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Diablo Venator	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:07:00 - [721] Originally by: Jowen Datloran I predict CCP will solve all this by removing all mission critical items in the near future. Hmm, how does this solve the issue of a 'greifer' NOT a pirate warping into your mission in high sec, shooting the big bounty ships while you tank them, taking the bounty and possibly the loot...? Or waits for you to loot the ship he/she has just popped so you get flagged to him so he can then pop you without intervention from concord?
Sendraks TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:08:00 - [722] Originally by: Bellum Eternus The PvE players (carebears) should stop thinking of this game as a PvE game. It is not. It's a PvP game that happens to have some PvE in it. The PvP players are not getting some PvP in your PvE, you're getting some PvE in their PvP. Yes and I'm sure most mission runners participate in PvP in some way. It might not be "combat PvP" but what does that matter, as Eve is not a pure "combat PvP" game. If you're expecting nothing but wall to wall ocmbat in Eve, then you have come to the wrong place. Originally by: Bellum Eternus PvE needs to exist to teach new players about the world and to get them started. Other than that there isn't any point to it. It just harms the game. How does it harm the game? I await with baited breath to hear one coherent, well thought argument on this matter. As I've not heard one yet, I could be waiting a while.
Sendraks TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:09:00 - [723] Originally by: Takanohana 1. In Hi-sec it should take such a long time to scan down a mission runner in deadspace that it won't be worth the griefers time, but worth it to a war-enemy. Mission critical drops should be removed from missions or made exclusively accessible to the mission runner, again removing griefplay. Time for scanning of safespots should stay the same. 2. In Lo-sec is should take a shorter time than Hi-sec to scan a mission runner, creating more risk, but not as short as it is now. This enables dedicated pirates and war-enemies to hunt down the mission runners, but also allows the mission runner to call in reinforcements. To avoid mass exodus of mission runners from low sec to Hi-sec rewards needs to be balanced to make it worthwile to take that risk. 3. In 0.0, no change from as it is. Again, rewards might need rebalancing. Just my 5 cents. ///Taka Your 5 cents are worth a lot. A good and sensible set of suggestions.
Lorn Yeager Gallente Blessed Souls	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:13:00 - [724] Originally by: Sendraks Moving all missions to low sec or not fixing them as they currently stand, is a restriction of choice in MMORPGs, which is generally considered to be a bad thing. So you'd rather restrict me in my choise to go in there and grap your missioncritical loot and ransomming it back to you. Begin sig: //-> Its Aloha time! Lorn Yeager Blessed Souls
Jowen Datloran Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:14:00 - [725] Edited by: Jowen Datloran on 07/12/2006 12:16:39 Originally by: Diablo Venator Originally by: Jowen Datloran I predict CCP will solve all this by removing all mission critical items in the near future. Hmm, how does this solve the issue of a 'greifer' NOT a pirate warping into your mission in high sec, shooting the big bounty ships while you tank them, taking the bounty and possibly the loot...? Or waits for you to loot the ship he/she has just popped so you get flagged to him so he can then pop you without intervention from concord? Why do you care? He is just helping you to complete the mission faster by shooting the ships. I would be like complaining that other people are ratting the belts in "your" system. This element would hardly be removed and I actually like that people can unexpectly show up during a mission. EDIT: Though my second prediction is that probing will nerfed soon as it is just far too easy in all aspects. ---------------- Mr. Science & Trade Institute
Fortior STK Scientific Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:15:00 - [726] I foresee a change.... A change to Probing and Scanning.... A change to Deadspace and Mission areas... I foresee.... Deadspace not yielding any results when probed.
