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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 10 post(s)
Helevorn Feanaro	Posted - 2007.08.15 13:32:00 - [331] Originally by: Kil'Roy Originally by: Yuki Nagato Originally by: Kil'Roy It's amazing how much instant gratification people seem to want in this game. This isn't, and should not be, some form of "Space" Half Life II or Unreal Tournament 2007. Since when was mineral importation and production 'instant gratification'? Do you even know how much effort is involved, even with carriers? Yes, I do... People complain how much Blob Warefare is bad, yet want to be able to replace their losses quickly to get back into that Blob. People complain how insurance pays too much, but complain how it is too hard to get the materials to replace their ships. If it is too easy to replace your losses, then Blob warefare is all you will have. The harder it is to replace your losses the less likely you would be willing to risk your ship, and the more the well balanced Alliances will have the advantage. The way to make it so not everyone is flying either a BS, Dread, or Carrier is to keep it hard to replace them. Make it so the hardest thing is to keep flying a BS, not training for it. Team work and diversification should be key. Don't only have Pvp'ers, or Carebears, have the proper mix in your Alliance. The future of this game shouldn't be about the next hard thing to train for, but are you organized well enough to keep flying the best. The well organized Nation "Alliance" should have the advantage. I think CCP is on the right path with this, but may take some time to balance it out. /signed
Fonze Sam	Posted - 2007.08.15 14:00:00 - [332] I would suggest the following take on the already mentioned æsuper veldsÆ idea: How about introducing hidden belts of Blackveldspar & Darkscordite? I would envisage these belts to be rare, in 0.0 only, but once found to be major finds. These can only be scanned down by the ORE capitalÆs specialised ore sensor arrays with the already popular exploration interface. Maybe even require triangulation with covert ops ships to find the really good but hard to find belts, in small teams of explorers. The Dark asteroids must be mined by deep core mining technology employed by the skiff and refines to 10x the amount of empire veld/scordite. I would envisage black ice too with the mackinaw getting the same kind of yields of empire ice versions. Once found these sites should be big enough to get the whole alliance involved for several consecutive days. We have all seen 200 man fleets in pvp ops, with 100 capitals, it would be cool if we had a reason to see 100 mining ships and 50 Rorquals in a big mining operation. If the sites slowly degraded once found this would add an urgency to itÆs recovery. This then brings the scenario of hostile alliances trying to break up these ops too: i.e. much fun/danger/rewards to both sides.
gordon861 Minmatar AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2007.08.15 14:02:00 - [333] If this change is to make people mine more of the minerals for use in construction rather than using loots to supply minerals for construction, it makes sense. But instead, 1. Increase the losses from reprocessing by a large amount 2. Create a POS module for compressing minerals 3. Allow that module to also uncompress the minerals In fact you even all ready have compressed minerals in the game, just make the compressed minerals the same as the current drone alloys (but maybe make them take up less space). Originally by: CCP Arkanon I frown on employees being power players to the extent that their gameplay results in any sort of domination over others. I donÆt believe CCP employees should run the EVE universe.
