I haven't used Somer Blink. The first time I heard of them was their donating 4,000 PLEX to help typhoon victims last year. I think they are not bad guys. Perhaps the reason they get hammered is that they are too successful in their business.

Doesn't even need to be a third seller Somer could had put up a shop by him self for selling GTC's, advertising it as someone else's company and raked in the cash and none the wiser.

Given the lengths some have gone to to stir up anti-blink sentiment to say there has been no witch hunt at all is hardly accurate.

If you're trying to figure out the "motive" you'll only be sorely disappointed. EVE players don't like it when another player presumes to be above the rules. The outrage was entirely justified IMO.

Submit your evidence to [email protected]

isnt there any mechanism in CCP to check their dealings and third party service providers to see that If they are keeping their part of the promise? Because What somer did like you said did not meet the original proposition. THen why CCP ever check them ?

So I hope this means that just because Somer decided to shut down themselves, the investigation is not over? If they are found "guilty" I still expect actions to be taken. Just because someone decides to cease on their own free will doesn't make it a get out of jail free card for the things done...

I understand that it's a delicate situation and that CCP also do not wish to see players of Somer getting punished (where not needed) because they played a game where the operator did wrong things - but still allowing the bad guys to offload everything to alts and what not is also kinda of a slap on the wrist. Like said, I know it's delicate and hard. But I really don't want to see you drop the ball on this.

/c

It'd be pretty stupid for CCP to punish people who played on that site, given CCP's past tacit endorsements of SOMERblink. But if they conclude that Somerset Mahm and his staff were clearly looking to engage in ISK selling, I do hope they are given the same punishment as any other player who engages in such activity.

Enjoy the hit to PLEX sales......

CCP loves making an example out of highly visible players to demonstrate that nobody is above the rules.

This is not mob justice.

This is a COMMUNITY that tries to solve the problem with free thinking. If you cant deal with other people's opinions then I suggest you to read somewhere else.

Also, it's not mob justice. CCP leaves a thread open for angry posters to be angry in and reduce moderator workload while the grownups at CCP talk. I doubt a single post in this thread was even considered in those discussions.

Question to CCP Falcon:

Given CCP's usual punitive actions when RMT accounts and their clients are discovered, will the clients of Somer that partook of this offer also face the usual actions for being a party to RMT transactions?

I'd say SOMER had a fairly good idea to try and circumvent the RMT rule. There really is no way to determine if they were actually doing it on CCP's end though. It is a 2 step process: 1) create demand for GTC's by offering highest isk for the PLEX redeemed from GTC's. 2) negotiate a kickback with a GTC seller and advertise that seller. The SOMER proposal clearly states they will buy the PLEX resulting from GTC sales with ANY affiliate but we can safely assume that the bulk of those sales will be from the linked GTC seller as it would take the least effort to locate. Everything on CCP's side of the table will look above board and they could never know different. SOMERS side of the table and the deals they negotiate with the GTC affiliate are where the info we need is located to determine if it was RMT and we will never see that.

PS. This is how pachinko parlors in Japan circumvent the gambling laws. You gamble for these "prizes" and then walk around the corner to a shop that buys said prizes. The connection between that shop and the gambling establishment is where the related info can be found.

An excellent post

An excellent post

I'm meeting again today within CCP, and will be in touch with the CSM again once we have further developments.

Thanks for the patience guys

An excellent post

CCP got gamed, by someone with the clear and long established intent to game those who make games.

While RMT is bad, I'm not sure it rates on the scale of wife-beating and stealing pensions.

In a nutshell this is exactly what happened. Finding enough evidence to get a conviction for it will be next to impossible though.

Question to CCP Falcon:

Given CCP's usual punitive actions when RMT accounts and their clients are discovered, will the clients of Somer that partook of this offer also face the usual actions for being a party to RMT transactions?

I haven't used Somer Blink. The first time I heard of them was their donating 4,000 PLEX to help typhoon victims last year. I think they are not bad guys. Perhaps the reason they get hammered is that they are too successful in their business.

Finding enough evidence to get a conviction for it will be next to impossible though.

It's not as bad as those things, but donating any amount of PLEX to PLEX for GOOD doesn't put you above the rules. As Stannis of the House Baratheon the First of His Name, the One True King of the Andals, the Rhoynar and the First Men, Lord of the Seven Kingdoms and Protector of the Realm says, a good act does not wash out the bad, nor the bad the good.

Hardly. Besides, there is such a thing as intent. In that regard Somer has left quite a trail. Markee however is a different beast alltogether.

Let's be honest though, when CCP declared war on RMT, there were plenty things that were grey during those days. Turns out it never pays to enable those who make a living out of gaming you for legitimisation. It's a harsh lesson for CCP.

I applaud Somer for being charitable with their considerable space monies.

However they got hammered because although they do a lot to generate revenue and content for CCP they are repeatedly crossing the line when it comes to RMT.

And to all of you saying: well why shouldn't he make money from it?

A: He can, but not from the ISK he has gained. ISK conversion to USD is a no-no as spelled out already many times in this thread.

And why do we care?

A: Because the rest of us can not even begin to do what he is doing. Consider how alliances already have affiliate links for buying PLEX so that when a member buys PLEX with that link they generate revenue for their alliance. The reason Mittani decided, perhaps, to make such a song and dance about this story so early is because it affects his alliance. But it affects other alliances too and I support him for speaking up along with the rest of us. Why would an alliance member buy PLEX from anyone other than SomerDragon if they would get less ISK for their PLEX by doing so? Most wouldn't, because Somer is making a "loss" (in ISK) on the PLEX sales in order to make a gain in USD. If other alliances, players, or game groups tried to follow suit (and some did when we had version one of this debacle in 2013) CCP was very very quick to shut them down immediately.

TLDR: If CCP let SomerDragon have their way, then we have a reboot of the T20 Scandal incoming (where an EVE employee used game mechanics to help out a certain group of players).

no RMT means no RMT, no matter how intricate or obfuscated you make the scheme. And if RMT is OKfor Somer, it needs to be OK for the rest of us.

--
Fang

Oh god, more meetings...

This isn't a criminal trial. You don't have to prove things beyond a reasonable doubt here.

Indeed. My initial questions after reading the proposal was, what are they going to use this potentially unlimited supply of plex for and why are they willing to pay an unspecified amount over market to ensure they receive them.

Every player who took a chance on EVE because of the battles that made mainstream media, you can attribute to us (and the people we fought against).

This isn't a criminal trial. You don't have to prove things beyond a reasonable doubt here.

The way plex prices are going up and up, all he'd need to do is sit on them for a few weeks before selling them for more than he paid.

There needs to be some minimum evidence standard or players will have the impression there is no due process involved in permanently banning their account.

So I hope this means that just because Somer decided to shut down themselves, the investigation is not over? If they are found "guilty" I still expect actions to be taken. Just because someone decides to cease on their own free will doesn't make it a get out of jail free card for the things done...

I understand that it's a delicate situation and that CCP also do not wish to see players of Somer getting punished (where not needed) because they played a game where the operator did wrong things - but still allowing the bad guys to offload everything to alts and what not is also kinda of a slap on the wrist. Like said, I know it's delicate and hard. But I really don't want to see you drop the ball on this.

/c