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REmove ECM from game

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
maralt Minmatar The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.12.17 13:34:00 - [121] Originally by: Tais It takes 2 minutes even less to to set snipers \ falcons at sniping point. Even without fast intys. So if you dictate where the battle takes place they either lose the use of all falcons/snipers for 2 mins as he sets up or he tries to fight in close and gets melted in seconds.
Tais Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.17 13:42:00 - [122] Originally by: maralt Originally by: Tais It takes 2 minutes even less to to set snipers \ falcons at sniping point. Even without fast intys. So if you dictate where the battle takes place they either lose the use of all falcons/snipers for 2 mins as he sets up or he tries to fight in close and gets melted in seconds. Mostly yes. And most of fleet battle are long range. But it's quite hard to force a fleet to go in a point you want them to be.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. The Firm.	Posted - 2008.12.17 14:06:00 - [123] Originally by: Tais Edited by: Tais on 17/12/2008 12:21:47 Originally by: TimMc Honestly, ECM is a very frustrating form of electronic warfare because you cannot do much in battle. But what would you replace it with? For a start remove falcons ECM Optimal range and give him Missile damage bonus. As all Force recons have. And an extra missile point, and better speed, and a drone bay, like the other Force recons have. Oh and a nifty secondary EW bonus too. Don't forget that. You know, those extremely powerful abilities that give the other Recons a reason to engage at closer range.
Tais Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.17 14:38:00 - [124] Originally by: Malcanis And an extra missile point Yes Quote: and better speed, No Falcon is abit slower, but more agile Quote: and a drone bay, like the other Force recons have. Maybe Quote: Oh and a nifty secondary EW bonus too. Don't forget that. You know, those extremely powerful abilities that give the other Recons a reason to engage at closer range. No. Powerfull ECM is good enough for a mid-range combat.null
Unforgivin Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.17 14:46:00 - [125] Maybe people should start using remote eccm and have a dedicated anti falcon ship in there gangs. For me i wish we could place ECCM projectors in the high slot :) like with remote reps, but then again jamming from over 200k is a bit harsh. I fly falcon so i dont give a toss either way.
shamai	Posted - 2008.12.17 15:04:00 - [126] Originally by: KingBobs Dawn question:wich module can -disrupt all your turrets to 100% -defend all your missiles -disrupt your remote repair -makes free of warp scrambles and disruptors -makes free of stasis webb -disable attack-orders for drones -disable the EW from your target -more then one can be used at one target without an drawback -all this in an save range of 100km and more out side from the battle ? Right the ECM-****-off module Question which module? -is not 100% effective -is fitted to paperthin ships -can be countered with a small amount of intelligence
DMF KingBob	Posted - 2008.12.17 15:54:00 - [127] Originally by: shamai Originally by: KingBobs Dawn question:wich module can -disrupt all your turrets to 100% -defend all your missiles -disrupt your remote repair -makes free of warp scrambles and disruptors -makes free of stasis webb -disable attack-orders for drones -disable the EW from your target -more then one can be used at one target without an drawback -all this in an save range of 100km and more out side from the battle ? Right the ECM-****-off module Question which module? -is not 100% effective -is fitted to paperthin ships -can be countered with a small amount of intelligence maybe an weapon disruptor ?
Master Akira Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.12.17 16:25:00 - [128] Originally by: Haakelen Originally by: PeachesAndCream Have you tried not sucking? That usually fixes it.
maralt Minmatar The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.12.17 16:32:00 - [129] Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -disrupt all your turrets to 100% Disrupting turrets to ineffectiveness is no different to breaking a lock with ecm, both make turrets worthless. Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -defend all your missiles FOF. Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -disrupt your remote repair RR drones. Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -makes free of warp scrambles and disruptors bubbles. Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -makes free of stasis webb web drones Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -disable attack-orders for drones Wrong, your assigned drones will continue to attack the target you set them on, they also auto aggro. Originally by: KingBobs Dawn -disable the EW from your target ew drones.
shamai	Posted - 2008.12.17 16:35:00 - [130] Originally by: DMF KingBob Originally by: shamai Originally by: KingBobs Dawn question:wich module can -disrupt all your turrets to 100% -defend all your missiles -disrupt your remote repair -makes free of warp scrambles and disruptors -makes free of stasis webb -disable attack-orders for drones -disable the EW from your target -more then one can be used at one target without an drawback -all this in an save range of 100km and more out side from the battle ? Right the ECM-****-off module Question which module? -is not 100% effective -is fitted to paperthin ships -can be countered with a small amount of intelligence maybe an weapon disruptor ? Eek, better nerf them as well, or infact any module that I dont use that prevents me using mine...thats about what this post boils down to.

