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Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
89
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:40:00 -
[241] - Quote
Edit: I should be nicer... |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:41:00 -
[242] - Quote
Skunk Gracklaw wrote:If I knew pubbies would get this mad about kestrels I would have started using them months ago. Who was the brave Goon hero who protected the blue ice with a kestrel?
Yes, please clown, enlighten us with your 200k ISK ship choice.
|

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:41:00 -
[243] - Quote
Vernn wrote:How about some risk vs. reward math......
2 Ice Harvesters roughly 3 million 1 Retriever roughly 5 million
Oh they pod you too so...
1 Clone roughly 3 million
So about 11 million I'm risking, and they are risking a 200k kestrel with some missile launchers on it. Lets just go nuts and call it a million isk.
11 to 1 my risk verse theirs Ok. With that Retriever, against that Kestrel, your probability of death is ~0%, so your risk is 11M+ù0 = 0. Their probability of death is 100%, so their risk is 200k +ù 1 = 200k ISK.
So what's the problem again? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Bubanni
SniggWaffe
42
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:42:00 -
[244] - Quote
:) did you get ganked by us on your main? trolololol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqc2gj_G2zY |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:42:00 -
[245] - Quote
Oh, and for the record, if they were suicide ganking me with 6 million ISK ships, this post wouldn't exist. I would be totally fine with that. You wanna control something, then pay the price. |

Acute Delirium
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:45:00 -
[246] - Quote
Vernn wrote:How about some risk vs. reward math......
2 Ice Harvesters roughly 3 million 1 Retriever roughly 5 million
Oh they pod you too so...
1 Clone roughly 3 million
So about 11 million I'm risking, and they are risking a 200k kestrel with some missile launchers on it. Lets just go nuts and call it a million isk.
11 to 1 my risk verse theirs
Oh they pod you, do they? I get it now, you're mining AFK.
I'm not going to touch the rest, because, to paraphrase you, "you talk like there's nothing you DO know". |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:46:00 -
[247] - Quote
Thank you for that. I need more exhibits supporting my claim that you guys are griefers.
Wikipedia entry for griefer....
Quote:A griefer is a player who does things in a game to deliberately cause annoyance ("grief" in the sense of "giving someone grief") for the griefer's own enjoyment. Such a player is a particular nuisance in online gaming communities, since griefers often cannot be deterred by penalties related to in-game goals.
Now, going by what he just posted, is he a griefer?
|

Skunk Gracklaw
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
580
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:46:00 -
[248] - Quote
Vernn wrote:Skunk Gracklaw wrote:If I knew pubbies would get this mad about kestrels I would have started using them months ago. Who was the brave Goon hero who protected the blue ice with a kestrel? Yes, please clown, enlighten us with your 200k ISK ship choice. Nobody is using kestrels. Personally, I use a thorax for untanked mackinaws and any of the lesser exhumers/barges, a brutix for tanked mackinaws and untanked Hulks, and a Tempest for tanked hulks.
CCP caved in to the whiners and nerfed insurance but luckily for me (and Gallente ice) my alliance now provides the insurance payout plus a bounty for every criminal miner I blow up. |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:47:00 -
[249] - Quote
Acute Delirium wrote:Vernn wrote:How about some risk vs. reward math......
2 Ice Harvesters roughly 3 million 1 Retriever roughly 5 million
Oh they pod you too so...
1 Clone roughly 3 million
So about 11 million I'm risking, and they are risking a 200k kestrel with some missile launchers on it. Lets just go nuts and call it a million isk.
11 to 1 my risk verse theirs
Oh they pod you, do they? I get it now, you're mining AFK. I'm not going to touch the rest, because, to paraphrase you, "you talk like there's nothing you DO know".
Nope, first time I just had one of those "what the hell is going on" moments and couldn't click warp out fast enough. Second time I got away before he could pop me, but he was trying.
|

Ocih
Space Mermaids
14
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:48:00 -
[250] - Quote
Kestral wins to Ret = Unfair.
Try Isotope hotdrop wins to everything, how fair is that.
The irony being, drone regions have blue ice if I'm not mistaken. Deklien has white so goons are actually making thier "enemy" pretty rich. Makes you wonder. |

Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
52
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:51:00 -
[251] - Quote
Vernn wrote: [...]
2) Fair enough. I'll leave the game then for another with some semblance of fairness built into it.
[...]
I can haz ur stuffs?
|

