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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
DrysonBennington
Eagle's Talon's
296
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Posted - 2016.09.02 00:20:37 -
[1021] - Quote
Slowy....Thanks Dryson....I would like to ask this question.
Your clone state will be determined by your account status. Characters on subscribed or PLEXed accounts will be granted Omega state, while Alpha state will be given to characters on any unsubscribed account.
I know what a subscribed account is but this unsubscribed account is rather perplexing. Wouldn't an unsubscribed account be someone that doesn't even interact with the environment? Basically everyone on Earth is getting an Alpha Capsule, correct? |
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
Cede Nullis
1472
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 00:24:26 -
[1022] - Quote
Toobo wrote:You know what all these Alpha toons are gonna call Omega toons?
Pay to win!
When all these Alpha toons see current players (Soon to be Omega pilots) flying and using things they can't on a free account, and stomping all over them everywhere, they will not think EVE is F2P game, they will see itnas Pay To Win game.
So ironically, EVE will become pay to win by allowing F2P lol.
Yeah its going from "pay to play" to "pay to win." CCP just need to make it clear that they really only intend the alpha to be for extended trials and for when people are mostly dormant from the game. Alpha is not intended for serious business spaceships.
But your post is prophetic.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
8669
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 00:28:12 -
[1023] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:
@ CCP - these complaints in the thread about developer responses being made on reddit seem fair. If confirmation of specifics is being made (such as Manifest's remark that the NPE will be revamped by November, or Fozzie confirming Alpha accounts can use the Gnosis) they need to be relinked into the original blog and possibly the OP here. This topic is already hard enough to follow as a single threadnaught let alone trying to keep an eye on 2 forums because devs are chosing to ignore their own forum. This really needs to stop btw, you are feeding this argument that devs are more willing to engage with potential players on reddit as opposed to their existing customers. It's a bad signal to be putting out.*
CCP staffers post more frequently on Reddit because their brand and reputation have a *lot* more overall public exposure in a venue where they cannot completely control the narrative like they do here. The last thing CCP wants (from a PR perspective) is for accusations, complaints and potential misinformation to foment and go unanswered where they have so much public exposure.
Simply put: Threadnaughts there get more attention because it could damage CCP's business reputation if they did not respond. This is not exclusive to CCP, many other companies have had to "attend" Reddit in the same fashion, lest they suffer bad PR consequences.
Gÿ+
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper: 'Hodor'.
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Winter Archipelago
Autumn Industrial Enterprises
650
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 00:32:59 -
[1024] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote:Marsha Mallow wrote:
@ CCP - these complaints in the thread about developer responses being made on reddit seem fair. If confirmation of specifics is being made (such as Manifest's remark that the NPE will be revamped by November, or Fozzie confirming Alpha accounts can use the Gnosis) they need to be relinked into the original blog and possibly the OP here. This topic is already hard enough to follow as a single threadnaught let alone trying to keep an eye on 2 forums because devs are chosing to ignore their own forum. This really needs to stop btw, you are feeding this argument that devs are more willing to engage with potential players on reddit as opposed to their existing customers. It's a bad signal to be putting out.*
CCP staffers post more frequently on Reddit because their brand and reputation have a *lot* more overall public exposure in a venue where they cannot completely control the narrative like they do here. The last thing CCP wants (from a PR perspective) is for accusations, complaints and potential misinformation to foment and go unanswered where they have so much public exposure. Simply put: Threadnaughts there get more attention because it could damage CCP's business reputation if they did not respond. This is not exclusive to CCP, many other companies have had to "attend" Reddit in the same fashion, lest they suffer bad PR consequences.
While true, they really need to learn to put the information they put there on here, as well.
For the Newbies: The 8 Golden Rules - The Magic 14 Skills - Finding the Right Corp - EVE University Wiki
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Circumstantial Evidence
356
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Posted - 2016.09.02 00:44:24 -
[1025] - Quote
Because lots of ppl read various social media, info "out there" comes back to official forums (of any game) fairly quickly.
