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To those who would support slavers in Catch

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Xennith Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 17:24:00 - [241] we do not work with slavers, the idea is anathema to us. if you have intel about one of our allies being a slaver, please present it to us through diplomatic channels.
Aurevoir Connard	Posted - 2009.01.28 17:43:00 - [242] Edited by: Aurevoir Connard on 28/01/2009 17:49:55 Edited by: Aurevoir Connard on 28/01/2009 17:48:55 Please see the Firm, -A-, AAA citizens, BoB. I have not once ever heard them denounce slavery on the contrary they have members who proudly hold slaves. Please do not turn a blind eye to this, and act innocent. You know who you are allied with. You just choose to ignore and try to act noble. If i close my eyes it to it it cant be there. It is admitted in this thread that you choose to ignore the fact that -A- is not anti slavery with your twisted logic of we are fighting the same bad people so we will ignore it crap. edited to add quotes "or as you said they do not care. Which last I checked was SSI's response. If -A- truly does not care then that must mean they harbor slavers as well therefore how can you ally yourself with them. It would be interesting to hear and official -A- Statement on this, and your reaction if they do not condemn slavery and all of those that hold slaves. Il morte wrote O'thief response Report -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, actions do speak louder than words, and I personally take great comfort from the actions of -A- in relation to the Providence slavers. The mass slaughter of the Providence holders conventional and capital class vessels, whilst not specifically labelled as 'anti-slaver' does have that effect, by virtue of the choice of target. The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Sounds like an admission to knowledge of this to me.
Maggot Minmatar Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 17:44:00 - [243] Originally by: Il Morte To UK I say this, You have been honorable as long as far as I can remember. You were criticized for the use of of mercanaries dusring your quarrel with CVA but that was survival and can be understood. We have only used mercenaries once in our entire existence, in the first battle of 9UY against the pirate invasion led by The Establishment. ISS contracted MC and we paid our share. I have no idea what this comment is about working with slavers is. Please forward me the details.
Xennith Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 18:01:00 - [244] well, you dont have to be actively fighting slavers to be our allies. but if you are a slaver yourself, we will never ever have friendly relations with you, until you renounce slavery. those entities you list, none are actively involved in slavery, or supporting slavers. SSI really are, see the constant repetitions of the reasons they are considered hostile for evidence. if you have actual proof of any of our allies being involved with slavery, or supporting slavers, please do forward it to our diplomats. public is not the place to do that.
Becq Starforged Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 18:33:00 - [245] First we are dismissed as pirates for opposing those who aid and support the single largest pod-pilot proponent for slavery in the cluster. Then we are accused of not being freedom fighters for not randomly attacking everyone in the cluster who has yet to make a statement opposing slavery. Is the universe insane? The statement is symbolic. It's actions that matter. SSI made themselves a target by working with the Providence Slaver Regime. When they claimed innocence by way of ignorance, we explained the struggle and offered them a chance to sever ties with the slavers and prove they had done so, but they refused. Several times. I'm not entirely sure why -A- keeps being brought up in this discussion, since the part they have played in this war has been minimal. No doubt they can speak for themselves about their policies should they choose to do so, however if -A- has members who engage in slavery; we are unaware of it. As an organization, they show no evidence of supporting slavery (which is similar to SSI), nor are they friends of slavery organizations (which is unlike SSI). Further, they have shown a willingness to strike against certain of our common enemies (which is also unlike SSI). Frankly, I'm surprised that there is so much confusion. Is it that uncommon for groups outside of our war for the freedom of our people to react negatively to third parties who aid their enemy?
Il Morte	Posted - 2009.01.28 19:47:00 - [246] Originally by: Maggot We have only used mercenaries once in our entire existence, in the first battle of 9UY against the pirate invasion led by The Establishment. ISS contracted MC and we paid our share. [/quote I appreciate your response Maggot and your true concern for the idea of you working with slavers. I would definatley be interesting to hear those that were accused of slavery to respond. However I must contradict your statement quoted above. You state that you only used mercanaries in defense of the first battle of 9UY. If that is so please explain why the rift between you and Sylph. For it is documented throughout these forums that you hired mercanaries that went into Sylph space and attacked their pilots. Whether they were sent or condoned by you can not be proven one way or the other for like everything else there is three sides to every story. The fact is though that mercs and pirates were brought in to help you that forced the hand of sylph, to choose a side. I have stayed neutral throughout this and I sympathize to those poor souls who are enslaved currently. However to re-arrange the past to suit your ideals of today or to prove your side is well just sad. I would expect that from a terrorist or an ammarrian priest not a true fighter for freedom.
