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Two years later: Walking in Stations

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Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 485	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:33:00 - [61] - Quote Baroness Vulna wrote: Well CCP is going to lose alot more players if they just ignore avatars and walking in stations because there are a great many players (i know of) who want that to be part of the game they play. That's fine. If people can't live without wizard robes and dance emotes they shouldn't be playing Eve in the first place. EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Davon Mandra'thin Rotten Legion Ops 246	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:38:00 - [62] - Quote Rhes wrote: Baroness Vulna wrote: Well CCP is going to lose alot more players if they just ignore avatars and walking in stations because there are a great many players (i know of) who want that to be part of the game they play. That's fine. If people can't live without wizard robes and dance emotes they shouldn't be playing Eve in the first place. All the people who want WiS don't want those things, so your comment applies to no one. In which case, why bother posting it at all?
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 485	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:40:00 - [63] - Quote Davon Mandra'thin wrote: Rhes wrote: Baroness Vulna wrote: Well CCP is going to lose alot more players if they just ignore avatars and walking in stations because there are a great many players (i know of) who want that to be part of the game they play. That's fine. If people can't live without wizard robes and dance emotes they shouldn't be playing Eve in the first place. All the people who want WiS don't want those things, so your comment applies to no one. In which case, why bother posting it at all? They say they don't want those things but when they actually list what they do want wizard robes and dance emotes are actually less offensive. Roleplayers are the worst. EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 3596	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:42:00 - [64] - Quote Baroness Vulna wrote: Kagura Nikon wrote: The players did , whith their massive revotls, riots and demands that CCP scrapped the focus on incarna in favor of SPACE. CCP lost a LOT of costumers and only started gettign them back after they complied. THey leaarned a lesson. Do not expect anything incarna related soon. Well CCP is going to lose alot more players if they just ignore avatars and walking in stations because there are a great many players (i know of) who want that to be part of the game they play. With competition coming, many will just go to the other games if CCP cant deliver. My point is, if one company can do a decent job with avatars and walking in station in BETA, why cant CCP do something decent for its customers who want walking in stations with their awesome internet spaceships? Is this where I type "posting in a stealth Star Citizen is gonna kill EVE thread"? I get confused. The problem here, Baroness, is that you don't understand the history of EVE online. Every year some game is supposed to kill EVE. One of the last ones was Star Trek Online, a game that (like Star Citizen will) has walking in stations (and on planets and in ships) and that allows players to avoid any kind of pvp interaction at all. Despite all the "omg competiton is coming" prophecies from people, STO didn't even make a dent in EVE. So you are not the 1st who has tried to use the "competition!" boogey man as leverage to get CCP to do something you want but that the community in general wants. You won't be the last at failing to make a dent in EVE either.
Davon Mandra'thin Rotten Legion Ops 246	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:42:00 - [65] - Quote Rhes wrote: Davon Mandra'thin wrote: Rhes wrote: Baroness Vulna wrote: Well CCP is going to lose alot more players if they just ignore avatars and walking in stations because there are a great many players (i know of) who want that to be part of the game they play. That's fine. If people can't live without wizard robes and dance emotes they shouldn't be playing Eve in the first place. All the people who want WiS don't want those things, so your comment applies to no one. In which case, why bother posting it at all? They say they don't want those things but when they actually list what they do want wizard robes and dance emotes are actually less offensive. Roleplayers are the worst. Roleplayers are bad, but they're not the worst. Your kind are the worst.