Lorn Yeager Gallente Blessed Souls	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:17:00 - [727] Originally by: Diablo Venator Hmm, how does this solve the issue of a 'greifer' NOT a pirate warping into your mission in high sec, shooting the big bounty ships while you tank them, taking the bounty and possibly the loot...? Or waits for you to loot the ship he/she has just popped so you get flagged to him so he can then pop you without intervention from concord? What you describe is a risk you take as a missionrunner, or part of it. Allways has been. Time to accept it. The universe cant evolve around how YOU think others should interact with you or your activities. Begin sig: //-> Its Aloha time! Lorn Yeager Blessed Souls
Miss Overlord Gallente Ferrum Pugnus New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:17:00 - [728] Originally by: Oen jei Edited by: Oen jei on 07/12/2006 11:37:53 As a mission runner over the past few years ive seen : Loot going from good - decent - sparce - Crap Mission rewards / bonus good straight to crap we dont even get item bonus anymore eg skillbooks Missions getting more difficult bounties get less most mission runners plan in advance, this includes skill training too, we get shafted there / salvage is a perfect example The drop rate for salvagable components is poor Now we have to contend with grief play too. Now Lowsec & 0.0 Commander loot, Good quality named loot and chained bs spawns Depending what area you are in you know what BS/ rats your fighting too significantly better salvagable parts Now just for the hell of it you want to intercept a completely different aspect of the game for nothing more than self gratification, cheap kills and ZERO risk I run in a 20+ player system on average that is a 0.5 and its beginning to happen here to. I think that new players running missions 1.0 to 0.8 (lvl 1 and 2 agents) should be locked no access to anyone not associated with the main mission holder. 0.7 to 0.5 keep them open to the grief players if so desired, but as soon as they enter theyre not protected by whats nothing more than a legal loophole by concord. They themselves are target by the mission faction and mission runners PVP is a fine part of this game and has its place Piracy is needed and another excellent part of the game but so are mission runners as a result of balancing 0.0 being underused its been boosted substatntially to entice players out for the most part this is working - mission runners being nerfed for one reason to many of em so the risk v reward balance is being balanced u watn saftey u get less u want risk u get higher rewards. These posts represent my personal views and not those of my corp or alliance. These do not reflect offical alliance or corp views This is a disclaimer
Diablo Venator	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:17:00 - [729] Originally by: Takanohana 1. In Hi-sec it should take such a long time to scan down a mission runner in deadspace that it won't be worth the griefers time, but worth it to a war-enemy. Mission critical drops should be removed from missions or made exclusively accessible to the mission runner, again removing griefplay. Time for scanning of safespots should stay the same. 2. In Lo-sec is should take a shorter time than Hi-sec to scan a mission runner, creating more risk, but not as short as it is now. This enables dedicated pirates and war-enemies to hunt down the mission runners, but also allows the mission runner to call in reinforcements. To avoid mass exodus of mission runners from low sec to Hi-sec rewards needs to be balanced to make it worthwile to take that risk. 3. In 0.0, no change from as it is. Again, rewards might need rebalancing. Just my 5 cents. ///Taka True, but a simpliar solution would be:: Quote: High sec space missions: gates should be locked to the owner of the mission and his/her gang EXCEPTION: If the corp/alliance is at war all parties have access to the gates, no total safe spots in space. Low sec space missions: all gates should be free to anyone, you take your chances, but the rewards for the risk should be higher, either by agent payout or LP. This allows the Carebears to go about thier business, stikes a balance for the pirates and allows mission runners to ventrue into low sec knowing that there is a risk that they may get jumped.. My 10 cents.. But one thing is obvious.. this thread is little over 24hrs old... there are ALOT of people who think something should be changed one way or another..
Alex Harumichi Gallente Gradient Namtz'aar k'in	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:18:00 - [730] Originally by: Bellum Eternus The PvE players (carebears) should stop thinking of this game as a PvE game. It is not. It's a PvP game that happens to have some PvE in it. The PvP players are not getting some PvP in your PvE, you're getting some PvE in their PvP. PvE needs to exist to teach new players about the world and to get them started. Other than that there isn't any point to it. It just harms the game. Oh, bull***. This is not "Counterstrike in Space", however much you want to make it so. And PvE only harms the game? Oh, right. Wasn't it you whining in both this thread and another one that you started that you don't have any more targets in lowsec, and that it's ruining your game as a solo pirate? Why do you imagine those "targets" were in lowsec, previously? For your own amusement? Claiming that EVE is a "PvP game" is just as stupid as claiming it's a "PvE game". EVE consists or PVP/PVE/roleplay and lots of other elements, and the critical* thing it has is that it allows people to play the way they like -- even if that consists of just sitting at a highsec station and playing the market, never to undock. You're advocating forcing everyone to play in one, narrow way, and that's just stupid. Besides, it's starting to hurt you, too. People who don't want to pvp won't do it, you can't force it on them. They'll just quit the game, if it comes to that. End result: nothing for you and other Counterstrike fans to shoot at, and more whines about how "lowsec piracy is dead!". EVE is an ecosystem, and it needs all kinds of players and playstyles. Besides, most people don't have tunnel vision and they combine the different facets. They do some missions, they do some pvp, they mine, they do market stuff, they do whatever they feel like. All pvp, all the time gets boring, just as "all missions, all the time" does. Variety = good.

