Why the double nerf to cap on the Apoc? First you remove the bonus to energy turret cap use, and then you nerf its total cap?
WTF?

And then you pretend to throw us a bone by giving us 1/5 of that bonus back for pulse and 2/5 for beam. Unbelievable.

The nerfing it's total cap was done with the intent to increase the amount of cap regen on the Apoc. It's arguably a single, half nerf.

At peak you get an extra 2 GJ/s. Not exactly a big change.

Fozzie was running level 4s fine before they adjusts pulse/beam lasers.

apparently Fozzie was running level 4s fine before they adjusts pulse/beam lasers.

What's the reason the Mael and Abaddon have the same PG? The Abaddon is supposed to armor tank and fit higher PG weapons while the Mael shield tanks and gets a higher CPU because of it. Even with the new energy weapon changes, it is physically impossible to fit Tach's (102% of PG) while it isn't on the Mael or any other race. Are all Amarr BS's supposed to use nothing but Scorch until they can fit a Paladin?

1: A fragile destroyer that most will operate at relatively close range of their target is not the best platform for a neut/drone weapons system. They are too slow to maintain range and have no tank to speak of. The Armageddon is pretty robust and can operate at further range.

2: The Apoc will be a nearly ideal kiting battleship, a near perfect fit for mid sized gang work. With the beam changes it will be a pretty good sniper now as well.

3: The Armageddon is borderline overpowered for small gang, close quarter brawls... and will be one of the most flexible and unpredictable ships in EvE.

We haven't gotten a response from CCP...but it's looking like yes. I feel the issue boils down to two separate issues: Scorch is too strong for pulse lasers, so smaller beams besides Tachs aren't worth fitting, and the Abaddon is too strong of a platform; having Tach's able to be fit on it would potentially lead to some serious balance issues, with a stronger tank than a Mael, combined with longer, more consistent damage at range.

...Having to relegate an entire line of BS's to nothing but Scorch is incredibly broken to me.

Dual Heavy Beam Laser? Mega Beam Laser?

Do a comparison of the Mega Beam and the Tachyon. They are not that far apart in performance, that said, one does pay a premium in terms of fitting for the extra 10% range/dps and ~50% alpha of Tachyons .. with sniping no longer valid in blob love fests and BS being replaced by much faster/nimbler tier3 BCs at ranges close to or in excess of 100km, all you need is Scorch .. Apoc needs just 2 or three mods to be able to reach 100km, beyond that you have MJD's and Probes to nail the enemy.

So, enough with the Tachyon nonsense. It became obsolete years ago when range option was removed and alpha was introduced .. if the problem is the Oracles ability to use them then address that, has nothing to do with the BS line .. go to the attack BC thread and ask for them to be hit alot harder than proposed. Focus man, focus!

EVE is a game where rails and blasters both have their upsides and downsides. Arty and autocannons too. We just saw reductions and adjustments in the medium missile lines to bring the two seperate sides to more equitable footing. So why is it "Lol scorch" is the only acceptable answer for Amarr?

There are issues with all the systems, and missiles definitely need more of a rework than lasers, but as-is, only one item is going to be getting use: Mega Pulse Laser II's with scorch. Without a major laser rebalance, Tachyons are the one item that stand a chance of changing that- sorry for hoping of fitting something else :(

Storyline, my dear. You can't just point at 10 years of storytelling and say "this had never happened". (Technically, you can, but you'll get the same level of disappointment, as Blizzard and other companies, who made this mistake in the past.)

The story says, that Armageddon and Apocalypse has seen service in years predating the current calendar. And the story says, what these ships were. Also, the story says, that sucking ships were used by suckers, as a direct product of their heresy, not by Holy Amarr Empire.

Also, where you saw my "accursed drones" angle? In your imaginary arguments? Sorry to burst your bubble.

And again, argumenting T1 ship changes with T2 ships is not correct (read: a failure of an argument.)