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 485	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:44:00 - [66] - Quote Davon Mandra'thin wrote: Your kind are the worst. Reported for racism. EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Lors Dornick Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet 784	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:46:00 - [67] - Quote Plug in Baby wrote: Dextrome Thorphan wrote: Yup but they did spend 4 years of development on it... so that was just a complete waste then? Of course not, it was just part of their development for WoD, a game which has the potential to make CCP even more money that Dust! Exactly. CCP was looking for ways to use as much as possible of their existing tools and resources to create new platforms (or streams of revenue to use biz speak). One obvious way was to streamline their code to both be better and more up to date but also less EVE centric and more a generic game engine. Which is what Carbon was and still is all about. To get a better business case (or maybe because it actually sounds smart) they decided to start building the first ,or technically second, game using this new Carbon engine in parallel to recoding core elements EvE into it. That new game (and new IP) was, and still is, World of Darkness. And there's already been a lot of good stuff coming of Carbon even seen through the camera drones a dedicated space faring pod pilot. Because a lot of the core code in EvE was written by a very small team, on a very small budget and with a main goal to get something up and running before they lost their homes. But to use Carbon for anything else than EvE, or rather rendering anything else than spaceships, they had to add a new rendering system that could handle avatars. And that's when stuff went pear shaped. There was, and is, several engines that can do that, but that would also mean buying the right to use that engine and grafting it into Carbon. So they decided to write their own. Mainly because it was critical for WoD, but anyone could see that while not critical to EvE, it would be very very good to have. In a perfect world it would have worked. Take all the working stuff from EvE, add a new IP, recode stuff (that kind of worked but according to Devs having to work it makes could make "Baby Jesus Cry") and then add whatever new (and game independent from scratch) code they needed. It would have meant that EvE would be better, more polished, less buggy and with shiny new features while at the same time adding a whole new game (and revenue stream) to CCP. But it didn't, management felt invincible and decided to not only to do that (Carbon/WoD), but also to reuse their IP and server technology to pick up a new customer segment and add a console FPS to the mix. And they ran out of cash and had to take some quite drastic decisions. Why they decided to keep pushing for Dust and turn WoD down to a slow simmer is a completely different issue. So back to WiS and Avatars. With the Avatar part of Carbon needing lots of more development to be of any relevant use in EvE and WoD development on slow simmer with no release date there was no longer any resources available. There was an attempt by CCP to find a good enough case for Avatars in EvE to continue pushing without being able to share the load with WoD. But such a case would have to be based on a solid addition to game play. But that prototype was shot down by the management. Not because it was bad, but because it wasn't good enough. Was all the resources poured into to Avatars wasted? Probably not, since it's still in development in Georgia. Will there ever be any Avatar game play in EvE? Probably, but not until either the WoD code and tools has been developed and matured enough so that it can be integrated back into EvE or that someone comes up with a serious brainwave and presents a better idea for Avatar based game play in Eve than the one that was shot down. CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP Fozzie: When Veritas describes a programming challenge as "very hard" I tend to believe him.
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 3596	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:47:00 - [68] - Quote Crumplecorn wrote: Captain IQ wrote: EVE is dying I can't quite communicate the feel I get from seeing posts saying this after having spent nearly a decade seeing posts saying this. Some people can't separate (in their minds) themselves from everyone else, so they think that if THEY are starting to dislike something, every one else is too, therefore EVE must be dying....when in fact, EVE is only dying for THEM. Funnily enough, in the General Discussion forum, people who can't understand the concept described above tend to have the word "Captain" in their screen names
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 485	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:48:00 - [69] - Quote I love people who still think WoD will ever be released. EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
NosEspEYE swordFightingaFart 3	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:49:00 - [70] - Quote I want to walk around more and punch people in a station, does that count?
alexi turov Neutronium Alchemist's 4	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:51:00 - [71] - Quote While WIS would have been a nice thing to have, the missing EVA content piqued my interest. The potential to move around the EVE universe in space suits, as in Shattered Horizon, would have been cool. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=161511
Major Trant Oxide Nation Iron Oxide. 216	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:53:00 - [72] - Quote Baroness Vulna wrote: EVE can be something for all of us who love EVE, not just for pixel spaceship fans. And there in a nutshell is the problem. Eve can be many things, but a development team can only focus on one thing at a time. In 2010 I remember CCP announcing there would be no development on any other aspect of the game other than WIS / Incarna for the next 18 months. Sure they screwed up, but the real hatred for WIS is that everything else went out the window for an incredibly long time before CCP finally gave up on the project and that is why so many are against CCP trying to divert resources to it again. To all those people talking about WiS that was almost complete and then arbitrarily thrown out to start again on a new engine. Rubbish! WiS failed, for whatever reason they couldn't get it working. They gave up on it. What we got was a face saving exercise, which failed to do even that. CCP are never going to work on it again, but after so much time and effort wasted, they are too embarrassed to admit it. That is why no CCP employee has commented on this thread. Oxide Nation - Minmatar FW - Low Sec PvP - Euro TZ - New Player Friendly Contact: Major Trant In game channel: FeO Public Recruitment thread: Oxide Nation
Seven Koskanaiken Sons Of Saints Circle-Of-Two 547	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:54:00 - [73] - Quote I want to believe.
