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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 23 post(s) |
Kane Fenris
NWP
62
   |
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:32:00 -
[1081] - Quote
Kais Fiddler wrote:Naomi Knight wrote:btw ishtar gets lame double bonuses why other ships cant get those?
like 7.5% optimal and tracking for med hybrids instead of 10% optimal /lvl for the eagle?
oh any other bonuses gets implemented into the ship hull
then why cant the 4%/lvl resist bonus put directly into the eagle hull and give it another bonus? The resist bonus is far more powerful than the speed or cap recharge bonus.
somebody here hasnt learned yet that naomi is a dedicated troll |
Menehune Ho'okele
Kiith Paktu
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:34:00 -
[1082] - Quote
It seems like there are fitting problems for obvious goto weapons on a couple of ships (deimos, vaga come to mind) a fitting reduction for ranged weapons struck me as a possible solution for the deimos, but I'm not sure how keen peple are for arty vagas. Still, something that makes the preferred ( not trying to insist on rail deimos, just trying to be brief) weapons easier to fit without adding an open ended fittings buff might be worth a thought.
Generally this 2nd pass looks like some woryhwhile improvements. Thanks. |
Kais Fiddler
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
24
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:34:00 -
[1083] - Quote
Naomi Knight wrote:
btw speed bonus if better ,if you sig tank anyway , not only it lowers the chance you being hit/missile dmg, it allows you to control range which is probably the most important part of pvp in eve
Perhaps. CCP doesn't seem to see eye to eye with you on that considering their recent nerf to resistance bonuses.
As an aside I suspect the mwd role bonus is far more powerful than most people are thinking. |
Kais Fiddler
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
24
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:35:00 -
[1084] - Quote
Kane Fenris wrote:Kais Fiddler wrote:Naomi Knight wrote:btw ishtar gets lame double bonuses why other ships cant get those?
like 7.5% optimal and tracking for med hybrids instead of 10% optimal /lvl for the eagle?
oh any other bonuses gets implemented into the ship hull
then why cant the 4%/lvl resist bonus put directly into the eagle hull and give it another bonus? The resist bonus is far more powerful than the speed or cap recharge bonus. somebody here hasnt learned yet that naomi is a dedicated troll
I generally don't post on these forums, but this is something I apparently care a lot about, which is somewhat surprising to be honest. |
XvXTeacherVxV
Nightmare Machinery
Illusion of Solitude
22
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:36:00 -
[1085] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Diesel47 wrote:Make the vaga the arty / autocannon boat and the munnin the missile ship. Taht is simply DUMB. the Missile hull for minmatar cruisers is the bellicose.
You mean the "t1 missile hull" is the bellicose. The point I'm making here is that Minmatar missile pilots are still getting the shaft because their options are so limited. The Bellicose is not even close to filling a t2 HAC role.
I also don't think it's productive to call someone's idea "dumb", especially with only the most minimal argument as to why. Try to stay constructive guys. |
XvXTeacherVxV
Nightmare Machinery
Illusion of Solitude
23
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:51:00 -
[1086] - Quote
Minmatar Missile Boat Progression: Breacher > Talwar > (Hound) > Bellicose > 1/2 Huginn > Cyclone > Typhoon.
Minmatar Projectile Boat Progression: Everything else.
At least we also have the Fleet Scythe now I guess, but the point remains that EVERY other race has more options for each weapon system (except perhaps Amarr, which sort of has three systems: lasers, drones, missiles). |
M1k3y Koontz
Thorn Project
Surely You're Joking
241
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 22:54:00 -
[1087] - Quote
Hannott Thanos wrote:Diesel47 wrote:Vagabad needs PWG buff.
I want to use arties/425mm on it. The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB.
Post constructively or don't post, we're trying to make the Vaga a useful ship that can actually use its shield booster bonus without having to fit an ACR.
How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp. |
Bouh Revetoile
TIPIAKS
349
|
Posted - 2013.07.31 23:42:00 -
[1088] - Quote
M1k3y Koontz wrote:Hannott Thanos wrote:Diesel47 wrote:Vagabad needs PWG buff.