Speaking of game balance changes, I'm fine with amarr drone ship. If you accidentally open your eyes, you'll even see my posts advocating that ship, and suggesting the layouts and bonuses.

The problem is the choice of hulls, first and foremost. Armageddon and Apocalypse MUST remain laser boats. No discussion allowed.
If you want a drone boat - Abaddon is here for you. You may even put 4-6 launchers on it. but no sucking bonuses, THANK YOU. If anyone want a bloody sucker, there's Bhaalgorn, and it even not require to crosstrain into any other race. And will require the same level of skills to fly, if I'm not mistaken.

Tachyons are not the best beam, they are not even in the list .. they are oversized, like 1600 plates on a cruiser or a MSE on a frig. They offer respectable alpha over that of smaller bore guns, but that is it .. horrible tracking, atrocious fittings and gluttonous operation make them inferior to Mega Beams in any scenario relevant today.

for the oversized thing simply compare the number of turrets that Amaar and Minmatar have.
Amarr: 2 pulses 3 Beams, 5.
Min: 3 auto, 2 Arties, 5.

While for gallente & Caldari they own 6 for two races while Caldari have missles

Fine if you say that Tach is oversized, just give another thing that is not oversized and enable Amarr a similar number of choice of turrets as Minmatar.

Don't like the idea of using oversize to neglect the problem.
Tachs are bit stronger than others and that MIGHT be right but we have to waste a 50% cap usage bonus even to use it.
Other turrests with some bonus like 10% range(Rokh) or 5% damage(Mealstrom) is defenatly better than Tachs.

for the oversized thing simply compare the number of turrets that Amaar and Minmatar have....

Constructive criticism:

For the 'new' Armageddon, the combination of Neutralizer bonus, the DominixGÇÖs drone bonus and the slot layout provide too much synergy GÇô it will be too powerful and steps too much on the DominixGÇÖs role.

Instead:


My changes emphasised.
Having a GÇÿdual-hattedGÇÖ bonus is not without precedent and having three bonuses is not without precendent (Scorpion).

What this does is keep clearer separation between the Armageddon and Dominx.

It has a larger drone bay, allowing a flight of heavyGÇÖs, flight of mediums and 3 flights of lights but not the drone damage bonus.
It retains enough of its laser focus to keep the GÇÿloyalistsGÇÖ happy, but also has that Khanid gleam to its eye, without going all the way (i.e. without the bonuses to missile damage projection, like the Raven and Typhoon).
It is flexible, but forces genuine compromise rather than the straight 7 neut + drones ship the current iteration is going to become.

Thoughts?

EVE is a game where rails and blasters both have their upsides and downsides. Arty and autocannons too. We just saw reductions and adjustments in the medium missile lines to bring the two seperate sides to more equitable footing. So why is it "Lol scorch" is the only acceptable answer for Amarr?

There are issues with all the systems, and missiles definitely need more of a rework than lasers, but as-is, only one item is going to be getting use: Mega Pulse Laser II's with scorch. Without a major laser rebalance, Tachyons are the one item that stand a chance of changing that- sorry for hoping of fitting something else :(

Tachyons are not the best beam, they are not even in the list .. they are oversized, like 1600 plates on a cruiser or a MSE on a frig. They offer respectable alpha over that of smaller bore guns, but that is it .. horrible tracking, atrocious fittings and gluttonous operation make them inferior to Mega Beams in any scenario relevant today.

LOL OKAY
A battleship can't fit 8 of these oversized guns, but a battlecruiser can do it without nearly as much trouble.
Anybody else see the problem with that?

Tachyons are not the best beam, they are not even in the list .. they are oversized, like 1600 plates on a cruiser or a MSE on a frig. They offer respectable alpha over that of smaller bore guns, but that is it .. horrible tracking, atrocious fittings and gluttonous operation make them inferior to Mega Beams in any scenario relevant today.