Townsend Harris wrote:Darker Domain wrote:CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. 70 dollar monocles was dumber than this, but not by much. Tell me that isn't you Alex? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTsI'm getting a lot of mileage out of this youtube clip
As am I reporting you for personal abuse each time.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Li Ter
Me Shoot Laser You Eye
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:31:00 -
[576] - Quote
Revii Lagoon wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:One person shooting at the monument in Jita.
Jeez, come on Goonies you can do better than that. Shooting the monument is for pubbies, we are going to make Jita burn. They will need to put up a monument for the massive amount of wrecks that will blot out the gates and the undock of 4-4
butthurt much? talk to the mittani about your wasted votes....he wasted them, not us, not ccp
|
Liang Nuren
Parsec Flux
1277
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:31:00 -
[577] - Quote
Rebecca Aventine wrote:I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome.
What makes this bad is that CCP yanked the CSM's chain. They sent one message to the CSM and then quite another entirely as their official position. The fallout wouldn't be nearly so bad without that misstep.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:32:00 -
[578] - Quote
Taihbea wrote:Goons are like little kids that go nuts when they see a lolipop. Then they demand more and more and then they cry the **** out when they are put in place with the rest.
You guys are the biggest whiney bunch of sissies I have ever seen.
All your "bad ass" look is now just a LMAO subject.
Go camp rats on belts buahaha please see threads on nerfing mission loot drops, titian nerfs, super nerfs, suicide ganking nerfs, requests to punish people wo participate in hulkageddon etc.
|
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:32:00 -
[579] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Townsend Harris wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Townsend Harris wrote:Darker Domain wrote:CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. 70 dollar monocles was dumber than this, but not by much. Tell me that isn't you Alex? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTsI'm getting a lot of mileage out of this youtube clip As am I reporting you for personal abuse each time.
Worth it every time, you ignorant ****. |
FalconX Blast
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:32:00 -
[580] - Quote
Is this the first time an out-of-game slight has been bridged into being a violation of a software license agreement? That is an interesting precedent in itself, that CCP is going to police all of our thoughts and words from out-of-game now... time to update point 5 on the TOS, something like "Yes, we CCP are responsible for actions taken by our subscribers that occur outside the jurisdiction of our game servers or web site." would be more accurate with these recent actions CCP is taking. |
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:32:00 -
[581] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Townsend Harris wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Townsend Harris wrote:Darker Domain wrote:CCP this is the most unintelligent maneuver you've done yet, a monkey would have made this retaliatory action fairer than you. 70 dollar monocles was dumber than this, but not by much. Tell me that isn't you Alex? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTsI'm getting a lot of mileage out of this youtube clip As am I reporting you for personal abuse each time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs Jane? |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:33:00 -
[582] - Quote
Li Ter wrote:Revii Lagoon wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:One person shooting at the monument in Jita.
Jeez, come on Goonies you can do better than that. Shooting the monument is for pubbies, we are going to make Jita burn. They will need to put up a monument for the massive amount of wrecks that will blot out the gates and the undock of 4-4 butthurt much? talk to the mittani about your wasted votes....he wasted them, not us, not ccp
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/wasted
oh the irony CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
CCP:-á the mittani has set an example -áto follow ? |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:33:00 -
[583] - Quote
Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable. We could simply start a vote wether people want Mittani to get banned from CSM 7 or not. |
Valkyria Caeli
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:33:00 -
[584] - Quote
Bumrush wrote:Vatek wrote:Schettino wrote:All those crying about the 10k vote loss.
The player has been banned and is out of the game -> LOSS OF REPRESENTATION.
PERIOD
Blame the player himself and NOT CCP. Sorry, no. There needs to be a system in place so that people who voted for candidates who either resign or are removed are still represented. Mittani's actions do not speak for the 10,058 people that voted for him. No there does not, if you vote for a president in RL and they do something wrong and leave or get kicked out they do not do a re-vote, the person under him steps up
Precisely, this is why a vice president is chosen with a president in the US and this is also why alternates are chosen alongside the members of the CSM. It is called having a backup plan. Working as intended. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
822
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:34:00 -
[585] - Quote
The last thing you ever want to do in EVE-Online is give goons & friends a cause to rally behind. We saw this most recently in the Branch invasion, which took under twenty days to completion, and perhaps most famously in the legendary threadnaught.
Unfortunately, we have a cause to rally behind. |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:35:00 -
[586] - Quote
Andski wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable. no its only 3% of the voting base! get over your self goon... seriously! one year and then its all mittenz again... yay Nope. Representation or bust - that's the way we roll. Then bust it is.. for the goons... |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1711
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:35:00 -
[587] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:Rebecca Aventine wrote:I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome. What makes this bad is that CCP yanked the CSM's chain. They sent one message to the CSM and then quite another entirely as their official position. The fallout wouldn't be nearly so bad without that misstep. -Liang
The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest.
This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Valkyria Caeli
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:35:00 -
[588] - Quote
Atomic Option wrote:The funny side to this is that CCP itself just guaranteed that "Kill yourself, in game." will be the most common insult in the galaxy for the next six weeks.
fix'd |
Bill Banner
State War Academy Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:35:00 -
[589] - Quote
Heathkit wrote:~ 10,058 ~
The amount of votes your WIZARD made disappear. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:36:00 -
[590] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:Rebecca Aventine wrote:I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome. What makes this bad is that CCP yanked the CSM's chain. They sent one message to the CSM and then quite another entirely as their official position. The fallout wouldn't be nearly so bad without that misstep. -Liang The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
|
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
130
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:37:00 -
[591] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest.
This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent.
So you're saying that almost the entire group of player elected representatives still represent the players less that you do because...?
Is it internet space likes? |
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:37:00 -
[592] - Quote
Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week. |
James Henry Smith
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:37:00 -
[593] - Quote
I think CCP may and should consider the option of completely dissolving the CSM. It may be the fairest and most logical solution based on what happened last year with the Fearless scandal and that players want CCP to be as transparent with their future ideas and changes as possible.
Let's be honest, CSM6 and CSM7 are mostly people elected who represent groups of people who were formed out of the game through other websites and forums ("Something Awful", "Reddit", etc...), and they care more about their own clique than everyone else. If EVE Online ceases to exist, they will still have their clique and they will just find another game or activity to join.
Also, a group of a few players representing everyone who pays for EVE Online doesn't really fit with what EVE Online is supposed to be about: doing WHATEVER YOU want to do to become as powerful as possible (within the EULA/TOS). Other MMOs and multiplayer-based games that are more restricted in how you can play the game would work better with councils or advisors that act as intermediates between the players and the company, but ALL players should be able to tell CCP what they want with EVE Online and not have it filtered by people that may not share their views. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3764
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:37:00 -
[594] - Quote
John Maynard Keynes wrote:Then bust it is.. for the goons...
You do not want to know how things end when we go "bust" friend "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:38:00 -
[595] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest.
This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent.
So you're saying that almost the entire group of player elected representatives still represent the players less that you do because...? Is it internet space likes? I think the youtube clip says it better than :words: |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1711
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:38:00 -
[596] - Quote
Bacchanalian wrote:Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week.
Nobody really cares since you don't represent anyone but yourself.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Shepard Book
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:38:00 -
[597] - Quote
Not surprising. You let him step down and not be kicked from CSM. Then you BAN him for only a month... He got off easy. He is lucky to have an account.
" As per our policies, this candidate may be eligible to run at a later date subject to candidacy review. "
Seriously?
As for the rest of the CSM saying you have issues with him being kicked... Do you even realize what he got kicked for? You have no leg to stand on about him being gone because the X chairperson knocked it from under you himself.
Cya in space in a month... |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
133
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:38:00 -
[598] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:The last thing you ever want to do in EVE-Online is give goons & friends a cause to rally behind. We saw this most recently in the Branch invasion, which took under twenty days to completion, and perhaps most famously in the legendary threadnaught.
Unfortunately, we have a cause to rally behind.
Have you guys realize your actions will be fueling even more CCP revenue with publicity and embargos and power to the player etc bringing more subscriptions right ? |
Derrick Munroe
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[599] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:
The CSM reached a wrong decision.
So in essence you're saying the CSM is powerless? Good to know CCP of 8 months ago is back. |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[600] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest.
Then CCP should have told them this? |
|
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[601] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week. Nobody really cares since you don't represent anyone but yourself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
216
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[602] - Quote
who knew the goons in csm might be trouble and that their leader might be any better than them?
*gasps*
told ya so http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[603] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:Rebecca Aventine wrote:I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome. What makes this bad is that CCP yanked the CSM's chain. They sent one message to the CSM and then quite another entirely as their official position. The fallout wouldn't be nearly so bad without that misstep. -Liang The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent.
Jade, so democracy only works when you agree with the conclusions? The CSM was going to talk about what they decided, including removing Mittens, this was cut short by CCP. What kind of independent body is the CSM now? |
stupid monkey
Easy Co. Fatal Ascension
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[604] - Quote
oh man.. JITA GONNNA BURRRRRNNNNN |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1711
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:41:00 -
[605] - Quote
Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. Then CCP should have told them this?
Well by disregarding their collective advise haven't they just done this?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:41:00 -
[606] - Quote
Andski wrote:John Maynard Keynes wrote:Then bust it is.. for the goons... You do not want to know how things end when we go "bust" friend
Lol, u are not as important as u believe to be... |
Coda Grimoire
Occupy Love
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:41:00 -
[607] - Quote
I'd like to raise a historic point. At some points in history games have been seen as the way for people to become more civilized. For example, many students who want to play college sports must keep their grades up. Before online gaming, you could be a dickwad all you want, but NOT on field of play.
With online gaming, we get the chance to reverse that and we have.
Mittens showed on film the face of gamer bullying and his ridicule of a player victimized was the call of a bully.
Bullies are playing hot and heavy in EVE. I'm so astonished how instantly bullies turn into victims if they are called on their stuff.
Bullies are very comfortable ridiculing other players...makes them feel better. They think because it is online, the rules have changed and they can bully people in a game much easier than in real life. They think it is FUN.
Mittens was having a ball at fanfest, but he wasn't there as a griefing eve player. He was there as the head of CMS and an alliance leader. He needs a time out, at least. Frankly, this is serious enough to warrant he step down.
I would respect him if he did it of his own accord.
On the other hand, FanFest was amazing and I'm looking forward to 60 million new DUST514 best friends. \o/ |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:42:00 -
[608] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. Then CCP should have told them this? Well by disregarding their collective advise haven't they just done this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k80nW6AOhTs |
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:42:00 -
[609] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week. Nobody really cares since you don't represent anyone but yourself.
And yet I impersonated not just another player in game, which is against the EULA, but someone in a position of authority at CCP. |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:43:00 -
[610] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. Then CCP should have told them this? Well by disregarding their collective advise haven't they just done this?
I said told as in civilly, like they respected their opinion as elected representatives. Not by tossing out a decision they must have given some sort of approval to without warning. |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1711
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:43:00 -
[611] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:Rebecca Aventine wrote:I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome. What makes this bad is that CCP yanked the CSM's chain. They sent one message to the CSM and then quite another entirely as their official position. The fallout wouldn't be nearly so bad without that misstep. -Liang The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent. Jade, so democracy only works when you agree with the conclusions? The CSM was going to talk about what they decided, including removing Mittens, this was cut short by CCP. What kind of independent body is the CSM now?
sigh really. CSM was never independent of game rules and enforcement of eula/tos. And certainly never "independent" of the need to represent the game in a positive light.
Yes this current CSM has probably lost some credibility by attempting to keep Alexander Gianturco in position which was a stupid move.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1711
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:44:00 -
[612] - Quote
Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. Then CCP should have told them this? Well by disregarding their collective advise haven't they just done this? I said told as in civilly, like they respected their opinion as elected representatives. Not by tossing out a decision they must have given some sort of approval to without warning.
Well seeing as the CSM members posted seconds after this thread went live either they knew it was coming or they just got very lucky indeed. My money is they were told what the decision was in advance.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1715
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:45:00 -
[613] - Quote
Bacchanalian wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week. Nobody really cares since you don't represent anyone but yourself. And yet I impersonated not just another player in game, which is against the EULA, but someone in a position of authority at CCP.
Did you get drunk on stage and embarrass the company and player base of Eve Online in the eyes of the gaming media perchance?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Shniker
Paxton Industries Gentlemen's Agreement
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:45:00 -
[614] - Quote
Personally, I feel a 30 day ban in accordance with EVE TOS is fine, as you could argue the Alliance Panel in an extension of the forums (especially due to the live feed). Yes, Alex did something stupid but he is doing his best to make amends and appears to genuinely regret his actions; not because of the consequences but because he believe what he did was wrong (a lot of people are judging him on his in-game persona, but I have seen no factual evidence from which to question his sincerity).
His removal from CSM IGÇÖm unsure on, the decision to drastically alter fanfest has me extremely worried.
CCP, you have just gone over the edge of a very steep and very slippery slope. You need to ask yourself: GÇ£If this hadnGÇÖt gone to gaming media and become the story of the week, if we werenGÇÖt concerned with the reactions of companies such as Sony, what would our reaction have been?GÇ¥
If the answer is GÇÿdifferent to our current responseGÇÖ then I suggest you start seriously reconsidering, before you build up too much momentum to turn around. If you try to fundamentally change the mindset of EVE based off the gut reaction of a wider gaming (or worse: business) community who have little or no understanding of what EVE is, you might as well ban all forms of griefing and release GÇÿpay-to-winGÇÖ items, it will be just as fatal to the game.
You nearly lost EVE once within the last 12 months, please CCP, think before you put yourself in that situation again.
|
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:46:00 -
[615] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week. Nobody really cares since you don't represent anyone but yourself. And yet I impersonated not just another player in game, which is against the EULA, but someone in a position of authority at CCP. Did you get drunk on stage and embarrass the company and player base of Eve Online in the eyes of the gaming media perchance?
No, I got drunk and gave an interview to some podcast or another pretending to be Mittens, which ultimately could have ended the same way. |
Nair Alderau
EVE University Ivy League
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:46:00 -
[616] - Quote
I don't particular like the decision (his resignation + tempban would have been sufficient).
But its done now. ALL of you (Issler, Jade, Darius III: you didnt make a good impression), including goons, remember one thing: We all like this game, we all want it to succeed. So try to restrain yourself before you create a marketing disaster that leaves it ruined. (basically, no mass-rage-goon-unsub, ect.)
A jita-burns-event... ok, don't care too much. But think before applying scorched earth to CCP itself. Doesn't help anybody if the whole thing fails. |
Tyrrax Thorrk
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
61
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:47:00 -
[617] - Quote
Holy shi CCP what are you smoking ? How can someone break the EULA/TOS without logging into EVE ? also he didn't forfeit being on the CSM, he simply declined the chairmanship, maybe you should activate your brains before posting a devblog
leave the handling of this to the CSM, you're obviously incompetent |
Khanh'rhh
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
971
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:48:00 -
[618] - Quote
I am looking back at some fanfest footage and I can see other instances of the EULA being violated.
Do I assume these are being investigated, also?
Or is your ban just the pandering to gaming-trash journalism that it looks? - "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930's |
kdsjfjhiskhfs
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:48:00 -
[619] - Quote
Ignore 10058 people is just pure lol what a shame.
I would like remind you 10058 x 15 usd x 12 months =~ 1.800.000 usd are you forget what happen when you ignore eve players (u know its called incarna) |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1715
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:48:00 -
[620] - Quote
Bacchanalian wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Incidentally, I think CCP owe me a ban. If what you do out of game at fanfest is subject to the EULA, I violated it by impersonating Mittani throughout the week. Nobody really cares since you don't represent anyone but yourself. And yet I impersonated not just another player in game, which is against the EULA, but someone in a position of authority at CCP. Did you get drunk on stage and embarrass the company and player base of Eve Online in the eyes of the gaming media perchance? No, I got drunk and gave an interview to some podcast or another pretending to be Mittens, which ultimately could have ended the same way.
well *shrug* tbh. If you feel strongly about it maybe you should petition yourself.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
Hitokiri Battoesai
Black Aces Against ALL Authorities
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:48:00 -
[621] - Quote
Bad CCP!
I can not help but laugh at all the Goon/goon pet tears, though. |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:48:00 -
[622] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Liang Nuren wrote:Rebecca Aventine wrote:I didn't envy Alex or CCP when this broke.
I respect Alex a great deal for making his apology, but regretably this was always the most realistic outcome. What makes this bad is that CCP yanked the CSM's chain. They sent one message to the CSM and then quite another entirely as their official position. The fallout wouldn't be nearly so bad without that misstep. -Liang The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. This is the problem with sycophancy in a nutshell. Last year they got so used to being beta males to the Mittani's alpha that they lost their collective backbone and the problem now is that the CSM iself is out of touch with the player base it is supposed to represent. Jade, so democracy only works when you agree with the conclusions? The CSM was going to talk about what they decided, including removing Mittens, this was cut short by CCP. What kind of independent body is the CSM now? sigh really. CSM was never independent of game rules and enforcement of eula/tos. And certainly never "independent" of the need to represent the game in a positive light. Yes this current CSM has probably lost some credibility by attempting to keep Alexander Gianturco in position which was a stupid move.
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent. |
Widowscar
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:52:00 -
[623] - Quote
Maybe you guys should have split your votes and got 2 CSMs? |
STARTSWARS
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:54:00 -
[624] - Quote
What a complete farce this election system is. 10,058 pay to play subscribers democratically elected our Socialist Dear Leader to be a voice for the people,but c.c.p. (a.k.a. The 4th Reich) has deemed him to be impure and therefore unfit to spread their message of meaningful progress (lol) and superiority over other mmo's. Our goose stepping overlords have made it abundantly clear now that anybody who is in the public spotlight that plays this GAME better not get egg on their face, or they will be subject to harsh reprisals regardless if said offense is committed ingame(within our jurisdiction) or out of game(well beyond our realm of jurisdiction, but hey we are a dictatorship,we give no f**ks)
FREE THE MITTANI NOW |
Li Ter
Me Shoot Laser You Eye
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:55:00 -
[625] - Quote
FalconX Blast wrote:Is this the first time an out-of-game slight has been bridged into being a violation of a software license agreement? That is an interesting precedent in itself, that CCP is going to police all of our thoughts and words from out-of-game now... time to update point 5 on the TOS, something like " Yes, we CCP are responsible for actions taken by our subscribers that occur outside the jurisdiction of our game servers or web site." would be more accurate with these recent actions CCP is taking.
it was broadcast via EVE TV..... which CCP control, which means the ToS/EULA is applicable since its a CCP service
|
kdsjfjhiskhfs
University of Caille Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:56:00 -
[626] - Quote
Csm election System is like russian's election system. Just shot/poison opposition |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:56:00 -
[627] - Quote
Quote:
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
hate to be the bringer of bad news to you but 1 , a member of the CSM has just shown that he isnt adult enough to handle alcohol and 2, CSM was never a democracy
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Victor Twenty
Odyssey Space Exploration
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:56:00 -
[628] - Quote
Some serious spaceship business, but in reality is all about what sells subscriptions. |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:56:00 -
[629] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Well seeing as the CSM members posted seconds after this thread went live either they knew it was coming or they just got very lucky indeed. My money is they were told what the decision was in advance.
Seleene wrote:This was an unexpected development and we are now working toward resolving both the issue of Mitten's 10k voters and figuring out the process for CSM 7 Chair.
|
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:57:00 -
[630] - Quote
Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. Then CCP should have told them this?
Yeah just like stating on HOT coffee cups that they are HOT...
Dumbfucks. |
|
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:59:00 -
[631] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
hate to be the bringer of bad news to you but 1 , a member of the CSM has just shown that he isnt adult enough to handle alcohol and 2, CSM was never a democracy
Dude, do you know why the CSM was made? Please tell me you have more than a 2 year history. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:00:00 -
[632] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
hate to be the bringer of bad news to you but 1 , a member of the CSM has just shown that he isnt adult enough to handle alcohol and 2, CSM was never a democracy Dude, do you know why the CSM was made? Please tell me you have more than a 2 year history. and that is exactly relevant to my post how ?
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1716
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:00:00 -
[633] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:[You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community?
You cannot be "independent" of the need to have the interests of Eve Online and its player community at heart.
The real problem with Alexander Gianturco is he didn't really give a monkeys about the Eve online community - he only cared for SA and goonswarm.
But regardless CCP have acted fairly in punishing him quite leniently really. Many players would have liked to see him permabanned for what he did so a 30 day ban is a slap on the wrists. The real punishment has been delivered to goonswarm itself whose players have wasted their votes, but to be honest, goonswarm probably deserve this punishment as well given their appalling behaviour on the forums over this incident.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
bestposteringoonfleet
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:01:00 -
[634] - Quote
You can take away my CSM leader... but you cannot take away our ability to ruin your game.
|
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:01:00 -
[635] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
hate to be the bringer of bad news to you but 1 , a member of the CSM has just shown that he isnt adult enough to handle alcohol and 2, CSM was never a democracy Dude, do you know why the CSM was made? Please tell me you have more than a 2 year history. and that is exactly relevant to my post how ?
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy. |
Victyrael
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:01:00 -
[636] - Quote
This was a poor knee-jerk reaction to what happened. Sure, what was said was wrong but CCP you have, by your decision, disenfranchised and made clear that the interests of over 10 thousand people you supposedly value are to be ignored.
You have deprived everyone of the abilities and experience Alex can - and has - brought to the table. Sanctions are necessary here to prevent this happening again, but your course of action is incorrect. You cannot create an environment as you did at the Fanfest panel and not expect some issues. You cannot ignore your own failings in the event. You cannot disenfranchise your players that fund your business.
"CCP delivers" - the wrong results. |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:01:00 -
[637] - Quote
Li Ter wrote:it was broadcast via EVE TV..... which CCP control, which means the ToS/EULA is applicable since its a CCP service
There is NOTHING in the TOS about inciting others to do something being actionable. CCP unilaterally, without discussion decided to throw away 1/6th of all the voters and claim it does violate the TOS. We can all agree or disagree that it was unacceptable, it doesn't change the fact that it was NOT AGAINST THE TOS. CCP decided to destroy this election. We shall see how happy this will make them in the long term.
|
Mortuus Adamo
Wipe Corp.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:02:00 -
[638] - Quote
bestposteringoonfleet wrote:
CCP should permaban all goons. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
254
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:03:00 -
[639] - Quote
This is sad.....
I think the banning is appropriate to send a message to Alliance Panel Leaders that their actions can have consequences if they go to far.
At the same time, he was enormously helpful to CSM 6, and I think he'll be enormously helpful to CSM 7 too!!!!! Don't remove him from the CSM!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's too much!!!
|
Li Ter
Me Shoot Laser You Eye
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:03:00 -
[640] - Quote
kdsjfjhiskhfs wrote:Ignore 10058 people is just pure lol what a shame.
I would like remind you 10058 x 15 usd x 12 months =~ 1.800.000 usd are you forget what happen when you ignore eve players (u know its called incarna)
un sub then? lets see all 10058 of you unsub...... |
|
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:03:00 -
[641] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:[You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent. So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community? You cannot be "independent" of the need to have the interests of Eve Online and its player community at heart. The real problem with Alexander Gianturco is he didn't really give a monkeys about the Eve online community - he only cared for SA and goonswarm. But regardless CCP have acted fairly in punishing him quite leniently really. Many players would have liked to see him permabanned for what he did so a 30 day ban is a slap on the wrists. The real punishment has been delivered to goonswarm itself whose players have wasted their votes, but to be honest, goonswarm probably deserve this punishment as well given their appalling behaviour on the forums over this incident.
I don't necessarily disagree with his 30 day ban, and yes I fully agree that it is well withing CCPs right to do it. But there are rights and there is intellegence. This isn't the most intellegent process. CCP could have and should have told the CSM that due to Mittens actions they believe it is best if he isn't on the CSM this year. THE CSM should have made this announcement.
Are they a rubber stamp or are they an actual useful body? |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:04:00 -
[642] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
hate to be the bringer of bad news to you but 1 , a member of the CSM has just shown that he isnt adult enough to handle alcohol and 2, CSM was never a democracy Dude, do you know why the CSM was made? Please tell me you have more than a 2 year history. and that is exactly relevant to my post how ? You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1718
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:05:00 -
[643] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent.
hate to be the bringer of bad news to you but 1 , a member of the CSM has just shown that he isnt adult enough to handle alcohol and 2, CSM was never a democracy Dude, do you know why the CSM was made? Please tell me you have more than a 2 year history. and that is exactly relevant to my post how ? You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
Yeah it was made partially in response to the developer corruption scandal that involved T20 and Band of Brothers alliance and make sure the players had oversight to ensure that could never happen again.
The irony is we almost had a situation where Mittani was boasting of being in control of developers and influence within CCP and replaying this corrupt old scenario again. Had Mittani not been appropriately punished over his behaviour at Fanfest many many players and many external media sites would have considered he was being given unfair treatment that other players could not expect.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
131
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:06:00 -
[644] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community?
If I was one of the remaining CSM members I'd sure as **** be considering resigning right now. If CCP had any intention of taking their much lauded (in both the gaming and mainstream press) player council seriously they'd have either respected the consensus they reached or told them right from the start it was out of their hands. Instead the CSM are given the illusion of legitimacy then overruled mere hours later.
That doesn't sound like the new CCP we were promised oh so recently, that sounds like the bad CCP of old who suffer from bad internal communication and schizophrenic public relations.
And that doesn't bear well for the future of Eve.
|
Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
155
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:06:00 -
[645] - Quote
Andski wrote:The only appropriate solution is to either leave Mittani on the council or start a new election. Disenfranchising a vocal group of players with 10,058 - 20% of the voting base - accounts between them is never, ever acceptable.
^^
If CCP insists on disenfranchising over 10k paying customers then its probably time to teach CCP a lesson that will hurt them where it counts. Time to burn EVE to the ground.
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:06:00 -
[646] - Quote
bestposteringoonfleet wrote:
of course, you've already ruined the game for more than 2 years, this is just a late and minor payback |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:07:00 -
[647] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CCP is like Putin... so I shouldn't pay any attention to you then, ok. Have a nice day. Scroll up and see Jade's response. That is a semi well thought out response. |
Temmu Guerra
Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:07:00 -
[648] - Quote
To be honest mittens did this to himself to be quite honest. Had he not been such a huge **** in game so many people wouldnt want his head on a spit...
Guess the only thing to say is karma is a b!tch |
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:08:00 -
[649] - Quote
Unsubbing goons won't be ccps biggest problem in about one month haha. |
Chris LaPlant
Nex Exercitus Raiden.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:08:00 -
[650] - Quote
Ah Goon tears. They sustain me. |
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:09:00 -
[651] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CCP is like Putin... so I shouldn't pay any attention to you then, ok. Have a nice day. Scroll up and see Jade's response. That is a semi well thought out response.
another advice for you you will get badrepped from your buddies for praising jade ...
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1718
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:09:00 -
[652] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:[You've played this game longer than I have, you were around when the CSM was actually formed and why it was formed. The CSM should be independent. They are adults and yes it is CCP's game, but interfering with a democratically elected body that in part is there to ensure that CCP is being "fair" in game is a horrible precedent. So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community? You cannot be "independent" of the need to have the interests of Eve Online and its player community at heart. The real problem with Alexander Gianturco is he didn't really give a monkeys about the Eve online community - he only cared for SA and goonswarm. But regardless CCP have acted fairly in punishing him quite leniently really. Many players would have liked to see him permabanned for what he did so a 30 day ban is a slap on the wrists. The real punishment has been delivered to goonswarm itself whose players have wasted their votes, but to be honest, goonswarm probably deserve this punishment as well given their appalling behaviour on the forums over this incident. I don't necessarily disagree with his 30 day ban, and yes I fully agree that it is well withing CCPs right to do it. But there are rights and there is intellegence. This isn't the most intellegent process. CCP could have and should have told the CSM that due to Mittens actions they believe it is best if he isn't on the CSM this year. THE CSM should have made this announcement. Are they a rubber stamp or are they an actual useful body?
I said earlier I think the CSM was damaged immensely last year by being used as a virtual "rubber stamp" for Alexander Gianturco himself. The presentation style and behind closed doors zero record keeping shoddy minutes and generally secretive approach to CSM was a pretty regressive devolution of what was originally quite transparent and accountable.
Alexander in his alliance leadership style in Goonswarm promotes an alpha male -> beta male hierarchy thing and unfortunately this followed into his chairmanship of the CSM. Thats why the current (last) lot can't really think of operating without him.
So to your question. At the moment I'm honestly not sure if they are any use any more.
Thats the long and short of it.
I voted for a new face to bring something fresh to the process - > Hans, but he ended up with an alternate slot. Fingers crossed he can make a difference.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
xXv1c10usXx
Alchemy Corp
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:11:00 -
[653] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community?
If I was one of the remaining CSM members I'd sure as **** be considering resigning right now. If CCP had any intention of taking their much lauded (in both the gaming and mainstream press) player council seriously they'd have either respected the consensus they reached or told them right from the start it was out of their hands. Instead the CSM are given the illusion of legitimacy then overruled mere hours later. That doesn't sound like the new CCP we were promised oh so recently, that sounds like the bad CCP of old who suffer from bad internal communication and schizophrenic public relations. And that doesn't bear well for the future of Eve.
Swammy Say (looking in to the crystal ball now) Official Alliance soon to be formed called "Band of Developers". CSM8 will all be members of said alliance. Darius III will change his portrait to be one of skin that is dark brown (stained from all the SH!T is absorbs while up BOD's alliance ass). |
Zarrack Zenndah
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:11:00 -
[654] - Quote
Goon tears?? This thread is drowning in Goon tears? My, my. Why does the sound reaching my ears from the Goons sound so similar to that normally heard from Goon victims?
Do you feel it is unfair? Do you feel it is outside the rules? Did you just want to play your game your way and not have anyone else in Eve enjoy your grief?
Eve is a sandbox, you want a regimented rigid MMO go play WOW else deal with it and HTFU.
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:12:00 -
[655] - Quote
well i recall that we always used to see in the patchnotes that we have the final line that says "various improvements that makes eve a better world for us to be in"
since csm6 and the goons/goon pets rise to power, there's not been much of this line appearing.
maybe the unsubbing of the goon + pets will bring this lovely line back and I'm looking forward to a better world that New Eden has to come.
Please continue your rant about unsubbing, more pics or it didn't happen. |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:13:00 -
[656] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CCP is like Putin... so I shouldn't pay any attention to you then, ok. Have a nice day. Scroll up and see Jade's response. That is a semi well thought out response. another advice for you you will get badrepped from your buddies for praising jade ...
You know nothing about me. You see unlike you I try very hard to be independent and as unbiased as I possibly can. I don't give a damn if people dislike Jade, read what he actually wrote and understand you ignorant kunt. The CSM should be a democracy, it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM, but not only would it be bad PR it would just be downright bad business decision. And this is also a bad decision. The CSM either is an actual body that is independent or it is a useless rubber stamp and either next month or 6 years from now another Incarna will occur because CCP doesn't listen to advice from the one body of players elected to give them advice. |
Derrick Munroe
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
46
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:14:00 -
[657] - Quote
Chris LaPlant wrote:Ah Goon tears. They sustain me.
Ah... you know what sustains me? The smell of Tenal in the morning.
Knock knock. |
Flette
Rosen Association
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:14:00 -
[658] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community?
If I was one of the remaining CSM members I'd sure as **** be considering resigning right now. If CCP had any intention of taking their much lauded (in both the gaming and mainstream press) player council seriously they'd have either respected the consensus they reached or told them right from the start it was out of their hands. Instead the CSM are given the illusion of legitimacy then overruled mere hours later. That doesn't sound like the new CCP we were promised oh so recently, that sounds like the bad CCP of old who suffer from bad internal communication and schizophrenic public relations. And that doesn't bear well for the future of Eve.
What many of you fail to realize, is that to the rest of the world (including all legal entities) the CSM is an arm of CCP.
Without CCP, there is no CSM. When the CSM goes to iceland on CCP's dime, they are representing CCP.
So, when something like this happens, where the fallout can come from far outside the little halls of CCP or the even smaller virtual walls of the game, CCP has to act...especially when the CSM fails to do so. The CSM failing to oust the chairman on it's own is really a sad indicator of how useless and morally bankrupt the CSM is.
Again, the Mittani will be lucky if this is all that happens to him, and CCP will be lucky as well. |
Luciana BlitzKriger
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:16:00 -
[659] - Quote
CanGÇÖt we re-do the election again, move on from what has happen an start again without the incident that happen or is to late to do another Election process? |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:18:00 -
[660] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CCP is like Putin... so I shouldn't pay any attention to you then, ok. Have a nice day. Scroll up and see Jade's response. That is a semi well thought out response. another advice for you you will get badrepped from your buddies for praising jade ... You know nothing about me. You see unlike you I try very hard to be independent and as unbiased as I possibly can. I don't give a damn if people dislike Jade, read what he actually wrote and understand you ignorant kunt. The CSM should be a democracy, it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM, but not only would it be bad PR it would just be downright bad business decision. And this is also a bad decision. The CSM either is an actual body that is independent or it is a useless rubber stamp and either next month or 6 years from now another Incarna will occur because CCP doesn't listen to advice from the one body of players elected to give them advice.
the CSM never was and never will be the final ruling power in eve thats not how you run a company or an MMO i told you allready , in an democracy you cannot buy unlimit voting slots as long as you have the bucks for it and my dear unbaised friend dont curse at me , thx CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
|
Flette
Rosen Association
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:18:00 -
[661] - Quote
Luciana BlitzKriger wrote:CanGÇÖt we re-do the election again, move on from what has happen an start again without the incident that happen or is to late to do another Election process?
This is what alternates are for, and I believe there is an alternate in this case?
There are no do-overs in real life. |
Xenuria
Center Haus
477
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:19:00 -
[662] - Quote
The Mittani should have the right to give his votes to a person of his choice. That person should be me.
Hockles |
Madis Joringer
Ginger Marketing
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:19:00 -
[663] - Quote
What I find funny is all the rage coming from GSF over this. When they grief someone in-game, they find it funny enough to keep records of all the tears, as seen on the alliance panel that started all this. They take pleasure in seeing people complain about losing their internet spaceships and tell them they shouldn't be soo upset over pixels on a computer. But when something doesn't go their way, the whole of goonswarm comes out crying foul. As a CSM member, Mittens knew the rules, or at least he should have. One of those rules is abiding by the TOS/EULA and is clearly stated when a person enters the running for CSM. Whether GSF wants to believe it or not, he violated those rules and suffered the consequences of his actions, in this case a temp ban and removal from CSM7. Had this been any other member, I highly doubt GSF would be whining this much about it. Those 10k votes? Oh well. The vast majority voted for him because of his title and position in the GSF alone, regardless of his merits. You vote for a sociopath, you get a sociopath. Deal with it. If you want to blame someone for your vote not 'counting', blame Mittens. He is ultimately the reason for his own removal. He broke the rules, not CCP. And those people threatening to cancel their accounts over this? Good riddance! Eve will survive without you, and honestly would probably be better off. You shouldn't be soo upset over internet spaceship politics. Its a game folks. |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:21:00 -
[664] - Quote
Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CCP is like Putin... so I shouldn't pay any attention to you then, ok. Have a nice day. Scroll up and see Jade's response. That is a semi well thought out response. another advice for you you will get badrepped from your buddies for praising jade ... You know nothing about me. You see unlike you I try very hard to be independent and as unbiased as I possibly can. I don't give a damn if people dislike Jade, read what he actually wrote and understand you ignorant kunt. The CSM should be a democracy, it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM, but not only would it be bad PR it would just be downright bad business decision. And this is also a bad decision. The CSM either is an actual body that is independent or it is a useless rubber stamp and either next month or 6 years from now another Incarna will occur because CCP doesn't listen to advice from the one body of players elected to give them advice.
Read Jade better, CSM is not a democracy, it just got elected democratically but it's function and powers are limited. Monoclegate and Incarna didn't get resolved because of the CSM, it's the entire majority of Eve players. In fact, CSM let bad things gets into development and was only appearing working on resolutions for their own political gains.
The last CSM failed us like what Jade says, and this one will too, i regret voting for mittens and now I'm reliefed that God is graceful in granting me the redemption. |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:22:00 -
[665] - Quote
Xenuria wrote:The Mittani should have the right to give his votes to a person of his choice. That person should be me.
+1 |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
39
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:22:00 -
[666] - Quote
Madis Joringer wrote:What I find funny is all the rage coming from GSF over this. When they grief someone in-game, they find it funny enough to keep records of all the tears, as seen on the alliance panel that started all this. They take pleasure in seeing people complain about losing their internet spaceships and tell them they shouldn't be soo upset over pixels on a computer. But when something doesn't go their way, the whole of goonswarm comes out crying foul. Exactly. They can dish out the griefing, but they sure can't take it.
Start a corp and do it yourself. You'll fail, but you'll enjoy failing. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
Joe D'Trader
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:24:00 -
[667] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Joe D'Trader wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
You are saying this isn't a democracy. It is very much a democracy and you knowing or not know WHY it was made should help you to understand why it is a democracy.
in an democracy you cannot buy the right to vote with just 15 bucks a month
if you know why it was formed , you would more see it as an guide to CCP, they may follow it or not
CCP is like putin
CCP is like Putin... so I shouldn't pay any attention to you then, ok. Have a nice day. Scroll up and see Jade's response. That is a semi well thought out response. another advice for you you will get badrepped from your buddies for praising jade ... You know nothing about me. You see unlike you I try very hard to be independent and as unbiased as I possibly can. I don't give a damn if people dislike Jade, read what he actually wrote and understand you ignorant kunt. The CSM should be a democracy, it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM, but not only would it be bad PR it would just be downright bad business decision. And this is also a bad decision. The CSM either is an actual body that is independent or it is a useless rubber stamp and either next month or 6 years from now another Incarna will occur because CCP doesn't listen to advice from the one body of players elected to give them advice. the CSM never was and never will be the final ruling power in eve thats not how you run a company or an MMO i told you allready , in an democracy you cannot buy unlimit voting slots as long as you have the bucks for it and my dear unbaised friend dont curse at me , thx
You are ignorant, maybe not a kunt but very very ignorant. There is a difference between independence and final ruling power. The supreme court is independent, but isn't considered a ruling power. CCP interfering with the operation of the CSM when the CSM announced it would be meeting to discuss the situation interferes with it's independence. Also do you have a reading defecit?
I said
it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM |
Fahzja
Envirocore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:27:00 -
[668] - Quote
All of this brings back grade school memories.
A student fails a subject, he blames the teacher... |
NiM Cal
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:28:00 -
[669] - Quote
In today's politically correct, marketing driven world, where the press are desperate for some reason to portray vidya games in a bad light, CCP really had no other option. For what it's worth, society does need to HTFU and stop pandering to bads, but CCP can't change that, they have to play by the rule book which is getting thicker every day thanks to ...lawyers.
He of all people should've known how this would end. The "I was drunk" defence was about as legit as OJ getting off. Should've gone down in flames fighting the power that is political correctness and stayed true to his words, but alas lawyers are not creatures renown for having spine~
Nelson: Ha Ha! I guess sums it up. |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
133
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:29:00 -
[670] - Quote
I'm really happy to say Mittens has won my utmost respect after listening to state of the goonion, I do understand now why he is what he is inside the goons, where we can clearly extrapolate that in a land of blind the one with an eye is king into in a land of irrationals the one with the brain is king, Mittens is clearly a king.
He was objective enough to understand what he did and how serious given the context of what he did, repent, and realize he was in the wrong and pretty much all that was decided was actually deserved.
I do agree that the PR/Marketing blog was a bit too much on him, they could have phrased it a little bit less emphatically on blaming him for the next steps.
In the end, Mittens has won my utmost respect for his posture in state of the goonion regarding this issue. |
|
Viktor Villiance
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:29:00 -
[671] - Quote
Neat. So CCP caves to pressure from some people, and now The Wis will be the one who really pays the ultimate price as players in game take their rage out on him.
Congratulations, CCP, you have done more to hurt The Wis (if he was ever depressed/unstable) than a slight, snarky comment made by a pseudo-intellectual douchebag could ever.
What are you going to do now? Ban anyone who dares to kill The Wis in game? Or send him eve mails?
Anyway you slice this, you screwed him royally. I feel bad for him most of all now. |
lol fourm troll
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:32:00 -
[672] - Quote
so...... when will jita 4-4 undock burn, i want to enjoy the show and watch so many goons lose sec status for no reason, a cause, but no reason |
Koby Botick
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:33:00 -
[673] - Quote
The joke is that after having knowledge of a suizide-endangered player that is unable to cope with stress caused ingame, CCP is actually in the moral dilemma that they would need to terminate HIS account in order to prevent any escalation. They have brought themselves into a very very very bad spot.
If the dude in question can't take it anymore and actually goes through with it, then CCP will bleed for not having prevented it after being clearly aware of the situation.
Very very stupid CCP.
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:33:00 -
[674] - Quote
Quote:
You are ignorant, maybe not a kunt but very very ignorant. There is a difference between independence and final ruling power. The supreme court is independent, but isn't considered a ruling power. CCP interfering with the operation of the CSM when the CSM announced it would be meeting to discuss the situation interferes with it's independence. Also do you have a reading defecit?
I said
it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM
ccp is an pravate held company, not a state the CSm was fine with mittens stayin within CSM 7 , CCP was not so they overrule all as we both agree is within CCP-¦s power
also, as you may already noticed , English isnt my first language , i may have things misunderstood , for this i apology
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:34:00 -
[675] - Quote
Viktor Villiance wrote:Neat. So CCP caves to pressure from some people, and now The Wis will be the one who really pays the ultimate price as players in game take their rage out on him.
Congratulations, CCP, you have done more to hurt The Wis (if he was ever depressed/unstable) than a slight, snarky comment made by a pseudo-intellectual douchebag could ever.
What are you going to do now? Ban anyone who dares to kill The Wis in game? Or send him eve mails?
Anyway you slice this, you screwed him royally. I feel bad for him most of all now.
stop trying to make this the other guys fault, its his fault and he has admited it. |
Flette
Rosen Association
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:34:00 -
[676] - Quote
Viktor Villiance wrote:Neat. So CCP caves to pressure from some people, and now The Wis will be the one who really pays the ultimate price as players in game take their rage out on him.
Congratulations, CCP, you have done more to hurt The Wis (if he was ever depressed/unstable) than a slight, snarky comment made by a pseudo-intellectual douchebag could ever.
What are you going to do now? Ban anyone who dares to kill The Wis in game? Or send him eve mails?
Anyway you slice this, you screwed him royally. I feel bad for him most of all now.
So, assuming CCP has already changed the name of this character, then what? The character is some 11 billion isk richer, and can then go in peace with a new name.
Your thinly veiled rant is just that. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:35:00 -
[677] - Quote
Viktor Villiance wrote:Neat. So CCP caves to pressure from some people, and now The Wis will be the one who really pays the ultimate price as players in game take their rage out on him.
Congratulations, CCP, you have done more to hurt The Wis (if he was ever depressed/unstable) than a slight, snarky comment made by a pseudo-intellectual douchebag could ever.
What are you going to do now? Ban anyone who dares to kill The Wis in game? Or send him eve mails?
Anyway you slice this, you screwed him royally. I feel bad for him most of all now.
i think this guy will be the best prtected guy in eve ever at least i hope so
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Swearte Widfarend
Mortis Noir. Ineluctable.
59
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:35:00 -
[678] - Quote
Based on the reading of the TOS/EULA, The Mittani (as a character) has broken it. I guess a 30 day ban may be appropriate, although I'd like to know what CCP's track record on "threatening" characters is for ban duration, and if they are prepared for the oncoming ****storm of petitions for "threatening" behavior.
With the impending beginning of CSM 7, the choice of a 30 day ban became interesting, because The Mittani can't log in, and so it becomes an easy excuse to disenfranchise a significant portion of the players who voted in the CSM elections (for the record, I did not vote for The Mittani with any of my accounts). Alexander Gianturco did not resign independently, and CCP Games has turned the entire CSM voting process into a sham, unless they plan on wiping the slate clean and running a new election.
Alexander Gianturco did not resign from CSM 7. His post in these forums states clearly that he would be "just a member of the CSM, not the Chairman":
The Mittani wrote:With CSM7's term beginning on April 4th, I now exercise my right as the winner of the election with 10,058 votes to decline the office of Chairman. It will then be up to CSM7 as a group to decide how to proceed regarding the Chair. As a member of the CSM without a title, what I do as the leader of Goonswarm will no longer unfairly reflect on the CSM as a whole - leaving me and my people free to do as we please without needing to consider corporate, political, or media ramifications every time we make a **** joke, offend someone, or sell a supercap made of vapor.
If CCP does not allow Alexander Gianturco (aka The Mittani) to maintain a seat on CSM 7, then they might as well throw the entire concept of a democratically elected player representative group out the window - because that is what they have done by removing him from CSM 7. CCP is changing ship skill trees. How ship skills should be |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3778
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:35:00 -
[679] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You are ignorant, maybe not a kunt but very very ignorant. There is a difference between independence and final ruling power. The supreme court is independent, but isn't considered a ruling power. CCP interfering with the operation of the CSM when the CSM announced it would be meeting to discuss the situation interferes with it's independence. Also do you have a reading defecit?
I said
it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM
ccp is an pravate held company, not a state the CSm was fine with mittens stayin within CSM 7 , CCP was not so they overrule all as we both agree is within CCP-¦s power also, as you may already noticed , English isnt my first language , i may have things misunderstood , for this i apology
So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.
"WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Raiykjab
Federal Navy Academy
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:35:00 -
[680] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
This just show the integrity of the ppl representing us at CSM, 10058 yeah sure, we all know those guys probably voted with their 5 accounts.
Bill Clinton was also elected by a majority, but kinda resigned after the sex scandal, same for DSK the boss of the FMI, this dude was favorite for the next French presidentials and now is a nobody. If you represent something and are given powers you gotta show the exemple, or you are out, that's how it works in a democracy.
Seeing so many CSM members objecting about the decision is quiet disturbing, and just prove that I should get myself more accounts the next time I go vote to make it count.
Honestly yours
Raiykjab Eve has miners?! |
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3778
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:38:00 -
[681] - Quote
Raiykjab wrote:Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page This just show the integrity of the ppl representing us at CSM, 10058 yeah sure, we all know those guys probably voted with their 5 accounts. Bill Clinton was also elected by a majority, but kinda resigned after the sex scandal, same for DSK the boss of the FMI, this dude was favorite for the next French presidentials and now is a nobody. If you represent something and are given powers you gotta show the exemple, or you are out, that's how it works in a democracy. Seeing so many CSM members objecting about the decision is quiet disturbing, and just prove that I should get myself more accounts the next time I go vote to make it count. Honestly yours Raiykjab
1) 5 accounts are 5 accounts - they are paid for. 2) Bill Clinton served two full terms, he did not resign. 3) CSM members object to their opinions being discarded and CCP throwing their chairman under the bus. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Qusal II
Viperfleet Inc. Narwhals Ate My Duck
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:38:00 -
[682] - Quote
With all things that happend this is a good decision of CCP, the most correct way to handle this, this shows noone has special treatment even if your chariman of csm!
And people should not feel sad about their votes it is something which you used, and should use every year! This reminds me of a time when President K got shot, the 2nd in command should just take over like back then. In this case Two Step which came in 2nd in votes, he was one of the more active members of the CSM6 council and i trust him completely for representing ALL eve-players.
And next year people can use their votes again to get The Mittani reelected. Maybe even with 15000 votes! |
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:39:00 -
[683] - Quote
Kalunmaar wrote:If our votes are going to count for nothing, why hold an election in the first place? Exactly !!! With 10,000 votes out of how many account holders? It seems that most subscribers care absolutely nothing at all about the CSM. Just get rid of it already...
Madis Joringer wrote:...You vote for a sociopath, you get a sociopath. Deal with it. If you want to blame someone for your vote not 'counting', blame Mittens. He is ultimately the reason for his own removal. He broke the rules, not CCP. And those people threatening to cancel their accounts over this? Good riddance! Eve will survive without you, and honestly would probably be better off. You shouldn't be soo upset over internet spaceship politics. Its a game folks. Right on !!! |
Axhind
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:40:00 -
[684] - Quote
Temulkar Blaine wrote:Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:Axhind wrote:Temulkar Blaine wrote:I applaud CCP for this decision, I will explain why before I am accused of being a political tool. In the EU we have clear laws about behaviour on the internet and in public that differ dramatically from the US. in America your right to freedom of speech is guarenteed by the first ammendment. In Europe freedom of speech is limited by the law in ways your country does not it seems understand. Before you start to call us all fascists as has been said on some threads, think about the history of the last century in Europe and ask yourself why we have limited freedom of speech to protect against hate. In recent months in the UK in paticular the profile of cyber offences, cyber bullying, trolling has been very much in the public eye. Cases of teenage suicides after a message on a social networking site like this example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hereford-worcester-14239702 made national headlines. EU law protects people from offensive behaviour on the internet and does not allow the anononymity of the web protect offendors when the use the internet as a medium to bully or spread hate. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-16144640 people have been given sentences lasting into years for offences carried out in the internet. Perhaps the timing of this incident was most ill fated for Alexander, In the last month we have had a high profile case of a celebrity being targetted by a cyber bully and anti social behavior on the internet has been on the news and on prime time TV and questions have been asked in paliament. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17399027 . Even worse timing wise is the very high profile case of a student jailed for a drunken abusive rant on twitter about a seriously ill footballer that aroused comdemnation from all quarters. The student was jailed in the last week. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17434587I sympathise with americans who assume protection from the first ammendment gives you the right to say what you want be as offensive as you want on the internet press whatever. This is not the case in the rest of the world and certainly not in Europe and Alexander maybe forgot that in Iceland. Perhaps those members of the CSM who have objected to this decision need to consider this issue and see the wider impolications of this act and also the different international interpretatinos of both what is legal and what is decent and acceptable. Again I would actually like to stress this is not a political post not a wum, This is actually somthing very good that CCP has done in sending out a clear message that certain behaviour will not be tolerated. It sucks for Alexander yes Im sure but he will bounce back from it if he wants to. As another European I can freely call you fascist dog. Europe has benefits but fascist **** laws for censorship of speech are not it. At the same time as you have to ***** foot around serious issues we all get butt raped by our dear politicians but hey they are at least preventing us to say thing they don't like. This is one thing where europe should take after US instead of introducing just more and more idiotic censorship laws. clearly I disagree with you, so does the law fortunatly, did you think the muamba sentence was unfair then? OFC it was. Who cares what some dude writes? Far better to allow saying few things that might make someone upset than to start banning anything that might make someone upset. For anything you say there will be someone who will give you **** for it. UK especially is ******** to hell and back with it's laws about speech. Even more than germany and france who are both already bad enough with the laws controlling what people can say about ww2. It never ends. Just more and more things get censored until you will not be allowed to open your mouth for the fright of breaking some idiotic law. Or maybe we start treating each other with more consideration and respect, maybe we start to look past issues of gender, race sexuality, etc and actually learn to empathise.Freedom or speech is not without consequenses nor is it an absolute right in the EU. When I look at our past its pretty obvious why these principles are enshrined in European law or can you not see that?
Oh yes. Our past really benefited from that. Like today. Benefits of free speech are much higher than drawbacks of someone getting their panties in a twist over some internet talk. Censorship and repressive regimes in Europe have all been very much in favour of censorship and against speech. You are just latest one to fall for the bullshit arguments. Think of the children, evil terrorists and so on... |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:40:00 -
[685] - Quote
Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Quote:
You are ignorant, maybe not a kunt but very very ignorant. There is a difference between independence and final ruling power. The supreme court is independent, but isn't considered a ruling power. CCP interfering with the operation of the CSM when the CSM announced it would be meeting to discuss the situation interferes with it's independence. Also do you have a reading defecit?
I said
it is CCP's game, and they are well within their rights to disband the CSM
ccp is an pravate held company, not a state the CSm was fine with mittens stayin within CSM 7 , CCP was not so they overrule all as we both agree is within CCP-¦s power also, as you may already noticed , English isnt my first language , i may have things misunderstood , for this i apology So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.
no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on bussiness as usual
there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA? CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
kdsjfjhiskhfs
University of Caille Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:42:00 -
[686] - Quote
Great job ccp i think you just killed the wis, not mittenz you killed him. |
Myz Toyou
Bite Me inc Exhale.
39
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:42:00 -
[687] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:The last thing you ever want to do in EVE-Online is give goons & friends a cause to rally behind. We saw this most recently in the Branch invasion, which took under twenty days to completion, and perhaps most famously in the legendary threadnaught.
Unfortunately, we have a cause to rally behind.
You sound like old BOB, sad
|
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
133
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:43:00 -
[688] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Andski wrote: So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.
no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on bussiness as usual there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA?
No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds bullshit. |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:44:00 -
[689] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Andski wrote: So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.
no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on bussiness as usual there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA? No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds crap.
Hell, even acknowledging that "The CSM was consulted, but we felt that their response did not go far enough" would be a bit nicer |
Viktor Villiance
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:46:00 -
[690] - Quote
Flette wrote:
So, assuming CCP has already changed the name of this character, then what? The character is some 11 billion isk richer, and can then go in peace with a new name.
Your thinly veiled rant is just that.
Nope. They haven't. And any special treatment CCP gives to him sets a dangerous precedent for developer->customer/player interactions. If they think the gaming media is shitstorming them over this, just wait till the media gets a hold of another T20-esque incident (special treatment of players by staff).
I won't even get into the legal ramifications they just exposed themselves to by policing player interactions out of game. Yeee-ouch.
But sure, strawman my point. It's cool. |
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:47:00 -
[691] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Andski wrote: So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.
no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on bussiness as usual there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA? No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds crap.
it was always clear to someone with half a brain that no CEO in the whole world wil let his desicions be overuled by a bunch of internet spaceship nerds
internet spaceship may be serious business but RL business is more serious CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Veilo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:48:00 -
[692] - Quote
Dear CCP
I respect your decision to interpret the EULA/TOS as applicable to out of game events.
However if you stand by this decision then I would like to have my vote back thanks.
I am so mad right now, my brother died as a child soldier in africa so the issue of democracy and justice is very close to my heart, if you don't respect this then I will not-figuratively kill myself.
|
Vladimir Vladimirovitch Putain
Remanaquie Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:49:00 -
[693] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
If I were you I'd resign in protest.
Getting a bit annoying to see the people bringing up the 10k votes all the time. Yes he got them but if you'd repeat the vote after this I'd love to know how many he'd keep.
However, kudos to Gianturco for maning up and making it clear his drunkenness wasn't a valid excuse, I actually liked that. And on that note the Goonie tears will make an awesome presentation for next year's FF. Keep'em cumin you drunken bees. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
255
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:50:00 -
[694] - Quote
Doc Severide wrote:Kalunmaar wrote:If our votes are going to count for nothing, why hold an election in the first place? Exactly !!! With 10,000 votes out of how many account holders? It seems that most subscribers care absolutely nothing at all about the CSM. Just get rid of it already...
Don't be a moron...
The CSM has been enormously beneficial to the player base as a whole. It has also been a tremendous PR boost for CCP.
There were 60k votes cast in this election, which represents more accounts than have EVER been online simultaneously. While this is less than 20% of the total accounts, its hardly an inconsequential number. The CSM is here to stay, and if they remove it, they will see a **** storm the likes of which will bury CCP...
Finally... Reinstate Mittani to CSM7.... his removal is out of line!!!! |
Flette
Rosen Association
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:50:00 -
[695] - Quote
Viktor Villiance wrote:Flette wrote:
So, assuming CCP has already changed the name of this character, then what? The character is some 11 billion isk richer, and can then go in peace with a new name.
Your thinly veiled rant is just that.
Nope. They haven't. And any special treatment CCP gives to him sets a dangerous precedent for developer->customer/player interactions. If they think the gaming media is shitstorming them over this, just wait till the media gets a hold of another T20-esque incident (special treatment of players by staff). I won't even get into the legal ramifications they just exposed themselves to by policing player interactions out of game. Yeee-ouch. But sure, strawman my point. It's cool.
Well, you didn't have a point really, All I saw was "wah, CCP is mean" Put bluntly, they can change his name anytime they want without any shitstorm or even murmur as a result of a cyber-bullying action, or just plain bullyiing action.
And, oh, the 11 billion isk? That wasn't given to him by CCP...
lol
BTW, the only "The WIz" i see, looks like he hasn't logged in in a while. I could be wrong though. I don't think it's too far out to assume they have changed the character's name, and slipped in another character with the previous name to catch those who might continue this bullying trend. That is speculation however.. |
Ustrello
Mindstar Technology Executive Outcomes
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:51:00 -
[696] - Quote
Navigator you know what you should do...? go to a bridge with a very long drop this is important ok? Then I want you to go skill yourself up and get a t2 thrasher |
Kitty Vintner
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:53:00 -
[697] - Quote
Vladimir Vladimirovitch Putain wrote: Getting a bit annoying to see the people bringing up the 10k votes all the time. Yes he got them but if you'd repeat the vote after this I'd love to know how many he'd keep.
About 10,000. |
REDBIERD
Space Gear Productions
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:54:00 -
[698] - Quote
Quote:no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on bussiness as usual
there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA?
No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds crap.
Hell, even acknowledging that "The CSM was consulted, but we felt that their response did not go far enough" would be a bit nicer
~ Yeah but its CCP's job to decide when a player commits a breach of TOS; it isn't left up to the CSM to decide who stays or who goes. How can he be an effective Chairman or CSM member if he's out of the game for the first 30-days of term ?
|
Flette
Rosen Association
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:54:00 -
[699] - Quote
Veilo wrote:Dear CCP
I respect your decision to interpret the EULA/TOS as applicable to out of game events.
However if you stand by this decision then I would like to have my vote back thanks.
I am so mad right now, my brother died as a child soldier in africa so the issue of democracy and justice is very close to my heart, if you don't respect this then I will not-figuratively kill myself.
Your vote counted. You voted in someone who resigned. Take it up with the representative.
This happens all the time IRL, and they don't do the election over. |
Bibosikus
Inside out. The G0dfathers
89
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:55:00 -
[700] - Quote
So CCP step up, in a timely fashion, and deliver a sharp shock. They've taken definitive action, performed damage limitation, assuaged the indignant, and outraged the bees (meh).
Mittens will be back in 30 days, and next year running for CSM8 no doubt.
Jita will burn, and frankly I'll come watch.
All in all, a very very good day.
Well done, CCP.
The box said "Requires Windows-á2000 or better", so I installed Linux. |
|
Swearte Widfarend
Mortis Noir. Ineluctable.
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:55:00 -
[701] - Quote
Raiykjab wrote:Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page This just show the integrity of the ppl representing us at CSM, 10058 yeah sure, we all know those guys probably voted with their 5 accounts. Bill Clinton was also elected by a majority, but kinda resigned after the sex scandal, same for DSK the boss of the FMI, this dude was favorite for the next French presidentials and now is a nobody. If you represent something and are given powers you gotta show the exemple, or you are out, that's how it works in a democracy. Seeing so many CSM members objecting about the decision is quiet disturbing, and just prove that I should get myself more accounts the next time I go vote to make it count. Honestly yours Raiykjab
You can't add, can you?
Even if ever single character in Goonswarm were an individual account, that is barely 7,000. And if you think every character in Goonswarm is an individual account, I've got a great bridge to sell you in Tuscon, Arizona, with a nice ocean view. CCP is changing ship skill trees. How ship skills should be |
Damion Rayne
Dark-Rising
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:56:00 -
[702] - Quote
Gotta love the goons, you people are so full of immaturity. cheating, lying, and down right hatred..and not in game mind you, that not a single one of you deserve to sit there and ***** and moan about CCP's decision.
Grow the hell up you children. Mittens deserves this, you don't like it? Leave Eve. Teamwork.. Maturity.. Tactics.. www.tacticalgamer.com |
Raiykjab
Federal Navy Academy
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:56:00 -
[703] - Quote
Andski wrote:1) 5 accounts are 5 accounts - they are paid for.
You make a point
... oh wait
Andski wrote:2) Bill Clinton served two full terms, he did not resign.
Ok lucky me I mentionned the DSK case, not the first nor the last.
Andski wrote:3) CSM members object to their opinions being discarded and CCP throwing their chairman under the bus.
You forgot to add "Some" before CSM, would have really sucked if they all objected CCP's decision Eve has miners?! |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:58:00 -
[704] - Quote
seriously you guys who keep separating in-game and out-of-game and try to defend for unacceptable behaviour just need to stop.
Yes it's a game, but doesn't mean cyber-bullying + real life references and impacts are allowed.
CCP said themselves "The line is crossed"
In a decently minded mature adult's view "The line is crossed"
stop separating one issue into multiple, you all know why there are more people diagnoized with dual / multiple personality nowadays? I bet most of you don't if you have to find courage and confidence in a video game where it is lacking in RL. |
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:58:00 -
[705] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Doc Severide wrote:Kalunmaar wrote:If our votes are going to count for nothing, why hold an election in the first place? Exactly !!! With 10,000 votes out of how many account holders? It seems that most subscribers care absolutely nothing at all about the CSM. Just get rid of it already... Don't be a moron... The CSM has been enormously beneficial to the player base as a whole. It has also been a tremendous PR boost for CCP. There were 60k votes cast in this election, which represents more accounts than have EVER been online simultaneously. While this is less than 20% of the total accounts, its hardly an inconsequential number. The CSM is here to stay, and if they remove it, they will see a **** storm the likes of which will bury CCP... Like more fools out shooting the Jita monument? I don't believe for a minute that the CSM is beneficial to anything except getting a free trip to Iceland to get drunk once a year...
And as a paying subscriber I am perfectly in my right to have my opinions regardless of the disagreeing mobs who cannot respond without name calling and idiotic threats of "Destroying EVE".
Bunch of children....
|
IsTheOpOver
88
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:59:00 -
[706] - Quote
Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal
A world without goons?
Good job CCP.. although it was the only decision you could make. Well I guess you could have given him a perma-ban.
Andski how does it feel to not be able to unsub quicker than that?
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:59:00 -
[707] - Quote
Swearte Widfarend wrote:Raiykjab wrote:Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page This just show the integrity of the ppl representing us at CSM, 10058 yeah sure, we all know those guys probably voted with their 5 accounts. Bill Clinton was also elected by a majority, but kinda resigned after the sex scandal, same for DSK the boss of the FMI, this dude was favorite for the next French presidentials and now is a nobody. If you represent something and are given powers you gotta show the exemple, or you are out, that's how it works in a democracy. Seeing so many CSM members objecting about the decision is quiet disturbing, and just prove that I should get myself more accounts the next time I go vote to make it count. Honestly yours Raiykjab You can't add, can you? Even if ever single character in Goonswarm were an individual account, that is barely 7,000. And if you think every character in Goonswarm is an individual account, I've got a great bridge to sell you in Tuscon, Arizona, with a nice ocean view.
than again how many goons have multiple accounts and test and whoever kisses up to you these days
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Wacktopia
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
223
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:00:00 -
[708] - Quote
The Mittani was good for EVE. He knew what the game was and how it was different and what made it so good.I hope, after his 30 days are up, that he can reconcile with CCP and get back into that chair.
The real shame of all this is that the back lash is i na form of players crying for less war and greif. It could not have come at a worse time with Inferno around the corner. Last thing we want now is some kind of knee-jerk decision that puts the fire out before it even gets going, so to speak.
War is upon the citizens of New Eden, whether they like it or not. This is the way of EVE. . |
paradigmblue
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:05:00 -
[709] - Quote
Alex's words at the alliance panel were regrettable, and it is understandable for CCP to be especially sensitive to possible PR problems with Dust 514 close to release. I, like many others, was troubled by his comments. This firestorm needed to be dealt with, in one way or another.
To his credit, Alex, on his own volition, made a sincere public and private apology, both to EVE players as a whole and to the victim. Additionally, he made restitution to the victim and stepped down from the Chairman position, forfeiting his coveted position as the face of the CSM. Having met Alex several times out of the game, these apologies rang true to me, and his sincerity and candor are admirable.
