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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 62 post(s) |
JOATMOS Incorporated
Serenity Rising LLC Vanguard.
0
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Posted - 2012.06.07 22:04:00 -
[421] - Quote
CCP Goliath wrote:Par'Gellen wrote:CCP Goliath wrote:Par'Gellen wrote:CCP Goliath wrote:To open a container via overview you double click it under the old system. Now that opens it in the tree view. If you want it open in a separate window, shift double click it. Swap that around and some of us would be happy. Why does this abominiation of a UI try to take control of everything I do unless I hold up the holy cross (shift key)? The default behaviour is now to use the tree view. For people that are not a fan of this, shift click is implemented to enable them to use separate windows. If you like I will ask the team if mapping these as shortcuts that individual users can customise is an option? (Note, even if this is possible, it will not change the default behaviour) And you just pointed out the biggest problem with the whole mess. Thank you. Which I assume you mean to be that you do not want to use the tree view at all on basic principle? The team are doing everything they can to make this of minimal impact to you, but the tree view itself is not going anywhere so I hope that you can come to terms with it in some way.
CCP Goliath, atm the best terms are simply to unsubscribe given CCPs attitude. (2 accounts lapsed, 1 dying out now).
Also you folks at CCP SERIOUSLY need to read up on HCI design principles. (I have seen several people list a few books for you here already in the forums.) Many UI design books that are based on HCI will hand a sizable section (if not a whole chapter) explaining in very plain words about why tree structure is BAD when trying to make things understandable to the general population. It works for IT people, but not the rest of humanity in general.
This account dies in about a week, I will check in via trial accounts to see if you fixed stuff around Aug/Sept. But you aren't getting a dime until this is properly fixed. FIXED, not crappy work arounds. |
Smoking Blunts
ZC Industries Dark Stripes
318
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Posted - 2012.06.07 22:12:00 -
[422] - Quote
Bantara wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:its a shame though, industry was something taht i enjoyed doing as the background part of my game. i just can not face trying to shift click my way though 100's of hanger divisions So when you say this, are you talking about all of your characters, or 1 character? I didn't put it on the previous post, but I'm not a person involved with POS's, so I'm just trying to get an understanding of what y'all are complaining about, cause I think the tree's great. I hated mutlple inventory windows open, for the very same reason others are saying--too much screen real estate. Now it's all in one place. I'm never looking in two different places at once, just one. I know what I want to go where--go there, drag it over. Easy, simple, and done.
im pissed about all of them really, the ones this thing mostly screws is the ones that have to deal with many corp hangers at once. so 3 accounts 9 toons
but, have you tried bouncing caps about recently, the ******* ui thing refreshes every 10 sec's and its anoying as hell. and recenters itself with every jump, all i want is 2 windows stacked, one hanger and one fuel bay open, how bloody hard is that to achive? OMG when can i get a pic here
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Par'Gellen
170
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Posted - 2012.06.07 22:42:00 -
[423] - Quote
CCP Goliath, would you consider 20 minutes a long time to watch this happen? Or is this an inherent part of the new UI that I just need to STFU about?
http://www.neoncranium.com/SpinningCircles.jpg CCP, I understand that "To err is human", but it shouldn't be the company motto... |
Acks
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
15
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Posted - 2012.06.07 23:08:00 -
[424] - Quote
CCP Goliath wrote:Which I assume you mean to be that you do not want to use the tree view at all on basic principle? The team are doing everything they can to make this of minimal impact to you, but the tree view itself is not going anywhere so I hope that you can come to terms with it in some way.
OK ... Here is where the disconnect is occuring and the point you especially Goliath at least APPEAR to be missing:
CCP and particularly you Goliath are of the opinion that the new tree view is much better. As such you feel it is important to defend it and try and compromise enough to keep it and try and make us happy.
The EVE player base OMFG HATE THIS UI more than pretty much anything I can recall in my 8+ years playing this game. As a result we are raging about this.