I want to use arties/425mm on it. The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB. Post constructively or don't post, we're trying to make the Vaga a useful ship that can actually use its shield booster bonus without having to fit an ACR.
He was underlining a bit sarcasticaly that asking for your ship to be able to fit everything you can possibly need is unreasonable. You are asking too much sir, and it's not christmas yet.
Because if you think about it, the Vagabond can fit guns and ASB to profit from all of its bonus. You're only asking more without real reasons. |
Joelleaveek
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
247
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 00:06:00 -
[1089] - Quote
I really dislike that the Deimos is keeping the MWD bonus instead of tracking. It also seems like the Ishtar is getting one bonus split into to slots to waste one of them. Still don't get the shield boost bonus on the Vagabond. |
I'm Down
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
186
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 00:07:00 -
[1090] - Quote
I love how people's understanding of the Vaga is:
If it can't fit an XL ASB, then **** it.
Player level competence trying to fit a BS sized mod on every cruiser class ship.... You know what, why not let it fit a 100mn AB too, and for that matter, get an agility boost when using it. |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1384
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 00:35:00 -
[1091] - Quote
Harvey James wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:The damage is inline with the range, but the Deimos fall off bonus kinda makes the range on bonus on the Eagle kinda underwhelming. If the falloff bonus on the Deimos was changed to a tracking bonus they would both be very useful as both blaster or rail platforms. The lack of low slots also hurt the eagle...2/4 is mags just too get 370 dps at 15km with null at lv5 HAC i might add doing about 1600m/s with a massive sig and only 2 slots left for a choice of either nano/TE or damage control... for 200mil i mean come on its taking the **** when a Talos can do 900dps at 15km and what 1700m/s for a overall shorter training time and and half the price..
[Eagle 1.1, Egale]
5x Heavy Neutron Blaster II (Void M)
10MN Microwarpdrive II
2x Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Large Ancillary Shield Booster (Navy Cap Booster 150)
Large Shield Extender II
Faint Warp Disruptor I
2x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Damage Control II
Medium Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
[Statistics - All Skills 5]
Effective HP: 44,059 (Eve: 24,571)
Tank Ability: 632.64 DPS
Damage Profile - (EM: 25.00%, Ex: 25.00%, Ki: 25.00%, Th: 25.00%)
Shield Resists - EM: 63.78%, Ex: 81.89%, Ki: 89.13%, Th: 92.76%
Armor Resists - EM: 57.50%, Ex: 23.50%, Ki: 68.13%, Th: 88.31%
Capacitor (Lasts 1m)
Volley Damage: 1,696.51
DPS: 551.82 @8.3km + 3.7km Falloff 2 Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 1 Tracking Enhancer II
DPS: 474.40 @ 9km + 4.4km Falloff 1 Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 2 Tracking Enhancer II
Harvey James wrote: Again with the tracking bonus on Deimos is pointless as the thorax or brutix navy issue can do the exact same thing at least as a mini durable talos that can armour tank or shield tank well and is much more mobile than the talos it has a useful role and some uniqueness rather than a T2 thorax The falloff bonus is just a bad tracking bonus that only is usable with null or antimatter charges. Less most forget there are more than just those types of charges. I always viewed the role of the Deimos as a close range high damage specialist ship, which is almost does.
Ideas for Drone ImprovementTwitter Account-á @Omnathious |
SMT008
SnaiLs aNd FroGs
Verge of Collapse
653
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 00:37:00 -
[1092] - Quote
I'm Down wrote:I love how people's understanding of the Vaga is:
If it can't fit an XL ASB, then **** it.
Player level competence trying to fit a BS sized mod on every cruiser class ship.... You know what, why not let it fit a 100mn AB too, and for that matter, get an agility boost when using it.
I would use the LASB. If it wasn't super-bad. So instead, I prefer to seriously gimp my ship and shoehorn an XLASB.
Let's try something alright, get a cruiser-class ship, doesn't matter which one. Then use a medium shield booster. Any medium shield booster except deadspace ones. And then see if it's of any use in PVP.
It's not. |
Ronny Hugo
Dark Fusion Industries
Limitless Inc.
