You're further proving my point that highsec pubbies should not be permitted to post or ever catered to because they outright deny reality and cannot form coherent thoughts.

To get back from the horrible derail caused by that moronic highsec pubbie:

Removing the ability to blitz missions would probably be enough.

So we're back to one of my suggestions from 30 pages ago?

Seems quite a few mission runners are being ganked in the SOE area lately. As much as that causes risk it further increases the value of LP further skewing isk per hour for those that avoid being ganked. I saw a few golem kills in local the other day while testing SOE blitzing myself.

Seems the simplest solution would be to require all NPCs to be killed in order to complete a mission (excluding some missions where NPCs spawn infinitely such as recon 1 and the tower killing amarr faction mission).

Maybe 100 ganks occur a day, ganking isn't even a factor yet. I think we're all pretty much in agreement that blitzing needs to go. I think it could go a bit further by requiring missions to take place over several jumps which would add travel time. It would bring the isk/hr down and if done right it could help defeat mission bots.

So we're back to one of my suggestions from 30 pages ago?

Seems quite a few mission runners are being ganked in the SOE area lately. As much as that causes risk it further increases the value of LP further skewing isk per hour for those that avoid being ganked. I saw a few golem kills in local the other day while testing SOE blitzing myself.

Seems the simplest solution would be to require all NPCs to be killed in order to complete a mission (excluding some missions such as recon 1/3). Obviously some missions would need a little reworking but I don't see how this would be a difficult thing to do. It's already apparent that most missions wouldn't even have to be changed as the number of cost effective blitzable missions is below 10.

Did anyone actually provide a list of current blitz missions?

So we're back to one of my suggestions from 30 pages ago?

Seems quite a few mission runners are being ganked in the SOE area lately. As much as that causes risk it further increases the value of LP further skewing isk per hour for those that avoid being ganked. I saw a few golem kills in local the other day while testing SOE blitzing myself.

Seems the simplest solution would be to require all NPCs to be killed in order to complete a mission (excluding some missions such as recon 1/3). Obviously some missions would need a little reworking but I don't see how this would be a difficult thing to do. It's already apparent that most missions wouldn't even have to be changed as the number of cost effective blitzable missions is below 10.

Did anyone actually provide a list of current blitz missions?

I see very few ganks that happened just because people wanted to kill a thing. People getting ganked because they stuffed their ship full of expensive faction modules isn't a factor in the highsec isk/hr argument.

Well quite simply you're not going to achieve the numbers claimed here without stuffing some expensive faction mods on your ship. All it takes is one module for these guys to find it worth ganking you. Since there's such a limited area for SOE mission running it's almost like shooting fish in a barrel.

Out of the population in highsec a relative few are achieving the numbers in question so every gank matters. In the few hours I was blitzing I saw 2x golems and a NM ganked by a group of catalysts (with a thrasher in there for some reason). Extrapolation of that would mean that there's definitely a decent amount of ganks there a day. Unfortunately I cannot remember the number of people in local.

This is very profitable for the gankers even when using the 13 or so ships I saw.

In the end one gank can easily wipe out 30 hours of blitzing. Spread out over a reasonable period of time one can only assume that would be at least a weeks worth of blitzing.

So for every gank that means someone is not making any effective isk for at least 30 hours of gameplay. That means there's a further narrowing in the number achieving the high end.


Basically gankers matter but that doesn't mean blitzing shouldn't be nerfed.

Much like freighter pilots insist ganking is a problem.

Much like freighter pilots insist ganking is a problem, it really isn't there's a handful of people doing. If it were such a goldmine and common as some folks like to claim we'd see a lot more people doing. Its a non-issue use T2 mods and you will have an effective mission ship.

Practice or not you should publish all of the data, that's part of being objective about the whole thing.

I've not seen one. Depends what you mean by blitz as well - not have to kill anything or not have to kill everything?

For the not have to kill anything : Recon Part 1, Recon Part 2 and Cargo Delivery Blood / Serp can be done in an interceptor (or similar) so that's not many.

No one really talks about freighter ganks except Baltec, who much like you, keeps posting the same tired link over and over about them to prove how lucrative it is.

Mr Epeen

I'm going to say this as nicely as I can. Since my opinion is of absolutely no value I'll once again step out of this discussion and the rest of you can impotently whine about whatever you want.

o/

Your call, EVE is big boy land, if you can't deal with the consequences of your mistakes, stop making them.

I'm simply telling you to stop jumping to unfounded conclusions (ie "lp is the problem") and instead spend the time listening.

Roughly I said that while freighters are spread out across all of highsec there's only 3 SOE level 4 security agents. That alone is a huge difference. I agree with you that freighter pilots overstate the odds.

Seems the simplest solution would be to require all NPCs to be killed in order to complete a mission (excluding some missions such as recon 1/3). Obviously some missions would need a little reworking but I don't see how this would be a difficult thing to do. It's already apparent that most missions wouldn't even have to be changed as the number of cost effective blitzable missions is below 10.

I've not seen one. Depends what you mean by blitz as well - not have to kill anything or not have to kill everything?

For the not have to kill anything : Recon Part 1, Recon Part 2 and Cargo Delivery Blood / Serp can be done in an interceptor (or similar) so that's not many.

It has nothing to do with a big boy land. It has to do with respect. I can deal with being told that I'm wrong. It doesn't bother me. But to tell someone who is trying to be reasonable that their opinion is not valued is simply disrepectful and makes you just a whining ****.

At this point, I don't give a ****. The game is fine the way it is and if it changes I'll do whatever the **** I want.

In the meantime Jenn, you should feel free to run outside and play hide and go **** yourself.

I see very few ganks that happened just because people wanted to kill a thing. People getting ganked because they stuffed their ship full of expensive faction modules isn't a factor in the highsec isk/hr argument.

Out of the population in highsec a relative few are achieving the numbers in question so every gank matters. In the few hours I was blitzing I saw 2x golems and a NM ganked by a group of catalysts (with a thrasher in there for some reason). Extrapolation of that would mean that there's definitely a decent amount of ganks there a day. Unfortunately I cannot remember the number of people in local.

In the end one gank can easily wipe out 30 hours of blitzing. Spread out over a reasonable period of time one can only assume that would be at least a weeks worth of blitzing.

So for every gank that means someone is not making any effective isk for at least 30 hours of gameplay. That means there's a further narrowing in the number achieving the high end.

Basically gankers matter but that doesn't mean blitzing shouldn't be nerfed.

Good post, Mara. And what you said is exactly the reason which leads me to believe not a lot of players are blitzing missions. Otherwise, you wouldn't see the times we see allotted to clear missions in order to earn the bonus. To my understanding, the bonus time adjusts itself in relation to the average it takes to complete the mission. For example, last time I checked, Worlds Collide has a bonus time of appx. 5.5 hrs.

*IF* blitzing missions is indeed causing a problem, then this is probably where CCP needs to look. But, after 100 pages there is still no proof to be had that '100 mil plus' is the 'norm', or that it is even sustainable. I shutter at the thought of logging in for even three hours just to blaze through missions; never mind doing it for days on end. I enjoy my time doing missions. But, that's just me.

I've seen thukker mentioned as being a high isk to LP but I'm not sure what people are buying with their LP to convert. Anyone know?

Stoicfaux provided the proof there is evidence of ~100m isk/hr from highsec missions and I provided proof that ~70m isk/hr for drone hub ratting. All of this stuff has been provided but, you all don't read it and continue to scream as loud as you can that highsec is fine. The only one of you that even attempted to prove this was Kimmi the others are either terminally stupid or shitposting. There's been plenty of proof provided by the pro-nullsec crowd and yet all the pro-highsec crowd, aside from a select few, is scream incoherently.

If removing blitzing isn't enough then the other two ideas that haven't been addressed are stretching missions through multiple systems or adding high HP low isk/LP enemies to missions.

Did you see KMs by chance? The cool part out Golem is it runs like a +2.5 CNR with a basic T2 fit, with better tank, better targeting range and better missile range. I doubt those golems were very pricey, that is the reason to use the boat.

Nomad implants.

boring waffle

Good post, Mara. And what you said is exactly the reason which leads me to believe not a lot of players are blitzing missions. Otherwise, you wouldn't see the times we see allotted to clear missions in order to earn the bonus. To my understanding, the bonus time adjusts itself in relation to the average it takes to complete the mission. For example, last time I checked, Worlds Collide has a bonus time of appx. 5.5 hrs.

*IF* blitzing missions is indeed causing a problem, then this is probably where CCP needs to look. But, after 100 pages there is still no proof to be had that '100 mil plus' is the 'norm', or that it is even sustainable. I shutter at the thought of logging in for even three hours just to blaze through missions; never mind doing it for days on end. I enjoy my time doing missions. But, that's just me.

That was my suspicion. I'm having issues with a lack of demand for the implants. They tend to sit on the market for lengths of time for me. I don't particularly feel like moving billions in implants to jita either. I don't see how thukker could be very sustainable compared to SOE.

Oddly I've never paid attention, I think if they drifted I would have noticed at some point.

The completion times are long enough that I have docked up, halfway through a mission, went to dinner, stopped and had a couple drinks with a friend on the way home and STILL got the completion time bonus.

They are in no way indicative of actual completion times unless you are using an assualt frig or something silly like that.