Tear Dancer State War Academy Caldari State 8	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:55:00 - [74] - Quote Walking in stations and exotic dancing in stations now that would be fun Give me more isk boys! (and girls) Pissed off Exotic Dancer
Tear Dancer State War Academy Caldari State 8	Posted - 2013.12.06 13:57:00 - [75] - Quote Major Trant wrote: Baroness Vulna wrote: EVE can be something for all of us who love EVE, not just for pixel spaceship fans. And there in a nutshell is the problem. Eve can be many things, but a development team can only focus on one thing at a time. In 2010 I remember CCP announcing there would be no development on any other aspect of the game other than WIS / Incarna for the next 18 months. Sure they screwed up, but the real hatred for WIS is that everything else went out the window for an incredibly long time before CCP finally gave up on the project and that is why so many are against CCP trying to divert resources to it again. To all those people talking about WiS that was almost complete and then arbitrarily thrown out to start again on a new engine. Rubbish! WiS failed, for whatever reason they couldn't get it working. They gave up on it. What we got was a face saving exercise, which failed to do even that. CCP are never going to work on it again, but after so much time and effort wasted, they are too embarrassed to admit it. That is why no CCP employee has commented on this thread. sounds legit, CCP? (crickets) Pissed off Exotic Dancer
Seven Koskanaiken Sons Of Saints Circle-Of-Two 547	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:00:00 - [76] - Quote Ramona McCandless wrote: CCP: Walk around in stations, pose, ERP, itll be fun and a nice test for WoD Forums: Wah, complain, grissle, Saceship gaem, GrrCCP, ruiners, waste of time, Moar ships, less barbie, why you no listen CCP to customers CCP: Ok Two Years Later CCP: Here, more ships, do more, modules, tactics, maybe even ares Forums: OMG GrrCCP BLINK, ruiners, waste of time, where WiS?? CCP: sigh It'll be exactly the same with this new stargate/space idea that everyone loves (at the moment), you watch. Youuuu just waaaatch. "No one wanted new stargates" - GD 2015 hold hands up like a gypsy curse
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 485	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:03:00 - [77] - Quote Major Trant wrote: Sure they screwed up, but the real hatred for WIS is that everything else went out the window for an incredibly long time before CCP finally gave up on the project and that is why so many are against CCP trying to divert resources to it again. Exactly. People who are asking CCP to once again neglect real Eve content for more roleplaying nonsense should be banned for trolling. EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Davon Mandra'thin Rotten Legion Ops 248	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:05:00 - [78] - Quote Major Trant wrote: Baroness Vulna wrote: EVE can be something for all of us who love EVE, not just for pixel spaceship fans. And there in a nutshell is the problem. Eve can be many things, but a development team can only focus on one thing at a time. In 2010 I remember CCP announcing there would be no development on any other aspect of the game other than WIS / Incarna for the next 18 months. Sure they screwed up, but the real hatred for WIS is that everything else went out the window for an incredibly long time before CCP finally gave up on the project and that is why so many are against CCP trying to divert resources to it again. To all those people talking about WiS that was almost complete and then arbitrarily thrown out to start again on a new engine. Rubbish! WiS failed, for whatever reason they couldn't get it working. They gave up on it. What we got was a face saving exercise, which failed to do even that. CCP are never going to work on it again, but after so much time and effort wasted, they are too embarrassed to admit it. That is why no CCP employee has commented on this thread. If development can only be focused on one thing at a time, why are CCP spreading their resources between four games and a mobile app? Most big successful companies like EA wouldn't even take on that many projects at one time, especially if only one of those projects were bringing in an income (Eve). At the moment Eve is getting a small fraction of the total development time and it still pulling the dead weight of projects that aren't earning. If it wasn't for CCPs terrible management plan, we wouldn't have this problem. There really would be development time enough for both. CCP never said they were going to spend 18 months on WiS. Maybe if you find a quote for me I will believe you, but the truth is they spent those 18 months developing the CARBON engine, not WiS. And the Carbon engine has given us most of the things people hail as amazing since then, such as the V3 textures, TiDi, the new UIs etc etc etc. As for your last paragraph, go back through the thread to Tippia's post. In 2008, they were demoing versions of WiS that had 10 times the amount of content our CQs have using the unreal engine. Learn your history before you start telling people they don't know theirs.
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 880	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:07:00 - [79] - Quote Major Trant wrote: Baroness Vulna wrote: EVE can be something for all of us who love EVE, not just for pixel spaceship fans. And there in a nutshell is the problem. Eve can be many things, but a development team can only focus on one thing at a time. In 2010 I remember CCP announcing there would be no development on any other aspect of the game other than WIS / Incarna for the next 18 months. Sure they screwed up, but the real hatred for WIS is that everything else went out the window for an incredibly long time before CCP finally gave up on the project and that is why so many are against CCP trying to divert resources to it again. To all those people talking about WiS that was almost complete and then arbitrarily thrown out to start again on a new engine. Rubbish! WiS failed, for whatever reason they couldn't get it working. They gave up on it. What we got was a face saving exercise, which failed to do even that. CCP are never going to work on it again, but after so much time and effort wasted, they are too embarrassed to admit it. That is why no CCP employee has commented on this thread. They might revisit it, but I would bet only AFTER world of darkness is launched and they have enough knowledge on that to advance at a faster pace. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Bel Tika Dirty Rotten Scoundrel's 31	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:12:00 - [80] - Quote i really do hate it when i accidentally press the captains quarters tbh
Meskiaggaseir Anunnaku Industrial Corp. 8	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:13:00 - [81] - Quote Rhes wrote: Davon Mandra'thin wrote: Your kind are the worst. Reported for racism. shakes me head....