With these actions, the firestorm was abated, and with a little time, the controversy would have died out, as it should have. We all have made mistakes before, but most realize that it is how we handle those mistakes that is important, and Alex owned up completely to his lapse in judgement. You'll notice that he made no excuses for his inebriation (from alcohol provided by CCP), and did not ask CCP to share the blame (even though the content of his presentation- including the unfortunate slide which prompted this controversy - was vetted by CCP).
This story could have ended with Alex's sincere apology, and would have faded with the next news cycle from the gaming press. Instead, CCP has taken the last, dying embers from this firestorm, and tossed gasoline on them. If they wanted this story to not gain any more traction in the gaming press, banning The Mittani in game for Alex's verbal misteps was exactly the wrong course of action to take. Moreover, while I am sure they acted with the best of intentions, by lumping more punishments on to those that Alex undertook voluntarily, the outcome seems not only excessive, but vindictive.
I am disappointed and saddened by CCP's response to the issue, and I hope that they will take a step back and reconsider the implications and intent of their actions. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:05:00 -
[710] - Quote
Quote: words from paradigmblue
i feel bad for ccp .. all they wantet is DUST EVE interaction all over the press after FF
all they got was a drunken guy that couldnot handle himself ....
edit wrong quoting CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
|
Max Wager
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:05:00 -
[711] - Quote
Democracy at its finest I see. Fortunately, I have plenty of experience with my votes being worthless. |
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
71
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:09:00 -
[712] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: So given the CSM was formed partially as an oversight body to look at CCPs internal proceedures and ensure t20 didn't happen again and was supposed to include players of good character and trustworthy community-centric outlook - how do you propose that kind of body could get any real respect if it was not itself held to the standards expected of the rest of the community?
If I was one of the remaining CSM members I'd sure as **** be considering resigning right now. If CCP had any intention of taking their much lauded (in both the gaming and mainstream press) player council seriously they'd have either respected the consensus they reached or told them right from the start it was out of their hands. Instead the CSM are given the illusion of legitimacy then overruled mere hours later. That doesn't sound like the new CCP we were promised oh so recently, that sounds like the bad CCP of old who suffer from bad internal communication and schizophrenic public relations. And that doesn't bear well for the future of Eve.
This is why you are not one of them. Shortsighted, not really clever and far from smart! They are not there to fall behind some frat tool. They are there to make this game better! |
Megalift
The Executives Executive Outcomes
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:13:00 -
[713] - Quote
We all can see who has the power here. 10,000 player votes vs CSM vs CCP. Today is the beginning of the end for Eve. |
ceaon
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:15:00 -
[714] - Quote
i really want to know from a legal point of view how CCP extend EvE EULA to real life
what kind of legal magic you need in order to do this ?
tia looking for a coder to do this https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=711072 |
Flette
Rosen Association
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:17:00 -
[715] - Quote
Megalift wrote:We all can see who has the power here. 10,000 player votes vs CSM vs CCP. Today is the beginning of the end for Eve.
Because of the Mittani.
In all seroiusness, CCP has all the power. Always has. Always will. What else did you think?
Oh, and for the record, this is how it should be. CCP is a business. Their motivation to make profit is known. What is the Mittani's motivation? With this single presentation he has brought an awful lot of damage to the game we all play. CCP did not do this. |
Taihbea
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
71
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:17:00 -
[716] - Quote
Megalift wrote:We all can see who has the power here. 10,000 player votes vs CSM vs CCP. Today is the beginning of the end for Eve. And you just woke up naked and touching yourself...
Dude. Goons can quit and war for their region will fuel up eve to some nasty temps. Nobody gives a **** about a bunch of whiney noobs If they leave it's going to be awesome. Big null space to fill! |
Wacktopia
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
224
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:18:00 -
[717] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:
i feel bad for ccp .. all they wantet is DUST EVE interaction all over the press after FF
all they got was a drunken guy that couldnot handle himself ....
edit wrong quoting
That's CCP's own dumb fault for letting players get really drunk and be on stage. It's like they were thinking "LOL if the players are drunk on stage it will be wacky and funny".... and each year people seem to try and out-do each other by being more drunk.
Something like this was bound to happen. To be honest every year I watch fanfest waiting for the moment bitter rivals punch it out on stage or spit something like this because they're too drunk to know better.
I don't like someone being cyber-bullied one bit but at the same time I'd hate to watch EVE ruin itself by sticking play pens up all over the place as a result of this. . |
Viktor Villiance
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:21:00 -
[718] - Quote
Flette wrote:
Well, you didn't have a point really, All I saw was "wah, CCP is mean" Put bluntly, they can change his name anytime they want without any shitstorm or even murmur as a result of a cyber-bullying action, or just plain bullyiing action.
And, oh, the 11 billion isk? That wasn't given to him by CCP...
lol
BTW, the only "The WIz" i see, looks like he hasn't logged in in a while. I could be wrong though. I don't think it's too far out to assume they have changed the character's name, and slipped in another character with the previous name to catch those who might continue this bullying trend. That is speculation however..
Oh, my bad. You're a publord and need education, badly. His name isn't "the wiz", but that's okay.
They haven't changed his name and he was recently blown up in game actually.
Your speculation is like your knowledge, I see. But hey, be more buttmad at goons/mittani, whatever. Doesn't mean that its fair for CCP to literally beg a bunch of self-righteous, "wronged" nerds to grief him into oblivion by taking down a figurehead. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3808
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:23:00 -
[719] - Quote
Raiykjab wrote:You forgot to add "Some" before CSM, would have really sucked if they all objected CCP's decision
Oh alright I forgot that Darius III and Issler are all for this, I forget how important they are for the CSM "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Meno Theaetetus
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:23:00 -
[720] - Quote
The real issue here has little to do with cyber bullying, anyone that genuinely believes that Mittens wanted someone to kill themselves is either socially backwards or are lying to promote their own agenda.
What happened during that alliance panel was Mittens gave the wider press, namely SONY's media people a glimpse into the game SONY are buying into that CCP had rather them not see.
A HUGE part of the eve online that cements it 's niche position and success over the years is the meta game, the back stabbing, the theft, the scamming. If your average jita scammer gave the money back every time some dude said his wife had left them, or that they were feeling suicidal, you would not be able to continue that style of play.
You may say, good! We don't want scammers and thieves, and that's your prerogative. However what can't be denied is that for years eve online has been played by and continues to be played by thousands of people that play the game mainly to do this.
The simple fact remains, in a game like WOW, or any other game, bread and butter scamming like that which goes on everyday in eve would be considered in poor taste, perhaps not cyber bullying, but more than likely something SONY would want to distance themselves from.
It's just unfortunate that Mittens brought this to the attention of people like the SONY media reps, what we have to worry about is just how far CCP is willing to bend, next time SONY come leaning. |
|
stupid monkey
Easy Co. Fatal Ascension
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:23:00 -
[721] - Quote
lolz - let the jita burn begin |
Tahna Rouspel
BWE Special Forces Ascendance.
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:24:00 -
[722] - Quote
Mittani should get the chance to transfer his votes. |
REDBIERD
Space Gear Productions
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:25:00 -
[723] - Quote
Quote:Alex's words at the alliance panel were regrettable, and it is understandable for CCP to be especially sensitive to possible PR problems with Dust 514 close to release. I, like many others, was troubled by his comments. This firestorm needed to be dealt with, in one way or another.
To his credit, Alex, on his own volition, made a sincere public and private apology, both to EVE players as a whole and to the victim. Additionally, he made restitution to the victim and stepped down from the Chairman position, forfeiting his coveted position as the face of the CSM. Having met Alex several times out of the game, these apologies rang true to me, and his sincerity and candor are admirable.
With these actions, the firestorm was abated, and with a little time, the controversy would have died out, as it should have. We all have made mistakes before, but most realize that it is how we handle those mistakes that is important, and Alex owned up completely to his lapse in judgement. You'll notice that he made no excuses for his inebriation (from alcohol provided by CCP), and did not ask CCP to share the blame (even though the content of his presentation- including the unfortunate slide which prompted this controversy - was vetted by CCP).
This story could have ended with Alex's sincere apology, and would have faded with the next news cycle from the gaming press. Instead, CCP has taken the last, dying embers from this firestorm, and tossed gasoline on them. If they wanted this story to not gain any more traction in the gaming press, banning The Mittani in game for Alex's verbal misteps was exactly the wrong course of action to take. Moreover, while I am sure they acted with the best of intentions, by lumping more punishments on to those that Alex undertook voluntarily, the outcome seems not only excessive, but vindictive.
I am disappointed and saddened by CCP's response to the issue, and I hope that they will take a step back and reconsider the implications and intent of their actions.
Yeah but CCP is a business. Did you really expect them to take Alex's apology and Chairman resignation as "enough" ? This incident -may-or-may not- have faded from the gaming press without further action from CCP, but do you think the several hundred employees of CCP would be happy risking their own livelihood with that gamble ?
No, CCP did the right thing and took the aggressive and affirmative action. In this day and age of videogame controversy, the collective eye of the gaming world is gazing upon CCP, evaluating their actions, and you would be very naive or very optimistic to think otherwise.
|
Flette
Rosen Association
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:26:00 -
[724] - Quote
Viktor Villiance wrote:Flette wrote:
Well, you didn't have a point really, All I saw was "wah, CCP is mean" Put bluntly, they can change his name anytime they want without any shitstorm or even murmur as a result of a cyber-bullying action, or just plain bullyiing action.
And, oh, the 11 billion isk? That wasn't given to him by CCP...
lol
BTW, the only "The WIz" i see, looks like he hasn't logged in in a while. I could be wrong though. I don't think it's too far out to assume they have changed the character's name, and slipped in another character with the previous name to catch those who might continue this bullying trend. That is speculation however..
Oh, my bad. You're a publord and need education, badly. His name isn't "the wiz", but that's okay. They haven't changed his name and he was recently blown up in game actually. Your speculation is like your knowledge, I see. But hey, be more buttmad at goons/mittani, whatever. Doesn't mean that its fair for CCP to literally beg a bunch of self-righteous, "wronged" nerds to grief him into oblivion by taking down a figurehead.
Alright, I haven't looked up his name. I went by your, and previous posts. Nevertheless, I think it's pretty easy for CCP to shield this individual if the individual wants it with no repurcussions at all. Also, I'm not buttmad or whatever.
True, I do think Mittani has all done us a big disservice by making Eve look bad, by making Eve players look bad, and by pushing CCP into a position where they're likely to have to PCify Eve somewhat. So, yeah, I do think that kinda sucks.
I don't have anything against you personally. So I apologize for my tone. I just don't see CCP as the bad guy here, more of the victim. The most I can stretch is for CCP being so stupid as to give someone like the Mittani a forum to use to bring us all down.
Thw whole thing really sucks, and at least there, I can agree with you. |
Flette
Rosen Association
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:32:00 -
[725] - Quote
Meno Theaetetus wrote:The real issue here has little to do with cyber bullying, anyone that genuinely believes that Mittens wanted someone to kill themselves is either socially backwards or are lying to promote their own agenda.
Just for the record, the issue of cyber-bullying is very much the issue here, and it has nothing to do with what he actually wanted. It has everything to do with how he acted, and the risks involved.
As a side note I will point out a mildly related (though much more serious) issue that recently happened here in the US. Two students were living together in a dorm room, both males. One of the students suspected the other of being gay, and set up a webcam to secretly record his roomate. With damning footage in hand, this person posted the video to the internet, and the other rommate did, in fact, commit suicide as a result. I don't think the roommate who made the video wanted the other person to commit suicide, but that was the result.
Actions matter more than intentions. |
Rasz Lin
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:38:00 -
[726] - Quote
Thank you CCP |
Minister of Death
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:38:00 -
[727] - Quote
This was a good decision CCP. The right thing to do.
I applaud the principle and the action behind it. Well done.
Minister of Death Amarr Ministry of War |
LtTysander
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
20
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:40:00 -
[728] - Quote
Burn it all SORCHED EARTH |
Isky McBuilder
Perkone Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:42:00 -
[729] - Quote
Yeah all you people bitching that this is no big deal and it is said everyday in various online games are obviously too short sighted to see this from the perspective of CCP as a company.
They are in a PR sense tied to the chairman of CSM. When he is wearing that hat at an official CCP event being broadcast around the world, CCP has no choice but to cover their asses and cut affiliation.
Eve is harsh, but so is reality. You f*&%k up big time, you pay for it. |
Valk Enaka
The Lone Patrol Tactical Narcotics Team
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:43:00 -
[730] - Quote
Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? |
|
Rokujochi
Duragon Pioneer Group Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:44:00 -
[731] - Quote
I surely hope that CCP in its infinite wisdom has thoroughly thought out the possible repercussions of this extremely poor decision.
I sure hope that being forced to resign from CSM6, forfeit his position on CSM7 and being banned from the game for 30 days doesn't cause poor Mittani to fall into a deep depression and contemplate suicide. He LIVES for playing EvE, leading his alliance and being chair of the CSM, the loss of these combined with his clear history of alcohol abuse have me fearing for his safety.
PLEASE CCP FREE MITTANI! FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI FREE MITTANI |
Minister of Death
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:45:00 -
[732] - Quote
Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election?
It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz.
Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics.
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:47:00 -
[733] - Quote
Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics.
goons and pets can't think
Edit: Perfect example below, now they think CCP poisoned the drink and manipulated The Mittani The Great
| | vv |
stupid monkey
Easy Co. Fatal Ascension
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:47:00 -
[734] - Quote
Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics.
cept i've been told ccp provided the liquor |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:50:00 -
[735] - Quote
Rokujochi wrote:I surely hope that CCP in its infinite wisdom has thoroughly thought out the possible repercussions of this extremely poor decision.
I sure hope that being forced to resign from CSM6, forfeit his position on CSM7 and being banned from the game for 30 days doesn't cause poor Mittani to fall into a deep depression and contemplate suicide. He LIVES for playing EvE, leading his alliance and being chair of the CSM, the loss of these combined with his clear history of alcohol abuse have me fearing for his safety.
PLEASE CCP FREE MITTANI!
http://soundcloud.com/cptunderpants/state-of-the-goonion-march
he doesnt sound ...depressed
actually he sounds like a priest trying to tame a horde of religious maniacs with promisses how bright the future will be CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:50:00 -
[736] - Quote
Rokujochi wrote:I surely hope that CCP in its infinite wisdom has thoroughly thought out the possible repercussions of this extremely poor decision.
I sure hope that being forced to resign from CSM6, forfeit his position on CSM7 and being banned from the game for 30 days doesn't cause poor Mittani to fall into a deep depression and contemplate suicide. He LIVES for playing EvE, leading his alliance and being chair of the CSM, the loss of these combined with his clear history of alcohol abuse have me fearing for his safety.
PLEASE CCP FREE MITTANI!
apart from he stated in the state of the goonion , i'm kinda famous for not logging into eve. |
sakurako
Eternal Darkness. G00DFELLAS
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:51:00 -
[737] - Quote
stupid monkey wrote:Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics. cept i've been told ccp provided the liquor
no one forced him to drink it, no one force him to say what he did. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:54:00 -
[738] - Quote
stupid monkey wrote:Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics. cept i've been told ccp provided the liquor
hahahaha
when you think youve heard it all someone tops it
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:54:00 -
[739] - Quote
Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics.
Both. If someone breaks the law, and the authorities overreact and mete out a punishment out of proportion with the crime, then both are wrong. |
Lamperouge Kasenumi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:54:00 -
[740] - Quote
CCP didn't take out those 10000 votes, The Mittani did. The terms for being a member of the CSM were clean and clear and The Mittani broke them.
Instead of blaming CCP, you should be blaming The Mittani for putting them into that position. |
|
Atrum Veneficus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
84
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:56:00 -
[741] - Quote
I bring you the official Goonswarm Federation response to CCP throwing the Mittani under the bus.
http://i.imgur.com/J42oU.gif
Enjoy. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3813
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:56:00 -
[742] - Quote
Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:CCP didn't take out those 10000 votes, The Mittani did. The terms for being a member of the CSM were clean and clear and The Mittani broke them.
Instead of blaming CCP, you should be blaming The Mittani for putting them into that position.
thank you for your "valuable" insights NPC alt "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Urziel99
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:56:00 -
[743] - Quote
Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? |
ShatIn FACE
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:56:00 -
[744] - Quote
GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARSGOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS GOON TEARS |
Alexia Canada
United Highsec Front The 99 Percent
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:58:00 -
[745] - Quote
Shigsy wrote:HEH Eggs in one basket goons
Hey we still got Dovi |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:58:00 -
[746] - Quote
Bacchanalian wrote:Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics. Both. If someone breaks the law, and the authorities overreact and mete out a punishment out of proportion with the crime, then both are wrong.
how is a temp ban for 30 days + barred from CSM for the next 13 or so months "over react" and "out of proportion"? |
digi
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:58:00 -
[747] - Quote
This post best post. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:00:00 -
[748] - Quote
Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB?
i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3813
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:01:00 -
[749] - Quote
I love how pubbies think that NPC posting alts are a license to post nonsense "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3813
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:01:00 -
[750] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain
I have the strong feeling that CONCORD isn't going to stop tornadoes from instapopping freighters "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
|
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:02:00 -
[751] - Quote
Diamonica Norya wrote:Bacchanalian wrote:Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics. Both. If someone breaks the law, and the authorities overreact and mete out a punishment out of proportion with the crime, then both are wrong. how is a temp ban for 30 days + barred from CSM for the next 13 or so months "over react" and "out of proportion"?
Taking in-game action for out-of-game action seems like an overreaction or at least an inappropriate one to me. Ban him from fanfest next year? Appropriate. Ban him in-game? Not appropriate. |
Urziel99
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:03:00 -
[752] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain
And when the entire coalition shows up at your doorstep you think CONCORD is going to stop them?
Surely you jest. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:08:00 -
[753] - Quote
Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain I have the strong feeling that CONCORD isn't going to stop tornadoes from instapopping freighters
i have the strong feeling that you have no idea how many frighters pass jita in a day
and how many tornados you will need to "burn jita down" listining to your SofG
edit clarifying CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Paint Thinner
The Grubs
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:08:00 -
[754] - Quote
Hold on CCP, you're holding anyone but yourselves responsible for a broadcast on a website that you have sole and complete control over? Because that is exactly what is happening here. Your failure to time delay or properly filter your broadcast is not a fault of the participants.
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:10:00 -
[755] - Quote
Urziel99 wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain And when the entire coalition shows up at your doorstep you think CONCORD is going to stop them? Surely you jest.
my doorstep ?
to doe a CONCORD database failure im not allowed in highsec atm ... CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Urziel99
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:11:00 -
[756] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain I have the strong feeling that CONCORD isn't going to stop tornadoes from instapopping freighters i have the strong feeling that you have no idea how many frighters pass jita in a day and how many tornados you will need to "burn jita down" listining to your SofG edit clarifying
You, good sir , underestimate the industrial and financial power of the coalition. You also underestimate their desire to gank pubbies. They give no fucks, never have, never will. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3813
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:12:00 -
[757] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:i have the strong feeling that you have no idea how many frighters pass jita in a day
and how many tornados you will need to "burn jita down" listining to your SofG
edit clarifying
2,000 tornadoes aren't enough laff "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:13:00 -
[758] - Quote
Urziel99 wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:Urziel99 wrote:Jita will surely burn.
Maybe the CFC can demonstrate to the pubbies what the 6VDT HellCamp was like for BOB? i have the strong feeling that there is no CONCORD in fountain I have the strong feeling that CONCORD isn't going to stop tornadoes from instapopping freighters i have the strong feeling that you have no idea how many frighters pass jita in a day and how many tornados you will need to "burn jita down" listining to your SofG edit clarifying You, good sir , underestimate the industrial and financial power of the coalition. You also underestimate their desire to gank pubbies. They give no fucks, never have, never will.
it will be interresting if you can pull it off , i doubt it not gank the odd frighter , but "burn jita down" CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:13:00 -
[759] - Quote
Andski wrote:I love how pubbies think that NPC posting alts are a license to post nonsense
I love how forum posting pixels think they can do whatever they like to ppls RL references and think they are never going to be held responsible when something horrible can happen to the said person. Then a whole bunch follows and thinks that's the only way to be cool.
Hey, roleplay all you like, go back to EvE (or leave) but restrict that in your virtual world, NPC alt or not, they are more aware of the difference between real world and game world than you think. Whatever being posted by everyone else are more sensible than any of the goon pets have posted in this thread to date.
(10000 votes, too harsh, how's that breaking EULA, unsub, shooting monuments, what's the big deal, wtf csm no power...etc.) keep recycling these actual non-sense and irresponsible poor thought out reasons and tell the world that your opinion actually matters more than any of your so called NPC corp alts.
You should be ashamed, the more you defend for your leader's childish actions as well as yours
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:13:00 -
[760] - Quote
Andski wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:i have the strong feeling that you have no idea how many frighters pass jita in a day
and how many tornados you will need to "burn jita down" listining to your SofG
edit clarifying 2,000 tornadoes aren't enough laff no not if you want to "burn jitta down" CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3813
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:15:00 -
[761] - Quote
Diamonica Norya wrote:Andski wrote:I love how pubbies think that NPC posting alts are a license to post nonsense I love how forum posting pixels think they can do whatever they like to ppls RL references and think they are never going to be held responsible when something horrible can happen to the said person. Then a whole bunch follows and thinks that's the only way to be cool. Hey, roleplay all you like, go back to EvE (or leave) but restrict that in your virtual world, NPC alt or not, they are more aware of the difference between real world and game world than you think. Whatever being posted by everyone else are more sensible than any of the goon pets have posted in this thread to date. (10000 votes, too harsh, how's that breaking EULA, unsub, shooting monuments, what's the big deal, wtf csm no power...etc.) keep recycling these actual non-sense and irresponsible poor thought out reasons and tell the world that your opinion actually matters more than any of your so called NPC corp alts. You should be ashamed, the more you defend for your leader's childish actions as well as yours
You didn't even watch the video you're just hopping on the bandwagon because your hulk got ganked "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Flamespar
Woof Club
346
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:16:00 -
[762] - Quote
CCP has put a lot of work into cleaning up their own act .. time for the CSM to do likewise. I can post on a forum, therefore I represent everyone. |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:17:00 -
[763] - Quote
Andski wrote:Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:CCP didn't take out those 10000 votes, The Mittani did. The terms for being a member of the CSM were clean and clear and The Mittani broke them.
Instead of blaming CCP, you should be blaming The Mittani for putting them into that position. thank you for your "valuable" insights NPC alt
Obviously more valuable than any of the goon/goon pets' insights.
Seriously, if you cannot argue more, just shush, stop pretending you're intellectually superior just because someone chooses to stay in a NPC corp because the fact is you're not intellectually superior. out of arguments, accept it that you have no grounds for arguing. |
Lamperouge Kasenumi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:20:00 -
[764] - Quote
Paint Thinner wrote:Hold on CCP, you're holding anyone but yourselves responsible for a broadcast on a website that you have sole and complete control over? Because that is exactly what is happening here. Your failure to time delay or properly filter your broadcast is not a fault of the participants.
Lol, quoting for posterity's sake. Goon's tears best tears right?
About Goons burning Jita down, that's gonna be entertaining, this is what the sandbox is all about! |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:22:00 -
[765] - Quote
Andski wrote:Diamonica Norya wrote:Andski wrote:I love how pubbies think that NPC posting alts are a license to post nonsense I love how forum posting pixels think they can do whatever they like to ppls RL references and think they are never going to be held responsible when something horrible can happen to the said person. Then a whole bunch follows and thinks that's the only way to be cool. Hey, roleplay all you like, go back to EvE (or leave) but restrict that in your virtual world, NPC alt or not, they are more aware of the difference between real world and game world than you think. Whatever being posted by everyone else are more sensible than any of the goon pets have posted in this thread to date. (10000 votes, too harsh, how's that breaking EULA, unsub, shooting monuments, what's the big deal, wtf csm no power...etc.) keep recycling these actual non-sense and irresponsible poor thought out reasons and tell the world that your opinion actually matters more than any of your so called NPC corp alts. You should be ashamed, the more you defend for your leader's childish actions as well as yours You didn't even watch the video you're just hopping on the bandwagon because your hulk got ganked
I'm sorry but i never lose hulks to date on any of my 50 toons, there are so many attempts of suicidal ganks on my great team and non succeeded, last I knew, 5 dessies from goons can't even pop my mack. |
Nick Bison
Bison Industrial Inc Thundering Herd
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:23:00 -
[766] - Quote
Paint Thinner wrote:Hold on CCP, you're holding anyone but yourselves responsible for a broadcast on a website that you have sole and complete control over? Because that is exactly what is happening here. Your failure to time delay or properly filter your broadcast is not a fault of the participants.
So, by your warped logic, no one has to be responsible or accountable for their own actions. Nice ...
ProTip: get out of your mom's basement
Nothing clever at this time. |
Terrorfrodo
Deep Space Darwinian Law Enforcement Agency
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:24:00 -
[767] - Quote
This is outrageous. Ten thousand votes ignored because of an insignificant misstep. |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:26:00 -
[768] - Quote
Terrorfrodo wrote:This is outrageous. Ten thousand votes ignored because of an insignificant misstep.
sure it is insignificant, you're not the victim themselves nor represents any of the parties involved who have been victimized. |
Savion Chastis
Golden Sail Enterprises
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:27:00 -
[769] - Quote
Come on CCP. Removing him from the CSM ... fine, he brought that on himself and wasted the 10k votes ... that's on him.
Banning the guy in game for something he did outside of the game? Banning someone in game for something they did out of game is kind of like banning someone because they got a DUI.
Sounds like this might have been dictated towards you by your savior SOE.
|
Lamperouge Kasenumi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:32:00 -
[770] - Quote
Savion Chastis wrote:Come on CCP. Removing him from the CSM ... fine, he brought that on himself and wasted the 10k votes ... that's on him.
Banning the guy in game for something he did outside of the game? Banning someone in game for something they did out of game is kind of like banning someone because they got a DUI.
Sounds like this might have been dictated towards you by your savior SOE.
Psst, dude, just so you know, the big deal here is about the CSM thing. The 30 days ban is only relevant in the context that it kicks him out of the CSM. |
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:35:00 -
[771] - Quote
Savion Chastis wrote:Come on CCP. Removing him from the CSM ... fine, he brought that on himself and wasted the 10k votes ... that's on him.
Banning the guy in game for something he did outside of the game? Banning someone in game for something they did out of game is kind of like banning someone because they got a DUI.
Sounds like this might have been dictated towards you by your savior SOE.
of course ban him from the game for something he did related to the game outside of the game, what do you think, since he did this outside of the game, now he needs to go to court and faces trials instead? or go to jail or remand centres straight away?
30 days ban for someone who never logs in is not like hell, it's too light and lenient as the general public has felt already. he's only 30 something ish old and there's plenty of 30 days to live through, grow up and live this one already. |
minime92
Barr Heavy Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:40:00 -
[772] - Quote
TBH I have to agree with the point made, that this massive recoil about the mittani's actions, which I do not condone in the slightest, is less about what he said and more a general anti goon protest. The Wis himself seems pretty much non-plussed about the entire deal and has accepted the mittani's apology.
On an additional note the fact that a large portion of the player base no longer feel they are represented in the CSm is a little unfair, prehaps the many players who voted for Mittani should be allowed to revote, they could push another CSM member into the chair (Please God not Riviani). Also Jita will burn my friends. April 28th. |
Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
906
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:46:00 -
[773] - Quote
Hi CCP Sverige here, can we have our 10058 votes back please thank you in advance, that will be fantastic |
Savion Chastis
Golden Sail Enterprises
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:46:00 -
[774] - Quote
Diamonica Norya wrote:
30 days ban for someone who never logs in is not like hell, it's too light and lenient as the general public has felt already. he's only 30 something ish old and there's plenty of 30 days to live through, grow up and live this one already.
Then we both agree that a 30 day ban is redundant and pointless? I don't see how a real life action can carry consequences in game. This is just CCP doing a little bit of CYA. They can remove the guy from the CSM to make a point. For God's sake though. At least let those people revote. I'm sure there has to be some sort of policy for this...
On second thought, it is probably a little early to go up in rave about the re-vote thing. Nothing that CCP has said has eluded to the fact that there won't be a re-vote. |
lol fourm troll
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:47:00 -
[775] - Quote
still waiting for jita to burn.......
|
Veinnail
FinFleet Raiden.
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:47:00 -
[776] - Quote
Considering the publicity, this entire headline was right in line with the "we're here to ruin this game" mantra..
falling in love with a game under the guise of destruction has created some rather twisted personalities.
stop playing forums-online, and get back into spaceships ffs. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3819
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:48:00 -
[777] - Quote
lol fourm troll wrote:still waiting for jita to burn.......
One month. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:49:00 -
[778] - Quote
I don't think people who replied in this thread have the intention to start another anti-goon protest. In fact, if the goons and pets stop their meaningless posts and finger pointing, this thread wouldn't have end up in its current state.
but maybe it's the goons motto that any publicity is good publicity so they fearlessly continue posting their complaints about a decision a company made on a player's misconduct.
Bring on the Jita burning, you guys are surely busy in Branch still and gonna play with Raiden a bit longer eh? 28th April...that's a long time, no wonder Jita's temperature hasn't risen a bit, still cold and nothing interesting going on. Your rapid response team need to work harder, there's a deadline to meet! |
Destrim
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:50:00 -
[779] - Quote
... methinks people are going a bit out of bounds here.
CCP did not remove him from the CSM, he resigned of his own volition. Thus, the people raging about "CCP just invalidated 10058 votes" are themselves an invalid argument, since it was not CCP who performed that action, but the Mittani himself.
The ONLY thing CCP is responsible for is the 30-day ban, which amounts to a slap on the wrist. |
Lamperouge Kasenumi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:52:00 -
[780] - Quote
minime92 wrote:On an additional note the fact that a large portion of the player base no longer feel they are represented in the CSm is a little unfair, prehaps the many players who voted for Mittani should be allowed to revote, they could push another CSM member into the chair (Please God not Riviani).
Nah, it's all about risk and reward. The risk was The Mittani screwing up and getting kicked out, the reward was The Mittani keeping his position and influencing future CCP's decision to benefit the Goons. They lost their bets, now they have to live with it. |
|
Bacchanalian
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:55:00 -
[781] - Quote
Destrim wrote:... methinks people are going a bit out of bounds here.
CCP did not remove him from the CSM, he resigned of his own volition. Thus, the people raging about "CCP just invalidated 10058 votes" are themselves an invalid argument, since it was not CCP who performed that action, but the Mittani himself.
The ONLY thing CCP is responsible for is the 30-day ban, which amounts to a slap on the wrist.
Incorrect, he resigned as CSM chair, which is not the same thing--it's a right of anyone elected to that office to step down from that office and remain as CSM member. |
Destrim
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:57:00 -
[782] - Quote
Bacchanalian wrote:Destrim wrote:... methinks people are going a bit out of bounds here.
CCP did not remove him from the CSM, he resigned of his own volition. Thus, the people raging about "CCP just invalidated 10058 votes" are themselves an invalid argument, since it was not CCP who performed that action, but the Mittani himself.
The ONLY thing CCP is responsible for is the 30-day ban, which amounts to a slap on the wrist. Incorrect, he resigned as CSM chair, which is not the same thing--it's a right of anyone elected to that office to step down from that office and remain as CSM member.
"He has also resigned from his position as Chairman of CSM 6 and has forfeited his right to serve on CSM 7" -from the devblog post.
Both actions were voluntary. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3822
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:00:00 -
[783] - Quote
Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:minime92 wrote:On an additional note the fact that a large portion of the player base no longer feel they are represented in the CSm is a little unfair, prehaps the many players who voted for Mittani should be allowed to revote, they could push another CSM member into the chair (Please God not Riviani). Nah, it's all about risk and reward. The risk was The Mittani screwing up and getting kicked out, the reward was The Mittani keeping his position and influencing future CCP's decision to benefit the Goons. They lost their bets, now they have to live with it.
Oh please you're going to be bleating in a month again when the Jita undock is filled with freighter wrecks anyway "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Hecatonis
Ascension Manufacturing
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:01:00 -
[784] - Quote
even i sat through his address to the goons,
he left the CSM by his own choice, you people need to lay off the koolaid |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3822
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:01:00 -
[785] - Quote
Hecatonis wrote:even i sat through his address to the goons,
he left the CSM by his own choice, you people need to lay off the koolaid
He hasn't confirmed that, FYI "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Nirnaeth Ornoediad
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
91
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:01:00 -
[786] - Quote
DelightSucker wrote:Wolfgang Helm wrote:
Ban yes, remove from chair yes - removal from CSM was too far.
you are aware that the Ban is what makes him getting kicked form csm right?
It didn't get Krutoj kicked from the CSM. "The Mittani isn't even gone for a day and CCP's management is already making bad decisions."
THE MITTANI for CEO of CCP 1-800-273-8255 |
Savion Chastis
Golden Sail Enterprises
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:04:00 -
[787] - Quote
Well, since we cleared that up I guess this can now be a burn jita thread.
I also need to go pay my parking tickets. Wouldn't want for the parking po-po to write someone and get me banned. |
Ager Agemo
X-Factor Industries Synthetic Existence
47
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:06:00 -
[788] - Quote
As mittens itself said:
DEAL WITH IT!
he resigned himself, he was not forced to resign. |
Tetragammatron Prime
Pink Sockers
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:10:00 -
[789] - Quote
a bloo blooo blooo bloooo |
Tetragammatron Prime
Pink Sockers
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:11:00 -
[790] - Quote
Ager Agemo wrote:As mittens itself said:
DEAL WITH IT!
he resigned himself, he was not forced to resign.
He also banned himself from game! |
|
Valk Enaka
The Lone Patrol Tactical Narcotics Team
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:11:00 -
[791] - Quote
Minister of Death wrote:Valk Enaka wrote:Thank you CCP for throwing out my interest in the game. When you take over 10,000 of the votes for CSM and throw them out, what are you thinking? As many others said, none of this was ingame which means the EULA wouldn't apply. The Mittani publicly apologized, and in my opinion at least, went far beyond what he needed to do.
You had several thousand players interested in taking part in this process, and have told them that their opinions do not matter to you. Way to go CCP. As others have said, if you are going to ignore these votes, why even bother with the election? It is truly odd that you blame CCP for this, and not mittenz. Who did the wrong thing here? CCP or mittenz? Think about it and drop the hysterics. I have said already that I did not think what mittens did was right, but he did try to make it right on his part.
I do blame CCP for completely blowing off the more than 10k votes. They make a joke out of the whole CSM voting process when they do something like that.
And now Jita will burn! |
Minister of Death
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
37
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:15:00 -
[792] - Quote
Valk Enaka wrote:
I do blame CCP for completely blowing off the more than 10k votes.
Would it be possible to consider a paraphrase of the above as:
"I am disappointed in myself for voting for a jackass who wasted my valuable vote."?
|
Lamperouge Kasenumi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:26:00 -
[793] - Quote
Andski wrote:Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:minime92 wrote:On an additional note the fact that a large portion of the player base no longer feel they are represented in the CSm is a little unfair, prehaps the many players who voted for Mittani should be allowed to revote, they could push another CSM member into the chair (Please God not Riviani). Nah, it's all about risk and reward. The risk was The Mittani screwing up and getting kicked out, the reward was The Mittani keeping his position and influencing future CCP's decision to benefit the Goons. They lost their bets, now they have to live with it. Oh please you're going to be bleating in a month again when the Jita undock is filled with freighter wrecks anyway
Will I? Or will I be enjoying the show just like I am right now? |
Gevlin
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
121
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:45:00 -
[794] - Quote
I am sad to see this resolution but we need to move on.
I do hope that the Mittani returns in 30 days I hope the goons remain being goons and don't disolve or leave.
I hope the CSM represents the "Whole" eve community including the goons and listen to the community and not the angry mob mentality.
I also hope that appropriate procedures are in place to prevent accidental action in the future at any player created content. I agree with several people: CCP needs to focus most of eve's recources on FIS, but the development of WIS still needs to continue, just as a slower and more efficient pace. In eve I wish to be more than just a machine. |
Zhade Lezte
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:49:00 -
[795] - Quote
To make it clear to those who don't have a hateon for mitanni and a fondness for distorting the truth towards your own agenda while maintaining a facade of self-righteousness, CCP pretty much unequivocally removed Mitanni from the CSM as opposed to Mitanni resigning.
Our latest CEO update on the forums mentions how he has chosen to resign from the charimanship but continue to work within the CSM as a regular member. Then this devblog was posted.
Don't fool yourself into thinking that he willingly resigned from the CSM, if that was the case it would be written that he resigned from the chairmanship and the CSM, instead of having resigned from the chairmanship and "forfeited" his position on the CSM.
Naturally of course, CCP's PR department has made sure to make it not clear what the truth of the matter really is: the disenfranchisement of 10,058 voters.
I'm disappointed at this but not particularly surprised they would take such an action with the media shitstorm and likely pressure from Sony due to their presence at fanfest due to Dust, they are a company after all and they'll do unjust things if it seems important enough for their business interests. I'm glad to hear that the other representatives are likely going to remain in contact with The Mitanni in spite of CCP's cowardice and I hope they will bring forth the interests of The Mitanni's constituents in their interactions with CCP.
Hopefully CCP's apparent fear of Sony and the gaming media will not result in a reduction to the harsh universe that made me stay around in Eve and brought so many of us here. We shall see soon enough! |
Faikkun
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:50:00 -
[796] - Quote
This decision makes me want to kill myself. |
Daktar Jaxs
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:54:00 -
[797] - Quote
CCP and the Hypocritical Bullshit: Episode 435
Anyway, if you think this is going to effect our behaviour in game you are one dumb bear. |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:07:00 -
[798] - Quote
Daktar Jaxs wrote:Anyway, if you think this is going to effect our behaviour in game you are one dumb bear. No one cares bro.
Start a corp and do it yourself. You'll fail, but you'll enjoy failing. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
Hecatonis
Ascension Manufacturing
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:12:00 -
[799] - Quote
Andski wrote:Hecatonis wrote:even i sat through his address to the goons,
he left the CSM by his own choice, you people need to lay off the koolaid He hasn't confirmed that, FYI
um, yes he did, listen again my dear goon. |
Flamespar
Woof Club
346
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:17:00 -
[800] - Quote
u mad bro? I can post on a forum, therefore I represent everyone. |
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3834
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:17:00 -
[801] - Quote
Hecatonis wrote:Andski wrote:Hecatonis wrote:even i sat through his address to the goons,
he left the CSM by his own choice, you people need to lay off the koolaid He hasn't confirmed that, FYI um, yes he did, listen again my dear goon.
he didn't resign from the CSM. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
IllusiveWolf63
Rayn Enterprises Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:18:00 -
[802] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:This entire situation is regrettable and there was no perfect outcome. I am concerned about the disenfranchisement of voters but trust CSM6 and CCP to sort things as best as possible under the circumstances.
You can trust CCP to work it out the best possible way for them. The CSM is supposed to represent the player base. Test Alliance Please Live Stream Drunk Eve Players |
buck herrick
101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:18:00 -
[803] - Quote
Faikkun wrote:This decision makes me want to kill myself.
no, please, dont. seek assistance, stroke the furry wall, something, anything.
oh wait, TEST.....hmmmm |
Helena Russell Makanen
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:22:00 -
[804] - Quote
Andski wrote:Hecatonis wrote:even i sat through his address to the goons,
he left the CSM by his own choice, you people need to lay off the koolaid He hasn't confirmed that, FYI
Who care what he 'confirms'. CCP owns this game not mitty. They said he is out - he is out... regardless of his hubris. He did it himself. Oh and goons seem to cry and moan more than the carebears they mock btw. That's not lost on anyone. I won't (yet) use the 'delicious' term you love so much.
|
Damion Rayne
Dark-Rising
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:25:00 -
[805] - Quote
Zhade Lezte wrote:To make it clear to those who don't have a hateon for mitanni and a fondness for distorting the truth towards your own agenda while maintaining a facade of self-righteousness, CCP pretty much unequivocally removed Mitanni from the CSM as opposed to Mitanni resigning.
Our latest CEO update on the forums mentions how he has chosen to resign from the charimanship but continue to work within the CSM as a regular member. Then this devblog was posted.
Don't fool yourself into thinking that he willingly resigned from the CSM, if that was the case it would be written that he resigned from the chairmanship and the CSM, instead of having resigned from the chairmanship and "forfeited" his position on the CSM.
Naturally of course, CCP's PR department has made sure to make it not clear what the truth of the matter really is: the disenfranchisement of 10,058 voters.
I'm disappointed at this but not particularly surprised they would take such an action with the media shitstorm and likely pressure from Sony due to their presence at fanfest due to Dust, they are a company after all and they'll do unjust things if it seems important enough for their business interests. I'm glad to hear that the other representatives are likely going to remain in contact with The Mitanni in spite of CCP's cowardice and I hope they will bring forth the interests of The Mitanni's constituents in their interactions with CCP.
Hopefully CCP's apparent fear of Sony and the gaming media will not result in a reduction to the harsh universe that made me stay around in Eve and brought so many of us here. We shall see soon enough!
Do "Un Just" things? Un Just? Your'e glorious leader told people to force a man to kill himself, and you call CCPs' actions un just? News flash..
THE VERY EXISTENCE OF GOONSWARM IS UNJUST Teamwork.. Maturity.. Tactics.. www.tacticalgamer.com |
Helena Russell Makanen
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:26:00 -
[806] - Quote
Andski wrote:
Oh please you're going to be bleating in a month again when the Jita undock is filled with freighter wrecks anyway
Like you have been BLEATING for days? Whine and snivel.
|
Etil DeLaFuente
New Eclipse Initiative Mercenaries
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:33:00 -
[807] - Quote
10,058 tears, he's indeed the best vilain in eve |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3835
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:34:00 -
[808] - Quote
Helena Russell Makanen wrote:Andski wrote:
Oh please you're going to be bleating in a month again when the Jita undock is filled with freighter wrecks anyway
Like you have been BLEATING for days? Whine and snivel.
We're going to have delegates in CSM 8. One will be the Chairman. Same with CSM 9, CSM 10, and so on until this game dies.
Deal with it. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:41:00 -
[809] - Quote
In the words of "your CEO~" and "chairman for life~" or whatever his current title is:
"Deal with it~".
I don't see how the voters got disenfranchised by CCP's actions anyway. The Mittani got himself into this mess, and you're angry at CCP. Why? Because being angry at your elected buddy would destroy too much of your self esteem?
Personally, I'm, frisky as a squid on Tuesdays. |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
367
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:45:00 -
[810] - Quote
Andski wrote:
We're going to have delegates in CSM 8. One will be the Chairman. Same with CSM 9, CSM 10, and so on until this game dies.
Deal with it.
DIdn't you unsub already, you sobbing little baby
I've never seen as much dickless futile crying over internet space pixels in my time in EVE. But hey, everyone's a special little snowflake when they're butthurt!
|
|
Phigmeta
EXPCS Corp SpaceMonkey's Alliance
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:49:00 -
[811] - Quote
So after reading very carefully through the entire EULA and TOS something occured to me.
His actions we outside of the game and since the statements we not on the forums.......
.......... the EULA / TOS does not apply.
This literally means that CCP .... your an idoit
|
Empathic Psychopath
Cult of the Crayon
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:52:00 -
[812] - Quote
RDevz wrote:You've disenfranchised 10,058 voters. Good job. Edit: CCP Navigator's edited post wrote: The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. The Mittani wrote:I now exercise my right as the winner of the election with 10,058 votes to decline the office of Chairman. Unless there's something that's not been said in public, I think you might be jumping to conclusions there. There's a difference between being a CSM member and being the CSM chairman.
Ummmm...I didn't hear anyone complain about being disenfranchised when the last CSM member got kicked, how does it make the people who voted for mittens any different? Just because most of them were goons? If that's the case then maybe all goons should quit eve in protest...I dare ya! |
Kile Kitmoore
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:53:00 -
[813] - Quote
What does the victim say about this because if he was that upset (which I don't believe he is) why not allow him to change his game identity? If he is OK with everything and actually enjoying the media spotlight why not have him and Mitt's sing "We are the world", together on YouTube?
Makes me wonder what the turn out will be like in the next election when the Chairman can so easily be tossed out. Oh, I do understand that he stepped down, but what amount of pressure was placed on him to do so?
Quick note on the bad press, imagine if you will some dude who's grinding his 1000th WOW quest on the verge of shooting himself in the head but reads this "bad" press and thinks to himself, "Jesus Christ on a popsicle stick, I can do that crazy **** in a game!". Yes, he quits WOW, comes here and we have just saved a life.
This idea that CSM members need to be model citizens in a game which prides itself on being a dark cold universe full of cutthroats is stupid.
CCP HTFU and enjoy the press Mittens has yet again brought to your door.
|
Hecatonis
Ascension Manufacturing
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:53:00 -
[814] - Quote
Phigmeta wrote:So after reading very carefully through the entire EULA and TOS something occured to me.
His actions we outside of the game and since the statements we not on the forums.......
.......... the EULA / TOS does not apply.
This literally means that CCP .... your an idoit
thats like saying RMT is outside game because you dont use the eve client to send the money. the told people to use CCP tools to find, player search, and harass, eve mail, another player.
CCP is well within their rights to temp ban him |
Arkady Sadik
Gradient Electus Matari
582
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:04:00 -
[815] - Quote
Good decision. Thank you, CCP. |
Empathic Psychopath
Cult of the Crayon
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:04:00 -
[816] - Quote
Koby Botick wrote:1/6 th of all votes disregarded. Is CCP back a russian sounding abbreviation again? I hear they like to manipulate votes in plain sight there too.
Wasn't it goons that were praising CCP not that long ago when a nerf to tians was announced? My how the mighty have fallen :) |
Phigmeta
EXPCS Corp SpaceMonkey's Alliance
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:05:00 -
[817] - Quote
Hecatonis wrote:Phigmeta wrote:So after reading very carefully through the entire EULA and TOS something occured to me.
His actions we outside of the game and since the statements we not on the forums.......
.......... the EULA / TOS does not apply.
This literally means that CCP .... your an idoit
thats like saying RMT is outside game because you dont use the eve client to send the money. the told people to use CCP tools to find, player search, and harass, eve mail, another player. CCP is well within their rights to temp ban him
actually RMT does happen inside the game ....
but thanks for playing genius |
Aineko Macx
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
165
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:08:00 -
[818] - Quote
Etil DeLaFuente wrote:10,058 tears, he's indeed the best vilain in eve I approve
Quick goonies, go "burn jita to the ground". |
Hecatonis
Ascension Manufacturing
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:09:00 -
[819] - Quote
Phigmeta wrote:Hecatonis wrote:Phigmeta wrote:So after reading very carefully through the entire EULA and TOS something occured to me.
His actions we outside of the game and since the statements we not on the forums.......
.......... the EULA / TOS does not apply.
This literally means that CCP .... your an idoit
thats like saying RMT is outside game because you dont use the eve client to send the money. the told people to use CCP tools to find, player search, and harass, eve mail, another player. CCP is well within their rights to temp ban him actually RMT does happen inside the game .... but thanks for playing genius
ok i will bite, how are they different?
|
Shang Fei
The Illuminatii Mildly Intoxicated
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:13:00 -
[820] - Quote
Even though I do not like The Mittani, as in the evil leader of the goons. I do believe that Mittens, the ex-CSM chairman, has done alot for our game and I believe that he being removed, resigning, whatever, is a mistake that might take a hard toll upon EVE Online. I certainly hope not, but I think he was a good member of the CSM and I do not realy disagree with anything that he has accomplished as Chair of the CSM 6. |
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:17:00 -
[821] - Quote
we're still going? I ran out of pop corns and jars to contain the tears collected
I thought the Fanfest is a CCP hosted event about some CCP developed game, some bad guy did something at the event about the game has everything to do with it...
Btw, Mitty sounds mad at the end of his new speech, hurting much?
I prefer the Mitty on Eve Radio interview, full of confidence and sounded like a reasonable man would, but I guess it was a show.
Or was it the new speech that was more of a real Mitty, then I have no regrets about my miscasted votes. |
Valryon
Insight Investments Independent Operators Consortium
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:26:00 -
[822] - Quote
How do you ban someone for something they did outside your game? That's messed up. |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:33:00 -
[823] - Quote
I bet that most of Eve forgets about the Mittani in the next 30 days. Start a corp and do it yourself. You'll fail, but you'll enjoy failing. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
Ordais
DARK ORCHESTRA
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:35:00 -
[824] - Quote
Goon tears....so many goon tears....*nomnomnom*
As for the 10.000 voters....its not CCPs fault that you candidate shot himself in the foot and can't represent you anymore. Take it up with him.
Well, i do agree with the desicion, but it will hurt the game in many ways wich makes me even MORE angry at Mittens...you just couldn't pull yourself together. All this talk about "beeing a politician" and "understanding how this works"....and then you do something STUPID like this. Well done....not. |
Aineko Macx
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
165
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:35:00 -
[825] - Quote
While mittens unintendly self-facializing must have been a Karma thing, the one question raised is interesting:
Will the newly established connection to Sony usher a time of false politically correctness at CCP? |
Irisandra T'Lavel
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:43:00 -
[826] - Quote
Andski wrote:Angelus X wrote:lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee $150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal
And how many of these will be back in a month or two because they miss their internet spaceships?
I watched it, I dont know if it was live or a replay, after the DUST514 keynote. I thought it was pretty ****** up to say that, but I didn't foresee this kind of fallout over it. Either way, I am not losing any sleep over it, it's just a game. For those of you that take it as Serious Business, I am sorry. Not that you are losing "Dear leader" but that you let a game consume that much of your life.
If they do a new election would it be the people that already ran, or would the goons fight for a new rep to be included?
And to the useless pubbie/npc alt comments: At least my two votes went to someone still on the CSM... |
Zhade Lezte
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
30
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:45:00 -
[827] - Quote
Damion Rayne wrote:Zhade Lezte wrote:To make it clear to those who don't have a hateon for mitanni and a fondness for distorting the truth towards your own agenda while maintaining a facade of self-righteousness, CCP pretty much unequivocally removed Mitanni from the CSM as opposed to Mitanni resigning.
Our latest CEO update on the forums mentions how he has chosen to resign from the charimanship but continue to work within the CSM as a regular member. Then this devblog was posted.
Don't fool yourself into thinking that he willingly resigned from the CSM, if that was the case it would be written that he resigned from the chairmanship and the CSM, instead of having resigned from the chairmanship and "forfeited" his position on the CSM.
Naturally of course, CCP's PR department has made sure to make it not clear what the truth of the matter really is: the disenfranchisement of 10,058 voters.
I'm disappointed at this but not particularly surprised they would take such an action with the media shitstorm and likely pressure from Sony due to their presence at fanfest due to Dust, they are a company after all and they'll do unjust things if it seems important enough for their business interests. I'm glad to hear that the other representatives are likely going to remain in contact with The Mitanni in spite of CCP's cowardice and I hope they will bring forth the interests of The Mitanni's constituents in their interactions with CCP.
Hopefully CCP's apparent fear of Sony and the gaming media will not result in a reduction to the harsh universe that made me stay around in Eve and brought so many of us here. We shall see soon enough! Do "Un Just" things? Un Just? Your'e glorious leader told people to force a man to kill himself, and you call CCPs' actions un just? News flash.. THE VERY EXISTENCE OF GOONSWARM IS UNJUST
I'm not sure how you got from Mitanni saying something that was definitely unjust, realizing this, and making amends to the best of his ability to "THE EXISTENCE OF GOONSWARM IS UNJUST!!1". CCP has failed to remove a player temp banned for RMTing from the CSM, and now removes Mitanni from the CSM, so it's pretty clear to me that while the ban may be fine, the boot from the CSM is a calculated move by CCP, likely under pressure from other entities.
Anyways, you are exactly the type of person I mentioned at the start of that post, so that's about as much of a reply as you're getting graced with.
I still maintain hope that CCP won't ruin the sandbox due to this event, as of now. We shall see. |
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
160
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:53:00 -
[828] - Quote
CCP saves face with Sony/Nvidia and the media while simultaneously disregarding 10058 players. Way to take all that effort you put into fanfest about listening to the community and flushing it down the commode. You just cant make this **** up. The irony is so massive, it needs a double sized version of whatever container that held The Mittani's ego to store it in. |
Kratisto
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:56:00 -
[829] - Quote
It is my fervent hope that the jita hellcamp is long, bloody, tear-stained and brings pubbies like Issler Dainze to great annoyance. the system will be lagged by the seemingly countless npc spawns of concord. Will ccp intervene? if so, then sony has assumed the role of CEO. |
Kozmic
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:56:00 -
[830] - Quote
Idiocy.
And even if he did resign as a CSM 6 member, the CSM 7 is something else - the cards are shuffled anew and there is no connection between the two.
Free Mittani! |
|
Kasumi Nakamoto
Treadstone71
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:57:00 -
[831] - Quote
Silly decision.
Remove leadership status if you must pander to the people who are clearly using this opportunity to settle old scores. Listening to players is one thing, jumping every time they say jump is another.
Also, can you judge personal actions on game rules? The guy was clearly inebriated, and he won't be the last person to say something idiotic while under the influence.
Re-instate him, he got 10,000 people interested enough to vote in an online game and for all his goonish behaviour was humble enough to apologise as soon as he realised his fault. D |
Kai Pirinha
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:02:00 -
[832] - Quote
RDevz wrote:You've disenfranchised 10,058 voters. Good job. I hope you were speaking about that guy who got banned, and not CCP.
This is/was a totally unexceptable behaviour and he brought it all on himself. Blaming CCP for this is just plain ridiculous because they didn't choose to misbehave. It was the guys fault and I'm glad that CCP took such actions and that they made it clear, that CSM are not above "the law" (above the EULA/TOS).
If anybody is to blame, it's the guy himself!
It's bad luck for the voters who trusted him, but he abused their trust. |
Josefine Drake
ISK Liberation Legion
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:02:00 -
[833] - Quote
To anyone at CCP,
1. How is RL actions breaking a EULA/TOS?
2. You claimed to have seen and vetted the presentation and KNEW he was going to laugh at a particular character yet you are two faced about the entire thing and ban him.
3. He apologised, made restitution (isk), offered to step down from the chair and you still find a need to punish a democratically elected official?
Whom ever made this decision should lose their jobs at ccp. Worst customer service move ever.
|
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:03:00 -
[834] - Quote
Kratisto wrote:It is my fervent hope that the jita hellcamp is long, bloody, tear-stained and brings pubbies like Issler Dainze to great annoyance. the system will be lagged by the seemingly countless npc spawns of concord. Will ccp intervene? if so, then sony has assumed the role of CEO. I hope it is really long because that will be great for business. Start a corp and do it yourself. You'll fail, but you'll enjoy failing. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
Lock out
Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:06:00 -
[835] - Quote
New elections surely ?
Also, extending TOS/EULA to rl actions (granted actions that took place at a CCP event) is concerning to say the least.
In any case, Mittens for CSM 8 :) |
Beidorion eldwardan
Corporation Danmark Tactical Narcotics Team
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:06:00 -
[836] - Quote
one account down ( of mine ) 10 more to go
what to do with all that money im going to save.
this is even more ******** than the spacepants CCP. fix it or loose it.
hm... where is the door again... there it is.... im out... i wanted to and soe rude words... but best not to get the big bad ccp screwups to ban anymore accounts from cfc. |
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:18:00 -
[837] - Quote
Kasumi Nakamoto wrote:Listening to players is one thing, jumping every time they say jump is another. You mean that when CFC says "Nerf all Titans" that CCP shouldn't listen? Nice to know.
This post (In the sense of what it conveys, not necessarily the post itself) can't be quoted enough:
Kai Pirinha wrote:RDevz wrote:You've disenfranchised 10,058 voters. Good job. I hope you were speaking about that guy who got banned, and not CCP. This is/was a totally unexceptable behaviour and he brought it all on himself. Blaming CCP for this is just plain ridiculous because they didn't choose to misbehave. It was the guys fault and I'm glad that CCP took such actions and that they made it clear, that CSM are not above "the law" (above the EULA/TOS). If anybody is to blame, it's the guy himself!It's bad luck for the voters who trusted him, but he abused their trust.
The CFC were posting about "we voted, we have a voice" all the way through CSM6, now he disgraced you and you lost the voice you voted for. You could've voted for someone who wouldn't disgrace you. So far, all my 4 votes are represented. |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:29:00 -
[838] - Quote
Wow, this is just saturated with big, salty Goon/Goon alt tears. Allow me to pull a Shyamalan for a moment...
What a twist! |
Ishihiro tanaka
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:34:00 -
[839] - Quote
Well, here we go again, after 9 years of seeing this tidal wave come and go, it never get old :) Let's see where we end up this time shall we? |
Camios
Minmatar Bread Corporation
83
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:41:00 -
[840] - Quote
But isn't the mittani a "manipulative bastard"? I know all this is part of his plan and he'll come back stronger than before.
It sucks to be the mittani. It sucks to be goon. But sometimes, just in some well defined situations, you must behave. Internet spaceships are serious businness... the mittani didn't take it as seriously as he should have done.
If CCP let him stay, the image of EVE would be hit really hard. Mittani, why were you so stupid? I was starting to like you. |
|
OutCast EG
Very Industrial Corp. Legion of xXDEATHXx
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:46:00 -
[841] - Quote
So i see nothing new here, just CCP shooting itself in the leg again. |
Kara Balveda
EVE University Ivy League
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:48:00 -
[842] - Quote
SuperBeastie wrote:hold a new election or reinstate mittens. ~10058~ people agree with me.
More than that. I did not vote for The Mittani, knowing that Goons' votes would be enough to make him chairman, but instead voted my CEO into CSM7. Regardless, my reaction to CCP Navigator's post was a quick succession of denial, anger, bargaining, and depression. Acceptance just won't come.
Mittens should not be chairman of CSM7 after this. But he accepted that and acted on it, in a responsible way. In the meantime, CCP showed that they still suck big time.
What a pity. Crucible was a step in the right direction, Inferno was looking promising. Hell, I even wanted to do a Po2 and get me a second account on Saturday. But now, CCP is clearly back in Incarna mode, making very bad decisions under self-inflicted time pressure, not caring for the players' opinions, resulting in rage quits again. I hate it when it comes to forum whining like this post and rage quits like all the others I just read.
I expect that the people the players voted for are the people ending up as CSM, and that CCP does nt disenfranchise the 10.058 voters of a guy who got more voters than the next two people together. |
1Of9
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:53:00 -
[843] - Quote
Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. |
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:54:00 -
[844] - Quote
Kara Balveda wrote:I expect that the people the players voted for are the people ending up as CSM, and that CCP does nt disenfranchise the 10.058 voters of a guy who got more voters than the next two people together. I would expect that as well, so I wouldn't be too nice to my representative if he ruined my chance of being represented.
The Mittani got himself into this mess. He disenfranchised the 10.058 voters, if they really are disenfranchised (The CSM7 posts in this thread hints in another direction). He got elected with a clear mandate - who wouldn't call roughly 17% of the votes a mandate in cases like this? - and he screwed it up. He did apparently not think enough of that mandate to behave properly. He did not think enough of those 10.058 who voted for him to represent them.
And yet you're angry at CCP? |
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:55:00 -
[845] - Quote
stop being naive and keep ranting about the 10k votes
the elected abused it he took it too far he can't take alcohol he breaks your trust he crossed the line between a video game and real life he was naive enough to think a forum apology will play well he's naive enough to think that 10 billion virtual currency will buy his way out he f'ed up CCP's PR image he f'ed up other players' effort trying to bring Eve to more wider audience he f'ed up your vote he is filled with anger, fear, hate in his new speech that he actually didn't see all this coming he has't learnt a thing he's just another politician he need to get himself and pets to actually really distinguish what RL and game life are and don't get too attached to a video game like they've shown to everyone else.
30 days ban is too generous
|
Zloco Crendraven
BALKAN EXPRESS
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:02:00 -
[846] - Quote
I see lots of ppl stopping. Can i haz your stuff pls? This game will anyway be better without you, so pls dont look back. About Mittani, well he did behave very very badly and bad behavior deserves a punishment. Only fault for those 10k votes gone bad is your chairmans fault and its really ******** to put it on CCP. |
Florestan Bronstein
United Highsec Front The 99 Percent
490
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:04:00 -
[847] - Quote
Hecatonis wrote:Phigmeta wrote:So after reading very carefully through the entire EULA and TOS something occured to me.
His actions we outside of the game and since the statements we not on the forums.......
.......... the EULA / TOS does not apply.
This literally means that CCP .... your an idoit
thats like saying RMT is outside game because you dont use the eve client to send the money. the told people to use CCP tools to find, player search, and harass, eve mail, another player. CCP is well within their rights to temp ban him CCP reserves the right to perma-ban you for no special reason at all, so they are always "within their rights".
But that's not the question...
|
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
61
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:11:00 -
[848] - Quote
Sould be interesting to see how many, indeed if any Goons rage quit. This is not to have a go at the goonies - it would make more sense to stay in the game to exact revenge.
Mittens admitted that he did wrong, so CCP had to act.
He could have been perma banned, so really he got off 'relatively' lightly |
Zowie Powers
Hole in the wall
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:16:00 -
[849] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
I hope you are never forced to learn why you are wrong. |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:16:00 -
[850] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Sould be interesting to see how many, indeed if any Goons rage quit. This is not to have a go at the goonies - it would make more sense to stay in the game to exact revenge. Revenge on who?
The game is moving past the Goons, CCP fired the first serious shot at them today by banning Mittens.
The days of badass internet tough guys running Eve are going to come to an end. Sony is going to bring thousands of new players into the game as CCP goes mainstream. Those players aren't going to be interested in meta gaming, Reddit, 4Chan or Something Awful.
Start a corp and do it yourself. You'll fail, but you'll enjoy failing. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
|
Zowie Powers
Hole in the wall
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:18:00 -
[851] - Quote
The unhappy voters can just swallow it. They're not the first people in history to be duped by lacklustre fanatical leaders and they won't be the last.
You made a bad bet based on bad interpretation of available information sucks to be you etc. |
Beidorion eldwardan
Corporation Danmark Tactical Narcotics Team
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:25:00 -
[852] - Quote
please dont ban me for the following post. it is only ment as food for thought and not a rage post
why are we only talking about what mittani is to have done wrong.
but isnt it also a violation against the eula/tos to treaten with killing yourselves unless another stops some ingame action. ?
im just saying that its not fair that we ONLY see this from one side. it al started with a person( who if serious needs immeadiate proffession help and attension) claiming to end his own life unless people stop shooting his icemining boats.
the comments the mittens made where bad but how come we have degenerated into saying that the other dude okay...
stop blaming mittens for a drunken slipup you holi-holly's and ban the suicide pilot as well, at least for the amount of time the ccp paid doctor needs to fix the guy...
ccp - that iceminer is adicted to your product !!! how about repairing that damage instead of creating a huge problem over a slipup
and to ccp - you have a game that is somewhat good, stop mixing reallife into it |
Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
148
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:26:00 -
[853] - Quote
CCP, HTFU IRL.
|
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:26:00 -
[854] - Quote
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Sould be interesting to see how many, indeed if any Goons rage quit. This is not to have a go at the goonies - it would make more sense to stay in the game to exact revenge. Revenge on who? The game is moving past the Goons, CCP fired the first serious shot at them today by banning Mittens. The days of badass internet tough guys running Eve are going to come to an end. Sony is going to bring thousands of new players into the game as CCP goes mainstream. Those players aren't going to be interested in meta gaming, Reddit, 4Chan or Something Awful.
I am no fan of the Goons and their childish name calling - aspies - sperg etc, in fact I think CCP should ban the use of these insults. But, so long as they do not violate the eula etc thay are a part of the game.
The Goons have lost so much credibilty over this, that they may never recover.
They should look closer to home for the cause of their rage and ask themselves of mittens is a fit and proper person to lead them. |
Edward Olmops
Sirius Fleet Bringers of Death.
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:29:00 -
[855] - Quote
Reading the EULA/TOS closely again, I found this:
Quote:You may not abuse, harass or threaten another player or authorized representative of CCP, including customer service personnel and volunteers. This includes, but is not limited to: petitioning with false information in an attempt to gain from it or have someone else suffer from it; sending excessive e-mails, EVE-mails or petitions; obstructing CCP Employees from doing their jobs; refusal to follow the instructions of a CCP Employee; or implying favoritism by a CCP Employee
You may not use any abusive, defamatory, ethnically or racially offensive, harassing, harmful, hateful, obscene, offensive, sexually explicit, threatening or vulgar language. (Alternate spelling or partial masking of such words will be reprimanded in the same manner as the actual use of such words.)
