Ah yes, this dates back to 2009, and you're looking at the one responsible for that (along with the Dramiel, Cynabal and Machariel uberness)

Considering I was the one breaking this ship in the first place, the least I can do is to post here what we think of pirate ships at the moment.

• Blood Raiders: Bhaalgorn is nice, Ashimmu and Cruor need some iteration. Need to find ways to make them useful at what they do without them competing too much with the Amarr Recon Ships.


• Sansha's Nation: Nightmare is very good, Phantasm and Succubus also need some love. Probably going to need to have a look at their mobility and EHP. Open to ideas however, so this thread will be watched.


• Guristas: Rattlesnake and Gila we are happy with, not so much with the Worm.


• Serpentis: we are quite pleased with all the ships in this line.


• Angel Cartel: while the Dramiel has been brought back into line, the Cynabal and Machariel need a nerf. Not necessarily a big one mind you, but at the moment they are just too much versatile with their flexible slot layouts, extended drone bays coupled with amazing speed and good damage. Their theoretical weaknesses (lack of EHP, poor damage projection) don't matter as much in the field as they should.


So, when would this be coming out? Not for a while, we have a lot of more urgent rebalancing to go through, mainly with Tech1 and 2 hulls, but this definately is on our to-do list.

my 2 isk says the succubus needs 1 high slot changed into a low slot to fit either, TE, Nano, or fitting mod or whathaveyou. also a bit more speed would be nice. maybe a little more shield.

Hope the Phantasm doesn't get an AB bonus >.<.

Why wouldn't you want an AB bonus? It doesn't lose anything for it, and allows a beastly sig tank.

I would also add that I think the cruiser level gets the largest benefit from an AB bonus.The biggest issue with shield brawlers is that you have to gimp yourself to dual prop. So either you lose a shield or tackle module or you have no MWD and can't catch anything that doesn't want to fight you. The increased AB speed should allow a Phantasm to catch some things it normally wouldn't without giving up a valuable mid.

Even with an AB bonus I doubt the phantasm will catch anything. It is already one of the slowest cruisers in the game.

Even with an AB bonus I doubt the phantasm will catch anything. It is already one of the slowest cruisers in the game.

The succubus was much slower before it's changes were posted so it would be unlikely if the phantasm doesn't get it's speed increased.

SUCCUBUS

Amarr Frigate Bonus:
7.5% bonus to Small Energy Turret tracking speed

Caldari Frigate Bonus:
20% bonus to Afterburner velocity bonus (was 5% energy turret damage)

Role Bonus:
150% bonus to Small Energy Turret damage (was 100% energy turret damage)


Slot layout: 3H(-1), 4M, 3L(+1); 2 turrets, 0 launchers
Fittings: 44 PWG(-14), 170 CPU(-5)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 650(+41) / 550(+6) / 540(+23)
Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 450(+15) / 210000 (-24375) / 2.14 (+.09)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 340(+53) / 3.5(-.35) / 965000 / 4.68s(-.4)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 0 / 0
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 32km / 650 / 5
Sensor strength: 13
Signature radius: 33(-2)

Literally in the [Summer 2014] Pirate Faction Frigates thread.

Whaddya know, 1 high slot changed to a low, a bit lot more speed, and a tiny bit more shield, armour, and hull. Literally exactly what you just said, but they've already suggested it.

Speculation backed by facts about a ship meant to be the class equivalent.

Just because the succubus gets a speed buff doesn't mean the phantasm will too.


If a dramiel gets nerfed does that also mean the cynabal and mach get the same nerf? No they don't (and didn't),

So what you said was pure speculation.

Just because the succubus gets a speed buff doesn't mean the phantasm will too.


If a dramiel gets nerfed does that also mean the cynabal and mach get the same nerf? No they don't (and didn't),

So what you said was pure speculation.

They're all of the same flavour though.
Dramiel is faster than usual frigs.
Cynabal is faster than usual cruisers.
Machariel is faster than usual Battleships.

They're all of the same flavour though.
Dramiel is faster than usual frigs.
Cynabal is faster than usual cruisers.
Machariel is faster than usual Battleships.

Cruor has neuts & webs.
Ashimmu has neuts & webs.
Bhaalgorn has neuts & webs.


It is very likely that the Phantsam will get an AB Speed bonus.
And if not, it will still most likely be something that will increase it's mobility.

You should probably read the pirate frigate thread a bit closer. Rise heavily implies that all sansha ship s are getting a bonus to afterburners.

You should probably read this thread a bit closer, I never said the pantasm won't get an AB bonus.