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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Ethelda
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Posted - 2007.05.05 00:52:00 -
[151]
hehe, sales must be down this quarter :P
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Marquis Dean
Energy.
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Posted - 2007.05.05 00:53:00 -
[152]
Another thing just occured to me.
How are CCP going to set the prices?
Set them too high, people won't be able to afford the GTCs and they'll stop playing.
Set them too low, and lots more people will buy GTCs and CCP will lose out in revenue.
Or have I missed something?
---
 Originally by: Tista
i dont like you much but i'm going to agree with you on that.
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Briana Flametop
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Posted - 2007.05.05 00:53:00 -
[153]
Originally by: Ionia
Read the TOPIC people, you are so far off track.
Wtf is wrong with people that they miss the topic completely, start taking about other things, even t2 bpos. Get real, get on topic.
T2 BPO = significant ISK generator = playing EVE for free forever, probably for multiple characters. Not that difficult a concept, really. |
Craam Hustler
Gallente
ReTech
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Posted - 2007.05.05 00:55:00 -
[154]
I can see why the mods didnt bother stickying this thread.
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 00:55:00 -
[155]
I like this move to purchase gametime directly from CCP for ISK. It's awesome, they're literally going to make everyone else pay for the multiple accounts of powergamers.
I SEE NO WAY THIS CAN BE A BAD IDEA.
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Jordan Musgrat
Convergent
Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.05.05 00:59:00 -
[156]
Dear CCP kieron.
Could you reply to this thread with a *clarification*? This is all I ask.
 Don't cut out third party GTC sellers.
Change the process if you want, but don't make it more difficult for people to buy and sell GTCs.
Next time, make clearer anouncements.
-----------
Primary is family values, secondary is 0.0... |
Elendor Xanadaph
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:00:00 -
[157]
Both my corpmates and I have only paid to play eve for one month, for the last year we have worked hard to generate enough ISK to play the game through GTC's. Without them all 4 of us would not play. We just dont have the money or want to spend that much money to play EVE.
If theres a CCP implemented way to buy gametime with ingame ISK im all for that, and will continue to play. If not there gos 4 accounts, along with all the hard work over the past year.
It wouldnt make sense for CCP to lose money like this, im sure theres tons of people that would switch to a different game because of this, one that you only have to pay once for.
CCP eliminating GTC's completely and adding a new ISK for Gametime process would be a win win, keep your subscribers and get rid of any connection between ISK/GTC's and real money.
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Dangerously Cheesey
Anqara Expeditions
The OSS
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:03:00 -
[158]
Uhhh so how does CCP make money? Instead of it going real life money -> GTC -> isk, its just going to go isk -> GTC? I feel the need to point out that all that will really change is that CCP wont get its 14.95 a month from thousands of accounts...
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:03:00 -
[159]
Since apparently my meaning was lost this is the point: ISK for gametime is retardedly cyclical. CCP would make NO MONEY off giving people gametime for ISK.
This would mean that anyone financing their gametime with ISK is actually being financed by anyone who's still dumb enough to actually be paying the monthly subscription for this game. This means a vast number of 0.0 alt accounts for going to be effectively being paid for by those in Empire.
If ISK for Gametime via CCP becomes a reality, my recommendation is you cancel paying money immediately and do it that way - because you will only end up paying for some other guy to be able to play thanks to your money.
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CmdrThor
FinFleet
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:05:00 -
[160]
Originally by: Craam Hustler
I am not really against players spending $$$ for ISK, ever since GTCS were allowed.
What I am really against is players converting ISK, to GTC, to $$$ on eBay.
The main thing I like about this, is the fact that they will be killing ISK -> GTC -> eBay
I absolutely agree with you.
Originally by: Marquis Dean
Originally by: CmdrThor
lots of reasonable stuff
...but you missed the point somewhat.
People aren't complaining that players can buy GTCs for isk they earn in game. That's fine.
Fair enough, maybe I misunderstood a comment here and there, or maybe there are just a few bad apples that like to badmouth everyone.
In any case, the "Player 1" part of my post is still valid - the "ships for $" supporters HAVE been getting a lot of heat about their opinion. Speaking of that and of the second part of your post, see below.
Originally by: Crumplecorn
I feel bad about it because it seems even more grossly unfair you can get around it and I can't just because you have more RL money than me.
You are missing one thing though - the guy with more RL money than you and me has spent RL time to earn them. Using the usual $-to-ISK conversion rates, you can say that if he earns 15$ per hour IRL and then buys ISK with that $15, then he basically earns 150-200m ISK per hour. While this is most certainly nothing to laugh at, there are many people who can earn such amount by using only in-game resources and their own RL time to play.
