| Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 .. 18 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Dust Puppy
   |
Posted - 2004.12.09 19:56:00 -
[61]
 Originally by: Workdawg
thanks for your quick reply, when you say the multiplier is in effect at 30%, does that mean that below 30%, i will actually get faster recharge?
No you would get less recharge rate and furthermore the 2.4 multiplier is only in effect for infinitly small time so it is to be expected that you would experience a recharge a little bit less than that. I analytically proved to myself that the maximum recharge of the curve peaks at just over 29%.
Originally by: Workdawg
also, in follow up to my first post, would using a combonation of cap batteries and rechargers yield a potentially better figure as far as cap recharged per second? as opposed to just going with straight rechargers
Depends on your cap. If you have a large capacity but high recharge time you might be better off with using a recharger but for most cases it's better to use cap battery but that it is much harder to fit.
__________
Capacitor research |
Dust Puppy
|
Posted - 2004.12.09 19:56:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Workdawg
thanks for your quick reply, when you say the multiplier is in effect at 30%, does that mean that below 30%, i will actually get faster recharge?
No you would get less recharge rate and furthermore the 2.4 multiplier is only in effect for infinitly small time so it is to be expected that you would experience a recharge a little bit less than that. I analytically proved to myself that the maximum recharge of the curve peaks at just over 29%.
Originally by: Workdawg
also, in follow up to my first post, would using a combonation of cap batteries and rechargers yield a potentially better figure as far as cap recharged per second? as opposed to just going with straight rechargers
Depends on your cap. If you have a large capacity but high recharge time you might be better off with using a recharger but for most cases it's better to use cap battery but that it is much harder to fit.
__________
Capacitor research |
Ra'Ken
|
Posted - 2004.12.10 13:17:00 -
[63]
A large shield booster is 160 points over 4 seconds. So to compare you take yyyy in my case 43.2 and * by 4 = 172.8. Extra large shield boosters are over 5 seconds so to compare to that you would do yyy my case 43.2 b 5 = 215.
Didn't understand this part. Can see where *4 (or *5) comes from, but fail to see where 160 disappears. Could you elaborate a bit?
|
Ra'Ken
|
Posted - 2004.12.10 13:17:00 -
[64]
A large shield booster is 160 points over 4 seconds. So to compare you take yyyy in my case 43.2 and * by 4 = 172.8. Extra large shield boosters are over 5 seconds so to compare to that you would do yyy my case 43.2 b 5 = 215.
Didn't understand this part. Can see where *4 (or *5) comes from, but fail to see where 160 disappears. Could you elaborate a bit?
|
Dust Puppy
|
Posted - 2004.12.10 13:49:00 -
[65]
She's just saying how much she recharges over 4 and 5 seconds so she can compare with the large and extra large shield booster. So when large shield booster repairs 160 every 4 seconds her passive shield tank repairs 172 in for seconds. Similarly when X-large shield booster repairs 400 every 5 seconds the passive shield tanker repairs 215 ever 5 seconds.
Of course Pottsay ignores the fact that active shield tankers still have shield that recharges to 
__________
Capacitor research |
Dust Puppy
|
Posted - 2004.12.10 13:49:00 -
[66]
She's just saying how much she recharges over 4 and 5 seconds so she can compare with the large and extra large shield booster. So when large shield booster repairs 160 every 4 seconds her passive shield tank repairs 172 in for seconds. Similarly when X-large shield booster repairs 400 every 5 seconds the passive shield tanker repairs 215 ever 5 seconds.
Of course Pottsay ignores the fact that active shield tankers still have shield that recharges to
__________
Capacitor research |
DeFood
|
Posted - 2004.12.10 14:26:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Dust Puppy
She's just saying how much she recharges over 4 and 5 seconds so she can compare with the large and extra large shield booster. So when large shield booster repairs 160 every 4 seconds her passive shield tank repairs 172 in for seconds. Similarly when X-large shield booster repairs 400 every 5 seconds the passive shield tanker repairs 215 ever 5 seconds.