Sendraks TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:18:00 - [731] Edited by: Sendraks on 07/12/2006 12:19:15 Originally by: Lorn Yeager So you'd rather restrict me in my choise to go in there and grap your missioncritical loot and ransomming it back to you. So you'd like to be able to grab my mission critical loot and give me no chance to stop you? Do you not see the problem with what you're saying! I have no problem with you enterting my DS mission space providing I can do something about it that doesn't risk concord. You're not risking concord by your actions so neither should I. Come into the mission space. Be the bad guy. Revel in your choice. But at least I should have the choice of choosing whether to stop you or not. Is this really so hard to understand?
Radioactive Babe	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:19:00 - [732] Originally by: Bellum Eternus The PvE players (carebears) should stop thinking of this game as a PvE game. It is not. It's a PvP game that happens to have some PvE in it. The PvP players are not getting some PvP in your PvE, you're getting some PvE in their PvP. PvE needs to exist to teach new players about the world and to get them started. Other than that there isn't any point to it. It just harms the game. OH CRAP ... i just realised something, i should have been paying my subscription to the PvPers and not CCP ... because Bellum must be right, its the PvPers own this game and we are just in it to keep them amused. /sarcasm implant turned off I just cant figure out why people are saying that mission runners must be rounded up and forced out to low sec or 0.0 to be blobbed by pirates or alliances and their killmails posted on their epeen inflating websites ... (d'oh, sarcasm implant was still on) Why is it wrong for mission runners to stay as mission runners and just enjoy their game without interfering with "pvp"ers? Dont dare say risk vs reward, because that is gone out the window, pirates = no risk ...everyone knows it, the current round of griefing shows how much risk they have alas, poor risk and reward, I knew you well
James Duar Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:31:00 - [733] Edited by: James Duar on 07/12/2006 12:34:13 Originally by: Radioactive Babe Originally by: Bellum Eternus The PvE players (carebears) should stop thinking of this game as a PvE game. It is not. It's a PvP game that happens to have some PvE in it. The PvP players are not getting some PvP in your PvE, you're getting some PvE in their PvP. PvE needs to exist to teach new players about the world and to get them started. Other than that there isn't any point to it. It just harms the game. OH CRAP ... i just realised something, i should have been paying my subscription to the PvPers and not CCP ... because Bellum must be right, its the PvPers own this game and we are just in it to keep them amused. /sarcasm implant turned off I just cant figure out why people are saying that mission runners must be rounded up and forced out to low sec or 0.0 to be blobbed by pirates or alliances and their killmails posted on their epeen inflating websites ... (d'oh, sarcasm implant was still on) Why is it wrong for mission runners to stay as mission runners and just enjoy their game without interfering with "pvp"ers? Dont dare say risk vs reward, because that is gone out the window, pirates = no risk ...everyone knows it, the current round of griefing shows how much risk they have The entertaining thing is that it's often the PVP'ers who are running the Lvl 4 missions as a way to get ISK during their EVE slow times. So entertainingly, a lot of these people are in fact inflation neutral with regards to the value of ISK, since they run Lvl 4's to buy ships, which they then go and PVP in until they get them blown up. But, because they PVP, they're probably killing other ships as well, so the net amount of ISK exiting the game via them neatly balances as being slightly greater. The other point to consider is that someone who only missions isn't really adding to inflation either. While they may have an awful lot of ISK, unless they are spending that ISK in the economy it can't contribute to inflation because it doesn't effect people's valuations of things. In fact, if they never lose ships at all, then they'll still end up being inflation neutral overall because they will not be aggressively buying ships with their ISK - it doesn't enter the economy. Of course, mission runners overall do lose ships - rather a lot of ships - as evidenced by how easily I can sell the high end named damage controls I find from ratting - which neatly funnels their ISK to me, which eventually blows up with my ships or gets shot as my ammo or burned in my POS's - whatever. So stop freakin' wailing on mission runners unless you want to present me a compelling economic argument as to why they're ruining the game. EDIT: Actually there is a mistake in my analysis - the inflation in the economy is actually going to come from people who Lvl 4 mission in order to PVP, since the inflation will be based on the availability of ISK to them to replace ships. However, seeing as inflation by CCP's own analysis is more or less under control, I hardly think the system as it was has a problem.
