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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
Demonic Sentiment
Space Exploitation Inc Get Off My Lawn
6
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Posted - 2013.10.16 01:57:00 -
[181] - Quote
No to the eris split weapons... stupid change |
Kel hound
Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking
54
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:01:00 -
[182] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote: ERIS - Eris is the next in the new Roden designs. Big bonuses to both missiles and hybrid turrets allow the highest damage of all the dictors if one chooses. However for most normal uses the big Eris changes are the huge amount of mass it lost (leading to much much improved speed and agility) and the extra fittings. The 10mn AB plated fleet fits will be much improved after Rubicon.
Gallente Destroyer Bonuses: 10% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret falloff per level 5% bonus to Rocket and Light Missile explosion radius per level (was 10% bonus to small hybrid tracking per level)
Interdictors Bonuses: 10% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret, Rocket, and Light Missile damage per level (was 5% bonus to thermal rocket and light missile damage) 10% bonus to Interdiction Sphere Launcher rate of fire per level
Role bonus: Can fit Interdiction Sphere Launchers
Slot layout: 8H, 2M, 4L; 4(-1) turrets, 4 launchers Fittings: 64(+2) PWG, 210(+16) CPU Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 650(-1) / 700 / 750(-1) Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap/s) : 700(+231.25) / 350s(+37.5) / 2(+0.5) Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 305(-3) / 3.52(+0.145) / 1250000(-213000) / 6.1s(-1.11) Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5 Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 55km / 500 / 7 Sensor strength: 13(+2) Magnetometric Signature radius: 85(-1)
a¦á_a¦á
Quote:Slot layout: 8H, 2M, 4L; 4(-1) turrets, 4 launchers
a¦á_a¦á
Quote:4 turrets, 4 launchers
a¦á_a¦á This is the first time you've made me really question you Fozzie. It was said you would rebalance these ships, not leave them in darkness. |
Mioelnir
Cataclysm Enterprises Easily Offended
139
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:04:00 -
[183] - Quote
Tuxedo Catfish wrote:xttz wrote:The best way to address this (although probably too late now) is in a similar way to how old command ships worked:
1) Give the old interdictors stats geared toward small-scale pvp / gatecamping, much like the proposals in the OP 2) Use the newer destroyer models to make 'fleet interdictors' with bonuses to speed / agility / EHP. This is an excellent idea. I'd say there is writing on the wall for a second interdictor that throws anti-microjump bubbles based on the new hull. At least there was talk about anchorable anti-microjump bubbles when the MJD was introduced, so mobile Dic/Hic versions of that would be logical. |
Catherine Laartii
Atavism Archaeological Institute
34
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:06:00 -
[184] - Quote
gascanu wrote:
o wise dude, can you explain how the hell will you be able to bubble a fleet with a mobile warp distrupor??? do you even know that they need some time before they get online? or that they can be locked and killed by any ship out there? like really, stop postig if you have no ideea what are you takinb about...
It was a suggestion because this is a features and IDEAS thread. And if you'd cared to read further down, I stated that I'd be fine with them buffing the interdiction spheres' time on field as long as the ships themselves get buffed. The implication I was ATTEMPTING to make was that the two should merge in some way, if they did elliminate interdiction sphere launchers. Yes, they take time to set up, and yes, they can be shot down, but the problems with interdiction sphere launchers is the SHIPS that field them. That is what this thread is about and that is what I'm concerned with when I'm looking at them. So mobile warp disruptors can be shot down and take time to online? So do 'dictors; that's why everyone on this thread is pissed. These changes don't do enough.
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Catherine Laartii
Atavism Archaeological Institute
34
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:08:00 -
[185] - Quote
Vatek wrote:
I'd like to see the bubble firing rate bonus removed from the hull, given to the launcher itself as a baseline ROF (who cares about making it a hull bonus when nothing else can fit them) and have that bonus replaced with a useful survivability bonus like resists or a sig reduction of some kind. Even if they just copied the covops cloak revamp (set it to 100cpu and give the hull a bonus to fitting) it would at least give us a bunch of extra CPU to play with when all of these ships are extremely fitting limited.
I've never understood why these ships are so fragile. Hictors have ridiculous passive tanks so they can stand up to fleet firepower but dictors can't survive against a single T1 frigate or a battle industrial (especially the newly buffed ones) without logistics or ewar backup.
The mids and lows are another issue, especially on the Eris and the Flycatcher. The slot layouts on these two ships are frankly silly. The Eris should go from 2/4 to 4/2 and the flycatcher should be switched from 5/1 to 3/3. I'm aware that this homogenizes the fits quite a bit but the result is that both of these hulls end up being more competitive with the sabre for small gang work.
What do you think about dropping a high for a fitting slot, assuming they all get 7 highs with 6 weapons? If they fix the launching system for them, do you think it would be appropriate to do that if it gives them more survivability to launch more bubbles and, you know, actually shoot back? |
SmarncaV2
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
38
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:16:00 -
[186] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:I believe the actual interdictor sphere launcher needs a revamp. Sure years ago it worked for the scale of the game, but thankfully the game has grown since then, specifically fleet battles.
I propose you limit the sphere launcher to only one fit at a time. Change the rate of fire to 3-5 seconds. Remove the bonus to the sphere launcher rate of fire and make it +1 to amount of bubbles in the launcher clip with a base amount of 0. At level 1 interdictor you can carry one bubble in the launcher and at max skill, level 5, you can have 5 loaded. Now have the reload time decently long.
With this you have a launcher that fullfills the needs of today's fleets and allows fitting room for a more logical tank so the pilot can be more than a 15 second hero. Also when the launcher is reloading, the pilot can bail off the battlefield or stay and perform some other duties like anti-tackle role without being gimped due to 2-3 launchers and a cloak.
I support this very good idea!
+ Maybe in the winter expansion 2024 add fleet interdictor and "combat" interdictor |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
1791
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:17:00 -
[187] - Quote
Catherine Laartii wrote:
What do you think about dropping a high for a fitting slot, assuming they all get 7 highs with 6 weapons? If they fix the launching system for them, do you think it would be appropriate to do that if it gives them more survivability to launch more bubbles and, you know, actually shoot back?
one fitting slot won't give you enough survivability to 'drop bubbles and shoot back', people will still not want fleet dictors to bother trying to shoot things, rather they'll still be tasked with dumping bubbles and just trying to live |
Xercodo
Xovoni Astronautical Manufacturing and Engineering
2723
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Posted - 2013.10.16 02:24:00 -
[188] - Quote
Garviel Tarrant wrote:Why do all races have missile ships now?
I don't get it.. We don't see lasers or Ac's being flavour for other races :S
LEAVE THE KHANID ALONE D: The Drake is a Lie |
Lfod Shi
Lfod's Ratting and Salvage
130
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Posted - 2013.10.16 04:25:00 -
[189] - Quote
The Flycatcher changes are very acceptable. My ship and I are pleased. ...end transmission... GÖ¬ They'll always be bloodclaws to me GÖ˝ |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1350
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 04:46:00 -
[190] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:I believe the actual interdictor sphere launcher needs a revamp. Sure years ago it worked for the scale of the game, but thankfully the game has grown since then, specifically fleet battles.
I propose you limit the sphere launcher to only one fit at a time. Change the rate of fire to 3-5 seconds. Remove the bonus to the sphere launcher rate of fire and make it +1 to amount of bubbles in the launcher clip with a base amount of 0. At level 1 interdictor you can carry one bubble in the launcher and at max skill, level 5, you can have 5 loaded. Now have the reload time decently long.
With this you have a launcher that fullfills the needs of today's fleets and allows fitting room for a more logical tank so the pilot can be more than a 15 second hero. Also when the launcher is reloading, the pilot can bail off the battlefield or stay and perform some other duties like anti-tackle role without being gimped due to 2-3 launchers and a cloak.
a much more thought out version of my previous post plus one like There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |
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Abdiel Kavash
Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
1313
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Posted - 2013.10.16 05:05:00 -
[191] - Quote
The best buff dictors could get is a proper visible cooldown timer on the bubble launcher. |
Zilero
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
108
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Posted - 2013.10.16 06:33:00 -
[192] - Quote
Abdiel Kavash wrote:The best buff dictors could get is a proper visible cooldown timer on the bubble launcher.
Not empty quoting. |
Magic Crisp
Amarrian Micro Devices Yulai Federation
140
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Posted - 2013.10.16 06:54:00 -
[193] - Quote
usually the matari stuff is the most agile in eve. whatever you touch, you seem to be changing this. So, from now on the matari interdictor is the least agile one, looking at the align time stats. Eve's basic principles have changed since Fozzie. |
Sizeof Void
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
372
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Posted - 2013.10.16 07:03:00 -
[194] - Quote
Buff to split weapons on Eris - thumbs up!
Great fun for those of us who actually spent the time to skill up both guns and missiles.
Not sure why you kept the single small drone, though. |
Hannott Thanos
Notorious Legion
692
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 07:15:00 -
[195] - Quote
Magic Crisp wrote:usually the matari stuff is the most agile in eve. whatever you touch, you seem to be changing this. So, from now on the matari interdictor is the least agile one, looking at the align time stats. Eve's basic principles have changed since Fozzie.
Let me tell you why this is wrong.
Would you put a nano on a 1 lowslot low dps hull? No, damage mod Would you put a nano on a 3 or 4 lowslot armor tank hull? No, damage and tank mods Would you put a nano on a 2 lowslot shieldtanker that has the greatest top speed? Yes, and a damage mod as well
Slot layout and tanking type plays a huge part in the balancing. If the Sabre had the best agility as well as top speed it would just stomp the other dictors like it always has. It's still the most agile and fastest dictor with a nano fit to it. |
Hannott Thanos
Notorious Legion
692
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 07:20:00 -
[196] - Quote
Sizeof Void wrote:Buff to split weapons on Eris - thumbs up!
Great fun for those of us who actually spent the time to skill up both guns and missiles.
Not sure why you kept the single small drone, though.
Hush you, split types are bad, mkay? At least give the option to use either, don't force a split, that's bad design, and that's a quote from CCP, not just me, so why they even did this is a mystery. I've only ever given Fozzie praise for his rebalancing, but this I can't get behind. |
Harreeb Alls
Biohazard. WINMATAR.
2
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Posted - 2013.10.16 08:27:00 -
[197] - Quote
These look awesome. I support these changes! These combined with the interceptors and EAF's is going to change null sec, and low for the better.
A whole new vibrant era of small gang pvp is about to emerge. Gangs of smaller class ships using hit and run tactics will be much more viable. The people who have been bearing in nullsec reaping massive rewards with so little risk are about to drown in their own tears. If you want to use your space, you'd better be active in it.
The wolf packs are coming for you bloated cows. |
Venum Einherjar's
Babylon Knights Renegades Council
0
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Posted - 2013.10.16 08:36:00 -
[198] - Quote
Is it possible to put 7 launchers to the flycatchers ?
Heretic has 7 launchers, Sabre 7 turrets, and flycatcher specialised in missiles ( caldari ) only 6 ... |
Bezdar22
0utLaw. Northern Coalition.
0
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Posted - 2013.10.16 08:39:00 -
[199] - Quote
wtf.. its not rebalance at all.. look athose bonus they all became missle boat.. sabre is stilll the good one..and others are still ****..why not u make them t2 destroyer same as t1 with bubbles on it...
sabre is the only one has projectile and and tracking bonus .. eris is mixed with hybrid and missle .. no one gonna fly that hertic missle bonus not accepttable need laser bonus as coarcer with tracking dont care abt flycather much |
Serenum
Red Cross Marauders
5
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Posted - 2013.10.16 08:50:00 -
[200] - Quote
i'll chime in, no split weapons on the eris, the rest is okay
but doing something against the suicide mission that is actually using your bubbles would be cool
warpin in > bubble > pray
if you do get popped you are likely to get podded as well, discourages older pilots as usual |
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Harreeb Alls
Biohazard. WINMATAR.
2
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Posted - 2013.10.16 08:57:00 -
[201] - Quote
Heretic 7(+1) launchers, makes really viable as a pvp boat beyond bubbles. Is that a typo or is it 6(+1) ?????????? |
Kossaw
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
75
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:01:00 -
[202] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Bubble immune dictors would be wtfbbqop. Just saying.
Rest of your feedback I'm looking into and taking note of, keep it coming.
Well, yes and no. Somebody earlier suggested that they be immune to their own bubbles - which I guess technically might be pretty hard to do, but would make sense. Essentially a dictor should be allowed to warp out of its own bubble hence making it much easier to survive a large fleet battle but still be caught in another bubble. Maybe if they were immune to only interdiction bubbles but not mobile warp disruptors ? An interceptor is much better equipped to defend itself than a dictor, so I dont really see bubble immune dictors as being more omfgwtfpwn than the new interceptors. Also, immersion wise, it seems odd that you could manufacture a bubble immune interceptor and not apply the same technology to an interdictor.
Otherwise, the split weapon system on the Eris spoils what is otherwise a very welcome rebalance to that ship. Essentially the Eris needs the ability to fit 5 turrets or 5 missiles leaving the remaining slots for 2 bubbles and a cloak. I strongly disagree that a double bubble fit is overpowered, because you have to gimp the lows with co-processors to get it to fit.
Overall I'm looking forward to flying an Eris again. Thanks Fozzie - the changes look pretty good.
WTB : An image in my signature |
Rodent Jr
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:11:00 -
[203] - Quote
Kossaw wrote:
Well, yes and no. Somebody earlier suggested that they be immune to their own bubbles - which I guess technically might be pretty hard to do, but would make sense. Essentially a dictor should be allowed to warp out of its own bubble hence making it much easier to survive a large fleet battle but still be caught in another bubble.
This seems like the simplest way to achieve that aim...
xttz wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Bubble immune dictors would be wtfbbqop. Just saying.
Rest of your feedback I'm looking into and taking note of, keep it coming. What about a halfway measure... create the Small Micro Jump Drive? Dictors would have a limited ability to jump out of bubbles to reposition, but can't use it alongside every interdiction probe cycle.
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Uncle Gagarin
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:13:00 -
[204] - Quote
That looks boring. Same as SB and CovOps "rebalance". They were different, now they are almost the same. Missiles are for Caldari.
- HERETIC - no dronez or lazors, why ? is that Caldari armor based ? That's really unfair. 8.75 effective launchers on hull with 3 tank and 3 utility slots ? And 3 tank modules can be replaced with 3 damage mods. Sig 75, nice, armor tank will not bloom it.
- FLYCATCHER - overall nice bonuses to missiles, but looking at only 1 low slot something is still broken. 1 low is not enough pushing you to hard decision - tank, navig or dps module. No tank bonus so at least ship should have more low slots to allow DCII AND something else (nano or BC). No drones - good , it's not amarr/gallente. It's caldari. Sig 80 !!!!!! - this is bad, veeery bad. Add to that shield tank blook and boom, this ship is no longer an option. That ship needs turret sockets and hybrid bonuses.
- ERIS - what missiles are doing on that ship ? Actually bonuses better fit Caldari - hybrids/missiles. Here should be hybrid/drones. a single drone ? that's joke, isn't it ? what is that for - a mining drone ? I can only imagine how excited are Gallente pilots to skill that ship. That additional month to use weaponry is really temptating. ;)
- SABRE - weaponry, tank ok - it's matar, sig+speed ok for shield tanked ship. Not enough med slots for shield tanked ship.
In generic - shild tanked should have sig 70-75max, 5 med slots, armor tanked sig 80-85 2-3 med, 4-5 low. Amarr - drones, lazors Gall - hybrids, drones Matar - projectile, drones Caldari - hybrids, missiles, no drones.
It's quite funny combination 5*10% missile velocity (range) bonus combined with 50km targeting and very low number of med slots.
These ships doesn't look like well designed at all. Do you guys play EvE or only plan EvE ? |
Urkhan Law
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
23
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:25:00 -
[205] - Quote
Hannott Thanos wrote: Let me tell you why this is wrong. (...) It's still the most agile and fastest dictor with a nano fit to it.
No it's not, if you nano the others, it will not be, and if you have a 1 low slot, you still have the choice to do it or not. Paint it as you wish, you're forcing a nano in the Sabre so he can be what he should be by default. WITHOUT a nano, MWD ONLY, is the Sabre still the fastest hictor? If is not, then mass/agility/speed were not tuned up right. So now Minmatar have to nano (a module available to all others) to be able to have his racial speed/agility back, kk. |
Elindreal
Planetary Interactors
98
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:29:00 -
[206] - Quote
Somethings look good some things look a little... confused.
If you're giving the 4% armour resist to the heretic I get the feeling that its role is that of a fleet vessel. Therefore given the racial dispositions I'd recommend some changes such as...
Heretic - 4% to armour 7 highs 5 launcher slots 3 mids 4 lows Since fleet usage doesn't require a full set of weapons and the extra low can provide added survivability.
Flycatcher - 4% to shield 7 highs 5 launcher slots 5 mids 2 lows Same idea as above. Less damage for that extra low that the hull could really use.
Sabre - more or less the same 8 highs 7 turret slots 4 mids 2 lows They are more skimishy and get the extra weapon slots
Eris - 8 highs 6 turrets 6 launchers 3 mids 3 lows Also skirmishy and a bit more versatile than the others.
I would also argue that the sabre and eris get a tad lower sig radius than their caldari and amarr counterparts.
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LakeEnd
FinFleet Northern Coalition.
49
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:38:00 -
[207] - Quote
Rodent Jr wrote:Kossaw wrote:
Well, yes and no. Somebody earlier suggested that they be immune to their own bubbles - which I guess technically might be pretty hard to do, but would make sense. Essentially a dictor should be allowed to warp out of its own bubble hence making it much easier to survive a large fleet battle but still be caught in another bubble.
What dictor needs is a MJD module and role bonus to spool up timer.
Anyway I think these dictors changes overall are big letdown. This ship class needs some major chances, not minor tweaks and nerfs. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
581
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 09:55:00 -
[208] - Quote
[quote=CCP Fozzie]Interdictors ahoy! The single biggest buff these guys are getting is from the already announced warp speed changes, where their 8au/s will allow them to get on their targets extremely quickly. Otherwise we've focused on getting the three under-performers up closer to the Sabre's power level while maintaining their own distinctive styles. The class has lost a fair bit of sig across the board, and the Heretic, Flycatcher and Eris all see very significant mass decreases which lead to them gaining a lot of speed while under mwd.
[quote]
You are doing that again. Minmatar ships aligning and warping slower than all other races. THat is WRONG. Youa re not keepign racial identity. you are murdering it!!!
Minmatar are the hit an run race. You shoudl NOT have given more HP to sabeer.. you shoudl have kept the saber as the most trully mobile but at the cost of HP.
When did CCP finnaly lost all grap about the original races identities? "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Catherine Laartii
Atavism Archaeological Institute
35
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Posted - 2013.10.16 09:59:00 -
[209] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:Catherine Laartii wrote:
What do you think about dropping a high for a fitting slot, assuming they all get 7 highs with 6 weapons? If they fix the launching system for them, do you think it would be appropriate to do that if it gives them more survivability to launch more bubbles and, you know, actually shoot back?
one fitting slot won't give you enough survivability to 'drop bubbles and shoot back', people will still not want fleet dictors to bother trying to shoot things, rather they'll still be tasked with dumping bubbles and just trying to live
Then why give them any weapons at all? The problem with 'dictors that has sidelined them so long is BECAUSE they're pidgeon-holed like this; if you give them some power and flexibility, it lets them perform better within their role. It's just maddening because of how deep the broken goes for them; JUST using interdiction spheres for fleet work lends mostly to mobility and a consideration for range dictation, but how useful are they compared to other classes in their family? Hictors are monstrously powerful combat ships in their own right, and interceptors are going to be turned into a solo pirate's wet dream. What balance changes can possibly be made to stack 'dictors in the same category as that?
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
581
|
Posted - 2013.10.16 10:03:00 -
[210] - Quote
Urkhan Law wrote:Hannott Thanos wrote: Let me tell you why this is wrong. (...) It's still the most agile and fastest dictor with a nano fit to it.
No it's not, if you nano the others, it will not be, and if you have a 1 low slot, you still have the choice to do it or not. Paint it as you wish, you're forcing a nano in the Sabre so he can be what he should be by default. WITHOUT a nano, MWD ONLY, is the Sabre still the fastest hictor? If is not, then mass/agility/speed were not tuned up right. So now Minmatar have to nano (a module available to all others) to be able to have his racial speed/agility back, kk.
That is what I also dislike. CCP keep forgeting racial identities.!!!
Amarr are supposed to have most armor hitpoints and be the strongest FACING direclty ene,my. Gallente are balanced mobility and defese but huge firepower. Minamtar are supposed to be SQUISHY as a paper bag but FASTER AND MORE AGILE THAN ANY of the other races!!!
That was the race conception, that is on what people choosen their races and focus. it is WRONG.. COMPLETELY WRONG to change them!!!
THis absurdity is at the point that we had to beg CCP to not make the tempest SLOWER than the apocalypse!!!!!! "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
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