Of course Pottsay ignores the fact that active shield tankers still have shield that recharges to
Ah yes. By contrast an Apocylapse has 3975 shield with a recharge of 2000 sec. for a 1.99 shield per second average, or 4.77 peak per second regeneration, or an extra 23.85 shield hitpoints per 5 seconds. Not sure how the other battleships play out at base regen rates.
|
DeFood
|
Posted - 2004.12.10 14:26:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Dust Puppy
She's just saying how much she recharges over 4 and 5 seconds so she can compare with the large and extra large shield booster. So when large shield booster repairs 160 every 4 seconds her passive shield tank repairs 172 in for seconds. Similarly when X-large shield booster repairs 400 every 5 seconds the passive shield tanker repairs 215 ever 5 seconds.
Of course Pottsay ignores the fact that active shield tankers still have shield that recharges to
Ah yes. By contrast an Apocylapse has 3975 shield with a recharge of 2000 sec. for a 1.99 shield per second average, or 4.77 peak per second regeneration, or an extra 23.85 shield hitpoints per 5 seconds. Not sure how the other battleships play out at base regen rates.
|
Pottsey
|
Posted - 2004.12.16 18:04:00 -
[69]
Must have skills for passive shield tanking. The nice thing about passive tanking is the needed skills are all low rank so easy to train.
Rank 1 Engineering at least to level 3. I assume most people have this at level 5 anyway. ItÆs a must have skill for just about everyone.
Rank 1 Science at level 1. Needed before you can train up certain shield skills.
Rank 1 Shield Operation take to level 5, gives 5% shield recharge boost per level
Rank 3 Shield Management take to Level 5, gives 5% shield cap per level
Rank 2 Energy Grid upgrades at level 2 needed for PDUÆs and Shield relays.
Rank 2 leadership at Level 2 Only needed if you plan to use Escort Tactics.
Rank 2 Shield upgrades at lest level 3, 5% less power needs for shield extender and recharges. Needed at level 3 for Large shield extenders T2. Needed at Level 4 if you use T2 shield recharges.
Rank 2 Escort Tactics gives 2% extra shield cap per level when in a group. Very nice if you spend time in groups. If you solo then itÆs a waste of time.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Pottsey
|
Posted - 2004.12.16 18:04:00 -
[70]
Must have skills for passive shield tanking. The nice thing about passive tanking is the needed skills are all low rank so easy to train.
Rank 1 Engineering at least to level 3. I assume most people have this at level 5 anyway. ItÆs a must have skill for just about everyone.
Rank 1 Science at level 1. Needed before you can train up certain shield skills.
Rank 1 Shield Operation take to level 5, gives 5% shield recharge boost per level
Rank 3 Shield Management take to Level 5, gives 5% shield cap per level
Rank 2 Energy Grid upgrades at level 2 needed for PDUÆs and Shield relays.
Rank 2 leadership at Level 2 Only needed if you plan to use Escort Tactics.
Rank 2 Shield upgrades at lest level 3, 5% less power needs for shield extender and recharges. Needed at level 3 for Large shield extenders T2. Needed at Level 4 if you use T2 shield recharges.
Rank 2 Escort Tactics gives 2% extra shield cap per level when in a group. Very nice if you spend time in groups. If you solo then itÆs a waste of time.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Damien Vox
|
Posted - 2004.12.16 19:48:00 -
[71]
All those numbers confused me...
|
Damien Vox
|
Posted - 2004.12.16 19:48:00 -
[72]
All those numbers confused me...
|
Sun Sliver
|
Posted - 2004.12.18 01:46:00 -
[73]
friendly bump - I like this idea good to see new things being tried. props to Pottsey 
|
Sun Sliver
|
Posted - 2004.12.18 01:46:00 -
[74]
friendly bump - I like this idea good to see new things being tried. props to Pottsey
|
Jennifer Danz
|
Posted - 2004.12.18 10:19:00 -
[75]
I plan to Boostless Tank my Vagabond.
|
Jennifer Danz
|
Posted - 2004.12.18 10:19:00 -
[76]
I plan to Boostless Tank my Vagabond.
|
Narcissa
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 08:52:00 -
[77]
Edited by: Narcissa on 20/12/2004 09:29:30
Edited by: Narcissa on 20/12/2004 08:55:41
Edited by: Narcissa on 20/12/2004 08:54:08
Thank you Pottsey for sharing this idea.