So in the end, the rich-in-RL guy has still spent some RL time for his battleships/HACs/Dreads, he just spent that time out of game, as opposed to in-game (And maybe even doing a more boring thing at that. Or maybe not - who knows.). Maybe he earns technically more ISK/hour than some players that way, but then there are others, who earn more than him too - a circle that is seen everywhere in the day to day EVE-life.
So in the end I still don't understand why the hate towards those rich-in-RL guys.
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:07:00 -
[161]
Originally by: CmdrThor
So in the end I still don't understand why the hate towards those rich-in-RL guys.
Because this is freakin' internet spaceships. We don't come here to have the usual social order preserved.
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Craam Hustler
Gallente
ReTech
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:09:00 -
[162]
Edited by: Craam Hustler on 05/05/2007 01:06:54
Originally by: CmdrThor
I absolutely agree with you.
And in case it can't get any clearer to why I think ISK to GTC to eBay needs to be stopped, heres some history for everybody: The cost of ISK Selling in EVE
If players were allowed to convert their ISK into REAL MONEY, it would encourage more of this:
Quote:
4. Evil conglomerates are formed and prices go up!
As you probably realize by now, ISK sellers go to great lengths to get their hands on ISK. Recently we busted a blueprint conglomerate that was set up just to skim ISK off the top. That extra ISK was then sold for real life currency. The players involved bought a large number of expensive blueprints over a long period of time with the purpose of monopolizing the market on certain items. They attempted to drive prices as high as possible so that they could skim more money off the top and sell more ISK on eBay. This went on for some time and I am sure that a large number of the playerbase unknowingly felt the effect of this when buying ships and modules.
This conglomerate was found out and brought down by your friendly GMs and all those involved given a lifelong vacation from EVE. Their precious pile of blueprints will be reseeded to lucky players through the blueprint lottery. This is a perfect example of how those willing to buy ISK for real money can directly cause inflation and can end up costing the rest of the playerbase a lot of ISK.
I don't want an EVE-CHINA server, thanks.
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Hank Cousteau
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:11:00 -
[163]
Originally by: Marquis Dean
Another thing just occured to me.
How are CCP going to set the prices?
Or have I missed something?
One supplier = one price. It may be at a commodity price, but yes... they are removing the market.
Is there a time line for this? Please do give a little heads up before you cut your financial throat here fellas.
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Marquis Dean
Energy.
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:11:00 -
[164]
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: CmdrThor
So in the end I still don't understand why the hate towards those rich-in-RL guys.
Because this is freakin' internet spaceships. We don't come here to have the usual social order preserved.
Rich-in-RL guys create 6 accounts, puts Hulk in 5 of them and makes billions a day. Not a GTC in sight and he's still got a huge advantage because of his rl finances.
---
Originally by: Tista
i dont like you much but i'm going to agree with you on that.
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Team Chk
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:15:00 -
[165]
A clearly written blog about this wouldn't have gone astray, instead of half-answers causing confusion 
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Scarlet Azmodea
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:19:00 -
[166]
Personally I think its impossible to stop people from selling virtual currency. Even if CCP sold ISK the 3rd party companies would just sell for less creating a massive loss to the community as a whole. The only way you will see decreases in sales is if you made it harder to produce ISK in which case everyone in game would cry non stop.
I don't really know why people seem to think its such a huge advantage to have bought ISK. You all still need to go through the same time frames in training to use stuff. Sure it allows people to have "disposable ships" to some extent but does that really hurt anyone? Buying yer ship with ISK gained from money doesn't make you pvp better? It does however stimulate the economy for every builder selling their items.
You people also seem to blame ISK sales on "rich kids" yet have you thought of the fact that some people make good money in RL and don't feel like sacrificing their family/job to farm ISK from a roid field or mission site 16 hours a day, yet would like to enjoy the game also. Tell me this:
If you make money grinding a roid, rat belt, pirating, mission running, building, and buy a carrier from a corporation versus making it yourself is that any different then: you sitting in your management office grinding out your hotels advertisement strategies, researching your market segments,working on insurance claims,training your employees,serving your customers etc. Can you honestly say its different?
You really can't because you have aquired an item purchased with "currency" doesn't really matter if said currency is ISK or canadian dollars; someone throughout each process had to work for that "currency" no matter the color. It is not a persons fault for growing a career so they have extra cash to toss into a game. Maybe you should spend less time ice mining and work harder IRL.
Scarlet
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:19:00 -
[167]
Originally by: Marquis Dean
Originally by: James Duar
Originally by: CmdrThor
So in the end I still don't understand why the hate towards those rich-in-RL guys.
Because this is freakin' internet spaceships. We don't come here to have the usual social order preserved.
Rich-in-RL guys create 6 accounts, puts Hulk in 5 of them and makes billions a day. Not a GTC in sight and he's still got a huge advantage because of his rl finances.
Well then they can sit at their computer for the hours it takes to run those Hulks, the time it takes to train up those accounts and the chance that someone might just suicide bomb them in high sec for the comedy of it.
