Why don't you fly gallente/minmatar/caldari then ? If you don't value amarr weapons advantages and only care about their drawbacks, that mean they are not meant for your playstyle.

Yeah I'm sick to death of CCP buffing Gallente if the Gallente pilots b i t c h for under 2 hours, and buffing Minmatar all the time cause CCP are biased f u c k s, and always either ignoring Amarr and the Caldari or give them the shaft.

CCP is never going to recover rep from that whole boot.ini thing are they?

I'm sorry but I've yet to see any thread were anyone asked for the Mega to trade drones for dps, I haven't seen the dominix get it's hybrid bonus back, and I haven't seen a single thread where anyone asked for the Hyperion to gain bandwidth at the cost of gun dps. Don't blame us, it's not our fault that ccp does what they do.

I'm sorry but I've yet to see any thread were anyone asked for the Mega to trade drones for dps, I haven't seen the dominix get it's hybrid bonus back, and I haven't seen a single thread where anyone asked for the Hyperion to gain bandwidth at the cost of gun dps. Don't blame us, it's not our fault that ccp does what they do.

5 or 10 seconds is not advantage, it's a loss of DPS for anyone else. And we're not talking about swtitching from MF to Gleam. Yeah, go guess, there's people who know how to actually use lasers, and not just fit MF and wonder, why they can't kill anything.

I am quite excited by these changes (in combination with the changes to Large Lasers) and cannot wait to try out the new Amarr ships on the testserver.

Depending on that, perhaps CCP will change other things, perhaps not.

Its going to be interesting to fly those changed vessels.
Especially the Armageddon sounds like lots of fun.

And the Apocalypse sounds better as well.

-

One thing that turned me off from the Amarr ships is that they were all the same;
Laserboats with capacitator-problems or capacitator bonusses.

Now we have a dedicated Combat-BS, one Laser-Attack BS and one Drone/drain BS.

-

Life will be interesting for Amarr pilots.

You can only advocate for changes that directly affect you and your play style?

No, no it wont.

sicne the geddon is being forced on us as a missile ship for battleships, sicne we wont have enough cap to be viable in PvP on the battleship level, and in order to GET the cap to be viable, youll have to sacrifice tank or fiepower (and in the chance of not max fitting skills, you will have to sacrifice both to get your cap to manageable levels).

so yeah, gallente? buffs
minmatar? soem tweaks
caldari? buffs
amarr? nerfs across the board

Well, the Armageddon is a Drone Boat. With A Secondary Bonus to Energy Neuts and Vamps.
Its not a Missile ship.
Please get the facts correct.
You can fit missiles but it has no bonus to them.

You will have 4 mediums for Capacitor Boosters and 7 for Tank.
Not enough cap ? You are not even using turrets on the Armageddon, so please, cap is the last of your problems.
If you think you will have a low cap, fit Large Vampires.

-

It is quite interesting to see these Battleship threads.

Loads of persons are whining that THEIR race gets nerfed and the OTHERS get Buffed or Tweaked.
Amarr players are not different.

Luckily we have the Testserver coming up.
So please try out the new ships and make video's.

Give Amarr battleships cap advantage they have in smaller hulls. It wont break anything.

[quote=Nariya Kentaya]No, no it wont.
Loads of persons are whining that THEIR race gets nerfed and the OTHERS get Buffed or Tweaked.
Amarr players are not different.

Cap disadvantage of the Abaddon is intended, and the Apocalypse have the best cap of all BS.

Well, the Armageddon is a Drone Boat. With A Secondary Bonus to Energy Neuts and Vamps.
Its not a Missile ship.
Please get the facts correct.
You can fit missiles but it has no bonus to them.

You will have 4 mediums for Capacitor Boosters and 7 for Tank.
Not enough cap ? You are not even using turrets on the Armageddon, so please, cap is the last of your problems.
If you think you will have a low cap, fit Large Vampires.

-

It is quite interesting to see these Battleship threads.

Loads of persons are whining that THEIR race gets nerfed and the OTHERS get Buffed or Tweaked.
Amarr players are not different.

Luckily we have the Testserver coming up.
So please try out the new ships and make video's.

Um no the Hyperion does but why let facts get in the way. It has a higher total cap and the difference in recharge rate is marginal relative to the cap draw in the Apoc's weapons versus the Hyperion. It isn't even close.

Facts. Tell me more about them please :
Hyperion :
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second: 7200 / 1250s / 5,76

Apocalypse :
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / recharge per second) : 7000(-500) / 1002s(-152s) / 6.99 (+.49)

This is 3% more cap (like a cheap implant) for 25% less regen time. Facts, yes. Something a lot of people here completely ignore.

Way to pull out a stat in a vacuum. Are we using arties on the Apoc?

[
Facts. Tell me more about them please :
Hyperion :
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second: 7200 / 1250s / 5,76

Apocalypse :
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / recharge per second) : 7000(-500) / 1002s(-152s) / 6.99 (+.49)

This is 3% more cap (like a cheap implant) for 25% less regen time. Facts, yes. Something a lot of people here completely ignore.

Apocalypse is one ship and here is more about it.

Fact about Apocalypse ? its a flying turd. Why fly apoc when you have ABC that is cheaper (this fact cannot be emphasized more since CCP decided to raise BS build cost!!), faster, smaller sig superior DPS and does the same job? What purpose does Apoc have? Its a flying turd nothing more nothing less. Even pre Odyssey PVE Apoc could not tank everything with 4x res modules and 1 repper. Abaddon did better, with limited range but better DPS.