I just picked up a Ferox at the weekend, as my Moa just doesn't cut it on L3 missions any more, and followed your guidelines for passive tanking. Most of my required skills are at 3 or 4, Engineering at 5 for grid. Around 1.5 mill SP in combat skills.
I took it out for about a dozen missions with a few close moments in dead space, but the shield held on every mission. Those times when the shield falls below 30% something needs to be done to decrease the incoming damage as the last part of the shield goes quickly.
Shield Cap 6336 over 311 secs giving a regen of 50.9/second
Ferox setup as follows:
Hi-
5*Heavy missile Launcher
2*Heavy Electron Blaster
Mid-
2*Large Shield Extender II
2*Shield Recharge I
1*10mw AB I
Low-
3*Shield Power Relay I
1*Power Diagnostic I
Lots of room for improvement there, now if I can only find some tech II rechargers and relays.
Narc
|
Narcissa
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 08:52:00 -
[78]
Edited by: Narcissa on 20/12/2004 09:29:30
Edited by: Narcissa on 20/12/2004 08:55:41
Edited by: Narcissa on 20/12/2004 08:54:08
Thank you Pottsey for sharing this idea.
I just picked up a Ferox at the weekend, as my Moa just doesn't cut it on L3 missions any more, and followed your guidelines for passive tanking. Most of my required skills are at 3 or 4, Engineering at 5 for grid. Around 1.5 mill SP in combat skills.
I took it out for about a dozen missions with a few close moments in dead space, but the shield held on every mission. Those times when the shield falls below 30% something needs to be done to decrease the incoming damage as the last part of the shield goes quickly.
Shield Cap 6336 over 311 secs giving a regen of 50.9/second
Ferox setup as follows:
Hi-
5*Heavy missile Launcher
2*Heavy Electron Blaster
Mid-
2*Large Shield Extender II
2*Shield Recharge I
1*10mw AB I
Low-
3*Shield Power Relay I
1*Power Diagnostic I
Lots of room for improvement there, now if I can only find some tech II rechargers and relays.
Narc
|
Pyr8
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 14:01:00 -
[79]
Best thread I have read in a long time...
I'm interested to see how a passive setup fairs while sentry tanking I don't quite think it will cut it tbh.. but will be fun finding out
|
Pyr8
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 14:01:00 -
[80]
Best thread I have read in a long time...
I'm interested to see how a passive setup fairs while sentry tanking I don't quite think it will cut it tbh.. but will be fun finding out
|
Damocles Ician
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 14:20:00 -
[81]
You can always get the following implant from agent missions:-
1 x Hardwiring - Zainou 'Gnome' KUA2000 (-5% shield upgrade module power needs)
-------------
|
Damocles Ician
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 14:20:00 -
[82]
You can always get the following implant from agent missions:-
1 x Hardwiring - Zainou 'Gnome' KUA2000 (-5% shield upgrade module power needs)
-------------
|
Pottsey
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 17:56:00 -
[83]
öFerox setup as follows:
Hi-
5*Heavy missile Launcher
2*Heavy Electron Blaster
Mid-
2*Large Shield Extender II
2*Shield Recharge I
1*10mw AB I
Low-
3*Shield Power Relay I
1*Power Diagnostic Iö
Nice setup but whatÆs the PDU for? Did you try swapping the PDU for another Shield relay?
As for the mid slots what about taking out 1 shield recharger for a EM or another passive hardener? Or instead of a hardener use a 3rd T2 large shield extender. If you do need the PDU for power I guess you can always swap it for a PDU T2.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Pottsey
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 17:56:00 -
[84]
öFerox setup as follows:
Hi-
5*Heavy missile Launcher
2*Heavy Electron Blaster
Mid-
2*Large Shield Extender II
2*Shield Recharge I
1*10mw AB I
Low-
3*Shield Power Relay I
1*Power Diagnostic Iö
Nice setup but whatÆs the PDU for? Did you try swapping the PDU for another Shield relay?