I also watched this panel video where this Goonswarm guy made fun of former victims by reciting some hate/tearmails.
What does this chain of events now mean for ME? There is thousands of players all over new Eden, boasting and bragging, all those Websites about killmails. CCP emphasizing over and over again that the EVE universe is a harsh place and so on.. And then someone gets banned for not being nice to another player. Where EXACTLY is the red line he crossed? Mocking another player? Publishing this mail? Doing it on the fanfest? Not verifying that a specific player who was griefed does not have suicidical tendencies as some have indicated?
I perfectly understand that CCP might have a serious problem, a legal problem, if they do not condemn this behaviour.
But after all, the game itself does encourage conflicts and villains. Of course, I would never take this to a player-to-player level, but I strongly doubt that this counts for all 350k people in the game After being provoked, it now and then might happen that some furious player sends mails ingame that contain strong language And it will be impossible to decide what is meant or understood as a threat or insult to a character as opposed to a threat or insult to a player. And then?
Name him a fool. Petition. Ban? Sound metagaming.
I mean, seriously...
What exactly do you want the players to do?
I can only suggest to have a much more strict code of conduct for CSM members, but that won't solve everything.
Quote:You may not abuse, harass or threaten another player or authorized representative of CCP
The Mittani himself presented another mail in the same video where someone threatened to get him and send mercenaries after him if he does not turn over a supercap. What makes that a legal threat and the grief-the-miner-thing not? |
1Of9
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:30:00 -
[856] - Quote
1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future.
to pinpoint my claim:
http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdf
on page 20 it says, and i quote:
Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future. |
Orion GUardian
133
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:33:00 -
[857] - Quote
Great democracy guys...about nearly a quarter of all votes dismissed...
Whatever CCP, CSM is a scam now.....
Well thats what Eve is known for after all, scamming allowed! |
Inovy Dacella
Proper Villains
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:34:00 -
[858] - Quote
The Mittani did this to himself and he is now dealing with it.
The so called 1058 need to understand that votes do not make you unaccountable. Learn from your leaders mistake. Don't warship him. |
Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
148
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:34:00 -
[859] - Quote
1Of9 wrote: In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future.
Because, you less-than-average-intelligent mammal, it has nothing to do with EULA/TOS, but is an equivalent to an out-of-court settlement.
|
Sam McCausland
Pax Mortis Inc.
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:36:00 -
[860] - Quote
Funny how all the internet toughguys of goonswarm & pets, who do like to revel in their oh so mighty badassery by telling everyone else to "HTFU" and ~deal with it~ are crying worse than the hisec bears they so despise.
How about you maintain your absurd toughguy image, take your own advice and just ~deal with it~Gäó? You neckbeards are breaking character here and it's quite hilarious
Go ahead and unsuscribe, apart from the fact that (a) you won't go through with it and (b) CCP won't care, the rest of EVE surely will not miss you.
HTFU |
|
Tvaishk Suzuki
Long Night Industries Black Thorne Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:43:00 -
[861] - Quote
Thank you CCP for your quick action personaly I fully suport this action. and hope we can move on to premote eve in a more mature way.
As for all of you waveing your number of votes around and bashing ccp for this please....
While I agree we could now do with a reopening of elections, all the crys of "WHAT ABOUT MY VOTE" are pathetic.
Infact going on about this is just makeing things worse, I've looked though just about every news site that has mentioned this incedent and the comments are almost all negative in terms of the eve comumity as a whole, because of your insesant wineing and being dicks about this.
He was in the wrong and got the punishment he was due, if you can't deal with it get out the fire.
This is eve HTFU! |
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:51:00 -
[862] - Quote
Some of you really need to wake up and smell the roses.
When Alexander stepped out of the game and made a statement that potentially could have had serious indeed fatal consequenses he did more than simply make a tasteless joke.
Freedom of speech is not an absolute right nor is it wiothout consequenses. The first ammendment does not apply in Europe and Iceland. EU/Icelandic law is very very very clear,
You have the right to express your opinions, culture, faith you do not have the right to harrass, discriminate against or offend.
What Alexander did in Iceland was not merely in bad taste, it was not merely the product of a petty mind without the intellegence to understand the implications of what he was saying.
What he did was more than a slight faux pas. He chose to make statements that could potentially endanger someones life. He encouraged others in a course of action that could have endangered sombodys life. He has to understand his responsibility in this.
What he did may be viewed in america as tasteless and unintellegent, under EU/Icelandic law it is potentially illegal. Let me paint a scenario for you, had sombody taken that joke and decided to do somthing about it and the worst had happened and the guy was from a EU country then Alexander would have faced a civil and criminal court case. There are multiple cases including high profile ones in the last week where people have been charged tried sentenced and jailed for drunken crass behaviour on the internet.
YOu can express yourself in game to a toon and as a toon how you wish, when you take that behaviour into the real world there are consequenses.
So US players who think its an apalling limit on peoples civil liberties and us Europeans are crazy well, we dont have guns allowed in our society for people to carry around, hows that working out for you? |
Tessle Aesis
DECIMA LEGIO Yulai Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:56:00 -
[863] - Quote
EULA/TOS are for CSM too, not only for us all, if a CSM did a violation it's right to take any possible actions to punish him as well. |
Captain Warp
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:59:00 -
[864] - Quote
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Sould be interesting to see how many, indeed if any Goons rage quit. This is not to have a go at the goonies - it would make more sense to stay in the game to exact revenge. Revenge on who? The game is moving past the Goons, CCP fired the first serious shot at them today by banning Mittens. The days of badass internet tough guys running Eve are going to come to an end. Sony is going to bring thousands of new players into the game as CCP goes mainstream. Those players aren't going to be interested in meta gaming, Reddit, 4Chan or Something Awful. I am no fan of the Goons and their childish name calling - aspies - sperg etc, in fact I think CCP should ban the use of these insults. But, so long as they do not violate the eula etc thay are a part of the game. The Goons have lost so much credibilty over this, that they may never recover.
Our credibility backbone... |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:01:00 -
[865] - Quote
Captain Warp wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:Sould be interesting to see how many, indeed if any Goons rage quit. This is not to have a go at the goonies - it would make more sense to stay in the game to exact revenge. Revenge on who? The game is moving past the Goons, CCP fired the first serious shot at them today by banning Mittens. The days of badass internet tough guys running Eve are going to come to an end. Sony is going to bring thousands of new players into the game as CCP goes mainstream. Those players aren't going to be interested in meta gaming, Reddit, 4Chan or Something Awful. I am no fan of the Goons and their childish name calling - aspies - sperg etc, in fact I think CCP should ban the use of these insults. But, so long as they do not violate the eula etc thay are a part of the game. The Goons have lost so much credibilty over this, that they may never recover. Our credibility backbone...
Precisely |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:07:00 -
[866] - Quote
You morons say "10,058" like it's a large number. Do you even realize how many of those votes were probably alts? Do you know how many votes Obama alone received in the US 2008 presidential election? 69,456,897 votes. 52.92% of all of the voters in the third most populated country in the world. Kinda puts things into perspective, huh?
If Obama went live and told everyone in the US to feel free to call/mail/message a specific person and tell them to kill themselves, do you really think he would still be in office for much longer?
Most of you won't un-sub. Of the ones who do, I'm sure many, if not most, will inevitably re-sub. If you don't, good riddance.
Why don't you try looking at it conversely? Out of 59,109 votes cast, Mittani only received 10,058. That means 49,051 votes were NOT for Mittani. 83% of the votes/voters did NOT want Mittani for CSM. So while you're all bitching about how all 10,058 of you wanted Mittani to be CSM, consider the fact that the other 49,051 of us don't give a **** about what you think.
Math rules. |
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:09:00 -
[867] - Quote
Why is Mittens not posting in this thread?
oh wait..... |
Akrasjel Lanate
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
674
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:13:00 -
[868] - Quote
Mashie Saldana wrote:The funny thing is, CCP didnt force Mittens to resign and invalidate the votes.
He did that himself. Well said, sir. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1325
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:16:00 -
[869] - Quote
1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. to pinpoint my claim: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfon page 20 it says, and i quote: Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future.
This right here.
If he is allowed to campaign again for CSM, this whole shitstorm will be reactivated with a vengeance. There will be plenty of players making sure that happens. The press will be notified, players will rebel and basically CCP will have another load of bad PR heaped upon them again.
CCP needs to stand by their own rules no matter how many players threaten to rage quit. If they do quit, good riddance.
|
Thebriwan
LUX Uls Xystus
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:17:00 -
[870] - Quote
Well handled CCP!
There is no excuse for doing a drunken stunt at an official life streamed panel.
I regret that we lost a good speaker of the CSM - but personal attacks at a player can't be justified in any way. |
|
Norian Lonark
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:17:00 -
[871] - Quote
Mittens didn't get my vote and he wont in the future but I I disagree with the decision.
CCP previewed the slides so they were OK with the content that was shown. Obviously the presentation was going to be having a laugh and mocking what was up there. CCP also allowed for drinking to go on on the stage and allowed for questions to a drunk panel. I ask myself why they did this and the answer... because people were just getting drunk, being stupid and having a laugh.. nothing too evil or life threatening about that.
During the presentation the other CSM representatives and alliance members were laughing, so if Mittens is accountable then everyone up there on the stage should be accountable as well. No one stepped forward to protest and plead for players not to harass anyone as it was a life or death situation. The CCP representative on stage also said nothing and I understand why no one said anything because it was a joke(yes in poor taste).
This has been an example of the mob mentality at best and has really seemed like a witch hunt from the start. I suspect a large majority of protesters haven't even watched the alliance video, and the player in question wasn't made aware until the mob had caused the storm on the forums and contacting all the gaming press about this terrible incident where a player was driven to suicide.
This was a silly joke made by a drunk nerd in a wizard hat having a laugh with lots of other drunk nerds which has been blown out of all proportion and I am 100% sure that much worse gets said in game and on voice-comms each and every day.
Mittens has publicly and personally apologised, feels bad what he said and that he upset someone as well as give a large isk donation to the player in question, this IMO should have been sufficient. |
Jowen Datloran
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
372
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:17:00 -
[872] - Quote
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:The funny thing is, CCP didnt force Mittens to resign and invalidate the votes.
He did that himself. Well said, sir.
Amazing how such a crucial point can be missed by so many people. Mr. Science & Trade Institute, EVE Online Lorebook-á |
Kai Pirinha
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:22:00 -
[873] - Quote
Jowen Datloran wrote:Akrasjel Lanate wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:The funny thing is, CCP didnt force Mittens to resign and invalidate the votes.
He did that himself. Well said, sir. Amazing how such a crucial point can be missed by so many people.
It's also amazing that he seems to have accepted that he misbehaved while his fellows and followers (and goon pets :D) don't...
If you are a true follower, keep following him and accept it!
Or in other terms: deal with it. (That really can't be said enough!) |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:23:00 -
[874] - Quote
Norian Lonark wrote:Mittens didn't get my vote and he wont in the future but I I disagree with the decision.
CCP previewed the slides so they were OK with the content that was shown. Obviously the presentation was going to be having a laugh and mocking what was up there. CCP also allowed for drinking to go on on the stage and allowed for questions to a drunk panel. I ask myself why they did this and the answer... because people were just getting drunk, being stupid and having a laugh.. nothing too evil or life threatening about that.
During the presentation the other CSM representatives and alliance members were laughing, so if Mittens is accountable then everyone up there on the stage should be accountable as well. No one stepped forward to protest and plead for players not to harass anyone as it was a life or death situation. The CCP representative on stage also said nothing and I understand why no one said anything because it was a joke(yes in poor taste).
This has been an example of the mob mentality at best and has really seemed like a witch hunt from the start. I suspect a large majority of protesters haven't even watched the alliance video, and the player in question wasn't made aware until the mob had caused the storm on the forums and contacting all the gaming press about this terrible incident where a player was driven to suicide.
This was a silly joke made by a drunk nerd in a wizard hat having a laugh with lots of other drunk nerds which has been blown out of all proportion and I am 100% sure that much worse gets said in game and on voice-comms each and every day.
Mittens has publicly and personally apologised, feels bad what he said and that he upset someone as well as give a large isk donation to the player in question, this IMO should have been sufficient.
So if I got drunk one day and punched you in the face, you'd be okay with it because I'm not responsible for my actions while drunk, right? Right??? Surely I shouldn't be punished for this. If you got drunk and received a DUI, would you blame the alcohol or yourself? I didn't do it, the alcohol did! Have you ever heard of drinking in moderation? In terms of maturity, it's how you can tell the adults from the children. |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
196
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:24:00 -
[875] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog.
Due to ccp not being able to moderate events or even pre-screened material. |
Lisatrommi
Perkone Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:25:00 -
[876] - Quote
After all this time and all the crap Goons have pulled, the huge amounts of rage tears in this thread are utterly delicious
Some great points have been made, specifically regarding his *VOLUNTARY* rejection of the CSM7 Chair. CCP didn't force that, he did it himself
Also, 10,000 votes, out of ~60k votes. Big whoop. As was mentioned, that means ~49k other people *didn't* want him on CSM, much less as the Chairman
Please, do continue the crying though. I'm enjoying it immensely, and I'm certainly not the only one
Thank you CCP, for not making exceptions. |
Norian Lonark
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:26:00 -
[877] - Quote
Chicken Pizza wrote:
So if I got drunk one day and punched you in the face, you'd be okay with it because I'm not responsible for my actions while drunk, right? Right??? Surely I shouldn't be punished for this. If you got drunk and received a DUI, would you blame the alcohol or yourself? I didn't do it, the alcohol did! Have you ever heard of drinking in moderation? In terms of maturity, it's how you can tell the adults from the children.
Where anywhere did I say him being drunk excused his actions or that he wasn't responsible for them? And also he didn't physically assault anyone did he. If a drunken idiot wearing a hat called me a name would I be bother about it? no.
|
John Maynard Keynes
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:32:00 -
[878] - Quote
Ivana Twinkle wrote:CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog. Due to ccp not being able to moderate events or even pre-screened material.
Its like all murderers being innocent due to police not being able to prevent those crimes. |
hioshi IV
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:33:00 -
[879] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. to pinpoint my claim: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfon page 20 it says, and i quote: Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future. This right here. If he is allowed to campaign again for CSM, this whole shitstorm will be reactivated with a vengeance. There will be plenty of players making sure that happens. The press will be notified, players will rebel and basically CCP will have another load of bad PR heaped upon them again. CCP needs to stand by their own rules no matter how many players threaten to rage quit. If they do quit, good riddance.
+1 here. I also want a explanation why CCP are not enforcing CSM regulation. |
Eve Carel
Northern Freight Unlimited Clockwork Pineapple
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:37:00 -
[880] - Quote
hioshi IV wrote: +1 here. I also want a explanation why CCP are not enforcing CSM regulation.
Because CCP are CCP, they can do whatever they want. |
|
John Zorg
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:39:00 -
[881] - Quote
nice work CCP, so after all that he has done to help save your game, one bad action gets him banned from the game and removed from the CSM. EVE-Online used to be a open game where no one cared because it is just that, a game.
Sociaty has totally lost it. To be completely honest, if I guy wants to kill himself because of a game then he should! We don't need attention seekers in this world.
Hint for next time: Leave it and let it just blow over. Instead you have just pissed off everyone that supports you.
I am no longer represented by the CSM.
Thank you CCP for being so childish about your game.
Question to CCP: Does the EULA extend beyond the game and services that CCP provides, even to EVE Fan Fest? |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:41:00 -
[882] - Quote
Norian Lonark wrote:Where anywhere did I say him being drunk excused his actions or that he wasn't responsible for them? And also he didn't physically assault anyone did he. If a drunken idiot wearing a hat called me a name would I be bother about it? no.
Nothing gets by you, eh?
Your post basically stated that because alcohol was allowed, anything that was said or done was acceptable as long as they were drunk and it was a joke. Mind if I quote? Of course you don't.
Norian Lonark wrote:CCP previewed the slides so they were OK with the content that was shown. Obviously the presentation was going to be having a laugh and mocking what was up there. CCP also allowed for drinking to go on on the stage and allowed for questions to a drunk panel. I ask myself why they did this and the answer... because people were just getting drunk, being stupid and having a laugh.. nothing too evil or life threatening about that.
First, the controversy in question is not with regards to the presentation. It is with regards to the comment he made AFTER the presentation. You know, the bit where he spelled out the player's character name and invited everyone to have a drunken ha-ha and tell him to go kill himself. But according to your quote right above this, it's alright to tell someone to kill themselves, but ONLY if you're drunk and think it's funny.
There's nothing evil or life-threatening about someone getting drunk and joyriding around town - until someone dies. |
Smarty James
Heimr BLACK-MARK
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:44:00 -
[883] - Quote
Norian Lonark wrote:Mittens didn't get my vote and he wont in the future but I disagree with the decision.
CCP previewed the slides so they were OK with the content that was shown. Obviously the presentation was going to be having a laugh and mocking what was up there. CCP also allowed for drinking to go on on the stage and allowed for questions to a drunk panel. I ask myself why they did this and the answer... because people were just getting drunk, being stupid and having a laugh.. nothing too evil or life threatening about that.
During the presentation the other CSM representatives and alliance members were laughing, so if Mittens is accountable then everyone up there on the stage should be accountable as well. No one stepped forward to protest and plead for players not to harass anyone as it was a life or death situation. The CCP representative on stage also said nothing and I understand why no one said anything because it was a joke(yes in poor taste).
This has been an example of the mob mentality at best and has really seemed like a witch hunt from the start. I suspect a large majority of protesters haven't even watched the alliance video, and the player in question wasn't made aware until the mob had caused the storm on the forums and contacting all the gaming press about this terrible incident where a player was driven to suicide.
This was a silly joke made by a drunk nerd in a wizard hat having a laugh with lots of other drunk nerds which has been blown out of all proportion and I am 100% sure that much worse gets said in game and on voice-comms each and every day.
Mittens has publicly and personally apologised, feels bad what he said and that he upset someone as well as give a large isk donation to the player in question, this IMO should have been sufficient.
Agree with Norian
|
Kai Jyokoroi
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:48:00 -
[884] - Quote
Also everything that has happened here is not regrettable, it's god-damn hilarious and you're all a bunch of whiny thin-skinned crybabies with an entitlement complex
except for that fact Mittens is literally receiving death threats over this in case you're too stupid to have spies on our forums |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:50:00 -
[885] - Quote
Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Chicken Pizza wrote:You morons say "10,058" Thank you for your searing political insight and mathematical calculations, Eve Online poster "Chicken Pizza"
Wa-hey! That's much more useful, contextual content in a post than I could ever have expected from a Goonswarm character. I must really have a knack for bringing out the good qualities in people.
You're welcome. |
Jallock
Death-To-Taxes
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:53:00 -
[886] - Quote
Tvaishk Suzuki wrote:Thank you CCP for your quick action personaly I fully suport this action. and hope we can move on to premote eve in a more mature way.
As for all of you waveing your number of votes around and bashing ccp for this please....
While I agree we could now do with a reopening of elections, all the crys of "WHAT ABOUT MY VOTE" are pathetic.
Infact going on about this is just makeing things worse, I've looked though just about every news site that has mentioned this incedent and the comments are almost all negative in terms of the eve comumity as a whole, because of your insesant wineing and being dicks about this.
He was in the wrong and got the punishment he was due, if you can't deal with it get out the fire.
This is eve HTFU!
Goon tears are best tears |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:54:00 -
[887] - Quote
According to the Dev Blog, Mittens has...foreited his right to serve on CSM7 |
Norian Lonark
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:57:00 -
[888] - Quote
Chicken Pizza wrote:Norian Lonark wrote:Where anywhere did I say him being drunk excused his actions or that he wasn't responsible for them? And also he didn't physically assault anyone did he. If a drunken idiot wearing a hat called me a name would I be bother about it? no.
Nothing gets by you, eh? Your post basically stated that because alcohol was allowed, anything that was said or done was acceptable as long as they were drunk and it was a joke. Mind if I quote? Of course you don't. Norian Lonark wrote:CCP previewed the slides so they were OK with the content that was shown. Obviously the presentation was going to be having a laugh and mocking what was up there. CCP also allowed for drinking to go on on the stage and allowed for questions to a drunk panel. I ask myself why they did this and the answer... because people were just getting drunk, being stupid and having a laugh.. nothing too evil or life threatening about that. First, the controversy in question is not with regards to the presentation. It is with regards to the comment he made AFTER the presentation. You know, the bit where he spelled out the player's character name and invited everyone to have a drunken ha-ha and tell him to go kill himself. But according to your quote right above this, it's alright to tell someone to kill themselves, but ONLY if you're drunk and think it's funny. There's nothing evil or life-threatening about someone getting drunk and joyriding around town - until someone dies.
No the point that I was making is that drunk people lose their inhibition, self control and judgement. The point is that maybe CCP should have took this into consideration if they were that that bothered about what was being broadcast and I am sure this unfortunate incident will change things in the future.
I at no point in the post said that everything was acceptable because they were drunk. And I think you are pushing it to try and say what happened is comparable to drink driving, but I guess everyone has a different opinion.
|
Sanche Tehkeli
Bionesis Technologies Electus Matari
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:00:00 -
[889] - Quote
Chicken Pizza wrote:You morons say "10,058" like it's a large number. Do you even realize how many of those votes were probably alts? Do you know how many votes Obama alone received in the US 2008 presidential election? 69,456,897 votes. 52.92% of all of the voters in the third most populated country in the world. Kinda puts things into perspective, huh?
If Obama went live and told everyone in the US to feel free to call/mail/message a specific person and tell them to kill themselves, do you really think he would still be in office for much longer?
Most of you won't un-sub. Of the ones who do, I'm sure many, if not most, will inevitably re-sub. If you don't, good riddance.
Why don't you try looking at it conversely? Out of 59,109 votes cast, Mittani only received 10,058. That means 49,051 votes were NOT for Mittani. 83% of the votes/voters did NOT want Mittani for CSM. So while you're all bitching about how all 10,058 of you wanted Mittani to be CSM, consider the fact that the other 49,051 of us don't give a **** about what you think.
Math rules.
Such fallacy is itching me. So, since you are the kind to argue with numbers, logic and math, at least do it right.
1. 1/7 of all cast votes were for the Mittani. It's a fact that cannot be denied. He came first of all candidates. As additional figure, this very candidate has more than 200% of cast votes than his first follower after him (2nd position is Two Step with 4,150 votes.)
2. 6/7 of all cast votes were for OTHER candidates, spread among them. You can never assert it is against a pick, always it is for pick. This is on the same ground as your own logic. To be able to tell "83% of the votes/voters did NOT want Mittani for CSM" (quoting you) you have to ask each individual voter of its intent. Again : 17% were for him, 83% were for (many) others. This is maths.
3. Parallel with RL is irrelevant. As always you should make parallels between things comparable in all aspects, or issue disclaimers and restrictions. This is argumentation. There are aspects in common between CSM elections and RL elections and things that are completely different. Voting system is different, result assessing is different... Etc.
4. If you don't agree, be constructive when you argue your point. You're posing and gave no useful information/argument.
EDIT:
If you want to counter someone running for an election, you could either do dirty tricks or compete. If you dislike having The Mittani as top result, make a campain of your own, join another candidate campaign.
TL;DR : compete to get someone else elected. |
Chantal Vermeer
Vermeer Trading Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:00:00 -
[890] - Quote
Gratz to CCP for a quick and adequate decision on this. I did not expect it and I'm pleasantly surprised. |
|
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics Bringers of Death.
700
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:06:00 -
[891] - Quote
I hope he set his training queue. |
Kai Jyokoroi
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:06:00 -
[892] - Quote
Chicken Pizza wrote:Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Chicken Pizza wrote:You morons say "10,058" Thank you for your searing political insight and mathematical calculations, Eve Online poster "Chicken Pizza" Wa-hey! That's much more useful, contextual content in a post than I could ever have expected from a Goonswarm character. I must really have a knack for bringing out the good qualities in people. You're welcome.
let me put in another way seeing as I'm not sure you understood the intent of my original post
you're a god-damned idiot |
Catho Sharn
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
26
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:11:00 -
[893] - Quote
While I don't have much to say here about Alex's situation, I hope CCP will use this incident as incentive to review CSM candidacy and position requirements and insure they're accurately reflected in CSM-related documentation available to the players and perhaps conduct a document reorg and cleanup.
|
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:12:00 -
[894] - Quote
Norian Lonark wrote:No the point that I was making is that drunk people lose their inhibition, self control and judgement. The point is that maybe CCP should have took this into consideration if they were that that bothered about what was being broadcast and I am sure this unfortunate incident will change things in the future.
I at no point in the post said that everything was acceptable because they were drunk. And I think you are pushing it to try and say what happened is comparable to drink driving, but I guess everyone has a different opinion.
I understand what you're saying, and I will agree to disagree on whether or not drunk driving is comparable. But we must all keep in mind that you are responsible for your actions, drunk or not. CCP isn't responsible for what you say while live, but they certainly reserve the right to punish you for it with regards to your precious spaceship game.
What was really broken here was the bond of trust between Mittani and CCP. CCP allows alcohol at Fanfest because they trust the participants to stay in line with certain rules, spoken or unspoken. On the internet, anonymity is effectively your shield when you make comments like that. But when you show up in person, that shield is gone, and your actions have consequences.
Sure, worse things have definitely been said in EvE. I've witnessed plenty of them. But the reason those people tend to go unpunished is because nobody reports them. That doesn't make it any less unacceptable.
If you can't maintain your alcohol intake and keep yourself at least somewhat decent, you don't deserve to have a beer in your hand, or a brain in your head. |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:15:00 -
[895] - Quote
Kai Jyokoroi wrote:let me put in another way seeing as I'm not sure you understood the intent of my original post
you're a god-damned idiot
Sarcastic AND condescending! What a card! |
decaneos
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:15:00 -
[896] - Quote
Midge Mo'yb wrote:**** this ****, you discard 20% of the voters in one swoop, an out of game action is not bound to the TERMS OF THE GAME SERVICE
Im sorry but your postion in any elected position does not give you the right to break the law, if Barrack obama broke the law he would be impeached and removed from office, this is no different, he clearly broke the terms and agrements of the game and he has been punished for it, if anyone actually had any respect for the democratic process then they wouldnt be complaining at all.
Or do you wish one rule for them and another for me to start just cuase your CSM, just cuase you were elected to this possition does not mean you are better than us.
i also note ,tho it seems no one read, that he RESIGNED and FORFITTED these words are not as you seem to think REMOVED and BANNED from CSM so until we hear a youtube vid from mittens saying he didnt resign and was infact removed i think you should keep quite. |
Xander Blackwell
Blackwell Industries IMPERIAL LEGI0N
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:20:00 -
[897] - Quote
CCP you made a mistake. Everything you did was correct EXCEPT removing Alex from CSM 7. Let me make this clear. Not a fan of Mittani. But the man in CSM is a different man in some ways. And I think in a lot more ways after the horror of seeing what he had done. I really hope you look again at this decision as its a mistake and will effect eve in a bad way.
I agree with the ban, I agree with taking his chair....Kicking him from CSM.... bad move. All of this is my opinion only and does not represent the opinion of my corp/alliance/sober self.
p.s I didn't vote for him. Not a goon fan. Just someone who hates to see good democracy go to waste.
|
AfroOfDoom
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:24:00 -
[898] - Quote
See you in Jita. ~10,058~ |
ctx2007
Wychwood and Wells
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:24:00 -
[899] - Quote
For all the ones quitting EVE in protest.
Can I have your stuff?
|
Jax Mones
Barr Heavy Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:28:00 -
[900] - Quote
See you in jita
~10,058~ |
|
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:28:00 -
[901] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:I hope he set his training queue.
implying Mittens logs in...at all. |
Zalifer Esepula
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:29:00 -
[902] - Quote
CCP I love you, but this is a mistake.
I hope you fix this ASAP. He stepped down as CSM 7 Chair, but there should be no problem with him being on the CSM. He was the leading candidate.
Creating a position that is voted for by players and then just taking away the person voted for is a breach of our trust and respect. I understand that there was some bad media, but this is something that is going to look even worse for the people who matter, the people who play the game. Who cares if some soccer mom thinks EVE is evil, she didn't subscribe anyway. Anyone who plays EVE wants real player elected CSM, and 10058 of them want The Mittani. |
Dirk Decibel
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:30:00 -
[903] - Quote
Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Also everything that has happened here is not regrettable, it's god-damn hilarious and you're all a bunch of whiny thin-skinned crybabies with an entitlement complex
Indeed, been a while since I had such a good laugh at Goons. Thanks Mittens!
|
Rihanna Hawksworthy
Street Birds
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:31:00 -
[904] - Quote
If 10 thousand votes have been lost because an EvE character has renaged on his responsibilities by his own actions, well oh my, isn't that just sweet. |
Katrina Bekers
Rim Collection RC Test Alliance Please Ignore
80
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:31:00 -
[905] - Quote
Nice that all the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
(This without any comment on the merit of the decision itself, the panel events, or anything related to loving/hating Goons. Just pointing out how rotten the woodwork should be, for these cockroaches to come crawling out of it.) << THE RABBLE BRIGADE >> |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
47
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:34:00 -
[906] - Quote
Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
(This without any comment on the merit of the decision itself, the panel events, or anything related to loving/hating Goons. Just pointing out how rotten the woodwork should be, for these cockroaches to come crawling out of it.)
Not empty quoting |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:38:00 -
[907] - Quote
Sanche Tehkeli wrote: Such fallacy is itching me. So, since you are the kind to argue with numbers, logic and math, at least do it right.
Scratch yourself. This is not an argument; it's an assertion. Like it or leave it. Actually, I do love circular discussion. Maybe I shall indulge.
Sanche Tehkeli wrote: 1. 1/7 of all cast votes were for the Mittani. It's a fact that cannot be denied. He came first of all candidates. As additional figure, this very candidate has more than 200% of cast votes than his first follower after him (2nd position is Two Step with 4,150 votes.)
Irrelevant. Where's my easy button? I need to give it a push.
Sanche Tehkeli wrote:2. 6/7 of all cast votes were for OTHER candidates, spread among them. You can never assert it is against a pick, always it is for pick. This is on the same ground as your own logic. To be able to tell "83% of the votes/voters did NOT want Mittani for CSM" (quoting you) you have to ask each individual voter of its intent. Again : 17% were for him, 83% were for (many) others. This is maths.
You're either for or against something in a democratic vote. There is no undecided, unless you choose to abstain. It's pretty black-and-white. If it's multiple choice, you are for ONE choice and against ALL others. If you deny that logic, I have nothing more to say to you.
Sanche Tehkeli wrote:3. Parallel with RL is irrelevant. As always you should make parallels between things comparable in all aspects, or issue disclaimers and restrictions. This is argumentation. There are aspects in common between CSM elections and RL elections and things that are completely different. Voting system is different, result assessing is different... Etc.
I don't know where people like you get off thinking that "real life" doesn't include what you say on the internet. Are you roleplaying right now, or are you speaking as yourself? Are the things you say to people online anonymous to you as well? If so, I'd highly suggest seeing a psychiatrist, as that sounds like a problem only drugs are going to solve.
Sanche Tehkeli wrote: 4. If you don't agree, be constructive when you argue your point. You're posing and gave no useful information/argument.
So far, 5 people have found my post useful enough to actually go out of their way to click the "like" button. I'd say that mildly exceeds yours thus far. I'd also say that makes you a hypocrite.
EDIT: Have you ever heard of the oral voting system, "yea or nay"? "Yea" means FOR. "Nay" means AGAINST. |
Smoking Blunts
ZC Industries Dark Stripes
217
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:40:00 -
[908] - Quote
Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
(This without any comment on the merit of the decision itself, the panel events, or anything related to loving/hating Goons. Just pointing out how rotten the woodwork should be, for these cockroaches to come crawling out of it.)
he did something very stupid and something had to be done. i think that him stepping down from the csm was the right action after a very foolish one, but the 30day ban is meaning less and a waste of time. CCP-áare full of words and no action. We will watch what they are doing, for now
|
Dirk Decibel
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:41:00 -
[909] - Quote
Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
Are you one of those rare ppl who still hold e-honor in high regards?
|
Irisandra T'Lavel
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:46:00 -
[910] - Quote
Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
(This without any comment on the merit of the decision itself, the panel events, or anything related to loving/hating Goons. Just pointing out how rotten the woodwork should be, for these cockroaches to come crawling out of it.) Some of us actually live in NPC coprs. I have no other toons in other corps...Is there something wrong with me for not mindlessly following the top few corps? Does that make my CSM votes worth less than yours? |
|
Zhade Lezte
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:47:00 -
[911] - Quote
Not particularly interested in feeding all the trolls with a clear agenda anymore.
I've said my piece, but let me extend a heartfelt thanks to Two Step for openly disagreeing with this decision and the many members of the CSM who consider this disenfranchisement a serious issue and something that needs to be discussed, of which I see several on the first page. Looking forward to hearing from you all as this discussion continues. |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics Bringers of Death.
701
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:47:00 -
[912] - Quote
You people are too short sighted. Within a year the ban will be long over and he'll be elected to CSM8 with well over 10058 votes as some sort of Eve troll folk hero. Stop crying, take it like Goons, plan your comeback. It's not like you haven't done it before. |
1Of9
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:49:00 -
[913] - Quote
1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. to pinpoint my claim: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfon page 20 it says, and i quote: Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future.
Bump |
Irisandra T'Lavel
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:50:00 -
[914] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:You people are too short sighted. Within a year the ban will be long over and he'll be elected to CSM8 with well over 10058 votes as some sort of Eve troll folk hero. Stop crying, take it like Goons, plan your comeback. It's not like you haven't done it before.
Dev Blog wrote:As per our policies, this candidate may be eligible to run at a later date subject to candidacy review. Maybe. Will he be eligible in a year? |
Dirk Decibel
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:51:00 -
[915] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:You people are too short sighted. Within a year the ban will be long over and he'll be elected to CSM8 with well over 10058 votes as some sort of Eve troll folk hero. Stop crying, take it like Goons, plan your comeback. It's not like you haven't done it before. I wonder if Mittens can be arsed to go for another term though. This turn of events would be extremely demotivating for most ppl. |
Marduua Damman
Damman Trading Co
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 10:56:00 -
[916] - Quote
I'm just just god-dammed amazed. - I thought the player base had more brains and compassion!
I've written about 4 replies describing how I feel about the majority of the comments here. Deleted them all and started again.
Perhaps bullet points will do
- GET SOME F__KING PERSPECTIVE!
- SUICIDE IS SERIOUS
- YOUR VOTES DON'T MATTER
M is living the consequences of his actions, and from what I can gather, he understands this too.
CCP has reacted well in the situation.
|
Diamonica Norya
University of Caille Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:10:00 -
[917] - Quote
Dirk Decibel wrote:Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
Are you one of those rare ppl who still hold e-honor in high regards?
In that case, he is also too mentally attached to the game and can't differentiate reality and virtual worlds like many of his fellow corp/alliance/coalition mates as well as their leader. |
Joss56
Kernel of War Goonswarm Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:16:00 -
[918] - Quote
10 058 bees after you.
BzzzZZZZZzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZ |
Sedilis
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:19:00 -
[919] - Quote
30 day ban fair enough Stepping down as chair is a good gesture Leaving CSM7? Way over the top...
I while I voted for Two Step, the CSM without Mittens will be greatly diminished. His ability to rally the council to speak with one voice helped get the game through its most difficult year in 2011. I hope this decision gets reversed because the players and CCP need you on this council. |
T'hena Kha'tek
Austudy The Welfare State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:39:00 -
[920] - Quote
Quote:10 058 bees after you.
Grow a spine would you and get your facts straight. There is only 8323 people in your alliance and out of the 123 corps under your umbrella, 3601 are under the gewns ticker. So even if all 8323 voted which is highly unlikey unless all corp's kick inactive members after 4-6 weeks your only looking at 2000-3000 active players based on a 1.8 vote per person with a few other alliances in CFC making up the numbers.
So No there is probably only 2-3k bumble bees and the rest are Pubbies arent they ? |
|
Maul555
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:44:00 -
[921] - Quote
Hey guys, great day for a thread, eh?... I just thought I would put in my 2 cents and say that I did not participate in CSM elections and this has little or no effect on me. That being said, Mittens did the right thing by stepping down as chairmen, but I think that throwing him off the CSM is a bit much. As someone else said, what did CCP think would happen when you put a bunch of professional assholes in one room, get them drunk, and put them on TV?
BTW, none of my statements should lead CCP to believe that cutting back on alcohol at fan fest would be a good idea... |
Merasa Tro
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:48:00 -
[922] - Quote
If (in the real world) I voted for a party or politician who ended up doing something stupid, and he resigned, my vote would be 'lost', its just the way democracy works.
Some random bloke I've never heard of would be put in as the replacement, or a vote might be forced, depends on your countrys rules on 'democary'.
I voted for a CSM delegate that didnt even get in, is my vote 'lost'? No.. Its the way the system works.
The same system works for CSM, time to find the rule book, or create a rule now based on this precident.. Its not like it could NEVER happen again. |
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
451
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:53:00 -
[923] - Quote
Eve isnt real life. Eve is Eve, dont try and make comparisons.
My opinion is that a total revote should take place. Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing. |
Lance Starfury
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:58:00 -
[924] - Quote
Good, all goons delete your accounts please
I will resubscribe 4 more accounts and entice the 100's of people I know to also come back to Eve. Thanks for doing the right thing CCP, GREAT work.
Of course, the best part is simply the IRONY of a goon being gooned :P When the shoe is on the other foot, it is not so funny is it. Hahahahahahahahahah to infinity!!!
love and wet sloppy kisses. |
Dirk Decibel
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:58:00 -
[925] - Quote
Rico Minali wrote:Eve isnt real life. Eve is Eve, dont try and make comparisons.
My opinion is that a total revote should take place.
Revote cuz of one delegate stepping down/being kicked out? Brotha plz.... |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1333
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:05:00 -
[926] - Quote
Aruken Marr wrote:Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
(This without any comment on the merit of the decision itself, the panel events, or anything related to loving/hating Goons. Just pointing out how rotten the woodwork should be, for these cockroaches to come crawling out of it.) Not empty quoting
Looks like you're really saying - Don't look at the 'Tracks Of My Tears'.
|
Sylvia Tran
Sylvia Tran's Transporation Services
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:09:00 -
[927] - Quote
hahahahahahahahahah |
Agonising Ecstacy
State War Academy Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:09:00 -
[928] - Quote
Mittens,
This only happened because you didn't have your Douche Canoe Protection Insurance. Avoid future costly errors, by depositing 10058 million isks into the wallet of Agonising Ecstacy. A certificate will be issued forthwith, indemnifying you against the costs of such blunders in the future.
Amidoinitrite?
|
Kai Pirinha
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:16:00 -
[929] - Quote
Sedilis wrote:His ability to rally the council to speak with one voice helped get the game through its most difficult year in 2011. That may well be the case, but this gives im no way the right to act in anyway as he did! And considering what he did, a 30 day ban is very, very, very generous.
I said it before and I'll say it again: he can be so lucky nobody's pressing charges against him, he'd end up in jail for the attempt to drive a person towards suicide and for abetting thousands (10.058?) of other people to do the same.
It's so sad to see that most of you goon pets don't realize what he has done.
At least he did realize it and stepped down (or maybe was forced to step down, who really cares, fact is he is gone and he is fine with it! Deal with it!) |
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
268
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:24:00 -
[930] - Quote
Joss56 wrote:10 058 bees after you.
BzzzZZZZZzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZ
What 10 058 votes? You mean 8,447 30 day alts/accounts made only for voting and the 1611 legitimate players votes?
http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=28529 What 10 058 votes? You mean 8,447-á30day alts/accounts made only for voting, and the 1611 legitimate players votes? data from: http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=28529 |
|
Vihura
Vihura Cor
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:27:00 -
[931] - Quote
Yeah less ******** brain dead goons zomibe is good for game. |
Swearte Widfarend
Mortis Noir. Ineluctable.
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:29:00 -
[932] - Quote
Last night I took the time to read the CSM White Paper, which justifies CCP's actions in the removal of The Mittani from CSM 6 and voiding his election in CSM 7.
However that does not resolve the outstanding issue of the 14 CSM members. The Mittani was removed from CMS 6 due to a EULA/TOS violation, which then precludes his ability to be on CSM 7. This action occurred prior to the engagement of CSM 7. I've been trying to recall a RL comparison, because this happened prior to the announcement of CSM 7 winners.
Frankly, I think the best option is for CCP to re-open the polls for those who have now been disenfranchised (and those who chose not to vote previously). Existing votes would stand as-is. CCP is changing ship skill trees. How ship skills should be |
John Zorg
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
59
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:29:00 -
[933] - Quote
Marduua Damman wrote:I'm just just god-dammed amazed. - I thought the player base had more brains and compassion! I've written about 4 replies describing how I feel about the majority of the comments here. Deleted them all and started again. Perhaps bullet points will do
- GET SOME F__KING PERSPECTIVE!
- SUICIDE IS SERIOUS
- YOUR VOTES DON'T MATTER
M is living the consequences of his actions, and from what I can gather, he understands this too. CCP has reacted well in the situation.
Suicide is serious yes... studies have shown that most victims of suicide never cry out publically, and those that do are mostly attention seekers. What happens in EVE stays in EVE, if you have a problem don't call out in public for help, go to someone you trust and that you know can help you. And to say it again, to shout "I am going to commit suicide" over a game... really... grow up.
I have been there so I know what it's really about.
CCP instead of just ignoring it and letting it blow over has over reacted, made it known to all and now there is a shitstorm over it. PR needs to learn when to do what...
Banning him yes I can understand that, but kicking him from the CSM, after he saved your game last year, that was the dumbest thing CCP did since the T20 saga... |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:35:00 -
[934] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:...
This unprecedented situation raises significant questions -- such as representation and disenfranchisement -- that CSM6 will be discussing with CCP and with the new members of CSM7 over the next few days. I think I can speak for everyone on CSM when I ask for your patience while we work through these issues. I voted for another candidate and feel fully represented on the CSM.
Prior to Fanfest, I was ambivalent about Gianturco's reign as CSM chairman. Goons will be goons, after all. Post Fanfest and having seen the video footage of the alliance panel circus, I have no interest in being represented by such a person.
For those who consider themselves to be disenfranchised, consider that it was their candidate's own words and actions which put himself into this position. Of their free will *cough* they put Gianturco into the position of CSM Chairman and he royally ****** it up. They have nobody to blame but themselves for this situation.
No matter how the situation is twisted, turned and muddied up by Goons and sycophantic CSM representatives such as yourself, it was Gianturco's RL actions which put his chairmanship at-risk.
Deal. With. It. 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284286 |
Kai Pirinha
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:38:00 -
[935] - Quote
John Zorg wrote:[quote=Marduua Damman]studies have shown that most victims of suicide never cry out publically, and those that do are mostly attention seekers. What happens in EVE stays in EVE, if you have a problem don't call out in public for help, go to someone you trust and that you know can help you. And to say it again, to shout "I am going to commit suicide" over a game... really... grow up.
I have been there so I know what it's really about.
CCP instead of just ignoring it and letting it blow over has over reacted, made it known to all and now there is a shitstorm over it. PR needs to learn when to do what...
Banning him yes I can understand that, but kicking him from the CSM, after he saved your game last year, that was the dumbest thing CCP did since the T20 saga... Great, try to downplay it all you want. Just another goons ... who cannot see what really happened and how serious this is.
Hey I got news for you, buddy, the guy you voted for and you are trying to defend has a different opinion about it than you. He accepted it and saw that he was wrong. You don't.
So you are even worse than him.
Can I haz your stuff when you quit? |
Alexandra Alt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
139
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:39:00 -
[936] - Quote
The funny thing is, this oh so tears makers, destroyers of our gameplay, griefers 24/7 and so on and so on, CRY like hell, and they sure are oh so fun to watch It's awesome.
The guy in the fault already admitted his fault, is the only one man enough to HTFU and take responsibility for his actions, move on, and use all this as fuel, all the other drones were just programmed to cry on their latest update !! |
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers Galactic-Rangers
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:43:00 -
[937] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 Goons and Goon Alts that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
FYP
|
John Zorg
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
59
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:48:00 -
[938] - Quote
Kai Pirinha wrote:[quote=John Zorg][quote=Marduua Damman]studies have shown that most victims of suicide never cry out publically, and those that do are mostly attention seekers. What happens in EVE stays in EVE, if you have a problem don't call out in public for help, go to someone you trust and that you know can help you. And to say it again, to shout "I am going to commit suicide" over a game... really... grow up
I have been there so I know what it's really about
CCP instead of just ignoring it and letting it blow over has over reacted, made it known to all and now there is a shitstorm over it. PR needs to learn when to do what..
Banning him yes I can understand that, but kicking him from the CSM, after he saved your game last year, that was the dumbest thing CCP did since the T20 saga...[/quote Great, try to downplay it all you want. Just another goons ... who cannot see what really happened and how serious this is
Hey I got news for you, buddy, the guy you voted for and you are trying to defend has a different opinion about it than you. He accepted it and saw that he was wrong. You don't
So you are even worse than him
Can I haz your stuff when you quit?
He admitted that he did wrong, which is good right? And how am I downplaying it? What is serious about it?
Either you are new to the game and therefore you have less of an idea about the history or you havn't got the common decency to post with a main. Hide behind a alt. Real pro of you.
Based on that alone your comments are invalid.
And no, I have no stuff... |
cap Mal
Defense Advanced Research Program Agency
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:53:00 -
[939] - Quote
HTFU Goons. This is not your game. Vote for him next time and deal with the fact that the world has consequences. |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:54:00 -
[940] - Quote
Just a reminder, since the dev blog is twistingly worded and some people seem a bit off. Mittens resigned the chairmanship willingly. Being removed from CSM7 was not his choice. Carry on with your arguing. |
|
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
54
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:54:00 -
[941] - Quote
I love it this is all absolutely hilarious. As if any of theis means anything of importance in the long run. Melodramatic drivel from basement dwelling fools:
"Jita is gonna Burn"
"The beginning of the end of EVE"
"Bla bla bla"
You couldn't make this **** up....
Hilarious.... |
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:58:00 -
[942] - Quote
I am reasonably certain I could make this all up.
Hell, I'm making it up now as I go along. |
Captain Thunk
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:58:00 -
[943] - Quote
10,058 Goons and Goon Alts should've split their vote, if Mitanni's ego would have allowed it.
That way you have a spare representative incase one chokes to death on his own foot (ingame)
Mitanni's Hubris has taken Goons out of the political arena for the next year. I am however pleased to see Goons return to their roots. |
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 12:59:00 -
[944] - Quote
Doc Severide wrote:I love it this is all absolutely hilarious. As if any of theis means anything of importance in the long run. Melodramatic drivel from basement dwelling fools:
"Jita is gonna Burn"
"The beginning of the end of EVE"
"Bla bla bla"
You couldn't make this **** up....
Hilarious....
BOLD TEXT GUYS, BOLD TEXT, WE GOT A BADASS OVER HERE |
SolusLunes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:00:00 -
[945] - Quote
Captain Thunk wrote:10,058 Goons and Goon Alts should've split their vote, if Mitanni's ego would have allowed it.
That way you have a spare representative incase one chokes to death on his own foot (ingame)
Mitanni's Hubris has taken Goons out of the political arena for the next year. I am however pleased to see Goons return to their roots.
Nobody else wanted a CSM seat.
But rest assured, Lyris Nairn and I will campaign for CSM9: Sky Captains of your Heart. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:01:00 -
[946] - Quote
Valryon wrote:How do you ban someone for something they did outside your game? That's messed up.
NEWSFLASH
1 CCP can ban anyone if they want
2 he used INGAME material t harass an INGAME player calling for INGAME actions
CSM are expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM |
Zixie Draco
Tactical Knightmare
108
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:04:00 -
[947] - Quote
..I tried to tell you all to vote for Skippermonkey. Yep I did. Would you like a kitten? |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
168
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:13:00 -
[948] - Quote
Hi,CCP Spitfire brought me here. |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics Bringers of Death.
702
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:13:00 -
[949] - Quote
There is a good point being talked about in the SA forums -- and maybe it's been brought up in the last 47 pages but I'm not going to read them all.
Why should CCP be able to punish players for out of game actions?
No I'm not sure it entirely applies in Mittens' case but it is a good question. Should CCP really be able to enforce EULA on its players outside of the game? If you encourage players to harass someone outside the game and they take it inside the game, then shouldn't the punishment be directed soley at those committing the in-game rule violation?
Obviously players are punished for RMT which is an out of game act - though clearly the bots or macros that generate the isk are violating the rules and those accounts should be banned. And you could argue that isk generated by way of rule violations is invalid. But should CCP be able to punish you because you paid someone money outside the game and they gave you isk in game? What if that isk wasn't generated with a bot account?
How far does this go? I remember when Helecity was banned because he leaked an internal CCP memo. But he didn't do it on the CCP forum - he did it on his own website. Why was his action outside the game be punished? Should it have been?
I guess it all boils down to - shouldn't EULA only be enforced for acts committed on CCP servers where the players agreed to the EULA? |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:19:00 -
[950] - Quote
John McCreedy wrote:From the TOS: Quote: If you are between 13 and 18 years of age, you must have the permission of your parent or guardian to before providing the personal information required to create an EVE Online game or website account.
Not to excuse what was said but how about some responsibility accepted for the debacle by CCP for allowing the presentation participants to get blind drunk before going "on air"? CCP's actions where hardly responsible when 13 year old kids (well below the legal drinking age in many countries) where able to legally access the live feed but where subjected to constant references to the glorification of irresponsible drinking, therefore CCP need to issue an apology for their part in this and review their policies towards these issues before the next Fanfest.
read the devblog they already said that FF will never be the same , sadly , because of one adult that couldnt handle alk What a lot of goon need to realise is that its not because we hate you that we do these things Its because WE LOVE YOU |
|
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics Bringers of Death.
702
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:21:00 -
[951] - Quote
Lt Pizi wrote:
as long as you use any CCP property CCP is involved and they have the right to deny you acess to their sevice at any point without refund or discussion
easy as that
get that into your head
Sure, they have a right to. The question is - should they be banning people for actions committed out of game? |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
50
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:28:00 -
[952] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
as long as you use any CCP property CCP is involved and they have the right to deny you acess to their sevice at any point without refund or discussion
easy as that
get that into your head
Sure, they have a right to. The question is - should they be banning people for actions committed out of game?
in the case we are discussing now absolutely other cases may differ
What a lot of goon need to realise is that its not because we hate you that we do these things Its because WE LOVE YOU |
Catho Sharn
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:33:00 -
[953] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
as long as you use any CCP property CCP is involved and they have the right to deny you acess to their sevice at any point without refund or discussion
easy as that
get that into your head
Sure, they have a right to. The question is - should they be banning people for actions committed out of game?
Pure speculation on my part, but the presentation was live-streamed via the Eve site, which is covered by the EULA/TOS. I suspect that's their reasoning.
|
Henry Haphorn
Aliastra Gallente Federation
272
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:34:00 -
[954] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:Lt Pizi wrote:
as long as you use any CCP property CCP is involved and they have the right to deny you acess to their sevice at any point without refund or discussion
easy as that
get that into your head
Sure, they have a right to. The question is - should they be banning people for actions committed out of game?
You have to look at it from a business and legal perspective. Remember that CCP, Nvidia and Sony are in a partnership and on-air incidents like this can potentially derail the relationship since all this happened on CCP's watch and considering that almost all of the major gaming websites caught wind of this incident that has resulted in a PR nightmare for CCP. This is not what they had in mind when they hosted Fanfest 2012 especially considering the up-coming release of Dust 514 which will expand CCP's player base which could potentially be easily turned away by debacles like this. Welcome to Eve Online. Don't expect people to be nice to you. |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics Bringers of Death.
702
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:34:00 -
[955] - Quote
Maybe I'm miswording things here. I don't really have a problem with CCP punishing Mittens since this did take place at a CCP hosted event and I think they had to do it for their own legal protection. But to claim that this was covered by the EULA is the part that I find totally bizarre.
Taken as a unique case, maybe the banning is warranted because it could have endangered a player. But this shouldn't become a trend. What I or anyone else say out of game shouldn't be subject to EULA violations.
If Mittani went on TV and said "I play The Mittani on Eve Online and I hate Brutors because they're space negroes" would that be bannable as well? |
Temulkar Blaine
Liberation Army BricK sQuAD.
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:40:00 -
[956] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:There is a good point being talked about in the SA forums -- and maybe it's been brought up in the last 47 pages but I'm not going to read them all.
Why should CCP be able to punish players for out of game actions?
No I'm not sure it entirely applies in Mittens' case but it is a good question. Should CCP really be able to enforce EULA on its players outside of the game? If you encourage players to harass someone outside the game and they take it inside the game, then shouldn't the punishment be directed soley at those committing the in-game rule violation?
Obviously players are punished for RMT which is an out of game act - though clearly the bots or macros that generate the isk are violating the rules and those accounts should be banned. And you could argue that isk generated by way of rule violations is invalid. But should CCP be able to punish you because you paid someone money outside the game and they gave you isk in game? What if that isk wasn't generated with a bot account?
How far does this go? I remember when Helecity was banned because he leaked an internal CCP memo. But he didn't do it on the CCP forum - he did it on his own website. Why was his action outside the game punished? Should it have been?
Let's say you attended a KKK rally wearing an Eve Online t-shirt with your username. Would it be appropriate for CCP to ban you?
I guess it all boils down to - shouldn't EULA only be enforced for acts committed on CCP servers where the players agreed to the EULA?
What your not realising is that different countries have different laws on what is acceptable and legal on the internet. Drunken rants on the internet can get you jailed in the EU and Icelandic law is the same now that their appication to join the EU has been accepted.
Freedom of speech is not absolute it has consequenses. You are free to express opinion, culture and faith you are not free to threaten, harrass and bully. That is the line Alexander stepped over He is just damn lucky the consequenses werent a hell of a lot worse for him, the wiz and for eve as a whole. He should be thankful not indignant. |
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:41:00 -
[957] - Quote
Henry Haphorn wrote:Who is to say that those 10k+ players that voted for The Mittani had any clue that he was going to do something like this? Thankfully, I voted for Seleene. But let's assume for the sake of this argument what would have happen if it was Seleene, or any other elected member of the CSM for that matter, who was inebriated, wearing the wizard hat and told players to grief the miner to suicide himself in real life. I probably would've been outraged that my vote went to someone like that.
My point is, who are we to judge what those 10k+ voters had in mind when they voted for The Mittani? It is kind of the behaviour many have come to associate with GoonSwarm and the CFC (Even though this was a number of steps more than "usual"), so I honestly do not see the surprise that The Mittani went ahead and did it. When I saw the enormous margin that he had won by, I did expect a boat full of smugness from GSF and CFC. But my answer to this would rather be in the line of ... yeah, I'd be angry. I would be angry at whomever had wasted my vote saying stupid things while drinking himself/herself into a stupor. I would not first defend the actions, I'd demand the individual removed so he/she couldn't make more of a fool of me and anyone else who voted for him/her. I voted for two people who at least consider "my brand" of EVE as a part of their constituency, so I have a chance of having my voice heard at those two. If one of those screwed up this bad, I'd be infuriated with him and certainly not vote for him again. After all, I trusted him with my vote, my voice, and he did not care enough about it to think before drinking.
I can understand the voters who voted for The Mittani are angry - since hell yeah I'd be that as well! - but they're delivering the vast payload of anger the wrong place. Those who aren't CFC members should re-evaluate their voting strategy for the next election, since after all several CFC alliances have done or condoned things on the slippery slope to where we are now, and the CFC members who are infuriated should at least think and discuss what they think their outward people (Diplomats, executives or CSM members) say and do when they could carry the tarnished reputation alongside them home, or to their work as seen here. Those CFC members who think The Mittani is the martyr and that he was the wronged one in all this... well, you got what you voted for in my opinion. |
Tairon Usaro
The X-Trading Company RAZOR Alliance
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:41:00 -
[958] - Quote
Hopefully CCP and CSM7 will find a solution that fits.
It is difficult. Mittens as alliance leader did nothing wrong in his alliance presentation. Most of us did not like it and felt disgusted about it, but there was no sanctionable action in this presentation and it was roleplay. The thing went over top in the spontaneous Q&A session. And yes, it went not just slightly over the top, but really utterly bad. Alex should not have gotten this drunk, he certainly should not given out the name by any means. He did not find the line between his ingame role as alliance leader of a villainous alliance and the real life consequences of calling out for harresment of a specific player. It was a clear mistake and it needs to be sanctioned by CCP. Beside that, we are all humans and we do make mistakes.
But does that all connect to his work for CSM ?? My personal opinion is, that his knowledge about the game, his proven track record in prior CSM and the total absence of abuse his position as a CSM for the events that happend in the Alliance panel outweights his bad mistake as a drunken alliance leader.
Every real life democracy protects its elected representatives from legal sanctions for the time of their period. Yes, there are procedures to remove the legal immunity from a representative during his period of election, but in most cases this is tied to abuse of the power they got elected for and it has to be decided by a broad plenum, which usually comprises other elected representatives.
On the other side CCP/EVE is not a democracy and CSM is only a tool for CCP to source player feedback (and review some interal controll processes concering ingame abuse of knowledge by CCP employees).
Nevertheless, i hope for a solution, that makes use of Alexander Gianturco's knowledge and compassion about this game for the benefit of us all, but also makes clear, that he distended his roleplay as the Mittani over the limits of ethical acceptance by far. |
Henry Haphorn
Aliastra Gallente Federation
273
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:43:00 -
[959] - Quote
Jada Maroo wrote:Maybe I'm miswording things here. I don't really have a problem with CCP punishing Mittens since this did take place at a CCP hosted event and I think they had to do it for their own legal protection. But to claim that this was covered by the EULA is the part that I find totally bizarre.
Taken as a unique case, maybe the banning is warranted because it could have endangered a player. But this shouldn't become a trend. What I or anyone else say out of game shouldn't be subject to EULA violations.
If Mittani went on TV and said "I play The Mittani on Eve Online and I hate Brutors because they're space negroes" would that be bannable as well?
You're right, it shouldn't. But in this case, it was under CCP's watch. Therefore it was covered by the EULA/TOS. Welcome to Eve Online. Don't expect people to be nice to you. |
Care Bear King
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:44:00 -
[960] - Quote
A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players.
May as well scrap it and wait for CSM8. |
|
Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:48:00 -
[961] - Quote
Care Bear King wrote:A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players.
May as well scrap it and wait for CSM8. Then why did The Mittani not represent the players a bit better at the unscripted Q&A session where he asked other players to harass a player (Not character) so he would commit suicide? |
I Love Boobies
All Hail Boobies
80
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:48:00 -
[962] - Quote
It's funny that so many people are upset for CCP following their own policies. HE did something that broke the EULA/TOS and HE had to pay. He should feel lucky that he was only banned for 30 days, and not a lifetime ban. Don't blame CCP for HIS actions, HE did it himself. Blame HIM. It's HIS own fault.
I actually believe what happened is a good thing because it shows that CCP isn't playing favorites. They knew the GOONs would be upset, but went ahead anyway. I applaud CCP for being steadfast on their policies, and don't make exceptions for anyone.
( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o ) ( o Y o )
The world would be a better place if boobies ran the world instead of boobs. |
Rhaile Vhindiscar
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:50:00 -
[963] - Quote
Disband the sham CSM! Day 2 of the real CSM in exile! Viva la Revolution! |
lol fourm troll
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 13:57:00 -
[964] - Quote
Goons you owe everyone a taco!!!!!!!!!! |
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:00:00 -
[965] - Quote
SolusLunes wrote:Doc Severide wrote:I love it this is all absolutely hilarious. As if any of theis means anything of importance in the long run. Melodramatic drivel from basement dwelling fools:
"Jita is gonna Burn"
"The beginning of the end of EVE"
"Bla bla bla"
You couldn't make this **** up....
Hilarious.... BOLD TEXT GUYS, BOLD TEXT, WE GOT A BADASS OVER HERE No, my eyesight is bad. It helps me read my own posts...
And it's still all melodramatic crap... |
Katrina Bekers
Rim Collection RC Test Alliance Please Ignore
82
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:01:00 -
[966] - Quote
Dirk Decibel wrote:Katrina Bekers wrote:Nice that all most of the comments cheering up the CCP move come from characters in NPC corps.
Where are your balls, gentlemen?
Are you one of those rare ppl who still hold e-honor in high regards? No. That's why I post with my main.
And you? This is your main?
<< THE RABBLE BRIGADE >> |
Kmelx
Applied Creations The Fendahlian Collective
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:01:00 -
[967] - Quote
I know what this thread needs - moar goon/goonpet whining
I think he deserved some sort of sanction for his actions, most reasonable people recognise that he crossed a line. |
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:17:00 -
[968] - Quote
I applaud CCP for taking an affirmative, responsible and mature approach to resolving this matter. No one is above reproach, and no one persons contributions are so great as to warrant a pass for this sort of drunken, boorish, and offensive behavior
I have heard some members of the CSM not supporting this decision, and I am likewise disappointed, as you guys do not get it. Fanfest is a chance for CCP to speak about upcoming products and releases, show an appreciation for their players, and to celebrate what has already been achieved. This immature and disgusting episode robbed us all and CCP of that opportunity
As a result, many players have unsubscribed in their initial outrage, and the press was full of reports not of the upcoming release of Dust 514 and the like, but rather how once again EVE is not a good place to game, and CCP tacitly endorses griefing and bullying of the worst sort
Given that, and the extreme level of outrage over this event from many, many people in the player base, who do not see this incident as a trifle, there was not choice but to ban The Mittani for 30 days and have him tender his resignation. None of us knows whether The Mittani resigned completely of his own volition or under direction from CCP, but either way the result is the same The Mittani had to go.
To do otherwise on the part of CCP would have been a terrible business decision, and would have shown nothing but indifference the the legitimate outrage many people who play this game and financially support the continuation of EVE. Do not blame CCP but rather blame the Mittani and his own irresponsible behavior. None of us asked him to act the fool on the international stage. The Mittani did that all by himself. Now he has answered for it |
Silath Slyver Silverpine
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:22:00 -
[969] - Quote
Wow. The sheer amount of goon tears in this thread is fairly hilarious. Amazing how they love to call everyone a 'crybaby pubbie' but their candidate screws up, and they blame CCP? What?
Mittani screwed up, big time, in a very public manner. He wants to play at being a politician, it goes both ways. Consequently he was forced to 'take responsibility' for his actions. And everyone knows those 10k votes were a sham anyway. You don't have to pretend anymore.
Curious to see who the new chairman will be, and how that will be decided. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1773
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:22:00 -
[970] - Quote
Care Bear King wrote:A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players.
May as well scrap it and wait for CSM8.
The problem is a Mittani-led CSM6 didn't represent "the players" either. It represented a selection of nullsec voting blocs interests without really caring about the wider issues in the game. CSM6 was noteworthy for removing transparency and accountability from the CSM process (no more internal meeting minutes) for cloaking decision making behind committee head (we couldn't see who believed what) and for initially schmoozing with the MT devs when they should have been protesting Incarna.
Lets remember Mittani is infamous for getting drunk with CCP Monocle and telling him that the players of Eve would be cool with a "gold scorpion" purchased entirely with Aurum and no other input.
First formal summit CSM came home from Iceland with nothing but a badly written set of formal minutes (that took MONTHS to agree) and did nothing to answer player fears about Incarna whatsoever and would lead on to the release of possibly the worst "expansion" in Eve Online's history.
Rage happened and it was rage from the player base with the Jita Riots and beginning of the unsub protest.
During the "emergency summit" Mittens appeared on Eve TV with CCP thousand dollar jeans in a joint address assuring people it was all sorted and everyone was happy now. He came back from the summit with a Nevil Chamberlain-esq "peace in our time" paper that did absolutely NOTHING to mollify the rage and anger of the Eve player base.
Protests continued, threadnaughts continued, unsubs continued.
The only thing that turned the CCP ship around was the public Mea culpa from Hilmar and announcement of the crunch to Crucible and significant restructuring of the company.