People on the limited-time trials today can complain that the game is "pay to win," from their perspective. But they face a deadline where they must decide to pay, or move on to some other game. No more deadline.
@DrysonBennington: all "unsubscribed" (unpaid, inactive) accounts will become minimally usuable thanks to the new "alpha clone" mechanics.
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DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
56298
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Posted - 2016.09.02 00:45:39 -
[1026] - Quote
Winter Archipelago wrote:Doc Fury wrote:Marsha Mallow wrote:
@ CCP - these complaints in the thread about developer responses being made on reddit seem fair. If confirmation of specifics is being made (such as Manifest's remark that the NPE will be revamped by November, or Fozzie confirming Alpha accounts can use the Gnosis) they need to be relinked into the original blog and possibly the OP here. This topic is already hard enough to follow as a single threadnaught let alone trying to keep an eye on 2 forums because devs are chosing to ignore their own forum. This really needs to stop btw, you are feeding this argument that devs are more willing to engage with potential players on reddit as opposed to their existing customers. It's a bad signal to be putting out.*
CCP staffers post more frequently on Reddit because their brand and reputation have a *lot* more overall public exposure in a venue where they cannot completely control the narrative like they do here. The last thing CCP wants (from a PR perspective) is for accusations, complaints and potential misinformation to foment and go unanswered where they have so much public exposure. Simply put: Threadnaughts there get more attention because it could damage CCP's business reputation if they did not respond. This is not exclusive to CCP, many other companies have had to "attend" Reddit in the same fashion, lest they suffer bad PR consequences. While true, they really need to learn to put the information they put there on here, as well.
Yeah, and that info should be posted here first.
This is the Official Eve Online Forums, right ?
DMC
'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
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Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Top Belt for Fun
4425
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Posted - 2016.09.02 00:52:40 -
[1027] - Quote
Marsha Mallow wrote:Liang, when was the last time you did small gang pvp in lowsec? The preferred ship I've seen in use both by friends I fly with and others I watch soloing on stream appears to be the tristan. They win fights in these ships already with a meta fit. T2 fitting does not guarantee a win. Module tiericide has made sub t2 fitting much more viable - perhaps this was part of an internal roadmap to pave the way for this change?
Almost every night for the last 6 weeks or so? I live in the Amarr/Minnie FW zone (Amamake) with Liang, and the only alt I log into is in the Amarr FW. If you check my killboards you'll find that I spend a huge amount of time flying a T2/meta fit Executioner. The Tristan's pretty good, and I almost went with it. It's a pretty good example too. The restrictions on an alpha account will make me do 2-3x as much DPS and have 2-3x as much EHP.
That said, I've been out of game for about a week (a bit less on one of my altS). I've been taking some time to work, replay Alpha Protocol, and watch Jessica Jones.
-Liang
I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
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Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
8669
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Posted - 2016.09.02 00:53:38 -
[1028] - Quote
Winter Archipelago wrote:
While true, they really need to learn to put the information they put there on here, as well.
Ideally, yes, but CCP has never been good at marketing or the dissemination of accurate, consistent information...EVER.
Gÿ+
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper: 'Hodor'.
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Marsha Mallow
2906
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Posted - 2016.09.02 00:53:53 -
[1029] - Quote
You snipped my edit doc, reread the original post.
Funny thing as well, for all that some prefer reddit because of the branched discussions and the way upvotes re-arrange topics supposedly from good to bad, even though wading through topics like this is sometimes a chore all comments are read and all are visible. The fact that some of us prefer eve-o should be respected - it's the forum we've created, for all it's quirks.
Demonstrating a preference for one or the other at a company level might be solid practice in the gaming world but antagonising segments of the community against each other is not. I really don't understand how this can be so hard to comprehend or why it is being so consistently ignored, especially given that the complaint has been made by many of the more thoughtful and constructive posters. Stop treating us with such obvious disdain. Good will is not infinite.
Svara - haha u said flow
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oiukhp Muvila
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 01:03:50 -
[1030] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote:Winter Archipelago wrote:
While true, they really need to learn to put the information they put there on here, as well.