Mikron Alexarr New Age Solutions New Age Solutions Amalgamated	Posted - 2007.08.15 18:01:00 - [334] The idea of taking 80% of refines on modules doesn't make much sense. I think back to the times when new features of the game were released as news articles. The storyline played an important part in the release of these new technologies. CCP was the omniscient corporation in the game. You didn't get press releases from devs. You got press releases from in game corporation's leaders about what new and exciting technology was being released. This has some of what I'm talking about. When t2 was introduced, it was a news article. There was storyline to it. It wasn't just some release from the devs in a blog somewhere on the website. Getting back to the storyline, what is perfect efficiency again? It's the ability to reprocess and rebuild an item from the same minerals costing only what the station charges to go through the process. Making only some select items have some 20% deficiency in refining makes no sense in terms of the game world. This interaction between the storyline and actual game play is what makes this game great. It's not just the warring 0.0 alliances slugging it out at eachother, it's the part of the game that all players can appreciate that make this game top dog in the MMO world. How many other games allow for such interaction between storyline and gameplay? Not many. It takes a lot of planning and development. All that time pays off in customer satisfaction. Now on to the battleships question: What should be the cost of flying a battleship? In the early days of eve, a battleship was something like the super capitals are today. You just didn't see them at every stargate in eve. The blobs of Battleships that clutter space will only be replaced by frigates and cruisers if the cost of a BS significantly increases. Wars will be determined by who is willing to grind longer to be able to fly those battleships instead of which side will run out of minerals first or which side gets tired of fighting. As a miner, transporter, and recreational PVPer, I think that wars should be decided by who is the best everything at the end of the day. Wars should not be decided by an alliances foothold being reinforced by a titan acting solely as a logistics ship. I read most, but not all of the posts in this thread. There were some people that welcomed a logistics change. But no one has endorsed a 20% decrease in refines on selected items. As a carebear and fellow player, I would hate to see anymore disconnect between gameplay and the storyline - now, in REV3.0, or other. There must be alternatives that target what you want to target while minimizing the effect on the other aspects of eve. (start whipping that economist into playing all parts of the game ) I love eve, and I love the immersion in the storyline. It was a shame that the Tetrimon story arc got so screwed up, but leaving behind that immersion in favor of what I see in this forum is what will ultimately kill EVE. Once you destroy a game mechanic that people like, you must have something to keep them here. That storyline is it. ____________________________________________________________________] "Did you just smacktalk my grandma?"
Andrus Delai e X i l e FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.15 19:24:00 - [335] Originally by: CCP Chronotis In kali 3.0, we aim to introduce a wider range of fixes to not only resolve the issue which has lead to an increase in use of modules such as the jump portal generator or tractor beam but also provide more suitable alternatives, for example, addressing some of the reasons why low end ores such as veldspar for example are not mined in null/low-sec and make changes to different aspects such as loot, low-end ore mining with skiffs and mackinaws. These changes slated for kali 3.0 will cause many null-sec dwellers to have to alter their current operations where they have established such around use of mineral compression and you rightly need as much time as possible to adapt. I don't understand why many people are screaming DOOOM! Chronotis clearly states that CCP will provide suitable alternatives. If CCP addresses why low ends are not mined in 0.0, then it might be that mineral compression is no longer necessary. And to be honest, mineral compression is an exploit and should go away. I give CCP props for not only giving us a heads-up on the coming changes well in advance, but also for planning to address the reasons why mineral compression first started.
Artmedis Valben Gallente Lobster of Babel	Posted - 2007.08.15 21:51:00 - [336] There is a much better way to do this. 1) Adjust the mineral composition of every module that has too high a reprocess rate (170 items). 2) If you want reprocess rate to be less than than 100% even when building with 0% waste, then make that across the board. 3) Its easy to nerf the most blatant abuses with having a lower cap on the reprocess value of Capital modules. 4) Give the Rorqual a single turret slot, and allow it to fit a Capital Strip Miner that requires crystals to use. Only have Veldspar crystals. Since they can only be used in low-sec/no-sec where no one mines Veld anyways, this will get Veld mining done in those areas, and will solve the issue of hauling Trit to 0.0 Just My two cents ___________________________________________ Selling PERFECT PRINTS of almost all seeded BPOs. Lobster of Babel currently holds 671 of the 728 Tech 1 BPOs seeded. 7 ships and Capital are missing.