SiJira	Posted - 2008.12.17 16:57:00 - [131] right because someone with 2 million sp and another person with 5 million sp killed your 50 million sp character with ships worth 10 times less you have to face it that you just arent very good at this game Trashed sig, Shark was here
Glach Duwat	Posted - 2008.12.17 17:07:00 - [132] ECM is a good thing for the Game. It allows smaller Gangs to engage larger ones. Up to a certain scale. In a game were often times Numbers is everything, it's refreshing to have an alternative. On the other hand, it is terrifyingly effective. Being able to jam from Sniper battleship range is just absurd. I am not sure how to balance if, if it's scripts or what. Maybe just making their cycle time obscenely long would help. So that they can't 'permanently' jam you. It's tough, because I like it when ECM is on my side, and hate it when it's not. But then Again, I am Matari and we have **** for sensor strength. Not sure how to fix it, but what I will say is, ECM pilots are the biggest sissies in the game. If you even look sideways at them for a moment they start to turn tail and flee. The easiest way to nullify a falcon is to get drones on him at all cost. I don't care if that means bringing an drone boat built for range, or an Ishkur with an MWD. Blackbirds and Falcons are weak ships. So if you touch them they book it the hell away.
Cassius Longinus Stimulus Rote Kapelle	Posted - 2008.12.17 19:37:00 - [133] Falcon is amazingly effective if you are fighting in your own bookmarked space. Still, it's all Caldari have for effective small-gang PVP just now. Regardless of whether the Falcons jamming strength bonus gets reduced, I would like to see other races recons slightly boosted.
DMF KingBob	Posted - 2008.12.19 12:10:00 - [134] Originally by: Cassius Longinus Falcon is amazingly effective if you are fighting in your own bookmarked space. Still, it's all Caldari have for effective small-gang PVP just now. Regardless of whether the Falcons jamming strength bonus gets reduced, I would like to see other races recons slightly boosted. sennsless becouse the other races have no player-jammers
Zhula Guixgrixks Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations Vanguard.	Posted - 2008.12.19 13:02:00 - [135] Edited by: Zhula Guixgrixks on 19/12/2008 13:02:44 Originally by: Cassius Longinus Falcon is amazingly effective if you are fighting in your own bookmarked space. Still, it's all Caldari have for effective small-gang PVP just now. Thats true, bookmarks mean you can choose terms of fight. If people fights on their terms and somebody decide to take up the glove..well he deserves to die. Originally by: DMF KingBob sennsless becouse the other races have no player-jammers So you propose same EW for all races ?? It sounds well in terms of uniformity and boredom.
Darwin's Market	Posted - 2008.12.19 13:32:00 - [136] I used to have a Falcon alt and life was great, but I got rid of him because I knew it was wrong. Stop the madness. ECM jam range should be less than 40km.
BiggestT Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works	Posted - 2008.12.19 16:08:00 - [137] Originally by: DMF KingBob it sucks to lose every fight through **ing ecm its comming from 100 km out side of the battle and makes my 2 year close to 50 mil sp char 100% senseless every time it is able in this ing game(where i pay time and money for) to make an fight in low sec without being perma jammed by an **ing alt char or so ????? Before screaming like a shcool girl about how u got ganked, at leas tbe constructive. CCP cant just remove ECM, that means caldari have no recon ewar lol. Instead suggest a different ewar to use instead of ecm, damn id be keen to try it (ecm gets old fast). EVE history t2 precisions
SSgt Sniper Gallente MAIDS	Posted - 2008.12.19 16:48:00 - [138] Originally by: DMF KingBob Pyramid quoting is removed.Applebabe and when the cycle ends/begins the next..... edit Then they do not disable attack orders they just stop you from making new ones during the jam cycle. LOL u talk bull** **ed poaster is ****ed. Drones will continue to auto aggro anything attacking you WITHIN YOUR DRONE CONTROL RANGE while you are jammed. True story. ------- CEO of Maids. No I didn't pick the name. I've grown rather fond of it though.Poor PR in progress!
Tarron Sarek Gallente Biotronics Inc. Alternative Realities	Posted - 2008.12.19 17:01:00 - [139] Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 19/12/2008 17:01:47 No need to remove ECM. It just needs to be made more work intensive, or dangerous, so you can't easily operate an ECM ship on a second account while PvP'ing on the first. Using Falcon-alts is just too easy at the moment. ___________________________________ Balance is power, ~~guard~~ hide it well "Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam"
fllow	Posted - 2008.12.19 19:03:00 - [140] my god. stop moaning and bring a god damn cerb to the fight that has a falcon in. if you dont have a pilot that can fly a cerb then your corp is doing it wrong.