As for the mid slots what about taking out 1 shield recharger for a EM or another passive hardener? Or instead of a hardener use a 3rd T2 large shield extender. If you do need the PDU for power I guess you can always swap it for a PDU T2.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Pottsey
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 17:58:00 -
[85]
ôI'm interested to see how a passive setup fairs while sentry tanking I don't quite think it will cut it tbh.. but will be fun finding out ô
How much damage do sentry guns do per second? If its one damage type perhaps you could use 3 hardeners. I might try this on the test server if people want me to.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Pottsey
|
Posted - 2004.12.20 17:58:00 -
[86]
ôI'm interested to see how a passive setup fairs while sentry tanking I don't quite think it will cut it tbh.. but will be fun finding out ô
How much damage do sentry guns do per second? If its one damage type perhaps you could use 3 hardeners. I might try this on the test server if people want me to.
_________________________________________________
Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Cal Drago
|
Posted - 2004.12.21 06:08:00 -
[87]
First of all, thank you Pottsey for being so inventive and then telling us about this on the forums.
Now then, here's my Ferox setup:
5 Heavy Launchers
2 Dual 150 Railguns
2 Large Shield extender 2's
1 M51 Itinerative Shield Generator
1 Passive Hardener
1 Active Hardener
4 Shield Power Relays
With this setup, I get 51 shield/second (at peak). That's 152/3 seconds (or more than double a tech 2 medium shield booster) and 204/4 seconds (nearly as good as a tech 2 Large shield booster). Needless to say, it tanks good. Yeah, the dual 150s aren't the greatest, but they work. I'm currently training Engineering V, so I may be able to fit blasters (electron) after that. Also worth mentioning, my Shields are at 6095 with this setup.
The only issue with a passive shield tank is cap. With 5 heavy launchers for weapons and no need for a shield booster, that's really not a problem. My recharge rate can support the two railguns and one active hardener nearly indefinitely.
I'm running Lvl 3 Agent missions with this thing and it's absolutely unstoppable. I don't even bother to stay out of range of the Drones or move to use Tranversal to reduce hits. I just sit there and spam until everything is dead and I have yet to drop below 70% shields.
Again, thanks Pottsey. I never even considered using Shield rechargers or relays until I read this thread. It definitely works. It's really nice to fight and not worry about cap for defense (or anything for that matter). Just imagine running your large shield booster nonstop while unloading with all of your weapons and never even worrying about your cap. That's where my Ferox is.
|
Cal Drago
|
Posted - 2004.12.21 06:08:00 -
[88]
First of all, thank you Pottsey for being so inventive and then telling us about this on the forums.
Now then, here's my Ferox setup:
5 Heavy Launchers
2 Dual 150 Railguns
2 Large Shield extender 2's
1 M51 Itinerative Shield Generator
1 Passive Hardener
1 Active Hardener
4 Shield Power Relays
With this setup, I get 51 shield/second (at peak). That's 152/3 seconds (or more than double a tech 2 medium shield booster) and 204/4 seconds (nearly as good as a tech 2 Large shield booster). Needless to say, it tanks good. Yeah, the dual 150s aren't the greatest, but they work. I'm currently training Engineering V, so I may be able to fit blasters (electron) after that. Also worth mentioning, my Shields are at 6095 with this setup.
The only issue with a passive shield tank is cap. With 5 heavy launchers for weapons and no need for a shield booster, that's really not a problem. My recharge rate can support the two railguns and one active hardener nearly indefinitely.
I'm running Lvl 3 Agent missions with this thing and it's absolutely unstoppable. I don't even bother to stay out of range of the Drones or move to use Tranversal to reduce hits. I just sit there and spam until everything is dead and I have yet to drop below 70% shields.
Again, thanks Pottsey. I never even considered using Shield rechargers or relays until I read this thread. It definitely works. It's really nice to fight and not worry about cap for defense (or anything for that matter). Just imagine running your large shield booster nonstop while unloading with all of your weapons and never even worrying about your cap. That's where my Ferox is.
|
Narcissa
|
Posted - 2004.12.21 08:48:00 -
[89]
Edited by: Narcissa on 21/12/2004 08:50:43
Edited by: Narcissa on 21/12/2004 08:50:05
Edited by: Narcissa on 21/12/2004 08:49:13
Originally by: Pottsey
Nice setup but whatÆs the PDU for? Did you try swapping the PDU for another Shield relay?