15
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 00:40:00 -
[1093] - Quote
Just one thing I've just noticed, the laser-ship (Zealot) has less capacitor than the missile ship (sacrilege)... Are you sure the capacitor values aren't backwards? |
Vayn Baxtor
Ultra High Ping Crew
Tribal Band
72
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 00:57:00 -
[1094] - Quote
Vaga: Well, can call it tweaking. I still find it not a good idea to be making it all fancy for ASB fits. But apparently, people don't fancy other bonuses instead, either.
Using tablet, typoes are common and I'm not going to fix them all. |
Sol Mortis
An Heroes
11
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 02:40:00 -
[1095] - Quote
HACs should get a third rig slot if they are really being balanced to be competitive with tech 1 and faction ships. It would be a solid but balanced buff to all of them, with the normal trade-offs between speed, tank, and fitting we're all used to with rigs.
|
Mire Stoude
Antelope with Night Vision Goggles
191
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 03:25:00 -
[1096] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:For the Deimos ... We did look closely at the MWD cap use bonus and in the end decided that there wasn't any replacement compelling enough to warrant a change.\
Literally anything at all would be better than the MWD cap bonus; A hull bonus, tank bonus, a range bonus, a drone hit points bonus, an agility bonus... ANYTHING.
On second thought, a missile bonus would be even less useful. But I think that's about it.
|
Lord Eremet
The Seatbelts
21
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 03:58:00 -
[1097] - Quote
In the offchance that you are still reading this thread, CCP RISE, move those light drones you gave the cerberus to the eagle. It won't need drone defence when six HAM's will skewer tackiling frigates and drones with ease. I'm positive the cerberus will become the BEST kiter ingame even without em.
And 25 mbit drone bandwith, not 15 thats for frigates.
Kthxbye |
NinjaStyle
hirr
RAZOR Alliance
23
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 04:14:00 -
[1098] - Quote
well I guess these changes are final regardless any input we post since some of the ship changes where fairly well recived. |
Leskit
The Night Wardens
Viro Mors Non Est
38
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 04:27:00 -
[1099] - Quote
AstraPardus wrote:Amarr: That's nice, capacitor recharge is nice for most Amarr ships, but IMO is too much on a missile boat.
It was great when you were active tanked+mwd+neut in the utility high. didn't need a cap booster. |
Devon Weeks
Deadspace Defense Initiative
Initiative Associates
22
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 04:42:00 -
[1100] - Quote
Quote:Literally anything at all would be better than the MWD cap bonus; A hull bonus, tank bonus, a range bonus, a drone hit points bonus, an agility bonus... ANYTHING.
On second thought, a missile bonus would be even less useful. But I think that's about it.
Agreed. Although, now you've got me thinking about a HAM Deimos... could be fun, or funny. But, seriously, I find it hard to believe that there is no compelling change besides a MWD bonus to make.
For those saying that Deimos pilots are asking too much, let me point something out. I don't care if the Deimos gets a single point more of DPS. I don't care if it gets the ability to fit neutrons with a 1600mm plate (been flying it with electrons for quite a while on two characters and think it works well enough). I don't care if it loses the utility high as long as the math works out to fit a comparable cap booster to make up for it, which it looks like it has. I don't care if it gets an active rep bonus (I buffer tank the thing most of the time or run a nos/repper setup). I don't care if it gets more speed (I catch most targets just fine, at least the ones the Deimos is intended to fight). I don't care if it or any other HAC gets an additional slot.
My point is simply this. Where CCP found no compelling bonus to give the Deimos, I find no compelling reason whatsoever to reduce its tank. I find no compelling reason, at all.
CCP_Rise, please be so kind as to explain why the Deimos needed a hit to its tank. I think by this point in the thread it's pretty obvious that no one has been able to grasp the reasoning behind it. Even those "defending" it are only saying its new tank is merely adequate, but no one has provided a reason it needs to be softer (cue the trolls). Is a blaster Deimos really supposed to be something we go Captain Ahab on targets with? If so, why is it as costly as it is?