Ideally, yes, but CCP has never been good at marketing or the dissemination of accurate, consistent information...EVER.
CCP Developers should be posting official confirmations on CCP forums as well as any third party forums regardless.
Many players don't read Reddit and should not be forced to in order to get the current official picture of any feature regarding this game.
CCP Developers regularly bypassing Eve Online forums and using third party sites to communicate with a portion of the Eve Community is totally unprofessional IMO.
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Galaxy Duck
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
5
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Posted - 2016.09.02 01:12:55 -
[1031] - Quote
Agreed. Reddit is garbage. |
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
8671
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 01:20:35 -
[1032] - Quote
oiukhp Muvila wrote:Doc Fury wrote:Winter Archipelago wrote:
While true, they really need to learn to put the information they put there on here, as well.
Ideally, yes, but CCP has never been good at marketing or the dissemination of accurate, consistent information...EVER. CCP Developers should be posting official confirmations on CCP forums as well as any third party forums regardless. Many players don't read Reddit and should not be forced to in order to get the current official picture of any feature regarding this game. CCP Developers regularly bypassing Eve Online forums and using third party sites to communicate with a portion of the Eve Community is totally unprofessional IMO.
You are 3x correct. Doc is not white-knighting for CCP, they really just are that bad at communication and Community Management.
Looking at the bigger picture: how much longer do you think CCP will operate these forums in the same capacity as they have historically when they have repeatedly demonstrated they are primarily focused on obtaining new players, and Reddit provides a free venue to do both, including moderation and features not available here. We already know they are planning another forum "revamp", which in CCP terms could mean anything from replacement up to and including removal.
Gÿ+
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper: 'Hodor'.
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Toobo
Project Fruit House
Solyaris Chtonium
111
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Posted - 2016.09.02 01:41:56 -
[1033] - Quote
There's nothing wrong with using another website/SNS/forums to do PR work. All companies do this to reach wider audience.
But when it comes to EVE development/upcoming features/visions/work in progress/looking for community feedback on wild ideas for future, etc, etc, it HAS TO happen on EVE Forums - "You heard it here first!"
They can post 'simultaneously' on multiple platforms - ok fair enough. But using other channels BEFORE posting it on official EVE forums is just sh*t.
This may be a bit silly analogy, but how would you feel if a government minister posted on reddit,
"We are thinking about increasing tax by 200% and cutting down on social benefits to half. Your life may be affected but don't quote me on this - this is not an official press release or policy announcement anyway, it's only reddit, i.e. I can say whatever I want here and this is only reddit so it's unofficial hence I take absolutely no responsibility.
For official announcement of the new tax policy wait for the official government press release - by then we probably made our decisions based on feedbacks from this reddit thread & the policy would have been decided, so give us your feedbacks here on reddit, because people should be responsible and keep up to date with threads on Reddit right?
When the official press release is announced by the official spokes person for the government, you just lay down and take it as we give ya (because we already gave you chance to communicate with us on Reddit).
PS: BTW, as a rough idea, what you guys think about us implementing conscription policy? we thinking maybe 10 years of mandatory service in the armed forces for all boys and girls aged over 12. There are some other issues, such as legalising torture and building nuclear weapons, but we will open separate reddit thread for those
NOTE: Don't forget to follow us on Twitter too! We announce all the important life affecting national policy ideas on our Twitter account first! Also, don't bother tuning into government owned national broadcast TV channel for the news, because all the important bits will be shown on Youtube and Twitch first!"
erm... yeah.... :p
Toobo is a lucky talisman. Try Toobo's lucky referral link at the awesome iwantisk website and have a great time
http://www.iwantisk.com/?ref=1216023697
Remeber - you win by luck and lose by luck. Don't go crazy. ;)
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oiukhp Muvila
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2016.09.02 01:48:15 -
[1034] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote:
...
Looking at the bigger picture: how much longer do you think CCP will operate these forums in the same capacity as they have historically when they have repeatedly demonstrated they are primarily focused on obtaining new players, and Reddit provides a free venue to do both, including moderation and features not available here. We already know they are planning another forum "revamp", which in CCP terms could mean anything from replacement with something worse, up to and including removal.