Mantalari Altis Caldari Mercatoris Technologies	Posted - 2007.08.15 22:06:00 - [337] Originally by: Andrus Delai Originally by: CCP Chronotis In kali 3.0, we aim to introduce a wider range of fixes to not only resolve the issue which has lead to an increase in use of modules such as the jump portal generator or tractor beam but also provide more suitable alternatives, for example, addressing some of the reasons why low end ores such as veldspar for example are not mined in null/low-sec and make changes to different aspects such as loot, low-end ore mining with skiffs and mackinaws. These changes slated for kali 3.0 will cause many null-sec dwellers to have to alter their current operations where they have established such around use of mineral compression and you rightly need as much time as possible to adapt. I don't understand why many people are screaming DOOOM! Chronotis clearly states that CCP will provide suitable alternatives. If CCP addresses why low ends are not mined in 0.0, then it might be that mineral compression is no longer necessary. And to be honest, mineral compression is an exploit and should go away. I give CCP props for not only giving us a heads-up on the coming changes well in advance, but also for planning to address the reasons why mineral compression first started. People are screaming for a number of reasons, not the least of which is that there was not a lot of advance warning. Further, the proposed suitible alternatives are not scheduled to appear for quite some time, while the changes to reprocessing to 'address' mineral compression were going to be implemented almost immediately until midway through this thread the decision was made to hold off for a while. Even with CCP holding off on making the changes later and trying to spread out the impact over a more staged introduction, there are people that are screaming because they have a huge investment in mineral compression that would be made useless literally overnight. The example of the guy that bough a Jump Portal Generator BPO, researched it for months and then expected to use it for purposes of mineral complression... That poor bastard has an investment that was worth somewhere around three-quarters of a billion isk prior to the announcement of the reprocessing nerf for mineral compression. I'd scream too. Now that the decision has been made to hold off and fix things in a more staged and probably better planned way, with viable alternatives for mining low-ends in low-sec and 0.0 planned at least vaguely for around the same time... Panic can probably be shelved in favor of reasoned discussion. I don't think that mineral compression itself can't be termed an exploit. I do think that there are some compression ratios that are unreasonable. I do think that being able to transport capital modules by mounting them on a frigate in space is a bit obscene too.. But I also think that nobody in their right mind would try to fly a frigate with a few jump portal generators mounted up to it through 0.0. I think they'd be pretty foolish to try to fly it through empire, frankly. In general though, I do wish that proposed radical changes to game mechanics for the purpose of ending a widespread practice should be well vetted before being announced. Here you have a widespread practice that lots of people had invested lots of isk, time, effort, and skill training in that was going to be summarily terminated. Think about it. What industrial corp doesn't own a handful of passive targeter BPOs for the purpose of moving a giant pile of trit around for production purposes? That's something that even a small scale corp could and would do. Hell, it even makes more sense for a small scale corp since they might not be able to swing having a freighter to move trit around in. Changes like this should have a couple questions answered early on: Who's going to be negatively impacted by this change? Is there a viable alternative to the activity that we're going to impact? What are the local and universe-wide economic impacts?
Andrus Delai e X i l e FREGE Alliance	Posted - 2007.08.16 03:36:00 - [338] Originally by: Mantalari Altis In general though, I do wish that proposed radical changes to game mechanics for the purpose of ending a widespread practice should be well vetted before being announced. Here you have a widespread practice that lots of people had invested lots of isk, time, effort, and skill training in that was going to be summarily terminated. Thanks for clearing it up. I didn't realize that the Dev Blog had been changed from when it was first posted. I only read the current incarnation and missed the fact that it had been edited. I agree that changes of this magnitude should not be sprung on players.
Mnengli Noiliffe	Posted - 2007.08.16 08:58:00 - [339] does anyone have a copy of blog before editing? it's so vague now.. basically as I understood from the comments, it said that you will only get 20% of the mineral cost from item refining, correct? and were some details on mineral compression process cost provided?
Fastercart Gallente Ihatalo Heavy Industries	Posted - 2007.08.16 09:29:00 - [340] Originally by: Mnengli Noiliffe does anyone have a copy of blog before editing? it's so vague now.. Try http://www.battleclinic.com/eve_online/news.php. Do a Find for "August 11, 2007, 05:00:50 pm" (without quotes).

Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2007.08.16 11:08:00 - [341] Why not a check if capital ship modules (such like JPG) can only fitted to capital ships? Such a check should be quite easy to implement and I cannot see any problems that it will cause because capital ship modules belong to capital ships. Or is there already such a check?
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2007.08.16 11:20:00 - [342] Originally by: Mestoth The only comment i wish to make is this: Nice that the rorqual can compress and haul 240m trit....we still need to MINE 20 or so MILLION veld...at a grand total of what...10K per hour... (exageration there). To encourage people to actually MINE veldospar, you need to double or tripple its RATE OF MINING (not density of asteroids or number, but physcial RATE that it comes in)... even with veld II crystals etc etc...you get nothing! Lets tripple or quadruple the amount PER cycle that comes in...then start looking @ changing the rest. Low should be X4 Mids should be X 2 Hights X 1 Hence,...as the names suggest, Low Ends should be abundant! IE: Real World Example: Iron is available. Everywhere. Cheaply (relativly) (LOW) Getting Gold (mid range) is not tooo expensive, but is available. Getting Natural Diamonds (high endS) are expensive and limited in quantity. In 0,0...it is easier to get TONNES of high ends (the diamonds) but nothing else! and i know we are in 0,0..so it should be skewed to the right side (high)...but not such that the net market has....1 -2 sellers of Trit...and 50 of 600K+ Zydrine sellers.... ie: BOOST VELD AND SCORDITE INCOME RATES Boost MID RANGE (by a little) Keep Highs. There is one major flaw in this calculation. And that is the market. If you want trit that urgently, set up buy orders in 0.0 for the price you want to pay. If it is high enough you will get trillions if trit. You say it is much more profitable to mine Arkonor, and you are right with that! But why is it profitable? Because no one sets up buy orders for a fair price in 0.0! Actually some large alliances forbid their renteers to set up mineral buy orders at stations in 0.0! This way you destroy market and then it is no wonder that trit is artificial low. The thing is, you and all the other people, do not want to have high trit prices. You do not want to pay lots of money! That is your flaw. Free market and no strange mineral compression with absurd rates and the market would solve everything.
Imhothar Xarodit Minmatar Wolverine Solutions Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.08.16 13:20:00 - [343] You cannot setup high enough tritanium buy orders to make Veldspar mining profitable in 0.0 due to the sheer quantity of tritanium you need. Paying 4k per megacyte is not so evil as you don't need so much of it but tritanium buy orders of, say, 10+ isk is insane. You would automatically need to increase the cost of all your products. An unresearched Rokh needs almost 12 mil trit to build. Can you imagine the ship/module price increase in this? It is not that simple...
Una Versa Trader's Academy Daikoku Trade Syndicate	Posted - 2007.08.16 17:50:00 - [344] Originally by: CCP Chronotis Important Update whilst the ability to move two freighters worth of minerals in a frigate is broke and something we want to fix... If this is broken, it is broken for many other reasons. 1. Where are the NPC haulers? Why can only players move things to fulfill player buy orders? Even if this happened automagically so as to not burden the servers with tons of npc ships hauling around the place - it's something should happen & currently makes less sense than mineral compression (which actually made sense when the foreign guy compared it to orange juice from concentrate). 2. Where are the robots? This is the future. Why can I not have ships that are on autopilot without me sitting in them? Maybe I jump in a BS and lead a convoy of Indys piloted by robots. Ok, if you don't want that in the game, fine - but realise that if this was reality, we would have robots, or perhaps aliens, doing our mindless grunt work. Now the player is stuck with the grind, and you want to make it more of a boring task? 3. Again with the small corp &/or lone player nerf. Creating a big dumb ship that only rich corps can build and utilise only marginalizes the little guy even more. How about making that mini-freighter or a super-indy that costs 100mil and hauls 200,000m3. This one has been raised 1000 times - but it would make it profitable and more importantly - accessible - for many smaller players to help supply & settle lowsec & 0.0. 4. Other stuff that I know nothing about - This is the greatest thread ever.. I'm thrilled to see everyone make a point of explaining to CCP why this is a horrible idea for a non-problem. Please don't do something to 'fix' a creative player solution to an oddity of the game that has many other sources. In fact, please do the opposite. Please make it easier to get minerals to lowsec & 0.0, and not just for capital ship & titan flying alliances.
Nyphur Pillowsoft	Posted - 2007.08.16 22:58:00 - [345] Edited by: Nyphur on 16/08/2007 23:03:57 I'm going to be perfectly honest. I'm not pleased that mineral compression is being removed as the Rorqual is not even as effective at that task as a carrier filled with tractor beams. I have a jump portal generator bpo with a bunch of ME on it and never really got much use out of it but I do see how that module is gamebreaking. Instead of making it 8000 m3, you're nerfing all mineral compression and that's.. fine, I guess. It's your decision. However, I do request one thing. If mining is to be profitable or useful again, it MUST be the primary source of minerals and therefore must be the most time-efficient source of minerals. This new capital ship doesn't address that issue and clearly isn't meant to. The only thing that will address that issue is a nerf of minerals from refinement of loot across the board and possibly a decrease of missionloot drop rates. Could you run some comparisons on mining versus refining all of the loot from a level 4 mission based on roughly the fastest competion time for a given mission? Compare the two in highsec and again in lowsec. As far as I am aware, people pull in a higher value in minerals running level 4 missions than they do mining in lowsec and they get zyd and mega. I really like mining and I want you to give me a good reason to go out into that belt in lowsec. Until you can do that, mining as a profession is not going to recover. I want you to force me to bring my corp out mining in lowsec again and force me to deploy the Rorqual in a lowsec belt where it's at risk of heavy assault from pirates, even some with capitals. I want mining to be the primary source of minerals in the game like it was in the good old days and I'm not the only one. Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened.
Ivor Gunn	Posted - 2007.08.17 01:49:00 - [346] Boost all 0.0 ores to the same isk/hour as the highest level ore available in that truesec. Lowend supply problem solved.
Tarron Sarek Gallente Endica Enterprises	Posted - 2007.08.17 02:39:00 - [347] Edited by: Tarron Sarek on 17/08/2007 02:39:09 Originally by: Helevorn Feanaro Originally by: Kil'Roy Originally by: Yuki Nagato Originally by: Kil'Roy It's amazing how much instant gratification people seem to want in this game. This isn't, and should not be, some form of "Space" Half Life II or Unreal Tournament 2007. Since when was mineral importation and production 'instant gratification'? Do you even know how much effort is involved, even with carriers? Yes, I do... People complain how much Blob Warefare is bad, yet want to be able to replace their losses quickly to get back into that Blob. People complain how insurance pays too much, but complain how it is too hard to get the materials to replace their ships. If it is too easy to replace your losses, then Blob warefare is all you will have. The harder it is to replace your losses the less likely you would be willing to risk your ship, and the more the well balanced Alliances will have the advantage. The way to make it so not everyone is flying either a BS, Dread, or Carrier is to keep it hard to replace them. Make it so the hardest thing is to keep flying a BS, not training for it. Team work and diversification should be key. Don't only have Pvp'ers, or Carebears, have the proper mix in your Alliance. The future of this game shouldn't be about the next hard thing to train for, but are you organized well enough to keep flying the best. The well organized Nation "Alliance" should have the advantage. I think CCP is on the right path with this, but may take some time to balance it out. /signed 100% agreed It's very unfortunate that 'exploits', or perhaps let's just call them game mechanical flaws, like mineral compression were allowed enough time to become common practice. I mean.. logistics and maintenance are not meant to be circumvented. They're there for a reason. To make things complicated from a certain point on and curb uncontrolled growth. _________________________________ - Balance is power, guard it well.. -
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.08.17 03:51:00 - [348] well... there's multiple possibilities: if you just want to cripple logistics - increase volume of the modules (titan mods in particular) if you want to cripple production costs (and increase mineral demand and prices) - lower effects of the prod.eff.skill or bump up the base waste from 1.25 to 1.5 if you want to screw mission looters & ratters aswell - lower effects of scrapmetal repro if you wish to include mission looters and ratters - go ahead with your idea[*]if you want to hurt all refiners on top of that, reduce both 'global' refining skills or debuff all installations as i mentioned earlier, the large alliances don't really care about 20% extra costs to the jump portal thingy - 344:1 result will still make it a great tool to shove those quantities around. only the mineral prices will explode a lil due to demand and logistics will increase a bit ... which will be compensated by the future two-iteron-V-and-a-hoarder=96km¦ in rorqual's ship bay (carrier these days: interon+viator end up below 49k m¦) so, it's all about the mineral price - macro miners, rejoice - putting the gist back into logistics
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2007.08.17 03:52:00 - [349] well... there's multiple possibilities: if you just want to cripple logistics - increase volume of the modules (titan mods in particular) if you want to cripple production costs (and increase mineral demand and prices) - lower effects of the prod.eff.skill or bump up the base waste from 1.25 to 1.5 if you want to screw mission looters & ratters aswell - lower effects of scrapmetal repro or go ahead with your indiscriminate idea if you want to hurt all refiners on top of that, reduce both 'global' refining skills or debuff all installations as i mentioned earlier, the large alliances don't really care about 20% extra costs to the jump portal thingy - 344:1 result will still make it a great tool to shove those quantities around. only the mineral prices will explode a lil due to demand and logistics will increase a bit ... which will be compensated by the future two-iteron-V-and-a-hoarder=96km¦ in rorqual's ship bay (carrier these days: interon+viator end up below 49k m¦) so, it's all about the mineral price - macro miners, rejoice - putting the gist back into logistics
Tuto Strike	Posted - 2007.08.17 12:12:00 - [350] Originally by: CCP Chronotis ... Low sec 'low end' ore mining we will very much want to make more attractive so trit and pyerite can be obtained locally and personally I have been looking at some possibilities that may be even a little fun like 'blast mining' ... yay! \o/ blast mining FTW! More fun for the miners! Just make sure that blasting a roid will damage the high ends so it gives a puny yield on those ores. \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ /me wants blast mining! /me wants blast mining! /me wants blast mining!

