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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Shahirahh Orgasana
University of Caille Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2011.12.01 04:33:00 -
[511] - Quote
A whole lot of this font angst would be avoided if CCP would just let US pick which font to use. Seriously, in this day and age, how hard can it be to allow picking something from our system Fonts folder? So some fonts would mess up the UI? so what! |
FilterDecay
Tsunami Cartel Dark Solar Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.12.01 04:36:00 -
[512] - Quote
New font is bad. I feel like all my windows are resized. What a pain. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
410
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Posted - 2011.12.01 04:42:00 -
[513] - Quote
Woo Doggy wrote:Vachir Khan wrote:CCP t0rfifrans wrote:Hey all
Obviously there are divided opinions on the new font, it being in front of everyone the whole time and a big part of the overall EVE experience. When designing the new font, there were two major paths which we had to choose between. Make it legible, and improve accessibility or make it sci-fi and futuristic, risking usability for asthetics. We chose to go down the usability path.
Now from what we can see, there are very heated opinions on the topic. We did a little quasi-scientific analysis of the forums chatter. There were 1220 posts on the topic at the time of counting, 960 unique characters posting ( with the top 50 posting 31% of the posts ). We counted 6% objecting the new font, 49% somewhat neutral and 45% writing in a positive manner about it.
Looking at that date, we determine than while many people miss the old font and want the new one printed in books in order to be burned Farenheit 451 style, the majority of those writing on the topic like it and are enjoying the improved usability.
Also, the UI scaling is a very separate feature than the font, it was just lucky that we managed to get them both into Crucible. The font and the scaling had been developed by very different people at separate ends of the studio on very different schedules. Being able to launch both of then in Crucible made us pretty happy in terms of providing increased usability, which is something EVE sorely needs improved and we are committed to work on ad infinitum.
Finally, don't pick on Punkturis for implementing the new font or the UI scaling! She did a great job on both and I think EVE is a better product as a result of it! Those "6%", as you call them, are probably the PVPers who actually need to make USE of all the info they can while still being somewhat able to see wth they're doing ingame. I'm quite sure some idiot who does nothing but mining in high sec or chains lvl 4s isn't exactly bothered by the changed font and its implications. Have you seen the screenshots of people who PVP, it's a fricking WALL of nothing but UI. I'm sure some carebears with a 63" screen running at 6666x1337 while not ever getting further than targeting 4 ice roids does fine and will attest to just that. Would one of you CCP people actually be a PVPer (and possibly not have an uberl337 screen) worth his/her salt he'd just need to glance 3 seconds at the new UI to realise that the font (and almost more importantly it's implications) is TERRIBLE. EXACTLY. It's not the font that's the problem. It's the UI scaling. Horrible for those of us with small screens that were able to have pvp info viewed appropriately with old font, but can no longer do so because of the changes. Question: Did CCP test this on a 17" inch monitor? My guess is NO.
Actually, being able to tell what system you are in when in enemy territory is rather a nice change of pace.
Scale things down a bit and you will find that you can get as much, if not more, on your screen than before... and actually be able to read all of it for a change. To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
Psychophantic
163
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Posted - 2011.12.01 05:01:00 -
[514] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote: Scale things down a bit and you will find that you can get as much, if not more, on your screen than before... and actually be able to read all of it for a change.
90% http://i.imgur.com/Wr4nC.jpg
Overview pretty close to same size as when using old font. Item stacks too small. Ammo stacks too small. Icons in space and overview too small. Hud too small. Window controls too small.
Go to 100% and I'll need an IFR to fly with that overview.
But just keep on dismissing peoples concerns, we're all here solely for the drama. |
Forum Fighter
Internet Tough Guys
0
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Posted - 2011.12.01 05:08:00 -
[515] - Quote
I like the font. What's the problem? Rescuing fanbois from haters since 2003-¬ |
Peter Drakon
Independent Traders and Builders MPA
5
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Posted - 2011.12.01 06:23:00 -
[516] - Quote
I checked my self, and in 90% scaling the stack size numbers (like how many ammo there is in that stack) are actualy 5 pixel high. The overview text in 90% is 8, in small font setting is only 6 pixel high. There is no font that is going to be nice and readable in that small - but this is a scaling problem, and not the font's fault.