I would be totally cool with CCP offloading most of the discussion forums to a third party site that was controlled by a entity who does not play this game or could not moderate it in a way to promote their own agenda regarding the game.
I am not sure Reddit fits that description.
But, any Blogs / New Feature discussions or official responses to questions regarding those should be done on a CCP owned and controlled site.
Though I do agree that CCP may be heading in a direction to dump everything they can in order to cut costs. They could end up dumping more than they should, but we can only hope they don't.
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Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
373
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Posted - 2016.09.02 01:56:47 -
[1035] - Quote
Dibz wrote:Blimey, so EVE finally goes free to play, based on the SWTOR model. Be interesting to see what happens.
Bikinis everywhere.
I know, they don't want it to be that kind of game. That just means it's another sacred cow to slaughter.
A signature :o
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Khan Wrenth
Ore Oppression Prevention and Salvation
672
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 01:57:34 -
[1036] - Quote
I tried using Reddit once, specifically looking for EvE news updates. And it's a complete mess. Looking at it again right now to confirm, I'd never use a forum like that, popular or not, until they updated their format. It looks like the sort of haphazard web design you might have gotten from a hastily created forum in the late 90's. Indented conversation lines? I honestly hadn't seen that since the turn of the century (except zkill. And it looks terrible and obsolete there, too).
The EvE forums here are nicely formatted, nested quotes are easy to understand and follow conversation, we have backgrounds and colors that are easy on the eyes, and we don't have a ton of high-contrast ads and sub-links on the right side of the page. These forums are, as forums should be. Reddit looks like a virus and trojan claptrap and I already feel like I should be running my AV software because those forums just look that shady.
If devs want to use Reddit, well, I honestly don't have a problem with that. Other people listed good reasons for devs to do so. But there is no excuse for updating Reddit but not updating here where their actual playerbase is asking for information. Whichever one they want to update first, whatever, so long as the other party gets it immediately thereafter as well. If the information is to be disseminated, you can't go around telling complete strangers and hoping that some of them will eventually tell the playerbase. That's like calling your mother to ask how she's doing, but instead of telling you, she tells some random neighbor and hopes said neighbor will call you back to let you know.
Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
1975
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 02:10:05 -
[1037] - Quote
One thing I'll note regarding Reddit in particular is that there seems to be more information specifically sought from other sources and shared there. And this in done mostly by non-CCP posters. Tweets, info gathered from presentations (eve vegas/fanfest/etc) seems to be captured, broken down and disseminated far father there than here if it hits here at all (and ironically when it does it's often a complaint about CCP posting it on reddit when it's actually a player who managed a screen grab).
This is of course an anecdotal observation, but given the idea that one needs to be in some way invested to post here, sometime the ones over there act as if things are the reverse.
Also they automate capture of dev blogs so the official forums doesn't even have that advantage. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
56300
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 02:43:37 -
[1038] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote: We already know they are planning another forum "revamp", which in CCP terms could mean anything from replacement with something worse, up to and including removal.
Judging from CCP's recent track record, I'd bet these forums will be removed. Just like the Jukebox, Ingame Browser, Evelopedia, Aura NPE and other various aspects of this game.
I hate to say this but it looks like the Die is cast.
DMC
'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
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Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
1110
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 02:53:47 -
[1039] - Quote
Wait wat pay to win. Nah joking sounds good I was already thinking to stop paying eve but this well sounds good. lets hoop it is. |
Circumstantial Evidence
356
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Posted - 2016.09.02 02:59:00 -
[1040] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Doc Fury wrote: We already know they are planning another forum "revamp", which in CCP terms could mean anything from replacement with something worse, up to and including removal. Judging from CCP's recent track record, I'd bet these forums will be removed. .... CCP Falcon has solicited feedback on a forums revamp or replacement in this thread.
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Max Groote
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2016.09.02 04:07:40 -
[1041] - Quote
This is a great change IMO: it actually drove me to resubscribe and start training my skills up so that I'm ready when November hits.