Apocalypse is degrading obsolete sniper platform. Attack BS term itself is a joke. ABC is what is now. Yes, ABC can't work in every situation where BS can but the fact is that ABCs have come permanently and taking more space from BS.

The fact is that 2013 and Odyssey is blooming time for BCs. Year of the battlecruiser.

You will have 4 mediums for Capacitor Boosters and 7 for Tank.
Not enough cap ? You are not even using turrets on the Armageddon, so please, cap is the last of your problems.
If you think you will have a low cap, fit Large Vampires.

[Well hello there developers alt!

In the tier 3 battleship lineup Amarr together with Caldari are the losers. Hyperion got buffs it needed and then some, making it borderline op. The best and most used tier 3 Maelstorm, both in pve and pvp, remained unchanged.

As far as assault battleship go, Apocalypse has worst tank, worst speed, worst damage up to 30km, capacitor problems. Both of its bonuses are highly situational. Everything it can do Mega and Tempest do better. In the old Apocalypse i could fit Tracking computer in the mids and tracking rig if i wanted tracking and i would still have more cap than i have now when i have to fit discharge rigs. Old Apocalypse would wipe the floor with new one.

Armageddon had the dumbest possible bonus. Large neuts already have the range to do what they need to do, range bonus wont make a difference in 99% situations.

Every damn ship got capacitor buff, Amarr dont have any capacitor advantage on battleship level even compared to ships that fire missile weapons. Is Maller op because it has 2x the capacitor of Caracal? Even if Abaddon gets a cap buff it deserves and can replace one discharge rig with resistance nerf if you put trimark in there you will have 1.5k more ehp than you have now.

Give Amarr battleships cap advantage they have in smaller hulls. It wont break anything.

Even without ABC's, the Apoc is a mess. CCP Rise claims he wants to open them up to more beam usage yet gives them no increased fitting to account for it and that tracking bonus should haunt every snipers dreams.

Utterly and catastrophically wrong. Why should we be forced to fit 4 Cap Boosters? the Amarrian's ideal battle tactic is firing the Photonic output of a white dwarf star at their opponents, not sneaking in to within 37.5kms and sipping their cap away, all the while hoping that some Godless, Souless Machine does the work for you.

Its bonusses are now Tracking and Optimal.
Situational? Sorry, it has the same tracking bonus as the Megathron.
It has Superior Optimal to the Megathron.
And you call both "situational"

Now CCP will change the Large Energy weapons.
They will require less cap.

Armageddon has a very nice bonus.
You say dumb?

Yes, Large Neuts have a Long Range. And now you get 50% extra.
And you are complaining?
The new Armageddon is amazing. Much better then the former Neutralizing/Vamp Dominix.

Now, lets look at the Apoc.
It gets 113 speed. The same as the Raven. It gets +19 speed, which is good.
That Debunks worse speed

It has a better tank than the Megathron (7000 vs 6500) but worse than the Tempest.
The tank of the Raven is similar.
So that debunks "Worst Tank"

Its bonusses are now Tracking and Optimal.
Situational? Sorry, it has the same tracking bonus as the Megathron.
It has Superior Optimal to the Megathron.
And you call both "situational"

Now CCP will change the Large Energy weapons.
They will require less cap.

So lets first see what the feedback is from the Test Server before we start Demanding Changes.

Of course, I am sure you will do lots of testing and will give lots of feedback in the form of posts, statistics and even video's. That is the best way to provet hat the new Amarr Bs's are bad :)

Cap disadvantage of the Abaddon is intended, and the Apocalypse have the best cap of all BS.

I am quite excited by these changes (in combination with the changes to Large Lasers) and cannot wait to try out the new Amarr ships on the testserver.
Depending on that, perhaps CCP will change other things, perhaps not.
Its going to be interesting to fly those changed vessels.
Especially the Armageddon sounds like lots of fun.
And the Apocalypse sounds better as well.
One thing that turned me off from the Amarr ships is that they were all the same;
Laserboats with capacitator-problems or capacitator bonusses.
Now we have a dedicated Combat-BS, one Laser-Attack BS and one Drone/drain BS.
Life will be interesting for Amarr pilots.

Now, lets look at the Apoc.
It has a better tank than the Megathron (7000 vs 6500) but worse than the Tempest.
The tank of the Raven is similar.
So that debunks "Worst Tank"

Utterly and Catastrophically wrong?
Well, I guess Curses needs to be changed to BEAM platforms.
And Pilgrims Too.
And of course Dragoons.

Please put that forward in Features and Ideas Section and good luck while everyone will burn you with that Photonic Output of a White Dwarf Star (+1 for description by the way).

Have fun

At least pre-Odyssey non-lvl 5 players could go with a Geddon for solo play and missioning, but none of the ships in the new lineup come close to being mission playable. Until you get access to Scorch beams are your only option and as this thread has outlined, the beam fits available to Amarr BS's face significantly more tradeoffs (can't active tank the Baddon and Apoc, while drones are awful for missioning without level 5 interfacing). I know everybody only cares about PvP and blob fights, but this is a serious concern of mine as that is the primary activity of newer players and I don't want them getting discouraged with Amarr ships off the bat.