O Thief The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 20:02:00 - [247] Il Morte, I think I know of the 'mercenaries' of which you speak in this instance, for it was my corporation, and we were not in U'K at the time. The truth of the matter, and this we publically admitted later, was that we (my corporation) faked a contract against Sylph and did not suggest U'K paid us (that was assumed, but it is totally incorrect). However, we were so delighted with the damage our two weeks of targetted carnage caused to Sylph, we made a public statement publishing some statistics, which gave it the feel of a 'contract'. But it was no such thing, it was our own desire to avenge U'K which led to these actions. But at the time, feeding that misinformation worked for us. Not once have U'K paid for our support - not whilst we were leading the ISSN in support of the first seige, or indeed the second time around against CVA. It was our choice to be brothers in arms and fight the decent fight. For freedom.
Maggot Minmatar Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 22:02:00 - [248] There is absolutely zero evidence that U'K have hired mercenaries other than the statement I made regarding MC. I am a man of my word. There is nothing documented, nothing recorded, not a transfer of a single ISK or item of value. We have never had any need to ever make such a contract. Just because you say it is historic truth does not make it so. Every single ally we had in the failed defence of 9UY was a volunteer who requested to assist. They came from all backgrounds, some from the republic, and some were our former enemies from the 1st Siege of 9UY. I still thank them for their valiant efforts. Your view of history is incorrect.
Cribb Minmatar Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.28 22:46:00 - [249] Edited by: Cribb on 28/01/2009 22:46:28 Originally by: Il Morte Look in the mirror warriors of freedom, or terrorists of the empire. Look closely and tell me who are you and who have you become and have you truly lost the way. To be honest, i'm quit dashing according to the Gallente Damsels i meet during R&R. And the Minnie girls often send me mail, they like the heroics i think.
Apoc Baltar Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 02:45:00 - [250] Edited by: Apoc Baltar on 29/01/2009 02:54:25 Originally by: Kelban Kevar Originally by: Conlin Originally by: Kelban Kevar i know your historys very well I say you dont !!! I say answer Il Morte , he was impartial from the start , but the more you ignore his simple recquests , the more foolish you are becoming . Even your friends are giving up on you . and to conlin please run away more from me i find it very funny please undock another Moros Kelban the isk we recieved off of your faction-issue shield reinforcement alone is funding the war effort greatly
No Homo Gallente THE INTERNET.	Posted - 2009.01.29 03:28:00 - [251] I put on my robe and wizard hat....
Kelban Kevar Gallente The Order of Black Knights SYSTEM SHOCK INITIATIVE	Posted - 2009.01.29 03:52:00 - [252] Originally by: Apoc Baltar Edited by: Apoc Baltar on 29/01/2009 02:54:25 Originally by: Kelban Kevar Originally by: Conlin Originally by: Kelban Kevar i know your historys very well I say you dont !!! I say answer Il Morte , he was impartial from the start , but the more you ignore his simple recquests , the more foolish you are becoming . Even your friends are giving up on you . and to conlin please run away more from me i find it very funny please undock another Moros Kelban the isk we recieved off of your faction-issue shield reinforcement alone is funding the war effort greatly well i could but then you'd just cry and call in another 63 ppl from aaa and few more from stain and and stuff to help kill it seeing how you couldnt do it with out um
Conlin Gallente Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 05:12:00 - [253] Run you say ?...... I constantly use what is left of your sovereignity to get where I wish to go , I easily evaded a Sylph & SSI attempt to blockade me last night . I challenge your bravado from within that station you have become so wholeheartedly attached to when I am in system . You wish to stop me Kelban ?. I have no need to call upon anybody to swat you out my way !!!!