As for the mid slots what about taking out 1 shield recharger for a EM or another passive hardener? Or instead of a hardener use a 3rd T2 large shield extender. If you do need the PDU for power I guess you can always swap it for a PDU T2.
The grid for this setup is right on the power limit, so a Power Diag gives just enough to fit it all. However I did look to see where I could lower the grid enough to get a fourth relay on. I don't think it is possible with skills that affect grid (I have Engineering 5 and Shield Upgrades 4).
I could either remove the AB (As the poster abve has) or downgrade blasters to Dual 150s to reduce the grid load. I prefer the extra speed for collecting loot cans so I opted for the duals.
Another Option might be Tech II Shield Relays which look like they give 10% powergrid bonus. However I have yet to find one for sale so I haven't tried it.
On the mid slots, in comparison of shield rechargers and passive hardners, the hardener is a better choice if the enemy is doing that damage type.
As most NPC pirates do thermal damage plus either Kinetic or EM, I'll go with EM and TH hardeners as those are the ones that shields are most vulnerable. So here goes:
Passive Tanking Ferox (Revised)
Hi-
5*Heavy Missile Launcher
2*Dual 150mm Rails
Medium-
2*Large Shield Extender II
1*Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II
1*Heat Dissipation Amplifier II
1*10mn Afterburner
Low-
4*Shield Power Relay I
Shield regen tops out at 43.7, a bit slower that before, but it has all shield resists at 50%+ so it can warp in at 15km and lay waste to 2*100k cruisers with a deadspace sentry in support and not break a sweat.
As something of a weekend warrior (my main focus being industry) having a ship that can do L3 missions with no cap worries and an always-on built-in shield booster is really fun.
For me this is one is a keeper.
|
Narcissa
|
Posted - 2004.12.21 08:48:00 -
[90]
Edited by: Narcissa on 21/12/2004 08:50:43
Edited by: Narcissa on 21/12/2004 08:50:05
Edited by: Narcissa on 21/12/2004 08:49:13
Originally by: Pottsey
Nice setup but whatÆs the PDU for? Did you try swapping the PDU for another Shield relay?
As for the mid slots what about taking out 1 shield recharger for a EM or another passive hardener? Or instead of a hardener use a 3rd T2 large shield extender. If you do need the PDU for power I guess you can always swap it for a PDU T2.
The grid for this setup is right on the power limit, so a Power Diag gives just enough to fit it all. However I did look to see where I could lower the grid enough to get a fourth relay on. I don't think it is possible with skills that affect grid (I have Engineering 5 and Shield Upgrades 4).
I could either remove the AB (As the poster abve has) or downgrade blasters to Dual 150s to reduce the grid load. I prefer the extra speed for collecting loot cans so I opted for the duals.
Another Option might be Tech II Shield Relays which look like they give 10% powergrid bonus. However I have yet to find one for sale so I haven't tried it.
On the mid slots, in comparison of shield rechargers and passive hardners, the hardener is a better choice if the enemy is doing that damage type.
As most NPC pirates do thermal damage plus either Kinetic or EM, I'll go with EM and TH hardeners as those are the ones that shields are most vulnerable. So here goes:
Passive Tanking Ferox (Revised)
Hi-
5*Heavy Missile Launcher
2*Dual 150mm Rails
Medium-
2*Large Shield Extender II
1*Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II
1*Heat Dissipation Amplifier II
1*10mn Afterburner
Low-
4*Shield Power Relay I
Shield regen tops out at 43.7, a bit slower that before, but it has all shield resists at 50%+ so it can warp in at 15km and lay waste to 2*100k cruisers with a deadspace sentry in support and not break a sweat.
As something of a weekend warrior (my main focus being industry) having a ship that can do L3 missions with no cap worries and an always-on built-in shield booster is really fun.
For me this is one is a keeper.
|
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 .. 18 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |