Read this and then read this. You clearly haven't read a thing I've said.

My point is precisely that anywhere the EvE system is paying people directly in ISK for something there is a problem. I don't want to nerf incursions. I want to remove all EvE system ISK payouts entirely and replace them with something you can sell on the market. It's the only way to achieve any kind of balance that doesn't require CCP to constantly intervene. My point isn't moot you just didn't read anything in this thread.

BTW - I get raises in EvE every day the market inflates. So do most people. The only people who's paychecks don't keep pace with inflation are people who play exclusively PvE content. Your knowledge of market mechanics explains why you keep getting passed up for that raise...

You had better get started then eh? Considering their next step is to nerf bounties. If nullsec folks can report blue bots and people get serious about reporting hisec bots. Inflation may be able to be stopped. Or atleast slowed to acceptable levels.

The real solution is not to try to pin the nerf to one specific area of the game, as there isn't a specific mechanic causing the inflation singularly. It's to do an all around slight nerf to income, which will result in a net no-change to people's wealth.

The thing that's not helping is people trying to bandwagon this as another nerf-highsec thread.

Removing bots will do very little to stop the massive inflation going on.

Just curious, are there any numbers for what bounty isk facets were like pre-incursions for comparison? I'm curious to see how much isk influx from other activities decreased if any as a result of their introduction.

We're looking at the economy constantly and looking at our options.

One of the fundamental issues we have is that we're making everyone "better" at making money, so the effect kind of snowballs. Right now we're considering everything form increasing taxes to lowering bounties across the board.

Just curious, are there any numbers for what bounty isk facets were like pre-incursions for comparison? I'm curious to see how much isk influx from other activities decreased if any as a result of their introduction.

Are you serious? Or are you a botter yourself?

[quote=CCP Soundwave]
Love makes pretty blind, you know. We all know how much you love your baby that is Incursions. Please don't cuddle it until it dies.

Seems like Soundwave just promised us that he won't be nerfing Incursions but will instead focus on bounties via ratting, anoms, and missions. I'm very curious how that's gonna pan out - I suppose that there's (theoretically?) an absolute cap to the Incursion faucet, so it'll really emphasize the income differential between high sec Incursions and other high end activities like L5s and high level WH ops.

I guess the net result is that high sec incursion runners will become even more fantastically wealthy compared to everyone else, and Shiny Fleet will be the only way to make ISK at it?

It'll be interesting!

-Liang

Nothing to do with inflation, but again, Incursions are terrible for the EVE universe for more than just inflation.

Should I quote CCP about Incursions again?

You're aware that we're making adjustments to Incursions right? I've never said we didn't need to look at Incursion income in isolation, the point I made was that in terms of money coming into the economy, bounties are a massive issue. I'm not entirely sure why some of you keep insisting that it's either or.

Do Incursions need looking at? Absolutely, that's already been done and is awaiting deployment. Are Incursions the big issue in terms of isk coming into the economy? Not even remotely.

I think you can go check out Tippia's rants for some numbers gathered from dev posts all over the forums throughout the years. IIRC missions and bounties have basically remained unchanged for years while Incursions provide what amounts to a wholly new ISK faucet.

-Liang

You're aware that we're making adjustments to Incursions right? I've never said we didn't need to look at Incursion income in isolation, the point I made was that in terms of money coming into the economy, bounties are a massive issue. I'm not entirely sure why some of you keep insisting that it's either or.

Do Incursions need looking at? Absolutely, that's already been done and is awaiting deployment. Are Incursions the big issue in terms of isk coming into the economy? Not even remotely.

You're aware that we're making adjustments to Incursions right? I've never said we didn't need to look at Incursion income in isolation, the point I made was that in terms of money coming into the economy, bounties are a massive issue. I'm not entirely sure why some of you keep insisting that it's either or.

Do Incursions need looking at? Absolutely, that's already been done and is awaiting deployment. Are Incursions the big issue in terms of isk coming into the economy? Not even remotely.

Which I assume what you mean by adjustments are changes to VGs to remove blitzing while boosting assault and HQ income right?

Side question when will we see a dev blog about those changes? After fanfest right? And will we have plenty of time to test them on Sisi to make sure there arent any surprises right?


Yet thanks for yet again pointing how wrong many are about Incursion Inflation. They just don't get it. In my opinion all they see is rage from Incursions providing an alternative to broken nullsec.

Do you believe that running pirate missions in 0.0 should be more profitable than high sec incursions?

-Liang

Incursions are killing the traditional lp stores which used to be an isk sink.

Someone already posted the numbers, the majority of isk in EVE comes off bounties and if anything, we should be reviewing the current bounties on battleship NPCs.

They are the major change that happened right before the inflation. Bounties didn't change. Level 4s didn't change. Insurance didn't change except for the nerf in dominion.

Incursions are killing the traditional lp stores which used to be an isk sink.

Incursions are seeding allot of isk directly into the game.

Both of these would tend to cause inflation.

Yet thanks for yet again pointing how wrong many are about Incursion Inflation. They just don't get it. In my opinion all they see is rage from Incursions providing an alternative to broken nullsec.

Which I assume what you mean by adjustments are changes to VGs to remove blitzing while boosting assault and HQ income right?

Side question when will we see a dev blog about those changes? After fanfest right? And will we have plenty of time to test them on Sisi to make sure there arent any surprises right?


Yet thanks for yet again pointing how wrong many are about Incursion Inflation. They just don't get it. In my opinion all they see is rage from Incursions providing an alternative to broken nullsec.

Hmmmmm.... Actually I think he did more damage to your arguement - since most people were not against hitting bounties, but rather against hitting bounties instead of (rather than as well as) incursions. while you seem to be going on about how incursions are fine as they are.

I'm predicting no end of posts about INCURSIONS by ignorant NULL SEC peeps.

Forum ate my post :(

I don't honestly know enough about 0.0 PvE to answer that properly.

All I can say is that we could do with an honest conversation about what people really get as income in various areas of the game. There's a lot of misinformation going around.

My personal experience of HS Lv4's is <20m/hour because I don't have a sufficiently shiny ship to do the ridiculous numbers that are thrown around when discussion missions. Given how utterly tedious most of them are, this is not something I want to see nerfed.

My personal experience of HS Incursions is 50m/hour in a decent fleet, with usually 1/2 to 1 hour required set up time before it reaches anywhere near that level of efficiency.

(not personal experience) I understand that there is a theoretical maximum of around 120m/hour for HS incursions, assuming the fleet does not take breaks and everything goes to plan. Realistic shiny fleet income (not personal experience) I'm told is about 100m/hour.

Perhaps others can speak to realistic incomes in other areas of the game?

No, that's incorrect. The massive jumps we see in terms of isk almost always come when we make adjustments to anomalies. The last change we did was pretty drastically increase the isk floor across the board on anomalies and the isk coming into the economy jumped after that.

Which I assume what you mean by adjustments are changes to VGs to remove blitzing while boosting assault and HQ income right?

Side question when will we see a dev blog about those changes? After fanfest right? And will we have plenty of time to test them on Sisi to make sure there arent any surprises right?


Yet thanks for yet again pointing how wrong many are about Incursion Inflation. They just don't get it. In my opinion all they see is rage from Incursions providing an alternative to broken nullsec.

I'll leave the details to the devblog but I'd say there is a chance the changes might be (among other things) exactly what you wrote.