O Thief The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 08:35:00 - [254] Originally by: Kelban Kevar well i could but then you'd just cry and call in another 63 ppl from aaa and few more from stain and and stuff to help kill it seeing how you couldnt do it with out um Only a few minutes before a U'K only gang (the same which had your Moros tackled) destroyed an SSI Thanatos. Your death was a certainty, we just invited -A- to join in the fun as they had a gang nearby and like big explosions. To suggest we would not have killed it otherwise is simply laughable. You were 20km off station without a hope.
zoolkhan Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 08:44:00 - [255] Edited by: zoolkhan on 29/01/2009 08:57:40 Originally by: Il Morte please explain why the rift between you and Sylph. I take the word here, because i was one of the main diplomats trying to avoid the rift for a long time in countless marathon conversations with drakmor of sylph - until i reached a point where i had to throw the towel. i make it simple - for the impatient, look out for the bold text. situation: UK was defending its outposts against the might of CVA and their rather significant allies at that time (at some point IAC and goons have appeared, however - irrelevant now) While traditional matari allies like EM turned away for their reasons - we were confronted with offers for help from unexpected sides. Some of them pirates whom we fought against. However, their help offeres were sincere, we knew they were battlehardened and we knew our choices were limited. The day came when we accepted their help - we have put the object of anti-slavery above beeing "anti-pirates" - previously we policed the are well for the parasites that became sylph and settled in our policed neigbourhood. now my point: our new allies blue to us - harassed sylph also blue to us. we refused to pick a side between our blues we told them they can deal with the problem and retaliate (unless they do it in front of our outpost) - we would not intervene. that was not enough for them. So i had convos popping up - filled with high demands from sylph alliance officials. Like we were supposed to defend them, and we were supposed to do this and that - note: sylph hasnt offered anything in return for us, their help against the invading forces we faced was not existant. They could not even break camps made of two shuttles armed with snowballs. (They have learned, and are not as bad as they were - that has to be said here) The diplomatic "negotiations" went nowhere - after many attempts, i... no.. we gave it up and ceased the talks. And focussed on the grave situation at hand rather than on rabble with an ally that could not even deal with their ,compared to ours, rather minor problems alone. But UK did not shoot them, or change their colour taht was Blue. We granted them their autonomy, and allowed them to defend against our other blue allies. (unlike CVA, we didnt view them as lesser beeings at that time) Sylph then went red overnight - well timed in a moment when we had already our hands full and were on the backfoot against the already mentioned powerful CVA+allies block. _THAT_ is the history of sylph - and why we view them as backstabbers. We also view them as lousy combattants, because back then they were whining moaning and unable to keep their house clean, hence they turned to someone who had the military class to do it -> CVA. the foul taste of backstabbing, whining, and incompetence remains until today may it be still justified or not. Would i personally reach a hand to sylph, and correct my picture i have in my mind since 2 years? Yes, i think i would. Sending mercs into their space is fabricated fantasytale - but it might have felt so to them, at some points in time. Only one who knows UK for longer, will realize that we deal with our enemies personally usually - even with those who are far above our shoesize. Sylph is not falling into that big shoesize category i am afraid.
O Thief The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 10:35:00 - [256] Regarding Sylph, it is only by the grace of U'K, and latterly CVA, that the alliance hold space at all. They are a weak, fractured alliance and despite their age show little combat skill or resolve. They are, by far, the weakest of the main space holding entities. I am absolutely certain that in a straight up fight between U'K and Sylph, that they would hold no space after a month or so (despite their larger size). It is only by the patience of others they hold any space at all.
Poreuomai Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:01:00 - [257] You know, after reading this IGS transmission, I understand what kind of person the SSI leader is.
Poreuomai Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.29 16:01:00 - [258] You know, after reading this IGS transmission, I understand what kind of person the SSI leader is.