Now in this I say to you that Alexander Gianturco as chair provided very POOR leadership and representation of the player base and didn't at any time have a full grasp of precisely what people were protesting about.
And of course then we had the christmas minutes which were another fiasco. Released late and indistinct, with the CSM being refered to as "the csm" (not individual reps) and being on record as anonymously saying some very stupid things about game development and priority.
Wormholes -what are they? FW -is for noobs isn't it? Hisec -lol carebears?
There was a player backlash and some of the rest of the CSM broke ranks with Gianturco and announced they had personally been "for" or "against" certain things to assure people they were not part of the collective.
What did Gianturco achieve?
I think his legacy is in removing transparency and accountability from the CSM and turning into a skype channel social club for nullsec alliance leaders to get their jollies from drinking in Iceland. He will be remembered as the guy who gave CCP Monocle the nod on MT delivery of spaceships, the guy that appeared with CCP thousand dollar jeans and said "crisis what crisis" and the guy that tried to run CSM like the goonswarm executive division pulling strings and puppet-mastering the other reps and announcing all decisions in an eery (but unbelievable) unity.
And finally. He'll be forever remembered as the unacceptable face of cyber-bullying and player harrassment in Eve Online in a role that puts him up there with Aris Bakhtanians as a villain then gaming media can get behind condemning. His drunken antics in calling a player to be harrassed to suicide with a wizards hat and cheesy smile will never be forgotten.
Nor will his 11th hour attempt to cling onto power by having his sychophants on the CSM forge a shoddy compromise with CCP where he kept his position despite clear breach of CSM guidelines and basic Eve code of conduct that would have any other player booted to a ban immediately.
So even when he could have kept some dignity by simply resigning as promised he waited too long and got kicked out proving himself a failure even in choosing the manner of his own demise.
Eve online and the CSM is far the better for this guy leaving the stage.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
Ispia Jaydrath
Reib Autonomous Industries
50
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:25:00 -
[971] - Quote
Kmelx wrote:I think he deserved some sort of sanction for his actions, most reasonable people recognise that he crossed a line.
Everybody agrees on this, especially mittens. This is not the issue of contention.
The problem is that CCP could have done any number of things. They could have removed him from CSM 6, for example, or banned him from fanfest. Instead they went with the thermonuclear knee-jerk option, removed him from CSM 7 and told his voters - a substantial portion of the players who are most invested in the game - to go **** themselves. Perhaps most critically, they did this without bothering to consult the CSM.
This is the old CCP, the CCP that brought us 18 months, incarna, and fearless. And I'm sick of their s***. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1773
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:28:00 -
[972] - Quote
Ispia Jaydrath wrote:Kmelx wrote:I think he deserved some sort of sanction for his actions, most reasonable people recognise that he crossed a line. Everybody agrees on this, especially mittens. This is not the issue of contention. The problem is that CCP could have done any number of things. They could have removed him from CSM 6, for example, or banned him from fanfest. Instead they went with the thermonuclear knee-jerk option, removed him from CSM 7 and told his voters - a substantial portion of the players who are most invested in the game - to go **** themselves. Perhaps most critically, they did this without bothering to consult the CSM. This is the old CCP, the CCP that brought us 18 months, incarna, and fearless. And I'm sick of their s***.
They consulted the CSM, CCP simply disagreed with the CSM's position that it was possible for Alexander Gianturco to continue as a CSM member.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
292
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:34:00 -
[973] - Quote
I understand why CCP had to do this; however it is always sad to see the idiots victorious over common sense and objectivity.
Whatever... |
1Of9
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:35:00 -
[974] - Quote
1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. to pinpoint my claim: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfon page 20 it says, and i quote: Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future.
Bump |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1778
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:37:00 -
[975] - Quote
1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. to pinpoint my claim: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfon page 20 it says, and i quote: Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future. Bump
He like any other player will be allowed to "apply" to run for CSM. But the CSM admin team will look at his history of warnings and past behaviour before saying yes or no. Knowing what we do of the circumstances of the ban I think we can probably imagine how that application will end up.
(I'd expect its highly unlikely anyone from CCP will answer this question btw because it will stretch too closely to discussing disciplinary proceedures about another player)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Crasniya
Legio Geminatus Gentlemen's Agreement
128
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:41:00 -
[976] - Quote
I think Alex's apology was a class act, I really respect him for his actions once he saw the recording. People do stupid stuff when drunk, fact. One of the things very few people can do, is honestly and humbly apologize. I respect it a lot.
That being said, folks need to realize, that once this hit the major gaming websites, it was squarely in CCP PR's hands to prevent a further PR nightmare. Mittani's removal from the CSM had to be done, unfortunately. It would've made the game look very bad if they didn't do that. The month long ban is probably equivalent to a slap on the wrist, which he probably deserves. Players have gotten permanent bans for less, so it was probably somewhat generous.
I will still hail Space King Mittens, and look forward to his explosive return to the game a month from now. |
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:43:00 -
[977] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:And of course then we had the christmas minutes which were another fiasco. Released late and indistinct, with the CSM being refered to as "the csm" (not individual reps) and being on record as anonymously saying some very stupid things about game development and priority.
Wormholes -what are they? FW -is for noobs isn't it? Hisec -lol carebears?
And the CSM wants us to think they represend ALL the players of EVE?
Not likely all they care about is likeminded individuals, not the 2 week old new player looking for adventure... |
Snot Shot
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers The 0rphanage
77
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:44:00 -
[978] - Quote
Is this the thread where karma put its foot so far up The Martinis ass that his nose looks like a Timberland work boot now?
I have been laughing for days over this and it couldnGÇÖt be more poetic. After years of twisting every word said by anyone he disliked so as to ruin their reputation and drive them out of the game, The Martini himself drank his own poisonGǪGǪGǪGǪGǪ
You planned to say what you said, you defended what you said, and continue to believe that you did nothing wrongGǪGǪ..butGǪGǪGǪ you realized the battle was being lost, so you went into full on damage control mode to try and save yourself. Throwing around apologies, isk, resignations, and grand speeches which are all just self-serving acts as you frantically try to underpin your collapsing Gǣspace spyGǥ internet fameGǪ.
Then you realize that, if not redirected quickly, the Goonie mob will turn on you for ******* things up for them. QuickGǪ..to the State of the Goonie! = GǥWe are going to take Tenal once and for all from the evil Raiden!!!!GǥGǪGǪGǪ/Sends all the pissed off CFC pilots out to shoot structures again to keep their minds off your colossal **** upGǪGǪGǪ.
You will survive this only because Goonies won't let you fail since that would make them look bad. In the mean time this beats anything goonies have/will ever do to others or to themselvesGǪGǪGǪGǪ.I will be in Jita as well to celebrate the return of GǣThe MartiniGǥGǪ.. .
CSM representative conduct wrote:
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
GÇ£God grant me the serenity to accept the things I canGÇÖt shoot, the courage to shoot the things I can, and the wisdom to GTFO!!GÇ¥GÇô Snot Shot - 2012.....Yeah I'm a killin machine..... http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50753
|
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
681
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:48:00 -
[979] - Quote
Razin wrote:I understand why CCP had to do this; however it is always sad to see the idiots victorious over common sense and objectivity.
Whatever...
I think you missed the mark here a bit.
Objectivity is why he was banned and removed, per the rules.
Subjectivity would've been making an exception to the rules because of who he was or any extenuating circumstances. Here's your sign... |
dr vonVettet
Swedish Aerospace Inc The Kadeshi
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:48:00 -
[980] - Quote
This action is so cowardly and hypocritical that I have for the first time in my many years of EVE:ing lost faith in CCP. I hope they get this in order.
I did watch the stream of the alliance panel. Mittanis presentation was distasteful and boring. I also watched the stream where the new marketing driver lauded and applauded the rough gaming that is the basis of the Mittani persona behaviour. And to make things worse, CCP states that they had inspected and approved of the presentation slides in advance. And quoting the EULA/TOS? Come on. Just by harvesting obscenities from the CCP hosted forums a significant portion of the playerbase are breaking the EULA/TOS on a regular basis.
Today I regretfully unsubscribed EVE. |
|
1Of9
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:52:00 -
[981] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:1Of9 wrote:Thank you ccp.
You did the right thing, altho the CSM rules state that he cannot run for CSM again.
Plz explain why you are allowing him to run again in the future. to pinpoint my claim: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfon page 20 it says, and i quote: Quote:
CSM representative conduct
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
In light of this, ccp please explain why he will be able to run for CSM in the future. Bump He like any other player will be allowed to "apply" to run for CSM. But the CSM admin team will look at his history of warnings and past behaviour before saying yes or no. Knowing what we do of the circumstances of the ban I think we can probably imagine how that application will end up. (I'd expect its highly unlikely anyone from CCP will answer this question btw because it will stretch too closely to discussing disciplinary procedures about another player)
Ya i know that's the most probable route of action for ccp .. but .. the CSM rules state NO EXCEPTIONS. He must NOT be allowed into the CSM again, as per rules.
Otherwise, ccp is opening a very very dangerous door. a) goon special treatment theory's are proven right b) mittanus claim on his recent ceo update where he claims and i quote: "One could additionally argue that IGÇÖve spent so much time in Iceland this year that IGÇÖve become co-opted by CCP; I have too many friends who work at the company and I donGÇÖt want to **** them over " (source) c) CCP wont be able to permaban anyone from CSM in the future, since a new precedent is set.
Once again, i am waiting for some official answer on the matter, altho i understand it's not a easy subject to reply to, must be answered, otherwise CSM <-> CCP <-> GOONS relationship is not as transparent as CCP claim and needs further investigation, at the possible cost of CSM complete collapse, not to mention CCP/EVE itself. |
Rhaile Vhindiscar
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:55:00 -
[982] - Quote
Snot Shot wrote:Is this the thread where karma put its foot so far up The Martinis ass that his nose looks like a Timberland work boot now? I have been laughing for days over this and it couldnGÇÖt be more poetic. After years of twisting every word said by anyone he disliked so as to ruin their reputation and drive them out of the game, The Martini himself drank his own poisonGǪGǪGǪ GǪGǪ You planned to say what you said, you defended what you said, and continue to believe that you did nothing wrongGǪGǪ..butGǪGǪGǪ you realized the battle was being lost, so you went into full on damage control mode to try and save yourself. Throwing around apologies, isk, resignations, and grand speeches which are all just self-serving acts as you frantically try to underpin your collapsing GÇ£space spyGÇ¥ internet fameGǪ. Then you realize that, if not redirected quickly, the Goonie mob will turn on you for ******* things up for them. QuickGǪ..to the State of the Goonie! = GÇ¥We are going to take Tenal once and for all from the evil Raiden!!!!GÇ¥GǪGǪGǪ/Sends all the pissed off CFC pilots out to shoot structures again to keep their minds off your colossal **** upGǪGǪGǪ. You will survive this only because Goonies won't let you fail since that would make them look bad. In the mean time this beats anything goonies have/will ever do to others or to themselvesGǪGǪ GǪGǪ.I will be in Jita as well to celebrate the return of GÇ£The MartiniGÇ¥GǪ.. . CSM representative conduct wrote:
any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
Now THIS is a angry man. Show us where the bad chairman touched you?
|
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
54
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:59:00 -
[983] - Quote
former chairman What a lot of goon need to realise is that its not because we hate you that we do these things Its because WE LOVE YOU |
Snot Shot
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers The 0rphanage
78
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 15:20:00 -
[984] - Quote
Rhaile Vhindiscar wrote:Now THIS is a angry man. Show us where the bad chairman touched you?
You should know that when someone receives this response from a Goonie its confirmation that the persons post was a GÇ£wrecking shotGÇ¥GǪGǪ. Carry on being ~mad~GǪGǪ . GÇ£God grant me the serenity to accept the things I canGÇÖt shoot, the courage to shoot the things I can, and the wisdom to GTFO!!GÇ¥GÇô Snot Shot - 2012.....Yeah I'm a killin machine..... http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50753
|
Shiana Soltek
Celestial Horizon Corp. Flatline.
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 15:45:00 -
[985] - Quote
What I find interesting is they are all whinning and crying about disenfranchisement. Apparently these players do not know, or do not care about the actual definition of the term. Their votes were not less effective, they were not blocked. Their votes were counted, served their purpose, and successfully elected their chosen delegate to office.
What happened was AFTER the votes were counted, and AFTER the delegate became the official Chairman to be sworn in once CSM 7 started. The delegate himself, through his OWN actions, and by his own admission, stepped down from the position of CSM 7 chairman/member. This is no different than a US elected president stepping down prior to being sworn into office for actions he committed. The votes were counted, the person was successfully elected.
Your votes were not made less effective, you were not blocked from being able to vote. The person you voted for committed immoral, unethical, and via violation of the TOS and EULA illegal actions, that resulted in his account being banned, and after some personal reflection, resigned from his elected position. Under a normal democratic society, the spot would be filled by the Vice President, or in this case, the person with the next highest amount of votes, and every position from there down filled by the person below it, and the final spot filled by the person with the highest number of votes that did not make the original CSM 7 panel.
Instead of complaining about and trying to cry "disenfranchisement", how about you condemn the person who failed to maintain a professional decorum and failed to represent his constituents in a moral, ethical, and professional manner. |
Soldarius
United Highsec Front The 99 Percent
190
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 15:48:00 -
[986] - Quote
Mittani has shown his lack of personal character and irresponsibility as a representative and chair of the player base. I find CCPs actions on this issue appropriate.
Simply put, 10058 accts voted wrong. "How do you kill that which has no life?" |
Droodid
Antec Enterprises
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 15:59:00 -
[987] - Quote
Just goes to show if enough people ***** and whine about something utterly unimportant then the result is a load of predictable bollocks. I can't believe he's resigned, as one of the 10k people that voted for him I want that decision reversed.
It's Fanfest, it's a party. If you want to "serious business" up the party at the top of the world that I come to once a year, then I'll stop ******* coming.
Well played CCP, and well played you bunch of whining cunts. |
Silath Slyver Silverpine
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:02:00 -
[988] - Quote
Shiana Soltek wrote:What I find interesting is they are all whinning and crying about disenfranchisement. Apparently these players do not know, or do not care about the actual definition of the term. Their votes were not less effective, they were not blocked. Their votes were counted, served their purpose, and successfully elected their chosen delegate to office.
What happened was AFTER the votes were counted, and AFTER the delegate became the official Chairman to be sworn in once CSM 7 started. The delegate himself, through his OWN actions, and by his own admission, stepped down from the position of CSM 7 chairman/member. This is no different than a US elected president stepping down prior to being sworn into office for actions he committed. The votes were counted, the person was successfully elected.
Your votes were not made less effective, you were not blocked from being able to vote. The person you voted for committed immoral, unethical, and via violation of the TOS and EULA illegal actions, that resulted in his account being banned, and after some personal reflection, resigned from his elected position. Under a normal democratic society, the spot would be filled by the Vice President, or in this case, the person with the next highest amount of votes, and every position from there down filled by the person below it, and the final spot filled by the person with the highest number of votes that did not make the original CSM 7 panel.
Instead of complaining about and trying to cry "disenfranchisement", how about you condemn the person who failed to maintain a professional decorum and failed to represent his constituents in a moral, ethical, and professional manner.
This. A thousand times, this. I applaud you for a reasonable and objective post.
Goons, CCP did not 'discount' your votes, nor did it 'disenfranchise' you. Mittani did.
But to accept that, you would have to sacrifice your little Jesus on the altar of self responsibility. Gods forbid your glorious leader be held accountable for his actions. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:04:00 -
[989] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Della Monk wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:The CSM reached a wrong decision. Alex Gianturco's actions were indefensible really and rather than manning up and telling him he had to go they tried to fool themselves about the scope of the damage done by Alex's drunken antics at Fanfest. Then CCP should have told them this? Well by disregarding their collective advise haven't they just done this? I said told as in civilly, like they respected their opinion as elected representatives. Not by tossing out a decision they must have given some sort of approval to without warning. Well seeing as the CSM members posted seconds after this thread went live either they knew it was coming or they just got very lucky indeed. My money is they were told what the decision was in advance.
OMG, a conspiracy. |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
97
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:04:00 -
[990] - Quote
~goonhate~ trumps fairness |
|
Pyrus Octavius
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:09:00 -
[991] - Quote
Seleene wrote:This was an unexpected development and we are now working toward resolving both the issue of Mitten's 10k voters and figuring out the process for CSM 7 Chair.
You mean 10k character votes right? Because the way I understand this works, that each account has 3 character slots, so technically 1 person, can vote 3 times. So in reality, 10k individual people are not disenfranchised.
Also, didn't the votes take place prior to said actions taken by Mittens? I am curious to know how many votes he would have lost had he done this prior to the conclusion of the CSM7 vote. I think this should be taken into account as well.
A person in all aspects of life should be held accountable for their action's and inaction's. There is no difference in this situation, than if someone did this to someone they go to school with or work with. The person known as The Mittani is no different than you or I. Therefore, Mittens shouldn't be given special treatment for breaking the rules and inciting such terrible things. He had a choice in his words. He is an educated man, a smart man who prides on his abilities to communicate. There is a lesson in this for him, and I am sure he will grow and become a stronger leader because of it. Whether you like his game play or not doesn't matter. This is a human matter, not a gaming matter, and although it is a fine line, human matters are more important, and should be respected. I believe this is what CCP is doing. This is what I believe Mittens is doing in making reparations and stepping down. There is always next year, and he has plenty of time to plan and strategise his next campaign. I wish him luck.
|
hioshi IV
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:10:00 -
[992] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:~goonhate~ trumps fairness
hahahahha a goon talking about fairness hahahahahhaha
your tears ........... SO SWEEEEEEET |
Droodid
Antec Enterprises
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:11:00 -
[993] - Quote
Pyrus Octavius wrote:Seleene wrote:This was an unexpected development and we are now working toward resolving both the issue of Mitten's 10k voters and figuring out the process for CSM 7 Chair. You mean 10k character votes right? Because the way I understand this works, that each account has 3 character slots, so technically 1 person, can vote 3 times. So in reality, 10k individual people are not disenfranchised.
It's 1 vote per account.
|
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:24:00 -
[994] - Quote
CCP did not disenfranchise anyone. The Mittani disenfranchised himself ,and to an extent all who voted for him, with his ill-advised comments and behavior in a very public forum.
Like I said before, do not blame CCP, blame the Mittani. No one asked him to act the fool, it simply came natural to him and he paid the price. One might consider his conduct and apparent lack of maturity before voting for him again, assuming he is even allowed to run.
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:24:00 -
[995] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Yeah it was made partially in response to the developer corruption scandal that involved T20 and Band of Brothers alliance and make sure the players had oversight to ensure that could never happen again.
The irony is we almost had a situation where Mittani was boasting of being in control of developers and influence within CCP and replaying this corrupt old scenario again. Had Mittani not been appropriately punished over his behaviour at Fanfest many many players and many external media sites would have considered he was being given unfair treatment that other players could not expect.
I'm so happy you see the world with such nice conspiracy eyes. Ever played with the possibility that Mittens was trolling when he was saying he controlled the devs?
I think you should quit eve and go outside. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1786
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:33:00 -
[996] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Yeah it was made partially in response to the developer corruption scandal that involved T20 and Band of Brothers alliance and make sure the players had oversight to ensure that could never happen again.
The irony is we almost had a situation where Mittani was boasting of being in control of developers and influence within CCP and replaying this corrupt old scenario again. Had Mittani not been appropriately punished over his behaviour at Fanfest many many players and many external media sites would have considered he was being given unfair treatment that other players could not expect.
I'm so happy you see the world with such nice conspiracy eyes. Ever played with the possibility that Mittens was trolling when he was saying he controlled the devs? I think you should quit eve and go outside.
Somebody serving on a body that was setup to contront the stink of developer corruption in an online game should know better than to troll about corruption between him and his ex-goonswarm buddies in said online game development.
While I don't think you should quit the game I do think you should probably unplug your keyboard.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
101
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:34:00 -
[997] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7.
You can tell it was PR/marketing management who made the call to give him the boot from the really weird, vague language used to describe his kicking. |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
54
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:34:00 -
[998] - Quote
In a month no one will remember Mittani and Burn Jita will be a flop
This is a huge setback politically for the Goons, as they are one of the largest blocks and won't be represented
It is hilarious to see all of these Goonies on the forum crying like babies. Maybe they need to HTFU. The amount of whining and equivocation is thick enough to cut with a knife
Your leader is dumped. We don't care what you think. What are you going to do about it
I am guessing nothing because you guys are actually really soft when someone else bullies you. Start a corp and do it yourself. You'll fail, but you'll enjoy failing. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:36:00 -
[999] - Quote
Chris LaPlant wrote:Ah Goon tears. They sustain me. How can they sustain you when you've never seen any? |
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:37:00 -
[1000] - Quote
Daviclond wrote:CCP Navigator wrote:The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. You can tell it was PR/marketing management who made the call to give him the boot from the really weird, vague language used to describe his kicking.
And rightly so, the Mittani has been a Marketing/PR disaster with this latest debacle. Frankly, I would not follow this guy to the grocery store for a loaf of bread if he is no smarter than this. Maybe you should not either. |
|
Pyx Jasta
104th Ranger Mobile Combat Regiment Insane Asylum
42
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:38:00 -
[1001] - Quote
Pyrus Octavius wrote:[ You mean 10k character votes right? Because the way I understand this works, that each account has 3 character slots, so technically 1 person, can vote 3 times. So in reality, 10k individual people are not disenfranchised.
You understand wrong. You can only vote once per account. Of course many people have multiple accounts, so that 10k number is probably representative of fewer than 10k individual people.
|
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
101
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:39:00 -
[1002] - Quote
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:In a month no one will remember Mittani and Burn Jita will be a flop
This is a huge setback politically for the Goons, as they are one of the largest blocks and won't be represented
It is hilarious to see all of these Goonies on the forum crying like babies. Maybe they need to HTFU. The amount of whining and equivocation is thick enough to cut with a knife
Your leader is dumped. We don't care what you think. What are you going to do about it
I am guessing nothing because you guys are actually really soft when someone else bullies you.
just fyi, all true goons find this absolutely hilarious and aren't bothered
we've picked up a few j4g pubbies along the way and they're probably pretty unhappy, but for the rest of us this is some of the best posting since remedial absconded with the titan fund |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:39:00 -
[1003] - Quote
Mittens and Goons tried to make the new thing in eve "We love you". You know, spread the love and make eve a better place, but you butthurt pubbies had to turn it around to something awful like "Go kill yourself". |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
98
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:41:00 -
[1004] - Quote
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:Your leader is dumped. We don't care what you think. What are you going to do about it Your freighter was ganked. We don't care what you think. What are you going to do about it? |
|
CCP Xhagen
C C P
165
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:41:00 -
[1005] - Quote
Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
CCP Xhagen | CSM Project Manager |
|
Kile Kitmoore
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:42:00 -
[1006] - Quote
Anyone have any words from the victim? You know the guy on the verge of suicide who contacts the leader of an alliance who's source of entertainment is to ruin YOUR game. The fact he is contacting Mittani with such personal information in the first place is odd, odd enough that I would have taken it as some dude trolling.
If the guy wasn't being harassed before he certainly is now with CCP's decision.
|
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
101
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:44:00 -
[1007] - Quote
free Alexander "The Mittani" Gualdiuaghauigh |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
103
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:50:00 -
[1008] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
Well thank God we have Darius III on the council. |
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:50:00 -
[1009] - Quote
Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain.
Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers!
|
Gypsy RoseLee
Aliastra Gallente Federation
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:51:00 -
[1010] - Quote
Goon's tears are the BEST tears. That is, unless they are Goon's tears that are caused be self inflicted stupidity. Oh wait... |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1787
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:52:00 -
[1011] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.)
The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Snot Shot
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers The 0rphanage
79
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:54:00 -
[1012] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
Like a BOSS!!.... GÇ£God grant me the serenity to accept the things I canGÇÖt shoot, the courage to shoot the things I can, and the wisdom to GTFO!!GÇ¥GÇô Snot Shot - 2012.....Yeah I'm a killin machine..... http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50753
|
Ispia Jaydrath
Reib Autonomous Industries
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:55:00 -
[1013] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
I can tell you're in marketing because of the way you're weaseling around to make it look like mittens resigned from CSM 7 instead of you removing him. |
Gizmo Marpa
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:55:00 -
[1014] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Xhagen, were you not there moderating the panel? No, CCP was just there implicitly urging everyone to get hammered because Fanfest is (rightfully) a "party" atmosphere.
Then some crybabies cried crocodile tears simply because someone they don't like said something that they considered a HUGE OUTRAGE |
Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
933
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:56:00 -
[1015] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
Bottom of the pile roleplayer tries to manipulate a barely controversial dramabomb to suit his horrible larping political agenda, news at 11 |
Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
933
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:56:00 -
[1016] - Quote
If anyone took you seriously for the CSM this might actually have even been worth burning you over m8 |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
578
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:57:00 -
[1017] - Quote
I want to make it clear noone actually cares about the "victim" here except for the person who personally apologized and gave them ISK (Mittani).
Also, the "victim's" former in game bio gave a link to a RL blog which made it easy to track this person down to his RL identity for anyone that cared. Thankfully, that person has removed that link at this time.
I think CCP's actions here are a bit incredulous and based on suppositions.
The persons letter does not say he wants to kill himself, it states that he wishes he would die, and that he had done so often in this game.
You have killed that panel's potential. No matter how much you want to say "it's ok", every Alliance leader now has to walk up on that stage with the weight of being banned from EVE because of a drunken mishap done in person on a private broadcast.
It's a **** precedent really. Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1787
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:57:00 -
[1018] - Quote
Sverige Pahis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such. Bottom of the pile roleplayer tries to manipulate a barely controversial dramabomb to suit his horrible larping political agenda, news at 11
I like the way you come out with a personal attack rather than trying to debate the point. It does make rather easy to hold your comment up for ridicule.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Drago Palermus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:57:00 -
[1019] - Quote
Gypsy RoseLee wrote:Goon's tears are the BEST tears. That is, unless they are Goon's tears that are caused be self inflicted stupidity. Oh wait... Are you implying that we should harm ourselves?
Because that is just extremely offensive to someone that has known people ("cutters") that cause self-harm due to psychological issues. |
Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
933
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:57:00 -
[1020] - Quote
But yeah you go ahead and keep trying to threaten game developers hehe |
|
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:58:00 -
[1021] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
Agreed, and point of order, Mittani stated publicly his intent to resign, which is not the same as a resignation. I never saw a resignation as postulated under the conditions described by CCP.
Further, I realize CCP has decided to kick this can down the road to next year regarding the possible upcoming sequel The Return of The Mittani, but you guys should think long and hard about borrowing trouble of this kind, when it does not serve any legitimate business interest to do so. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:58:00 -
[1022] - Quote
free Ladie Harlot, free the Eurosquad four |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
78
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 16:59:00 -
[1023] - Quote
Gypsy RoseLee wrote:Goon's tears are the BEST tears. That is, unless they are Goon's tears that are caused be self inflicted stupidity. Oh wait...
alt
Gizmo Marpa wrote:Richard Desturned wrote:Xhagen, were you not there moderating the panel? No, CCP was just there implicitly urging everyone to get hammered because Fanfest is (rightfully) a "party" atmosphere. Then some crybabies cried crocodile tears simply because someone they don't like said something that they considered a HUGE OUTRAGE
Wow, sounds familiar! |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
78
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:00:00 -
[1024] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Sverige Pahis wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such. Bottom of the pile roleplayer tries to manipulate a barely controversial dramabomb to suit his horrible larping political agenda, news at 11 I like the way you come out with a personal attack rather than trying to debate the point. It does make rather easy to hold your comment up for ridicule.
You're a roleplayer.
In Space.
In a SpaceBrothel. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
881
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:01:00 -
[1025] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
get
out |
Twil Akachi
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:01:00 -
[1026] - Quote
Gideon Tyler wrote:Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain. Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers! Don't be mad your panelist was terrible :( |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
98
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:02:00 -
[1027] - Quote
Gideon Tyler wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such. Agreed, and point of order, Mittani stated publicly his intent to resign, which is not the same as a resignation. I never saw a resignation as postulated under the conditions described by CCP. Further, I realize CCP has decided to kick this can down the road to next year regarding the possible upcoming sequel The Return of The Mittani, but you guys should think long and hard about borrowing trouble of this kind, when it does not serve any legitimate business interest to do so.
nobody says that Mittens has to run for CSM 8, or that he even intends to
we have plenty of other people capable of talking spaceships in iceland |
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:04:00 -
[1028] - Quote
Twil Akachi wrote:Gideon Tyler wrote:Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain. Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers! Don't be mad your panelist was terrible :(
Actually, I thought Kelduum's presentation was clear, concise, professional and informative. It that is terrible, we could use more of it. - o7
|
Anvil44
Independent Traders and Builders MPA
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:05:00 -
[1029] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
This is exactly how this situation should have been viewed. All other subsequent actions and reactions, flow from this one instance. Therefore the actions taken by CCP are right on the money. Everyone keep in mind that Mittens (or however his name is spelled), did come out after to apologize and step down. So really, this looks like a beginning, a middle and an end. He gets a chance to come back to the game and play within the game in the spirit of how the game goes (and if he is a complete jerk there, well that's Eve for you). Hopefully, we won't see anymore 'outside the game environment' comments like this from anyone.
The best thing to do is to let this one go. No one wins here, but with these actions, there are no real big loses. I mean, come on, this is only a game. I may not like you or your point of view but you have a right to voice it. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
883
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:06:00 -
[1030] - Quote
Gideon Tyler wrote:Twil Akachi wrote:Gideon Tyler wrote:Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain. Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers! Don't be mad your panelist was terrible :( Actually, I thought Kelduum's presentation was clear, concise, professional and informative. It that is terrible, we could use more of it. - o7
yeah and you're not biased at all |
|
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
122
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:06:00 -
[1031] - Quote
Gideon Tyler wrote:Twil Akachi wrote:Gideon Tyler wrote:Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain. Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers! Don't be mad your panelist was terrible :( Actually, I thought Kelduum's presentation was clear, concise, professional and informative. It that is terrible, we could use more of it. - o7
wasnt he in an unironic fedora? |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:07:00 -
[1032] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
Deal with it now. You removed our candidate, not the CSM. You disenfranchised us, and as a result you're going to fix it for us. |
WolfLeader316
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:08:00 -
[1033] - Quote
All i saw was
"A bloo bloo Sony got all mad at us so we had to give them a pound of flesh so we can continue receiving paychecks" |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:10:00 -
[1034] - Quote
Taihbea wrote:Megalift wrote:We all can see who has the power here. 10,000 player votes vs CSM vs CCP. Today is the beginning of the end for Eve. *snip* That was uncalled for. SpitfireDude. Goons can quit and war for their region will fuel up eve to some nasty temps. Nobody gives a **** about a bunch of whiney noobs If they leave it's going to be awesome. Big null space to fill!
Hmm looking at your employment history it seems you started this toon about 30 days before the election was over. This do make we wonder who actually it was voting with 8000+ accounts that was around 30 days old... |
Crias Taylor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
111
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:11:00 -
[1035] - Quote
How does the **** of Sony taste? |
Major Spag
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
123
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:11:00 -
[1036] - Quote
By this time next year, I am certain people are going to be so apathetic over the game 10,000 votes will seem like a good turn out!
Looking forward to Second Life: Eve and $1000 digital pants that everyone wants. |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:11:00 -
[1037] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
I would like to note that one CSM candidate is well known for posting neo-nazi views on this forum and not only was he not removed from the race, not only was he not banned from the game, not only was he not banned from the forums, but ccp refused to allow people to call him out on it and erased posts that did.
Could you elaborate on your corporate opinion of naism and explain why you have supported an avowed neo-nazi during this process? |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:12:00 -
[1038] - Quote
I can't name this CSM candidate, because if i do my post gets deleted! Because we can't have people saying bad things about nazis! |
Pyrus Octavius
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:12:00 -
[1039] - Quote
Pyx Jasta wrote:Pyrus Octavius wrote:[ You mean 10k character votes right? Because the way I understand this works, that each account has 3 character slots, so technically 1 person, can vote 3 times. So in reality, 10k individual people are not disenfranchised.
You understand wrong. You can only vote once per account. Of course many people have multiple accounts, so that 10k number is probably representative of fewer than 10k individual people.
Got it, thanks for that explanation. |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
122
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:13:00 -
[1040] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Taihbea wrote:Megalift wrote:We all can see who has the power here. 10,000 player votes vs CSM vs CCP. Today is the beginning of the end for Eve. *snip* That was uncalled for. SpitfireDude. Goons can quit and war for their region will fuel up eve to some nasty temps. Nobody gives a **** about a bunch of whiney noobs If they leave it's going to be awesome. Big null space to fill! Hmm looking at your employment history it seems you started this toon about 30 days before the election was over. This do make we wonder who actually it was voting with 8000+ accounts that was around 30 days old...
Yep, you solved the mystery. At $15 per account, The Mittani bought 8000 accounts.
My god you should be a detective or something! |
|
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
122
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:14:00 -
[1041] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
I would like to note that one CSM candidate is well known for posting neo-naz i views on this forum and not only was he not removed from the race, not only was he not banned from the game, not only was he not banned from the forums, but ccp refused to allow people to call him out on it and erased posts that did. Could you elaborate on your corporate opinion of na ism and explain why you have supported an avowed neo-naz i during this process?
I forgot about that guy, I wouldn't mind an explanation either.
|
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
883
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:15:00 -
[1042] - Quote
can someone tell me who the **** is on jabber please |
jugornaut
Diversified Holdings
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:17:00 -
[1043] - Quote
lol the thing everyone fails to see is that mittens stepped down to start - the fact that ccp removed him after the fact is just pomp and circumstance...
10k voters with unheard voices should be shouting at mittens asking why the hell did he step down to begin with - instead you blame ccp for his drunken banter (which btw csm should be held to a higher standard)
besides 10k votes - after goons admitted to fraud to get those votes - gg noobs |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
579
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:18:00 -
[1044] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:I can't name this CSM candidate, because if i do my post gets deleted! Because we can't have people saying bad things about nazis!
lol.
This coming from a Goon is funny as hell.
I remember logging onto your voice server 5 years ago and everything was marked up like World War II German propaganda and military generals.
Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:19:00 -
[1045] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:can someone tell me who the **** is on jabber please im not saying its this guy but there sure are a lot of missing posts in this thread: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=68075&find=unread |
Brae Haen
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:20:00 -
[1046] - Quote
Ive got a question which was not covered by the post. This might sound a little out there but wouldn't a player who is threatening to committ suicide due to in game actions also be considered a violation of the EULA/TOS? It is a threat, it is harassment and a case could be made that it is cyberbullying.
I'm not trolling, or trying to attack the offended player. I'm not a mindless Goon trying to start more drama. But I am interested on what CCP's stance on this is. |
Alua Oresson
Demon-War-Lords BLACK-MARK
84
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:20:00 -
[1047] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
Actually, from the way I understand it, your account has to have not received any warnings for the past year. Therefore, it isn't a legal loophole, it is how it is set up. I remember hearing about that from Spectre from Eve Newb got told he couldn't run for CSM 4 because he had a warning on his account, but he was free to run next year. |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
122
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:20:00 -
[1048] - Quote
jugornaut wrote:lol the thing everyone fails to see is that mittens stepped down to start - the fact that ccp removed him after the fact is just pomp and circumstance...
10k voters with unheard voices should be shouting at mittens asking why the hell did he step down to begin with - instead you blame ccp for his drunken banter (which btw csm should be held to a higher standard)
besides 10k votes - after goons admitted to fraud to get those votes - gg noobs
Yeah, like I said, mittens totally bought 8000 accounts. At $15 each.
:tinfoil:snype |
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
46
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:21:00 -
[1049] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
Hah, like Mrs Mittens will let him.... |
Devo Ch
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:22:00 -
[1050] - Quote
the good news is now the CSM can go back to doing absolutely nothing, and CCP can go back to selling $80 pants |
|
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
46
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:24:00 -
[1051] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:
I would like to note that one CSM candidate is well known for posting neo-nazi views on this forum and not only was he not removed from the race, not only was he not banned from the game, not only was he not banned from the forums, but ccp refused to allow people to call him out on it and erased posts that did.
Could you elaborate on your corporate opinion of naism and explain why you have supported an avowed neo-nazi during this process?
oooh, hey, forgot about that one. Looking forward to the answer. You should probably ask GM Salmon..... |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
889
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:25:00 -
[1052] - Quote
For although some people think that CCP have handled this wrong, let us look at the whole story. Old timers and new timers alike know of The Mittani as a great voice of reason and balancing force in the EVE world. Now you seek to silence him?
Rather, I would suggest that you look not at The Mittani for this debacle, but at yourselves. Even the gaming media agree. Voracious appetites for drama may some goons have, but we are human beings, CCP, just like yourselves. Even goons want their votes to mean something. Do you really seek to disenfranchise over ten thousand people? Hah, the last person to do that was Vladimir Putin! Ordinary people play your game. Perhaps it is the aim of CCP to become like despotic rulers of old - like EA and Sony - and crush dissent? Really, that would be a shame. Truly, we do love EVE, but we're scared you're ruining it :(
(is a neo-nazi) |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:25:00 -
[1053] - Quote
Diamonica Norya wrote:Andski wrote:Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:CCP didn't take out those 10000 votes, The Mittani did. The terms for being a member of the CSM were clean and clear and The Mittani broke them.
Instead of blaming CCP, you should be blaming The Mittani for putting them into that position. thank you for your "valuable" insights NPC alt Obviously more valuable than any of the goon/goon pets' insights. Seriously, if you cannot argue more, just shush, stop pretending you're intellectually superior just because someone chooses to stay in a NPC corp because the fact is you're not intellectually superior. out of arguments, accept it that you have no grounds for arguing. If you can't post on your main you should go skill yourself. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
889
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:26:00 -
[1054] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Diamonica Norya wrote:Andski wrote:Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:CCP didn't take out those 10000 votes, The Mittani did. The terms for being a member of the CSM were clean and clear and The Mittani broke them.
Instead of blaming CCP, you should be blaming The Mittani for putting them into that position. thank you for your "valuable" insights NPC alt Obviously more valuable than any of the goon/goon pets' insights. Seriously, if you cannot argue more, just shush, stop pretending you're intellectually superior just because someone chooses to stay in a NPC corp because the fact is you're not intellectually superior. out of arguments, accept it that you have no grounds for arguing. If you can't post on your main you should go skill yourself.
whoa, don't even joke about that sort of thing -.- |
Crias Taylor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
113
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:30:00 -
[1055] - Quote
Come on guys, are you trying to suggest that one of CCP's largest backers at one time is the son of a convicted German **** or something and this somehow has allowed them to tolerate a **** on the CSM. CCP has higher standards than that.
Stop being so :tinfoil: |
Bocephus Morgen
The Suicide Kings Test Alliance Please Ignore
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:30:00 -
[1056] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Frankly that's bullshit, there should be a re-vote and any half-way competent person knows this. |
Twil Akachi
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:31:00 -
[1057] - Quote
Gideon Tyler wrote:Twil Akachi wrote:Gideon Tyler wrote:Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain. Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers! Don't be mad your panelist was terrible :( Actually, I thought Kelduum's presentation was clear, concise, professional and informative. It that is terrible, we could use more of it. - o7 He had the charisma of a butchered rat. |
CynoNet Two
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
546
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:32:00 -
[1058] - Quote
]EvilweaselSA wrote:
I would like to note that one CSM candidate is well known for posting neo-nazi views on this forum and not only was he not removed from the race, not only was he not banned from the game, not only was he not banned from the forums, but ccp refused to allow people to call him out on it and erased posts that did.
Could you elaborate on your corporate opinion of naism and explain why you have supported an avowed neo-nazi during this process?
The key difference here is that no one has told Sony, loudly, and in public. |
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:32:00 -
[1059] - Quote
*rabble rabble rabble* *whine whine whine* Mittani stepped down himself after he encouraged people to try to make someone commit suicide and all you guys are whining about some meager temp ban? There was a time when Goons were someone I loved to hate, they were the perfect villains and in their own way good for EVE for adding that unique flavor to it. Now you guys just disgust me. Not because of what Mittani said as he since apologized for that, but for the reaction you all showed. You think by swarming the forums and rabbling about your tears with your alts and friends you're going to fool anyone? Mittani threw 10,000+ votes out of the window, not CCP and frankly it doesn't matter who did. When an elected official fucks up he's out regardless if he got 10,000 or 10 million votes.
It has become obvious that none of you ever cared about this game, only about it being fun and beneficial to your own player base. I for one stand by and support MITTANIS DECISION TO STEP DOWN and I also support the 30day ban CCP imposed on his account as it seemed necessary to avoid the media ruckus that his actions caused. Don't do the crime, if you can't do the time. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:33:00 -
[1060] - Quote
Hecatonis wrote:Andski wrote:Hecatonis wrote:even i sat through his address to the goons,
he left the CSM by his own choice, you people need to lay off the koolaid He hasn't confirmed that, FYI um, yes he did, listen again my dear goon. I think you should listen to it again. Apparently you're a bad judge of character. |
|
Drago Palermus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:33:00 -
[1061] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote: I would like to note that one CSM candidate is well known for posting neo-nazi views on this forum and not only was he not removed from the race, not only was he not banned from the game, not only was he not banned from the forums, but ccp refused to allow people to call him out on it and erased posts that did.
Could you elaborate on your corporate opinion of naism and explain why you have supported an avowed neo-nazi during this process?
This is a pretty good question. |
Aselus
Crimson Right
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:34:00 -
[1062] - Quote
+CCP Games Rant, on the weakness of a company to certain social 'inadequacies'
the first weakness of CCP(and a good number of real people) is shown... for all those who listened to the mitani during the live-stream or read about it, it's an interesting case, but not one that warrants the response that has actually taken place in my honest opinion. Real life statements should not in any way effect the game as a whole, this response: """ Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban. """" does not sit well with me at all. Statement of precedence or not, there is an inherent weakness in a company that I have supported based on its social policy(the gamers make their own rules) for a long time. But it should be clearly stated that this action/response puts CCP in a DRAMATICALLY bad light in my eyes, not the actions of Alex themselves, as those where statements made in a drunken stupor, which where followed by the correct response from him (a public apology - and even if there was anything more to BE done it would need to be done on behalf of the targeted party, NOT CPP, and in a real life venue[i.e.:court]), but the fact that CPP did anything at all takes them down from a paragon of progress in the games social space back into "he said he hates me please ban him" or WoW. This should not be in any way the current state of affairs in relations, as an action is being taken under unprecedented statements in the EULA/TOS, it is impossible to hide behind a document that DOES NOT COVER THE ALLIANCE PANEL/FANFEST IN ANY MANNER OR SORT, i read over it just to make sure, no such clauses are present.
|
Xeross155
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
115
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:35:00 -
[1063] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Diamonica Norya wrote:Andski wrote:Lamperouge Kasenumi wrote:CCP didn't take out those 10000 votes, The Mittani did. The terms for being a member of the CSM were clean and clear and The Mittani broke them.
Instead of blaming CCP, you should be blaming The Mittani for putting them into that position. thank you for your "valuable" insights NPC alt Obviously more valuable than any of the goon/goon pets' insights. Seriously, if you cannot argue more, just shush, stop pretending you're intellectually superior just because someone chooses to stay in a NPC corp because the fact is you're not intellectually superior. out of arguments, accept it that you have no grounds for arguing. If you can't post on your main you should go skill yourself. I'll await your ban o7 |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:39:00 -
[1064] - Quote
Empathic Psychopath wrote:Koby Botick wrote:1/6 th of all votes disregarded. Is CCP back a russian sounding abbreviation again? I hear they like to manipulate votes in plain sight there too.
Wasn't it goons that were praising CCP not that long ago when a nerf to tians was announced? My how the mighty have fallen :) "Oooooh look at me, I can use fancy words I saw in a movie once!" |
Kilylol
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:40:00 -
[1065] - Quote
Gideon Tyler wrote:Twil Akachi wrote:Gideon Tyler wrote:Praerian wrote:it was like a disturbance in the force and 10,000 goons cried out in pain. Possibly the best post I have seen ever....Cheers! Don't be mad your panelist was terrible :( Actually, I thought Kelduum's presentation was clear, concise, professional and informative. It that is terrible, we could use more of it. - o7
m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8m8 o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7o7
|
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
109
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:40:00 -
[1066] - Quote
the trolling when Dust flops is going to be glorious |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
580
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:40:00 -
[1067] - Quote
This is the astute article i've been waiting for.
Thank you.
http://www.evenews24.com/2012/03/29/easley-thames-the-king-of-scapegoats/ Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |
Isarian
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:41:00 -
[1068] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:I would like to note that one CSM candidate is well known for posting neo-nazi views on this forum and not only was he not removed from the race, not only was he not banned from the game, not only was he not banned from the forums, but ccp refused to allow people to call him out on it and erased posts that did.
Could you elaborate on your corporate opinion of naism and explain why you have supported an avowed neo-nazi during this process?
Count me in as interested in this. |
Machine Delta
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
95
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:41:00 -
[1069] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
When do you resign for badgering "context" into killing itself?
|
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:43:00 -
[1070] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
I don't want to live on this planet anymore. /farnsworthoff
|
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:44:00 -
[1071] - Quote
Aineko Macx wrote:Etil DeLaFuente wrote:10,058 tears, he's indeed the best vilain in eve I approve Quick goonies, go "burn jita to the ground". Quick npc alt, go post on your main. |
Snot Shot
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers The 0rphanage
80
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:46:00 -
[1072] - Quote
jugornaut wrote:lol the thing everyone fails to see is that mittens stepped down to start - the fact that ccp removed him after the fact is just pomp and circumstance...
10k voters with unheard voices should be shouting at mittens asking why the hell did he step down to begin with - instead you blame ccp for his drunken banter (which btw csm should be held to a higher standard)
besides 10k votes - after goons admitted to fraud to get those votes - gg noobs +1
Could not have been planned better at any BoB BBQ......."Get all Goons votes into one player and then have the player resign from the CSM."........... GÇ£God grant me the serenity to accept the things I canGÇÖt shoot, the courage to shoot the things I can, and the wisdom to GTFO!!GÇ¥GÇô Snot Shot - 2012.....Yeah I'm a killin machine..... http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50753
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:47:00 -
[1073] - Quote
Ordais wrote:Goon tears....so many goon tears....*nomnomnom*
As for the 10.000 voters....its not CCPs fault that you candidate shot himself in the foot and can't represent you anymore. Take it up with him.
Well, i do agree with the desicion, but it will hurt the game in many ways wich makes me even MORE angry at Mittens...you just couldn't pull yourself together. All this talk about "beeing a politician" and "understanding how this works"....and then you do something STUPID like this. Well done....not. This is where your logic fails, by allowing him, after going through the slides, they are at least accessory to it, hence part guilty. |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:49:00 -
[1074] - Quote
they didn't even raise a peep: they watched him do it and didn't bat an eye
they were cool with it |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:50:00 -
[1075] - Quote
but then suddenly reversed course, putting them in the ... interesting ... position of having a corporate policy that joking statements in poor taste are significantly worse than open praise of david duke, head of the KKK, on the eve online forums |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
893
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:52:00 -
[1076] - Quote
CCP Xhagen and other CCP staff members, if you are interested I have religiously and without pause scoured the eve forums for any mention of suicide, killing oneself or any other physical harm caused to one's person, and reported them in the hope that you can possibly help these people get the assistance they direly need. |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
127
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:52:00 -
[1077] - Quote
I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
202
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:53:00 -
[1078] - Quote
To be fair, It didn't look like mohawk-man had much control of what was going on. |
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
726
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:53:00 -
[1079] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
Deal with it now. You removed our candidate, not the CSM. You disenfranchised us, and as a result you're going to fix it for us.
Like titans?
|
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
895
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:54:00 -
[1080] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at.
It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc |
|
Entombment
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:56:00 -
[1081] - Quote
The problem with this entire thread. is the people saying "oh CCP is doing the right thing" are all just pubbies who hate goonswarm. CCP infact went through this the wrong way. We now have 10,000 angry coalition members, and we can't wardec CCP, (we can but we can't shoot them) but we can indeed wardec the "victim". |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
895
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:56:00 -
[1082] - Quote
nope, not at all |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
127
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:57:00 -
[1083] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc
I ALREADY CANCELLED MY 50 ACCOUNTS BECAUSE IM DISENFRANCHISED. JOIN ME BROTHER. IF WE ALL 'QUIT' THE GAME THEY WILL HAVE TO LISTEN TO US WE ARE 4 PERCENT OF THE PLAYER BASE. |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
127
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:57:00 -
[1084] - Quote
~10058~ |
Deeavlo
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:57:00 -
[1085] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
Jesus, why don't you just tell Mittens to kill himself already? |
Glasi Vookto
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:58:00 -
[1086] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
+ I'm glad to see that there will be NO perma ban on Mittens trying for future CSM's. Granted im sure his efforts for the csm have been highly over rated, but its undeniable that he has had an impact due to the successful outcomes of this past 12 months.
+ It's understandable that you dont want to hold a re election, but perhaps you could open it up so the eve mass's could vote for who they want as the chairman, and not leave it to the current csm to nominate there own. This would give us ALL the opportunity to make up for our votes no matter who they went to. (no i didnt vote for mittens, but i almost did)
+ Although i have not viewed the footage of the event, im curious how an ingame message could be blown to these proportions. Eve is a game with scams and in character abuse happening pretty much on an hourly basis. The only difference i see here is the influenece of booze and a live webfeed. For this i blame ccp as the suspect q&a session should have been done at a time when little alchohol had been consumed. On top of this, ALL feeds should have been vetted, to this effect i find no excuse in allowing a live feed.
+ The in game mail was the precursor to all the following actions, so as such, has the initial posted (victim) had any bans or restrictions placed on them? As i understand it, they started the rl references to commiting suicide, and who is to say they weren't simply refering to poding themself, and this whole thing has been blown well out of proportion? I also read somewher that mittani gave this so called victim 1.8billion in isk as a way towards an apology? I sincerely hope this has been removed from said victims account in light of ccp's actions in regards to banning a player.
|
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
125
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:59:00 -
[1087] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. your titan is still being nerfed |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1795
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 17:59:00 -
[1088] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc I ALREADY CANCELLED MY 50 ACCOUNTS BECAUSE IM DISENFRANCHISED. JOIN ME BROTHER. IF WE ALL 'QUIT' THE GAME THEY WILL HAVE TO LISTEN TO US WE ARE 4 PERCENT OF THE PLAYER BASE.
The brutal irony is that if the entirety of Goonswarm quit tomorrow it'd probably take about a month to make up the loss with extra hisec miners and carebears deciding that Eve was now a game for them after all.
(and course with the biggest NAPFEST the game has ever seen being broken up then 0.0 wars would start getting interesting again.)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
895
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:00:00 -
[1089] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc I ALREADY CANCELLED MY 50 ACCOUNTS BECAUSE IM DISENFRANCHISED. JOIN ME BROTHER. IF WE ALL 'QUIT' THE GAME THEY WILL HAVE TO LISTEN TO US WE ARE 4 PERCENT OF THE PLAYER BASE.
The only goons who have whined about cancelling their accounts are pretty much 100% idiots fyi
~10,058~ disenfranchised voters |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
125
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:01:00 -
[1090] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc I ALREADY CANCELLED MY 50 ACCOUNTS BECAUSE IM DISENFRANCHISED. JOIN ME BROTHER. IF WE ALL 'QUIT' THE GAME THEY WILL HAVE TO LISTEN TO US WE ARE 4 PERCENT OF THE PLAYER BASE. The brutal irony is that if the entirety of Goonswarm quit tomorrow it'd probably take about a month to make up the loss with extra hisec miners and carebears deciding that Eve was now a game for them after all. (and course with the biggest NAPFEST the game has ever seen being broken up then 0.0 wars would start getting interesting again.) so you're literally saying that when people consider playing eve, they realize that people from the somethingawful forum play eve, then they decide not to play eve |
|
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:02:00 -
[1091] - Quote
The Mittani did himself in here on the Alliance Panel and there can be little argument about that. That being said CCP did probably err in the following:
1) Allowing intoxicated persons participate in the panel
2) Allowing people on the panel to drink during the panel
3) Approving some pretty distasteful slideshows and thus giving their tacit endorsement to said content
4) Allowing the Alliance panel to operate without moderation by CCP
Looking to next year, such reforms would include barring obviously intoxicated panelists from participating, not permitting drinking during panels, and CCP employees moderating the panels, and exercising more caution when reviewing/approving materials for panels.
CCP did not create this fiasco, but CCP did create an environment that permitted, and perhaps even encouraged this nonsense in the first place. Corrections should be made going forward. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
895
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:02:00 -
[1092] - Quote
Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc I ALREADY CANCELLED MY 50 ACCOUNTS BECAUSE IM DISENFRANCHISED. JOIN ME BROTHER. IF WE ALL 'QUIT' THE GAME THEY WILL HAVE TO LISTEN TO US WE ARE 4 PERCENT OF THE PLAYER BASE. The brutal irony is that if the entirety of Goonswarm quit tomorrow it'd probably take about a month to make up the loss with extra hisec miners and carebears deciding that Eve was now a game for them after all. (and course with the biggest NAPFEST the game has ever seen being broken up then 0.0 wars would start getting interesting again.) so you're literally saying that when people consider playing eve, they realize that people from the somethingawful forum play eve, then they decide not to play eve
cultural victory |
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
152
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:03:00 -
[1093] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
Hi CCP Xhagen, which CSM bylaw are you applying in this case? The document linked from the CSM community page is this one: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdf
In the section on candidate eligbility it states:
Quote:Also, players with a serious warning22 or ban on any account in their possession can be excluded from candidate eligibility. However, in-game behavior, regardless of play style, will never be a criterion for candidacy unless the rules of the EULA and/or TOS are violated.
This is a get out clause, not a hard and fast rule so this doesn't mandate The Mittani's exclusion from CSM6 or 7.
The section on representative conduct states:
Quote:any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow.
Now this is a little ambiguous because its not clear whether "the council" refers to the current iteration of the CSM or all iterations. However, the interpretation implied by your statement is that it refers only to CSM6, in which case he should still be eligible for CSM7. If that is not the case he should be barred from all future CSMs.
If I'm referring to the wrong versions of the byelaws then please let me know, however the pdf above is linked from the CSM community page (http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/). I'm also aware that at the end of the day you don't have to abide by these self imposed rules, however I'd appreciate if you didn't try to paint this as a decision forced upon you by them when it clearly isn't. |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
127
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:03:00 -
[1094] - Quote
I just like the Titan nerf thread where Raiden whined like babbies and were 'cancelling their accounts'. And goons trololol'd them.
This is an exact replica with a different alliance ticker.
I get to laugh at both of them. It's so cute. |
Entombment
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:03:00 -
[1095] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:~10058~
Actually our exit polls showed that this year mittens got 10,011 votes from inside the coalition, only 47 outside of the CFC voted for him and they could very well have been alts. |
Li Charen-Teng
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:04:00 -
[1096] - Quote
Thanks for clarification, CCP Xhagen.
I voted for Mittani in CSM6 and he got none from me in CSM7 - his elitist attitude that he gained over the CSM6 period just a bad copy of old BOB and I seriously can't support that. Death to all shield supercaps! Checking EVE GATE every few minutes... |
Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
128
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:05:00 -
[1097] - Quote
Entombment wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:~10058~ Actually our exit polls showed that this year mittens got 10,011 votes from inside the coalition, only 47 outside of the CFC voted for him and they could very well have been alts.
Is your exit poll the redirect you had on your killboard? 'Cause I put i had 99 accounts about 5 times. |
Col Spinks
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:05:00 -
[1098] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote: Do you really seek to disenfranchise over ten thousand people? Hah, the last person to do that was Vladimir Putin!
Putin on the Ritz.
Seriously, far less people would have cared if the whole cyberbullying thing wasn't an issue in current media today. |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
895
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:08:00 -
[1099] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:Entombment wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:~10058~ Actually our exit polls showed that this year mittens got 10,011 votes from inside the coalition, only 47 outside of the CFC voted for him and they could very well have been alts. Is your exit poll the redirect you had on your killboard? 'Cause I put i had 99 accounts about 5 times.
Solo pretty religiously Drakbanned any odd results. |
Care Bear King
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:11:00 -
[1100] - Quote
Not a goon.
I was opposed to The Mittani's first term, but voted for him this time around based off what he did last time. Forcing someone to resign from CSM7 by suggesting they can run again under some technical loophole when they got more votes this time around than #2 and #3 combined is easily as terrible as this long, long sentence.
HTFU indeed.
What's next, someone getting PL banned for feeling offended by their copious use of the word '******' in voice chat?
. . .
A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players. Bring on CSM8. |
|
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
16
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:12:00 -
[1101] - Quote
Dez Affinity wrote:Entombment wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:~10058~ Actually our exit polls showed that this year mittens got 10,011 votes from inside the coalition, only 47 outside of the CFC voted for him and they could very well have been alts. Is your exit poll the redirect you had on your killboard? 'Cause I put i had 99 accounts about 5 times. sneaky, no way we would have thought to bounce all the input from people saying they had 99 accounts |
Col Spinks
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:13:00 -
[1102] - Quote
Li Charen-Teng wrote:Thanks for clarification, CCP Xhagen.
I voted for Mittani in CSM6 and he got none from me in CSM7 - his elitist attitude that he gained over the CSM6 period just a bad copy of old BOB and I seriously can't support that. Death to all shield supercaps!
Saying that El Mittani "gained" and elitist attitude during CSM6 is just showing the rest of us that either you weren't here before CSM 6, or that you just weren't paying attention. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1796
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:18:00 -
[1103] - Quote
Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:Dez Affinity wrote:I feel sorry for these straws that are being grasped at. It's not like you're grasping at your own straws to desperately prove to the world that you're not angered over the titan nerf, and it's not like you're using mittens' dismissal as some sort of tool you can wave around whilst shouting "HAHA LOOK AT THIS GUYS WE'RE NOT MAD ABOUT THE TITAN NERF NO NOT AT ALL HEH HAZED" etc I ALREADY CANCELLED MY 50 ACCOUNTS BECAUSE IM DISENFRANCHISED. JOIN ME BROTHER. IF WE ALL 'QUIT' THE GAME THEY WILL HAVE TO LISTEN TO US WE ARE 4 PERCENT OF THE PLAYER BASE. The brutal irony is that if the entirety of Goonswarm quit tomorrow it'd probably take about a month to make up the loss with extra hisec miners and carebears deciding that Eve was now a game for them after all. (and course with the biggest NAPFEST the game has ever seen being broken up then 0.0 wars would start getting interesting again.) so you're literally saying that when people consider playing eve, they realize that people from the somethingawful forum play eve, then they decide not to play eve
Thats pretty much the gist of comments on many gaming websites. But really I'm just trying to say that CCP don't need goonswarm anymore than they need 10,000 hisec mission runners. You guys should get over yourselves.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:18:00 -
[1104] - Quote
You all scream about Goons/CFC tears, but all I see are pubbies who think they finally have a chance to strike back for all the grief caused. It's not like the CFC is disbanding because you think you've "won". |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1796
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:19:00 -
[1105] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:You all scream about Goons/CFC tears, but all I see are pubbies who think they finally have a chance to strike back for all the grief caused. It's not like the CFC is disbanding because you think you've "won".
Well you did just have your "king of space" decapitated.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:21:00 -
[1106] - Quote
Chicken Pizza wrote:You morons say "10,058" like it's a large number. Do you even realize how many of those votes were probably alts? Do you know how many votes Obama alone received in the US 2008 presidential election? 69,456,897 votes. 52.92% of all of the voters in the third most populated country in the world. Kinda puts things into perspective, huh?
If Obama went live and told everyone in the US to feel free to call/mail/message a specific person and tell them to kill themselves, do you really think he would still be in office for much longer?
Most of you won't un-sub. Of the ones who do, I'm sure many, if not most, will inevitably re-sub. If you don't, good riddance.
Why don't you try looking at it conversely? Out of 59,109 votes cast, Mittani only received 10,058. That means 49,051 votes were NOT for Mittani. 83% of the votes/voters did NOT want Mittani for CSM. So while you're all bitching about how all 10,058 of you wanted Mittani to be CSM, consider the fact that the other 49,051 of us don't give a **** about what you think.
Math rules. Your math is awesome... especially where you compare the US population to the EVE pop. Go skill yourself. |
Deeavlo
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:22:00 -
[1107] - Quote
Li Charen-Teng wrote:Thanks for clarification, CCP Xhagen.
I voted for Mittani in CSM6 and he got none from me in CSM7 - his elitist attitude that he gained over the CSM6 period just a bad copy of old BOB and I seriously can't support that. Death to all shield supercaps!
If I were a huge part of a reason having good intentions of saving a video game company from committing seppuku by having mircotransaction items costing 60 IRL bucks, forcing their players contained in a small rusty 3rd world country like rooms with zero gameplay all the while melting their video cards, diverting their efforts from their flagship spaceship game to focus on twilight online and making countless of players regain their optimism for the future of Eve not seen since Apocrypha and resubbing again, I'd be smug as **** too. |
The Illuminist
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:23:00 -
[1108] - Quote
I haven't played much over the past few months and have only kept my account alive due to my love and memories of the game. This is as good a reason to let my account expire.
Bad show, CCP. |
Li Charen-Teng
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:28:00 -
[1109] - Quote
Mittani is not the only guy responsible guy for the good changes we had with Crucible. He was just the face to the media, he ****** up his face to the media in Q&A session with TOS violation. HTFU - the other guys in CSM6/7 will not break your game. Checking EVE GATE every few minutes... |
Omnathious Deninard
M'Tar Logistics Division Night Sky Alliance
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:29:00 -
[1110] - Quote
Goons lose there spot on the CSM, goons cry and talk about rage quitting.......... i dont see any problem here |
|
Lillith
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:29:00 -
[1111] - Quote
YES YES YES. Finally justice has been served!!!!!!!!!!!! |
Quinn Eskimo
Chaos Mercenaries BLACK-MARK
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:30:00 -
[1112] - Quote
Extremely bad decision on behalf of CCP. Banning a player after a public and private apology was made. On top of that a donation of billions to help lessen the insult and they still crucify him.
Mittani should be unbanned and allowed to continue his role on the CSM.
Darius III needs to be exterminated from the CSM, his posts are blatantly awful. He is derogatory beyond hope and is an insult to all those players who invest actual time and effort into helping improve this game.
Hows abouts CCP puts forward the list of remaining candidates and those 10,000 votes can be put towards selecting a replacement for Mittens. Just a thought like.....
''May Chaos Reign forever across the bleakness that is Eve''
Goodbye sweet Jita... |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
203
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:31:00 -
[1113] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Goons lose there spot on the CSM, goons cry and talk about rage quitting.......... i dont see any problem here
The problem is that people are doing the same as mittens did. They're taking it to real life and threatening him, his family and pet. |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
98
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:31:00 -
[1114] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Well you did just have your "king of space" decapitated.
Implying that he needs to play the game to lead a coalition? "Nullsec alliances will now begin counting reporters on staff along with supercapitals and tech moons. Unironically." - The Mittani |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:32:00 -
[1115] - Quote
T'hena Kha'tek wrote:Quote:10 058 bees after you. Grow a spine would you and get your facts straight. There is only 8323 people in your alliance and out of the 123 corps under your umbrella, 3601 are under the gewns ticker. So even if all 8323 voted which is highly unlikey unless all corp's kick inactive members after 4-6 weeks your only looking at 2000-3000 active players based on a 1.8 vote per person with a few other alliances in CFC making up the numbers. So No there is probably only 2-3k bumble bees and the rest are Pubbies arent they ?
You forget, there's about 27000+ accouns in CFC. Or did you think that only Goons would come gank you?
Like the rest of us doesn't wanna have any fun? |
Deeavlo
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:32:00 -
[1116] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:
Thats pretty much the gist of comments on many gaming websites. But really I'm just trying to say that CCP don't need goonswarm anymore than they need 10,000 hisec mission runners. You guys should get over yourselves.
