Not interested in conversing with trolls sorry...

Bullshit, 'IRL' you shoot the ************ trying to shoot you.... you can't do that in a mining/merchant ship in eve.... which is ******* stupid

And I feel sorry for your family if you are a cop... if your idea of 'defense' is simply survival.... you are not nearly prepared to do what is necessary to face down a killer.

Yes, I'm aware that tutorials barely existed some time ago. But do the tutorials prepare for the world even now? That deserves another topic altogether.

There were comments about newbies being griefed or ganked right out of rookie station, did you experience that as well? Greeted by flashy reds or yellows 1 jump from the starter system? Spammed by duel requests before knowing what duel even is? Just a few examples out the top of my head.

What should also be considered is the fact that players are the product of their time. Players who started 5-10 years ago aren't necessarily of the same generation of people or players. They may have grown in a different kind of world, and that has the potential to carry here to the game. HTFU has very different meaning to a 12-year-old (PEGI 12 game) than to a 30-year-old.

We were once new players too.

Very true, and when we were new players, EVE was a very different place.

I think the eaelier comment by someone, that much uneccessary and unfounded disgruntlement is actually rooted in some peoples inability or unwillingness to accept or understand the nature of this game as compared to many other MMOs, rather than the "toxiccommunity", is very true.

Its not the behavior of other people towards them that is the problem, the problem is their own attitude.

If I walk around in life with unrealistic expectations both of the way the world works and of the nature of my fellow mankind, I will be repeatedly dissappointed and angry, not because of what other autonomous people are doing in it, but because I am so stupid as to assume I am responsible for, or capable of controlling, anyone else except myself.

These people dont seem to understand the fundamental link between the ability to control an outcome, and being responsible for it.

I am not responsible for how others view my actions. Why? Because I have no business or auspice to control how they view it.
That is their own prerogative, purview and privilege and one I cannot determine or define. Its in their own head to which I have no access or business.

Reciprocally, this also means that though they are free to view my actions as they wish, their views have NO control over my own autonomous choices in my own life. Their views are their own, and not mine, and do not define how I choose to live my life, no matter how they try to claim that theirs is the "right" way.

But many people dont understand this. They think because they dont "like" something, that somehow means they are entitled to judge and restrict those who do like that.

How does this translate in EVE?

As some people who expect others to behave according to how THEY demand and perceive they should, according to their own internal system of beliefs. Is that fair towards the other person? Hell no. Does that entitle them to dictate how others should behave or think? Absolutely not. Why not? Becuase the same rationale could be levelled right back at them, and they, in return, be expected (against their own autonomy and self-determination) to act as those other people whom they presume to dictate to, dictate right back to them.

Its a ridiculous arrangement, premise and approach to interaction with others.

Its also extremely offensive and socially reprehenensible to even THINK you are in somekind of position to dictate to others how they should behave. It is none of your business. You have no control over how others behave, only over how YOU yourself behave.

I am not responsible for how you feel about something.
I am not responsible to your personal view on how "things should be".
I am not beholden to act as you in your head think I should.
You dont, and cant, control me, nor I you.

Its abhorrent to even think or attempt otherwise, and yet that is exactly what this thread is trying to defend.

Stop trying to dictate how others live their lives and how they choose to conduct themselves.

Eve Online Priest 2423546, preaching us Social Apathy 101.

Stop trying to violate and impinge upon the rights of other individuals to make their own choices.
Stop trying to tell other people how to live.
THAT is socially unacceptable, in the extreme, and you should stop it immediately.

If those individual rights prevents and violates others to have those same rights, then you're damn right I will speak out for the one being unjustly violated against.

If I come into your home, take a **** on your carpet and **** your wife, I would take it as my individual right to do so, right ?

Get a ******* grip on the social empathy of things, even just a little.

Nobodys rights are being violated unjustly in the game.

Your premise is false.

That is a fair point, but the question at that point is really if it should affect the design. Yes, parents can expect the game content (but not necessarily the interactions) to be non-offensive enough to suit a 12-year-old, but that doesn't mean it's actually a game for 12-year-olds. In practice, getting that rating is more a retail consideration GÇö when releasing those boxed copies, it was needed in order for some outlets to carry the game. Also, ratings aside, EVE has always been a more adult game than your average MMO. Is that a bad thing? Or is it just a thing that needs to be communicated more clearly?

There couldn't be more evidence of a premise, my friend...

Gratuitous and personal humiliations and verbal slander was proven a rampant fact in the game and Out of game also, if you re-read the OPs post or have been paying attention lately.

You don't have a right to not be humiliated for your mistakes.

Do you even know what "slander" means?

The law supercedes EVE. If someone violates the law, that is obviously an issue where another autonomous individuals rights have been breached by ANOTHER INDIVIDUALS ACTIONS, but NOT BY THAT OTHER INDIVIDUALS RIGHTS.

CCP has absolutely zero responsibility for or control of what happens outside of the game.

Are you so juvenile or uneducated that you cannot distinguish the difference in definitions of these concepts and terms?

You are like a child talking about adult issues. You clearly have zero understand of what your rights actually are, and what those same rights actually are in others. Like a child whos idea of rights is limited to "i was nice and did as I was told to the best of my understanding, that means I now have the right to that piece of candy as a reward".

How exactly are peoples rights being violated ingame?

Be specific.
Give me 3 examples.
Either do that or remove yourself.

And what happened? What happened that day? Gaming press ate it up. Holy crap I remember Eurogamer, IGN, everyone talking about Alexander "The Mittani" Gianturco goading an audience of Eve players into harassing a suicidal man to hopefully see him go over the edge.

It was a lot more harsh for a new player back then.

What amazes me is:

1. He wasn't permabaned.
2. He isn't in jail for terrorist threats.
3. People still follow him, how pathetic are they?

Your understanding of what rights you have, which are exactly the same rights as I have, is completely false.

False ?

Feel free to show me how so in my latter sentences, because so far I don't see it.

PS: You may refrain from superior-looking manner of speech, or you lose all credibility, haven't they taught you that at relativist law school ? ;)

Terrorist Threats! Call the Cyber Police!

Right?

The funny thing is, that my daughter likes to sit on my lap when I'm on my suicide ganker character. She loves to watch as other ships blow up, her enthusiasm is hilarious.

We had a CSM chairman literally stand on-stage and tell people to harass an ISBoxing ice miner, who had voiced concerns about suicidal thoughts in a message to him, with the hopes that the guy would actually hurt himself. (Cont'd)

Alright you seem to be incapable of reading so ill say it completely bluntly.

You talk big. I want you to back up your talk. Get all your ganker friends into a fleet, as many as you can. Then, fight me. I'm not saying come welp into me. It won't be as nearly as satisfying as shaming you and your tank fleet with my fleet of missionary and miners who decided we had enough of griefers and campers.

I am literally saying come at us bro. But since you aren't capable of rallying them, or unwilling, it seems you are intact proven a coward, as the rest of the griefers here. Can't shoot this that'd shoot back now can we?

Get rekt.

<3

---