Arnulf Ogunkoya Minmatar The Causality	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:04:00 - [259] Originally by: zoolkhan <snip> While traditional matari allies like EM turned away for their reasons - we were confronted with offers for help from unexpected sides. <snip> With respect Zoolkhan. The Electus did send a contingent to the second siege. I still have a cruiser parked up at Unity station, with a Khumaak in her hangar, waiting for the day when someone other than CVA is in residence. That said I can understand you accepting aid from your old enemies. It does seem ironic though that one of the pirate groups assisting you was the outfit that got Karishal Muritor disciplined. This would be for taking a detachment off station to chase them, back when he was still in the Fleet. Regards,
Marketalt989	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:54:00 - [260] Edited by: Marketalt989 on 30/01/2009 01:55:20
Predator989	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:55:00 - [261] Originally by: O Thief Originally by: Kelban Kevar well i could but then you'd just cry and call in another 63 ppl from aaa and few more from stain and and stuff to help kill it seeing how you couldnt do it with out um Only a few minutes before a U'K only gang (the same which had your Moros tackled) destroyed an SSI Thanatos. Your death was a certainty, we just invited -A- to join in the fun as they had a gang nearby and like big explosions. To suggest we would not have killed it otherwise is simply laughable. You were 20km off station without a hope. Talk is cheap, come play
Mae West Knives Nukes and Sharp Sticks Inc	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:56:00 - [262] Originally by: Predator989 Edited by: Predator989 on 30/01/2009 02:56:31 Talk is cheap UK, come play Edit: quoting the wrong person for the win I don't think you really want to do that.......
Tractus Vesica Caldari Atrum Flamma Order of the Black Dragons	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:19:00 - [263] We Caldari don't need slaves. We aren't weak ass Ammars, or whiny Minmatars. We work for ourselves and profiteer by your failures and misfortunes. ALL PRAISE THE STATE!
Predator989	Posted - 2009.01.30 06:24:00 - [264] Originally by: Mae West Originally by: Predator989 Edited by: Predator989 on 30/01/2009 02:56:31 Talk is cheap UK, come play Edit: quoting the wrong person for the win I don't think you really want to do that....... Eh, I'll be waiting
Xennith Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.30 08:13:00 - [265] who are you, which organisation do you belong to and where would we find you? your reputation hasnt spread so far that your name is recognisable.
Conlin Gallente Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.30 09:22:00 - [266] Originally by: Xennith who are you, which organisation do you belong to and where would we find you? your reputation hasnt spread so far that your name is recognisable. Just......... a sylph who rarely leaves his homeground . Nothing much to worry about Xennith .
O Thief The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.30 09:29:00 - [267] Originally by: Predator989 Originally by: Mae West Originally by: Predator989 Edited by: Predator989 on 30/01/2009 02:56:31 Talk is cheap UK, come play Edit: quoting the wrong person for the win I don't think you really want to do that....... Eh, I'll be waiting You're right, talk is cheap. So, announce to the Providence holders that you believe your alliance is stronger than the U'K. Inform them you do not need their assistance, and make that public for all to see. We shall then engage you in a full territorial war, with the goal of taking all your space (though not keeping it, we have not wish for that). We'll see how many stations you have left after 30 days. Remember - talk is cheap, so less posturing and more action to prove how much better than U'K your alliance is. We're waiting.
zoolkhan Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:46:00 - [268] Edited by: zoolkhan on 30/01/2009 10:46:09 Dont mistake this for arrogance. But i have just relieved the dreadnought crews from duty and sent them to well deserved holidays. Sylph will not agree to fight us w/o their muppeteers. Or let me put it this way, even if they wanted - the muppeteers would intervene on their own accord becaise they rather keep the buffer zone filled with people that are easy to manipulate and whom present no danger to anyone, than with u'k pilots who speerhead back into providence with an uncorruptable determination.
Mazzdreg	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:36:00 - [269] The only authorized posters for Sylph Alliance are Drakmor, Ktor, and Mazzdreg.
shanda captison The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.01.30 20:57:00 - [270] Originally by: Predator989 Originally by: Mae West Originally by: Predator989 Edited by: Predator989 on 30/01/2009 02:56:31 Talk is cheap UK, come play Edit: quoting the wrong person for the win I don't think you really want to do that....... Eh, I'll be waiting Over confident Sylph "fleet commander" spotted. Leading pointless so called roams around providence, where you chase after single hacs with 20 man blobs, killing nothing and achieving nothing does not make you any good. In fact it demonstates how terrible you really are. I cannot wait to school you in a fleet fight. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])

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