The Sony marketing guy would like a word with you.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9Ozvef7CvQ#t=1h05m49s
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:34:00 -
[1117] - Quote
Agonising Ecstacy wrote:Mittens,
This only happened because you didn't have your Douche Canoe Protection Insurance. Avoid future costly errors, by depositing 10058 million isks into the wallet of Agonising Ecstacy. A certificate will be issued forthwith, indemnifying you against the costs of such blunders in the future.
Amidoinitrite?
No, you fail like the npc alt pubbie that you are. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1799
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:35:00 -
[1118] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Well you did just have your "king of space" decapitated.
Implying that he needs to play the game to lead a coalition?
implying that you understand what makes a guy like Alexander Gianturco tick. Without the media spotlight chances are he'll be bored of the game in six months at the outside.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
203
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:35:00 -
[1119] - Quote
Ivana Twinkle wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Goons lose there spot on the CSM, goons cry and talk about rage quitting.......... i dont see any problem here The problem is that people are doing the same as mittens did. They're taking it to real life and threatening him, his family and pet.
In addition they're doing it while sober and not in the spur of the moment. |
Deeavlo
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:41:00 -
[1120] - Quote
Ivana Twinkle wrote:Ivana Twinkle wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Goons lose there spot on the CSM, goons cry and talk about rage quitting.......... i dont see any problem here The problem is that people are doing the same as mittens did. They're taking it to real life and threatening him, his family and pet. In addition they're doing it while sober and not in the spur of the moment.
Pretty much this, I mean who the hell threatens a dog?! Pathetic. |
|
Omnathious Deninard
M'Tar Logistics Division Night Sky Alliance
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:43:00 -
[1121] - Quote
Ivana Twinkle wrote:Ivana Twinkle wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Goons lose there spot on the CSM, goons cry and talk about rage quitting.......... i dont see any problem here The problem is that people are doing the same as mittens did. They're taking it to real life and threatening him, his family and pet. In addition they're doing it while sober and not in the spur of the moment. Well when they do that on an open broadcast tell ccp to ban them as well for cyberbullying, if they cause emotional harm to the mittani sue for damages, if they assault him report if it to the police. All actions have reactions, that is true in eve, and in real life. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:43:00 -
[1122] - Quote
John McCreedy wrote:From the TOS: Quote: If you are between 13 and 18 years of age, you must have the permission of your parent or guardian to before providing the personal information required to create an EVE Online game or website account.
Not to excuse what was said but how about some responsibility accepted for the debacle by CCP for allowing the presentation participants to get blind drunk before going "on air"? CCP's actions where hardly responsible when 13 year old kids (well below the legal drinking age in many countries) where able to legally access the live feed but where subjected to constant references to the glorification of irresponsible drinking, therefore CCP need to issue an apology for their part in this and review their policies towards these issues before the next Fanfest. We should get Mothers for sober children or something like that to pound on CCP for showing alcohol to minors. |
Zowie Powers
Hole in the wall
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:43:00 -
[1123] - Quote
So because he walked before he was pushed he can run again in the future.
That's a very weak position to uphold CCP. Citation Needed. |
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:45:00 -
[1124] - Quote
CCP... you need to add a feature on the forums to be able to "hide posts" from an entire alliance like you can with individual posters. Then this thread will actually compress to a few pages of praising CCP for it's right decision and we will be able to read real and meaningful comments from the community rather than this tearfest. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:47:00 -
[1125] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Empathic Psychopath wrote:Koby Botick wrote:1/6 th of all votes disregarded. Is CCP back a russian sounding abbreviation again? I hear they like to manipulate votes in plain sight there too.
Wasn't it goons that were praising CCP not that long ago when a nerf to tians was announced? My how the mighty have fallen :) "Oooooh look at me, I can use fancy words I saw in a movie once!" Was the movie Roadhouse? |
Entombment
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:50:00 -
[1126] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Richard Desturned wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Well you did just have your "king of space" decapitated.
Implying that he needs to play the game to lead a coalition? implying that you understand what makes a guy like Alexander Gianturco tick. Without the media spotlight chances are he'll be bored of the game in six months at the outside.
good thing he's only banned for 30 days nerd. |
Kmelx
Applied Creations The Fendahlian Collective
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:54:00 -
[1127] - Quote
Brae Haen wrote:I'm not trolling
Then you sir are obviously lost.
These are the official eve forums - get with the program for god's sake |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
203
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:57:00 -
[1128] - Quote
The question remains:
Will YOU come to Banfest 2013? |
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
92
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:57:00 -
[1129] - Quote
Ivana Twinkle wrote:The question remains:
Will YOU come to Banfest 2013? nope. |
Drago Palermus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 18:57:00 -
[1130] - Quote
Why is this thread now a page shorter than it was a few minutes ago?
My poooooasts |
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:02:00 -
[1131] - Quote
Quote:Ya i know that's the most probable route of action for ccp .. but .. the CSM rules state NO EXCEPTIONS. He must NOT be allowed into the CSM again, as per rules. Otherwise, ccp is opening a very very dangerous door. a) goon special treatment theory's are proven right b) mittanus claim on his recent ceo update where he claims and i quote: "One could additionally argue that IGÇÖve spent so much time in Iceland this year that IGÇÖve become co-opted by CCP; I have too many friends who work at the company and I donGÇÖt want to **** them over " ( source) c) CCP wont be able to permaban anyone from CSM in the future, since a new precedent is set. Once again, i am waiting for some official answer on the matter, altho i understand it's not a easy subject to reply to, must be answered, otherwise CSM <-> CCP <-> GOONS relationship is not as transparent as CCP claim and needs further investigation, at the possible cost of CSM complete collapse, not to mention CCP/EVE itself.
As it is CCP who made those rules they are allowed to bend, break and change them as they see fit, you whining about it here won't make it written in stone. |
Wirbin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
78
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:10:00 -
[1132] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Entombment wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Richard Desturned wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Well you did just have your "king of space" decapitated.
Implying that he needs to play the game to lead a coalition? implying that you understand what makes a guy like Alexander Gianturco tick. Without the media spotlight chances are he'll be bored of the game in six months at the outside. good thing he's only banned for 30 days nerd. Because a guy that doesn't even play Eve ingame really cares about a 30 day eve ban and the fact he's no longer darling of the gaming press is completely irrelevant right?
you are a dickgirl roleplayer, stop posting |
cap Mal
Defense Advanced Research Program Agency
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:17:00 -
[1133] - Quote
Ispia Jaydrath wrote: I can tell you're in marketing because of the way you're weaseling around to make it look like mittens resigned from CSM 7 instead of you removing him.
The best thing about conspiracies is that any attempt to dispute it is just part of the conspiracy. Congratulations in confirming to the world that you're a simple minded idiot.
Also, whine more please. |
WolfLeader316
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:21:00 -
[1134] - Quote
Yeep wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
Hi CCP Xhagen, which CSM bylaw are you applying in this case? The document linked from the CSM community page is this one: http://community.eveonline.com/download/devblog/CSM.pdfIn the section on candidate eligbility it states: Quote:Also, players with a serious warning22 or ban on any account in their possession can be excluded from candidate eligibility. However, in-game behavior, regardless of play style, will never be a criterion for candidacy unless the rules of the EULA and/or TOS are violated. This is a get out clause, not a hard and fast rule so this doesn't mandate The Mittani's exclusion from CSM6 or 7. The section on representative conduct states: Quote:any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the eula or tos by a Csm representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow. Now this is a little ambiguous because its not clear whether "the council" refers to the current iteration of the CSM or all iterations. However, the interpretation implied by your statement is that it refers only to CSM6, in which case he should still be eligible for CSM7. If that is not the case he should be barred from all future CSMs. If I'm referring to the wrong versions of the byelaws then please let me know, however the pdf above is linked from the CSM community page (http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/). I'm also aware that at the end of the day you don't have to abide by these self imposed rules, however I'd appreciate if you didn't try to paint this as a decision forced upon you by them when it clearly isn't.
This here is a good post.
|
Takoten Yaken
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:23:00 -
[1135] - Quote
Hi, my post asking why you deleted posts calling out a neo-nazi candidate was erased, and my character banned from the forums for 14 days.
I don't intend to be silent about this issue so I'd like a response this time. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
109
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:24:00 -
[1136] - Quote
BUTTECORP INC will not be silenced |
Ispia Jaydrath
Reib Autonomous Industries
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:40:00 -
[1137] - Quote
cap Mal wrote:Ispia Jaydrath wrote: I can tell you're in marketing because of the way you're weaseling around to make it look like mittens resigned from CSM 7 instead of you removing him.
The best thing about conspiracies is that any attempt to dispute it is just part of the conspiracy. Congratulations in confirming to the world that you're a simple minded idiot. Also, whine more please.
If you're going to use hurtful words like that, you could at least tell me when I said anything about a conspiracy. Or, you know, provide a counterpoint in some way. Something productive.
As it is you're just being rude on the internet. |
Takoten Yaken
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:42:00 -
[1138] - Quote
we post and post but the thread stays the same length :catdrugs: |
Cyaron wars
D00M. Northern Coalition.
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:59:00 -
[1139] - Quote
At least he won't drink before presentation any more. what a tard, oh wait... he's goon... |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:12:00 -
[1140] - Quote
Cyaron wars wrote:At least he won't drink before presentation any more. what a tard, oh wait... he's goon... At least he has an excuse, what's yours? |
|
Ugleb
Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan
182
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:24:00 -
[1141] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Xhagen, were you not there moderating the panel?
I doubt he had a mute control over The Mittani's voice in the handful of seconds it took to make those comments. And as stated elsewhere, CCP's feed was going out live without any delay for editing.
It's unfortunate that this happened and that a significantly contributing member of CSM6 will not be returning for CSM7, but the error was entirely that of The Mittani and I think that CCP are applying the rules correctly and fairly. If they let this slide then they lose their moral authority in future.
CSM7 will be weakened by the loss of its would-be chairman, and CSM8 will probably suffer some backlash as well, but its the call CCP have to make. 10 votes or 10,000 is irrelevant when the rules are clear. http://uglebsjournal.wordpress.com/ |
Endeavour Starfleet
788
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:25:00 -
[1142] - Quote
Nice try CCP at saying "BUT BUT BUT!!!!" You had intended to directly nullify his seat with the ban yet got lucky enough for him to resign so you could throw him under the bus and point.
10k votes screwed over by CCP. You had an absolute crap voting system so that many votes were wasted and now 10k just went out the window.
Just shut down the CSM CCP. You don't seem to care about the voters anyway. |
Lazertouch
Distinguished Gentleman's Boating Club Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:26:00 -
[1143] - Quote
"he who must not be named" best wizard ever 10k+ votes
Miners are muggles! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:34:00 -
[1144] - Quote
Brae Haen wrote:Ive got a question which was not covered by the post. This might sound a little out there but wouldn't a player who is threatening to committ suicide due to in game actions also be considered a violation of the EULA/TOS? It is a threat, it is harassment and a case could be made that it is cyberbullying.
I'm not trolling, or trying to attack the offended player. I'm not a mindless Goon trying to start more drama. But I am interested on what CCP's stance on this is.
Hmm, Interesting assessment. I too would like to see an official answer to this, just for amusements sake.
Gizmo Marpa wrote: No, CCP was just there implicitly urging everyone to get hammered because Fanfest is (rightfully) a "party" atmosphere.
Then some crybabies cried crocodile tears simply because someone they don't like said something that they considered a HUGE OUTRAGE
Someone forgot to buy the them free shots so they emo raged |
jugornaut
Diversified Holdings
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:49:00 -
[1145] - Quote
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:10k votes screwed over by CCP. You had an absolute crap voting system so that many votes were wasted and now 10k just went out the window.
Just shut down the CSM CCP. You don't seem to care about the voters anyway.
10k votes screwed over by the guy that you voted for - he already stepped down before ccp said he was gone morons cant seem to figure this out durka dur
|
Takoten Yaken
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:51:00 -
[1146] - Quote
jugornaut wrote:Endeavour Starfleet wrote:10k votes screwed over by CCP. You had an absolute crap voting system so that many votes were wasted and now 10k just went out the window.
Just shut down the CSM CCP. You don't seem to care about the voters anyway. 10k votes screwed over by the guy that you voted for - he already stepped down before ccp said he was gone morons cant seem to figure this out durka dur hi my dimwitted friend
this is a clear lie based on what ccp posted
thanks for trying though |
Eve Carel
Northern Freight Unlimited Clockwork Pineapple
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:52:00 -
[1147] - Quote
He was going to decline the CSM7 chairmanship. Learn to use your primary brain functions (processing information in case you didn't get it) |
jugornaut
Diversified Holdings
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:57:00 -
[1148] - Quote
still screwed over by the guy you voted for - maybe as a person in a higher position he should learn to watch his mouth instead of sticking his foot in it like most goons?
people in a position like this should be held to a higher standard - guess you loose |
Drago Palermus
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:02:00 -
[1149] - Quote
jugornaut wrote:still screwed over by the guy you voted for - maybe as a person in a higher position he should learn to watch his mouth instead of sticking his foot in it like most goons?
people in a position like this should be held to a higher standard - guess you loose How dare you impugn my tightness!
Also, what you are saying goes directly against the jovial atmosphere of fanfest. I've never been, but it seems like CCP's #1 goal is to make it A Fun Place for Fun People. If you just wanted a bunch of droll nerds talking quietly about spaceships, well, that can be arranged, but it would be pretty boring. |
Mechaet
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:08:00 -
[1150] - Quote
Drago Palermus wrote:[quote=jugornaut]If you just wanted a bunch of droll nerds talking quietly about spaceships, well, that can be arranged, but it would be pretty boring. You've been to a Blizzcon, I see. |
|
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:12:00 -
[1151] - Quote
VICTORY IN THE NAME OF THE PEOPLE'S WILL !!
It is high time that this "Mittani" criminal be punished for his crimes against the common pod pilots of EVE. His gross disregard of proper decorum, cavalier attitude of disrespect of both players and his position as CSM Chairman deserved nothing less than what he has received.
Hopefully this will serve to motivate those who have been selected to act on behalf of EVE's community to take a more responsible and evenhanded approach to the duties which they have been awarded by the players. The CSM is a rare opportunity for gamers to participate in the evolution of the game they enjoy and the CSM members should honor their positions with comensurate professionalism.
Game on !
FORWARD THE REVOLUTION ! |
jugornaut
Diversified Holdings
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:13:00 -
[1152] - Quote
i 100% agree - fanfest should be "jovial" but is bashing someone elses RL deficiencies fun? or just make you look like an ass... i think we can all use our (how did she put it?) "higher brain functions" to find something fun to do without being open jackass's to each other
:edit - the above poster is goin slightly overboard but meh |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
326
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:15:00 -
[1153] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
Didn't want that illusion of democracy anyway.
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:16:00 -
[1154] - Quote
I think all the current delegates should ask themselves each time they come up with a new suggestion, what would Mittens do?
Skill yourself! |
Emiko P'eng
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:20:00 -
[1155] - Quote
As a first time attendee at FanFest the Alliance Panel just reinforced my views of Goonswarm and their leader in particular
The Q&A section basically shows what binge drinking can do to your life. RUIN IT!!!
The apology & CCP's actions I feel are enough
The fact that fans and CCP can go drinking together and have a party at the end. Has no bearing on this as they are both 'unofficial' when it comes to what is said or done. Unless they burn down a bar or kill someone
The Alliance Panel though, being an officially sanctioned by CCP and 'monitored' as in CCP vet the presentations. Is covered by the EULA. So when someone does break the EULA by their own stupidity CCP needs to act.
Unfortunately the real damage done here to CCP is due to the whole thing being broadcast
The fact that this panel was transmitted live to anyone on the planet. In HD for CCP subscribers who paid and normal for anyone else, CCP subscriber or 'NOT' highlights CCP's naivety about live broadcasts. Live broadcasts should always be run with a time delay to allow for offending or illegal actions to be removed or 'bleeped'
Even the BBC uses it on the satirical political panel show 'Have I got News for You'
As for CSM I feel a re-run of the election is required and if 'Goonswarm' wishes to put forward a new candidate they should be allowed too. As stupidity the of one should never get in the way of representation of the many! |
Kat Ayclism
Starwinders The Unwilling.
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:38:00 -
[1156] - Quote
Darius can break the NDA with no ramifications but Mittens makes fun of a carebear's pathetic, bleating attempt to gain sympathy and gets a 30day ban?
I guess I'll be reporting all the tears I get that contain threats or emo baww from now on.
Mittens remains chairman of my heart. |
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:48:00 -
[1157] - Quote
The Mittani earned the treatment he received. Arrogance, lack of common courtesy, and a gross disregard for proper decorum in a publicly elected position of the People of EVE is the cause of his demise.
Despots and Exploiters of the People historically end up this way. |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:52:00 -
[1158] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Ordais wrote:Goon tears....so many goon tears....*nomnomnom*
As for the 10.000 voters....its not CCPs fault that you candidate shot himself in the foot and can't represent you anymore. Take it up with him.
Well, i do agree with the desicion, but it will hurt the game in many ways wich makes me even MORE angry at Mittens...you just couldn't pull yourself together. All this talk about "beeing a politician" and "understanding how this works"....and then you do something STUPID like this. Well done....not. This is where your logic fails, by allowing him, after going through the slides, they are at least accessory to it, hence part guilty.
AFTER the presentation , AFTER it , no slides involved
get that into your skull
all his fault ...
What a lot of goon need to realise is that its not because we hate you that we do these things Its because WE LOVE YOU |
Lt Pizi
Dark-Rising
57
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 22:02:00 -
[1159] - Quote
Emiko P'eng wrote:As a first time attendee at FanFest the Alliance Panel just reinforced my views of Goonswarm and their leader in particular
The Q&A section basically shows what binge drinking can do to your life. RUIN IT!!!
The apology & CCP's actions I feel are enough
The fact that fans and CCP can go drinking together and have a party at the end. Has no bearing on this as they are both 'unofficial' when it comes to what is said or done. Unless they burn down a bar or kill someone
The Alliance Panel though, being an officially sanctioned by CCP and 'monitored' as in CCP vet the presentations. Is covered by the EULA. So when someone does break the EULA by their own stupidity CCP needs to act.
Unfortunately the real damage done here to CCP is due to the whole thing being broadcast
The fact that this panel was transmitted live to anyone on the planet. In HD for CCP subscribers who paid and normal for anyone else, CCP subscriber or 'NOT' highlights CCP's naivety about live broadcasts. Live broadcasts should always be run with a time delay to allow for offending or illegal actions to be removed or 'bleeped'
Even the BBC uses it on the satirical political panel show 'Have I got News for You'
As for CSM I feel a re-run of the election is required and if 'Goonswarm' wishes to put forward a new candidate they should be allowed too. As stupidity the of one should never get in the way of representation of the many!
remember nipplegate a few years ago ? even high profile TV station made the same mistake ...
so its hard to blame a game company running for 10k visitors What a lot of goon need to realise is that its not because we hate you that we do these things Its because WE LOVE YOU |
Mechaet
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 22:42:00 -
[1160] - Quote
Comrade Commizzar wrote:...Arrogance, lack of common courtesy, and a gross disregard for proper decorum... Those are actually traits I look for in people I invite to come play Eve. Because they're honest. |
|
Kai Pirinha
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 22:51:00 -
[1161] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:I think all the current delegates should ask themselves each time they come up with a new suggestion, what would Mittens do?
And then do the opposite - or at least think about it again and do it the smart way. |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
48
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 22:54:00 -
[1162] - Quote
I think people need to pull themselves from up their own arses and reflect on what really matters in life... |
Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
153
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:00:00 -
[1163] - Quote
Aruken Marr wrote:I think people need to pull themselves from up their own arses and reflect on what really matters in life...
Never stopping posting? |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
48
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:01:00 -
[1164] - Quote
Yeep wrote:Aruken Marr wrote:I think people need to pull themselves from up their own arses and reflect on what really matters in life... Never stopping posting?
Couldn't even if I wanted to |
Jason1138
The Catalina Wine Mixer
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:05:00 -
[1165] - Quote
"CCP in no way condones the harassment of players"
LOL sure you don't. Sure you don't
|
Ebon Rue
The Incursion Career University
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:09:00 -
[1166] - Quote
Jason1138 wrote:"CCP in no way condones the harassment of players"
LOL sure you don't. Sure you don't
Depends on how you define harassment. >:-D
Harassment via in game mechanics is fine*, meta harassment is not.
(*You may be required to prove that your actions benefit you in some way.) |
Jason1138
The Catalina Wine Mixer
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:10:00 -
[1167] - Quote
"It's unfortunate that this happened and that a significantly contributing member of CSM6 will not be returning for CSM7, but the error was entirely that of The Mittani and I think that CCP are applying the rules correctly and fairly. If they let this slide then they lose their moral authority in future."
How much moral authority did a company founded by griefers for griefers every have to begin with though? |
Jason1138
The Catalina Wine Mixer
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:13:00 -
[1168] - Quote
"Harassment via in game mechanics is fine*, meta harassment is not."
giving out a toon's name is in game by definition though, right?
if he gave out the guy's real life name and phone number then obviously that's wrong but to sit there and say "this guy (toon's name) is dumb, ********, a crybaby, etc, go mess with him in game until he cries/kills himself/quits the game, etc" is something we've all seen thousands of times
in fact, it is all but the stated purpose for the game's existence. |
Nathanael Lemmont
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises Test Alliance Please Ignore
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:23:00 -
[1169] - Quote
I find CCP's hypocrisy and sanctimoniousness about all of this to be rather gross. |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
456
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:27:00 -
[1170] - Quote
Look at the bright side. He only got charged and banned for breaking the EULA.
Other companies would also probably ponder a lawsuit in case they'd get damage over their fresh deals with Sony or would lose sponsorship off nVidia etc. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
|
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
184
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:28:00 -
[1171] - Quote
I also love CCP's comparison to real life politics as the low hanging fruit they reach for to avoid ::effort::. Welp, we didn't want a player mandated CSM anyways. |
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
729
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:39:00 -
[1172] - Quote
Alex/Mittens supporters....
End your subscriptions.
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:40:00 -
[1173] - Quote
Mechaet wrote:Comrade Commizzar wrote:...Arrogance, lack of common courtesy, and a gross disregard for proper decorum... Those are actually traits I look for in people I invite to come play Eve. Because they're honest.
+1
You always know where you stand with an a-hole, and you'll always see him comming, because he'll never stab you in the back, He'll stab you in the face, and he'll tell you when he's going to do it. I've never trusted anyone that goes out of their way to be nice to me |
Slurp DatDurp
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:46:00 -
[1174] - Quote
DELICIOUS GOON TEARS!!!
|
J Random
Teshnology Inc. Stealth Wear Inc.
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:08:00 -
[1175] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
The real question I have here is were they (the CSM members) aware of this prior to the event happening?
|
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
185
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:09:00 -
[1176] - Quote
J Random wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
The real question I have here is were they (the CSM members) aware of this prior to the event happening? No, the real question is why does ccp constantly move the rules around to achieve whatever agenda they have? Because they couldn't care less about the mittani or any of the effort he put into making this a better game. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:11:00 -
[1177] - Quote
Kai Pirinha wrote:Kosh Seere wrote:I think all the current delegates should ask themselves each time they come up with a new suggestion, what would Mittens do?
And then do the opposite - or at least think about it again and do it the smart way. So you want them to ruin EVE.
This is why we can't have shiny objects. Skill yourself! |
Ibn Taymiyyah
Treasures Collectors Northern Associates.
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:13:00 -
[1178] - Quote
Well, just to put my bias out, we're red to the goons, didn't vote for the man so my votes are still well represented. My representation if at all, just got stronger with this but ...
This seems like a very ****** maneuver by CCP, with all the timeline the events were processed.
3 days with "deal with it" threads and not a single worry from CCP ... then pubbies with axes to grind due to being griefed to hell by goons, so no love there, come out and spam "KILL" until CCP actually does what they want just to save face.
I understand that the goons have little love from almost anyone, due to their "we're out to destroy your game" ... but that's all within the rules! I understood those rules when I joined the game.
Even though I understand the need to kill this issue due on the CCP as a company side, due to bad press... but on the other hand I can't help feel this was them choosing the easy way out. No one criticized the presentation. People on the audience GOT THE JOKE as they laughed at it, CCP also got the joke, in due context, and some five days later shows up with a broken heart and feeling the moral standards higher than ever? WTF?
Mittens got ****** over by years of goons ******* with others people gaming experience and CCP just joined the band wagon forgetting to take into account that even them (CCP) saw nothing wrong with the presentation when it was done. ****, I almost bet most devs smirked/smiled/laughed at the damn thing when it was happening!
This ban was WRONG, the resignation from the CSM, if unvoluntary, was wrong. Mittens can repent all he wants, resign for all his positions,as is his right... but the way this was all treated just to save face in the end just disgusts me and I too have an axe to grind with the goons!
Free Mittens!
Fake edit: if he ever runs again, you can bet he's getting 20k votes ... or at least my 4 accounts, which none voted for him this time, will be voting on him. CCP grow your balls back PLEASE! |
Demitrios
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:32:00 -
[1179] - Quote
Who would have thought that the EULA applied to how you conducted your self in life as well as in the game.
Must remember not to slow anyone down on the motorway for lols, or CCP will ban me for intentionally causing lag and griefing. |
Pyro Tsu
Sarum Industries Viking Empire
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:48:00 -
[1180] - Quote
The entire CSM7 should do one thing on their first day: step down - and refuse to reassemble. If they feel that CCP's reaction is too harsh and/or not backed up by the written rules.
But after all, hasn't "he" been a lawyer? I am looking forward to his response. I would not be surprised if he referenced one of the principles of Roman Law... We'll see. |
|
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:49:00 -
[1181] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:Alex/Mittens supporters....
End your subscriptions.
Go skill yourself. Skill yourself! |
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
186
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:52:00 -
[1182] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Hurr durrr goonie hate. Go skill yourself. Alternatively, get thrilled by a speeding bus. |
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
186
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:56:00 -
[1183] - Quote
Pyro Tsu wrote:The entire CSM7 should do one thing on their first day: step down - and refuse to reassemble. If they feel that CCP's reaction is too harsh and/or not backed up by the written rules.
But after all, hasn't "he" been a lawyer? I am looking forward to his response. I would not be surprised if he referenced one of the principles of Roman Law... We'll see. Here's hoping that the current CSM sees what a grand catastrophic error they made in completely removing him from the CSM. He already posted a response, Pyro. He made a mumble speech to his coalition yesterday. Dont have a link handy, it's posted on many sites that host eve stuff. |
Aramis Rosicrux
Aliastra Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:00:00 -
[1184] - Quote
First, Mittens is a self-involved prlck and I hope he emofart/ragequits and I never have to deal with him again... but:
CCP's actions are arrogant, arbitrary and a slap in the face to the playerbase.
Consider: CCP makes the game rules so damn mean that people want to kill themselves over losses in the game, but then blames an alliance leader for following your play style set up?
How can you be such hypocrites?
Mittens may deserve a reminder, but it is YOU, the DEVS and GM's that make us want to slash our wrists when we get ganked. I don't blame Goons for playing the game, I blame you for making the game so mean spirited.
Look, I love Eve, and I will miss it when it goes, but you got to be fairer than this.
Un-Ban Mittens and restore his position as CSM chair. Anything less makes you guilty of everything you accuse him of.
Eve: The Anti-Social MMO. |
lol fourm troll
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:06:00 -
[1185] - Quote
Aramis Rosicrux wrote:First, Mittens is a self-involved prlck and I hope he emofart/ragequits and I never have to deal with him again... but:
CCP's actions are arrogant, arbitrary and a slap in the face to the playerbase.
Consider: CCP makes the game rules so damn mean that people want to kill themselves over losses in the game, but then blames an alliance leader for following your play style set up?
How can you be such hypocrites?
Mittens may deserve a reminder, but it is YOU, the DEVS and GM's that make us want to slash our wrists when we get ganked. I don't blame Goons for playing the game, I blame you for making the game so mean spirited.
Look, I love Eve, and I will miss it when it goes, but you got to be fairer than this.
Un-Ban Mittens and restore his position as CSM chair. Anything less makes you guilty of everything you accuse him of.
Eve: The Anti-Social MMO. Is not each player in control of there own actions? How is giving a player the choice to gank someone the devs fault? The player who ganks you was fully aware and in control of there desicion. The only mean spirited players are the ones who want to be mean spirited. |
Moon Kitten
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:09:00 -
[1186] - Quote
Jason1138 wrote:"Harassment via in game mechanics is fine*, meta harassment is not."
giving out a toon's name is in game by definition though, right?
if he gave out the guy's real life name and phone number then obviously that's wrong but to sit there and say "this guy (toon's name) is dumb, ********, a crybaby, etc, go mess with him in game until he cries/kills himself/quits the game, etc" is something we've all seen thousands of times
in fact, it is all but the stated purpose for the game's existence.
This is what I never understood about this fuss. He gave out a -character- name. He did not give any personal information out. He gave out a character name and told people to go **** with him. Maybe he did it awkwardly and offensively but there was never any intent for griefing of "wis" to be taken out of the game. Mittani was suggesting he be messed with -within- the confines of Eve.
Obviously I'm more likely to give Mittens the benefit of the doubt than people that hate him but to me it always felt like he intended it to mean "**** with these players" not "**** with these real life people". I personally prefer to separate real life and the game so if someone (especially a stranger) sends me a long evemail with personal details I will try my best to treat it like something in game and not some truthful statements about a real life person because I have no context by which to judge it in that light. As a result I would think nothing about replying to an evemail about depression with "just kill yourself." Hell, who hasn't self-destructed within the game before?
I just feel like his punishment would have been deserved if he had given out an email address or said "Hey this guy is 34 years old, lives with his mother, and is a massive nerd". Instead he made fun of an in game message, in a forum about the game it was received in, and gave out his in game character.
I do understand that the only reason it's taken seriously is the CCP policy of assuming anything relating to suicide is automatically understood in an out of game context for safety, but did Mittani know that? I didn't, until the events of this, and it would never have crossed my mind that saying "I cannot believe you won't reimburse my mission ship, I've had enough and this is the final straw, I'm going to kill myself because why continue?" to a GM in a petition would be seen as an actual real world cry for help. But then that's because I assume things in the game are in the game and not otherwise. I see nothing wrong with telling someone -in game- that I am suicidal because they are holding me ransom in the hope they feel soft and let me go.
I think that's the crux of my disappointment with the handling of this, combined with the nullification of my votes completely. Like most people in Goonfleet this doesn't make me feel like unsubscribing because most of us understand that the real world is tricky and just because someone makes a decision you disagree with and think is idiotic doesn't make them a terrible person or mean you should quit in a huff. |
Anya Klibor
Error-404
58
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:10:00 -
[1187] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
Deal with it now. You removed our candidate, not the CSM. You disenfranchised us, and as a result you're going to fix it for us.
Eve is a game focusing on a harsh environment where you are never safe and no one is truly your friend.
Deal with it, pubbie. |
Swearte Widfarend
Mortis Noir. Ineluctable.
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:14:00 -
[1188] - Quote
lol fourm troll wrote:Aramis Rosicrux wrote:First, Mittens is a self-involved prlck and I hope he emofart/ragequits and I never have to deal with him again... but:
CCP's actions are arrogant, arbitrary and a slap in the face to the playerbase.
Consider: CCP makes the game rules so damn mean that people want to kill themselves over losses in the game, but then blames an alliance leader for following your play style set up?
How can you be such hypocrites?
Mittens may deserve a reminder, but it is YOU, the DEVS and GM's that make us want to slash our wrists when we get ganked. I don't blame Goons for playing the game, I blame you for making the game so mean spirited.
Look, I love Eve, and I will miss it when it goes, but you got to be fairer than this.
Un-Ban Mittens and restore his position as CSM chair. Anything less makes you guilty of everything you accuse him of.
Eve: The Anti-Social MMO. Is not each player in control of there own actions? How is giving a player the choice to gank someone the devs fault? The player who ganks you was fully aware and in control of there desicion. The only mean spirited players are the ones who want to be mean spirited.
I find this funny coming from an obvious alt. Almost as funny as the post you replied to.
EVE, like the internet, allows you to hide behind a different face, a different name. You are no different, hiding there behind your NPC corp alt. Why do you not post with your main, the character you should be proud of?
CCP did what they think was right. I don't disagree with their actions as a whole, but with the single inaction that has disenfranchised 10,000 paid accounts who voted for a candidate who never got to even take office.
A special continuation of the CSM election should be opened, with the 10,058 (or whatever) who voted for The Mittani having their votes reset, and the option to apply those votes to a new candidate. Any others who had not voted and were eligible during the elections would also be able to vote, but those whose votes were cast for any other candidate would have those votes stand. CCP is changing ship skill trees. How ship skills should be |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:30:00 -
[1189] - Quote
Swearte Widfarend wrote: CCP did what they think was right. I don't disagree with their actions as a whole, but with the single inaction that has disenfranchised 10,000 paid accounts who voted for a candidate who never got to even take office.
Next year just vote for someone who isn't going to do something so stupid. Your Votes are precious, you wasted them.
~Deal with it~ Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:48:00 -
[1190] - Quote
Anya Klibor wrote:EvilweaselSA wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: CCP words
Deal with it now. You removed our candidate, not the CSM. You disenfranchised us, and as a result you're going to fix it for us. Eve is a game focusing on a harsh environment where you are never safe and no one is truly your friend. Deal with it, pubbie. /facepalm
Skill yourself! |
|
Jason1138
The Catalina Wine Mixer
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 02:02:00 -
[1191] - Quote
"Eve is a game focusing on a harsh environment where you are never safe and no one is truly your friend"
CCP apparently disagrees. We're all friends here right guys? Just playing our game and fostering a sense of community, right?
I have no idea how you can have devs reply to bug reports with "harden the **** up" or "we don't care", have a CEO who basically says "go screw yourself customer base" on more than one occasion, but then they try to spin this BS like they're the family friendly MMO and they won't tolerate anyone's feelings being hurt
its ridiculous and presumes a level of utter stupidity on the customer's part that I find more insulting than CCP's utter hostility those same customers. Hello? We've been playing your game for more than 2 weeks, we all know everyone here revels in acting like A-holes and that sort of thing is encouraged in every single facet of the game by the devs, on purpose. Why are you trying to ***** out on it now? |
Snot Shot
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers The 0rphanage
85
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 02:05:00 -
[1192] - Quote
Did goonies just lose a Titan in brotest........ GÇ£God grant me the serenity to accept the things I canGÇÖt shoot, the courage to shoot the things I can, and the wisdom to GTFO!!GÇ¥GÇô Snot Shot - 2012.....Yeah I'm a killin machine..... http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50753
|
God's Apples
Space Boats 'N Hoes
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 02:34:00 -
[1193] - Quote
Anya Klibor wrote:EvilweaselSA wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
Deal with it now. You removed our candidate, not the CSM. You disenfranchised us, and as a result you're going to fix it for us. Eve is a game focusing on a harsh environment where you are never safe and no one is truly your friend. Deal with it, pubbie.
Don't you sit on the Dodi undock all day? |
Judge Cyclonite
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 03:04:00 -
[1194] - Quote
Bwhaahaha... Goodswarm and all the 0,0 pricks got ganked by CCP... I will call this 2012 CSMageddon "1028 Null Tears". Who do I send the prize isk to? Are you mad bro? Why you mad? |
Tsalaroth
BRG Corp Acquisition Of Empire
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 04:54:00 -
[1195] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
I hope you don't ever get drunk, make a mistake, and get banned, then. What he did was horrible, agreed, but this attitude is more like a damned witch hunt than seeking justice. He quit as chairman, got banned AND removed from CSM7. Now you want him banned from the CSM for life?
Even if I hated the guy, you'd have driven me to his side with this revolting example of an attempted rail-roading. |
lol fourm troll
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 04:55:00 -
[1196] - Quote
Swearte Widfarend wrote:lol fourm troll wrote:Aramis Rosicrux wrote:First, Mittens is a self-involved prlck and I hope he emofart/ragequits and I never have to deal with him again... but:
CCP's actions are arrogant, arbitrary and a slap in the face to the playerbase.
Consider: CCP makes the game rules so damn mean that people want to kill themselves over losses in the game, but then blames an alliance leader for following your play style set up?
How can you be such hypocrites?
Mittens may deserve a reminder, but it is YOU, the DEVS and GM's that make us want to slash our wrists when we get ganked. I don't blame Goons for playing the game, I blame you for making the game so mean spirited.
Look, I love Eve, and I will miss it when it goes, but you got to be fairer than this.
Un-Ban Mittens and restore his position as CSM chair. Anything less makes you guilty of everything you accuse him of.
Eve: The Anti-Social MMO. Is not each player in control of there own actions? How is giving a player the choice to gank someone the devs fault? The player who ganks you was fully aware and in control of there desicion. The only mean spirited players are the ones who want to be mean spirited. I find this funny coming from an obvious alt. Almost as funny as the post you replied to. EVE, like the internet, allows you to hide behind a different face, a different name. You are no different, hiding there behind your NPC corp alt. Why do you not post with your main, the character you should be proud of? CCP did what they think was right. I don't disagree with their actions as a whole, but with the single inaction that has disenfranchised 10,000 paid accounts who voted for a candidate who never got to even take office. A special continuation of the CSM election should be opened, with the 10,058 (or whatever) who voted for The Mittani having their votes reset, and the option to apply those votes to a new candidate. Any others who had not voted and were eligible during the elections would also be able to vote, but those whose votes were cast for any other candidate would have those votes stand. I try to avoid posting with my main when goons are involved, a wrong statement could get you war deced for a while. But i do post with my main. |
Wolfduke
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 06:05:00 -
[1197] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Marketing spin and random bullshit
I would tell you were to stick this load of nonsense but the last time I spoke out I got censored. |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
205
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 06:19:00 -
[1198] - Quote
Would posting about how much I admire Paris Hilton result in a ban? |
Random MonDistinct
Alternative Innovations Unknown and Beyond
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 06:39:00 -
[1199] - Quote
"10,000 votes wasted"..... It is very unlikely he will get those 10000 votes if CCP run voting now. And, it is very likely that some of pilots voted for him would feel like **** if he gets into CSM despite the incident.
But it could be very interesting experiment to restart CSM election & to see opinion of players AFTER this incident. Not those few on forums but bulk of community. |
Foodpimp
Heaven's Harvesters LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 06:40:00 -
[1200] - Quote
Mittens did what mittens does. There may have been some booze (which we see the boy clearly can't hold), but the words and actions are all his. The only thing he is really upset with is that he showed his arse in public. To paraphrase CCP...Mittani-----working as intended. |
|
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
135
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 06:57:00 -
[1201] - Quote
First, I like CCP's decision. I think it's fair. Mittani was clearly out of line, but permabanning him would ignore the fact that it was not just him alone being an ass. To be fair, it's not like everyone else was being polite and sober in one corner and he suddenly dashed off and crossed the line by jumping over it; it's more like there was and has been for some time a crowd at or across the line and he was drunk and staggered one step too far in the wrong direction.
Question to CCP and/or CSM:
Considering that this event was not an isolated incident, but a culmination of a culture where it is considered normal and acceptable (even desirable by some) to publicly humiliate rivals and verbally abuse other players in order to "harvest tears" (and I assure you those are RL tears), are you planning to take steps to fix the underlying bully-friendly culture? Or do you consider the culture just fine, as long as suicide etc are not mentioned?
(Before anyone cries about making EVE a WoW in Space, no, that's not what I am after. I want an EVE where baiting, ganking, blobbing, scamming, trapping, using clever tricks, gloating on local and PR wars are still possible. But I also want an EVE where it is not ok to point and laugh when someone is upset, or use racist/sexist/homophobic/etc slurs to hurt people for real. And where we all admit that part of why EVE is great is that it is a serious game and to be good at it you have to take it seriously - compare to RL sports - and that's why losing actually matters. See more of that in this discussion.) |
Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
206
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 07:18:00 -
[1202] - Quote
of course he would. |
L4ST
Helios Alliance C0NVICTED
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 07:31:00 -
[1203] - Quote
The more I read here the more I like what I before considered the only not-so-positive point on Mittens: His bullying on players with few knowledge of the game - Where (knowledge of the game) ~ (skill) for most of this game btw...
Voted for Mittens before, now may not say that I'm a "real" Mitten voter anymore, as I'm in the CFC and thus my payment of 2 bil ISK for my vote should arrive shortly according to non-CFC-players.
The whole CSM stating that he keeps the **** together there and actually fulfills his job as the chairman is the reason why. I don't think the CSM is about smacktalking **** and bullying other ppl/alliances at all. Already because there are simpler ways to get into a high council of pro-trolls than gathering 10,000 votes.
He did **** because he was drunk, regret it and stepping down from CSM VOLUNTARILY + getting a 30 days ban is the concequence. Dunno what happens if we ban every player who spams Jita with "kill yourself" for 30 days.
Maybe CCP should also take consequences and for future alliance panels go "sober or silent". Everyone tries to take this game serious, so be serious.
Seeing this, planning Burn Jita was extremely prospective by the way.
TL;DR
S H U T T H E F U C K UP No matter if you like Goons or not Mitten is the best that has happened to the CSM. As CSM, he himself and CCP treated him harder than other players would be treated. Clap for it, cheer and send some Titans, you already got more than you haters deserve. Conspiracy Sh*theads. |
GeneralDisturbed
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
117
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 07:34:00 -
[1204] - Quote
A guy gives out an in-game character name, that could easily be found by anybody that goes to eve-kill. No personal information whatsoever. CCP gives no fucks, because that's Eve. And that's the eve they sell. A world where you can be a space bastard if you choose.
The second the media gets wind of this, suddenly Eve is a honoureable space game where players are nice to each other, and ships **** rainbows. And Mittani, the evil space bastard that CCP was praising at fanfest, must now be thrown under a bus.
Sounds to me like CCP needs to HARD THE **** UP! And not go hide in a hole and pretend like eve isn't what it really is, when they get some negative press.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgvM7av1o1Q <--- Watch this before CCP remembers it and presumably removes it. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
137
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 07:40:00 -
[1205] - Quote
The EVE that CCP sells is a sandbox game where you can do anything. They by no means have ever, anywhere, sold a game where you can go on stage in their live event and use your limelight time to point and laugh at other players, let alone call them names and incite other players to harass them in game to drive them to suicide. They also do have rules in place about what is acceptable language (though it does seem they do not have the resources and/or interest to enforce those). That they let it go as far as actual reference to driving someone to death before they intervened is what should surprise people here - not that they did eventually do something.
A sandbox is for building whatever you want and playing whatever games you like. There is no fixed plot you have to use and you can use the toys provided the way you like. But if you start calling other kids names and throwing the sand in their eyes, a kindergarten teacher is going to come and pick you up and put you on the timeout bench, and no amount of kicking and screaming about how it was your sand will save you. The only thing left to do at that point is to grow up and realize that despite having the freedom to play you do not have the freedom to bully. |
Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
452
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 07:43:00 -
[1206] - Quote
Goons running out of tears after only 57 pages?
What happened with the ~10058~? Dominique Vasilkovsky Mashie Saldana Monica Foulkes |
GeneralDisturbed
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
117
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 07:51:00 -
[1207] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:The EVE that CCP sells is a sandbox game where you can do anything. They by no means have ever, anywhere, sold a game where you can go on stage in their live event and use your limelight time to point and laugh at other players, let alone call them names and incite other players to harass them in game to drive them to suicide. They also do have rules in place about what is acceptable language (though it does seem they do not have the resources and/or interest to enforce those). That they let it go as far as actual reference to driving someone to death before they intervened is what should surprise people here - not that they did eventually do something.
That they let it go on so long shouldn't surprise anybody. This is the eve a lot of players, including myself were sold on when we joined. A game where you can be a space bastard and CCP gives no fucks. They looked at the slides, they knew what the goon presentation was about- all the players we've griefed over the year, and they approved it just fine.
If CCP gave two ***** about this pubbie, they could have intervened at any point, given him his stuff back, told us to leave him alone, etc... but they don't do that. Because that's not how eve is. You can hound a guy to the end of the galaxy, steal all his stuff, blow up everything he ever owned... and CCP DOES NOT CARE. That is eve.
At no point during the presentation did CCP step in to stop any of this, even after the Q&A. If they gave a **** they would have stood up and said something the second the guy asked the question of who this player was ingame. They didn't. They didn't say anything as Mittani stood there and slow spelled out the guys name for everyone. It was funny, people were laughing, CCP gives no fucks.
The -only reason- they are taking any action whatsoever is because of the media attention to this. They're trying to make eve out to be some sunshine and roses fairyland where nothing bad ever happens to good people. And it's utter crap. And anybody in 0.0, from any alliance, goons or otherwise, know that it's crap. That's not the eve we play.
CCP should take their own advice and HTFU, and not throw both the CSM, and The Mittani under a bus. |
Ajita al Tchar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
183
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 08:20:00 -
[1208] - Quote
jugornaut wrote:lol the thing everyone fails to see is that mittens stepped down to start - the fact that ccp removed him after the fact is just pomp and circumstance..
10k voters with unheard voices should be shouting at mittens asking why the hell did he step down to begin with - instead you blame ccp for his drunken banter (which btw csm should be held to a higher standard)
besides 10k votes - after goons admitted to fraud to get those votes - gg noobs
Just after Mitt's first Twitter posts re: the situation I looked at the CSM rules and I knew what I would do in his situation. This decision would have been especially easy since it's as close to a "win-win" as you can get given the ****** situation
Mittens said he was genuinely sorry which I believe, I would probably feel the same way: made an ass of myself, possibly made someone else feel ******, embarrassed multiple people, stirred up a shitstorm, again--possibly (and likely) harmed someone who didn't deserve it at all, etc. Repentant of my actions, stepping down from my current role as Chairman and member of the CSM in general would seem appropriate; after all, I kind of no longer deserve to be seen in that role. BUT WAIT! This opens up another win. Should I end up being banned over this or warned or something (likely...), it will have happened to me no longer as a CSM 6 member and not yet as a CSM 7, but as a regular EVE-dude with no political power and no expectations. Different rules apply to CSM people in that respect: commit a bad during your term and, since you've just dragged the image of CSM through the mud and acted in a way that doesn't befit your office you're out and can not sit on the council again. If you're banned or warned as a "civilian" you *can* be banned from CSM in the future, but it's not a guarantee. Read difference between two cases of infractions at the end.
So, both from a "I did the crime, I should do the time" point of view (really feeling sorry about stuff, want to do something that feels right) and the point of view of an okay political move, there's literally NO reason to not resign from all CSM positions as soon as I realize I did something pretty ******* bad that might be ban-worthy, and just a ****** thing to do from a human standpoint. This way I'll be missing just a little more than a year of CSM membership and can run again, and resigning from your current office that I've just sullied with stupid shenanigans is a good thing to do. I can represent my people again in a year rather than never; sounds better, no? This wouldn't mean that I'm not feeling any genuine guilt and remorse, not at all. It really is just a matter of as close to a win-win solution as I can find for a shittastic situation I'm responsible for.
Unfortunately, no matter how I know I feel, this would seem like I'm apparently just trying to weasel out in the most advantageous way possible. But I believe that just because someone ****** up, doesn't mean they must self-flagellate for the rest of their life, restricting themselves entirely to bad everything from now on. Making smart moves is something that's independent of feeling genuinely sorry. Is this something Mittani was thinking of and aiming for, or did it just fall out like that? IDK, but I think it worked out in the best way possible. As I said before, personally I think that leaving Mittens in CSM 7 would have been good, which can't happen if he's banned, so no ban... But... The more I thought about it, the more right it seemed for CCP to issue said ban, I know I'd be very much okay with it and it would have felt entirely appropriate had I been in Mitt's place. Which once again leaves the option of resigning and skipping CSM 7.
Infractions and consequences for a CSM member: "any behavior or actions considered being a material breach of the EULA or TOS by a CSM representative is grounds for immediate dismissal and permanent exclusion from all pending and future participation in the council. there are no exceptions, regardless of the infraction. representatives are not only expected to uphold the social contract that all society members are held accountable to, but should also set a behavior standard for everyone else to follow." (you'll be fired and banhammered from the CSM forever)
Infractions and consequences for a non-CSM member: "players with a serious warning or ban on any account in their possession can be excluded from candidate eligibility. However, in-game behavior, regardless of play style, will never be a criterion for candidacy unless the rules of the EULA and/or TOS are violated." (you may not be hired even if you broke the EULA/TOS, it's going to be a matter of discussion and opinion) |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
137
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 08:20:00 -
[1209] - Quote
GeneralDisturbed wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:The EVE that CCP sells is a sandbox game where you can do anything. They by no means have ever, anywhere, sold a game where you can go on stage in their live event and use your limelight time to point and laugh at other players, let alone call them names and incite other players to harass them in game to drive them to suicide. They also do have rules in place about what is acceptable language (though it does seem they do not have the resources and/or interest to enforce those). That they let it go as far as actual reference to driving someone to death before they intervened is what should surprise people here - not that they did eventually do something.
That they let it go on so long shouldn't surprise anybody. This is the eve a lot of players, including myself were sold on when we joined. A game where you can be a space bastard and CCP gives no fucks. They looked at the slides, they knew what the goon presentation was about- all the players we've griefed over the year, and they approved it just fine. I agree on this 100 %. They looked away and let it go on so long and so far that people actually honestly join the game expecting that public humiliation of other players and pointing and laughing in order to "harvest tears" is CCP-encouraged policy, rather than a result of them not having a policy they enforce and letting a particular player group sell their idea as The Truth About Eve. (And some people probably join and leave without CCP ever hearing of them, because that point is sold to them too, so well that they never even attempt petitioning.)
That's a huge problem, and while I think Mittens's punishment is fair, it should not be made so that he will be made the sole scapegoat of what is a wide-spread cultural problem in the whole EVE. That would not be in the interests of anyone, not the ones who want the right to make other people cry for real, and not the ones who oppose it.
I am rather shocked they approved of slides that consisted of nothing but berating other players. Yes, they say in the devblog that the alliance panel is supposed to be a really open forum and yes, I see the value in that... but still. I am even more WTF about the players who think this is what we should hear from our most successful alliance leaders, whom I am pretty damn sure would have actually interesting things to provide, instead of what you can hear on any high-sec local any day. I mean, whether or not you like that stuff being on locals - would you still rather not hear something more unique in the alliance panel? |
Marlona Sky
Massive PVPness Psychotic Tendencies.
735
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 08:49:00 -
[1210] - Quote
GeneralDisturbed wrote:A guy gives out an in-game character name, that could easily be found by anybody that goes to eve-kill. No personal information whatsoever. CCP gives no fucks, because that's Eve. And that's the eve they sell. A world where you can be a space bastard if you choose. The second the media gets wind of this, suddenly Eve is a honoureable space game where players are nice to each other, and ships **** rainbows. And Mittani, the evil space bastard that CCP was praising at fanfest, must now be thrown under a bus. Sounds to me like CCP needs to HARD THE **** UP! And not go hide in a hole and pretend like eve isn't what it really is, when they get some negative press. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgvM7av1o1Q <--- Watch this before CCP remembers it and presumably removes it.
Sounds like you need to be the one to watch it.
|
|
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
193
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 08:51:00 -
[1211] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:The EVE that CCP sells is a sandbox game where you can do anything. They by no means have ever, anywhere, sold a game where you can go on stage in their live event and use your limelight time to point and laugh at other players, let alone call them names and incite other players to harass them in game to drive them to suicide. They also do have rules in place about what is acceptable language (though it does seem they do not have the resources and/or interest to enforce those). That they let it go as far as actual reference to driving someone to death before they intervened is what should surprise people here - not that they did eventually do something.
A sandbox is for building whatever you want and playing whatever games you like. There is no fixed plot you have to use and you can use the toys provided the way you like. But if you start calling other kids names and throwing the sand in their eyes, a kindergarten teacher is going to come and pick you up and put you on the timeout bench, and no amount of kicking and screaming about how it was your sand will save you. The only thing left to do at that point is to grow up and realize that despite having the freedom to play you do not have the freedom to bully.
First of all, did you see the names of the pilots singing their respective national anthems to the glee and delight of every nerd in Reykjav+¡k? Do you think CCP was laughing too? Because it sure looked like it. Or how about the slide which was vetted where an Eve player hinted at symptoms of mental instability and possible suicide? Do you think they let that go up on the screen because they want Eve to be Hello Kitty Online?
Were IPOL and the local police dispatched to this "victim's" home, as per CCP policy, when they became aware of his purported condition? Was anything done for nearly a week after this "reprehensible offense?"
Is it possible, however unlikely, that even in a state of drunken stupor Mittens was being allegorical? Is it remotely conceivable that he didn't genuinely want this person to die?
Did everybody in the presentation have their headsets on, laptops ready to blow this dude up and supposedly verify the IRL kill? Or were they at a location where this was unfeasible?
Did CCP, a tech-savvy firm with a historical penchant for cramming both of their feet in their mouth and going "nom nom nom" with regard to bad press think, even for a second, that broadcasting drunks for profit might not be a good idea? Did anybody at fanfest sign a waiver of their rights to free speech or even receive a verbal warning pertaining to the Q&A session and its potential consequences in-and-out-of game before the panel?
I just wonder if you can clear some of this up for we disenfranchised, since you obviously have a pretty firm grasp of what CCP has and has not done for the community that basically props up Iceland's entire economy. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
139
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 08:59:00 -
[1212] - Quote
I do not think Mittens wanted the person to actually die. My guess is he really just did not think about it that way at all - he made a joke, and the thought that it might have real consequences just did not occur to him at the moment. Had he stopped to think things like "Do I really want that person to hurt themselves? Is there any risk that he might?", he probably would have just not made the joke at all. For me this issue does not really depend on whether Mittens intended it as a joke or not, and whether the victim was at any point in any real danger. This is not primarily about the victim (and sorry if that sounds harsh), this is about what kind of behavior is acceptable. It is very usual in school bullying incidents for the perpetrators to be totally astonished when they are punished: "It was just a joke! We did not really think he cared!" And the point is, a lot of them really never did. That does not make bullying ok.
Beyond that, CCP has spoken about the issues you mention in another related devblog: http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=28575 - you probably get more out of that than from me trying to interpret their intentions to you. :) For the record, I do think they botched stuff here and before - to use my metaphor, they are not very good kindergarten teachers here and need to do some shaping up - but so do they. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
193
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 09:06:00 -
[1213] - Quote
Duly noted and I will be posting a quote from this thread to that thread.
Not like I expect my questions to be answered - or even considered.
CCP's actions speak volumes here. Volumes. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Haellena
The Fiction Factory Blue Nation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 10:40:00 -
[1214] - Quote
Goons raging, Mittani being his usual self, everyone else in New Eden wanting the Goons gone...
I see nothing out of the ordinary with this, why is everyone still so upset? Wherever the Goonion goes, drama follows, this is exactly what they want and you're all giving it to them.
He messed up, he got banned for it, boo-hoo, shed tears, get a new CEO and move on. Or... yanno... wait until either the ban is lifted or he gets another account. Simple enough.
This has lasted for 50+ pages and all I've seen is flaming, drama-queens and bashing. This thread is better off gone. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
145
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 10:46:00 -
[1215] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Duly noted and I will be posting a quote from this thread to that thread.
Not like I expect my questions to be answered - or even considered.
CCP's actions speak volumes here. Volumes.
EDIT: Also, having to consider any possible risk to any victim in this game ever pretty much negates the whole game, as there's no telling what emorage from internet spaceship violence might bring out in an otherwise well-adjusted but relatively new Eve player.
I'm absolutely serious, think about the culpability that implies. No one is asking you to think of any possible culpability. As I read CCP's statements on this, they have been absolutely not at all against the miner having been blown up in the first case. Their condemnation only concerns what was said about it, to whom, and how. There has been a discussion about this on GD (thread asking for clarification on this), and like I said there, based on the CCP statement and GM comment in the thread, I interpret it this way:
If you are shooting someone's ship, and at quarter armor they tell you they are suicidal and ask you to stop, it is fine (as per EVE rules - individual morals aside) to continue shooting. It is not fine to tell them to go ahead and do it, point and laugh, or share the message with others encouraging them to drive him to it, not even as a joke.
If seriously you cannot tell the difference and think that the only way to avoid doing what Mittani was punished for is to never do anything at all in EVE just in case you hurt someone, I don't think you should be playing the game. It's obviously way too complex for you. |
Parthonax
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 11:01:00 -
[1216] - Quote
Because you won a election( even with vote rigging and manipulation ) doesn't mean you are above the law nor should CCP make a exception , that would only give the wrong signal I am actually suprised CCP didn't change the rules since CCP so blatantly favours those certain group of people anyway good riddance eve will be so much better for 30 days without that white trash
so this is permanence |
PleaseDONTblow Myship
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 11:57:00 -
[1217] - Quote
Kat Ayclism wrote:Darius can break the NDA with no ramifications but Mittens makes fun of a carebear's pathetic, bleating attempt to gain sympathy and gets a 30day ban?
I guess I'll be reporting all the tears I get that contain threats or emo baww from now on.
Mittens remains chairman of my heart.
QFT
Free Mittens! |
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
56
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:01:00 -
[1218] - Quote
Shiana Soltek wrote:What I find interesting is they are all whinning and crying about disenfranchisement. Apparently these players do not know, or do not care about the actual definition of the term. Their votes were not less effective, they were not blocked. Their votes were counted, served their purpose, and successfully elected their chosen delegate to office.
What happened was AFTER the votes were counted, and AFTER the delegate became the official Chairman to be sworn in once CSM 7 started. The delegate himself, through his OWN actions, and by his own admission, stepped down from the position of CSM 7 chairman/member. This is no different than a US elected president stepping down prior to being sworn into office for actions he committed. The votes were counted, the person was successfully elected.
Your votes were not made less effective, you were not blocked from being able to vote. The person you voted for committed immoral, unethical, and via violation of the TOS and EULA illegal actions, that resulted in his account being banned, and after some personal reflection, resigned from his elected position. Under a normal democratic society, the spot would be filled by the Vice President, or in this case, the person with the next highest amount of votes, and every position from there down filled by the person below it, and the final spot filled by the person with the highest number of votes that did not make the original CSM 7 panel.
Instead of complaining about and trying to cry "disenfranchisement", how about you condemn the person who failed to maintain a professional decorum and failed to represent his constituents in a moral, ethical, and professional manner. You just made way too much sense in this post. The neckbeards will be further enraged... |
Col Spinks
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:03:00 -
[1219] - Quote
Svodola Darkfury wrote:This won't be read because it's 58 pages in;
But it's easy to cloak yourself in righteous anger when in fact your representative stepped down under immense political pressure.
As a representative of this game, at an official CCP live forum, it is inappropriate for him to even JOKE about harassing a player who is depressed/suicidal in real life with the intent of making the guy commit suicide.
If you don't like it, quit. Be sure to contract all your stuff to some player corps.
Honestly, nobody cares if the biggest alliance in the game quits. We'd be ecstatic. Might make room for some new players.
It's kind of obvious you don't actually play the game. There is room enough for everyone that pays a subscription. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
21
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:07:00 -
[1220] - Quote
Parthonax wrote:Because you won a election( even with vote rigging and manipulation ) doesn't mean you are above the law nor should CCP make a exception , that would only give the wrong signal I am actually suprised CCP didn't change the rules since CCP so blatantly favours those certain group of people anyway good riddance eve will be so much better for 30 days without that white trash
Hmm Mittens hardly ever log in so nothing has changed actually. 30 days of "peace"? Think again. Skill yourself! |
|
Col Spinks
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:09:00 -
[1221] - Quote
jugornaut wrote:still screwed over by the guy you voted for - maybe as a person in a higher position he should learn to watch his mouth instead of sticking his foot in it like most goons?
people in a position like this should be held to a higher standard - guess you loose
If all people are not held to the same code of behavior then that standard is meaningless.
|
Col Spinks
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:15:00 -
[1222] - Quote
Mashie Saldana wrote:Goons running out of tears after only 57 pages?
What happened with the ~10058~?
Do you know how many posts CCP has deleted? Well, that's whats happening to that 10058. |
Tsalaroth
BRG Corp Acquisition Of Empire
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:26:00 -
[1223] - Quote
Col Spinks wrote:Mashie Saldana wrote:Goons running out of tears after only 57 pages?
What happened with the ~10058~? Do you know how many posts CCP has deleted? Well, that's whats happening to that 10058.
Pretty much this. |
Ni Cho
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:50:00 -
[1224] - Quote
Snot Shot wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
Like a BOSS!!....
This is honestly the only thing that I have ever been able to read from Snot Shot. |
Takoten Yaken
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 14:33:00 -
[1225] - Quote
Takoten Yaken wrote:So to reiterate: posting neo-nazi views on the forums merits none of the following:
A game ban Removal from the CSM race A forum ban
It is, in fact, apparently against the rules to post about how a CSM candidate posted neo-nazi views on the forums and this means he is not a good candidate.
But posting about this does merit a ban, apparently. Could you elaborate on how you consider this justifiable in any way?
I'm still looking for an explanation on this issue, as well as a justification for a character getting a two week ban for "offtopic" for discussing CCP's reaction to unacceptable comments from a CSM candidate in a thread about what CCP has deemed unacceptable comments from a CSM candidate. |
Don Dark
x13 Raiden.
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 15:12:00 -
[1226] - Quote
Andski wrote:10,058 paying customers totally ignored and disenfranchised. Good work, CCP.
So what your saying is .. because 10.000 paying costumers voted for him :. he should be held above the law ? He did something against the eula .. nomatter how many supporters he has . he should be punished like everyone els . |
KanashiiKami
98
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 15:42:00 -
[1227] - Quote
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman.
i think the player should be BAN from future involvement at FANFEST, any form of further interaction with crowd.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? players who vote for him obviously likes what the player does. and VICE VERSA ... i think you will have to account for the possiblity of HOW many who did not vote for him. having the highest vote does not really mean a win, because THE others have no 1 else to look up to to vote for.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community. [/quote]
i do not like this at all ... fact of the matter is ... CCP? is this the first day you know ALEX GIANTURCO? WUT ??? |
KanashiiKami
98
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 15:47:00 -
[1228] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:The entire chain of events that have lead to this action are extremely regrettable and sad.
Alex was an extremely talented and energetic member of CSM6, and his absence will be keenly felt during CSM7. I am deeply saddened that CCP felt they had no choice but to take this action.
This unprecedented situation raises significant questions -- such as representation and disenfranchisement -- that CSM6 will be discussing with CCP and with the new members of CSM7 over the next few days. I think I can speak for everyone on CSM when I ask for your patience while we work through these issues.
i disagree that CSM speaks and represents ALL of EVE players. you however DO represent those who VOTED for you. WUT ??? |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
157
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:05:00 -
[1229] - Quote
Quote:i disagree that CSM speaks and represents ALL of EVE players. you however DO represent those who VOTED for you.
Sorry, but while you are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to your own facts.
"The purpose of the CSM is to represent society interests to CCP. This requires active engagement with the player community to master EVE issue awareness, understanding, and evaluation in the context of the GÇ£greatest good for the greater player baseGÇ¥. --- A council of nine player Representatives will be democratically elected by EVE players." http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM (empasis mine)
In a democracy, typically when there is an election to choose representatives, the idea is that whoever is chosen becomes a representative of the whole thing. They are supposed to represent the good of the whole population, not just those who voted for them. The vote is there for so that the population can have a say what sort of things they consider "good" - they are supposed to vote for someone who holds their values and ideas, say. But after they are chosen, they become, for example, "the president of Finland", not "the president of those Finns who bothered to get off their asses on the election day and thought this guy was a good candidate".
There is nothing in the CSM rules that makes me think this is intended to be otherwise in CSM. Quite the opposite, the quote above speaks of "good of the greater player base". And while 10k accounts is a lot as far as votes go, it is still only about 4 percent of all accounts - not very great a base. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
194
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:19:00 -
[1230] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Quote:i disagree that CSM speaks and represents ALL of EVE players. you however DO represent those who VOTED for you.