Also, if the window you are trying to read is transparent, then the anti-aliasing feature will even worsen the look more. Try to set the window transparency to 255 (thus, not transparent), and check if that is better for You to read. Keep in mind, that pinned windows are always transparent. The old star background had way less stars then the new (it was more uniform black), so now there are much more white dots behind the overview, and those mish up with the text.
This is not a font problem, it's the scaling, anti-aliasing and windows transparency settings. There are so many new changes, allocate some time to find what is the best for You.
Also, those who are puting up screenshots: please set the "Save screenshots in high quality" setting, and do not use lossy compression image types (JPG for instance), use PNG or uplad the original BMP screenshot. |
Drew SkyWalker
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
0
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Posted - 2011.12.01 06:41:00 -
[517] - Quote
Probably it's a matter of personal perception but for me the new font is much more readable and I wouldn't go back now. It does take more screen space but it can be scaled down (remaining clear). I still remember my initial stress when I just started playing Eve - the old font looked stylish but was hard to read, I just got used to it because Eve had more attractions to offer. Now the font is easier on the eyes, thanks, CCP! |
Trotula
9
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Posted - 2011.12.01 06:49:00 -
[518] - Quote
As the last year has shown, there is only one way to give feedback that CCP responds to. If your so seriously disgruntled over the font as you say you are, then unsubscribe from Eve Online and on your exit survey be sure to post that their refusal to acknowledge that the new font is an issue for you is the reason for leaving.
Anything else will only result in CCP doing what they are doing right now, digging in their heals and blaming 'the vocal minority' for the attention on the forums. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
415
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Posted - 2011.12.01 07:23:00 -
[519] - Quote
Psychophantic wrote:Ranger 1 wrote: Scale things down a bit and you will find that you can get as much, if not more, on your screen than before... and actually be able to read all of it for a change.
90% http://i.imgur.com/Wr4nC.jpgOverview pretty close to same size as when using old font. Item stacks too small. Ammo stacks too small. Icons in space and overview too small. Hud too small. Window controls too small. Go to 100% and I'll need an IFR to fly with that overview. But just keep on dismissing peoples concerns, we're all here solely for the drama.
People really should stop posting screen shots that prove the opposite of what they are claiming.
You appear to have a rather small monitor, probably 17 inch at best. That's not helping you either.
I can see everything you listed perfectly well, and I don't exactly have great eyesight. And you aren't showing the pop up tool tips for items like ammo stacks, not that they are often needed.
I wish I had kept the link posted in the other thread that allowed you to see the old font and then mouse over the pic to see the exact same thing in the new font. It was posted to prove there was a problem... unfortunately for the person who put it together it rather decisively proved the opposite.
Sure, they could stand to fool around with the scaling and other options a bit to accommodate people that play on various size monitors and at various odd resolutions, but for legibility this one is already head and shoulders above the old font. To kill the enemy and break their toys!
It's not so much a mission statement,-áit's more like a family motto. |
Psychophantic
167
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Posted - 2011.12.01 07:50:00 -
[520] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote: You appear to have a rather small monitor, probably 17 inch at best. That's not helping you either.
23" @ 1680x1050, funnily enough this is the same resolution as the screenshot.
I really don't know what your problem is.
Keep trying to convince me that I'm a crank though. I'm glad you're over the moon with the new font. I'm not asking for a revert or a replacement. I'm asking for the issues which have been reported up to a month before this font went live to be looked at.