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:51:00 -
[252] - Quote
Vernn wrote:Now, going by what he just posted, is he a griefer? Nope. But it sure disproves your previous claims of what was needed and not. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:51:00 -
[253] - Quote
I have to make an update. I just checked the kill mail and he was flying a catalyst, so its actually................................
600k ISK ship
versus 5 million ISK ship
well 8 million with ice harvesters
Real balanced. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:53:00 -
[254] - Quote
Vernn wrote:I have to make an update. I just checked the kill mail and he was flying a catalyst, so its actually................................
600k ISK ship
versus 5 million ISK ship GǪand the question is still Gǣso?Gǥ
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Skunk Gracklaw
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
580
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:55:00 -
[255] - Quote
Vernn wrote:I have to make an update. I just checked the kill mail and he was flying a catalyst, so its actually................................
600k ISK ship
versus 5 million ISK ship
well 8 million with ice harvesters
Real balanced. lol
|

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:55:00 -
[256] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Vernn wrote:I have to make an update. I just checked the kill mail and he was flying a catalyst, so its actually................................
600k ISK ship
versus 5 million ISK ship GǪand the question is still Gǣso?Gǥ
Go away. You're just trolling. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 05:59:00 -
[257] - Quote
Vernn wrote:Go away. You're just trolling. No, I'm asking you a question.
So what? What's unbalanced with a 2M+ killing ship (further tweaked for killing at the complete expense of survival) being able to kill an 8M utility ship that (most likely) was tweaked to become weaker than usual?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:03:00 -
[258] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Vernn wrote:Go away. You're just trolling. No, I'm asking you a question. So what? What's unbalanced with a 2M+ killing ship (further tweaked for killing at the complete expense of survival) being able to kill an 8M utility ship that (most likely) was tweaked to become weaker than usual (but which, with a few other tweaks, could be given a fair chance against the gank ship)?
A catalyst is 600k on the market. Not sure where you're getting your 2 million from.
If they want to suicide gank they should have more risk than 1 million ISK.
And Tippia, you're a pirate, I get it. You you love fighting and blowing people up. Understood.
I'm not that type. If I wanted that I would be out in 0.0. The place that was specifically made for this kinda stuff.
I just wanna mine some ice. Thats it.
If someone wants to gank me, fine, just make their risk equal to mine. |

Brujo Loco
Brujeria Teologica
30
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:06:00 -
[259] - Quote
Khamelean wrote:Many years ago there was awesome 3D chat program called Quake. You could pick the colours of your avatar and enter an amazing 3D world with other plays and talk all day long.
One day I was in this really cool virtual space called DM6, just chatting away, when all of a sudden I got blown up by a rocket. I re-spawned and got shot in the face with a nail gun. I re-spawned again and I got zapped with a lightning gun.
I couldn't understand, here I was just standing around not interfering with anyone and they just wouldn't stop killing me over and over, no matter what I did.
What a fun story about and idiot who doesn't know what game he is playing.
FACT - Whenever you log in to eve online you issue a challenge to over 3 hundred thousand other people to try and kill you and take your stuff. If your don't like it, don't play Eve Online.
LOL ... Love the analogy. Although it's pretty obvious he's trolling your story is exactly that. Or the guy that plays Engineer in BF and just wants to repair tanks.
I think we have a severe distortion of the intent of the game, to a point where people are totally misunderstanding the basis of the it. EVE IS ABOUT SHIP Pew Pew and everything within the game is tied to it. Building, Mining, Researching, Blowing up and Reconstructing again in an endless circle.
Incarna failed in so many levels by trying to create a new level of reality that didnt tie directly to the main point of the game, and not to mention that they released a half baked attempt that wasnt even polished, which is a double blunder. I need to stress that for obvious reasons.
Back on the idea, I think this Degree'd Troll just wants to show us the current mindset of a lot of people in the game atm.
We are seeing our Battlefield server flooded by people that want to be Medics and Engineers without shooting and being killed and getting annoyed and then being vocal, problem with this throng of Medics that just drop medpacks endlessly and engineers that just repair mindlessly is that they paypal donate constantly like the regular players and in the end they are more than the rest. So here comes the interesting conundrum. A fully paid and upgraded server where everybody is slowly becoming static Engineers and Medics will be ... futile. IF we extrapolate to the future it poses problems of a new order of magnitude, but we need to understand the light being shed by Trollgineer.
See, the troll is showing us the very obvious and the emo rage that accompanies it and Tippia as usual is reflecting a particular pragmatic stance that is the norm here, seconded by several fellow players, but it is all practically useless against the self-deluded notion of the Hi Sec dweller that embodies the TRUE CAREBEAR credo of forced PEACE.
There are no bullets, missiles nor T2 Ammo able to even nickel that carebear mental shield.
Trollgineer OP is an amazing window into the debacle that we live in atm in EVE.
And this is what we need to analyze seriously.
Trollgineer even dared to utter that CCP should need to refocus THEIR OWN vision, and this is perhaps, in this pseudo-analysis of Troll dung the core Issue behind it.
Why is OUR Battlefield server becoming infested by Engineers and Medics that dont want to shoot? Thus creating the further parallax of issues behind this one?
And be with me for a little further, comrades, why is CCP so estranged from this vision when it comes to the playerbase? Is perhaps the way they market the game the main culprit at creating this issue? Or the Expectations of the new player are completely wrong from the start by their own doing? Is the new gen of gamers so "crystallized" in a metaphysical way of speaking, that they pretend to keep crystallizing here?
What I see is a CLOT, a blood CLOT, slowly forming from the extremes, (Hi Sec/Null) beginning to choke the main arteries of EVE from the borders and from within. Perhaps more like Arteriosclerosis , or just the hardening of mindsets.
There's no way one or the other side can reconcile as the player base attribute a certain type of value to ISK and from there to Ships and Modules. Fact is we could theorize on this for so long , we simply need a more analytical view from CCP itself to discern this issue.
It's underlying yet overtly apparent.
Anyone following me and what I'm trying to convey?
Oh well, just my thoughts.
Also Trollgineer 8/10 for making me visualize these issues as choking arteries. Inner Sayings of BrujoLoco: http://eve-files.com/sig/brujoloco |