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 487	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:17:00 - [82] - Quote Davon Mandra'thin wrote: As above. You've had this explained to you before Rhes. Ignorance is not an argument. Then explain why people are still crying about WiS when CCP has made it very clear that Eve is about spaceships. Incarna was over two years ago...if you can't live with the state of avatar gameplay at this point why are you still playing? EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 487	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:19:00 - [83] - Quote Meskiaggaseir wrote: Rhes wrote: Davon Mandra'thin wrote: Your kind are the worst. Reported for racism. shakes me head.... I know. It's sad to see racist rhetoric so openly stated in 2013. Here's hoping to a brighter future! EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Rebel Witch Volition Cult The Volition Cult 19	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:24:00 - [84] - Quote I remember being so enthusiastic in 2011 just before Incarna was rolled out. Then i joined in the collective gasp of shock when we saw just what CCP had done for 4 years of work and waiting. One of the biggest let downs in MMO history imho. Just because i play alot of them and looked so forward to ambulation. LIke others i still think there is hope for some kind of Avatar based expansion in EVE but for now I am loving what CCP is doing with the rest of the game, keep up the good work guys!!
Davon Mandra'thin Rotten Legion Ops 248	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:24:00 - [85] - Quote Rhes wrote: Davon Mandra'thin wrote: As above. You've had this explained to you before Rhes. Ignorance is not an argument. Then explain why people are still crying about WiS when CCP has made it very clear that Eve is about spaceships. Incarna was over two years ago...if you can't live with the state of avatar gameplay at this point why are you still playing? What has that got to do with anything? You supported the notion that CCP spent 18 months developing the CQs when they didn't, I dispelled the notion and then you changed the subject and asked me to explain something irrelevant. Which is like me going; "Well then explain why your in here crying every time someone brings up that people might like Avatar content?" Your a troll Rhes. There is no point to your posts, you have no argument, and just come in to annoy people. Your posts are ignoreable at best and petty at worst. I don't know why I bother.
Ila Dace Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 962	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:32:00 - [86] - Quote Kagura Nikon wrote: The players did , whith their massive revotls, riots and demands that CCP scrapped the focus on incarna in favor of SPACE. CCP lost a LOT of costumers and only started gettign them back after they complied. THey leaarned a lesson. Do not expect anything incarna related soon. I really hate revisionist history. The statue shooting and unsubscribing was over the NeX, Pay-to-Win, and because Incarna didn't deliver enough avatar gameplay for the time it took to develop it. If House played Eve: http://i.imgur.com/y7ShT.jpg
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 3598	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:33:00 - [87] - Quote Ramona McCandless wrote: CCP: Walk around in stations, pose, ERP, itll be fun and a nice test for WoD Forums: Wah, complain, grissle, Saceship gaem, GrrCCP, ruiners, waste of time, Moar ships, less barbie, why you no listen CCP to customers CCP: Ok Two Years Later CCP: Here, more ships, do more, modules, tactics, maybe even ares Forums: OMG GrrCCP BLINK, ruiners, waste of time, where WiS?? CCP: sigh Why isn't their an infinite like button??? I coldn't be a CCP employee, I'd live every day with dreams of carpet bombing fanfest. When I look at CCP it reminds of being a parent. You give your kid something, they want something else, you give them something else and it's all "why can't I have the thing I used to have". Then they grow up and have to work for their own things, then have kids then wonder "why in hell can't this kid be happy with what I give him, doesn't he know I work for a living"..... It's a vicious circle over and over again until the Sun explodes... At least as a parent you know the kid eventually grows up, where as with CCP their needy preteens...I mean customers...will always be the same.
Rhes GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 488	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:35:00 - [88] - Quote Davon Mandra'thin wrote: You supported the notion that CCP spent 18 months developing the CQs when they didn't, I dispelled the notion No, you didn't. EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Jenn aSide STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries 3598	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:35:00 - [89] - Quote Ila Dace wrote: Kagura Nikon wrote: The players did , whith their massive revotls, riots and demands that CCP scrapped the focus on incarna in favor of SPACE. CCP lost a LOT of costumers and only started gettign them back after they complied. THey leaarned a lesson. Do not expect anything incarna related soon. I really hate revisionist history. The statue shooting and unsubscribing was over the NeX, Pay-to-Win, and because Incarna didn't deliver enough avatar gameplay for the time it took to develop it. WiS types are delusional (as evidenced by you people still harping on this 2 years after it's all been decided). Do you think we all just made up our memories of US screaming "it's a space ship game" to CCP and our CSM reps?
Davon Mandra'thin Rotten Legion Ops 249	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:40:00 - [90] - Quote Rhes wrote: Davon Mandra'thin wrote: You supported the notion that CCP spent 18 months developing the CQs when they didn't, I dispelled the notion No, you didn't. You going to support that statement? No. Know why? Because you can't. That's as much talking to you as I can stand today.

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