**DEATH OF A DEIMOS**
Inspired by Moby ****
"And, he piled upon the great, white hump,
a sum of all the rage and hate.
If his chest had been a cannon,
he'd have shot his heart upon it."
Into the great, blue depths they fell
locked in a battle of wills,
neither caring to survive,
both hell bent to kill.
The outcome was certain,
as most seemed to know.
One's skin was so thin
his bones often showed.
The sea drank life
as it oozed from their hides
from the wounds they had dealt
on the turbulent tides.
Looking back to those depths,
the children would say,
"There sank Captain Deimos.
The whale got away." |
Kane Fenris
NWP
63
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 06:30:00 -
[1101] - Quote
Bouh Revetoile wrote:M1k3y Koontz wrote:Hannott Thanos wrote:Diesel47 wrote:Vagabad needs PWG buff.
I want to use arties/425mm on it. The Deimos needs 13.000 pwg and 800 CPU. I want to use Large guns and double XL ASB. Post constructively or don't post, we're trying to make the Vaga a useful ship that can actually use its shield booster bonus without having to fit an ACR. He was underlining a bit sarcasticaly that asking for your ship to be able to fit everything you can possibly need is unreasonable. You are asking too much sir, and it's not christmas yet. Because if you think about it, the Vagabond can fit guns and ASB to profit from all of its bonus. You're only asking more without real reasons.
oh really?
ever tried to fit a vaga ?
425mm +med neut +mwd and your at 98.99% pg (tech2)
and i'm only asking for the 425's cause its the only way i see that ccp could/would fix its dmg projection prolem a little.
|
I'm Down
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
187
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 06:37:00 -
[1102] - Quote
I think my favorite line ever is a dev saying he doesn't believe cruisers should fit all cruiser sized modules as a design element.
My jaw literally dropped.
|
Kane Fenris
NWP
63
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 06:44:00 -
[1103] - Quote
I'm Down wrote:I think my favorite line ever is a dev saying he doesn't believe cruisers should fit all cruiser sized modules as a design element.
My jaw literally dropped.
even if you drop the med neut to a small your still tight on grid....
if thats your meaning.... |
Caitlyn Tufy
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
372
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 06:53:00 -
[1104] - Quote
I'm Down wrote:I think my favorite line ever is a dev saying he doesn't believe cruisers should fit all cruiser sized modules as a design element.
My jaw literally dropped.
Try fitting a full rack of Tachyon Beams on an Apocalypse. Just because something is ment to be fitted on a certain type of hulls it doesn't mean that all hulls will support it. |
Lucien Cain
Twilight Phoenix Rising Inc.
8
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 06:57:00 -
[1105] - Quote
I'm Down wrote:I think my favorite line ever is a dev saying he doesn't believe cruisers should fit all cruiser sized modules as a design element.
My jaw literally dropped.
My god...i hope he's not employed any longer. That's utterly ridiculous.
|
Hannott Thanos
Notorious Legion
642
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 07:06:00 -
[1106] - Quote
Kane Fenris wrote:
oh really?
ever tried to fit a vaga ?
425mm +med neut +mwd and your at 98.99% pg (tech2)
and i'm only asking for the 425's cause its the only way i see that ccp could/would fix its dmg projection prolem a little.
Tell me all about all the other ships that can put largest guns, mwd and neut and not have pg issues..
Oh right, none of them can that. So why should the vaga?
Edit: not counting pirate cruisers. They are not yet rebalanced. |
Shereza
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
170
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 07:23:00 -
[1107] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:CERBERUS
...
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 15(+15) / 15(+15)
While it's nice to finally see a Caldari HAC get drones why did you choose the cerberus over the eagle? It's not a complaint that they're getting a damage/utility augment, but with missiles already being a "travel time" weapon system it seems an odd choice compared to the eagle.
CCP Rise wrote:DEIMOS
We did look closely at the MWD cap use bonus and in the end decided that there wasn't any replacement compelling enough to warrant a change.
Again, thank you very much. Having a cap penalty reduction bonus is, to me at least, one of the more iconic aspects of the ship, and while having it removed might make fitting afterburners on them more appealing it would also lose something that helps separate it from the other HACs.