Nietor	Posted - 2007.08.17 13:23:00 - [351] 1) How about taking a look at the mineral composition of things, and adjusting those first. 2)Then, make the size of an item based on the amount of minerals used to make it. 3) After that, restrict the fitting of too large modules at all. A JPG is probably larger than the frigate(or even a cruiser) is to begin with, so why even allow it to be fitted. Make the slots have some sort of size requirement as well as CPU/Grid. For the person that said they wanted to keep it story related, well.. one could just say "The corporations allowing you to use their refineries learned they could make a lot more money by taxing the reprocessing process further". There, RP reason to take that 20%. To the person who said corps/alliances/players will lose money because of a bad investment... well imagine this... I go to the hardware store, and buy a crowbar. I use that crowbar to smash someones face in and they die cuz of it. I get charged with murder and end up spending the rest of my life in jail. Poor investment? Should i get a pass because i used it in a manner other than directed? Maybe the 16 year old cashier at the store should take the fall cuz he/she sold it to me... Or maybe... the store owner, he stocked it to sell after all... I think you get my point. By exploiting (yes i said exploiting) a game mechanic to achieve something you shouldn't be able to, you deserve what you get. I feel no sympathy when CCP changes the rules. I am pretty certain that when they introduced the JPG and/or other capital modules, they did not intend them to be a way of transporting minerals to/from/around 0.0/empire/low-sec. If they realize they made an error, and correct it... too bad to those that were trying to take advantage of the mechanics. I also read somewhere else, that it really doesn't make much sense to mine an ore whose value is 2 isk per unit, when you have ore thats worth 2000 isk per unit in the next asteroid field. I think they should just remove low quality ores from 0.0, as it really makes no sense what-so-ever to mine it. I can mine arkonor for an hour, and buy the 8m trit i need for a raven with isk left over. Well, not quite.... but maybe when i get into a hulk with t2 crystals! I guess there has to be a reason to mine it. Heres a random thought. How about a chance of named loot popping out from those giant Veld roids. Least then, those of us in the drone regions would be able to get some, and the ore would probably get mined a lot more. I know that sounds silly... but it could work, at least in theory. Maybe that roid could jettison a map to a complex, or pirate hideout instead; only good for x amount of time after examined... The maps could be sold, unexamined on the market for treasure hunters to find the loot. Theres a lot of possibilities that could be explored into getting people to mine veldspar in 0.0. I also think it could be fun.
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.08.17 14:33:00 - [352] Originally by: CCP Chronotis Come kali 3 when we will look to add in new low sec methods... Do you mean low sec or 0.0? Please bear in mind they're totally different situations altogether.

CCP Chronotis	Posted - 2007.08.17 14:48:00 - [353] Update regarding Advanced Mobile Lab The original concept has changed following feedback. The lab now has 3 copy (0.65* time mod), 2 ME (0.75* time mod) and 2 invention (0.5* times mod). The advantage being it significantly increases the alternatives for copy slots and research specific to invention which finds a niche for both types of lab.