Sorry, but while you are entitled to your own opinion, you are not entitled to your own facts. "The purpose of the CSM is to represent society interests to CCP. This requires active engagement with the player community to master EVE issue awareness, understanding, and evaluation in the context of the GÇ£ greatest good for the greater player baseGÇ¥. --- A council of nine player Representatives will be democratically elected by EVE players." http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM (empasis mine) In a democracy, typically when there is an election to choose representatives, the idea is that whoever is chosen becomes a representative of the whole thing. They are supposed to represent the good of the whole population, not just those who voted for them. The vote is there for so that the population can have a say what sort of things they consider "good" - they are supposed to vote for someone who holds their values and ideas, say. But after they are chosen, they become, for example, "the president of Finland", not "the president of those Finns who bothered to get off their asses on the election day and thought this guy was a good candidate". There is nothing in the CSM rules that makes me think this is intended to be otherwise in CSM. Quite the opposite, the quote above speaks of "good of the greater player base". And while 10k accounts is a lot as far as votes go, it is still only about 4 percent of all accounts - not very great a base.
The fact of the matter is that even CCP did not act on their own policies, period. They may be able to wrap it all up nice and tidy with corporatese BS, but the facts are clear. They never dispatched IPOL or the local police to verify the well-being of the "victim" - instead they vetted slides essentially giving The Mittani the greenlight for this subject matter. The only way the "victim" knew about this was from an internet video site, when we're to understand that the ******* cops should have showed up to deal with him. Fantastic job CCP!
They streamed it live sans delay and provided copious amounts of booze.
They laughed when other pilots were named and shamed in other presentations where they had obviously been "bullied and humiliated".
They literally could have stopped this at any time. Instead they went on to praise The Mittani, award him CSM chair, do nothing for five days about the victim, and then spazzed out and inserted their respective corporate feet in their mouths when it was done.
The truth is, CCP deserves as much indignation or more. Can we ban CCP? Will there be an ISD investigation into this?
It's easy to throw people under a bus and say "Not me!"
It's also easy to hop on a bandwagon and be convinced of your smug self-righteousness' purity of motive to a fault. That looks like what's happened here.
Sorry, there's facts, and then there's THE facts. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
|
Cahoun
BAND of MAGNUS CZECH Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:31:00 -
[1231] - Quote
I usually dont write on forum. But I dont understand if someone asked "victim" player. "Are you healthy? Did you not kill yourself? Did you visit family or a doctor?" Its more important. Its not funny do jokes if someone is depressed or have the problems in RL. But Its happens. Its better to help players if they are really have problems in their minds Many players are unhappy after lost the ships. But Its Eve Online. Many players play games and they want to forget about problems in RL
But Mittani was drunk and he did mistake. Ok, no more CSM6 chairman member, no more CSM7 chairman member, apologies to "victim" player
But I dont know if "victim" player feels better and more important now. Whole Eve know about him. Maybe Mittani did good thing if he told about him
I dont care about politics in game. But It was Mittani who help to solve situation after Incarna expansion. I dont understand 1 month ban from game I have fear to say something in game
Is it really still fun? Can I say my opinion in public
I am not on side of Mittani and I didnt vote and I dont like Goons. Its only my opinion. |
Kile Kitmoore
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:50:00 -
[1232] - Quote
Well lets face it, CCP has made it's decision and Mitt's has planned out his future with the Goons and all the back and forth is not going to change that, unfortunately.
Gong to part this thread with a bit of advice for both the CSM and CCP, DON"T SCREW UP! If you guys/gals spend the next six months getting nothing done but "debating your procedures" or what shade of colors panties (or how they drop, LOL, never getting over that) should be in the character creator don't be surprised of another full-on revolt and it possibly being led by your ex-chairman. Imagine Mitt's without the constrains of CSM niceties and NDA's but instead he's just another pissed off customer with a voice, I would not want to be in the CSM or at CCP for that **** storm.
Who knows, maybe he will quietly go back to leading his alliance & meta-gaming and leave you guys to do, whatever.
Good luck to all parties and maybe the victim in this sad little tale will actually put this game down for a while and get some real help, if he really needed it at all.
|
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
157
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 16:52:00 -
[1233] - Quote
Sure. It's called "cancelling your account".
If you think CCP acted criminally, cancel your account and report to local authorities.
Quote:I dont understand if someone asked "victim" player. "Are you healthy? Did you not kill yourself? Did you visit family or a doctor?" CCP has spoken to him. Mittens has also (according to him) apologized to him personally. He has been reported to be ok. As I gather it, he does not want further publicity.
|
Ibn Taymiyyah
Treasures Collectors Northern Associates.
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:02:00 -
[1234] - Quote
Only read what CCP Xhagen all this way into the thread, but the timming is irrelevant for this case.
So let me just try to get my head around this.
If I go out, kill a bunch of highsec hardcore pvers, who'll proceed to cry me a river ... if I tell someone, within caracter, "go die in a fire", I get a 30 day ban?
Because you just said:
Quote:Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome.
Honestly, when I'm out to blow up your game, if you do end up on my TS crying (in RL about) I'm just laughing my ass off. So are you and so is everyone! You're hoping that people are dicks to one and other and get mad as in roleplaying?
* me proceeds to blow up helpless miner in a cowardly suicide gank * miner knows he lost the ship on undock and maintaining complete posture, procedes to insult and whine and cry, calling me the root of all evil in the world
where am I getting at? When you're out to "destroy someone else game" you're looking for REAL LIFE TEARS! If you end up making a video, whining about it, the ganker WON the absolute prize! No one gets mad "in character". These two are NOT separate realities. Sorry, I can't understand the separation.
You can tell me to kill myself all day, suicide gank me every day and every hour ... what the hell does that have to do with my decision to do it or not? How in the hell are you liable for someone RL decisions with your in game actions or even words?
Mittens was not disrespectful (not in any special/uncommon way). He told people to grief the player, joking with the fact that he might actually kill himself. I got it, you got it, the audience got it. Can't understand all this! Hell, I'm actually thinking of starting suicide ganking people ... starting with that one mate, unless he's off limits due to unstable psyche, in which case you should really get a flag for those people, so we can't shoot them dead in game and having that transpire to RL! :)
I have no desire to see the guy kill himself, but have no desire for him to live. I'm indifferent to his life, as I'm indifferent to most other living beings. As a whole, society works like this except for the few hypocrites who love to say different, but eat a full meal with kids dying of hunger nearby! :)
Damn, when a friend of mine coughs, my one reply to is "just die, it's faster!".... why all this drama?
Fake edit: you case you missed my last post, I'm red to goons, I didn't vote for mittens, I'm not a suicide ganker and have no love for that type of gameplay ... but ... this was wrong! |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
194
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:04:00 -
[1235] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Sure. It's called "cancelling your account". If you think CCP acted immorally, that's what you should do - do not give your money to people whose actions you cannot morally accept. If you think CCP acted criminally, cancel your account and report to local authorities. Quote:I dont understand if someone asked "victim" player. "Are you healthy? Did you not kill yourself? Did you visit family or a doctor?" CCP has spoken to him. Mittens has also apologized to him personally. He has been reported to be ok. As I gather it, he does not want further publicity. He also probably does not want the ******* cops to show up at his house over **** he said in the context of a video game, but nobody's talking about that. Does CCP suspect that his crisis is over? When will the cops be called?
I wonder if anybody even realizes how much that matters?
This guy got off scot free because you all made him a martyr. Either he's suicidal and CCP's actions were grossly negligent and continue to be such as long as the police are not involved OR he was lying, everybody knows it, and he should spend some time with Officer Mahoney and the State Mental Facility thereafter for evaluation to drive the point home to the alleged victim that suicide is nothing to joke about.
Only then will CCP's actions make any sense whatsoever.
TL;DR - If CCP doesn't call the cops on The Wis then they literally care about nothing other than what Sony thinks of their "image." He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
157
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:06:00 -
[1236] - Quote
You do realize, I am sure, that the mail that was read in the panel was months old?
Beyond that, it is not at all our place to judge whether he was really suicidal or not. Regardless of whether he was, and what has gone on between CCP, him, and possibly the local authorities (which is none of your business, and under confidentiality, and neither the victim nor the CCP has any reason, let alone duty, to tell you any details about it), joking about something like that was a crap thing to do.
If someone makes a suicide threat you believe not to be genuine, you report to whoever can take action in case it is genuine, and then STFU about it, not coax everyone to harass him for punishment. I trust I do not have to explain why. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
194
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:14:00 -
[1237] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:You do realize, I am sure, that the mail that was read in the panel was months old?
Beyond that, it is not at all our place to judge whether he was really suicidal or not. Regardless of whether he was, and what has gone on between CCP, him, and possibly the local authorities (which is none of your business, and under confidentiality, and neither the victim nor the CCP has any reason, let alone duty, to tell you any details about it), joking about something like that was a crap thing to do.
If someone makes a suicide threat you believe not to be genuine, you report to whoever can take action in case it is genuine, and then STFU about it, not coax everyone to harass him for punishment. I trust I do not have to explain why.
Oh I see. It was months old so that means it's OK. Sometimes petitions take freaking weaks to resolve. Would they not follow policy due to backlog? So now he's in the limelight and everybody assumes he's OK. I'm not saying that it's my business, but we know for a fact that he didn't get a visit from the cops. Why not, when it's ******* policy?
The answer is obvious.
CCP is really serious about that suicide policy, boy let me tell you. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Ibn Taymiyyah
Treasures Collectors Northern Associates.
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:20:00 -
[1238] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:If someone makes a suicide threat you believe not to be genuine, you report to whoever can take action in case it is genuine, and then STFU about it, not coax everyone to harass him for punishment. I trust I do not have to explain why.
Mate, I disagree. If I blow you up in game and you convo me saying you're going to kill yourself cuz of the lost pixels... I'm not going to report your bad day... I'm coming back tomorrow for seconds! And the next day, and the next day ... wtf? Kill yourself over a game? If my life is ever that devoid of content that a loss in a video game leads to a suicide note... I'm not here the next day because either:
a) I'm dead b) I quit the game and got a life!
!
I can't understand all this drama. Who cares? Everyone is free to do whatever they want with their lives! Unless I'm pushing you off a cliff ... **** it! I've seen a guy jump from a bridge 2 meters in front of me. He stopped his car, came out and jumped. My reaction was getting pissed because now I had to switch lanes to get past his ******* car! No sympathy here :| |
Kara Balveda
EVE University Ivy League
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:39:00 -
[1239] - Quote
Two step wrote:I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.
More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page
I'd expect all of you to resign. Yeah, even the guy I cast my vote for. Then CCP has to open the process for selecting CSM 8, and the 10.058 voters can cast their votes for Mittens again. Of course, it is to be hoped that CCP sees the light when all the CSM threatens to resign. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
158
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 17:46:00 -
[1240] - Quote
Darth Gustav:
No, that it was months old does not make anything ok. But sending cops over somewhere because of a months old suicide threat without checking with the guy who threatened will make said cops really, really pissed off. ;) As to why that was not handled at the time by CCP is probably because no one who saw it then bothered petitioning it, instead of circulating it internally and making fun of it - not because of petition backlog. A lot of petitions get looked at fairly fast, e.g. stuck petitions, EULA/TOS violations and suspicions of exploiting; I expect this would have. Again, how the guy fares now and what his contact with authorities, legal or medical, has or has not been, is none of your effing business. If one of us knew what his medical status is and spoke of it here, we could be banned. ("An immediate permanent ban of an account may result if a player: b. Divulges private and/or personal information about another subscriber or an official EVE Online representative through the EVE Online client or web site."). Back off.
I am not going to explain to you for a hundreth time why Mittani's behavior was out of line. If you do not get it yet, you either will not read the explanations, or will never get it.
Ibn:
I have never said, and neither has CCP said, that you cannot blow up my ship if I threaten with suicide (which I won't do, but as a hypothetical ;)). For the hundreth time, Mittani was not punished for blowing the guy up; he was punished for what was said about it. This is not black and white. We can at the same time accept blowing people's ships up no matter what they say to you to plead or threaten you to stop, think threatening with a suicide in a game is a crap thing to do, and think that pointing and laughing at people who are OOCly upset is also a crap thing to do. If you cannot handle that many different aspects of thinking at the same time, maybe you should not be playing EVE. It is such complex game, it might be too much for you. |
|
Ninker
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 18:51:00 -
[1241] - Quote
Cute that everyone thinks he should be let off.
Darling that they think 10k votes are wasted when most people have more than one account and probably voted with them.
Sweet that they think the numbers matter, what are they going to do unsub? Hahahaha. If that threat was maintained everytime something happened Eve would be in negative numbers.
Epic to see that no one is beyond the rules, no matter the size of the ego. |
Kosh Seere
Dissonance Corp BLACK-MARK
21
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:11:00 -
[1242] - Quote
Ninker wrote:Cute that everyone thinks he should be let off.
Darling that they think 10k votes are wasted when most people have more than one account and probably voted with them.
Sweet that they think the numbers matter, what are they going to do unsub? Hahahaha. If that threat was maintained everytime something happened Eve would be in negative numbers.
Epic to see that no one is beyond the rules, no matter the size of the ego. This just shows how much you know about what happened after Incarna. Skill yourself! |
Selinate
764
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:14:00 -
[1243] - Quote
If CCP puts him back on the CSM or lifts his ban before 30 days, I'm unsubbing and taking a hiatus again. I am not too big on playing games where this kind of behavior is allowed. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1944
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:18:00 -
[1244] - Quote
I support this decision completely.
It is sad Mittens displayed such poor judgement that required this action on the part of CCP but this was the minimum required to restore the integrity of the CSM in the eyes of the majority of the players of Eve and to show the outside world CCP took this indecent seriously.
Thank you CCP for making what must have been a very hard call and getting it right.
Issler |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
158
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:21:00 -
[1245] - Quote
Selinate wrote:If CCP puts him back on the CSM or lifts his ban before 30 days, I'm unsubbing and taking a hiatus again. I am not too big on playing games where this kind of behavior is allowed. Think it very likely CCP will change their call on something like this just because *forumragetears*? Yea, me neither. |
Anela Cistine
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
165
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:25:00 -
[1246] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS.
Can you please clarify this? It sounds like CCP employees were not sure if that panel was "real life" or "an official CCP forum" hence the need for "much deliberation". It was unclear. But after deciding that it was indeed an official forum, you retroactively applied the rules to players. Employees weren't sure what rules apply, but random players are expected to intuit the answer CCP will come to if they ever consider the question? That doesn't sound quite right.
Applying the EULA/TOS to a real life event and then retroactively declaring that real life event to be part of the forums, and punishing people seems like a terrible precedent. Announce the rules, then punish people who break the rules. Doing it the other way around is madness. What's next, banning people for things they say during the "official" pub crawl?
Please clarify. |
Selinate
764
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:27:00 -
[1247] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Selinate wrote:If CCP puts him back on the CSM or lifts his ban before 30 days, I'm unsubbing and taking a hiatus again. I am not too big on playing games where this kind of behavior is allowed. Think it very likely CCP will change their call on something like this just because *forumragetears*? Yea, me neither.
No, I don't, but I am just stating my position on the chance that they do, and hope that others have the sense to do the same. I'd rather play WoW than play a game where this kind of behavior is allowed. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
158
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:28:00 -
[1248] - Quote
I think the reply uses "forum" in the generic sense, as in, a place where people talk about stuff, as opposed to "forum" as in these specific thingies on web. The reply is about the fact that yes, Fanfest alliance panels are covered by CCP rules of conduct, as they are places "sponsored by CCP", as opposed to say tables in a random pub.
And anyone who thinks that the fact that they need to "intuit" the idea that is is NOT OK to encourage other players to harass someone in order to hurt them in RL, even as a joke, is a problem... well, they should not be communicating in any shape or form with the civilized world anyhow, so cannot see it as a problem myself if they cannot see the line and get banned as a result. |
Devore Sekk
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 19:29:00 -
[1249] - Quote
Mashie Saldana wrote:The funny thing is, CCP didnt force Mittens to resign and invalidate the votes.
He did that himself.
Been following this sage since I saw it on live feed. The vast majority of the commentary on it by players and outsiders has been nearly unanimously misinformed, missing context, and is just plain old knee-jerk white-knighting (none of them have talked to the player in question, and resorted to playing the popular "cyberbulliyng" card instead, the new "will someone think of the children" meme). This forces CCP to react to appease these whiners and fix perceptions which were set by the train wreck stories on Massively and similar.
The above comment plays right into this stupidity.
The Mittani's account is temp-banned. A banned player cannot serve on the CSM. The Mittani has merely saved himself and CCP the indignity and embarrassment of having to dismiss him from the CSM. His stepping down is the best outcome for all involved. In all likelihood, he was informed of the incoming ban in advance. |
Smiling Menace
Star Nebulae Holdings Inc.
232
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:22:00 -
[1250] - Quote
I feel like I missed something but can't be bothered to read 59 pages to find out what it was. |
|
Alexandr Kerensky
Paxton Industries Gentlemen's Agreement
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:26:00 -
[1251] - Quote
So much RAAAAAAAAGEEEEEE!!!!!
Mitanni was drunk, said something stupid, was big enough to apologize and VOLUNTARILY resign. He will be back in 30 days, his wrath will burn all before him. The Alexpocalyse will begin! Would I like him back for CSM7: Yes! But that's not gonna change, despite all the emo tears to the contrary. He'll rule CSM8 when it comes around, and will still be a huge force in New Eden politics and events. Bottom line: Mittens ain't dead. He will return, and all will be right with the world. The amount of ragetears over this is pretty entertaining though. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:56:00 -
[1252] - Quote
Selinate wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Selinate wrote:If CCP puts him back on the CSM or lifts his ban before 30 days, I'm unsubbing and taking a hiatus again. I am not too big on playing games where this kind of behavior is allowed. Think it very likely CCP will change their call on something like this just because *forumragetears*? Yea, me neither. No, I don't, but I am just stating my position on the chance that they do, and hope that others have the sense to do the same. I'd rather play WoW than play a game where this kind of behavior is allowed.
Its almost shocking the contrast between your statement and the reason I believe I actually play Eve instead of wow to begin with. After spening an entire day carrying a false smile towards people I'd rather strangle who in turn return a false smile and polite pleasantries when really all they are trying to do is step on you to hide their own faults or get ahead in their careers... Its somewhat refreshing to log onto a world where others can skip the pleasantries and be brutally honest about their intentions to break you, & you may return the sentiment. Not to say that 2 faced people dont exist in eve, who hide behind corp/ally politics shaking your hand while holding a back destined knife in the other... but at least the option use the knife is there. |
Selinate
764
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 21:28:00 -
[1253] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Selinate wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Selinate wrote:If CCP puts him back on the CSM or lifts his ban before 30 days, I'm unsubbing and taking a hiatus again. I am not too big on playing games where this kind of behavior is allowed. Think it very likely CCP will change their call on something like this just because *forumragetears*? Yea, me neither. No, I don't, but I am just stating my position on the chance that they do, and hope that others have the sense to do the same. I'd rather play WoW than play a game where this kind of behavior is allowed. Interesting, I kind of favour a game where no punches are withheld. Ofter a day at spent exchanging pleasantries with people who'd do anything within the confines of grey business ethics to screw you, but still smile when shaking your hand. I find it somewhat refreshing to log onto a world where others can skip the pleasantries and be brutally honest about their intentions to break you, & you may return the sentiment. Not to say that 2 faced people dont exist in eve, who hide behind corp/ally politics shaking your hand while holding a back destined knife in the other... but at least the option use the knife is there. Infact the greater the chance that my actions here might affect someones mood or even cause them emotional grief in RL, the bigger the turn on for me. And the knowledge that I can fall victim to the same only increases the rush.
You and I are talking about 2 completely different things. I am ok with scamming, lying, cheating betrayal in Eve and all of that.
What I do not accept is idiot players harassing other players and encouraging other players to harass that player in order to make them commit suicide. There is a line to be drawn here. |
Everial
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 22:06:00 -
[1254] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:Following the Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012, an incident was broadcast live on air by a panelist during the Q&A which broke the EVE Online EULA/TOS. The panelist was a member of the CSM who has subsequently resigned from CSM6 and, as a result, will resign his seat on CSM7. GM Salmon, VP of Customer Relations, provides more detail in this blog. Update: CCP Xhagen has posted some answers to common questions in the thread.
CCP's arbitrary application of their EULA and TOS reveals an endemic problem with their community relations wing. It is a years long issue that started with the T20 controversy and is revived each time you ban a critic. Your failure is comprehensive, your professionalism laughable, your future bleak. |
Draknishar
Directive XIII
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 22:23:00 -
[1255] - Quote
Personaly I feel CCP should be held responsible for this if anyone. Alternatively he should have been stoped in his tracks and told then and there that what he was doing was unacceptable and to stay clear of things like that.
I feel this is just CCP covering their ass 'cause alot of gaming sites posted about it. |
Wolfduke
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 22:29:00 -
[1256] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I support this decision completely.
It is sad Mittens displayed such poor judgement that required this action on the part of CCP but this was the minimum required to restore the integrity of the CSM in the eyes of the majority of the players of Eve and to show the outside world CCP took this indecent seriously.
Thank you CCP for making what must have been a very hard call and getting it right.
Issler
Full of yourself as ever I see.
How's that working out for you? |
Pasen Haas
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 22:33:00 -
[1257] - Quote
I like it when CCP go out of they're way to make the game enjoyable, then turn around and do stupid crap. Like this, and renaming all the missiles to stupid stuff >.< I CANT FIND MY DAMN HEAVIES!
Also, ..I., - right up you ccp. |
Joepopo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 22:37:00 -
[1258] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I support this decision completely.
It is sad Mittens displayed such poor judgement that required this action on the part of CCP but this was the minimum required to restore the integrity of the CSM in the eyes of the majority of the players of Eve and to show the outside world CCP took this indecent seriously.
Thank you CCP for making what must have been a very hard call and getting it right.
Issler
Now that mittani is out, it is up to you to make CSM7 successful. So far I only saw you and DariusIII being unsupportive of your fellow CSM member. This is not right and you shall not publicly diminish the other CSM member. This is, my good sir, a troll attitude. It shows nothing but disorder and tension within the CSM. Next time you have a problem in the CSM, please keep it quiet.
CSM6 was very successul and set the game back on the right track. We are expecting no less from you now. Don't disapoint us. I don't care really if it is you oor mittani who fixes the game for everyone, I just want the job done. And The Mittani, although you may find him too hard on afk miner, had the job done.
|
Chokichi Ozuwara
Lucky Dragon Convenience
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 22:44:00 -
[1259] - Quote
Everial wrote:CCP's arbitrary application of their EULA and TOS reveals an endemic problem with their community relations wing. It is a years long issue that started with the T20 controversy and is revived each time you ban a critic. Your failure is comprehensive, your professionalism laughable, your future bleak. Just keep paying that subscription fee sweetie! Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
Alexandr Kerensky
Paxton Industries Gentlemen's Agreement
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 00:00:00 -
[1260] - Quote
Why is this not 60 pages yet!? WHY!!???1111!1!
Edit: YAY!!! |
|
Shepard Book
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 00:02:00 -
[1261] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
So you change the wardec system to make it harder to escape from a wardec (which I like) but you make it easy for him to escape from removal from CSM and the chance of applying later... I wonder how many actually believe he was not warned to step down before the Ban. He waited quite sometime to step down from Chair and then CSM after he said he would. I am pretty sure everyone knows he was trying to stay in the CSM to begin with. Funny how he all of a sudden leaves CSM and is then banned. Who you trying to kid?
|
Proclus Diadochu
Obstergo Persona Non Gratis
80
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 00:36:00 -
[1262] - Quote
ISD Eshtir locked a thread without any proper provocation and held no justification for the LOCK. CCP, UNLOCK my thread, as a paying customer of Eve Online, and as long as my thread does not violate the EULA/TOS, then my thread does not deserve to be locked. I will repost here, as directed, and still expect my former thread to be unlocked. Also, stop allowing scrubs to lock threads without provocation simply because you consider it "damage control" CCP!
Quote:TL;DR - CCP violated their own policies to punish a player for apparently violating their own policies.
Before you lock this thread, CCP, you did say in your DEVBLOG that this was a 'special case', even making your own thread about The Mittani's ban. So I do not believe I am violating any policies regarding posting on the subject of "individual bans". I do believe, however, that this "special case" does bring to the surface a number of questions. (Also side note: You may ask why this is in CAOD, CCP, well it's because you just banned arguably the most influential leader in the game. He is referred to as the 'king of space' and this ban may or may not have repercussions in game. Probably won't but gives this enough reason to put it in here. Could just post it on SA, Reddit, K***, send it to Riverini for EN24, and some other gaming magazines to raise more questions, but lets see how it is received here first and give CCP a chance.)
What made this a "special case", CCP? Was it the fact that an alliance leader made an off-color remark during a panel at fanfest or the fact that it was posted by one of your employees on the internet causing a media frenzy? Regarding the off-color remark made by the player. A) It was not made within the realm of the EVE Online universe, B) This one is more a question: Did you make Mittens or any of the other members of the panel sign a waiver stating that what they said out of game could have in game consequences? Doubt it, and C) J+ñger was involved. Mittens sincerely apologized to the player, the community, the media, and even stepped down as CSM chair. Subjectively speaking, I do not believe that the step down was even necessary, as everyone makes mistakes, and honestly that comment held no real sway outside of the ridiculousness that was created by the gaming community and a couple of less popular CSM members who's questionable moral fiber should be reviewed by CCP as well if this is the direction of your company.
Now the "special case". What you did here, CCP, is create what we like to call in the educated world a "double standard". There have been numerous occasions that you have told my friends, players, and myself that you could not discuss bans of individual members, yet you publish this one in a DEVBLOG and create a thread to further embarrass a player for an out of game action. You violated your own policy to punish a player for violating a policy. You see what you did there?
However, since we are in the mood for breaking rules, letGÇÖs discuss something else. What did CCP do to punish the DEVS that were in the room during the panel? The ones that thanked everyone, laughed and enjoyed the festivities as opposed to reprimanding Mittani and browbeating him on the spot when the "violation" occurred. What about the CCP member that published the video on the web for the mass media to eat up and stir more drama? You violate policies to punish and embarrass players, now please account for what other measures you have done to clean your precious corporate name?
Personally, I believe after the hoops that CCP, the community at large, the media, and I am sure himself made The Mittani jump through, and the step down from CSM Chair, he has been punished enough. You guys seem to forget that The Mittani did lead the most successful CSM to date, helping your company quite a bit. I believe you should either reinstate his account and apologize for further embarrassing the player and apologize to the community for violating your own rules, or continue to make poor decisions and see this start another issue. Who is going to care about what the gaming media thinks of EVE Online if no one is there to play the game, CCP?
I would like to know, along with at least 10,058 other players. Thanks... ~Occupy New Eden~ |
Demon Azrakel
Bite Me inc Exhale.
76
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 02:17:00 -
[1263] - Quote
Seriously, most of the player base had no issue with the event setup itself or the comments made. We were rather happy about the setup, and some of the presentations were rather good, including the controversial presentation in question.
Remember who you are supposed to keep happy?
Sony?
The Gaming Media?
Soccer Moms?
no...
Think Incarna?
Who was unhappy?
What happened when those people were unhappy?
Is that what you want CCP?
Did you learn your lesson?
(apparently not) |
Zulran Hans
Refuge of Hope Boot Camp Lemniskate
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 04:34:00 -
[1264] - Quote
While it is important for CCP to think about the 10,000 voters, they also have to consider how this will affect the long-term image of EVE Online, as well as the hundreds of thousands other subscribers.
ThatGÇÖs why I think CCP had to take this extremely seriously.
Most presentations in the FanFest represented the developer, and the Alliance Panel was meant to represent us, the player community. There we had among the best GÇ£athletesGÇ¥ who are very good in the game to share with the public why EVE is enjoyable.
Of course, they also indirectly gave an impression on how the best EVE gamers are like outside the virtual universe.
His sincere public apology shows me that Alex is a respectable guy, and undoubtedly one of the great players we have in EVE. The Mittani is a character that will be remembered for a very long time.
I donGÇÖt know whether CCP has made the right call. But they have made it. LetGÇÖs stop exchanging angers towards other players and the developers.
LetGÇÖs instead learn from this mistake, and suggest things that will make the Alliance Panel better next time.
This is a wake-up call for all of us. With the average playerGÇÖs age of 27-28 years old, we are quite a mature gaming community. Let's show that, as EVE players, while we are fun, we are also a respectable group of people.
|
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
159
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 07:56:00 -
[1265] - Quote
Demon Azrakel wrote:Seriously, most of the player base had no issue with the event setup itself or the comments made. We were rather happy about the setup, and some of the presentations were rather good, including the controversial presentation in question. I don't doubt it that from where you are, it looks like that "most of the player base" had no issue; from where I am, however, it seems that most of it did.
|
Break Stuff
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 08:20:00 -
[1266] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote:Hi folks. We've noticed a few common questions popping up in this thread that we'd like to answer.
Q1, CCP forced the resignation of the CSM Chairman. A1, As a part of the CSM bylaws, banned players are ineligible to sit on the CSM. This would have been an unfortunate side effect of CCP feeling that a temporary ban was the correct course of action in this case. However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.
We have had members resign from the CSM before. The process is pretty clear in these cases, the next person on the voting poll becomes active. This is the first time the chairman of the CSM has resigned so we are discussing with the CSM if we should make amendments to the process based on that.
Q2, There is an issue of 10,058 votes. What will CCP do about that? A2, As in most democratic societies, if an elected member resigns the governance system is designed to handle that; for CSM6 the "next" person steps in (an alternate); for CSM7, where we had removed the concept of GÇÿalternateGÇÖ and increased the size of the CSM to 14, the council simply continues to function minus one. If players are not satisfied with that system they should contact the CSM and propose changes for CSM 7 to discuss formally. The CSM can bring this issue up directly with CCP and propose changes should such an event happen in the future. It is clear from many communications from CSM6 and CSM7-elect members that they take the representation of these 10,058 voters very seriously and hopefully the remaining CSM representatives will act in the spirit of those who voted for the resigned member.
We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players, and that the voting system is anonymous.
Q3, Real life actions should not equate to in game sanctions. Why did this happen? A3, After much deliberation on the subject, CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums. As such, it falls under the jurisdiction of the TOS. Furthermore, the panelist, present on the panel in order to represent his in-game identity, advocated using in-game actions to achieve a real world outcome. Specifically he suggested that if anyone wanted to make another player kill themselves in real life, they should go in game and harass them to achieve that consequence. The totality of the situation including the official forum in which it was held and statements of the panelist during the Q&A, have since lead to in-game sanctions. However, it is important to note that this incidence does not necessarily create precedence for any other "real life" actions or statements triggering a ban.
Q4, Wait, so you DID vet the presentations? Meaning it was perfectly fine for him to make fun of a suicidal player? A4, Although the contents of the Alliance Panel presentations and discussion topics are reviewed by CCP prior to the event itself, the TOS-breaking incident took place during an unscripted Q&A session after the main presentation which was not mentioned in the submitted presentation. The submitted presentation slides (although distasteful) did not give the name of the player at any time, nor did they call for direct action against that player, and therefore passed muster. CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community.
get out
emptyquoting this
|
MoyO zOlotse
State War Academy Caldari State
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 09:04:00 -
[1267] - Quote
Mashie Saldana wrote:The funny thing is, CCP didnt force Mittens to resign and invalidate the votes.
He did that himself.
10/10
Couldnt and shouldnt have happened to a nicer goon. |
Josef Djugashvilis
The Scope Gallente Federation
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 09:25:00 -
[1268] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Empathic Psychopath wrote:Koby Botick wrote:1/6 th of all votes disregarded. Is CCP back a russian sounding abbreviation again? I hear they like to manipulate votes in plain sight there too.
Wasn't it goons that were praising CCP not that long ago when a nerf to tians was announced? My how the mighty have fallen :) "Oooooh look at me, I can use fancy words I saw in a movie once!"
Missing a 'C'
CCCP
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
A Soviet being roughly the same as an English local council. |
Ibn Taymiyyah
Treasures Collectors Northern Associates.
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 11:16:00 -
[1269] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Ibn:
I have never said, and neither has CCP said, that you cannot blow up my ship if I threaten with suicide (which I won't do, but as a hypothetical ;)). For the hundreth time, Mittani was not punished for blowing the guy up; he was punished for what was said about it. This is not black and white. We can at the same time accept blowing people's ships up no matter what they say to you to plead or threaten you to stop, think threatening with a suicide in a game is a crap thing to do, and think that pointing and laughing at people who are OOCly upset is also a crap thing to do. If you cannot handle that many different aspects of thinking at the same time, maybe you should not be playing EVE. It is such complex game, it might be too much for you.
TL;DR; if you want to skip the life value vs morality bullshit, skip to the end! ;)
I play EVE because there's no clear moral standings within the EULA/TOS. You can define what you feel is the right path, hence, the sandbox nature, where the "god" (read GM/DEV) does not interfere with what's happening in the game world.
Keeping that in mind, I apply my RL mindset, in which life, as a concept, is simple and only holds any true value if you're related or otherwise connected to it. It's the only way to really be sane and live in a society where everyone does not give a **** about if you're starving to death or not.
So, if a friend of mine dies, I will be touched by it, grief and miss that person. My expectation is that everyone that didn't know the person won't give a **** and I'd be offended if someone who barely knew that person would come up to me and say "I'm really sorry!". Why are you sorry? Did you know him? Did you help him? You didn't care for his whole life, why care now? So I prefer honest people who say, sorry for your grief, but it means nothing to me, as it's the only truth!
In this case, I could not care any less if 1, 10 or 1000 people commit suicide, either because life sucks in RL or because they lost space pixels. I don't know you, your life has no value to me. Makes no goddamn sense to be putting value in something that EVERYONE just ignores on a daily basis, but when confronted with someone who calls it at is actually is, they get on that high horse and claim having some other set of values.
You claim I shouldn't be playing EVE as I can't grasp everything it implies, regarding concepts of mortality? From what you write I mostly understand you have a lot to go through in real life and a lot to understand about "life". You're not precious, you're not special, you're not enlightened... just as 99,999% of other humans aren't. You, me and mostly everyone else, are just here to keep the species going.
Think about the true meaning for life as a whole and then look at one individual that is claiming to take his life due to losing crap in a game. If you think about that, being honest with yourself and ignoring social boundaries and perceptions imposed by your education, you'll see that he's nothing to you. He's irrelevant. He is and will be relevant to those who know him, his family, his friends but to you, he might as well be a ant or a fly. You wont care.
And all this is taking us away from the real point. EVE is part of real life, in it's own context, and thus you cannot separate them. In fact, it was the suicide player that broke that frontier and opened that door to exploit. He's being playing a game as it's designed to be played and then, when losing, puts in a RL aspect to try to get an advantage in game. That RL aspect is now IN GAME because he put it in as a variable.
This ban was wrong!
And I do love that if I'm botting, I get a 7 day ban, but if I tell a crying miner to die in a fire after he tells me he's commiting suicide, due to a lost pixel, I get a 30 day ban! :)
The moral standards on CCP seem to be growing ... either that or a chick made this decision! (all emotional and crap :P) |
Cede Forster
Graffa
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 13:02:00 -
[1270] - Quote
The argument CCP makes here is that if you signed a contract with the company about using a game and website allows them to enforce such rules without explicitly mention it, to anything that is simmilar including a RL event.
That is just begging for getting into trouble with customer protection agencies in the european union for extending contracts clearly far beyond their intended reach. I am not sure they got properly advised about the legal fallout that can create. |
|
Deviana Sevidon
Jades Falcon Guards
294
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 13:04:00 -
[1271] - Quote
The ban is well justified and CCP is within their right to ban him. |
Cede Forster
Graffa
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 13:08:00 -
[1272] - Quote
Deviana Sevidon wrote:The ban is well justified and CCP is within their right to ban him.
Because the RL event had a TOS to sign? Or why is that? |
ASuperVillain
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 13:19:00 -
[1273] - Quote
Dear Enemies, please mark the time and date the high water mark has been stained into being. Evidently there is a limit to the "hardcore" no-limit nature of EvE. So be careful what you say and do. EULA/TOS can bite you in the ass, when they feel like it...
Now much like the fact there are warning labels on vending machines, "do not tip may crush you to death." Will EvE be packaged with a "don't play if depressed people may grief you to death?" or how about "trust no-one you don't have a physical address for and have met at LEAST once."
Since it comes with "scam all you want we'll make more noobs"
But, no one has actually killed themselves... yet. More the pity that, since most characters are horrible things
So now the spectre of EULA/TOS hangs over us all... And if you read it, and a funny read it is. It just becomes when will CCP snatch their ball away from us/me/you and go home?
In the words of Hunter S. Thompson;
And that, I think, was the handleGÇöthat sense of inevitable victory over the forces of Old and Evil. Not in any mean or military sense; we didnGÇÖt need that. Our energy would simply prevail. There was no point in fightingGÇöon our side or theirs. We had all the momentum; we were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave.GǪ
So now, less than (nine) years later, you can go up on a steep hill in (Iceland) and look (around), and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high-water markGÇöthat place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
-ASV |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
169
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 13:51:00 -
[1274] - Quote
ASuperVillain wrote:Now much like the fact there are warning labels on vending machines, "do not tip may crush you to death." Will EvE be packaged with a "don't play if depressed people may grief you to death?" or how about "trust no-one you don't have a physical address for and have met at LEAST once."
Current EULA actually reads:
"You may encounter and converse with people who are rude, offensive, belligerent, and who may use indecent, obscene, and/or threatening or harassing language while playing the Game. You may report any instances of such behavior to CCP. CCP will investigate and take such measures as CCP, in its sole judgment, determines are reasonable under the circumstances. CCP does not guarantee that you will not encounter behavior of others that you may view as insulting, demeaning, offensive, threatening or harassing. You assume all risk associated with playing the Game, and CCP assumes no responsibility for the conduct of any other players, and shall not be liable to you or any other person for their conduct. " |
Terra Mikael
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 13:55:00 -
[1275] - Quote
Really don't see why stepping down was necessary - not like The Wis voted for him. I'm sure there is some loser miner like him on the CSM that he could cry to. |
Cede Forster
Graffa
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 14:11:00 -
[1276] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:ASuperVillain wrote:Now much like the fact there are warning labels on vending machines, "do not tip may crush you to death." Will EvE be packaged with a "don't play if depressed people may grief you to death?" or how about "trust no-one you don't have a physical address for and have met at LEAST once." Current EULA actually reads: "You may encounter and converse with people who are rude, offensive, belligerent, and who may use indecent, obscene, and/or threatening or harassing language while playing the Game. You may report any instances of such behavior to CCP. CCP will investigate and take such measures as CCP, in its sole judgment, determines are reasonable under the circumstances. CCP does not guarantee that you will not encounter behavior of others that you may view as insulting, demeaning, offensive, threatening or harassing. You assume all risk associated with playing the Game, and CCP assumes no responsibility for the conduct of any other players, and shall not be liable to you or any other person for their conduct. "
But as we learned these days, what they write in their Eula/Tos and what they do are two different things. |
Serene Repose
Perkone Caldari State
502
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 17:32:00 -
[1277] - Quote
I was referred here by CCP Navigator, ironically. (Something about reduncency, go figure.) I wondered where this thread was hiding!
Smokestack lightnin' shinin' just like gold. |
Serene Repose
Perkone Caldari State
502
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 17:51:00 -
[1278] - Quote
CCP Xhagen wrote: ...However, prior to any notification to this effect, The chairman of CSM6 resigned of his own volition as he had previously announced that he would do. Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs.... I found this particularly poignant. I find it hard to believe Mitt knew this. If I asked was he counseled by "someone" on this point, would I get an...nevermind. I know the answer to that already.
CCP Xhagen wrote:"...CCP considers the Alliance Panel to be an official CCP forum, as it is hosted by CCP and broadcast in a similarly visible fashion to the EVE Online forums....We should also keep in mind that every CSM member has the obligation to, at some level, represent all of EVE and its players..." Which leads to this. No one of the person in question's ilk represents me on any level any place. I'm apalled CCP (you) doesn't have any better sense than to disqualify this person permanently having ably demonstrated his qualities as a "person."
CCP Xhagen wrote:"...CCP have always allowed substantial leeway during the Alliance Panel and we look forward to ensuring that future events remain entertaining and engaging for the EVE community...." I guess one must go to the frozen north and drink a few gallons of beer to get CCP's idea of "entertaining and engaging."
This amounts to repainting the office and moving the furniture around to solve a management problem. Let's hope it doesn't equate to rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Smokestack lightnin' shinin' just like gold. |
Galison
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 18:32:00 -
[1279] - Quote
Dear people that see nothing wrong with what he said. YOU are SICK in the head. ***** and moan all you want what he did is morally reprehensible yes its eve and people poop in each others sandbox all the time but honestly giving the name out of someone that maybe suicidal and actively encouraging people to harass him till he follows through with doing it shows you need to get a grip on reality. I hope some of you idiots do try to harass the guy so CCP who said their monitoring the situation with him see it and ban you as well. There is a line between game and real life some of you need to stop playing and get an understanding of that fact and grow up.
Signed the noobs will some will write off because he is a noob corp, Galison |
Gingerlord
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 18:37:00 -
[1280] - Quote
Galison wrote:Dear people that see nothing wrong with what he said. YOU are SICK in the head. ***** and moan all you want what he did is morally reprehensible yes its eve and people poop in each others sandbox all the time but honestly giving the name out of someone that maybe suicidal and actively encouraging people to harass him till he follows through with doing it shows you need to get a grip on reality. I hope some of you idiots do try to harass the guy so CCP who said their monitoring the situation with him see it and ban you as well. There is a line between game and real life some of you need to stop playing and get an understanding of that fact and grow up.
Signed the noobs will some will write off because he is a noob corp, Galison
What Galison said. Totally uncalled for. |
|
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
130
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:30:00 -
[1281] - Quote
Galison wrote:Dear people that see nothing wrong with what he said. YOU are SICK in the head. ***** and moan all you want what he did is morally reprehensible yes its eve and people poop in each others sandbox all the time but honestly giving the name out of someone that maybe suicidal and actively encouraging people to harass him till he follows through with doing it shows you need to get a grip on reality. I hope some of you idiots do try to harass the guy so CCP who said their monitoring the situation with him see it and ban you as well. There is a line between game and real life some of you need to stop playing and get an understanding of that fact and grow up.
Signed the noobs will some will write off because he is a noob corp, Galison
it really makes me sick to see people who lack the english skills to place emphasis through good diction, and instead resort to capitalising words
ugh
P.S. his alliance has already been wardecced |
lolbalavan
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:31:00 -
[1282] - Quote
'Kill yourself' - that's the message sent by Alex Gianturco of Eve Online to fellow player 'The Wis', who wrote to the Mittani (Gianturco's pseudonym) a heart-wrenching letter saying he was contemplating suicide.
The Wis, who's real name is unknown, spoke of being abandoned by his wife, robbed of his children, and left with nothing.
But that had no effect on Gianturco, known by many in the Eve community for being cruel, aggressive and pompous.
Speaking before hundreds of people gathered at an Eve convention in Iceland, Gianturco, drunk into a stupor, called for players to spam 'The Wis' with in-game mail and to encourage him to, quote - "Kill himself".
His words, however, prompted an unprecedented outrage.
Thousands of players flooded the official Eve Online forums demanding CCP Games take action, questioning why Game Masters had no acted on what was apparently a felony - assisting suicide.
The reaction was so tremendous, that journalists from a specturm of gaming websites rushed to investigate.
According to them - Gianturco has a history of violent episodes, and is a known cyber-bully.
In game, he leads the "Goonswarm" guild, composed of a similarly minded group of online thugs who by all appearances enjoy piling torment and anguish on their fellow players.
So far, CCP has issued a 30-day ban for Gianturco, and forced him to resign from the game's player council called the CSM.
"This has been long in coming" said one avid ********** poster named Opti, "For 8 years Gianturco has organized website attacks, sent out threats and flooded forums with spam".
"We will not stand for it anymore" he added.
Another active Eve Online player known as Riverini, who competed against Gianturco for a seat on the in-game council spoke of voter intimidation and organized ballot stuffing, with Goonswarm using multiple characters and multiple accounts, either owned by them or hacked, to make sure Gianturco got what he wanted.
But Gianturco remains at large and undaunted.
He has now called on his followers to harass and liable any journalist that dares speak out against him.
The first victim has become Brendan Drain of Massively, who has already received death threats over his article on the matter.
"It's absolutely deplorable what he has gotten away with" said another player, named PenifSmash "I have tried, and I will continue to try hard, because that's what I do best, to bring light to the Mittani's actions".
Police have allegedly become involved in the matter, and a cyber law enforcement source says Gianturco may be facing federal charges for what some call a decade long online terror-spree. |
GuidoCom
Eve Defence Force Fatal Ascension
19
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:39:00 -
[1283] - Quote
pausing my two account subscriptions as well after these few years.
so lame |
Alexandr Kerensky
Paxton Industries Gentlemen's Agreement
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:41:00 -
[1284] - Quote
Wow. Apparently someone has discovered how to use the 'copy' and 'paste ' function. What an amazing modern world we live in. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
177
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:55:00 -
[1285] - Quote
Hasn't learned to credit his sources yet, though. Maybe he'll learn that next. ;) |
Ban Bindy
Bindy Brothers Pottery Association
84
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 20:03:00 -
[1286] - Quote
People keeping tossing Terms of Service and EULA around as if that's the end of the issue. Mittani signed another document with CCP when he joined CSM, the non-disclosure agreement. It governs the behavior CCP expects of members of the CSM. Unless you have read it you have no idea what's in it. So you don't have any idea what agreement this guy actually violated.
If you search through all this welter of threads you'll see a quote from this agreement which, if accurate, indicates that CSM members are expected to go beyond the other agreements in their conduct.
10,000 votes don't invalidate anybody's obligation to behave in a respectable way in public. This guy was the head of the CSM and he acted out at a forum that got the gamer press involved and caused yet more public relations problems for CCP. Kicking him off the CSM was about the least action they could be expected to take.
This kind of PR disaster costs the company money and time.
All because a big mouth who knew better could not stop himself from wagging his epeen in public. And his "I'm sorry" is supposed to be enough.
It's no wonder Goonswarm is raging because this incident basically destroys their credibility in this game on all levels.
Hubris. That's what Mittani showed and continues to show. He's now in an active campaign to try to wreck CCP's image and shore up his own. He had 10,000 votes in his pocket and he thought that made him invulnerable. Nope. |
Mistress Lilu
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
117
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 20:50:00 -
[1287] - Quote
I would like to suggest that Mitardi gets a perma ban. |
Graic Gabtar
The Lemon Party
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 21:32:00 -
[1288] - Quote
Please rename thread to - "New Dev Blog: Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012: Sony's Judgement" EVE shall be purged by fire - please Gods let them ALL burn in Jita. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
131
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 22:04:00 -
[1289] - Quote
Ban Bindy wrote:People keeping tossing Terms of Service and EULA around as if that's the end of the issue. Mittani signed another document with CCP when he joined CSM, the non-disclosure agreement. It governs the behavior CCP expects of members of the CSM. Unless you have read it you have no idea what's in it. So you don't have any idea what agreement this guy actually violated.
If you search through all this welter of threads you'll see a quote from this agreement which, if accurate, indicates that CSM members are expected to go beyond the other agreements in their conduct.
10,000 votes don't invalidate anybody's obligation to behave in a respectable way in public. This guy was the head of the CSM and he acted out at a forum that got the gamer press involved and caused yet more public relations problems for CCP. Kicking him off the CSM was about the least action they could be expected to take.
This kind of PR disaster costs the company money and time.
All because a big mouth who knew better could not stop himself from wagging his epeen in public. And his "I'm sorry" is supposed to be enough.
It's no wonder Goonswarm is raging because this incident basically destroys their credibility in this game on all levels.
Hubris. That's what Mittani showed and continues to show. He's now in an active campaign to try to wreck CCP's image and shore up his own. He had 10,000 votes in his pocket and he thought that made him invulnerable. Nope.
hahahahaha get a load of this guy |
Micro star
Manson Family Corcoran State
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 22:17:00 -
[1290] - Quote
So it's saturday night and i have been drinking a few beers. Just going to call a dude that has problems and tell him to kill himself. If i get in any problems i will tell the police it's ok, just talk to the goons.......... |
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 22:47:00 -
[1291] - Quote
lolbalavan wrote:'Kill yourself' - that's the message sent by Alex Gianturco of Eve Online to fellow player 'The Wis', who wrote to the Mittani (Gianturco's pseudonym) a heart-wrenching letter saying he was contemplating suicide.
The Wis, who's real name is unknown, spoke of being abandoned by his wife, robbed of his children, and left with nothing.
But that had no effect on Gianturco, known by many in the Eve community for being cruel, aggressive and pompous.
Speaking before hundreds of people gathered at an Eve convention in Iceland, Gianturco, drunk into a stupor, called for players to spam 'The Wis' with in-game mail and to encourage him to, quote - "Kill himself".
His words, however, prompted an unprecedented outrage.
Thousands of players flooded the official Eve Online forums demanding CCP Games take action, questioning why Game Masters had no acted on what was apparently a felony - assisting suicide.
The reaction was so tremendous, that journalists from a specturm of gaming websites rushed to investigate.
According to them - Gianturco has a history of violent episodes, and is a known cyber-bully.
In game, he leads the "Goonswarm" guild, composed of a similarly minded group of online thugs who by all appearances enjoy piling torment and anguish on their fellow players.
So far, CCP has issued a 30-day ban for Gianturco, and forced him to resign from the game's player council called the CSM.
"This has been long in coming" said one avid ********** poster named Opti, "For 8 years Gianturco has organized website attacks, sent out threats and flooded forums with spam".
"We will not stand for it anymore" he added.
Another active Eve Online player known as Riverini, who competed against Gianturco for a seat on the in-game council spoke of voter intimidation and organized ballot stuffing, with Goonswarm using multiple characters and multiple accounts, either owned by them or hacked, to make sure Gianturco got what he wanted.
But Gianturco remains at large and undaunted.
He has now called on his followers to harass and liable any journalist that dares speak out against him.
The first victim has become Brendan Drain of Massively, who has already received death threats over his article on the matter.
"It's absolutely deplorable what he has gotten away with" said another player, named PenifSmash "I have tried, and I will continue to try hard, because that's what I do best, to bring light to the Mittani's actions".
Police have allegedly become involved in the matter, and a cyber law enforcement source says Gianturco may be facing federal charges for what some call a decade long online terror-spree.
Thats alot or hearsay, not saying you're talking through your rear, but those statements would have more weight if you posted any evidence to support them. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 22:54:00 -
[1292] - Quote
Copy paste from my offtopic reply in an unrealated forumn catagory with minor modifications so it makes sence without the need to include the posts I replied to:
Its not like he gave anyone his name, surname, address, social security & telephone numbers. He gave them one of his 22 character's names. At a game alliance panel discussing events & a character ...in a game, and when he spoke, he was introduced as "The Mitanni" a character... from a game, at a huge pissup event for fanboys of a game.
Is that enough game for you?
to be quite frank, the only person that brought RL into it was the guy who sent an evemail to another character in a game who is a member of unquestionably the most renouned griefer alliance in a game, describing his sad life story to the sounds of a [tearful man playing a really sad song on a tiny violin.. out of game]. (Incidentally this is why I have zero sympathy for him, & truly believe he deserves to be singled out & mocked in public. Its the equivelent of running up to a foaming at the mouth rottweiler with your pants down and farting in its face expecting it not to tear you a new anus. Of course here is a clear example of the owner of the dog being fined and the animal is put down.)
If this had nothing to do with "the game" then the TOS/EULA would not apply at all.
Many have presented a good argument about the moral implications of inciting a real person to commit suicied, aswell as the Mittani's seat on the CSM having a limited affect on CCP's image when making the comment as he did, which could be so widely misinterpreted.
I have no fond feelings for Mittani or for goonswarm, but objectively with the evidence presented I so far am struggling to find agreement with you that he infact broke any real world moral ethics, perhaps its a failing on my part. Had he himself given out any out of game info indentifying the 'victim', this would be an open and shut case in my opinion, and I'd even expect legal implications. But as it is, that was never the case, and as such. I have no moral issue. Now where it does get hazzy, is the interpretation of the EULA and how far did mittani go to breach its player harrassment clause. Even here its left up to interpretation because does the one punishable for the infraction have to be the people who commit the harrasment, or just the one who suggests it? And in mitanni's wording... did he infact even suggest it?
Lets take a look once again at his quote: The Mittani: Incidentally, if you want to make the guy kill himself, his name is The Wiz. Its GÇ£T-H-E SPACE W-I-SGÇ¥. He has his own corp. Find him.
It apears the only possible damning part that could be interpreted as inciting others to harass this individule may be the words "Find him". But he fails to go into detail about what creative measure one might take in order to achieve "guy killing himself." Nore did he elaborate if by guy killing himself he meant: The guy [being character] self destructing his pod, (Im sure that could be acomplished by scramming & webbing his capsule long enough that his only course of escape would be to commit ingame suicide.) or the guy [player] himself commiting real suicide. Since no rl names or specifics on how to accumplish the latter where given I shall have to accept the former interpretation.
|
Micro star
Manson Family Corcoran State
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 00:27:00 -
[1293] - Quote
Micro star wrote:So it's saturday night and i have been drinking a few beers. Just going to call a dude that has problems and tell him to kill himself. If i get in any problems i will tell the police it's ok, just talk to the goons..........
"Slaps myself on the head."
So I finaly saw it on youtube. What's the fuss about?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvo08_uYjHI
Maby i don't have the full link. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 00:37:00 -
[1294] - Quote
Micro star wrote:Micro star wrote:So it's saturday night and i have been drinking a few beers. Just going to call a dude that has problems and tell him to kill himself. If i get in any problems i will tell the police it's ok, just talk to the goons.......... "Slaps myself on the head." So I finaly saw it on youtube. What's the fuss about? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvo08_uYjHIMaby i don't have the full link.
Yeah I watched it too... but according to almost every game media website I've been to, they'd have you believe in 1000words or more that Mittani started a campaign of cyber bulling, Told players track down the individule, and spam him / edge him on to commit suicide. Some go as far as to suggest the players personal details where given out. And others who actually 'accurately' quote what mittani said, purposely censor the victims name from the quote giving the impression it was the persons real life name. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 00:58:00 -
[1295] - Quote
edit: double post |
Micro star
Manson Family Corcoran State
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 01:05:00 -
[1296] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Micro star wrote:Micro star wrote:So it's saturday night and i have been drinking a few beers. Just going to call a dude that has problems and tell him to kill himself. If i get in any problems i will tell the police it's ok, just talk to the goons.......... "Slaps myself on the head." So I finaly saw it on youtube. What's the fuss about? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvo08_uYjHIMaby i don't have the full link. Yeah I watched it too... but according to almost every game media website I've been to, they'd have you believe in 1000words or more that Mittani started a campaign of cyber bulling, breaking several laws, Told players track down the individule, and spam him / edge him on to commit suicide. many suggest the players personal details where given out. And others who actually 'accurately' quote what mittani said, purposely censor the victims char name from the quote giving the impression it was the persons real life name.
I hear you there. To bad I was believeing it. I was hoping it was the last nail for goons. But seeing it on youtube i must say WTF CCP. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 01:17:00 -
[1297] - Quote
Ban Bindy wrote:People keeping tossing Terms of Service and EULA around as if that's the end of the issue. Mittani signed another document with CCP when he joined CSM, the non-disclosure agreement. It governs the behavior CCP expects of members of the CSM. Unless you have read it you have no idea what's in it. So you don't have any idea what agreement this guy actually violated.
If you search through all this welter of threads you'll see a quote from this agreement which, if accurate, indicates that CSM members are expected to go beyond the other agreements in their conduct.
10,000 votes don't invalidate anybody's obligation to behave in a respectable way in public. This guy was the head of the CSM and he acted out at a forum that got the gamer press involved and caused yet more public relations problems for CCP. Kicking him off the CSM was about the least action they could be expected to take.
This kind of PR disaster costs the company money and time.
Since I sign these oftain when taking on work for a client, non-desclosure agreements are just that: an agreement to not pass on or discuss any confidential information passed onto you by the other party. for example: "We're increasing the need for technium & nerfing despro" (passing on this info would give someone an unfair advantage or disrupt the market)
about the alliance panel: If ccp where worried before this incident about gamer press or PR, perhaps they should have encouraged less yurger-bombs and foul language to start with, I think more people would find that offensive.
as for PR disaster costing money, I doubt a single current player of eve will unsub there account because of it, and the type of potential players that would now never try eve after hearing such a comment, even a missquoted one from a sensationalising bored blogger, would likely never continue to play the game after the first month regardless. |
pashared
Harbingers of Khaos Cant Be Arzed
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 05:13:00 -
[1298] - Quote
I love eve, and the dog eat dog sand box. Ive no problem with what happens in game. I even didnt see much bad in the AP video. Im lucky (or unlucky) enough to have a current RL CA DA at my dispolal so out of curiosity I wanted to know what he thought about the last minutes of the AP video. this person knows nothing about eve, or this thread
this is an exact quote from the return phone call "if this man as so much as showed up at his local ER with so much as an anxiety attack, Id have the guy in the disney hat hooked up by his locals.
what happens in EVE stays in EVE. however this was NOT in game, so I guess what I learned here is gank and burn all you want, just make sure you keep it in game and w/o RL personal depth
we all have to be very careful about media they dont care about facts.
TBH myself i cant really decide if what happen warrents all this attention in the end thou Id hate to his this guy loose his CSM since all in all this is a SNAFU, still thou witches have been burned at the stake becasue of a false nose a peice of wood and a duck |
Mourning Souls
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 05:48:00 -
[1299] - Quote
Had to be a part of the Threadnaught.
Free Mittens. |
Prodomicer
Draconis Coalition
6
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 05:58:00 -
[1300] - Quote
EULA / TOS covering what i say over ts too ? i mean this is bs
Gets banded for a infection that didn't even take place in-game.
And Just who made the videos that got uploaded to the net ? They should get banded as well then.
|
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
135
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 06:35:00 -
[1301] - Quote
Prodomicer wrote:EULA / TOS covering what i say over ts too ? i mean this is bs
Gets banded for a infection that didn't even take place in-game.
And Just who made the videos that got uploaded to the net ? They should get banded as well then.
By your logic the people who bring us this forum should be banned if someone says something like that on here. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Recoil Happens
Debatable Results
38
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 06:43:00 -
[1302] - Quote
So many of mittens followers are arguing with him.
He said he did a bad thing.
He said he would resign.
He said he was ashamed of what he had done.
Now his followers are arguing with him about it.
Either arguing with him or know him so well that they think he lied about his entire apology, and if that is so he is even a bigger scumbag than he described himself to be in his apology.
OK - the numbers
59000 votes about 16.4 % of the total player/voter base.
10085 votes for mittani which comes out to be less than 5% of the player /voter base.
With the total number of players/voters, 5% is about the margin of error. The margin of error is what can be expected to be the amount of sampling error. It means the results could be accepted if the results were 5% in either direction. That means it is not of statistical consequence.
Because the election produced such a small turnout, CCP should recognize the players, at least 83.6% of the players, have no confidence in the CSM.
Would any corporation in the top 10,000 corporations in the world have their customers elect a customer advisory panel? Have a customer advisory panel - yes, absolutely - but not produced by a phoney election where a large voting bloc could have each of its members buy a vote or five for some of the of the plentiful plexes which can be obtained with a few hours of the kind of play people signed up for in the first place. Forget about buying votes for 15 bux and think about the inflation of plexes leading up to fanfest where they could be used to pay for excursions, probably a poker tournament, and oh yeah, extra votes for a CSM
Rather a shallow argument to blame all the inflation on incursionists who might be buying one a month as thousands of other are doing, while fanfesters might be buying up to 30+ if they have a guest with them and intend to see all the excursions. And whatever else could be paid for with Plex by a fanfester. Or maybe even some votes.
CCP Next time you have an election, could you refrain from running a concurrent special on low priced additional accounts?
If you guys are mad because you feel your votes were disenfranchised - take it up with the guy who pizzed your votes down the crapper. Don't blame the victim. Don't blame CCP for getting their teat caught in the wringer by your guy and being forced to act. Put the blame square on the one who brought the whole thing on himself and for each of you for having trusted him. Now go burn Jita down - should be a nice fire, but where will all your market bots go? |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
179
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 08:24:00 -
[1303] - Quote
Quote:truly believe he deserves to be singled out & mocked in public That's the major problem with the EVE community currently: people seriously believing other people can deserve this, and not even just as punishment for something actually heinous or criminal they did after a proper investigation(*), but just because they think the person did something ridiculous.
(*) Personally I don't really believe in public naming&shaming even as a punishment for actual crimes, but I can understand a contrary viewpoint in that case. Talking about people who made a silly mistake "deserving" what is nothing but a mob bullying them disgusts me. |
The Legendary Soldier
Death from the Stars
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 08:37:00 -
[1304] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:CCP Xhagen wrote: Since the chair resigned from CSM 6 prior to being banned and was not yet seated on CSM 7 he will be able to run for future CSMs. That is a very poor decision that CCP in general should probably reconsider over the year to come. An individual's noteriety/prominence should never overcome the basic requirement to be a player of good standing and reputation (ie without serious infractions on the account.) The way you've stated it there just sounds like a shady legal loophole and it will be seen as such.
This. |
Grikath
T.E.L.O.G.S.
26
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 12:18:00 -
[1305] - Quote
Yay! Intarwebz Drama.. and lots of it...
After following the roohah! for a couple of days, I'm not sure which I dislike more: The sheer st00pidity of the Mittani's action at the panel, or the whole mess of misquotes, conjecture and fabrications created by some self-absorbed "internet journalists" aka Opinion(ated) Bloggers.
Did the Mitten make a BooBoo? Hell yes.... Not the least of which was the simple fact that he got hammered doing a presentation during a formal corporate event, with the resultant lack of judgement and constraint as a result. Does this excuse his remarks during the unscripted Q&A session? Not at all. You choose to toss alcohol in your own mug. You yourself are responsible for "responsible drinking". And only you yourself are responsible for any results of inebriated smacktalk. [insert random examples of your favourite flavour of reality police/local enforcement show here].
Was CCP's reaction correct? Yes, actually... The Mitten was the chairman of CSM6 and the chairman-to-be of CSM 7. The CSM itself is a PR item for CCP corporation, and any player sitting on the CSM is "powerful" in ways beyond the means of any normal player of this game. CCP was faced with a situation where their "top player" publicly perpetrated against the TOS/EULA, with all this players' political enemies blowing the incident up out of all reasonable proportions. Their reaction by placing a 30 day ban on the Mittens' account(s) is really the only way they could have reacted, and equivalent to what would happen in pretty much any RL job where you wouldn't be sacked at the spot to begin with for such a gaffe. The fact that this ban also invalidated the Mittens' candidacy for CSM 7, and as such cost him not only the Chair, but also his place on the CSM is simply a fact of applied rules. I will most definitely not speculate whether this result was intended or desired by CCP, there's already enough people doing that. Simple fact is that rules need to be applied equally, regardless of the status of the person/player involved.
Did CCP invalidate 10.000+ player votes by this action? No, they didn't, at all. The Mittani with his ill-adviced stunt did. People can rant and rave all they want, but CCP took such action as was needed and within their actual power, and nothing more. Which is far less than some of the "suggestions" I've seen floating around in several blogs and forum comments ( which themselves rate a ban each, because they are just as bad and inappropriate as the Mittens' original remark) .
Were the Mittani's actions after the Incident correct? Yes, they were actually. He resigned from his position as chair of CSM6, issued a public and personal apology to the player involved, and used his own funds in paying "damages" to the player involved. The route is clear and simple, and has been walked by many a politician and corporate leader. Whether or not these actions were "sincere" is a moot issue. The correct appeasements and Mea Culpa's have been made. Any Idort in need of Undorking can see that his actual powerbase hasn't changed, since the Goon powerbase is not based in this game, but in a forum-based "society" outside of it. Whether or not Mittens' action(s) have any repercussions for him will mainly be decided there, by the mores of that "society".
What is not a measure for any "sincerity" of the apology of the Mittani is the upcoming "Burn Jita" campaign by the Goons. It may be that this operation has been speeded up over this incident, but the whole operation has already been in the pipeline for a bit, and given the current size and strength of the Goons, it is actually inevitable after the successes of the Ice Interdictions. Any claim of "proof of insincerity" over this is political waffling, or worse, a complete and thorough lack of understanding about the underlying mechanics ( most ranters display both traits). And I suspect a fair measure of jealousy... The Goons are the only ones who can attempt to even try to disrupt Jita to any discernible level. Succeed or fail, the economy, and it's geographical landscape will adapt.