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
221
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:06:00 -
[260] - Quote
First Lieutenant Dan wrote:
HOLY ****. Overkill!!!! Overkill!!!! Thread derailments do not need a nuke!!  "Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:09:00 -
[261] - Quote
Brujo Loco wrote:Khamelean wrote:Many years ago there was awesome 3D chat program called Quake. You could pick the colours of your avatar and enter an amazing 3D world with other plays and talk all day long.
One day I was in this really cool virtual space called DM6, just chatting away, when all of a sudden I got blown up by a rocket. I re-spawned and got shot in the face with a nail gun. I re-spawned again and I got zapped with a lightning gun.
I couldn't understand, here I was just standing around not interfering with anyone and they just wouldn't stop killing me over and over, no matter what I did.
What a fun story about and idiot who doesn't know what game he is playing.
FACT - Whenever you log in to eve online you issue a challenge to over 3 hundred thousand other people to try and kill you and take your stuff. If your don't like it, don't play Eve Online. LOL ... Love the analogy. Although it's pretty obvious he's trolling your story is exactly that. Or the guy that plays Engineer in BF and just wants to repair tanks. I think we have a severe distortion of the intent of the game, to a point where people are totally misunderstanding the basis of the it. EVE IS ABOUT SHIP Pew Pew and everything within the game is tied to it. Building, Mining, Researching, Blowing up and Reconstructing again in an endless circle. Incarna failed in so many levels by trying to create a new level of reality that didnt tie directly to the main point of the game, and not to mention that they released a half baked attempt that wasnt even polished, which is a double blunder. I need to stress that for obvious reasons. Back on the idea, I think this Degree'd Troll just wants to show us the current mindset of a lot of people in the game atm. We are seeing our Battlefield server flooded by people that want to be Medics and Engineers without shooting and being killed and getting annoyed and then being vocal, problem with this throng of Medics that just drop medpacks endlessly and engineers that just repair mindlessly is that they paypal donate constantly like the regular players and in the end they are more than the rest. So here comes the interesting conundrum. A fully paid and upgraded server where everybody is slowly becoming static Engineers and Medics will be ... futile. IF we extrapolate to the future it poses problems of a new order of magnitude, but we need to understand the light being shed by Trollgineer. See, the troll is showing us the very obvious and the emo rage that accompanies it and Tippia as usual is reflecting a particular pragmatic stance that is the norm here, seconded by several fellow players, but it is all practically useless against the self-deluded notion of the Hi Sec dweller that embodies the TRUE CAREBEAR credo of forced PEACE. There are no bullets, missiles nor T2 Ammo able to even nickel that carebear mental shield. Trollgineer OP is an amazing window into the debacle that we live in atm in EVE. And this is what we need to analyze seriously. Trollgineer even dared to utter that CCP should need to refocus THEIR OWN vision, and this is perhaps, in this pseudo-analysis of Troll dung the core Issue behind it. Why is OUR Battlefield server becoming infested by Engineers and Medics that dont want to shoot? Thus creating the further parallax of issues behind this one? And be with me for a little further, comrades, why is CCP so estranged from this vision when it comes to the playerbase? Is perhaps the way they market the game the main culprit at creating this issue? Or the Expectations of the new player are completely wrong from the start by their own doing? Is the new gen of gamers so "crystallized" in a metaphysical way of speaking, that they pretend to keep crystallizing here? What I see is a CLOT, a blood CLOT, slowly forming from the extremes, (Hi Sec/Null) beginning to choke the main arteries of EVE from the borders and from within. Perhaps more like Arteriosclerosis , or just the hardening of mindsets. There's no way one or the other side can reconcile as the player base attribute a certain type of value to ISK and from there to Ships and Modules. Fact is we could theorize on this for so long , we simply need a more analytical view from CCP itself to discern this issue. It's underlying yet overtly apparent. Anyone following me and what I'm trying to convey? Oh well, just my thoughts. Also Trollgineer 8/10 for making me visualize these issues as choking arteries.
If the whole game is supposed to be about fighting then why the distinction between 0.0 and "high sec?"
Why wouldn't they just make every system in the game 0.0?
Clearly the intent was not to make the game so that you could be attacked anywhere. Otherwise why put in security status?
The problem is they didn't go far enough. |