Oen jei	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:32:00 - [734] For all the narrow focused people in Avons camp try to follow this : Its a nice day, get a pinic together we'll go down the park today. All the kids are having a laugh on the swings, slides sandpits. adults chatting away one guys had a problem with the car so theyve come on there bikes. i'll pop over later see if i can sort your motor out with you. Suddenly out of nowhere a guy comes rushing through the kids knocking them over, grabs the food, then legs it. Anger takes over you jump up to give chase, but you cannot, your feet are in concrete your hands are tied behind your back, but i took the kids to the park i knew the risk involved but hey st happens, nice one mate enjoy the food. Remove the concord cripple for us, i have no problem stuffing a precision cruise missile x14 up some griefer's (NOT PIRATE or PVPer)arse, but not when we are the ones who'll be concorded.**
James Duar Merch Industrial	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:37:00 - [735] Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 07/12/2006 12:35:59 Originally by: checkmarquet Originally by: Ishan Shade I know allot of people start "griefing" because of attitudes just like yours. So all in all you have yourself to thank for it. no, just because cant do anything else but annoying people trying to compensate their lifes.=) I tell you something: I could have easily started to grief mission runners now and ruin their missions, my alt probes down stuff in 50 seconds, but I don't, because the game mechanic is broken. Nevertheless it can't be that high-sec mission running seems to have such a big advantage over low. sec. activities, that 'Vets' hug there in high sec with out real risk. I can only repeat, let some rig stuff mainly in low sec and some mainly in 0.0 drop and then the market balances the rewards in low sec and high sec. ( The only thing that makes me want to go and probe down a certain 'breed' mission runners are some exaggerated whines here. It's about time that those grown-up chars with 20-30 mil SP leave mummies home and risk something for their rewards and play with others. ) Why? Who cares what they do. If they have loads of ISK and don't care to spend it then it doesn't effect the economy at all. It's only if they're rampantly spending their ISK that there will be an effect. Which the implication throughout the thread has been that they're not.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:38:00 - [736] Originally by: Oen jei Remove the concord cripple for us, i have no problem stuffing a precision cruise missile x14 up some griefer's (NOT PIRATE or PVPer)arse, but not when we are the ones who'll be concorded. You choose that "cripple". If you don't like it, move out of hi-sec. You have a choice. Oh, wait, you like Concord most of the time, just not when it gets in the way of you griefing some guy who is just NPC'ing. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Exlegion Caldari Legion's Knight	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:39:00 - [737] Edited by: Exlegion on 07/12/2006 12:42:07 Edited by: Exlegion on 07/12/2006 12:41:41 Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 07/12/2006 12:37:17 Originally by: checkmarquet Originally by: Ishan Shade I know allot of people start "griefing" because of attitudes just like yours. So all in all you have yourself to thank for it. no, just because cant do anything else but annoying people trying to compensate their lifes.=) I tell you something: I could have easily started to grief mission runners now and ruin their missions, my alt probes down stuff in 50 seconds, but I don't, because the game mechanic is broken. Nevertheless it can't be that high-sec mission running seems to have such a big advantage over low. sec. activities, that 'Vets' hug there in high sec with out real risk. I can only repeat, let some rig stuff mainly drop in low sec and some mainly in 0.0 and then the market balances the rewards in low sec and high sec. ( The only thing that makes me want to go and probe down a certain 'breed' mission runners are some exaggerated whines here. It's about time that those grown-up chars with 20-30 mil SP leave mummies home and risk something for their rewards and play with others. ) Why? Why should those you call "carebears" leave high sec? Because you say so? I'm a casual player. I just don't have time to make this game a second job. I want to log in and play. Why should I play your style of game? PLEASE tell me!
