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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
2652
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:13:00 -
[91] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:What's wrong with considering new ways to fix it as opposed to hardware upgrades?
And a bunch of people are saying that, rather than invent nanomachines or quantum computing or whatever to fix this "problem", what's wrong with considering shopping somewhere else? Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:14:00 -
[92] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Dave Stark wrote:
no, i've just suggested that you should be able to tell if the gate you're trying to go through is closed or not. i haven't made a single comment on how that should take place.
if that's the terrible design you'd give it, then yeah please shut up with your terrible ideas.
You've specifically said that you want this information before you get on the same grid as the gate. Or are you just suggesting they wave their magic wands and make it so that isn't a massive drag on the server? I mean, if your suggestion has merit and you aren't just stomping your foot with your lower lip sticking out, then you have a concrete idea, right?
i'm not suggesting they do anything. i'm suggesting knowing if a gate is open or not, is a better system than "warp to the gate and flip a coin" at current. |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:16:00 -
[93] - Quote
Kimmi Chan wrote:Dave Stark wrote:no, i've just suggested that you should be able to tell if the gate you're trying to go through is closed or not. This mechanic already exists. If you warp to the Jita gate in Perimeter and the Jita system is full, you get a popup that says, "Jump Prohibited" because the system is full. Working as intended. I'm so glad we got that sorted.
considering your fix of the problem, is the problem, i see you've read and understood the thread. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19574
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:16:00 -
[94] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:the jump button not working. and jita not letting you in because it's full and that's an intended effect are two different things. So claiming that the system that lets you jump in isn't working as intended isn't the same as claiming that the system isn't working as intended? Claiming that something needs to be fixed isn't the same as claiming that it isn't working?
Yes you have. Multiple times. Stop lying. You can also stop lying about the need for your supposed solution GÇö it's already in the game. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |

Marsha Mallow
63
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:18:00 -
[95] - Quote
Ai Shun wrote:EVE Online is not a twitch based game. It's slower, more thoughtful and requires players to plan ahead. You need knowledge based intelligence to survive and prosper in this game. This means scouting via the starmap, checking intel channels and knowing what your choke points are when hauling.
Why is "Knowing that Jita is a heavily travelled, reinforced node with problems during US peak times over the 4 day weekend period" any different to using the starmap, checking intel channels and generally knowing what is going on in the game?
That doesn't justify dying on gates due to lag.
Even if you know it's there, traders, haulers and manufacturers in particular NEED to get in and out.
Bearing in mind GMs treat empire lag losses that are server based differently to combat losses, I'm pretty sure people are petitioning and probably getting a few reimbursed. It's not an invalid argument.
- |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
2653
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:18:00 -
[96] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:
i'm not suggesting they do anything. i'm suggesting knowing if a gate is open or not, is a better system than "warp to the gate and flip a coin" at current.
You're wrong, because any feasible way for such a thing to exist, would cause more problems than it solves.
And since it would be trying to solve something that isn't actually a problem (autopiloting afk morons getting ganked on a locked gate), then it's not even worth consideration.
I honestly consider it insulting that Jita is wasting one of the cores that could be used for fleet fights. One of those is a big new player and recruitment draw. One of them is utterly boring.
So here's my solution to your "problem". Take Jita off the supernode entirely, FORCE people to shop elsewhere, and spread things around highsec.
Best part is, it's more technologically feasible than anything you're saying in this thread. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |

Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
1229
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:19:00 -
[97] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Dave Stark wrote:
no, i've just suggested that you should be able to tell if the gate you're trying to go through is closed or not. i haven't made a single comment on how that should take place.
if that's the terrible design you'd give it, then yeah please shut up with your terrible ideas.
You've specifically said that you want this information before you get on the same grid as the gate. Or are you just suggesting they wave their magic wands and make it so that isn't a massive drag on the server? I mean, if your suggestion has merit and you aren't just stomping your foot with your lower lip sticking out, then you have a concrete idea, right? i'm not suggesting they do anything. i'm suggesting knowing if a gate is open or not, is a better system than "warp to the gate and flip a coin" at current.
Then always assume the gate is always shut down - always assume that Jita is full on the weekends. And then, with that incredible knowledge in tow, go somewhere else. How is this difficult? "Grr Kimmi-á Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide
www.eve-radio.com -áJoin Eve Radio channel in game! |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:19:00 -
[98] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:the jump button not working. and jita not letting you in because it's full and that's an intended effect are two different things. So claiming that the system that lets you jump in isn't working as intended isn't the same as claiming that the system isn't working as intended? Yes you have. Multiple times. Stop lying. You can also stop lying about the need for your supposed solution GÇö it's already in the game.
i haven't, saying i did doesn't change that fact.
then again actually discussing the topic would be great too but if you want to spend all day **** posting, carry on. |

Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
1229
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:20:00 -
[99] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Kimmi Chan wrote:Dave Stark wrote:no, i've just suggested that you should be able to tell if the gate you're trying to go through is closed or not. This mechanic already exists. If you warp to the Jita gate in Perimeter and the Jita system is full, you get a popup that says, "Jump Prohibited" because the system is full. Working as intended. I'm so glad we got that sorted. considering your fix of the problem, is the problem, i see you've read and understood the thread.
My fix for the problem is going somewhere else. The people in Jita are the problem, not the gates. We've been over this.
"Grr Kimmi-á Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide
www.eve-radio.com -áJoin Eve Radio channel in game! |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19574
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:20:00 -
[100] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:That doesn't justify dying on gates due to lag. GǪbut that's not what we're discussing either.
Quote:Even if you know it's there, traders, haulers and manufacturers in particular NEED to get in and out. Not really, but if they feel they do, they can get in and out very easily.
Dave Stark wrote:i haven't, saying i did doesn't change that fact. GǪbut your posts saying that very thing do. So stop lying. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:21:00 -
[101] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Dave Stark wrote:
i'm not suggesting they do anything. i'm suggesting knowing if a gate is open or not, is a better system than "warp to the gate and flip a coin" at current.
You're wrong, because any feasible way for such a thing to exist, would cause more problems than it solves. And since it would be trying to solve something that isn't actually a problem (autopiloting afk morons getting ganked on a locked gate), then it's not even worth consideration. I honestly consider it insulting that Jita is wasting one of the cores that could be used for fleet fights. One of those is a big new player and recruitment draw. One of them is utterly boring. So here's my solution to your "problem". Take Jita off the supernode entirely, FORCE people to shop elsewhere, and spread things around highsec. Best part is, it's more technologically feasible than anything you're saying in this thread.
*shrug* might not be feasable, won't argue that.
however the system we have now is still terrible and could be improved. |

Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
1229
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:21:00 -
[102] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:Ai Shun wrote:EVE Online is not a twitch based game. It's slower, more thoughtful and requires players to plan ahead. You need knowledge based intelligence to survive and prosper in this game. This means scouting via the starmap, checking intel channels and knowing what your choke points are when hauling.
Why is "Knowing that Jita is a heavily travelled, reinforced node with problems during US peak times over the 4 day weekend period" any different to using the starmap, checking intel channels and generally knowing what is going on in the game? That doesn't justify dying on gates due to lag. Even if you know it's there, traders, haulers and manufacturers in particular NEED to get in and out. Bearing in mind GMs treat empire lag losses that are server based differently to combat losses, I'm pretty sure people are petitioning and probably getting a few reimbursed. It's not an invalid argument.
I'd support your assertion if there were no alternatives.
But there are alternatives - over 7,000 of them.
"Grr Kimmi-á Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide
www.eve-radio.com -áJoin Eve Radio channel in game! |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:22:00 -
[103] - Quote
Kimmi Chan wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Kimmi Chan wrote:Dave Stark wrote:no, i've just suggested that you should be able to tell if the gate you're trying to go through is closed or not. This mechanic already exists. If you warp to the Jita gate in Perimeter and the Jita system is full, you get a popup that says, "Jump Prohibited" because the system is full. Working as intended. I'm so glad we got that sorted. considering your fix of the problem, is the problem, i see you've read and understood the thread. My fix for the problem is going somewhere else. The people in Jita are the problem, not the gates. We've been over this.
actually the hardware running the game isn't sufficient for the amount of players the game has is the problem. |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
2653
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:22:00 -
[104] - Quote
Oh, and as for the claim that if you die on a locked gate, you get reimbursed.
I would like to point that, while many people have told me they will petition a loss to such a situation, no one has ever bragged about how it worked.
Locked gates are laissez faire, folks. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19574
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:23:00 -
[105] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:however the system we have now is still terrible and could be improved. How is it terrible that we have all the information we need at our fingertip; that it's trivially easy to get in even during congested times; that we have plenty of functionality that entirely removes the need to get in and out? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:24:00 -
[106] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:however the system we have now is still terrible and could be improved. How is it terrible that we have all the information we need at our fingertip; that it's trivially easy to get in even during congested times; that we have plenty of functionality that entirely removes the need to get in and out?
read the original post. |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
2653
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:25:00 -
[107] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:however the system we have now is still terrible and could be improved. How is it terrible that we have all the information we need at our fingertip; that it's trivially easy to get in even during congested times; that we have plenty of functionality that entirely removes the need to get in and out? read the original post.
Nothing in the original post has merit.
Literally nothing. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19577
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:26:00 -
[108] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:read the original post. So it's not actually terrible at all then: the GÇ£problemGÇ¥ is that people die because they're sloppy, which is as it should be. Well, that's sorted, I suppose. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:26:00 -
[109] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:however the system we have now is still terrible and could be improved. How is it terrible that we have all the information we need at our fingertip; that it's trivially easy to get in even during congested times; that we have plenty of functionality that entirely removes the need to get in and out? read the original post. Nothing in the original post has merit. Literally nothing.
wrong; it had enough about it to get you to repeatedly post. |

Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
1229
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:27:00 -
[110] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Kimmi Chan wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Kimmi Chan wrote:Dave Stark wrote:no, i've just suggested that you should be able to tell if the gate you're trying to go through is closed or not. This mechanic already exists. If you warp to the Jita gate in Perimeter and the Jita system is full, you get a popup that says, "Jump Prohibited" because the system is full. Working as intended. I'm so glad we got that sorted. considering your fix of the problem, is the problem, i see you've read and understood the thread. My fix for the problem is going somewhere else. The people in Jita are the problem, not the gates. We've been over this. actually the hardware running the game isn't sufficient for the amount of players the game has is the problem.
What you're saying here is that in order for CCP to have adequate hardware they would need said hardware to support 500,000 people in a single system. Not that 500,000 in a single system would ever happen but with that number of subscribers we need to make sure the hardware can support that many.
I could be wrong, but I don't think any such hardware exists, and if it does who the hell would be able to afford it?
"Grr Kimmi-á Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide
www.eve-radio.com -áJoin Eve Radio channel in game! |

Ai Shun
1059
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:27:00 -
[111] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:So, you're suggesting that, before anyone, anywhere, warps to any gate, that the client pings the server to see if the gate is locked or not? And that this information be available on demand, yes?
You're taking a narrow view of the potential methods for solving this. (I don't think it needs solving, but damn that's a narrow viewpoint, mate)
I'd wager that there is already information exchanged between the server and the client when somebody initiates warp. I'd give you better odds that there is information exchanged between the server and the client when somebody jumps into a system. You could leverage that, with a 15m / 30m cache to even further reduce processing loads and flag the different gates in/out of a perimeter system at a very low data transmission overhead. (1 byte additional per gate)
This way the information is available when you jump into a system and you can decide if you want to attempt the next jump or not.
|

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:27:00 -
[112] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:read the original post. So it's not actually terrible at all then GÇö the problem is that people because they're sloppy, which is as it should be. Well, that's sorted, I suppose.
i can't actually be bothered to type a proper response since you refuse to even read, let alone type a proper response.
the issue the OP pointed out has nothing to do with being sloppy. |