Skunk Gracklaw
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
580
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:10:00 -
[262] - Quote
Vernn wrote:A catalyst is 600k on the market. Not sure where you're getting your 2 million from. Unless you're claiming that bare hulls are killing you the 2 million isk comes from buying guns and mods for the hull.
|

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:10:00 -
[263] - Quote
Vernn wrote:A catalyst is 600k on the market. Not sure where you're getting your 2 million from. Think about it. Look at the price I'm comparing to.
Quote:If they want to suicide gank they should have more risk than 1 million ISK. They do.
Quote:And Tippia, you're a pirate, I get it. No, you don't get it.
Quote:I'm not that type. If I wanted that I would be out in 0.0. The place that was specifically made for this kinda stuff. GǪas was highsec. It's not the safe zone you're thinking it is. Combat happens there, and this specific type of combat in particular.
Quote:I just wanna mine some ice. Thats it. Then you need to take the responsibilities that come with that choice. That includes using safety tactics, proper fits, situational awareness, a good spot, and all the stuff that is freely available at your disposal. No, you can't GÇ£just do your thingGÇ¥ because this game doesn't work like that. It's a PvP-centric unsharded non-instanced open-sandbox MMO with a deeply integrated market and industry. GÇ£Just doing your thingGÇ¥ simply isn't supported by the game mechanics GÇö you are always cog in a much larger machinery. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:14:00 -
[264] - Quote
Vernn wrote:If the whole game is supposed to be about fighting then why the distinction between 0.0 and "high sec?"
Why wouldn't they just make every system in the game 0.0? Because they offer different buckets and spades to play in the sandbox with.
It's not a distinction between GÇ£combat zoneGÇ¥ and GÇ£non-combat zoneGÇ¥ GÇö it's a distinction between GÇ£combat zone with A, B, and CGÇ¥ and GÇ£combat zone with B, C, D and EGÇ¥.
Quote:Clearly the intent was not to make the game so that you could be attacked anywhere. Otherwise why put in security status? No. The intent is and has always been that you can be attacked anywhere. The purpose of security status has already been explained and does not contradict this intent in any way. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
114
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:16:00 -
[265] - Quote
machariel , officer fitted .. price tag 2,5 bil 5x torp typhoons / suicide gank fitted ... price tag 150mil
2500 mil v 150 mil ... typhoons would most likely win
you cant balance it via price... |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:16:00 -
[266] - Quote
[/quote]Then you need to take the responsibilities that come with that choice. That includes using safety tactics, proper fits, situational awareness, a good spot, and all the stuff that is freely available at your disposal. No, you can't GÇ£just do your thingGÇ¥ because this game doesn't work like that. It's a PvP-centric unsharded non-instanced open-sandbox MMO with a deeply integrated market and industry. GÇ£Just doing your thingGÇ¥ simply isn't supported by the game mechanics GÇö you are always cog in a much larger machinery.[/quote]
1) What safety tactics should I use when every blue ice belt is camped with gankers?
2) What fit should I use on a retriever to survive a gank?
3) What situational awareness is there to be had when he warps in 1000m from me, locks in a second, and open fires?
4) What good spot? Every belt is camped from their own admission.
5) What is freely available at my disposal that will stop them from ganking me as I mine ice?
6) Your right, this game "doesn't work like that" which is why I made this post so maybe someday it will work like that.
7) I hate it when games try to force me to do things. I'm the one paying the bills. I like hauling, doing missions, building stuff. I love 99% of eve. Why should I pay to be forced to do something I don't want? I don't want to be a cog. I want to be me and enjoy the game that I pay money for. Thats why I don't pay people to hit me with hammers. I wouldn't like it. |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:20:00 -
[267] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Vernn wrote:If the whole game is supposed to be about fighting then why the distinction between 0.0 and "high sec?"
Why wouldn't they just make every system in the game 0.0? Because they offer different buckets and spades to play in the sandbox with. It's not a distinction between GÇ£combat zoneGÇ¥ and GÇ£non-combat zoneGÇ¥ GÇö it's a distinction between GÇ£combat zone with A, B, and CGÇ¥ and GÇ£combat zone with B, C, D and EGÇ¥. Quote:Clearly the intent was not to make the game so that you could be attacked anywhere. Otherwise why put in security status? No. The intent is and has always been that you can be attacked anywhere. The purpose of security status has already been explained and does not contradict this intent in any way.
As I've said I have no problem being ganked on occasion, as long as there are penalties should someone choose to do that. It is absolutely ridiculous that someone with a -10 security rating who has been blowing people up all day would not be instantly attacked by concord when they entered a system.
If the guy wants to gank me he should have to go do something to get his rating back up before he can do it again. The way it stands now he gets virtually no penalties.
If I go to 0.0 there will be penalties.
If I attack someone their alliance will make me pay penalties.
For the love of God, if I turn down more than one agent mission twice in 4 hours there are penalties.
There is no penalty hardly at all with what they are doing. |