At the moment I'm just skill queuing on both accounts. Probably spent an hour in game since the expansion. |
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Psychophantic
167
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:00:00 -
[521] - Quote
dblpost |
Roime
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
40
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:01:00 -
[522] - Quote
(cross-posting, sorry if it bothers someone, there are just so many threads)
1) I really like the new font and it's made my EVE experience undoubtedly much better... but I did some testing yesterday and looks like I'm in a fortunate situation- 100% scaling suits my screen size and resolution, in my use case everything is perfect.
2) scaling to 90% on 24"@1920x1200 simply does not look good. There are several issues, worst is what is probably the source of all "my eyes get sore/tired/burn" -comments, they are real and the fault is EVE:
- the font looks like it's a bitmap font that is scaled to a non-native size, and anti-aliased, making it blurry and actually hurting my eyes. Idk the actual tech behind the font, but problem looks very similar to a bitmap font displayed at wrong size. UI scalings should lock to nearest native font size, and work from there.
- there are several scaling errors in various parts of the UI; words appear in different font sizes (Items list), text is not aligned to baseline, words are not aligned to left.
After this test I fully understand the rage and think people should seriously be more chill about each other and the font. CCP should also look into this technical issue, it is not as simple as different opinions. |
Djavo
Privateers Privateer Alliance
2
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:13:00 -
[523] - Quote
I personally like the new font, it scales well and well it works as intended I reckon.
All in all I am very happy with the latest update to our internet spaceship world. |
JeanMichel Bizarre
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
5
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:40:00 -
[524] - Quote
Just dropping in again to say how happy I am with the new font. It's so clear and legible... Yeah, I wished it was more sci-fi, but legibility is more important to me. |
mkint
415
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:41:00 -
[525] - Quote
CCP t0rfifrans wrote:Being able to launch both of then in Crucible made us pretty happy in terms of providing increased usability, which is something EVE sorely needs improved and we are committed to work on ad infinitum.
To clarify, are you going to work on fixing the new "fixed" font, or are you going to work on "usability"?
Because really, the old font had issues with a couple of characters. The new font is an issue. |
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries Alliance not Found
10
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:51:00 -
[526] - Quote
There are several aspects of the new font which are significantly worse than the old...
But the most significant is how much screen real-estate it takes up. In order to see the same number of orders in my wallet for example the window has to be almost twice as large.
Now maybe I'm missing an option somewhere to set the fontsize on the UI (other than the context menu) but...
Oh, and the chat scaling is a bit broken too (reducing the font size by a certain amount and the next reduction doesn't change the font size noticably but increases the spacing of the font... meaning it actually takes up more space. |
Terigan
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:52:00 -
[527] - Quote
Playing on a 27" monitor at 1920x1080, the old font gave me severe eyestrain. Using smaller resolutions helped legibility but then everything became slightly fuzzy since I was at a non-native resolution for this monitor.
I like the new font. I've tried it at 90% - 125% and while all are usable, 100% is what I prefer. The legibility is much improved for me. |
Lonokus Del'lar
Gambler's Fallacy
1
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:54:00 -
[528] - Quote
I have a small monitor and this new UI and Font make the game almost unplayable. How the hell did this make it to live? |
Planetarian
Covert Operations Inc.
1
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Posted - 2011.12.01 08:57:00 -
[529] - Quote
To all the whiners... You had time to complain / give feedback. You obviously didn't. You fail. Door is that way >>>>>
Oh and, new font is fine. God job!
If you're reading this you've come to my signature, which has little relevance to this post |
Psychophantic
167
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:08:00 -
[530] - Quote
Planetarian wrote:To all the whiners... You had time to complain / give feedback. You obviously didn't. You fail. Door is that way >>>>>
Oh and, new font is fine. God job!
We did. In the test server forums. So much so that they were forced to explain that the font would not be optional nearly a month ago.
The old there's the door trick eh. That's what eve needs right now hey? They can afford to lose some more subs now they've made some layoffs I suppose. |
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RaTTuS
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
146
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:08:00 -
[531] - Quote
new font is good, I'm used to it already - i don't think it's as good as the old old font but that did not scale and it's been too long to really say ;-p
http://eveboard.com/ub/419190933-134.png
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Koda Myr'koff
Lollipops for Rancors
1
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:15:00 -
[532] - Quote
Before anyone comments, I DID put through this feedback prior to Crucible going live, but here it is again.
I play on my monitor's native res, 1920x1200, and had zero issues with the previous font. My eyes are stuffed and I have to wear fairly strong glasses, both eyes with different problems, so people who couldn't read it before are either in denial about the state of their eyes or are playing at non-native resolutions (always a stellar idea ).
With the new font at 100%, everything is too big. I have to have many windows far bigger than they used to be in order to fit the same amount of stuff in. I tried 90% scaling and this makes the stuff that was too big perfect...but now all the stuff that was ok with the new font is too small to be rendered properly. As in there's no spacing at all between many characters in some windows. None, zero, not a single blank pixel between the edges of characters.
For the love of god, let the old font be an option or let us make EVERY text element of the UI the same size. We shouldn't have to compromise between having some stuff readable and others too big, or some stuff a blur of pixels and other stuff ok. |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
78
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:17:00 -
[533] - Quote
New font is ugly, but very functional.
Working as intended.
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Sashaaa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:20:00 -
[534] - Quote
CCP Navigator wrote:It is currently not possible to toggle between the new font and the old one. While we appreciate that this is something a lot of people are asking for, it simply cannot be done in the current font rendering system.
Not a problem.
Forget the toggle thing, just bring back the old one then.
Thank very much |
Tyrnaeg en Varche
46
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:31:00 -
[535] - Quote
I like the new font, everything is clearer now. I also like the scalability options, very usueful for some of my characters that want lots of windows open at the same time.
Overview is fine, you can use the "Use Small Font" checkbox to fine tune it.
Generally, with the new expansion i can arrange my windows better on screen, and that is ... good!
haters gonna hate, etc etc. |
Shang Tsungin
Narcolepsy Industries Absolute Damage Inc.
0
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:37:00 -
[536] - Quote
The new font beats the old one. |
Ai Shun
State War Academy Caldari State
15
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:37:00 -
[537] - Quote
It would be interesting to see the size of monitor and resolution that players who dislike the new font are using. I booted up into EVE for the first time tonight after the update and on a 1920x1200 display it looked brilliant. Everything was legible, clear to read and I think it looked grand. To me it is a big improvement on the old font.
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Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra Gallente Federation
58
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Posted - 2011.12.01 09:58:00 -
[538] - Quote
Woo Doggy wrote: Question: Did CCP test this on a 17" inch monitor? My guess is NO.
Have you checked how cheap 24" screens are these days? My guess is NO.
(granted, your argument holds some weight with laptops, yet that's the drawback you get from buying a PC that is squished into portable form factor with all kinds of compromises)
If anything, the font change has made me consider a 2560x1600 27-30" new display... |
Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra Gallente Federation
58
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Posted - 2011.12.01 10:00:00 -
[539] - Quote
Psychophantic wrote:Ranger 1 wrote: Scale things down a bit and you will find that you can get as much, if not more, on your screen than before... and actually be able to read all of it for a change.
90% http://i.imgur.com/Wr4nC.jpgOverview pretty close to same size as when using old font. Item stacks too small. Ammo stacks too small. Icons in space and overview too small. Hud too small. Window controls too small. Go to 100% and I'll need an IFR to fly with that overview. But just keep on dismissing peoples concerns, we're all here solely for the drama.
I guess your argument could be reworded as;
"EVE Overview window needs a redesign to make it more screen space-efficient"
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Sashaaa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2011.12.01 10:02:00 -
[540] - Quote
Octarius Eskravu wrote:the older might had issues...but this is surely not the solution.
I am old(er) and I much preferrred the old font. This is pretty dismal to be honest. |
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