CCP Chronotis	Posted - 2007.08.17 14:52:00 - [354] Do you mean low sec or 0.0? Please bear in mind they're totally different situations altogether. could be both. We will most likely in weeks ahead after 2.2 is deployed, write a dev blog discussing where we would like to progress mining which will include anything we might want to do with low/null sec and veld mining alongside other areas of focus such as mercoxit for example of stuff we are looking at.

SamuraiJack Caldari Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce	Posted - 2007.08.17 15:22:00 - [355] I'm still getting distinct feeling that CCP hate industrialists and logistics ppl and just want us to spend even more time doing grind. Howabout you try doing major logistics CCP instead of pvping. See how long it takes to do a proper market or a decent logistics chain. Remember about the smaller corperations who are new. Not everyone can field massive groups to run frieghters deep into space. You really want to restrict people to huge allainces or empire only? Its been like this since Exodus... (i know that was suppost to move us all to 0.0... but far too many went to empire instead. Lets not have another clusterfark like that again please). Would love to see how much fun you think it is running pos's and filling markets when you constantly get nerfs like the carrier GSC nerf and the compression nerf. The drone regions are getting better but if you had pulled the compression nerf back when roids were totally broken i think an angry mob would be burning you out of your offices. Kindly think about ALL aspects of the game... not just the "ooh shiny... it explodes" bit. Some of us build and create so you can have your fun. Help us have our fun too. SJ. CLS CEO, Valainloce Executor and Standings Director =-
bobtheminer Deadly Alliance Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.08.17 15:40:00 - [356] with the Rorqual being aimed at aiding logistics and transporting low end compressed ore upto 0.0 and high end down, would it not be resonable to give it the same jump distance as the carrier rather than the dread, if its supposed to be running up and down the lanes from empire to 0.0 needing loads of jump points really isent gonna help, i can understand why dreads have the shorter jump range but to me any way the Rorqual just screams to have a good jump range if its gonna help with logistics, it shouldent cause more logistics than it will help just setting up all the cyno towers or char's to cyno it about
Chruker	Posted - 2007.08.17 18:29:00 - [357] Edited by: Chruker on 17/08/2007 18:29:59 Originally by: CCP Chronotis Update regarding Advanced Mobile Lab The original concept has changed following feedback. The lab now has 3 copy (0.65* time mod), 2 ME (0.75* time mod) and 2 invention (0.5* times mod). The advantage being it significantly increases the alternatives for copy slots and research specific to invention which finds a niche for both types of lab. .... With these changes to the advanced lab I'll say that it is no longer worth the extra ISK, unless you are running a POS for just copying. How does 3 copy slots instead of 6 copy slots give it an advantage? If you really want to make it so that the regular mobile is used for ME/PL research, and the new lab is used for copying/invention you should give it 8 copy slots and 4 invention slots. Or even better: Allow us to reconfigure how many slots there are of each type when it the lab is offline. ----- http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online ----- Top wishes: - No daily downtime - Faster training on sisi - Speedup IGB table rendering
Kazuo Ishiguro House of Marbles Zzz	Posted - 2007.08.17 21:22:00 - [358] I'd expect that it'd be much more profitable to rent out, at least if alliance copying was fixed. If the current status quo is maintained, the current labs will be more useful. My research services Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant stats
Tuto Strike	Posted - 2007.08.17 21:28:00 - [359] Hey Chronotis! Cold we use careful placments of bombs to mine whole roids at a time in a low sec? I posted more detail is here Placing bombs. Those bombs could also have tactical use at ships in siege mode or pos warfire Blasting roids! Hehe. Blasting roids! \o/
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2007.08.17 22:23:00 - [360] Originally by: CCP Chronotis Do you mean low sec or 0.0? Please bear in mind they're totally different situations altogether. could be both.... . Please, first, before you blog about any proposed changes, seperate the two situations in your mind. Lowsec, to all intents and purposes, is empire space. It should have higher rewards, for sure, but it should still be the same, dependant NPC empire space. It is not a place for players to be building logistical empires, it is merely a riskier, more rewarding NPC space. 0.0 space on the other hand should be capable of being totally independant from NPC empire space, however, as we all know, this is not possible due to the imbalance between the values of low/high-end ores. Even if their values were comparable, there is simply no way (currently, even post-Rorqual) to mine enough low-end mins to support any kind of 0.0 infrastructure.



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