Ai Shun
1059
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:30:00 -
[113] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:That doesn't justify dying on gates due to lag.
Even if you know it's there, traders, haulers and manufacturers in particular NEED to get in and out.
Bearing in mind GMs treat empire lag losses that are server based differently to combat losses, I'm pretty sure people are petitioning and probably getting a few reimbursed. It's not an invalid argument.
You don't even know how big the problem is. All you have to base this conjecture on is a single forum post 
You're also only looking in a narrow band. You don't generally NEED to get in or out in those time windows if you've done enough pre-thinking and planning to avoid it during those times. If, however, it becomes a LIFE or DEATH matter to get into Jita at 20:30 on a Saturday night in prime-time when the system is blocked, the risk is known and you need to decide if the odds of losing a cargo is worth the potential pay off. Like the rest of EVE, no? |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
19577
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:31:00 -
[114] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:i can't actually be bothered to type a proper response I noticed. I gave you a proper response anyway, since I'm a kind and gentle person like that.
The OP was about the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker just to cover for the fact that the OP had been sloppy and failed to use the information and mechanics at his disposal. This is, of course, not a problem, but rather the way it should be. Less sloppiness on hiss part would have resulted in less death.
All in all, not a terrible system, just terrible users. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
2493
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:32:00 -
[115] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote: i can't actually be bothered to type a proper response since you refuse to even read, let alone type a proper response.
So instead you make another childish, petulant reply. Excellent work. Rifterlings pirate corporation is now recruitng members for lowsec PvP operations. Newbie friendly, free T1 frigate and dessy hangar, solo tutoring and PvP classes for new members. Join our in game channel 'weflyrifters' and speak to a recruiter today. |

Angeleh
Silverflames
4
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:32:00 -
[116] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Angeleh wrote:A ship that has made it to the gate and activated it should be out safe and not risk being killed. Why? This isn't Ender's Game. The enemy gate is not down.
No idea what Ender's game is, but when you transition system in Eve you can't be shot. And the transition is what should happen when you activate the gate.
Quote:GǪexcept that the gate is not malfunctioning and it is not a game fault. *snip*
It is not an intended design of the gate that it doesn't work, it is a result of the server being overloaded. Yes the mechanism to prevent the server from crashing is working as intended, but the mechanism isn't intended to be there. If the server could handle it, there would be no locked gate. Therefore the locked gate is a result of the game's fault to handle the load. |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:32:00 -
[117] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:i can't actually be bothered to type a proper response I noticed. I gave you a proper response anyway, since I'm a kind and gentle person like that. The OP was about the implementation of a hideously idiotic gamebreaker just to cover for the fact that the OP had been sloppy and failed to use the information and mechanics at his disposal. This is, of course, not a problem, but rather the way it should be. Less sloppiness on hiss part would have resulted in less death.
that's not what the op was about at all. |

Dave Stark
4393
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:33:00 -
[118] - Quote
Domanique Altares wrote:Dave Stark wrote: i can't actually be bothered to type a proper response since you refuse to even read, let alone type a proper response.
So instead you make another childish, petulant reply. Excellent work.
i can't give a reply to some one who isn't even able to discuss the topic and would rather have a monologue with themselves. |

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
2493
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:35:00 -
[119] - Quote
Angeleh wrote: And the transition is what should happen when you activate the gate.
If the system is not full, sure. If the system is capped, traffic control politely refuses your jump and advises you to try again later.
You don't get a gate cloak for being told 'no.'
Working as intended. Rifterlings pirate corporation is now recruitng members for lowsec PvP operations. Newbie friendly, free T1 frigate and dessy hangar, solo tutoring and PvP classes for new members. Join our in game channel 'weflyrifters' and speak to a recruiter today. |

Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
1229
|
Posted - 2014.02.23 20:35:00 -
[120] - Quote
Angeleh wrote:If the server could handle it, there would be no locked gate. Therefore the locked gate is a result of the game's fault to handle the load.
Wrong. The locked gate is a result of the players knowing the limitations of the game's ability to handle the load and then ignoring those limitations.
"Grr Kimmi-á Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide
www.eve-radio.com -áJoin Eve Radio channel in game! |
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