Let's say I decide to gank a freighter. I don't want the gank to fail through the target surviving, so I use significantly more DPS than what is needed to take down the freighter before CONCORD arrives. That leaves me two options: use a small number of pilots in tier 3 BCs or use a large number of pilots in destroyers. The former option is more expensive ISK-wise, but I only end up with around a dozen dudes stuck in GCC limbo, but even 2-3 dudes failing to engage on time can fail the gank. With destroyers, I end up with a lot more pilots stuck in GCC limbo, and there is a lot more room for error if a few guys fail to engage on time.

If I end up with too many pilots stuck in GCC limbo, I risk not having enough numbers to gank a lucrative target that may show up within the next 15 minutes. If I minimize the number of pilots in GCC limbo, the gank costs more, which means that I risk throwing away a lot more ISK if the drop isn't in my favor.

No lets take that sentence as exactly as it is without any reading between the lines that are not there.

If suicide ganking is risk free then it should have a 100% success rate. Anything less is not risk free.

I just ran that through my head and envisioned every time you would derail a direct question by repeating your own and it made more sense to apply it to you than when you use those same words.

Not to get all psychological but it is becoming quite apparent you have issues with dominance.

Suicide is the key part of the action in "suicide gank".

You would have a 100% of succeeding at suiciding and dying, yes. Without fail you became a wreck.

The goal in a suicide gank is the destruction of the target, not the loss of your ship. The self destruct function does the latter just fine.

Ok, real talk eh?

You would have a 100% of succeeding at suiciding and dying, yes. Without fail you became a wreck.

So yes, there you go.

But we are talking about the fact that when you attempt to do a suicide gank, the ship loss is a cost, not a risk.

Success is a risk, ship loss is a cost.

Or would you disagree?

No the suicide part is caused by the gank happening in a way not allowed by CONCORD. Even if CONCORD was to let the gnakers run away, there would still be risk involved in a gank because your mark would still posibly get away.

Suicide ganking is ganking with more strict limitation. All the risks still applies.

The goal is the destruction of the target ship and the taking of its cargo and mods.

To be risk free the target ship must die and all of its cargo must drop and be safely dropped off in a safe station 100% of the time.

The goal is the destruction of the target ship and the taking of its cargo and mods.

To be risk free the target ship must die and all of its cargo must drop and be safely dropped off in a safe station 100% of the time.

It's a risk because there are chance you will get it back in another form or not. It's like at the casino. The real money you put on the table is never coming back from that table even if you win. You will still ahve to take the tokens and go change them at a cashier. In EVE, after a gank, you take whatever you got out of your gank, ranging from nothing at all to salvage/loot/tears and have them exchanged. The money at the casino is at risk and so is the ship in EVE.

You will never get that catalyst back but you will also never get that 20$ bill back. You can only get it's value back just like the catalyst.

Yes. But we are not talking about success being risk free.

Yes. But we are not talking about success being risk free. We are talking about ship loss being risk free as to be a cost instead.

I have mentioned this more than 5 times now. You are either being deliberate or just don;t get it, or care (/shrug).

Yes. But we are not talking about success being risk free. We are talking about ship loss being risk free as to be a cost instead.

I have mentioned this more than 5 times now. You are either being deliberate or just don;t get it, or care (/shrug).

I know a guy named Scordite Cowboy who ganks Ventures with a Thrasher. His failure rate is pretty low.

I know a guy named Scordite Cowboy who ganks Ventures with a Thrasher. His failure rate is pretty low.

Then why are you saying suicide ganking is risk free then if its not true?

Then why are you saying suicide ganking is risk free then if its not true?

You are the one deliberately trying to focus the discussion of suicide ganking on the suicide part while everybody else discuss the whole suicide gank.

Because ship loss is a cost not a risk. Suicide ganking has zero risk. Success and profitability at suicide ganking has risk.

Can you say 100% sure he will never ever have a freak incident making him fail the gank?

But seriously. The average risk is less than 1%. Which means its basically non-existant.

One could say he might slip and fall in his shower scaring his cat to jump on the keyboard causing him to self destruct his ship.

But seriously. The average risk is less than 1%. Which means its basically non-existant.

But seriously. The average risk is less than 1%. Which means its basically non-existant.

No, back in the beginning, we quite specifically went over what was risk and what were costs.

There is over a 50% chance of nothing at all dropping.

This alone is a fair bit higher than 1% no?

I think you are misunderstanding the whole situation dude.
The argument is: Is susicide gankign a risk free endeavour.
The answer is no. Ignoring costs, ship loss, profits, etc as they are measures of level of success, the success of the operation is you kill the target, the failure of the operation is the target does not die. You can minimise the odds of failure by using more ships, higher DPS and through player skill, the same as any other endeavour.

The dude is killing ventures with a thrasher. I don't think loot is part of the equation.

And he says he doesn't care about the money.

The dude is killing ventures with a thrasher. I don't think loot is part of the equation.

And he says he doesn't care about the money.