Miri Tirzan Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:40:00 - [738] Risk or no Risk. Right or wrong. These dont matter for what is under discussion. What is being discussed is the griefing of mission runners. Like many have said, some one warps in and kills the NPCs, I may not like it but really, I could careless. Warp in and still loot, well, you risk getting shot by the MR. I have no problem with that. Warp in and agro the room or take the item that keeps the mission runner from completing the mission. That is grief play. You know grief play, that is when you dont gain anything but the satisfaction that you have hurt someone else but did not gain anything your self! The rules of Eve allow almost any kinda game play and style but griefing is not allowed. So, if some one griefs you on a mission and you cannot complete the mission, petition it. Petition someone enough and thier trial account might get banned. To sum up my position, if you are going into someone elses mission not to gain something but to force them to loose standing just because you can, then your doing grief play and deserve to pay the price. If your smart enough to find a way to rob them or blackmail them, more power to you. But giving some one grief just to cause grief needs to be petitioned. And yes, CCP once again messed up with the dumbing down of Eve. This is part of the "new player experiance" where T1 got a boost, T2 got nerfed, and everything that needed real skill is going away. Yeah for the new EASY MODE Eve. svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
Lorn Yeager Gallente Blessed Souls	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:42:00 - [739] Originally by: Sendraks So you'd like to be able to grab my mission critical loot and give me no chance to stop you? Do you not see the problem with what you're saying! Its not your deadspace pocket, its ß deadspace pocket. The loot is there for all to take. However, the second I empty YOUR can, you can shoot me down. You cant justify a flagging of rats, so that they only can be shot by you. It makes no sense. You must understand its not an instant. They are mindless NPC's but they do belong to a hostile faction, and as such - not your property. Anyone can shoot them (this it not WoW) The only viable solutions are either to lock out other players, destroying the very principles of this game. Or allowing players to shoot eachother in DD complexes with concord turning the blind eye. Both will cause other and far worse problems. Begin sig: //-> Its Aloha time! Lorn Yeager Blessed Souls
Sendraks TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:43:00 - [740] Edited by: Sendraks on 07/12/2006 12:44:57 Originally by: Avon You choose that "cripple". No we didn't. I don't recall actively choosing to have people, too dumb to use probes previously, come ruin my game time for me where I could do nothing. As I understand it, this was something CPP did. Originally by: Avon If you don't like it, move out of hi-sec. You have a choice. Apparently not. The choice should be to choose mission running in high sec for ok profit or mission running in low sec for a lot more profit. Right now its, potentially not be ablt to run missions in high sec at all versus run missions in low sec for negligible profit given the considerable risks. How it SHOULD be is in the first example where the choices are. How things are is choice limited. Basically the choice you are presenting is "Play the game the way I say or leave the game" which is about as much choice as a religious fanatic saying "Believe in my god or burn in hell." Gotta love those crazy non-choice, choices. Originally by: Avon Oh, wait, you like Concord most of the time, just not when it gets in the way of you griefing some guy who is just NPC'ing. There is a rare genius to this stupidity.

Plutoinum German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:44:00 - [741] Edited by: Plutoinum on 07/12/2006 12:44:12 Originally by: James Duar Why? Who cares what they do. If they have loads of ISK and don't care to spend it then it doesn't effect the economy at all. It's only if they're rampantly spending their ISK that there will be an effect. Which the implication throughout the thread has been that they're not. Whenever someone gets rewards in form of loot/isk or rig components it has an effect on the whole game. We use the same market, we use our isk to buy ships, mods, bpos etc., we all compete with eachother. No one plays in his own little economy, there is only one. CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix.
Sendraks TOHA Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:46:00 - [742] Originally by: Plutoinum Whenever someone gets rewards in form of loot/isk or rig components it has an effect on the whole game. It only has an effect on the game if they spend the money they have earned or sell the items they have. Otherwise it has no demonstrable effect on you at all.
Exlegion Caldari Legion's Knight	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:46:00 - [743] Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 07/12/2006 12:44:12 Originally by: James Duar Why? Who cares what they do. If they have loads of ISK and don't care to spend it then it doesn't effect the economy at all. It's only if they're rampantly spending their ISK that there will be an effect. Which the implication throughout the thread has been that they're not. Whenever someone gets rewards in form of loot/isk or rig components it has an effect on the whole game. We use the same market, we use our isk to buy ships, mods, bpos etc., we all compete with eachother. No one plays in his own little economy, there is only one. And who do you think is buying the faction mods you're selling?