Some specific feedback:
Character sheet: I know this is a WIP, but the sideways text is really hard to read and the grid arrangement doesn't make any sense (also, a significant increase in real-estate required). Overall this seems like a significant step back in UX, but hopefully the final design ends up looking a lot like the current character sheet, which is both nice to look at *and* highly functional. Everything should be listed vertically for compactness and to avoid a character sheet that bloats sideways to gigantic proportions as new skills/skill categories are added.
Multiple Alpha Clones: There absolutely needs to be a restriction of 1 Alpha clone per computer, just like how you can only run one trial per computer right now. If this is not done, there will be hordes of free alts run by existing vets, which I don't think is the intended consequence of this change. In addition, just like the existing trial restrictions, 1 Alpha clone should only be allowed to fly when there are no subbed accounts active (otherwise every existing vet will end up with a scout for free, which would take away from the incentive to sub another account to gain that powerful capability)
Gas Huffing: I can see why you chose to not allow Alpha clones to harvest gas (free gas farming by vets), but with the changes above new players will be able to experience the excitement of gas mining in a wormhole (because it honestly is exciting, active gameplay if you don't want to die) without causing hordes of multi-boxed Ventures to ravage wormholes. One Alpha clone active per computer won't negatively impact new players looking for some excitement, but it will prevent Alpha clone abuse.
High-Sec Mechanics: I imagine that even with the above changes, high-sec podding will increase if Alpha clones are allowed to do so (why not? It's a free account anyway). In my opinion, alpha clones should not be allowed to switch into "red safeties" in high-sec, but this is something that I would be willing to see tested live instead of changed right now.
Thanks for reading, and great work on these initial changes! |
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
359
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 04:14:25 -
[1042] - Quote
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
ACs on mini ships without barrage are not that bad, scorch is life for pulses tho.
The reason why T2 guns (and to smaller extent tanking modules) are "pay to win" is not because T1 could never win but because if two ships of equal skill meet in space the one with T2 guns is at such an advantage that the dude with T1 guns would be unlikely to win. That this never or ultra rarely happens is irrelevant as the perception in this matter is what is important. If the free-to-play dude figures out that he is at significant disadvantage against paying customer and no amount of "git guud" will make him win a fight against roughly equal skill paying customer he is exceptionally unlikely to stick around long enough to invest sufficient time into the game to spend money on it. On top of EVE getting "pay to win" sticker all over the net discouraging any potential new dudes joining.
It will not be only classical EVE problem but in turn also give worse image to any other projects CCP is up to which are also free-to-play, like, dor example, Valkyrie or (potentially) upcoming Dust 514 successor. Even if in these games the free-to-play model would be well balanced and not a clear pay-to-win.
Some amount of pay-to-win argument can not be avoided as there must be restrictions on free accounts obviously. But if the Alpha dude can fly at least something as good as Omega can one can argue against this notation by pointing out how the playing field is fair in the intended niche of Alphas. Frigates are ideal in that regard as there is sufficient amount of frigate reserved content in EVE to give the Alpha good experience. Frigate wormholes, FW, L4 burners, smallest anomalies and some fleet roles are first things that come from top of my head. Even with properly competitive access to skills and equipment at frigate level the Alphas would be at disadvantage in some scenarios, like, for example, in frigate wormholes because of no access to a cloak even if they would be able to fly, for example, sisters frigate.
Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK!
GOT the bastard.
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Zozoll Neblyn
Ziggurat Forge
26
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Posted - 2016.09.02 04:50:14 -
[1043] - Quote
Roenok Baalnorn wrote:Zozoll Neblyn wrote:
You can train frigate skills, sure. But you can only train a few skills to level 5. So a frigate flying alpha is always less powerful than a well trained omega on the same ship.
Try 20 people with assault rifles against a thousand with bows and arrows... tell me how that works out for ya.
In Eve online?
Are we talking one or a few players spamming alts? Can we assume they won't break Eula by attempting to automate anything?
If you're towing a fleet of multibox Vexors behind you, then all it takes is one guy in an Oracle with long range lasers parked outside their drone range to make that get messy.