In the end, the whole incident has proven to be a costly mistake for the Mittani, who will undoubtedly have learned that strong liquor and public presentations do not mix. It has also proven that the resentment against his success and/or playing style has driven people to rather extreme measures of Shows of Indignation, some of which are actually worse than the original mistake. Ultimately the whole situation, as he himself has pointed out, has given him the opportunity to bow out of the dual position of CSM chair and Space Villain, and pursue the Goons' interest to his hearts' content.
Whether you believe in the Myth of the Mitten or not, it certainly is going to be interesting to see how this plays out. |
Bacek HEPB
The Craniac The Aurora Shadow
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 13:12:00 -
[1306] - Quote
Grikath wrote:Yay! Intarwebz Drama.. and lots of it... After following the roohah! for a couple of days, I'm not sure which I dislike more: The sheer st00pidity of the Mittani's action at the panel, or the whole mess of misquotes, conjecture and fabrications created by some self-absorbed "internet journalists" aka Opinion(ated) Bloggers. Did the Mitten make a BooBoo? Hell yes.... Not the least of which was the simple fact that he got hammered doing a presentation during a formal corporate event, with the resultant lack of judgement and constraint as a result. Does this excuse his remarks during the unscripted Q&A session? Not at all. You choose to toss alcohol in your own mug. You yourself are responsible for "responsible drinking". And only you yourself are responsible for any results of inebriated smacktalk. [insert random examples of your favourite flavour of reality police/local enforcement show here]. Was CCP's reaction correct? Yes, actually... The Mitten was the chairman of CSM6 and the chairman-to-be of CSM 7. The CSM itself is a PR item for CCP corporation, and any player sitting on the CSM is "powerful" in ways beyond the means of any normal player of this game. CCP was faced with a situation where their "top player" publicly perpetrated against the TOS/EULA, with all this players' political enemies blowing the incident up out of all reasonable proportions. Their reaction by placing a 30 day ban on the Mittens' account(s) is really the only way they could have reacted, and equivalent to what would happen in pretty much any RL job where you wouldn't be sacked at the spot to begin with for such a gaffe. The fact that this ban also invalidated the Mittens' candidacy for CSM 7, and as such cost him not only the Chair, but also his place on the CSM is simply a fact of applied rules. I will most definitely not speculate whether this result was intended or desired by CCP, there's already enough people doing that. Simple fact is that rules need to be applied equally, regardless of the status of the person/player involved. Did CCP invalidate 10.000+ player votes by this action? No, they didn't, at all. The Mittani with his ill-adviced stunt did. People can rant and rave all they want, but CCP took such action as was needed and within their actual power, and nothing more. Which is far less than some of the "suggestions" I've seen floating around in several blogs and forum comments ( which themselves rate a ban each, because they are just as bad and inappropriate as the Mittens' original remark) . Were the Mittani's actions after the Incident correct? Yes, they were actually. He resigned from his position as chair of CSM6, issued a public and personal apology to the player involved, and used his own funds in paying "damages" to the player involved. The route is clear and simple, and has been walked by many a politician and corporate leader. Whether or not these actions were "sincere" is a moot issue. The correct appeasements and Mea Culpa's have been made. Any Idort in need of Undorking can see that his actual powerbase hasn't changed, since the Goon powerbase is not based in this game, but in a forum-based "society" outside of it. Whether or not Mittens' action(s) have any repercussions for him will mainly be decided there, by the mores of that "society". What is not a measure for any "sincerity" of the apology of the Mittani is the upcoming "Burn Jita" campaign by the Goons. It may be that this operation has been speeded up over this incident, but the whole operation has already been in the pipeline for a bit, and given the current size and strength of the Goons, it is actually inevitable after the successes of the Ice Interdictions. Any claim of "proof of insincerity" over this is political waffling, or worse, a complete and thorough lack of understanding about the underlying mechanics ( most ranters display both traits). And I suspect a fair measure of jealousy... The Goons are the only ones who can attempt to even try to disrupt Jita to any discernible level. Succeed or fail, the economy, and it's geographical landscape will adapt. In the end, the whole incident has proven to be a costly mistake for the Mittani, who will undoubtedly have learned that strong liquor and public presentations do not mix. It has also proven that the resentment against his success and/or playing style has driven people to rather extreme measures of Shows of Indignation, some of which are actually worse than the original mistake. Ultimately the whole situation, as he himself has pointed out, has given him the opportunity to bow out of the dual position of CSM chair and Space Villain, and pursue the Goons' interest to his hearts' content. Whether you believe in the Myth of the Mitten or not, it certainly is going to be interesting to see how this plays out.
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 15:37:00 -
[1307] - Quote
Another thought btw: The CSM is not there to represent ccp, its there to represent the players.
I think at the end of the day, everyone knows Mittani is an a**hole, ingame and in RL. The important thing to remember, is that over 10,000 players a 5th of all votes wanted an a**hole to represent them. Which paints an accurate picture about eve community in general. Why pretend its not what it is. Even a**holes have money and play computer games, and ccp shouldn't want or have to discurage them from playing their game. |
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
85
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:29:00 -
[1308] - Quote
was directed by a GM to post here *coverupcough*
Quote:Richard Desturned wrote: Talia Nachtigall wrote: @OP:
Absolutely not. Personally I think he should have been permanently banned from the game. 30 days is not enough. Furthermore as a legitimate subscriber to this game I strongly object to even the remote possibility that he be allowed back onto the CSM now or at any time in the future.
good thing that's not your call otherwise every single polarizing player would be permabanned
this is why ppl should NOT just "let it go" Enough ppl get behind it an ccp will boot him to the curb
And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME
Jeez you Goons are thick Or just that far up you leaders' ass you cant see daylight, which explains why you cant see him do wrong https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1379
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:39:00 -
[1309] - Quote
I agree. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5868
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:41:00 -
[1310] - Quote
Richard Aiel wrote:And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME GǪso, pretty much all the people still wanting to see Mittens being hurt even more, especially IRL. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
|
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
85
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:43:00 -
[1311] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Richard Aiel wrote:And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME GǪso, pretty much all the people still wanting to see Mittens being hurt even more, especially IRL.
Yes, the ppl that want him hurt IRL. No the ppl that want him permabanned for something that if any of us did and got reported for we'd GET a permaban FOR https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:49:00 -
[1312] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:I agree.
man I hate it when you get you were ganked so often you forget what you were gonna say (even tho I think I posted it somewhere but cant find it) https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1379
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:52:00 -
[1313] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Richard Aiel wrote:And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME GǪso, pretty much all the people still wanting to see Mittens being hurt even more, especially IRL. So, you're advocating that it's ok for a person with prior knowledge to go on live world wide video feed and encourage thousands of players to hunt down and harass another player who potentially may have suicidal tendencies in order to help facilitate and induce that person to commit suicide?
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:02:00 -
[1314] - Quote
Richard Aiel wrote: this is why ppl should NOT just "let it go" Enough ppl get behind it an ccp will boot him to the curb
And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME
Jeez you Goons are thick Or just that far up you leaders' ass you cant see daylight, which explains why you cant see him do wrong
I dont believe he wanted to make the guy hurt himself. I do believe he told others that if they are interested in ganking the guy they should go find him.
In a previous alliance, we had some highsec carebear smacktalking our FC's mining alt, and bumping it ect. In response we decked his corp and our ENTIRE ALLIANCE spend the war targeting this single player. when the dust settled we'd made an absulute fool of him, destroyed several of his ships including an orca, and scammed him out of 500mil.
That could be regarded as player harasment, but I'd be surely be pissed off if a presidence was set that allowed entire our alliance to be banned for defending our FC's honor. |
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:08:00 -
[1315] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Aiel wrote: this is why ppl should NOT just "let it go" Enough ppl get behind it an ccp will boot him to the curb
And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME
Jeez you Goons are thick Or just that far up you leaders' ass you cant see daylight, which explains why you cant see him do wrong
I dont believe he wanted to make the guy hurt himself.
thank you for proving my point
I guess you think he wanted the guy to die so he wouldnt HAVE feelings of pain or "hurt" so technically I guess youre right https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
Cede Forster
Graffa
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:09:00 -
[1316] - Quote
Ban Bindy wrote:People keeping tossing Terms of Service and EULA around as if that's the end of the issue. Mittani signed another document with CCP when he joined CSM, the non-disclosure agreement. It governs the behavior CCP expects of members of the CSM. Unless you have read it you have no idea what's in it. So you don't have any idea what agreement this guy actually violated. .
Sure we do, they said he violated the Eula/Tos, not some other agreement. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
182
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:09:00 -
[1317] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:I dont believe he wanted to make the guy hurt himself. I do believe he told others that if they are interested in ganking the guy his char is....
In a previous alliance, we had some highsec carebear smacktalking our FC's mining alt, and bumping it etc. In response we decked his corp and our ENTIRE ALLIANCE spend the war targeting this single player, ignoring his corp mates. when the dust settled we'd made an absulute fool of him, destroyed several of his ships including an orca, and scammed him out of 500mil.
That could be regarded as player harasment, but I'd surely be pissed off if a presidence was set that allowed entire our alliance to be banned for defending our FC's honor. You went in war because of smacktalk, and you exploded some ships to defend the honor of the guy who was smacktalked.
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone in order to drive them to suicide.
I am sure you can figure out the difference between those two yourself. ;)
Once more: The Mittani was not banned for his alliance having explodered the miner's ship. He was banned for what he said about the evemail the guy had sent to public while on stage. Any alarm about how we will soon not be allowed to exploder spaceships anymore is premature and frankly quite ridiculous. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:10:00 -
[1318] - Quote
Richard Aiel wrote:
thank you for proving my point
Which is? (its sunday, im a bit sleepy u'll need to eleborate for me). |
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:11:00 -
[1319] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:You went in war because of smacktalk, and you exploded some ships to defend the honor of the guy who was smacktalked.
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone in order to drive them to suicide.
I am sure you can figure out the difference between those two yourself. ;)
Once more: The Mittani was not banned for his alliance having explodered the miner's ship.
youre trying to argue with ppl whose heads are so far up Mittens' posterior they cant hear the sense of your words
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
182
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:12:00 -
[1320] - Quote
What if I cry louder? They seem to like crying. |
|
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:12:00 -
[1321] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Aiel wrote:
thank you for proving my point
Which is? (its sunday, im a bit sleepy u'll need to eleborate for me).
Richard Aiel wrote:was directed by a GM to post here *coverupcough* Quote:Richard Desturned wrote: Talia Nachtigall wrote: @OP:
Absolutely not. Personally I think he should have been permanently banned from the game. 30 days is not enough. Furthermore as a legitimate subscriber to this game I strongly object to even the remote possibility that he be allowed back onto the CSM now or at any time in the future.
good thing that's not your call otherwise every single polarizing player would be permabanned this is why ppl should NOT just "let it go" Enough ppl get behind it an ccp will boot him to the curb And no... not "every single polarizing player" Every single Sociopath trying to get someone to hurt themselves or others OVER A VIDEO GAME Jeez you Goons are thick Or just that far up you leaders' ass you cant see daylight, which explains why you cant see him do wrong
The one you quoted but yet failed to read
especially the last bit. you privede you couldnt see mittens as having done wrong by saying you didnt think he meant to hurt the guy after he told thousands of people to pressure him into suicide.... yeah... https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:13:00 -
[1322] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone[i] in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way.
And my story was in response that if u can ban one person for calling on a group of others to target a single individule, then that would mean what we did was wrong and against the EULA aswell.
Which is actually where my interest lies in this topic. I dont care about morals or suicide, mittani, goons, or the CSM. I only care about how the rules of the game are being interpreted and how it may affect me. |
Richard Aiel
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:14:00 -
[1323] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone[i] in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way. And my story was in response that if u can ban one person for calling on a group of others to target a single individule, then that would mean what we did was wrong and against the EULA aswell.
wow what an interesting world you live in. You should try some time in the real one. We have cookies https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1052586#post1052586-á thats why "EVE is dying" and you only have yourself to blame -á |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:18:00 -
[1324] - Quote
Richard Aiel wrote:
wow what an interesting world you live in. You should try some time in the real one. We have cookies
Again you have YOUR interpretation of events, I have mine. I didn't hear mitanni tell anyone to go forth and make someone commit suicied. I heard him state, if anyone wants to make some game character kill itself go find him. Thats very easy, u just scram and web his pod till he's forced to self destruct.
Since he didnt give any details of a real life person, it would be difficult for me to phone the guy up and tell him he should end it. And sending only one character of 22, ingame mail suggesting it, would either get me blocked, or ignored. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:27:00 -
[1325] - Quote
Richard Aiel wrote: he told thousands of people to pressure him into suicide....
He didn't actually tell anyone TO DO anything. He just passed on the intel |
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
129
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:28:00 -
[1326] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Aiel wrote:
wow what an interesting world you live in. You should try some time in the real one. We have cookies
Again you have YOUR interpretation of events, I have mine. yes, yours is wrong
Quote: I didn't hear mitanni tell anyone to go forth and make someone commit suicied.
Nice example of selective hearing
Quote: I heard him state, if anyone wants to make some game character kill itself go find him. Thats very easy, u just scram and web his pod till he's forced to self destruct.
ah youre not deluded, I get it, youre trolling. typical goon alt, move along
Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:30:00 -
[1327] - Quote
Richard Hammond II wrote: I get it, youre trolling. typical goon alt, move along
If by trolling you mean contructive argument, using only the true facts given. Then yeah maybe.
And im not a goon alt, i've already stated where my interest in this topic lies. |
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
129
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:31:00 -
[1328] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Aiel wrote: he told thousands of people to pressure him into suicide....
He didn't actually tell anyone TO DO anything. He just passed on the intel
guess you missed the part where he said to find him and make him kill himself. go watch it again, this time with the sound on. Might help
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Hammond II wrote: I get it, youre trolling. typical goon alt, move along
If by trolling you mean contructive argument, using only the true facts given. Then yeah maybe. And im not a goon alt, i've already stated where my interest in this topic lies.
and lying that youre not a goon alt doesnt make it untrue. You cant argue with someone unwilling to change their mind. Its like arguing religion. A waste of time. You cant see reality. I cant argue with your fantasy, sorry
hell even ccp see what you reuse to. read the dev blog Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:35:00 -
[1329] - Quote
Richard Hammond II wrote:
guess you missed the part where he said to find him and make him kill himself. go watch it again, this time with the sound on. Might help
Lets take a look once again at his quote: The Mittani: Incidentally, if you want to make the guy kill himself, his name is The Wiz. Its GÇ£T-H-E SPACE W-I-SGÇ¥. He has his own corp. Find him.
What is important is "If you want to make... and not "Go and make..."
It apears the only possible damning part that could be interpreted as inciting others to harass this individule may be the words "Find him". But he fails to go into detail about what creative measure one might take in order to achieve "guy killing himself." Nore did he elaborate if by guy killing himself he meant: The guy [being character] self destructing his pod, (Im sure that could be acomplished by scramming & webbing his capsule long enough that his only course of escape would be to commit ingame suicide.) or the guy [player] himself commiting real suicide. Since no rl names or specifics on how to accumplish the latter where given I shall have to accept the former interpretation.
also "Find him" was in the context of "if you want to..."
Furthermore insisting im a goon alt, doesn't really offend me. Just makes u look dumb. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
184
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:41:00 -
[1330] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way. In any case, CCP apparently does not think that what he did was the same as killing a dude's ship in game. So even if you do not see the difference, you should be safe from banning. |
|
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
129
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:43:00 -
[1331] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Hammond II wrote:
guess you missed the part where he said to find him and make him kill himself. go watch it again, this time with the sound on. Might help
Lets take a look once again at his quote: The Mittani: Incidentally, if you want to make the guy kill himself, his name is The Wiz. Its GÇ£T-H-E SPACE W-I-SGÇ¥. He has his own corp. Find him. What is important is "If you want to make... and not "Go and make..." It apears the only possible damning part that could be interpreted as inciting others to harass this individule may be the words "Find him". But he fails to go into detail about what creative measure one might take in order to achieve "guy killing himself." Nore did he elaborate if by guy killing himself he meant: The guy [being character] self destructing his pod, (Im sure that could be acomplished by scramming & webbing his capsule long enough that his only course of escape would be to commit ingame suicide.) or the guy [player] himself commiting real suicide. Since no rl names or specifics on how to accumplish the latter where given I shall have to accept the former interpretation. also "Find him" was in the context of "if you want to..." Furthermore insisting im a goon alt, doesn't really offend me. Just makes u look dumb.
put it in a ticket. Maybe you can get the 30 day revoked. Doubt it though, your semantics tricks dont seem to cut it with them and dont with me.
Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:46:00 -
[1332] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way. In any case, CCP apparently does not think that what he did was the same as killing a dude's ship in game. So even if you do not see the difference, you should be safe from banning.
Since Mittani is rather friendly with some of the devs, Im inclined to believe that his stepping down and banning was coached, & since a 30day ban is not really significant, it was just an easy ploy by ccp to save face in light of all the stupid & missplaced critisism from sensationalised game media, hoping that it would shut them up, quicker than explaining that nothing he did was wrong beyond what any character in eve can possibly face on a daily basis. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
185
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:52:00 -
[1333] - Quote
I don't personally believe for a moment that was the case. But whatever. Tinfoil is tinfoil and won't change to anything else by us talking about it, and I doubt even a dev coming up and telling you that YES, there was a difference, would not remove it. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 17:54:00 -
[1334] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:I don't personally believe for a moment that was the case. But whatever. Tinfoil is tinfoil and won't change to anything else by us talking about it, and I doubt even a dev coming up and telling you that YES, there was a difference, would not remove it.
You dont have to, but its an interesting & viable possibility none the less. |
Alexandr Kerensky
Paxton Industries Gentlemen's Agreement
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:03:00 -
[1335] - Quote
The amount of vitriol this is generating is amazing. The issue appears to have been dealt with to CCP's satisfaction, though apparently not to elements of the community. Mittanni will be back in 30 days and while upset appears to accept it and to paraphase him "dealing with it". In the end what does it matter? The victim of this incident is still drawing breath, and hopefully continues to do so, Mittens has been punished, the game media that jumped on this stopped reporting on it two to three days ago.... all that seems to be left are the Goons and Pubbies with torches doing the "rabble rabble rabble" schtick. Let it go, go back to mining, ratting, griefing, shooting each other in the face.... you know. ENJOYING LIFE! |
Cede Forster
Graffa
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:05:00 -
[1336] - Quote
Should people tell others in the game that they are suicidal? How do you know the difference betwen somebody screwing with you and somebody who is not?
Is it okay to assume that in general people are screwing with you? Is it okay to mock them?
If somebody claims he is suicidal you have to put your "nice kitty gloves on", just to be sure that you are not inciting something or else risk a ban, even if you comment on it clearly outside of the game and offical forums? Sounds a bit excessive.
What would make more sense? Report button for people who say they are suicidal and forwarding their personal information to the local authorities. If we are serious about this, that is the way to go. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:11:00 -
[1337] - Quote
Cede Forster wrote: What would make more sense? Report button for people who say they are suicidal and forwarding their personal information to the local authorities. If we are serious about this, that is the way to go.
A constructive suggestion indeed. Would you be willing to perhaps create an OP for it in features and ideas? I'll +1 it.
Although I think 95% of the time its just people screwing with you. I think the Wis was just screwing around aswell. |
Cede Forster
Graffa
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:22:00 -
[1338] - Quote
Or simply make it against the rules to threaten people with suicide for ingame actions, that would work for me as well. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
185
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:24:00 -
[1339] - Quote
I've said this before but since apparently not everyone has read it: 1) Blowing up someone's ship does not make it ok for them to pull the suicide card. 2) Someone threatening with suicide does not make it ok for to publicly mock them and encourage others to drive them to it. 3) Someone publicly mocking a suicide case does not make it ok for others to mock him back, let alone threaten his family. "He started it" and "he was asking for it" are not good excuses for escalating RL hurt.
Whether The Wis was really suicidal or not is not relevant for whether it was ok for The Mittani to say what he did.
If someone threatens with RL suicide inside the game, you are supposed to use petitions to report it to CCP, who know his RL details and can forward the threat to the proper RL people. |
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
129
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:56:00 -
[1340] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way. In any case, CCP apparently does not think that what he did was the same as killing a dude's ship in game. So even if you do not see the difference, you should be safe from banning. Since Mittani is rather friendly with some of the devs, Im inclined to believe that his stepping down and banning was coached, & since a 30day ban is not really significant, it was just an easy ploy by ccp to save face in light of all the stupid & missplaced critisism from sensationalised game media, hoping that it would shut them up, quicker than explaining that nothing he did was wrong beyond what any character in eve can possibly face on a daily basis.
lol? you are actually saying he got special treatment because of his friends in CCP? YEAH youre right, that totally justifies him.
Cede Forster wrote:Or simply make it against the rules to threaten people with suicide for ingame actions, that would work for me as well.
and make it permabannable, friends in CCP aside Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you. |
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 19:49:00 -
[1341] - Quote
Richard Hammond II wrote:
lol? you are actually saying he got special treatment because of his friends in CCP? YEAH youre right, that totally justifies him.
Im only suggesting that -maybe- his reasons for saying he'd step down from the CSM, was suggested to him to save face for ccp.
And if CCP really thought what he did was a critical breach of the EULA, they'd have permabanned him. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1379
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 20:09:00 -
[1342] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Richard Hammond II wrote:
guess you missed the part where he said to find him and make him kill himself. go watch it again, this time with the sound on. Might help
Lets take a look once again at his quote: The Mittani: Incidentally, if you want to make the guy kill himself, his name is The Wiz. Its GÇ£T-H-E SPACE W-I-SGÇ¥. He has his own corp. Find him. What is important is "If you want to make... and not "Go and make..." It apears the only possible damning part that could be interpreted as inciting others to harass this individule may be the words "Find him". But he fails to go into detail about what creative measure one might take in order to achieve "guy killing himself." Nore did he elaborate if by guy killing himself he meant: The guy [being character] self destructing his pod, (Im sure that could be acomplished by scramming & webbing his capsule long enough that his only course of escape would be to commit ingame suicide.) or the guy [player] himself commiting real suicide. Since no rl names or specifics on how to accumplish the latter where given I shall have to accept the former interpretation. also "Find him" was in the context of "if you want to..." Furthermore insisting im a goon alt, doesn't really offend me. Just makes u look dumb.
All semantics aside, you have definitely twisted everything around, turned it inside out and upside down in a failed attempt to justify his actions.
The text in the eve mail slide as well as The Mittani's remarks while reading it clearly establishes what the context of the Q & A statement meant. Obviously a majority of people perceived it that way while a small percentage of people still cling to your viewpoint. Doesn't matter.
Besides it's not about what's right or wrong, it's about what is. Most of the world's population views it as morally and sociably unacceptable which could also include legal ramifications for all parties involved. Clearly that's not good for business.
Anyway, the deed is done. CCP isn't going to change their decision. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 20:56:00 -
[1343] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote: you have definitely twisted everything around, turned it inside out and upside down
Just like everyone on the opposite camp of the argument.
DeMichael Crimson wrote: .... Most of the world's population views it as morally and sociably unacceptable which could also include legal ramifications for all parties involved....
Hmm, I think that statement is a bit of an assumption, Im not even sure if the majority of eve really care. But I understand what you mean. Perception is what counts. |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
40
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 04:09:00 -
[1344] - Quote
Brae Haen wrote:Ive got a question which was not covered by the post. This might sound a little out there but wouldn't a player who is threatening to committ suicide due to in game actions also be considered a violation of the EULA/TOS? It is a threat, it is harassment and a case could be made that it is cyberbullying.
I'm not trolling, or trying to attack the offended player. I'm not a mindless Goon trying to start more drama. But I am interested on what CCP's stance on this is.
He didn't threaten to kill himself at all. He didn't even state any outright intention to do so. If you watched the video, I'm afraid you have completely misinterpreted the victim's wording. |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
40
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 04:43:00 -
[1345] - Quote
Dregol wrote:So you're acknowledging that it's a CCP sanctioned event. Fine You're serving alcohol/allowing the consumption of alcohol/permitting players to be inebriated when they show up. And this somehow excludes you from culpability for what happened at the event? If I gave, say, a deranged person a gun, ammunition and a clip, and bad things happened (to themselves, or perhaps others), would I not be in someway responsible for bad things happening? Putting alcohol + crowds + socially awkward neckbeards in a room together seems like a formula for great success. It's awfully convenient for CCP to ban Mittens, kick him off the CSM, and brand themselves as the defenders of the innocent. EVE is a harsh place. Always has been. Did Mittens cross a line? Yes. But to pretend you had no role in allowing it to happen is a huge :headinsand: moment. Terrible decision is still terrible CCP, and washing your hands of any liability is a sham. Next year's FF is going to be zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz because of shortsighted decisions. Oh well, angry swarm, best swarm. Enjoy Jita while you can.
Incorrect! The deranged person has mental issues, and cannot be held fully responsible for his actions. Therefore, yes, you are responsible for giving an insane man a gun and ammunition.
Mittani is, I'm assuming, a mentally healthy individual with a crappy personality. If it is legal for him to drink alcohol, then he is solely responsible for his actions after imbibing it.
CCP, however, IS responsible for keeping their image as free of tarnish as possible. If you had any business sense, you would realize this.
Jita isn't the only trade hub in EvE. No one cares what you do there. Make sure you insure all of your suicide ships so that you can at least utilize one of the few isk drains in the game while you're at it.
Side note: Mittani doesn't even look like he is manly enough to grow a neckbeard. |
Alyssa Cristole
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 04:48:00 -
[1346] - Quote
I wanted to point out a few things from CCP's EULA/TOS. My opinion is the guy should have been permaban but is getting off easy because of his relationship with CCP. The reaction on CCP's part has been a joke. Encouraging other players to go repeatedly pod kill someone is griefing. Period. It's also harassing, harmful, and hateful. There is not even a fine line here and this has nothing to do with PVP/hardcore gaming.
That statement aside, it's a joke he was even given a 30 day ban because CCP regularly ignores enforcing the EULA/TOS. If I were him I would claim discrimination as CCP does not enforce the rules and therefor he is being made an example due to the fact the media caught wind of what happened.
Quote:http://community.eveonline.com/pnp/banning.as
6. SCAMMIN
Severe offenses may result in an immediate ban without warning; however, warnings may be given for first time offenses, followed by account suspensions of varying degree and ultimately a permanent ban if a player
b. Intentionally creates missions that cannot be completed through normal game mechanics or abilities.
Lies. There are plenty of player made courier missions that end at POS's that 99.9% of Eve players can't access. Furthermore, there are also plenty of player made courier missions that involve cargo way too big for any Eve ship to carry. Both are violations of this rule, yet are done on a daily basis. No enforcement.
Quote:An immediate permanent ban of an account may result if a player
a. Organizes or participates in a corporation or group that is based on or advocates... other hate-mongering philosophies.
There is plenty of hate going on in Eve. Hate against CareBears aside, how many times have you seen Eve forum posts talking about "Chinese" ISK farmers? There are several campaigns a year into HighSec space just to grief people isk farming. There is plenty of flaming on the forums where players actively try and get other players to quit the game. These go on ignored by moderators.
Quote:Severe offenses may result in an immediate ban without warning; however, warnings may be given for first time offenses, followed by account suspensions of varying degree and ultimately a permanent ban if a player
g. Engages in griefplay tactics which may include, but are not limited to, market/courier exploits.
Already talked about, but since CCP has stated it on more then one webpage [EULA/TOS/Banning] its very ironic they ignore it in game.
Quote:http://support.eveonline.com/Pages/KB/Article.aspx?id=33
A grief player, or "griefer," is a player who devotes much of his time to making othersGÇÖ lives miserable, in a large part deriving his enjoyment of the game from these activities while he does not profit from it in any way. Grief tactics are the mechanics a griefer will utilize to antagonize other players. At our discretion, players who are found to be consistently maliciously interfering with the game experience for others may receive a warning, temporary suspension or permanent banning of his account
This should not be confused with standard conflict that might arise between two (or more) players, such as corporation wars. The EVE universe is a harsh universe largely driven by such conflict and notice must be taken of the fact that nonconsensual combat alone is not considered to be grief play per the above definition
An example of grief play would be the so called "Can baiting" in starter systems. An experienced player drops a cargo container with some items in front of a station in a starter system and waits for a new player to take from it. The new player is flagged and promptly attacked and killed by the owner of the container. Doing the same in starter tutorial complexes is also considered grief play and will not be tolerated.
Can Bating is very much going on in Eve and is being ignored by CCP. Whether you agree with the tactic or not there is no way you can argue CCP is actually enforcing no can bating rules. This goes for a lot of the rules posted above. How can you go after one player when you have thousands breaking the rules every day which you choose to ignore?
It just goes to show this whole thing is a joke, including CCP's response to the matter which has been nothing more then a publicity stunt. Personally I feel that if this never came into the public eye then there would have been no response by CCP; its obvious they could really care less. While this guy screwed up, was completely inappropriate, is obviously a less then just human being, is not sincere with his apology, and should have never been CSM; I would argue he is being treated unfairly because CCP itself ignores its own rules.
The things that make this game and CCP as a gaming company great, unfortunately also lead to the complete opposite. I hope one day they will realize that sometimes they actually have to act like a game company and not just a bunch of friends sitting in the basement with a DM's guide and a few 20 sided dice. |
Chicken Pizza
Penumbra Institute
40
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 05:30:00 -
[1347] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote:Chicken Pizza wrote:You morons say "10,058" like it's a large number. Do you even realize how many of those votes were probably alts? Do you know how many votes Obama alone received in the US 2008 presidential election? 69,456,897 votes. 52.92% of all of the voters in the third most populated country in the world. Kinda puts things into perspective, huh?
If Obama went live and told everyone in the US to feel free to call/mail/message a specific person and tell them to kill themselves, do you really think he would still be in office for much longer?
Most of you won't un-sub. Of the ones who do, I'm sure many, if not most, will inevitably re-sub. If you don't, good riddance.
Why don't you try looking at it conversely? Out of 59,109 votes cast, Mittani only received 10,058. That means 49,051 votes were NOT for Mittani. 83% of the votes/voters did NOT want Mittani for CSM. So while you're all bitching about how all 10,058 of you wanted Mittani to be CSM, consider the fact that the other 49,051 of us don't give a **** about what you think.
Math rules. Your math is awesome... especially where you compare the US population to the EVE pop. Go skill yourself.
I was making a point that you are clearly too dense to absorb.
http://www.breathing.com/articles/nose-breathing.htm
I think you should take a look at this. It's very helpful for people like you. |
Benny Ohu
The Lazy Dragoons True Apathy
47
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 05:53:00 -
[1348] - Quote
Kosh Seere wrote: Your math is awesome... especially where you compare the US population to the EVE pop. Go skill yourself.
I liked the part where he suggested that everyone who didn't vote Mittani was specifically voting against him. It's pretty much admitting all the other candidates aren't actually worth voting for on their own merits.
Does he realise the difference between a two-party system and the CSM elections? Does he know that people don't vote the President in directly? |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
493
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 06:13:00 -
[1349] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone[i] in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way. And my story was in response that if u can ban one person for calling on a group of others to target a single individule, then that would mean what we did was wrong and against the EULA aswell. Which is actually where my interest lies in this topic. I dont care about morals or suicide, mittani, goons, or the CSM. I only care about how the rules of the game are being interpreted and how it may affect me.
Review the video again. You must have missed the part where Mittens solicited audience members to join and "help" make the guy commit suicide. It was pretty clear. There was no interpretation of his wording. He SOLICITED help specifically for the purposes of driving the guy to suicide. Whether he meant it or not is irrelevant. It's one of those things like yelling "FIRE" in a public space when there is no fire. People can get hurt, so therefore you're held accountable.
A better example is getting on the radio or a television broadcast and soliciting people to rise up to destroy public/private property and to commit bodily harm to others. Inciting people to violence is against the law in most countries whether or not damaging or injurious actions have taken place.
We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Ai Shun
564
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 07:21:00 -
[1350] - Quote
Is this an April fools joke or is this for real? |
|
Virgil Travis
GWA Corp
40
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 07:43:00 -
[1351] - Quote
We are very interested to know. A response to this would be appreciated. Roses are red. Bacon is also red. Poems are hard. Bacon. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
192
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 08:03:00 -
[1352] - Quote
Without even reading the post, I have to point out it's dated 04.02, so for an April Fool's, it's a tad late... |
Kara Roideater
Perkone Caldari State
131
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 09:12:00 -
[1353] - Quote
The Mittani wrote: The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance presentation is going to be Goonswarm hates you - and basically just talk about each different little aspect of demographic of eve of how much we hate them and want them all to die and kill themselves. Like highsec miners, we want them to kill themselves; people who role-play, we want them to kill themselves; people with Titans, we want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of thousands of nerds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E c. 7.00 to 7.40. Source uploaded to Youtube 27th January 2012 |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 09:35:00 -
[1354] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:[quote=Azran Zala] Review the video again. You must have missed the part where Mittens solicited audience members to join and "help" make the guy commit suicide. It was pretty clear. There was no interpretation of his wording. He SOLICITED help specifically for the purposes of driving the guy to suicide.
Again, I put it to you he did not tell anyone to do anything. Nor ask for anyones help. Please state his full quotation, and what parts of it you believe fit your argument. Or go skill yourself ....... (in the art of debate) |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 10:04:00 -
[1355] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote: The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance presentation is going to be Goonswarm hates you - and basically just talk about each different little aspect of demographic of eve of how much we hate them and want them all to die and kill themselves. Like highsec miners, we want them to kill themselves; people who role-play, we want them to kill themselves; people with Titans, we want them to kill themselves. [u][i][b]There's just a whole host of people I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of thousands of nerds.
But it was explained in the actual presentation, that goonswarm infact, loves you. and the only controvertial part was an offhand remark after the presentation. I found the actual presentation heart warming, and feel butterflies inside that there are so many goons out there with big hearts, filled with love for their fellow players. |
General Tux
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 10:14:00 -
[1356] - Quote
Dear Forum
the decision is absolutely correct and still pretty liberal. It is hard to describe that in a foreign-language, I hope it will be sufficent
I am not a fan of the Alliance Panel, because it seems like a jumping jack show there. But Mittani really beats it even more
Sad, that so much people follows that kind of presentation style, even the more eloquent players. I think we need more serious, more eloquent, more mature people. Playing on the darkside of EvE is one part, but present yourself in that way and in addition to that, mobbing a specific player is really unacceptable
A good chairman is person who is much more professional, much more political and more integer. |
Kinis Deren
EVE University Ivy League
39
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 10:17:00 -
[1357] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote:The Mittani wrote: The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance presentation is going to be Goonswarm hates you - and basically just talk about each different little aspect of demographic of eve of how much we hate them and want them all to die and kill themselves. Like highsec miners, we want them to kill themselves; people who role-play, we want them to kill themselves; people with Titans, we want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of thousands of nerds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E c. 7.00 to 7.40. Source uploaded to Youtube 27th January 2012
Well, having listened to the recording it certainly would seem that what happened on the panel was intentional and not the drink fueled rant as has been suggested in a certain apology.
I wonder if CCP considered this evidence? |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
157
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 10:25:00 -
[1358] - Quote
"Drinks with Bolton"
all you need to know Don't mind me, I'm just adding content to threads that otherwise have none. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1384
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 10:54:00 -
[1359] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Kara Roideater wrote: The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance presentation is going to be Goonswarm hates you - and basically just talk about each different little aspect of demographic of eve of how much we hate them and want them all to die and kill themselves. Like highsec miners, we want them to kill themselves; people who role-play, we want them to kill themselves; people with Titans, we want them to kill themselves. [u][i][b]There's just a whole host of people I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of thousands of nerds.
But it was explained in the actual presentation, that goonswarm infact, loves you. and the only controvertial part was an offhand remark after the presentation. I found the actual presentation heart warming, and feel butterflies inside that there are so many goons out there with big hearts, filled with love for their fellow players. Not only that, but also highlighted a few issues that need to be addressed in eve & the csm: the need for religious tollerance, english literacy, and removal of the stigma associated with depression. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E c. 7.00 to 7.40. Source uploaded to Youtube 27th January 2012
Those are not the words of Kara Roideater. Those are the transcribed words of The Mittani and when added with the Alliance Panel video makes all your posturing and semantics a waste of time. |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
157
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 11:08:00 -
[1360] - Quote
aren't you desperate then Don't mind me, I'm just adding content to threads that otherwise have none. |
|
Kale Kold
the unified Negative Ten.
69
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 12:32:00 -
[1361] - Quote
If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned! GÇ£Some people call me insane for the destruction-áIGÇÖve caused, ...I believe I was just doing my duty!GÇ¥ -- Testimony submitted to Caldari Navy war crimes tribunal. |
Scion Hakonen
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 12:33:00 -
[1362] - Quote
To all the whining goonswarm pilots claiming their votes are lost. Well you shouldn't have given your vote to such an idiot, go complain to him. I think he should be happy with the ban he got. He should have been removed from the game. |
Harry Farina
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 12:45:00 -
[1363] - Quote
This thread just got real interesting all of a sudden. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
497
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 14:28:00 -
[1364] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned!
It was premeditated. The slide proved it. The "Drinks with Bolton" video from January of this year is overwhelming proof that Mittens had been planning this for at least 3 months. Drunkenness doesn't even begin to work as an excuse. If this were in a court this would be an open and closed case of premeditated cyber-bullying. The "Drinks with Bolton" video also proves that CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit.
Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar.
"Drinks with Bolton" featuring CCP Soundwave
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E&feature=player_detailpage#t=440s We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 14:37:00 -
[1365] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned! ...CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit. Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar.
Yup I think CCP needs to quickly permanently ban all The Wis's accounts to protect him from cyberbulling, and themselves from possible lawsuits. If he no longer has an account, then he can't be bullied. Problem solved. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
497
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 14:50:00 -
[1366] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned! ...CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit. Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar. Yup I think CCP needs to quickly permanently ban all The Wis's accounts to protect him from cyberbulling, and themselves from possible lawsuits. If he no longer has an account, then he can't be bullied. Problem solved.
Mitanni alt detected. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 14:57:00 -
[1367] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote: Mitanni alt detected.
Baseless accusations only make you look simple and uneducated. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
oldbutfeelingyoung
VIRTUAL EMPIRE VANGUARD Vanguard Ascendants
527
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 15:00:00 -
[1368] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote:The Mittani wrote: The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance presentation is going to be Goonswarm hates you - and basically just talk about each different little aspect of demographic of eve of how much we hate them and want them all to die and kill themselves. Like highsec miners, we want them to kill themselves; people who role-play, we want them to kill themselves; people with Titans, we want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of thousands of nerds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E c. 7.00 to 7.40. Source uploaded to Youtube 27th January 2012
if he did that ,nobody would even care,then he was just an idiot bigmouth from Goonswarm at some panel. But being dumb he decided to go after one person,foolish action. But it was interesting to see soundwave on that vid.
pushing that button ,not expecting something. But suddenly the door opens and the next thing i see myself flooting in space,just before i wake up again. thank god for clones |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 15:03:00 -
[1369] - Quote
There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 15:05:00 -
[1370] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself.
Agree'd but lets keep quiet about it and watch more people post to the contrary and prove what mindless sheep they are. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
|
Esan Vartesa
Samarkand Financial
206
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 15:07:00 -
[1371] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over it.
Hey wait a second!
I thought NPC corp alts had nothing to say...
I'm confused... wait, no I'm not. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
498
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 15:56:00 -
[1372] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself. Agree'd but lets keep quiet about it and watch more people post to the contrary and prove what mindless sheep they are.
Right, because anytime someone says they're going to do something and then does it, it's completely unrelated. Got me there. I bow to your prowess of logic. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:14:00 -
[1373] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself. Agree'd but lets keep quiet about it and watch more people post to the contrary and prove what mindless sheep they are. Right, because anytime someone says they're going to do something and then does it, it's completely unrelated. Got me there. I bow to your prowess of logic. Unfortunately for Mitanni, that video coupled with a prepared slide, the former telegraphing his plan for fanfast & the latter facilitating it, is a clear line of evidence that would indeed support that it was premeditated.
No. Because I have the intelect to detect when a bunch of boys are talking crap and one says figuratively how he hopes to tell whiners to go f*** themselves... and the difference between that and a neo-natzi meeting discussing a plot for genocide. And also the fact that no-one at the alliance panel actually told or made anyone to go kill themselves. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:17:00 -
[1374] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Right, because anytime someone says they're going to do something and then does it, it's completely unrelated. Got me there. I bow to your prowess of logic.
Unfortunately for Mitanni, that video coupled with a prepared slide, the former telegraphing his plan for fanfast & the latter facilitating it, is a clear line of evidence that would indeed support that it was premeditated.
if he had said at fanfest what he said in that interview, it would have just been a tasteless joke, but nothing to kick up a storm about "cyberbullying" or even a EULA/TOS violation
what he said at fanfest directly, unfairly targeted one player who was allegedly vulnerable. what he said in the interview was nothing close.
if that isn't enough of an explanation, oh well, I tried |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
500
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:19:00 -
[1375] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself. Agree'd but lets keep quiet about it and watch more people post to the contrary and prove what mindless sheep they are. Right, because anytime someone says they're going to do something and then does it, it's completely unrelated. Got me there. I bow to your prowess of logic. Unfortunately for Mitanni, that video coupled with a prepared slide, the former telegraphing his plan for fanfast & the latter facilitating it, is a clear line of evidence that would indeed support that it was premeditated. No. Because I have the intelect to detect when a bunch of boys are talking crap and one says figuratively how he hopes to tell whiners to go f*** themselves... and the difference between that and a neo-natzi meeting discussing a plot for genocide. And also the fact that no-one at the alliance panel actually told or made anyone to go kill themselves.
But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". Alex on the other hand is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:25:00 -
[1376] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". And yet a child was driven to the point of suicide. To blame the dead child for not HTFU is the very definition of sociopathic. Alex is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer. Perhaps that's why some people say he's a former lawyer. *shrugs* I don't really know either way and I don't really care what he does for a living. I do know he's an adult that for what ever reason, perhaps a lack of self-esteem, is pandering to the worst adolescent behavior. Even sadder is CCP's complicity in this....supposedly a group of adults and professionals.
nothing in that interview even hints at bullying so get over it |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:29:00 -
[1377] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". And yet a child was driven to the point of suicide. To blame the dead child for not HTFU is the very definition of sociopathic. Alex is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer. Perhaps that's why some people say he's a former lawyer. *shrugs* I don't really know either way and I don't really care what he does for a living. I do know he's an adult that for what ever reason, perhaps a lack of self-esteem, is pandering to the worst adolescent behavior. Even sadder is CCP's complicity in this....supposedly a group of adults and professionals. nothing in that interview even hints at bullying so get over it
Except the part outlining how he's going to present, in front of thousands of people at fanfest, people for whom Mitanni wants to commit suicide.
From your reply I've never seen a more clear cut case of selective perception. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:31:00 -
[1378] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote: But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". And yet a child was driven to the point of suicide. Alex on the other hand is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer.
Pardom me if I refrain from speculation. The only thing that is important is the facts of this case. And so far you have proven no actual correlation between what was said on beers with bolton and what was said at the alliance panel. Besides that he intended to ridicle the antics of miners and titan pilots. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:33:00 -
[1379] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote: But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". And yet a child was driven to the point of suicide. Alex on the other hand is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer.
Pardom me if I refrain from speculation. The only thing that is important is the facts of this case. And so far you have proven no actual correlation between what was said on beers with bolton and what was said at the alliance panel. Besides that he intended to ridicle the antics of miners and titan pilots.
And the person that he specifically named was a miner. Got me again. Absolutely no correlation what-so-ever. The logic is strong in you! We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:33:00 -
[1380] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Except the part outlining how he's going to present, in front of thousands of people at fanfest, people for whom Mitanni wants to commit suicide.
From your reply I've never seen a more clear cut case of selective perception.
it's like you're deliberately ignoring the fact that he did not talk about singling a vulnerable player out
you're the clear-cut case of selective perception, you want to conclude that it was premeditated
so again, what he did at fanfest has nothing to do with what he said in the interview |
|
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:34:00 -
[1381] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Except the part outlining how he's going to present, in front of thousands of people at fanfest, people for whom Mitanni wants to commit suicide.
From your reply I've never seen a more clear cut case of selective perception. it's like you're deliberately ignoring the fact that he did not talk about singling a vulnerable player out you're the clear-cut case of selective perception, you want to conclude that it was premeditated so again, what he did at fanfest has nothing to do with what he said in the interview
I'm sorry, did you miss the part where he DID single out a specific player to the point of spelling his name for the benefit of drunken crowd members? We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Kara Roideater
Perkone Caldari State
135
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:35:00 -
[1382] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over it.
You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in.
In any case, if you want people to approach such data rationally and in a reasonable way, you might want to lead by example. The continuous goon efforts at deflection and justification are what has kept this a live issue for so long. |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:35:00 -
[1383] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:I'm sorry, did you miss the part where he DID single out a specific player to the point of spelling his name for the benefit of drunken associates?
in the interview? or at fanfest?
we're talking about two separate events here bro keep up |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:38:00 -
[1384] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote:You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in.
He overstepped the mark by pointing out a vulnerable player rather than saying some tired catchphrase. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:44:00 -
[1385] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:I'm sorry, did you miss the part where he DID single out a specific player to the point of spelling his name for the benefit of drunken associates?
in the interview? or at fanfest? we're talking about two separate events here bro keep up
They are only two separate events as a matter of when they occurred. Mitanni confessed his intent in the January video. Mitanni followed through by doing exactly that, going to fanfest, soliciting others to push a player to the point of suicide. Both videos, "drinks with bolton" and the fanfest alliance panel a irrevocably linked. One forecasts the action. The other is the action.
It's akin to someone calling you and threatening violence against you with laughter heard in the background months in advance giving you a specific date and time they're going to do it. Then, someone shows up and beats you exactly at the time and date they said they would. You would have us believe, in that instance that you would be completely befuddled and your police report would not reflect the phone call? *face palm* We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Kara Roideater
Perkone Caldari State
135
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:46:00 -
[1386] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in. He overstepped the mark by pointing out a vulnerable player rather than saying some tired catchphrase.
He overstepped the mark by combining the two. He didn't just indicate the vulnerable player, he indicated him specifically in the context of that kind of 'catchphrase'.
I'm sure you'll agree that a major element in the whole clusterfuck is that a phrase that is actually quite serious and is treated as having serious implications if used towards people in RL has become overly trivialised in the minds of many eve players, to the extent that they forget WHY it is offensive and only remember THAT it is offensive. |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:47:00 -
[1387] - Quote
so, in that interview, he specifically said that he was going to tell fanfest attendees to target a hisec ice miner who vaguely expressed suicidal ideations? |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:48:00 -
[1388] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote:Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in. He overstepped the mark by pointing out a vulnerable player rather than saying some tired catchphrase. He overstepped the mark by combining the two. He didn't just indicate the vulnerable player, he indicated him specifically in the context of that kind of 'catchphrase'. I'm sure you'll agree that a major element in the whole clusterfuck is that a phrase that is actually quite serious and is treated as having serious implications if used towards people in RL has become overly trivialised in the minds of many eve players, to the extent that they forget WHY it is offensive and only remember THAT it is offensive.
none of this makes it "premeditated" |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:50:00 -
[1389] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in. He overstepped the mark by pointing out a vulnerable player rather than saying some tired catchphrase. He overstepped the mark by combining the two. He didn't just indicate the vulnerable player, he indicated him specifically in the context of that kind of 'catchphrase'. I'm sure you'll agree that a major element in the whole clusterfuck is that a phrase that is actually quite serious and is treated as having serious implications if used towards people in RL has become overly trivialised in the minds of many eve players, to the extent that they forget WHY it is offensive and only remember THAT it is offensive. none of this makes it "premeditated"
All I can say is, another Mitanni alt detected. It's not even a nice try Alex. It's a sorry attempt to unlink a clear line of evidence. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:52:00 -
[1390] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote: Besides that he intended to ridicle the antics of miners and titan pilots. And the person that he specifically named was a miner. Got me again. Absolutely no correlation what-so-ever. The logic is strong in you!
He could have said he planned to make fun of people who drink tea, and a month later describes a ridiculous mail he recieved from a miner who happens to enjoy tea.
He made slides & joked about examples of ridiculous mails he recieves from several demographics of eve, not a personal attack singleing out one specific person.
And at no time did he state in the beers with bolton vid that he planned to single out any specific person(s) by name. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
|
oldbutfeelingyoung
VIRTUAL EMPIRE VANGUARD Vanguard Ascendants
527
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:56:00 -
[1391] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote: Besides that he intended to ridicle the antics of miners and titan pilots. And the person that he specifically named was a miner. Got me again. Absolutely no correlation what-so-ever. The logic is strong in you!
He could have said he planned to make fun of people who drink tea, and a month later describes a ridiculous mail he recieved from a miner who happens to enjoy tea. He made slides & joked about examples of ridiculous mails he recieves from several demographics of eve, not a personal attack singleing out one specific person. And at no time did he state in the beers with bolton vid that he planned to single out any specific person(s) by name.
but he did made that crazy move and now there are 10058 people crying ,bc he ****** up pushing that button ,not expecting something. But suddenly the door opens and the next thing i see myself flooting in space,just before i wake up again. thank god for clones |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:01:00 -
[1392] - Quote
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
but he did made that crazy move and now there are 10058 people crying ,bc he ****** up
I agree he may have made a stupid comment, but its a far cry from premeditated assisted suicide or murder. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Kara Roideater
Perkone Caldari State
135
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:03:00 -
[1393] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in. He overstepped the mark by pointing out a vulnerable player rather than saying some tired catchphrase. He overstepped the mark by combining the two. He didn't just indicate the vulnerable player, he indicated him specifically in the context of that kind of 'catchphrase'. I'm sure you'll agree that a major element in the whole clusterfuck is that a phrase that is actually quite serious and is treated as having serious implications if used towards people in RL has become overly trivialised in the minds of many eve players, to the extent that they forget WHY it is offensive and only remember THAT it is offensive. none of this makes it "premeditated"
I don't believe I have said it does. However, the sense of premeditated with which you are working is very narrow and only addresses one aspect of what was said but with regard to that aspect I think you are probably right. I think you would have a much harder time arguing that there was no premeditation with respect to going to Fanfest and deliberately offending people by encouraging them to kill themselves. What we ended up seeing was the unfortunate intersection of that plan and an extemporaneous remark. But those kinds of results are the almost inevitable consequences of the kind of thing that we see in the earlier video. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:07:00 -
[1394] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Lanasak wrote: none of this makes it "premeditated"
All I can say is, another Mitanni alt detected. It's not even a nice try Alex. It's a sorry attempt to unlink a clear line of evidence.
Oh look resorting back to baseless accusations in lieu of lack of argument. Are you even trying to form a cohesive sentence or are you just banging your keyboard with your head? and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
oldbutfeelingyoung
VIRTUAL EMPIRE VANGUARD Vanguard Ascendants
527
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:13:00 -
[1395] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Lanasak wrote: none of this makes it "premeditated"
All I can say is, another Mitanni alt detected. It's not even a nice try Alex. It's a sorry attempt to unlink a clear line of evidence. Oh look resorting back to baseless accusations in lieu of lack of argument. Are you even trying to form a cohesive sentence or are you just banging your keyboard with your head?
a lot of Goons have QWERTY in mirror writing al over their forehead lately ,how come? pushing that button ,not expecting something. But suddenly the door opens and the next thing i see myself flooting in space,just before i wake up again. thank god for clones |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:16:00 -
[1396] - Quote
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
a lot of Goons have QWERTY in mirror writing al over their forehead lately ,how come?
Im laughing too hard at the thought right now to come up with a sly answer. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:19:00 -
[1397] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Lanasak wrote: none of this makes it "premeditated"
All I can say is, another Mitanni alt detected. It's not even a nice try Alex. It's a sorry attempt to unlink a clear line of evidence. Oh look resorting back to baseless accusations in lieu of lack of argument. Are you even trying to form a cohesive sentence or are you just banging your keyboard with your head?
Yes, it's actually a sentence, but requires a modicum of grammatical aptitude to recognize it as such. Is it the big words or the comma's that is causing your confusion?
I only resort to baseless accusations after significant attempts to describe the situation irrefutably and have people refute it. When someone says they're going to do something giving a date, time and place they're going to do it, then shows up at the exact location, date and time they said they would and do exactly what they said they'd do....well, yeah, can't really see how you and others can insist that the two incidents are not related. Should I conclude that your mental faculties are deficient and start using pictures?
Doesn't really matter. You're either Mitanni or troll. And since we know Mitanni is a troll, I did take a leap of logic and assume you were Mitanni. Now, how about using a worn out cliche' in response? We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:22:00 -
[1398] - Quote
sorry, but when you're dragging the lead game designer into this you're going too far
drop the hatchet already |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:25:00 -
[1399] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:sorry, but when you're dragging the lead game designer into this you're going too far
drop the hatchet already
I didn't drag the lead designer into anything. It sounds as if he participated in the "drinks with bolton" interview of his on volition. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:27:00 -
[1400] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote: When someone says they're going to do something giving a date, time and place they're going to do it, then shows up at the exact location, date and time they said they would and do exactly what they said they'd do....well, yeah, can't really see how you and others can insist that the two incidents are not related. Should I conclude that your mental faculties are deficient and start using pictures?
He said he wants to tell miners, titan pilots, whiners, etc to go kill themselves. He did no such thing. Nor was his presentation at the alliance panel inappropriate.
The only discussion about what he may have done wrong, was if during the Q&A session he insisted that others harrass a specific ingame character in response to a CCP employee's comment about that char's last known location.
And one does not have to be bias (goons/mittani) or a troll to wade through a load of speculation and superfluous ranting to take the opertunity to point out the weakness in others arguments, and present an opposite opinion. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
|
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:27:00 -
[1401] - Quote
no, whoever decided to dig up that video got him involved
you're going too far, just drop the hatchet and walk away |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:37:00 -
[1402] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:no, whoever decided to dig up that video got him involved
you're going too far, just drop the hatchet and walk away
No, I'm pretty sure that when someone plans to break a law or EULA or TOS or any other rule set for which there are consequences, anyone that passively stands by and allows it to happen might have some liability. Because someone found evidence to that fact doesn't make them a party guilty of anything or by proxy involved Soundwave. He involved himself and as soon as suicide was mentioned he should have excused himself from the conversation and informed his superiors. That's otherwise know as CYA - covering your own ass.
Had he done so, perhaps they actually would have reviewed Mitanni's presentation and outlined certain things he was to avoid at all costs and this situation never would have happened.
Stop transferring your resentment from those who made this fiasco happen or who allowed it to happen to those who are pointing out how it happened. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:43:00 -
[1403] - Quote
CCP has already made their decision on this matter with the 30 day ban and removal from the CSM. I realize that you are a paragon of morality but when you're putting people's livelihoods on the line you're going too far, especially over some non-event that turned into an unnecessary media circus. |
oldbutfeelingyoung
VIRTUAL EMPIRE VANGUARD Vanguard Ascendants
529
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:46:00 -
[1404] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
a lot of Goons have QWERTY in mirror writing al over their forehead lately ,how come?
Im laughing too hard at the thought right now to come up with a sly answer.
at least i made somebody laugh today . But everybody must remember Goon or anti -Goon these forums are watched now by a lot of gaming-blog or - websites The longer we will let this go on ,well fill in the rest.
I don,t like what Mittani did ,but i don,t want this to last this forever and ever
pushing that button ,not expecting something. But suddenly the door opens and the next thing i see myself flooting in space,just before i wake up again. thank god for clones |
Kara Roideater
Perkone Caldari State
136
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:55:00 -
[1405] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:CCP has already made their decision on this matter with the 30 day ban and removal from the CSM. I realize that you are a paragon of morality but when you're putting people's livelihoods on the line you're going too far, especially over some non-event that turned into an unnecessary media circus.
Now, if only people would accept that there was a genuine problem and not a 'non-event' then there would really be nothing left to talk about but as long as the propaganda machine keeps on pushing the damage limitation line other people are going to push back.
Edit - Basically, take it on the chin, stop trying to minimise what was a fairly serious thing and you remove the motivation for other people to paint it as a VERY serious thing by way of counterbalance. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:01:00 -
[1406] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote: Now, if only people would accept that there was a genuine problem and not a 'non-event' then there would really be nothing left to talk about but as long as the propaganda machine keeps on pushing the damage limitation line other people are going to push back.
Edit - Basically, take it on the chin, stop trying to minimise what was a fairly serious thing and you remove the motivation for other people to paint it as a VERY serious thing by way of counterbalance.
And as long as speculators continue to blow it out of proportion or inflate it to conspiracy levels, there will be some willing to call bullsh*t on their dribble.
But I think for my own sanity and before my IQ starts dropping (if not too late) im going to bail from this thread. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:04:00 -
[1407] - Quote
Kara Roideater wrote:Now, if only people would accept that there was a genuine problem and not a 'non-event' then there would really be nothing left to talk about
Nonsense. You took it upon yourself to take a YouTube video, post it in two separate threads and try to shift the discussion towards this "new evidence" while dragging in CCP Soundwave. Another guy (or your alt) posted it in GD and it was locked. Nobody is debating the morality of what he did - Mittani screwed up. You, however, are willing to take down the lead game designer in pursuit of some agenda. |
Kale Kold
the unified Negative Ten.
70
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:12:00 -
[1408] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned! It was premeditated. The slide proved it. The "Drinks with Bolton" video from January of this year is overwhelming proof that Mittens had been planning this for at least 3 months. Drunkenness doesn't even begin to work as an excuse. If this were in a court this would be an open and closed case of premeditated cyber-bullying. The "Drinks with Bolton" video also proves that CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit. Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar. "Drinks with Bolton" featuring CCP Soundwave http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E&feature=player_detailpage#t=440s
Although this video has now mysteriously been deleted i heard for myself that Mitanni had planned this for a long time.
I totally agree he should be permanently banned from the game.
This could result in criminal action. Inciting a vulnerable member of society to kill themselves has been prosecuted before and if CCP don't act it reflects bad on them.
Here in the UK it's treated extremely seriously.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/mar/19/campaign-new-homicide-law-inciting-suicide
CCP ought to check with their lawyers as i bet this guy could sue! GÇ£Some people call me insane for the destruction-áIGÇÖve caused, ...I believe I was just doing my duty!GÇ¥ -- Testimony submitted to Caldari Navy war crimes tribunal. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:19:00 -
[1409] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned! It was premeditated. The slide proved it. The "Drinks with Bolton" video from January of this year is overwhelming proof that Mittens had been planning this for at least 3 months. Drunkenness doesn't even begin to work as an excuse. If this were in a court this would be an open and closed case of premeditated cyber-bullying. The "Drinks with Bolton" video also proves that CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit. Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar. "Drinks with Bolton" featuring CCP Soundwave http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E&feature=player_detailpage#t=440s Although this video has now mysteriously been deleted i heard for myself that Mitanni had planned this for a long time. I totally agree he should be permanently banned from the game. This could result in criminal action. Inciting a vulnerable member of society to kill themselves has been prosecuted before and if CCP don't act it reflects bad on them. Here in the UK it's treated extremely seriously. Quote: "There has to be some means of ensuring that those responsible for causing someone to take their life, are held criminally liable. The current state of affairs in untenable and cannot therefore be justified,"
Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/mar/19/campaign-new-homicide-law-inciting-suicideCCP ought to check with their lawyers as i bet this guy could sue!
You don't think they're talking about assisted suicide in that quote? Really?
You think that they're talking about people saying mean things? ******* really?
Because last time I checked the main person responsible in an act of killing oneself is---ONESELF.
All that person's life built up to that moment and you want to hold the ninny responsible who said the last mean thing?
******* really? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
12
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:20:00 -
[1410] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote:Although this video has now mysteriously been deleted i heard for myself that Mitanni had planned this for a long time. I totally agree he should be permanently banned from the game. This could result in criminal action. Inciting a vulnerable member of society to kill themselves has been prosecuted before and if CCP don't act it reflects bad on them. Here in the UK it's treated extremely seriously. Quote: "There has to be some means of ensuring that those responsible for causing someone to take their life, are held criminally liable. The current state of affairs in untenable and cannot therefore be justified,"
Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/mar/19/campaign-new-homicide-law-inciting-suicideCCP ought to check with their lawyers as i bet this guy could sue!
The video mentioned no such thing about targeting anyone for harasment.
And the your link discibes cases of a real people being victim of harassment and physical abuse. Not an anonymous alias being ridiculed in a game. In the real world there is no escape for the person being victimised besides "jumping off a bridge". And a game there is an alternative: CRTL-Q, or in this case, using the other 21 alternative aliases, or writing a petition. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
|
Kara Roideater
Perkone Caldari State
140
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:28:00 -
[1411] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:Now, if only people would accept that there was a genuine problem and not a 'non-event' then there would really be nothing left to talk about Nonsense. You took it upon yourself to take a YouTube video, post it in two separate threads and try to shift the discussion towards this "new evidence" while dragging in CCP Soundwave. Another guy (or your alt) posted it in GD and it was locked. Nobody is debating the morality of what he did - Mittani screwed up. You, however, are willing to take down the lead game designer in pursuit of some agenda.
You can find a post where I mention Soundwave? You must have a version of eve-search that works on alternate realities. Link please as that could be really fun.
Quote: Nobody is debating the morality of what he did Mittani screwed up.
Really. You must be reading different threads to me. In fact, are you even reading your own posts? Didn't you just say that it was a 'non-event'?
Personally, I would have lost interest days ago if I didn't wake up each morning to find a new line on why everyone else is terrible and disgusting but the Mittani really didn't do anything wrong. We started off with pretty much all the Goons that were posting claiming that actually, there was nothing wrong with what happened at fanfest and a pretty large chunk posting that it would be good if the comments had led to suicide (because Darwin ...). Then we had lots of Goons arguing that the presentation was fine because it didn't break the EULA/ToS. Then it was the freedom of speech issue. Then it was days of posts about how everyone else is disgusting because they are feigning moral outrage, metagaming (!) and trying to secure political advantage. Intermittent Roadhouse posts. Then the countless posts about how 10k players had been disenfranchised. Then the broader moral equivalency campaign and the creation of false dilemmas. Then the blame the media campaign. And all with a constant undercurrent of 'Really, the Mittani didn't do anything wrong but everyone else is a ****!' (a tradition that you appear to be a proud member of).
As I say, hundreds and hundreds of posts like that and people will continue to push back because they will be unwilling to allow you to frame the narrative in those terms. |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
503
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:43:00 -
[1412] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:Now, if only people would accept that there was a genuine problem and not a 'non-event' then there would really be nothing left to talk about Nonsense. You took it upon yourself to take a YouTube video, post it in two separate threads and try to shift the discussion towards this "new evidence" while dragging in CCP Soundwave. Another guy (or your alt) posted it in GD and it was locked. Nobody is debating the morality of what he did - Mittani screwed up. You, however, are willing to take down the lead game designer in pursuit of some agenda.
You poor fool. You're calling out the wrong person for the wrong reason. I suggested that CCP bring administrative action against Soundwave. What that action is, I don't care. But in no way did I indicate that he should be "taken down".
It's amusing that your interpretation of the bolton video and the panel video are so narrow that you won't admit how the two are related yet, your interpretation of my statements are so broad that you choose to conclude I want him "taken down". No. What I want is for CCP to handle this in a manner that is proactive rather than reactionary so that if the news of the January video leaves the forum they're seen handling the situation rather than not. Unfortunately, now that people know the LEAD dev is involved such handling will most undoubtedly include Soundwave.
I do think the Mitanni needs a perma-ban as many others have received more permanent punishments for far less.