Radioactive Babe	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:48:00 - [744] Originally by: Exlegion Why? Why should those you call "carebears" they leave high sec? Because you say so? I'm a casual player. I just don't have time to make this game a second job. I want to log in and play. Why should I play your style of game? PLEASE tell me! /iraqi information minister There is no problem, the friendly people in low sec and 0.0 will welcome you with open arms, you will be offered the nicest systems, lovely stations to dock in and of course the exotic dancers wink wink /meh, damn sarcasm implant was stuck on again.... They want you in 0.0 so they can increase their epeen to prodigious proportions. Its as simple as that. 0.0 cant handle more people in fleet battles, it couldnt handle the amount of people in fleet battles 2 years ago. What they want is nice juicy novice pvpers to chase around and pop when the pvper should have been on the corp mining op alas, poor risk and reward, I knew you well
Exlegion Caldari Legion's Knight	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:48:00 - [745] All these griefers are is bored kiddies looking for ways to twist game mechanics to their sad miserable ways. It wouldn't surprise me if they're just a game or two away from quitting EVE and finding another mmo game to go harass people on.
Fink Angel Caldari	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:48:00 - [746] I've got 25 mill SPs and I like to run high sec missions. I'll say it again, I'm not interfering with your game in any way whatsoever, except providing 1/30,000th or the lag, so why do you have a problem with that? I do occasionally venture into Lowsec and 0.0 and of course it goes with the territory to PvP and take the risk of death there. However if I get podded even the clone costs me many millions now. Avon, Blacklight and all the heavy hitters. How do you make your ISK then? Or do you never lose ships to PvP? Surely you can't make a living just through PvP all the time? One of the devs (Oveur?) said that ALL hardcore PvPers (or was it pirates?) have carebear alts.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:49:00 - [747] Originally by: Sendraks Originally by: Plutoinum Whenever someone gets rewards in form of loot/isk or rig components it has an effect on the whole game. It only has an effect on the game if they spend the money they have earned or sell the items they have. Otherwise it has no demonstrable effect on you at all. Not buying or selling stuff has just as much of an effect as actually doing it has. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Miri Tirzan Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:51:00 - [748] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Oen jei Remove the concord cripple for us, i have no problem stuffing a precision cruise missile x14 up some griefer's (NOT PIRATE or PVPer)arse, but not when we are the ones who'll be concorded. You choose that "cripple". If you don't like it, move out of hi-sec. You have a choice. Oh, wait, you like Concord most of the time, just not when it gets in the way of you griefing some guy who is just NPC'ing. Avon your full of crap and I know you, so I know you know your full it. Casual players don't have the time or the desire to go play full contact combat in 0.0 or low sec. They play in high sec for a few hours or less a day. There are times when this would not be grief play. If there was a wardec in place or if the mission runner was being forced to pay protection for him to complete the mission. Other than those two situations, anyone keeping the mission runner from completing the mission is doing grief play. The player that is doing the griefing looses nothing, has no risk, does not even have the risks that go with sucide ganking. This misuse of game mechanics does not cost them anything but does cost the mission runner standing. All so the griefer can get the joy of knowing they have ruined someones day. svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
Radioactive Babe	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:51:00 - [749] Originally by: Lorn Yeager Its not your deadspace pocket, its ß deadspace pocket. The loot is there for all to take. Its a pocket that did not exist or was empty until the mission runner accepted a mission ... therefore it belongs to him alas, poor risk and reward, I knew you well
Doc Extropy Gallente Cradle of Freedom Inc.	Posted - 2006.12.07 12:52:00 - [750] Originally by: Radioactive Babe Originally by: Exlegion Why? Why should those you call "carebears" they leave high sec? Because you say so? I'm a casual player. I just don't have time to make this game a second job. I want to log in and play. Why should I play your style of game? PLEASE tell me! /iraqi information minister There is no problem, the friendly people in low sec and 0.0 will welcome you with open arms, you will be offered the nicest systems, lovely stations to dock in and of course the exotic dancers wink wink /meh, damn sarcasm implant was stuck on again.... They want you in 0.0 so they can increase their epeen to prodigious proportions. Its as simple as that. 0.0 cant handle more people in fleet battles, it couldnt handle the amount of people in fleet battles 2 years ago. What they want is nice juicy novice pvpers to chase around and pop when the pvper should have been on the corp mining op Contact me or Brutara Solutor ingame if interested in constructive low security / 0.0 play style. Originally by: Fortior Good things come to those who persevere.



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