If it's a mining fleet, that will be exceptionally fun to blow up.
You don't try to wipe out the whole fleet, just kill a few, and then get out before they can coordinate. |
Lathael
Liga der aussergewoehnlichen Tattergreise
Evictus.
35
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Posted - 2016.09.02 05:19:36 -
[1044] - Quote
Hi,
here my feedback:
I assume that multiple character training will decline because you can have a free training queue on a fresh account for free.
That may not be the case if those alpha clones do not get skill points (or not many) for mining, PI, trading.
=> Maybe less income from multiple training for CCP.
People like me that like to gain fast skill points on their main character can do this with this change and enjoy PVP with an alternative character. We can enjoy battles without risking expensive attribute implants.
=> More activity in PVP from players that do not want to invest money in multiple training and have expensive implants or like high skill point gain.
I know many people that would like to join eve here and there, but are not willing to pay for a month. You get brand new games for that money out there. I see here a very big plus. And PLEX farming and be exhausting and need some time that some people are not willed to invest in a game.
=> Casual gamers will join us from time to time. More activity from that faction.
=> Same for beginners.
In my opinion this step is brave and good move of CCP and they get an epic clap from my side! |
Crack Spawn
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2016.09.02 05:36:44 -
[1045] - Quote
Lathael wrote:Hi,
get an epic clap from my side!
Does one need to buy you dinner to get clap ? 
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May'n Nome
Elements Arpeggio Vesperia
31
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Posted - 2016.09.02 06:03:20 -
[1046] - Quote
CCP, here is some more feedback I just thought of tonight. The Wardec system either needs a complete overhaul or dumped entirely as well for the November Release or Alpha Clones.
I remember very well how hard it could be to do stuff in Hisec with pilots from PIRAT and CD sometimes coming around looking for kills or gatecamping common movement routes. The way the system is now allows these entities to pretty much get away with ganking without the risk of CONCORD. Most of them sit on Trade Hubs anyways and rarely venture beyond these areas.
I doubt this was the intent of the Wardec system to allow a perma-wardec on various corps and alliances just because someone wants to circumvent CONCORD to shoot targets that can not shoot back and otherwise can not defend themselves. Risk is part of the game but the Hi-sec Wardeccers should have a fair share in that risk themselves. Right now, they really do not as they are very risk averse and do not like losing their ships.
Now moving on to the reason why this connects to the launch of the Clone States Feature....
Now imagine all these new Alpha Clones getting in, joining various corps...and then comes the Wardecs. Now they can't move around Hisec without someone getting to blow them up and they are powerless against the bling ships + fits some of these groups fly to do what they do.
I do not think the above will go over well with the new players as they join up and fan out into New Eden, expecting Hi-Sec to be a safe haven and finding that people can pay ISK to circumvent CONCORD.
Now what can be done to fix this?
Well if scrapping the system is out...why not make waging more than 5 or 10 Wardecs cost standings and security across the board not just for every Wardec after the initial 5 or 10 but also tie it to length of time the War goes on. Every week after that first initial week should cost standings...maybe in the -0.1 to -0.5 Range.
We can also make the costs of waging a Wardec past the first week increase in cost for each week after. So 500k per person one week potentially becomes 1 million ISK per person next week and the third week it shoots up to 2 million before week four sees it at 4 million per person...and so on but hopefully you get the idea. Sooner or later, they run out of cash flow to sustain their wars as it just becomes too expensive to do what they do.
To prevent them from just being able to have just enough to meet the upper limit...set no upper limit. They sooner or later lose money or have to stop and wait to recover their funding to do so. I doubt they get enough ISK to cover the 70-120 Wardecs the wage. Even that is hitting into stupendous amounts of money that at a certain point they can not sustain.
So basically if you can't get them to risk their ships...make them risk their security status and wallets instead.
"Threefold is the time's pace: the future comes not in haste, the present is gone arrow fast, eternally still remains the past."
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
17952
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Posted - 2016.09.02 07:07:43 -
[1047] - Quote
Toobo wrote:You know what all these Alpha toons are gonna call Omega toons?