Hopefully someone has copied the bolton video and can re-post it. Lanasak, if the two videos are unrelated why was the one taken down? We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Abriael VonRosen
State War Academy Caldari State
24
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:51:00 -
[1413] - Quote
I'm appalled. Honestly. Not by CCP's decision, but by the fact that many seem to be hell bent on defending Mittani's unacceptable behavior and minimize its gravity. This pretty much validates the opinion i had on certain (luckily very localized) parts of the EVE community, and on the fact that their in-game lack of morals pretty much extends out of the game
You seriously gotta learn to live with it. Mittani screwed up, badly. He's paying the consequences as the visibility he sought so actively came to bite him in the rear. If he was a normal goon in any other game at the moment he would be banned permanently. A 30 days ban and the exclusion from the CSM are a rather mild penalty for his action, and he should deem himself lucky.
It's not CCP that screwed up. It's not Sony, it's not the gaming press, it's not the large part of the community that wanted Mittani ousted. It's Mittani that screwed up. If you're angry at the consequences of those actions, the only one you should point your virtual torches and pitchforks at is Mittani himself. Of course many of you won't, because you're extremely biased.
The attempt to bully the gaming press into removing the articles on Mittani's screwup is just as appalling, and I say this as a fellow gaming writer that didn't write anything at all about this whole hubbub, simply because I never felt Mittani to be anywhere newsworthy, and because I think this whole mess shed indirect and undeserved bad press not on Mittani, but on the EVE community as a whole. While the bad press on Mittani was entirely deserved, I preferred to keep silent to avoid dragging the community into the pit with him
While there was a small amount of inaccuracies in reporting the facts, it's rather obvious that those inaccuracies were just marginal to the case in point, and Mittani used the pressure of his people to try and silence the whole (very justified) criticism on his actions
The funniest part is that he's so bent on calling out the "irresponsible press" when he's on the receiving end, but I think everyone can remember how he riled up quite a lot of at least partly irresponsible and definitely biased articles against CCP when it suited his agenda and his personal visibility that seems so important to him. I know, being on the receiving end of one's own methods is hard to swallow..
In the end the issue is pretty simple. Mittani screwed up badly. CCP dropped the banhammer, legitimately ad from an entirely justified position. Defending his unacceptable behavior does nothing else than casting a bad light on this whole community. Trying to bully the free press into silence makes you no friends. Take this as a lesson. It could have been way more harsh. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:09:00 -
[1414] - Quote
Abriael VonRosen wrote:I'm appalled. Honestly. Not by CCP's decision, but by the fact that many seem to be hell bent on defending Mittani's unacceptable behavior and minimize its gravity. This pretty much validates the opinion i had on certain (luckily very localized) parts of the EVE community, and on the fact that their in-game lack of morals pretty much extends out of the game
You seriously gotta learn to live with it. Mittani screwed up, badly. He's paying the consequences as the visibility he sought so actively came to bite him in the rear. If he was a normal goon in any other game at the moment he would be banned permanently. A 30 days ban and the exclusion from the CSM are a rather mild penalty for his action, and he should deem himself lucky.
It's not CCP that screwed up. It's not Sony, it's not the gaming press, it's not the large part of the community that wanted Mittani ousted. It's Mittani that screwed up. If you're angry at the consequences of those actions, the only one you should point your virtual torches and pitchforks at is Mittani himself. Of course many of you won't, because you're extremely biased.
The attempt to bully the gaming press into removing the articles on Mittani's screwup is just as appalling, and I say this as a fellow gaming writer that didn't write anything at all about this whole hubbub, simply because I never felt Mittani to be anywhere newsworthy, and because I think this whole mess shed indirect and undeserved bad press not on Mittani, but on the EVE community as a whole. While the bad press on Mittani was entirely deserved, I preferred to keep silent to avoid dragging the community into the pit with him
While there was a small amount of inaccuracies in reporting the facts, it's rather obvious that those inaccuracies were just marginal to the case in point, and Mittani used the pressure of his people to try and silence the whole (very justified) criticism on his actions
The funniest part is that he's so bent on calling out the "irresponsible press" when he's on the receiving end, but I think everyone can remember how he riled up quite a lot of at least partly irresponsible and definitely biased articles against CCP when it suited his agenda and his personal visibility that seems so important to him. I know, being on the receiving end of one's own methods is hard to swallow..
In the end the issue is pretty simple. Mittani screwed up badly. CCP dropped the banhammer, legitimately and from an entirely justified position. Defending his unacceptable behavior does nothing else than casting a bad light on this whole community. Trying to bully the free press into silence makes you no friends. Take this as a lesson. It could have been way more harsh.
If CCP were "entirely justified" they would have called the cops the moment it became apparent to them (read: fanfest) that this "victim" was "suicidal."
Notice how that hasn't happened?
Yet we have it on authority from CCP that their policy (regardless of context--their wording not mine) is to call law enforcement every time. This is as much about caring for the person as it is about keeping people from mindlessly using the suicide card.
Think about it. CCP is not "entirely justified". Not even close. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
503
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:13:00 -
[1415] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:
If CCP were "entirely justified" they would have called the cops the moment it became apparent to them (read: fanfest) that this "victim" was "suicidal."
Notice how that hasn't happened?
Yet we have it on authority from CCP that their policy (regardless of context--their wording not mine) is to call law enforcement every time. This is as much about caring for the person as it is about keeping people from mindlessly using the suicide card.
Think about it. CCP is not "entirely justified". Not even close.
Justification has nothing to do with it. They're trying to protect Mitanni with a symbolic 30d ban and whomever was involved. Others have received far harsher punishments for much less.
We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Abriael VonRosen
State War Academy Caldari State
25
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:14:00 -
[1416] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote: If CCP were "entirely justified" they would have called the cops the moment it became apparent to them (read: fanfest) that this "victim" was "suicidal."
Notice how that hasn't happened?
Yet we have it on authority from CCP that their policy (regardless of context--their wording not mine) is to call law enforcement every time. This is as much about caring for the person as it is about keeping people from mindlessly using the suicide card.
Think about it. CCP is not "entirely justified". Not even close.
Mittani's guilt is evident. The fact that CCP reacted slowly to it has no bearing on that fact. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
13
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:15:00 -
[1417] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote: If CCP were "entirely justified" they would have called the cops the moment it became apparent to them (read: fanfest) that this "victim" was "suicidal."
Notice how that hasn't happened?
Yet we have it on authority from CCP that their policy (regardless of context--their wording not mine) is to call law enforcement every time. This is as much about caring for the person as it is about keeping people from mindlessly using the suicide card.
Think about it. CCP is not "entirely justified". Not even close.
Just because they didn't put make dev blog about it doesn't mean they havent. Just saying.... and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:17:00 -
[1418] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:
If CCP were "entirely justified" they would have called the cops the moment it became apparent to them (read: fanfest) that this "victim" was "suicidal."
Notice how that hasn't happened?
Yet we have it on authority from CCP that their policy (regardless of context--their wording not mine) is to call law enforcement every time. This is as much about caring for the person as it is about keeping people from mindlessly using the suicide card.
Think about it. CCP is not "entirely justified". Not even close.
Justification has nothing to do with it. They're trying to protect Mitanni with a symbolic 30d ban and whomever was involved. Others have received far harsher punishments for much less.
You seem to miss the point. If there were some grievous offense against a suicidal person, why weren't the authorities called and dispatched to the victim in question?
If the victim is, in fact, fine - two things:
1) CCP needs to deal with this by contacting law enforcement. Fake suicide threats are serious business.
2) CCP's punishment against The Mittani is entirely baseless. No victim means no offense. If the guy isn't suicidal, then all this can possibly boil down to is sarcasm and allegory. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Abriael VonRosen
State War Academy Caldari State
26
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:20:00 -
[1419] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote: 2) CCP's punishment against The Mittani is entirely baseless. No victim means no offense. If the guy isn't suicidal, then all this can possibly boil down to is sarcasm and allegory.
The fact that the victim didn't kill himself doesn't mean that there's no victim. In this case, by the way, the victim isn't just Mittani's target, but CCP itself and this community, over which Mittani attracted a lot of bad press.
I'm afraid you're the one entirely missing the point. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
199
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:22:00 -
[1420] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:You seem to miss the point. If there were some grievous offense against a suicidal person, why weren't the authorities called and dispatched to the victim in question?
If the victim is, in fact, fine - two things:
1) CCP needs to deal with this by contacting law enforcement. Fake suicide threats are serious business.
2) CCP's punishment against The Mittani is entirely baseless. No victim means no offense. If the guy isn't suicidal, then all this can possibly boil down to is sarcasm and allegory. I have said this to you before, but here goes again:
1) You do not know whether authorities have been informed. 2) You do not know what they did if they were. 3) You do not know what lead to them not being informed, if CCP decided to refrain (after contacting the victim). 4) Most importantly, it is none of your business to know. CCP will never and can never publish that information. It is another player's private information that has no place whatsoever on a public announcement or forum. 5) Now stop making a fool of yourself by behaving as if absence of confidential information in public is proof of something. |
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
13
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:24:00 -
[1421] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:
1) CCP needs to deal with this by contacting law enforcement. Fake suicide threats are serious business.
2) CCP's punishment against The Mittani is entirely baseless. No victim means no offense. If the guy isn't suicidal, then all this can possibly boil down to is sarcasm and allegory.
1) As im guessing you already believe (but just for others that arn't paying attention: The Wis never threatend suicide, athough he did mention he'd been feeling that way since his wife died.
2) CCP have not claimed they are punishing the mittani for encouraging suicide, they have claimed he is being punished for breaking the TOS/EULA, most likely the player harassment clause. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:27:00 -
[1422] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:You seem to miss the point. If there were some grievous offense against a suicidal person, why weren't the authorities called and dispatched to the victim in question?
If the victim is, in fact, fine - two things:
1) CCP needs to deal with this by contacting law enforcement. Fake suicide threats are serious business.
2) CCP's punishment against The Mittani is entirely baseless. No victim means no offense. If the guy isn't suicidal, then all this can possibly boil down to is sarcasm and allegory. I have said this to you before, but here goes again: 1) You do not know whether authorities have been informed. 2) You do not know what they did if they were. 3) You do not know what lead to them not being informed, if CCP decided to refrain (after contacting the victim). 4) Most importantly, it is none of your business to know. CCP will never and can never publish that information. It is another player's private information that has no place whatsoever on a public announcement or forum. 5) Now stop making a fool of yourself by behaving as if absence of confidential information in public is proof of something not having happened.
1) I know for a FACT authorities were NOT informed. 2) Irrelevant since they were NOT. 3) REGARDLESS OF CONTEXT. 4) I like the, "Nyeah! None of your business!" argument. We knew Alex's personal information, and now he's been smeared all over the internet with REAL CONTACT INFO. 5) It's not foolish because it's ******* true.
You can ask The Wis whether he's gotten any calls from local law enforcement. No need to play the enforced-ignorance card. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
13
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:33:00 -
[1423] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:
You can ask The Wis whether he's gotten any calls from local law enforcement. No need to play the enforced-ignorance card.
if the 1000 people that just read this do that.... I think it would be rather invasive, or harassment even if we didnt intend such. And also, just because law officials are notified, by some company from another country, that someones feeling "rather sad" doesnt mean they'll send a squad car over to his house or even take it seriously. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Kale Kold
the unified Negative Ten.
70
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:35:00 -
[1424] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:This subject is so stupid I almost forgot my main point. THE GUY CANNOT SUE AS, HE DID NOT KILL HIMSELF. Or can you find a spot in a law somewhere that says "almost killing oneself" or "giving increased consideration to killing oneself" as a result of a supposed "tormentor"? Also, what about all the people who ran to The Wis pointing to this "mean video"? Where is their respective culpability? The guy didn't even know what was going on...until you people pointed it out. The guy didn't have to die. Inciting a vulnerable person to kill themselves is harassment and in the UK people have gone to jail for that even thought the victim of the harassment didn't succeed in killing themselves.
Like i said in some countries perpetrators of causing mental anguish and inciting suicide have been prosecuted. Look it up.
Also if he still goes on to commit suicide you can bet CCP will be questioned. GÇ£Some people call me insane for the destruction-áIGÇÖve caused, ...I believe I was just doing my duty!GÇ¥ -- Testimony submitted to Caldari Navy war crimes tribunal. |
Kale Kold
the unified Negative Ten.
70
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:38:00 -
[1425] - Quote
Quote: In many jurisdictions it is a crime to assist others, directly or indirectly, in taking their own lives. In some jurisdictions, it is also illegal to encourage them to do so. Sometimes an exception applies for physician assisted suicide (PAS), under strict conditions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_legislation GÇ£Some people call me insane for the destruction-áIGÇÖve caused, ...I believe I was just doing my duty!GÇ¥ -- Testimony submitted to Caldari Navy war crimes tribunal. |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
13
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:42:00 -
[1426] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:
1) I know for a FACT authorities were NOT informed.
um.. proof or ...you know the rest of this meme. Please state your source it just sounds like a rant. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
199
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:45:00 -
[1427] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:4) I like the, "Nyeah! None of your business!" argument. We knew Alex's personal information, and now he's been smeared all over the internet with REAL CONTACT INFO. And that, obviously, makes it ok to demand that we post about real life information of the guy he targeted? Could you explain by which logic?
If you know anything for a fact about what happened to him in this case, posting it is bannable offense. HTH, HAND. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:45:00 -
[1428] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:
1) I know for a FACT authorities were NOT informed.
um.. proof or ...you know the rest of this meme. Please state your source it just sounds like a rant.
Darth Gustav wrote:You can ask The Wis whether he's gotten any calls from local law enforcement. No need to play the enforced-ignorance card.
Can you read? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
14
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:46:00 -
[1429] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:This subject is so stupid I almost forgot my main point. THE GUY CANNOT SUE AS, HE DID NOT KILL HIMSELF. Or can you find a spot in a law somewhere that says "almost killing oneself" or "giving increased consideration to killing oneself" as a result of a supposed "tormentor"? Also, what about all the people who ran to The Wis pointing to this "mean video"? Where is their respective culpability? The guy didn't even know what was going on...until you people pointed it out. The guy didn't have to die. Inciting a vulnerable person to kill themselves is harassment and in the UK people have gone to jail for that even thought the victim of the harassment didn't succeed in killing themselves. Like i said in some countries perpetrators of causing mental anguish and inciting suicide have been prosecuted. Look it up. Also if he still goes on to commit suicide you can bet CCP will be questioned.
Thankfully, Mittani did not encourage anyone to commit suicide. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:47:00 -
[1430] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Kale Kold wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:This subject is so stupid I almost forgot my main point. THE GUY CANNOT SUE AS, HE DID NOT KILL HIMSELF. Or can you find a spot in a law somewhere that says "almost killing oneself" or "giving increased consideration to killing oneself" as a result of a supposed "tormentor"? Also, what about all the people who ran to The Wis pointing to this "mean video"? Where is their respective culpability? The guy didn't even know what was going on...until you people pointed it out. The guy didn't have to die. Inciting a vulnerable person to kill themselves is harassment and in the UK people have gone to jail for that even thought the victim of the harassment didn't succeed in killing themselves. Like i said in some countries perpetrators of causing mental anguish and inciting suicide have been prosecuted. Look it up. Also if he still goes on to commit suicide you can bet CCP will be questioned. Thankfully, Mittani did not encourage anyone to commit suicide.
^---******* this, really. +1. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
14
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:49:00 -
[1431] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:You can ask The Wis whether he's gotten any calls from local law enforcement. No need to play the enforced-ignorance card. Can you read?
yes can you?
Azran Zala wrote:
... just because law officials are notified, by some company from another country, that someones feeling "rather sad" doesnt mean they'll send a squad car over to his house or even take it seriously.
Also not everyone provides their real details when signing up for accounts over the internet.
and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:53:00 -
[1432] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:You can ask The Wis whether he's gotten any calls from local law enforcement. No need to play the enforced-ignorance card. Can you read? yes can you? Azran Zala wrote:
... just because law officials are notified, by some company from another country, that someones feeling "rather sad" doesnt mean they'll send a squad car over to his house or even take it seriously.
Also not everyone provides their real details when signing up for accounts over the internet.
Where is the vitriol at his local donut-eater station then? Who will champion this poor sad man teetering near the edge?
It's hard to answer the real ******* questions, isn't it? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
199
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:56:00 -
[1433] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Where is the vitriol at his local donut-eater station then? Who will champion this poor sad man teetering near the edge?
It's hard to answer the real ******* questions, isn't it? It isn't, but it seems to be hard to read the answers (hint: there's 70ish pages of this discussion here and 200+ in the apology thread and yes, that question too has been answered multiple times).
That, or you are just trying to get the final word, regardless of any arguments presented. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:03:00 -
[1434] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Where is the vitriol at his local donut-eater station then? Who will champion this poor sad man teetering near the edge?
It's hard to answer the real ******* questions, isn't it? It isn't, but it seems to be hard to read the answers (hint: there's 70ish pages of this discussion here and 200+ in the apology thread and yes, that question too has been answered multiple times). That, or you are just trying to get the final word, regardless of any arguments presented.
Nope I'm just shiptoasting away like the rest of you.
I just bang an obviously different drum. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
14
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:11:00 -
[1435] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote: Where is the vitriol at his local donut-eater station then? Who will champion this poor sad man teetering near the edge?
It's hard to answer the real ******* questions, isn't it?
I cant really go into discussion about lax policing, because I'm not even sure what country the wis is from. if you care to enlighten me perhaps we can evaluate their policing performance, or what their standard procedure in such cases are.
Would you restate your question? and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:19:00 -
[1436] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote: Where is the vitriol at his local donut-eater station then? Who will champion this poor sad man teetering near the edge?
It's hard to answer the real ******* questions, isn't it?
I cant really enter into discussion about lax policing, because I'm not even sure what country the wis is from. if you care to enlighten me perhaps we can evaluate their policing performance, or what their standard procedure in such cases are. Would you restate your question?
Sure, here goes:
Who will champion this sad man teetering on the edge in a way that is selfless and not self-serving in the context of a subscription-based video game or the company who runs it?
Any takers? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
14
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:24:00 -
[1437] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote: Sure, here goes:
Who will champion this sad man teetering on the edge in a way that is selfless and not self-serving in the context of a subscription-based video game or the company who runs it?
Any takers?
Since I don't know what country he is from, I cannot answer as to what local social or govermental services are availible to him. But im assuming most have a police force.
However I believe in my own country they will likely not even consider the matter let alone act on it. So it would be up to family or privatised mental health care. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:35:00 -
[1438] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote: Sure, here goes:
Who will champion this sad man teetering on the edge in a way that is selfless and not self-serving in the context of a subscription-based video game or the company who runs it?
Any takers?
Since I don't know what country he is from, I cannot answer as to what local social or govermental services are availible to him. But im assuming most have a police force. However I believe in my own country the police will likely not even file a report on the matter let alone act on it. So it would be up to family or privatised mental health care. Where I'm from in the 21st century we have police who undergo sensitivity training, including how to deal with persons of various mental illness. This includes depression.
Due to the investment value such education entails, officers are expected to act on information received as part of their duty to "serve and protect."
So I think we both know who the one entity is here who can actually act selflessly for this poor sad man.
Go ahead and say the name. It's OK.
He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
15
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:36:00 -
[1439] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:
Where I'm from in the 21st century we have police who undergo sensitivity training, including how to deal with persons of various mental illness. This includes depression.
Due to the investment value such education entails, officers are expected to act on information received as part of their duty to "serve and protect."
So I think we both know who the one entity is here who can actually act selflessly for this poor sad man.
Go ahead and say the name. It's OK.
the pope? I'd like to say himself. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:38:00 -
[1440] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:
Where I'm from in the 21st century we have police who undergo sensitivity training, including how to deal with persons of various mental illness. This includes depression.
Due to the investment value such education entails, officers are expected to act on information received as part of their duty to "serve and protect."
So I think we both know who the one entity is here who can actually act selflessly for this poor sad man.
Go ahead and say the name. It's OK.
the pope?
lol good one! He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
|
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
15
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:44:00 -
[1441] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:
Where I'm from in the 21st century we have police who undergo sensitivity training, including how to deal with persons of various mental illness. This includes depression.
Due to the investment value such education entails, officers are expected to act on information received as part of their duty to "serve and protect."
So I think we both know who the one entity is here who can actually act selflessly for this poor sad man.
Go ahead and say the name. It's OK.
the pope? lol good one!
Where im from the cops have been known to occationally shoot unarmed & facedown teenagers in the back of the head with R1 rifles or open fire an riddle "suspected" highjacked vehicles with automatic weapon fire only to discover that some innoccent grade school teacher just bit several slugs in her face on her way home because she happend to be driving the same colour car of a make and model of thousands like it.
So... Im not even going to go there... not with a 10foot f***ing pole and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
195
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 20:52:00 -
[1442] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:
Where I'm from in the 21st century we have police who undergo sensitivity training, including how to deal with persons of various mental illness. This includes depression.
Due to the investment value such education entails, officers are expected to act on information received as part of their duty to "serve and protect."
So I think we both know who the one entity is here who can actually act selflessly for this poor sad man.
Go ahead and say the name. It's OK.
the pope? lol good one! Where im from the cops have been known to occationally shoot unarmed & facedown teenagers in the back of the head or open fire an riddle "suspected" highjacked vehicles with automatic weapon fire only to discover that some innoccent grade school teacher just bit several slugs in her face on her way home because she happend to be driving the same colour car of a make and model of thousands like it. So... Im not even going to go there... not with a 10foot f***ing pole
Well let's hope [REDACTED] doesn't live in your neighborhood, then.
But hey, on the bright side, if he does it sounds like it'd be easy enough to just be fodder in your neighborhood.
In fact in such an environment it seems unlikely that we'd find somebody as sad as [REDACTED].
Darwin et al.
He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
15
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 21:00:00 -
[1443] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote: But hey, on the bright side, if he does it sounds like it'd be easy enough to just be fodder in your neighborhood.
In fact in such an environment it seems unlikely that we'd find somebody as sad as [REDACTED].
Darwin et al.
My house is in a great neighborhood, private security forces are well paid and very professional The -metro- police in the city where my apartment is are also very good, but they are employed by the city and not part of the national police force. Private health care is also world class. But I think the point im getting at, is there isnt going to be much help for those that dont help themselves or at least pay others to.
I think we probly have alot to be shoked over. So I would be lying if I where to say im not desensitised to issues like this. and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Ai Shun
566
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 21:00:00 -
[1444] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Without even reading the post, I have to point out it's dated 04.02, so for an April Fool's, it's a tad late...
Post explains the video it is linked to and can be posted afterwards. I was referring specifically to the video. Plus, by the time most of the world caught up to 1 April it was the 2nd here. Timezones, you know. |
Harry Farina
Assisted Genocide Unprovoked Aggression
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 02:57:00 -
[1445] - Quote
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKC00a0ovTA&feature=youtu.be
Just when you thought it went away and now it's back to haunt you. Check 7:00 - 7:40 and lets see who is sorry. |
Harry Farina
Assisted Genocide Unprovoked Aggression
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 04:34:00 -
[1446] - Quote
And 10000 goons go silent.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKC00a0ovTA&feature=youtu.be
7:00 - 7:40 is where the good stuff is. |
Jaqa
Screaming War Eagles Incorporated
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 05:01:00 -
[1447] - Quote
I like that quote about how "increasingly, spaceships are serious business." Internet spaceships will always be internet spaceships to the players. Internet spaceships are now super serious to CCP. Please don't let your 'Dust debut' make you uptight. The Original Jaqalope Pilot of the Transportosaurus Rex 100% Free Range |
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
509
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 12:54:00 -
[1448] - Quote
Good to see it again! We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
Kerensky White
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
52
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 02:36:00 -
[1449] - Quote
Harry Farina wrote:And 10000 goons go silent.
Actually, we're just too busy burning things in space right now. It's a lot of fun.
|
Snot Shot
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers The 0rphanage
92
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 02:52:00 -
[1450] - Quote
Kerensky White wrote:Harry Farina wrote:And 10000 goons go silent.
Actually, we're just too busy burning things in space right now. It's a lot of fun. You mean shooting more structures since you need that giant **** heap of a coalition to take space from anyone....
Carry on being terrible at EVE and crying about your Martini craping in his own spy space suit...... . GÇ£God grant me the serenity to accept the things I canGÇÖt shoot, the courage to shoot the things I can, and the wisdom to GTFO!!GÇ¥GÇô Snot Shot - 2012.....Yeah I'm a killin machine..... http://eve-kill.net/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=50753
|
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Mr Bigwinky
4U Services Inc. Talocan United
184
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 08:07:00 -
[1451] - Quote
Just wanted to take this opportunity to post in a goons tears thread. I've only made it 4 pages through but it's incredibly funny so far. Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself GÖÑ |
Harry Farina
Assisted Genocide Unprovoked Aggression
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 10:14:00 -
[1452] - Quote
Kerensky White wrote:Harry Farina wrote:And 10000 goons go silent.
Actually, we're just too busy burning things in space right now. It's a lot of fun.
I concede that number means nothing. Let Mittens know. Oh wait nevermind. |
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
13
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 10:20:00 -
[1453] - Quote
people stopped caring
I hypothesize that mittani eats cats |
Azran Zala
Sicarius. When Hippos Attack
16
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 11:11:00 -
[1454] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:people stopped caring
and a one and a two and a ching chong potato |
Argyle Jones
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
10
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 13:17:00 -
[1455] - Quote
There is a large grey area between the emergent sandbox game of serious internet spaceships and the real world implications of cyber bullying.
The brutal nature of the EVE Online sandbox means you can cheat, lie, steal, scam, attack the defenseless and generally grief everyone around you, but that doesn't mean you have to.
The Mittani and his compatriots crossed the line well before the alliance panel discussion at FanFest 2012. To break it down so anyone can understand it:
- Blowing up the guy's 23 mackinaws: OK
- Scamming the guy into paying billions in protection money: OK
- Making fun of his depression and personal problems: NOT OK
The issue here being that while we all enjoy nefarious activities from time to time, once someone contacts you in an online game and unloads personal problems of a suicidal nature, it's not a game anymore, it's not fun for anyone involved and the correct thing to do in such a situation is to petition CCP.
Really, it amazes me that people can't tell the difference. This is what your mother meant when she said "it's all fun and games until someone loses an eye". Have your fun, but don't take it too far.
How hard is that?
/Yargle |
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
225
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 13:30:00 -
[1456] - Quote
The whole discussion should be about one thing only.
Should The Mittani be removed completely from the CSM 7 or not. In my opinion the loss of the chair and the 30 day nad was more than enough. The loss of any position within the CSM was over the top. I have no love for The Mittani, but I have respect for the player behind the character.
He himself appologized and he himself dropped chair. He himself accepts the 30 day ban. I wonder why the need of so many people to keep on kicking the person behind the character. I have done theatre, tabletops, LARP's and so much more. I played and I was storyteller, I was asset in the form of NPC and I have played far worse persons than The Mittani. Yet nobody ever saw the need to put my person on the same line as the one I played.
I know actors who came within their role a tad too much, professionals who had to play certain feelings/behaviour over a certain amount of time that at some point the border between reality and fiction became blurry. This is a pretty natural reaction if people consider this. This doesn't make the person behind it good or bad. It's a mistake our own mind presses onto us after a prolonged period of thoughtformatting through play.
It would be a sign of maturity if people would start accepting that everyone has his or her bad days and makes mistakes. Some are bad and some are less bad. If someone is mature enough to reckognize what he or she did was bad and appologizes for it then why can't the rest be mature enough to accept it at some point without stopping even lower than the level of behaviour they are so furious about in the first place.
|
Delilah Wild
Concordokken Holdings Concordokken.
15
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 14:14:00 -
[1457] - Quote
Mature people do not turn a blind eye or make excuses for an act that in some jurisdictions might be considered actionable, and without doubt, is morally reprehensible. |
Mr Bigwinky
4U Services Inc. Talocan United
185
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 14:20:00 -
[1458] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:I have no love for The Mittani, but I have respect for the player behind the character.
I'm the opposite, I have respect for the feats the ingame character has achieved. After seeing him in person at fanfest, I found him to be a bit of a tool.
CSM is a privilege, not your "right". Rules of the game do apply as serving as part of the CSM (for the game), on an alliance panel (for the game) talking to players (of the game) at a festival (about the game) held by the people who develop the game seems to be pretty related to the game, no?
inb4 lost the game.
Also, please continue with goon tears and unsub pictures - those were the best GÖÑ Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself GÖÑ |
wanking monkey girl
Capital Maintenance
26
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 15:05:00 -
[1459] - Quote
ILikeMarkets wrote:For those who haven't had a chance to see, I thought I would repost this little gem. :) This is a pretty interesting video to listen to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=SKC00a0ovTA#t=0sESPECIALLY this part, where Mittani tells the name of his talk and what it will be about: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=SKC00a0ovTA#t=413s"The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance Presentation is going to be 'Goonswarm Hates you'. And basically just talk about each different little aspect... demographic of EVE. Of how much we hate and want people to die and kill themselves. Like, highsec miners: We want them to kill themselves. People who roleplay? We want them to kill themselves. People with Titans? We want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people who I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of a thousand nerds."
with the vid shown taking place before fanfest and with a dev taking part it is clear then this matter needs a internal investigated. being planed ahead of time removes mittans (i was drunk #) excuse. soundwave had prier knowledge what mittans was going to say and with that he had a duty to foreword the information to ccp. but with soundwave being goons t20 guy at ccp its plain and clear that ccp is being lead down a track they have experience with. |
oldbutfeelingyoung
VIRTUAL EMPIRE VANGUARD Vanguard Ascendants
540
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 15:28:00 -
[1460] - Quote
wanking monkey girl wrote:ILikeMarkets wrote:For those who haven't had a chance to see, I thought I would repost this little gem. :) This is a pretty interesting video to listen to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=SKC00a0ovTA#t=0sESPECIALLY this part, where Mittani tells the name of his talk and what it will be about: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=SKC00a0ovTA#t=413s"The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance Presentation is going to be 'Goonswarm Hates you'. And basically just talk about each different little aspect... demographic of EVE. Of how much we hate and want people to die and kill themselves. Like, highsec miners: We want them to kill themselves. People who roleplay? We want them to kill themselves. People with Titans? We want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people who I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of a thousand nerds." with the vid shown taking place before fanfest and with a dev taking part it is clear then this matter needs a internal investigated. being planed ahead of time removes mittans (i was drunk #) excuse. soundwave had prier knowledge what mittans was going to say and with that he had a duty to foreword the information to ccp. but with soundwave being goons t20 guy at ccp its plain and clear that ccp is being lead down a track they have experience with.
If soundwave only knew what was on that video ,he did not know that mittani was doing this on 1 person and asking people to harras this guy. pushing that button ,not expecting something. But suddenly the door opens and the next thing i see myself flooting in space,just before i wake up again. thank god for clones |
|
Slumber Hawk
Shadow on the moon
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 16:41:00 -
[1461] - Quote
so we got - intend - preparation (the slide) - execution
CCP is praying on their knees that it will be all fine? |
Hrald
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
93
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 19:46:00 -
[1462] - Quote
Quote:with the vid shown taking place before fanfest and with a dev taking part it is clear then this matter needs a internal investigated. being planed ahead of time removes mittans (i was drunk #) excuse. He has repeatedly disavowed this excuse. Furthermore, the_Mittani goes on to say he hopes to offend people, not to actually make anyone kill themselves as he's been painted by everyone.
He still made a poor decision but there was no premeditation to make anyone kill themselves. |
Cosmic Fart
Hedion University Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.05 00:19:00 -
[1463] - Quote
All of you who are quitting because CCP did the right thing...
Can I haz your stuff?
Your votes were not dimissed as you claim. Your mittens messed up and lost your votes for you. Blame the right person if you gonna blame anyone. |
Foxy Ferret
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
6
|
Posted - 2012.04.05 00:26:00 -
[1464] - Quote
CCP Navigator suggested this needs to be in here instead of its own thread. So for those of you who mailed me ingame and asked me to re-open this matter in the correct thread, here it is.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
With legislation heating up around the world over cyber bullying, its time some of you woke up and smelled the coffee. You may think your behaviour and actions are completely harmless, but the reality is, your actions, your words and your behaviour can have extremely adverse effects on people in real life and will ultimately be the downfall of CCP and EvE online if these things arent dealt with.
Before the swarm starts trolling, I am NOT an anti-goon ingame enemy, cry baby who got owned by Goons etc, nor am I some mamby pamby, or a carebear. I am however qualified in mental health and disability, I do work in this sector in real life and on a daily basis. So my letter to The Mittani is genuine and so is my concern.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
A Letter to The Mittani:
The definition of cyber bullying fits very snuggly into what The Mittani encited in his fanfest speech....It fits very snuggly into any call to suicide online. There are no excuses, you don't get to feel sorry for yourself now Mr Mittens just because its rebounded back on your backside.
This is NOT about Goonswarm, this is NOT about The Mittani ingame..... This is about the real life man who stood up infront of thousands of viewers and encited the masses to cause a single person to commit suicide.
Shame on you!
Definition:
Cyberbullying is the use of the Internet and related technologies to harm other people, in a deliberate, repeated, and hostile manner.
Enciting people to cause someone who was obviously mentally unstable to commit suicide is deliberate, repeated and hostile!
The term "cyberbullying" was first coined and defined by Canadian educator and anti-bullying activist Bill Belsey, as "the use of information and communication technologies to support deliberate, repeated, and hostile behavior by an individual or group, that is intended to harm others."
Cyberbullying has subsequently been defined as "when the Internet, cell phones or other devices are used to send or post text or images intended to hurt or embarrass another person". Other researchers use similar language to describe the phenomenon.
Cyberbullying can be as simple as continuing to send e-mail to someone who has said they want no further contact with the sender, but it may also include threats, sexual remarks, pejorative labels (i.e., hate speech), ganging up on victims by making them the subject of ridicule in forums, and posting false statements as fact aimed at humiliation.
It doesnt matter that you didn't put out his real life name, the fact is you and the rest of goons participate in cyber bullying on a regular basis. If you are causing people harm by lowering their self esteem, by causing them to feel humiliated and outcast, you are cyber bullying. DEAL WITH IT!
Harmful effects:
Research had demonstrated a number of serious consequences of cyberbullying victimization. For example, victims have lower self-esteem, increased suicidal ideation, and a variety of emotional responses, retaliating, being scared, frustrated, angry, and depressed.
One of the most damaging effects is that a victim begins to avoid friends and activities, often the very intention of the cyber-bully.
Cyberbullying campaigns are sometimes so damaging that victims have committed suicide. There are at least four examples in the United States where cyber-bullying has been linked to the suicide of a teenager.
It does not matter a fig if you feel there is nothing in the way you or goons behave and that its all part of the sandbox and in good fun. If you are infact effecting people in a negative manner, if you are causing people to suffer emotional distress with what you are doing and how you are behaving, you are a cyber bully and you need to rethink your position.
If you want to call me an anti goon and pretend that somehow im calling for your blood because you did something nasty to me ingame you can please yourself, thats how you sleep at night, fair enough.
I am however, qualified in mental health and deal with people that suffer at the hands of people like you on a daily basis. Just because you are on the internet doesnt mean you are any different to the bullies in real life, bar the fact that you have an entire cult of sycophants following you down that road with blindfolds fully attached convincing you its ok to emotionally damage people as long as you cant see the real life behind the pixels.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Take the time to mull this over Goons and Mittens and think about how you would feel if it was your mother, brother, sister, cousin or best friend that was close to suicide because of the humiliation they felt from someone online. If you are totally lacking in humanity and are laughing right now, you are probably a sociopath and I cant believe you read this far =/ |
Slumber Hawk
Shadow on the moon
8
|
Posted - 2012.04.05 07:28:00 -
[1465] - Quote
Hrald wrote:Quote:with the vid shown taking place before fanfest and with a dev taking part it is clear then this matter needs a internal investigated. being planed ahead of time removes mittans (i was drunk #) excuse. He has repeatedly disavowed this excuse. Furthermore, the_Mittani goes on to say he hopes to offend people, not to actually make anyone kill themselves as he's been painted by everyone. He still made a poor decision but there was no premeditation to make anyone kill themselves.
here you go wrong ....
There are a lot of reallife News Headlines, where people were never intend on killing other peoples, to name a few: - Shaking a baby to stop it crying - Insurance fraud by "feigning" a car accident - Chasing an assumed (and innocent) shoplifter - Placing a girl's name on a slutty list
All actions with a deadly outcome, but never with the mindset to "kill". The Mittani on the other hand willfully went for an action claiming before hand its termination point! An action that is described as cyberbullying and is known to be quite deadly ... if not reallife costly to cure!
With 10.000+ supporters, its one things if you end up in the incidental death list, another to end up on the intentional legitimate list as sported by those same 10.000+ EVE players.
|
Delilah Wild
Concordokken Holdings Concordokken.
18
|
Posted - 2012.04.05 14:48:00 -
[1466] - Quote
Excellent post. Thank you Foxy.
Slumber Hawks' post from your locked thread bears repeating as well.
Quote:@foxy,
You missed a couple of points: Cyberbullies ... - do not see the harm themselfs, unless pointed at it - only accept authority to stop - are mostly their own (local) authority - will seek confirmation that it wasn't that bad - think the punishment unfair for "just a joke" - have a more pronounced inner and outercircle of friends - rely on teamleader to define those circles according to acceptance of teamleader's value of behavior etc
each of those behaviors have a certain value towards recognising a cyberbully prior to the act(s), but most often, only after the act will one say: ah yes, now i see.
This of coarse stands aside from loners, which you can only recognise from the (small) facts it happend. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1075068#post1075068 |
Muul Udonii
THORN Syndicate Initiative Mercenaries
29
|
Posted - 2012.04.05 15:06:00 -
[1467] - Quote
Why didn't CCP remove this comment from the broadcast if they felt so strongly about it?
And is anyone actually shocked that Mittens is a ****? Personally I don't think he did anything out of character and would not punish him one jot for it. |
Hainnz
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
117
|
Posted - 2012.04.05 17:31:00 -
[1468] - Quote
Good. EVE has consequences. He knew better. He's an adult. He'll live. |
Abulurd Boniface
United Tritanium Forge Ishukone Drug and Research Utilization Group
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 05:54:00 -
[1469] - Quote
I hope CCP keeps these thread logs for future reference. They will be invaluable to future sociologists as they research the Emergence of Society and the Discovery of its Boundaries in Virtual Communities at the Start of the 3d Millennium.
The threadnaughts generated by this one single drunken comment and the spill over in different media is a clear indicator of the importance that virtual worlds have in our lives and EVE Online, for us, in particular. It shows that we care about what the boundaries, and consequences, should be for emergent behavior in a virtual world. This is the meta game of the meta game.
The Mittani demonstrates the significance of EVE Online in our lives and how much we care about what goes on in and around the sandbox. For that reason alone CCP should make him an honorary citizen.
Mittens is EVE Online done right. He has offered an apology, that's all he should have done. The guy apparently lost 23 (really?) Mackinaws. So, either he doesn't care about losing ships or he's an idiot for insisting to be a target to people whom he knows are not going to let up. Space isn't big enough to move away from the guys coming after you?
Either way, and I've said it before, it's a bad decision to come into the sandbox while being depressed. It's a spaceships-on-the-internet game, it's not a mental health clinic. Stay away already.
What Mitten's drunk comment has shown especially clearly, is how people will use fake outrage over someone else's perceived hurt to further their own agenda. I'm careful about losing control of my mental capacities in the company of people I don't know, for precisely the reasons that we see unfold here, I have far less respect for those who rejoice at finally having the opportunity to stab the person [and his wife, and his dog] personally only for the political expediency of the day.
Don't bring the tiny violin to tell us how bad the pain emerging from your anal cavity hurts over what some guy said when he was drunk. Your faux rage is worse because you're not even drunk when you're doing it. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
225
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 07:36:00 -
[1470] - Quote
The beginning of the above post had sense (EVE is important, we do care, we are looking for boundaries). Then it went down the drain, assuming that all or most of the outrage would be abusing someone's perceived hurt to attack one person, instead of actually, well caring about the boundaries. |
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Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
239
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 08:12:00 -
[1471] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:The beginning of the above post had sense (EVE is important, we do care, we are looking for boundaries). Then it went down the drain, assuming that all or most of the outrage would be abusing someone's perceived hurt to attack one person, instead of actually, well caring about the boundaries.
I like your avatar. I think that's about all I can say about the space above this post that doesn't violate the EULA or the TOS.
Your grammar was good too.
So self-serving, so sad that CCP let this happen and made real ISK doing so.
To be honest any other company would be getting sued by their client for breach of contract. You don't throw drunks at your own bar under the bus.
CCP published the behavior live. CCP violated their own TOS and their own EULA.
An individual is falliable. Corporations are supposed to insulate against that falliability, not expose it and then feign, "Oops!"
I maintain that regardless of the limited culpability of an inebriated individual for an off-color remark, a corporation should be held to much, much higher standards. By asserting that the broadcast was tantamount to their forums, they also assert that the broadcast was moderated in a way becoming of CCP. After all, this is true of their forums. A post such as this would have been wiped out. A FORUM ban may (or may not) have been given. But it would have been handled professionally.
This was not in any way, shape, or form "professional."
I still like your avatar. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
225
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 08:14:00 -
[1472] - Quote
I have no idea why you are talking to me about CCP's responsibility in this as a response to what I posted; the two do not seem related. As before, you seem to labor under the illusion that there's only two sides to the debate and if someone holds one opinion, they hold a bunch of others too. I posted nothing that as far I can see could be construed as defense of CCP or denying that they had their share of the responsibility too?
I am afraid the thought has crossed my mind that you must be Mittani alt - who else but the person in trouble himself could be so hurt by the event that the perception of it being UNFAIR that his response to anything posted (even posts that do not mention him at all) is to find someone else to blame?
Thank you for the kind words though. I quite like how that portrait turned out myself. |
Whitehound
26
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 10:29:00 -
[1473] - Quote
EVE Online is Tears Online, now with tears by CSM and tears by voters. |
Slumber Hawk
Shadow on the moon
9
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 16:01:00 -
[1474] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:EVE Online is Tears Online, now with tears by CSM and tears by voters.
just change tears to graves and we're talking about the same topic. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
256
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 17:21:00 -
[1475] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:I have no idea why you are talking to me about CCP's responsibility in this as a response to what I posted; the two do not seem related. As before, you seem to labor under the illusion that there's only two sides to the debate and if someone holds one opinion, they hold a bunch of others too. I posted nothing that as far I can see could be construed as defense of CCP or denying that they had their share of the responsibility too?
I am afraid the thought has crossed my mind that you must be Mittani alt - who else but the person in trouble himself could be so hurt by the event and the perception of it being UNFAIR that his response to anything posted (even posts that do not mention him at all) is to find someone else to blame?
Thank you for the kind words though. I quite like how that portrait turned out myself.
You're welcome. It really is a fetching portrait.
My point was just to emphasize that the post you said "went down the drain" did no such thing.
That is a simple matter of perspective. And no, there are not just "two sides."
There are clearly at least three sides. Maybe four if you count the gaming press. Five with the coalition of whine themselves.
1. The Mittani 2. The Wis 3. CCP 4. Gaming Press? 5. Self-serving Rabble
It's obviously more complicated than "two sides." He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
230
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 17:38:00 -
[1476] - Quote
Nevermind, you either totally missed my point about the sides, or intentionally misinterpreted it. It does not seem you are able to see anything in this except people who agree with you on everything related to it, and "self-serving rabble" who disagree with you on everything. The idea that someone might agree with you on some things and disagree with you on others seems to be completely impossible...
Just remember that you saying it is so does not make it so - not even if you get the final word. It would serve some agendas to make this a Mittani vs the World issue, but that's not what it is. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
256
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 18:08:00 -
[1477] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:Nevermind, you either totally missed my point about the sides, or intentionally misinterpreted it. It does not seem you are able to see anything in this except people who agree with you on everything related to it, and "self-serving rabble" who disagree with you on everything. The idea that someone might agree with you on some things and disagree with you on others seems to be completely impossible... Just remember that you saying it is so does not make it so - not even if you get the final word. It would serve some agendas to make this a Mittani vs the World issue, but that's not what it is.
I was really just trying to explain my response to your post.
How can your reply be that "you either totally missed my point about the sides, or intentionally misinterpreted it?"
I was trying to explain, in the context of your reply about the exceptionally good post about how self-serving many of the loudest voices truly are, why I would reply to your comment with what I did.
Then you changed gears and said that there were more sides and issues and that's fine too.
Now you're saying I apparently don't understand...and that I DELIBERATELY misinterpreted you? Oh really? I think you were quite freaking clear. Evasive, combattive, but clear. Look, all I'm saying is that the post about the self-serving rabble was a good one. I AGREE that there is (limited) individual culpability here. But the circumstances are a complete and total sham.
Apparently even you share a sliver of this sentiment, but you see fit to continue to berate any attempt I make at illuminating this shameful set of circumstances with hyperbole and fallacies. I understand that you may not disagree with everything I might have to say about this, OK? Is that any better? From now on I will preface everything I post with "I understand that some of you may or may not agree with each of these points, and that our collective agreements may also differ on other, as yet unmentioned points."
For somebody who likes to toss around the "last word" euphamism, you sure seem pretty obsessed with it to be honest. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Slumber Hawk
Shadow on the moon
9
|
Posted - 2012.04.06 22:55:00 -
[1478] - Quote
Darth Gustav,
If you agree with Mittani than just say so, no need to lower the thread to a different standard.
on a (potential) mmo offenders side note: I'm happy to hear the news about registered sex offenders being removed from a couple of mmo's. Plenty of room left for improvement though. |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
287
|
Posted - 2012.04.07 04:32:00 -
[1479] - Quote
Slumber Hawk wrote:Darth Gustav,
If you agree with Mittani than just say so, no need to lower the thread to a different standard.
on a (potential) mmo offenders side note: I'm happy to hear the news about registered sex offenders being removed from a couple of mmo's. Plenty of room left for improvement though. If you agree that's a strawman argument just say so.
Fallacious statements really add a lot of substance to the discussion... He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Nathaniel Sandalphon
Open University of Celestial Hardship Art of War Alliance
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.07 10:17:00 -
[1480] - Quote
Can we please stop crying (especially Goons and afiliates) abut this CSM issue, its old newsGǪ
Muttantani got drunk while wearing the cool kid wizard hat (auction it, am sure you could secure a few votes for the next CSM election) and all of a sudden 10.058 wentGǪhow do you say itGǪPOOF? It was more like "fttt" over here but I was far from the "epicenter".
No re-vote, if you don't like, do what your commander in chief told the other guy. Am not good at quoting people but it had something to do with "flesruoy llik"
So kidsGǪwhat have we learned? Role Playing in real live while intoxicated is dangerous!!!!
Now go play the serious space ship game and have a beer. |
|
Lanasak
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
25
|
Posted - 2012.04.07 10:30:00 -
[1481] - Quote
Nathaniel Sandalphon wrote:Can we please stop crying (especially Goons and afiliates) abut this CSM issue, its old newsGǪ
Muttantani got drunk while wearing the cool kid wizard hat (auction it, am sure you could secure a few votes for the next CSM election) and all of a sudden 10.058 wentGǪhow do you say itGǪPOOF? It was more like "fttt" over here but I was far from the "epicenter".
No re-vote, if you don't like, do what your commander in chief told the other guy. Am not good at quoting people but it had something to do with "flesruoy llik"
So kidsGǪwhat have we learned? Role Playing in real live while intoxicated is dangerous!!!!
Now go play the serious space ship game and have a beer.
welcome to the thread
thanks for your useless contribution |
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.08 18:08:00 -
[1482] - Quote
Mugged Yougot wrote:ConXtionS wrote:Lets start with your dumb leaders words... "I AM NOT A CYBER BULLY"
Well here is the Dictionary
cyber- GÇé
a combining form meaning GÇ£computer,GÇ¥ GÇ£computer network,GÇ¥ or GÇ£virtual reality,GÇ¥ used in the formation of compound words ( cybertalk; cyberart; cyberspace ) and by extension meaning GÇ£very modernGÇ¥ ( cyberfashion ).
bul-+ly 1 GÇé GÇé[bool-ee] Show IPA noun, plural -lies, verb, -lied, -ly-+ing, adjective, interjection
noun 1. a blustering, quarrelsome, overbearing person who habitually badgers and intimidates smaller or weaker people.
So a Cyber Bully is someone who uses a computer to badger or INTIMIDATE smaller or weaker people. Miners cant fight back, and people whose real lives SUCK SO MUCH that they might end their own lives are weaker. So that pretty much sounds right to me. If you feel badgered or intimidated by the actions of some random idiot residing on the other side of the planet, you should grow some balls. No, really.. Grow some balls. Or quit playing.. That's also an option. The difference between someone being bullied and someone getting **** in a computer-game is that essentially you can stop playing a game, so it's on your terms and in your power to decide weather or not to be a subject of it, while someone being bullied does not have any way of escaping the degrading actions of others. An example of this is humiliating pictures on facebook. ConXtionS wrote:Finally, you goons try to act as if your mittens made one small mistake. IT WASNT!
He made all those slides, sent in a prepared speech to be looked over by ccp where he said "If you are a miner we WANT YOU TO KILL YOURSELF bla bla bla"
Here are the facts, not everyone who plays this game is healthy, not everyone is here for YOUR entertainment, and if you catch the right person at the right moment your "GO KILL YOURSELF" bullcrap just might send someone over the edge. An edge that your actions pushed them over... Oh come on!! If you are trying to decide whether or not to end your life, do you really think it comes down to what some random person said to you in a ******* computer game? Do you have any idea how stupid that sounds? I'm not defending Mittoni's actions, because joking about suicide is not acceptable in most social situations. Mittoni should have realized that this guy was in an awful situation in his life and thus there are no reason to knock them down even further, but going as far as saying Mittoni might have been the cause of a person killing himself is just ******* ********. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient Electus Matari
235
|
Posted - 2012.04.08 19:22:00 -
[1483] - Quote
^ Without intending this as on a comment on The Mittani's case, has it occurred to you that people who contemplate ending their lives might not be in a state where they are very good at rational thought? Such things are usually decided in a mental, emotional state where things feel irrationally hopeless, and where you are under the illusion that everyone and everything is against you. Adding to such feelings by behaving in a way that seems to confirm the feelings can really matter, even though similar behavior would at worst merely annoy someone who is not at the brink already. |
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.08 21:02:00 -
[1484] - Quote
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:^ Without intending this as on a comment on The Mittani's case, has it occurred to you that people who contemplate ending their lives might not be in a state where they are very good at rational thought? Such things are usually decided in a mental, emotional state where things feel irrationally hopeless, and where you are under the illusion that everyone and everything is against you. Adding to such feelings by behaving in a way that seems to confirm the feelings can really matter, even though similar behavior would at worst merely annoy someone who is not at the brink already. Yes, but this person did not indicate that he wanted to take his own life, thus Mittani's comment were nothing but a bad joke presented at the wrong location. I'm pretty sure Mittani would not make this joke if the victim was standing on a chair in front of him with a rope around his neck. If we all were to tiptoe around each other in fear of making a joke with a subject which someone might be related to, humor would pretty much be dead. What is essential in this case is that a drunk person was standing on a stage wearing a ******* wizard-hat, so I would claim it to be pretty obvious that everything coming out of said person's mouth should be taken with a grain of salt. Mittani made a mistake, we all do, but that does not necessary make him an evil person with intent of inflict pain, chaos and misery upon everyone around him.
Also, what baffles me is that several people are referring to his conversation before the presentation as something that strengthens the case of his "conviction". If anything, this conversation proves the absolute opposite. It proves that his joke was not particularly directed at the victim in order to make him kill himself, but more like a declaration of his IN-GAME enemies. |
NekoKitten
Neko Industry 'n' PvE
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.10 18:33:00 -
[1485] - Quote
Sweet Goon Tears
|
T-B0NE
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.11 04:17:00 -
[1486] - Quote
NekoKitten wrote:Sweet Goon Tears I love the tastes of goon tears, they taste like cherry karma, please keep those tears coming goonies, they're soooo addictive.
"People pay for what they do, and still more, for what they have allowed themselves to become. And they pay for it simply: by the lives they lead." - Edith Wharton |
T-B0NE
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.11 05:15:00 -
[1487] - Quote
Oh and four quick questions if I may...
1. When is Jita supposed to burn? 2. Will I be able to order it on pay per view in Metro? 3. How will doing something pretty much everyone has wished they could do themselves punish CCP for banning your megalomaniac leader? 4. Will Goonswarm have enough players left to pull this off after so many have apparently emorage quit? |
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
304
|
Posted - 2012.04.11 08:13:00 -
[1488] - Quote
T-B0NE wrote:Oh and four quick questions if I may...
1. When is Jita supposed to burn? 2. Will I be able to order it on pay per view in Metro? 3. How will doing something pretty much everyone has wished they could do themselves punish CCP for banning your megalomaniac leader? 4. Will Goonswarm have enough players left to pull this off after so many have apparently emorage quit?
1. Even idiots can count. 2. No. 3. Imagine all the whining from thousands of high-sec bears all barred from hauling/trading. Tears, galore! 4. So now you're suddenly good at math? Somehow I doubt it. See also: Tenal. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
Psichotic
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
6
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 05:14:00 -
[1489] - Quote
In regards to the incident of prevailing discussion, CCP absolutely made the right decision. I applaud their actions. It is both wrong and illegal to incite someone to kill themselves. In fact, I would go further to say that they should make themselves aware of the extent of the problem. I am not an attorney and all statements I make herein are to be regarded as my personal opinion, but if I were their attorney I would advise them to include the specific language "cyberbullying" and "encouraging self-harm or harm to others" in their TOS. They should also, IMO, include language to the effect that violation of the Hate Crimes Prevention Act is also a violation of the TOS. This would help cover them should someone who is mentally ill harm themselves, although I would imagine proactive measures would be the best assurance of limitation of liability.
When people are online they tend to forget they live under the rule of law. As it pertains to the encouragement of suicide, United States case law has generally treated it as mala in se. In Burnett v. People (Ill.) 68 N. E. 505, 66 L. R. A. 304, 98 Am. St. Rep. 206 GÇô a case of a suicide pact GÇô the court held that the accomplice was in fact a principal in the offense, and that it was in and of itself, a natural crime to encourage another to commit the act of suicide. According to the legal precedent I was able to dig up in ~5min if you are an adult and incite someone to kill themselves you could be adjudicated guilty of murder.
If you are a minor such an incident might be covered under cyberbullying legislation, if you're lucky and don't get charged as an adult. In the U.S. cyberbullying is an illegal activity. All 50 states have cyberbullying laws. In most states it is a misdemeanor. A couple states, like Missouri, have upgraded it to a felony.
The fact is, if you take things too far and someone does hurt themselves, there will probably be media attention. In that case you will be judged first in the court of public opinion, and then in a court of law. You will find that while the people you have surrounded yourself with may not see anything wrong with your behavior the society you live in will not tolerate cyberbullying and certainly not incitement to commit suicide. These laws are the will of not 10,000 gamers, but hundreds of millions of citizens. Whether it is covered as part of the agreement you have made with the game owners is irrelevant.
Like it or not, agree with it or don't, but follow it or risk it. The consequences for the intentional or accidental serious injury or death of a person will be followed by actions against you by law enforcement. If your own conscious is not enough to prevent you from being a shmuck or you don't understand why it is considered wrong to be a shmuck, you would do yourself a favor by remembering that everything you do online is recorded.
|
Darth Gustav
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
332
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 18:21:00 -
[1490] - Quote
Psichotic wrote:In regards to the incident of prevailing discussion, CCP absolutely made the right decision. I applaud their actions. It is both wrong and illegal to incite someone to kill themselves. In fact, I would go further to say that they should make themselves aware of the extent of the problem. I am not an attorney and all statements I make herein are to be regarded as my personal opinion, but if I were their attorney I would advise them to include the specific language "cyberbullying" and "encouraging self-harm or harm to others" in their TOS. They should also, IMO, include language to the effect that violation of the Hate Crimes Prevention Act is also a violation of the TOS. This would help cover them should someone who is mentally ill harm themselves, although I would imagine proactive measures would be the best assurance of limitation of liability.
When people are online they tend to forget they live under the rule of law. As it pertains to the encouragement of suicide, United States case law has generally treated it as mala in se. In Burnett v. People (Ill.) 68 N. E. 505, 66 L. R. A. 304, 98 Am. St. Rep. 206 GÇô a case of a suicide pact GÇô the court held that the accomplice was in fact a principal in the offense, and that it was in and of itself, a natural crime to encourage another to commit the act of suicide. According to the legal precedent I was able to dig up in ~5min if you are an adult and incite someone to kill themselves you could be adjudicated guilty of murder.
If you are a minor such an incident might be covered under cyberbullying legislation, if you're lucky and don't get charged as an adult. In the U.S. cyberbullying is an illegal activity. All 50 states have cyberbullying laws. In most states it is a misdemeanor. A couple states, like Missouri, have upgraded it to a felony.
The fact is, if you take things too far and someone does hurt themselves, there will probably be media attention. In that case you will be judged first in the court of public opinion, and then in a court of law. You will find that while the people you have surrounded yourself with may not see anything wrong with your behavior the society you live in will not tolerate cyberbullying and certainly not incitement to commit suicide. These laws are the will of not 10,000 gamers, but hundreds of millions of citizens. Whether it is covered as part of the agreement you have made with the game owners is irrelevant.
Like it or not, agree with it or don't, but follow it or risk it. The consequences for the intentional or accidental serious injury or death of a person will be followed by actions against you by law enforcement. If your own conscious is not enough to prevent you from being a shmuck or you don't understand why it is considered wrong to be a shmuck, you would do yourself a favor by remembering that everything you do online is recorded.
Heavy ****. This really underscores CCP's culpability and liability for broadcasting it live via stream with no delay, for profit no less, doesn't it?
Seriously heavy ****. I had no idea CCP could get into so much trouble for broadcasting that **** live (and therefore tacitly assuming responsibility for their for-profit "content," such as it was).
Seriously. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
|
Adoniah Carrefour
the Whatley Brothers
11
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 21:53:00 -
[1491] - Quote
Its not an invalidation of a election to remove someone for violating terms of agreement anyways. CCP provided drinks cuz they are cool, the Mittani said stupid crap because he can't hold his liquor. During a live broadcast. During a pivotal year in the development of the company. The inherent cruelty of Eve remains intact .. the **** got a time out for pete's sake and gave up the chair his own self.
Learn how to hold your booze. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
417
|
Posted - 2012.04.15 17:04:00 -
[1492] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:Heavy ****. This really underscores CCP's culpability and liability for broadcasting it live via stream with no delay, for profit no less, doesn't it?
Seriously heavy ****. I had no idea CCP could get into so much trouble for broadcasting that **** live (and therefore tacitly assuming responsibility for their for-profit "content," such as it was).
Seriously. Oh yeah, they were selling those HD streams, weren't they?
Didn't get one, but I heard they were buggy or something like that?
Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes
Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY |
Demosthenes O'Connor
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.16 05:16:00 -
[1493] - Quote
Obvious solution is obvious:
It's not that I want CCP to lose business but as a consumer it seems clear that if CCP is not providing a service for which the 10,058 wish to pay, the 10,058 should consider closing their accounts and finding another game.
Otherwise the 10,058 need to htfu.
Edit: Repetitive. |
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor Federal Consensus Outreach
798
|
Posted - 2012.04.22 00:10:00 -
[1494] - Quote
I am utterly astounded by the Goon sense of entitlement in this thread. Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Animated Corporate Logos |
Mather Odile
The spice MUST flow
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 09:17:00 -
[1495] - Quote
As far as I see the matter at hand, CCP and Mittani reacted both in a sensible way, assuming, that the chain of events was as it was later stated. What was being said by the Mittani is an clearly unaccepteble public call to force someone into harming himself in reallife. Yes, it was a bad idea to give sensible informations about his real identity in the ingame bio. And yes, it might help future matters to clarify the TOS for such events as the fanfest. The fact that he was drunk (upon which he shouldn't have been allowed to speak officially as a CSM member), was taken into account by not banning him from future CSMs. Thus a wellrounded decission was taken by both sides. Those crying out about this, state that they perceive the RL wellbeing of other people of no importance to them. While EVE is perceived as an harsh universe, contrasting most other mmos out there, which I find to be refreshing, the line has to be drawn when it comes to potential RL consequences. Given the publicness of the incident and the prominence of the actor, CCP had no choice but to step in. Wether or not the votes he received are worthless now, lies in the hands of the other CSM members. |
Kusum Fawn
State War Academy Caldari State
26
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 22:40:00 -
[1496] - Quote
considering that far less will get your account perma-banned from the game, the fact that Mittens is allowed back in is something that is interesting. |
Hakaru Ishiwara
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
115
|
Posted - 2012.04.27 03:37:00 -
[1497] - Quote
Kusum Fawn wrote:considering that far less will get your account perma-banned from the game, the fact that Mittens is allowed back in is something that is interesting. Goon subscriptions.
284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284 Characters 284286 |
Kusum Fawn
State War Academy Caldari State
27
|
Posted - 2012.04.27 05:02:00 -
[1498] - Quote
EVE Online TERMS OF SERVICE
1.You may not abuse, harass or threaten another player or authorized representative of CCP, including customer service personnel and volunteers. This includes, but is not limited to: petitioning with false information in an attempt to gain from it or have someone else suffer from it; sending excessive e-mails, EVE-mails or petitions; obstructing CCP Employees from doing their jobs; refusal to follow the instructions of a CCP Employee; or implying favoritism by a CCP Employee.
2.You may not use any abusive, defamatory, ethnically or racially offensive, harassing, harmful, hateful, obscene, offensive, sexually explicit, threatening or vulgar language. (Alternate spelling or partial masking of such words will be reprimanded in the same manner as the actual use of such words.)
4.You may not use GÇ£role-playingGÇ¥ as an excuse to violate these rules. While EVE Online is a persistent world, fantasy role-playing game, the claim of role-playing is not an acceptable defense for anti-social behavior. Role-playing is encouraged, but not at the expense of other player. You may not create or participate in a corporation or group that habitually violates this policy.
16. You may not do anything that interferes with the ability of other EVE Online subscribers to enjoy the game or web site in accordance with its rules. This includes, but is not limited to, making inappropriate use of any public channels within the game and/or intentionally creating excessive latency (lag) by dumping cargo containers, corpses or other items in the game world.
19. You may not communicate, post or publicize any subscriberGÇÖs personal information within the EVE Online game world or website.
EULA 6.5 You may not submit any content to any chat room or other public forum within the Game that is harassing, abusive, threatening, harmful, obscene, libelous or defamatory, encourages conduct that could constitute a criminal offense or give rise to civil liabilities, or is unlawful in any other way, including without limitation the submission of content that infringes on a third-partyGÇÖs intellectual property rights.
1 month ban? seems legit
|
xCabalx
Eve Engineering Finance Eve Engineering
3
|
Posted - 2012.05.13 04:24:00 -
[1499] - Quote
A 30-day ban is nothing compared to what he pulled off against that guy. Good lord was this weak... |
nat longshot
New Eden Inc.
25
|
Posted - 2012.06.02 10:51:00 -
[1500] - Quote
He should be happy he was not permaban like alot are calling for.
If he had done that in the state he be in handcuff. hes voters are S.O.L CSM chair's are voted on and filled by players but are only there at the will of ccp rember that in the end ccp hold all the card when it comes to csm chair and if they wanted to deside to disban csm and we wont have any csm. so stop your crying move on. |
|
Tiger Would
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
227
|
Posted - 2012.06.05 20:17:00 -
[1501] - Quote
heh
Took a break for a bit, just after the election...
Come back, and find mittens has flushed over 10k votes down the toilet, or actually gs as a whole flushed the votes.
Good stuff, maybe next time these people will vote for a more mature candidate.
Anyone want to put the D back into Democracy already? (You know who to vote for next year) Once you think you have it all, you-áhave actually become-áignorant towards everything else.
T. Would |
Trollin
72
|
Posted - 2012.06.09 19:27:00 -
[1502] - Quote
kugu didnt get the option of a 30 day ban, an all he did was spill a name amirite?
ccp didnt throw the votes away, mittens did.
next time split your votes ffs, do u never watch survivor? you could have easy 4-5 seats on the csm if you had a brain between the lot of you
bottom 5 winner totals
1282 1533 1561 2284 2289 =8949 You are your own worst enemy. |
Shefus
StarFleet Enterprises Red Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2012.06.20 19:40:00 -
[1503] - Quote
KONY 2012 |
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