That and it's nice to fit a deadspace MWD with HAC5 and get a nice (up to) 22% bonus to your capacitor amount. 
CCP Rise wrote:ISHTAR
Heavy Assault Cruiser Bonuses:
7.5% bonus to Sentry Drone optimal range and tracking speed(was bonus to drone bay capacity)
Fittings: 780 PWG(+80), 340 CPU(+55)
Thank you for the fitting capacity boost, especially the CPU, and making HAC a skill worth prioritizing over other skills for an ishtar pilot. The control range bonus was nice, but as I pointed out in the old topic neither it nor the bay bonus really screamed out "train me."
I sincerely hope that whoever takes over the rebalancing for the ishkur and eos take a page from the ishtar and have their drone bay bonuses replaced with something more useful that would actually force players like myself to prioritize the respective ship handling skill instead of leaving it for last. |
Danny John-Peter
Stay Frosty.
256
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 07:40:00 -
[1108] - Quote
Hannott Thanos wrote:Kane Fenris wrote:
oh really?
ever tried to fit a vaga ?
425mm +med neut +mwd and your at 98.99% pg (tech2)
and i'm only asking for the 425's cause its the only way i see that ccp could/would fix its dmg projection prolem a little.
Tell me all about all the other ships that can put largest guns, mwd and neut and not have pg issues.. Oh right, none of them can that. So why should the vaga? Edit: not counting pirate cruisers. They are not yet rebalanced.
That would be a fair point if the other Cruisers didnt have other Redeeming qualities like better tank/DPS/projection, buts its OK guys because the Vaga goes fast, you wont be able to kill anything, but you can go fast. |
Liafcipe9000
Smeghead Empire
9418
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 08:09:00 -
[1109] - Quote
yes. Yes. YES. YES. YES. YES. YES. YES. YES. YES. YES.
Thanks for explaining the Vagabond changes, Rise. you rock.
The capacitor, sensor and targeting range buffs will make it and the other HACs more powerful in a way that might just fit them, so that is a welcomed buff no doubt.
Now, you just need to rebalance Assault Frigates to fit the new HACs (i.e. Shield Boost bonus for Jaguar) and you're good to go.
You may gain the knowledge, but you will lose your belief, with all its mystery and comfort. If there was proof, absolute and certain, there is an afterlife, why not quit this life, and be done with it?
Ponder about these things all your life, and you're a philosopher. Compress these ponderings into a couple of pages, and you'll go mad. |
Dani Lizardov
Otbor Chereshka
GaNg BaNg TeAm
17
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 08:28:00 -
[1110] - Quote
Last Try, after that I give up... I personally do not see how the current changes will make me want to use hac ships again.
@ CCP
1. Why EAGLE does not have second dmg bonus like all other HACs?
If changing bonus does not fall into the category "minor twiks", then maybe add another low slot !?
2. Why Gellente does not have Tank bonus?
All other races have one
3. Why Zealot and EAGLE are the only HACs vulnerable to frigate size ships?
Both Zealot nad EAGLE have no Drones, both have no utility high slots also.
The Munin has drones and 6H / 5 Turrets
The Deimost has drones / The Ishtar has all the drones in eve and only utility Highs...
4. Why Gallente does not fallow the logic of all other races?
1x Heavy tanker / brawler + 1x Long Range bonus to optimal or fall-off or flight time and speed
Ishtar or Deimost witch one is the brawler for Gallente?
Deimost has falloff bonus, looks to be the long range one... but then Ishtar with the Sentries can hit over 100 km...
5. Why don't you put a restriction on the Ishtar: no Sentries?
Like you did on the Mother-ships they have all the drone space and bandwidth on the world and they can only use fighter bombers ...
That might help us define Brawler / LR in the Gallente race...
Quote:Lets start with role. We've had several presentations and posts and dev blogs now which explain that tech 1 is general and tech 2 is specialized...
Please give us some more information, how T2 is specialized and it what exactly?
I personally have hard time finding clear roles, they overlap so much. What is a true for 3 of the races is not for the 4th etc... |
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