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Life reaper
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:20:00 -
[168]
Originally by: Team Chk
A clearly written blog about this wouldn't have gone astray, instead of half-answers causing confusion
Seriously, kieron, the past few news items you've done about massive changes to the game have all been mediocre at best. C'mon man, get your facts straight and THEN inform your users. It's your damn job man.
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Carsidava
Ars ex Discordia
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:23:00 -
[169]
Originally by: Team Chk
A clearly written blog about this wouldn't have gone astray, instead of half-answers causing confusion
The shocking thing is that Kieron's supposed to be the community liason and therefore the best person at CCP to be reporting these sorts of things to the rest of us.
Kieron's the best they have. |
Marquis Dean
Energy.
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:25:00 -
[170]
Originally by: Scarlet Azmodea
Personally I think its impossible to stop people from selling virtual currency. Even if CCP sold ISK the 3rd party companies would just sell for less creating a massive loss to the community as a whole. The only way you will see decreases in sales is if you made it harder to produce ISK in which case everyone in game would cry non stop.
I don't really know why people seem to think its such a huge advantage to have bought ISK. You all still need to go through the same time frames in training to use stuff. Sure it allows people to have "disposable ships" to some extent but does that really hurt anyone? Buying yer ship with ISK gained from money doesn't make you pvp better? It does however stimulate the economy for every builder selling their items.
You people also seem to blame ISK sales on "rich kids" yet have you thought of the fact that some people make good money in RL and don't feel like sacrificing their family/job to farm ISK from a roid field or mission site 16 hours a day, yet would like to enjoy the game also. Tell me this:
If you make money grinding a roid, rat belt, pirating, mission running, building, and buy a carrier from a corporation versus making it yourself is that any different then: you sitting in your management office grinding out your hotels advertisement strategies, researching your market segments,working on insurance claims,training your employees,serving your customers etc. Can you honestly say its different?
You really can't because you have aquired an item purchased with "currency" doesn't really matter if said currency is ISK or canadian dollars; someone throughout each process had to work for that "currency" no matter the color. It is not a persons fault for growing a career so they have extra cash to toss into a game. Maybe you should spend less time ice mining and work harder IRL.
Scarlet
Absolutely freakin' perfect. I 100% agree with every word.
---
Originally by: Tista
i dont like you much but i'm going to agree with you on that.
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 01:49:00 -
[171]
Oh snap I just looked at what I was sayng. My response to this is changed to: Dear CCP, Have better ideas and fix things which are actually broken.
Also, make Kieron actually communicate information rather then just randomly sort mangled sentences.
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Octin
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:03:00 -
[172]
This is an incredibly stupid idea, so thank you CCP for addressing this when there are tons of other issues that are far more pressing that could be addressed instead.
I think Hippoking on the SHC boards said it the best:
"Interesting. I can't say I'm sad to see a stop to buying ISK, but I'll be sad to see my accounts go."
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Big Al
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:10:00 -
[173]
Why exactly does this thread merit being in General Discussion over say, a certain thread admitting certain transgressions by CCP employees that was relegated to the Information forum that no one reads (yet still got 100k hits)
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pyschosis
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:17:00 -
[174]
Buying 'Game Time" with isk is a good thing for the player base. It allows those with more RL time than money to continue to play, while removing some of the 'surplus' isk. The isk they use for GT cannot be used to buy ships/mods/implants so they are at disadvantage vs 'paid subscriptions' as they have an "Eve Rent" bill to pay every month, and while it seems it would hurt CCP financially some, it is the correct route to go to support long term play.
Allowing the buying Isk with Real currency (by any means) is stupid and shortsighted.. the Example of Monopoly applies, but it also breaks the entire point of a MMORG to begin with.. "YOU" (behind the keyboard) are not "YOUR CHARACTER". What YOU can do has no effect on the game.. (ie you don't have to fight against 'me'(RL pilot) and my 10,000 hours of flight time in RL.. why should I have to 'fight' against your RL wallet?)
those that are whining about not being competitive anymore (primarily PvPers with no industrial Incomes) Now have to suck it up, and bring a 'soft target' on the field to make the isk to support their PvP. They've had no problems killing the miners and ratters up until now who WERE earning an "Eve living" all the while you were using your RL living to kill them.
Welcome to a leveled playing field.
Go ahead, Quit. The game wont miss you.
You want something in Eve.. You earn it IN EVE.
Cheers CCP!
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James Duar
Merch Industrial
We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:25:00 -
[175]
Edited by: James Duar on 05/05/2007 02:21:37
Originally by: pyschosis
Buying 'Game Time" with isk is a good thing for the player base. It allows those with more RL time than money to continue to play, while removing some of the 'surplus' isk. The isk they use for GT cannot be used to buy ships/mods/implants so they are at disadvantage vs 'paid subscriptions' as they have an "Eve Rent" bill to pay every month, and while it seems it would hurt CCP financially some, it is the correct route to go to support long term play.