VoiceInTheDesert Gallente Diplomatic Disruption	Posted - 2008.12.19 19:07:00 - [141] I hate falcons and want them nerfed to be in line with other recons. But taking out ecm would be stupid. I hope this is a troll.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.12.19 19:30:00 - [142] This whole chain of arguments and counter arguments remind me terribly of the nanonerf 'discussions'. In the end ludicrous speed got the nerfbat. It's only a matter of time. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Drogher Forerunner	Posted - 2008.12.19 20:06:00 - [143] I find it funny that the falcon is just better than the rook. At least i have never seen a rook being used over a falcon, so maybe something there could be changed. Get rid of ECM? that is a stupid idea for about 100 reasons. Defence against ECM? well ECCM is very effective against it but you do have to make a sacrifice to use it. But if you know you are going to fight ECM then its not a sacrifice. I would like to see another kind of defence against ecm, i dont know what or how they could do it but it would be nice as it does nullify everything a ship can do with regards to locking a target. However ECCM works very very well and odds are if you are on your own in a fight and you are getting jammed, then thats probably because you are fighting more than one person (one of them in a falcon), in which case why shouldnt the larger group have the advantage. ECCM can make that other person almost usless. In fact a well kitted ship with enough ECCM can make 10 falcons almost usless.
Akiba Penrose	Posted - 2008.12.19 21:15:00 - [144] Originally by: Drogher Forerunner In fact a well kitted ship with enough ECCM can make 10 falcons almost usless. Could you please post such a setup?
Drogher Forerunner	Posted - 2008.12.20 02:44:00 - [145] Originally by: Akiba Penrose Originally by: Drogher Forerunner In fact a well kitted ship with enough ECCM can make 10 falcons almost usless. Could you please post such a setup? Well having one or two eccms on board make a huge difference. A Guardian with 2 eccms gives a max skilled falcon pilot witha T2 racial jammer (not thinking of other modules at the moment) a 1 in 7 chance of landing a jam, even wasp ecm drones would have something like a 1 in 34 chance of landing a jam. so there could be 10 falcons trying to jam you but their chance is still a 1 in 7 chance in jamming you. They would have to be very lucky to permer jam you. With a bit of brain power and tactics, its not hard to build ships to counter jamming. Or at least on a 1 vs 2 basis, counter the jamming enough to try and kill the falcon or the other guy. With projected ECCM (if you have friends) you can really counter jamming very well. If you want to build an uber ship that is immune to jamming, then you cant. But you can hold off jamming pretty well on your own to try and get a job done. But to counter ecm you will have to sacrifice a slot to do it. The part i dont like is that a tracking computer can help counter a tracking disrupter, but if it is not countering anything it boosts your tracking to above normal. Which makes the slot useful if there is tracking disruption. The same goes for a Sensor booster. But the ECCM will counter against ECM by reducing its chance to land on you. But if there is not ECM around, it becomes a wasted slot. I suppose the upside of the module is that it doesnt use scripts, but that is not a big enough bonus.
TZeer BURN EDEN	Posted - 2008.12.20 05:43:00 - [146] There are two reasons we are having this discussion now. 1: Damps got nerfed HARD!! Without even looking at the bonuses on the respective ships who are using them. 2: Falcon's ECM power got boosted to to same as the rooks, to follow the design from the other races recons. Sort these 2 out first before you all go ragequit, slit wrist whatever...
Azrael Dinn 19th Star Logistics	Posted - 2008.12.20 09:31:00 - [147] Use the backups. This works fine while I hate it also when someone jams me and I loose a ship but when I have backups on and make a kill it's so worth it - Azrael -
Zhula Guixgrixks Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations Vanguard.	Posted - 2008.12.20 10:36:00 - [148] Originally by: Drogher Forerunner But if there is not ECM around, it becomes a wasted slot. If there is no explosive dmg around, explosive hardener becomes a wasted slot.
4THELULZ	Posted - 2008.12.20 11:09:00 - [149] Originally by: DMF KingBob it sucks to lose every fight through **ing ecm its comming from 100 km out side of the battle and makes my 2 year close to 50 mil sp char 100% senseless every time it is able in this ing game(where i pay time and money for) to make an fight in low sec without being perma jammed by an **ing alt char or so ????? Almost unreadable - check Lost several IQ points TRYING to read it - check Screaming for removal of X thing that killed him - check Offering no constructive solution - check Offering no constructive ANYTHING - check "I have X skill points" e-peen waving - check RAGEQUIT - missing, for now. Conclusions: If this isn't a troll, my already crushed hope in humanity takes another beating.
DMF KingBob	Posted - 2008.12.20 12:21:00 - [150] last night the same chase the main with an hyperion and the alt with an falcon at 100km i fitted an eccm and heated it but it was sennsless the hyperion escaped the ecm of the falcon turned all my offensive modules instandly it to idle my turrets stopped with firing (that better then alls neutralizer and turret disruptor can do!!!!) and my warp disruptor and webber turned off question:for what does the other ew exist when an ecm can do it all at once at the same time with more range then a neut on an curse/pilgrim or an webber from an huginn or rapier or an warp disruptor(t2) from an arazu??? its simple time to accept the fact that ecm with 20sec/cycle is overpowered



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