If you think theres no difference then why not just go all out and say why all this bollox, why dont CCP just sell skill points for cash

so if the end result is "a character with the exact set of skills that you want" whether some one rejigs it and sells it to you, or you buy it and rejig it... does it really matter if some one makes a 1 day old character and dumps a bunch of skill packets on to it?

in all 3 scenarios you just end up with a character with exactly the skills you want. restricting it to "you can only reallocate your own SP" doesn't really change the situation.

If you think theres no difference then why not just go all out and say why all this bollox, why dont CCP just sell skill points for cash

No matter how it is presented and sugar coated, this is precisely what they intend to do really...

Cant you already have that now?

at least at the moment they're limiting the supply to how fast the community can collectively train said SP. just spawning it out of thin air takes that limit and throws it out of the window, down the street, and in to the gutter.



yes, which is why the restriction of "you can only reallocate your own SP" is an irrelevant restriction.

What are you saying really this is completely ok or the game is already pay to win?

having sp is hardly "winning".

the fact that you can already sell one set of SP and buy another set of SP via the character bazzar... yes, i'm saying this new idea is completely ok. it's not like this idea is new to eve.

There is more to it than that.... a character's name and reputation now becomes moot because they are just shells housing SP... a character should be an analogue to somebody a real person not just a mix of skills that can be bought and sold. It cheapens Eve.

There is more to it than that.... a character's name and reputation now becomes moot because they are just shells housing SP... a character should be an analogue to somebody a real person not just a mix of skills that can be bought and sold. It cheapens Eve.

just like a ship is a shell housing a pod. if my ship's slow i'll buy a faster one. if my pilot can't fly that faster one i'll buy one that can.

it's a nice romantic idea that that "history should matter" but - it doesn't. the history of a person matters, the history of a specific character doesn't. as soon as you show some one the character sale thread that character's history is pretty much void.

this idea doesn't cheapen eve - eve is already that cheap.

How do you follow the history of the person if you can't follow his shell, because he just guts it after each major scam. I guess the honest players would be against this. All of the scammers rejoice!

You have to train that alt also, so it's not the same. Yes OGB is broken and has been around for years buts it's not game destroying.

How do you follow the history of the person if you can't follow his shell, because he just guts it after each major scam. I guess the honest players would be against this. All of the scammers rejoice!

the same way you follow the history of a person who just started.

it's no different to starting a new alt - you don't know if that person is new to eve or a 10 year vet who spun up a new character. it's not like these "problems" and "exceptions" are new.

How do you follow the history of the person if you can't follow his shell, because he just guts it after each major scam. I guess the honest players would be against this. All of the scammers rejoice!

just like a ship is a shell housing a pod. if my ship's slow i'll buy a faster one. if my pilot can't fly that faster one i'll buy one that can.

it's a nice romantic idea that that "history should matter" but - it doesn't. the history of a person matters, the history of a specific character doesn't. as soon as you show some one the character sale thread that character's history is pretty much void.

this idea doesn't cheapen eve - eve is already that cheap.

Why do people keep blathering about reputation?

In all of EVE history, maybe a hundred pilots have any reputation of note and I'm pretty sure they won't be breaking down their characters any time soon.

Can we just put that tired excuse to bed now? It's getting really redundant.

Mr Epeen

There really are... Account API's and character sales... in the future when you have no idea where the SP came from or where it went, you really have no idea and no way to figure out, names mean nothing. Reputation is the only deterrent you have really against scamming in Eve. Who thinks we need more folks gaming the system or more scammers in Eve?

For some reason, this is fine and doesn't cheapens the game at all. But me getting a 500k sp packet to get heavy missiles V a week earlier is terrible for the game and we should all cancel our subscriptions because CCP dared mention the idea

We're not talking absolutes here.

Yes, you can get the SP you want now by buying it. So it should be a lot EASIER because it's already currently possible?

Scamming is possible, and it's possible to avoid a bad rap, so let's make it EASIER to avoid one!