No it isn't you idiot. It means the paying playerbase is paying for the hardcore "12 hours a day, computer in my bathroom" playerbase. It's god damn social support structures in internet spaceships. ISK doesn't buy servers, money does - money comes from paying customers. Gametime for ISK from CCP means that paying customers are being made to pay for others.
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Aslord
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:31:00 -
[176]
ccp just want to cut out the middlemen in real life, buying directly from ccp mean more real profit goes to the company instead of the timecard dealer web site
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Carsidava
Ars ex Discordia
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:38:00 -
[177]
Originally by: Aslord
ccp just want to cut out the middlemen in real life, buying directly from ccp mean more real profit goes to the company instead of the timecard dealer web site
Previously:
CCP sells GTC to reseller for cash (CCP gets cash from reseller). Reseller sells GTC to player one (reseller gets cash from player one). Player one sells GTC to player two for ISK.
Now:
CCP sells GTC to player two for ISK (CCP gets cash from nobody).
Tell me how exactly CCP gets more money out of this? |
Petrothian Tong
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:43:00 -
[178]
Edited by: Petrothian Tong on 05/05/2007 02:40:14
As much as I love the idea of playing for free.
I cannot support this,
currently, CCP Gets the cash for GTC, which is great, since CCP gets $$$
$$$ keeps Devs/GMs/Staff Paid....
Paid staff = working staff
Working Staff = Eve is maintained and developed.
if it goes into the system proposed.
it would hurt CCP income ALOT. as I can say that most people who had over 5 mill SP would be able to afford paying for the game with isk. (at current isk for GTC rates..)
and CCP wont get any income due to it.
Please.. CCP , Take my money... TAKE THE MONEY!!!! you cant Live on ISK!!!!
as a pharse I used ALOT on the forum...
DO NOT CHOP OFF YOUR ARM FOR A WOODEN SPLINTER IN YOUR FINGER!!!!
(yes those guys are a problem, but doing this will hurt Eve more than those guys..)
I repeat.. CCP: TAKE OUR MONEY!!!! not ISK!!!
-Siggi-
""PvP" isn't only direct person to person combat, it can be very indirect. Selling an item on the market which somebody buys from you is resulting in another guy not getting a sale." Oveur |
Ce Domina
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:43:00 -
[179]
This seems like a neat idea. Depending on the implementation (some details please, CCP) it could mean a sharp drop in the number of active accounts/players. This will help to curtail lag by reducing the strain on Tranquility, and help EVE return to its roots as a niche MMO.
An added bonus is that if CCP is selling game-time for ISK directly, their revenue will drop. I'm sure that benefits everyone who plays this game somehow.
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pyschosis
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Posted - 2007.05.05 02:44:00 -
[180]
Edited by: pyschosis on 05/05/2007 02:42:38
Edited by: pyschosis on 05/05/2007 02:42:10
Originally by: James Duar
Edited by: James Duar on 05/05/2007 02:21:37
Originally by: pyschosis
Buying 'Game Time" with isk is a good thing for the player base. It allows those with more RL time than money to continue to play, while removing some of the 'surplus' isk. The isk they use for GT cannot be used to buy ships/mods/implants so they are at disadvantage vs 'paid subscriptions' as they have an "Eve Rent" bill to pay every month, and while it seems it would hurt CCP financially some, it is the correct route to go to support long term play.
It means the paying playerbase is paying for the hardcore "12 hours a day, computer in my bathroom" playerbase. It's god damn social support structures in internet spaceships. ISK doesn't buy servers, money does - money comes from paying customers. Gametime for ISK from CCP means that paying customers are being made to pay for others.
CCP determines their profit margins not you. If you think they are going to create a system that means more of their income is isk than real currency you are simple ignorant. As long as the price is right those 'hard cores' will spend just as much time IN GAME earning money TO PLAY THE GAME as those who are actually working to pay for their subscription. (1 hour of my labor in RL can pay for 4 accounts for a month. How many hours will you grind for your monthly fee in isk? more than 1 I'm sure) the difference is that the 'paid' players can skip out on Eve for a month (or a year) and not lose anything, can come back right where they were whenever they want with no "Eve job" to do to play. If the 'play to play' types stop playing (stop grinding) they lose their entire account access.
the number of people who actually desire "yet another rent bill to occupy their gaming time" will be SIGNIFICANTLY lower than the number of people who can simply plop down 150.00 and be golden for a year.
once the majority of the 'play to play' crowd passes adolescence they wont have the leisure to keep grinding for their play time and will either quit (unlikely if they've invested that much time already) or realize the subscription fee is nothing for anyone with a 'real job'
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