Pay to win!
When all these Alpha toons see current players (Soon to be Omega pilots) flying and using things they can't on a free account, and stomping all over them everywhere, they will not think EVE is F2P game, they will see itnas Pay To Win game.
So ironically, EVE will become pay to win by allowing F2P lol.
People have been calling multiple accounts "pay to win" since I started EVE in 2006.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
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Raphendyr Nardieu
Unpublished Chapter
Suddenly Content
83
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Posted - 2016.09.02 07:11:47 -
[1048] - Quote
Some feedback on industry side from talking about it with my friend who does way more industry than me.
We noticed that Alpha state clones can manufacture pretty much any T1 item. Including many capital modules or rigs (unless I missed something). Well at least they can construct battleships. If one wouldn't like them to be able to do that, I think limiting Alpha Industry to 3 and requiring industry 4 for BC and BS sized ships and modules and Industry 5 for capital stuff. Bad thing with this aproach is that it limits what Alpha could build.
Also we thougt that running 4 industry jobs might be too interesting for Omega players to create multiple Alpha alts so they get more industry lines for high volume T1 production (e.g. with those battleships or capital rigs..).. Presuming Alphas could learn only Mass Production 1 would limit the number of lines to 2 and thus would be too much overhead for Omega to use those (instead of Omega alts). Bad things with this is that generic Alpha player would probably feel really limited by the Mass Production skill.
Third idea is that we could reintroduce skill to effect material efficiency and limit that skill on Alpha characters. Thus removing change from Alphas to be as effecient as Omegas. Thus any Omega industrialist with max efficiency would probably use Omega alts.
None of above ideas are really nice and all have annoying side effects, but as it stands now Alphas industry skills might be too good to be leveraged by Omega pilots as extended industry lines. Our concerns of course might be non valid, but I still though I should log them down for CCP to read.
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Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
363
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Posted - 2016.09.02 07:18:54 -
[1049] - Quote
May'n Nome wrote:
I doubt this was the intent of the Wardec system to allow a perma-wardec on various corps and alliances just because someone wants to circumvent CONCORD to shoot targets that can not shoot back and otherwise can not defend themselves. Risk is part of the game but the Hi-sec Wardeccers should have a fair share in that risk themselves. Right now, they really do not as they are very risk averse and do not like losing their ships.
While I do agree that wardec system is in need of the overhaul somehow I do not believe having Alphas around could be used as justification for that.
As it stands currently the usual trade-hub campers target predominantly sufficiently large null sec alliances. But they only get noobs or clueless that way because anyone with couple of braincells to rub togehter has NPC cor hauler alt in one of the spare slots in these entities or uses the in-alliance logistics backbone for their couriers. So it is pretty much at best mild inconvionience for null sec entities that all of them are more or less with permanent wardec from some entity or another.
Wardecs can be a lot more frustrating for hi-sec industrial entities probably but putting on their big boy pants and going to null solves that part as well. Null sec is actually safer for the average miner than hi-sec or god forbid, low sec. It's just that logistics is harder, it's not a solo things etc etc. But that is not any different to Alphas than it is to Omegas.
Similarly as Alphas will be free and have Industrial 1 they can be used for hauling stuff around (for the joy of all suicide gankers ofc).
I'll add that as Alphas cant use T2 ships nor Links they are no additional threat as far as the empire wardeccing scene goes.
Anyone can shoot back btw and defend themselves. Problem with empire tradehub campers, however, is the neutral logistics, offgrid neutral links, neutral eyes, etc etc etc. So the effort to get one of them in their shiny ship and shiny clone is a bit too much to bother with. They do bail the second they get the feeling that things might not go in their favor - they are not in it for fair fights.
Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK!
GOT the bastard.
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Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
363
|
Posted - 2016.09.02 07:20:07 -
[1050] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:
People have been calling multiple accounts "pay to win" since I started EVE in 2006.
EVE is just an MMO with 30 eur/month fee if one wants to get the full EVE experience (which starts at 2 accounts).
Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK!
GOT the bastard.
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