There are barriers to entry on what you're saying, we're only after solving a personal problem, tweaking our char a little avoiding wasted SP on our own char or obsolete SP or SP that no longer makes sense for its progression, you're campaigning for changing the whole paradigm for how SP is perceived and used, because Eve is already cheap. So let's make it CHEAPER!

If only we had an Eve Easy button with a credit card slot in it that spammed the message YOU WIN for each transaction.

We're not talking absolutes here.

Yes, you can get the SP you want now by buying it. So it should be a lot EASIER because it's already currently possible?

Scamming is possible, and it's possible to avoid a bad rap, so let's make it EASIER to avoid one!

There are barriers to entry on what you're saying, we're only after solving a personal problem, tweaking our char a little avoiding wasted SP on our own char or obsolete SP or SP that no longer makes sense for its progression, you're campaigning for changing the whole paradigm for how SP is perceived and used, because Eve is already cheap. So let's make it CHEAPER!

If only we had an Eve Easy button with a credit card slot in it that spammed the message YOU WIN for each transaction.

If there is no correlation between SP's and in game skill then why would you need to be instantly boosted by the need for in game purchasing of skillpoints ??

The devblog created kind of a huge shitstorm in the first hour or so, and I only saw two CSM's who were capable of expressing their opinion without hopping into the cesspool and slinging ****: Sort and Gorski. So mad props to those two.
The big drawbacks that I've seen are

• People will make SP farming toons
• It'll be harder to evaluate character SP based on age
• Older players will abuse this to gain an insurmountable advantage

And probably some others.

For the first bit...yea probably. But guess what? People currently make specialized characters to sell on the Bazaar. This doesn't cheapen any part of the game.

Assessing character skill based on age will be a bit harder, but if that's a huge issue it's really easy to fix. There is no part of the brain-bag system that prevents adding a skillpoint tab to show info. I don't think it's a problem but v0v if it is, easy fix irrelevant to the mechanic.

The third part is what gets me mega confused. Why would I spend billions of isk to get like 1mil unallocated SP? I have a hard enough time trying to choose what to train as is. The main argument I see is "because they can". Which a) I'm not sure how that's a real argument and b) wutface. Yea I could buy tons of **** and destroy it for no reason. In Eve, people aren't dumb. Players tend to spend their time doing things that'll help them.

Newer players, especially those that catch the Eve bug early, will benefit from this. I started a new character last year or so and wanted to see what it was like. In the first 3 weeks I had a lot of fun, I flew a frigate, I PvP'd, I did missions. It was a blast. I was playing like 3 hours a night 4 times a week and made a fair amount of ISK from looting and salvaging. I had like, 3 bil by the end of 3 weeks. Then I hit this wall. Can't really try something new, can't fly T2 for a month, can't move up to cruisers that effectively, I had so much to catch up on in terms of support skills that I couldn't even consider moving up to a new class. And then I just stopped playing.

Luckily I had a main to fall back on, but imagine if I was just John Q Pubbie. Three billion isn't enough to buy a new character on the forums. What if I could leverage my activity in the game (isk) to get 4 million SP and start moving on.
There is of course this notion that misery loves company; when I started playing Eve I had to just train and not do anything for a few months - so everyone else should too! Right? I'd much rather see those people who are really into the game keep playing so that I can see them in space and interact with them. Getting people sucked into Eve for a few years instead of a few months? That's maximizing the misery right there.

SKINS seems like monetization (one that the players have been begging for), but this doesn't. Maybe it's because I feel like the base mechanic has existed forever. If these brain bags were coming out of the ether instead of other pilots' heads, then I'd be screaming "cash grab".

When a new idea comes out there are two things to talk about: the core principles of the idea, and the specific mechanics around that core. Personally I think the core idea is sound, though I am the first to admit that there should be some tweaks. In classic /r/Eve fashion the only data I have is rhetorical evidence based on when I played the game ten years ago, but damn if I don't feel entitled to have that listened to.

So if we as a community can agree that the core principles are OK, regardless the presentation of the idea, then we can talk about the guts that make it work.

There is more to it than that.... a character's name and reputation now becomes moot because they are just shells housing SP... a character should be an analogue to somebody a real person not just a mix of skills that can be bought and sold. It cheapens Eve.