M5 Tuttle
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
24
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:21:00 -
[268] - Quote
guise i think he is serious, actually. makes me sad to be an engineer, honestly. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
2038
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:22:00 -
[269] - Quote
Vernn wrote:1) What safety tactics should I use when every blue ice belt is camped with gankers?
2) What fit should I use on a retriever to survive a gank?
3) What situational awareness is there to be had when he warps in 1000m from me, locks in a second, and open fires?
4) What good spot? Every belt is camped from their own admission.
5) What is freely available at my disposal that will stop them from ganking me as I mine ice?
6) Your right, this game "doesn't work like that" which is why I made this post so maybe someday it will work like that.
7) I hate it when games try to force me to do things. I'm the one paying the bills. I like hauling, doing missions, building stuff. I love 99% of eve. Why should I pay to be forced to do something I don't want? I don't want to be a cog. I want to be me and enjoy the game that I pay money for. Thats why I don't pay people to hit me with hammers. I wouldn't like it. 1) Being aligned. Keeping an eye on your scanner. Fitting a tank. Keeping track of known gankers. Keeping track of the map statistics. 2) Not a retriever to begin withGǪ Other than that, shield extender (and rigs), suitcase. 3) He'll show up on the overview long before he can lock you, and he'll show up on scanner long before he shows up on the overview. 4) No, they just camp in Gallente highsec space. 5) All of the above. 6) How about, instead of ruining the game, you find a game that works the way you want it to work? 7) Tough. See above.
Quote:As I've said I have no problem being ganked on occasion, as long as there are penalties should someone choose to do that. There are. Like the rest of the game, most of them are player-driven. If you as a player choose not to drive them, then that's your choice and your problem. The reason those -10s can go into highsec and not be instantly blown up is because it's your job to do that, and you've chosen not to.
Quote:If I go to 0.0 there will be penalties.
If I attack someone their alliance will make me pay penalties. GǪand the same holds true in highsec. It's just that you choose not to make them pay. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
If not, contact Miss DSA to shed your wardecs. |

Vernn
The Scope Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.13 06:22:00 -
[270] - Quote
Oh, and why should I be screwed when I go to get some gas for my pos so I can do some research and just because some clown dictated that a gank squad should be made I have to suffer? |
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