Are there SOME players who are ok with the new UI? Yes. Are they the majority? Not even close.
What this boils down to is that you have made a design decision that makes sense to you and only you (you = CCP). You are attached to this new design without giving any information at all as to why you are so unreasonably attached to it. If there are 50 features in the pipe that require this new inventory UI to work then tell us that. But when you get a massive pile of feedback from the test server and weeks of feedback and in some cases just blind rage and you offer no justification for A) why this NEEDED to be done and B) Why it can't be the way the majority of us want it you are only going to continue to lose hearts and minds.
Now I believe that it was not your intent to make your quoted statement above sound like this but to us, the players this is what we hear when we read this:
"We did this thing because one of us thought it was a good idea. We got attached to the idea and ran with it and we are not looking back damn the consequences. You can yell and scream and kick all you want and while we will tweak a few things for you to make it suck slightly less, we are not going to actually listen to you or give you what you want. Here is some lube, grab your ankles and learn to like it because this is going to happen and there is nothing you can do to stop it."
I am not trying to attack you or anyone else I am trying to point out what I see as a significant disconnect between CCP and it's paying customers. This UI would be AWESOME for the player INVENTORY screen allowing us to see all our junk everywhere in game including containers, ship holds, etc. It is IDEAL for that purpose. It is not however ideal, useful, etc for day to day operations. I have read all of the threadnaughts, I have posted "constructive" feedback, I have read all of the dev blogs and dev responses.
I believe you want to deliver awesomeness. I believe you THINK you are delivering awesomeness. The issue is you do not appear to be willing to accept that we do not agree with your definition of awesomeness.
CCP has built a great game that truly has no equal. We the players would not get so enraged if we were not so emotionally invested in this game that for many of us is an integral part of our lives. Please take a step back and realize that we are not just internet rage trolling and that as a whole, we really do know what we are talking about on this subject. |
Maul555
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
217
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Posted - 2012.06.07 23:28:00 -
[425] - Quote
Maul555 wrote:Opening orca bays before inferno:
*right click orca > open cargo hold *right click orca > open ore hold *right click orca > open corp hangers
Opening orca bays after inferno and fixes so far:
*Hit cargohold button at bottom of screen *right click orca > shift+click open corporate hangers *expand tree view > close filters > scroll > shift+click ore hold > collapse tree view *and now remember to hit shift+click for EVERYTHING else..... *also remember to manually close windows that you are about to warp away from to avoid getting another cargohold view that you will have to manually close anyways...
- - - - - - - - - - Please return full original functionality... please
I would really like to get a DEV response on this exact scenario. Please explain to me what I am doing wrong, and how the new UI can help me do things better than before. I keep these windows open because I will need to empty all these bays to a single location, several times a day... I can just go to the pos, open the appropriate hangar, and drag all the items from all the open bays to thier new location, then repeat... I have to use special tricks now just to retain this ability. Your new UI, if used as intended, would have me scrolling and switching views in 1 window every time I wanted to do this mundane and routine procedure, thus making it more tedious.
there are many other such usage cases that have been fubard equally, if not more. So many usage cases that it might as well be an infinite number of possibilities... |
Krystyn
Serenity Rising LLC Vanguard.
74
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Posted - 2012.06.07 23:28:00 -
[426] - Quote
CCP Goliath wrote: Which I assume you mean to be that you do not want to use the tree view at all on basic principle? The team are doing everything they can to make this of minimal impact to you, but the tree view itself is not going anywhere so I hope that you can come to terms with it in some way.
Goliath, We don't want to use the tree view because it takes too long to find what we want in our inventory. I have cans in hangars and they have to be re navigated by the tree every time. So I have to shift-click(which I hate btw) to open another window and then click down at least 4 levels to get to where I want to go to find an item and then I have to do the whole process again to navigate to the destination of the item when before I open the corp hangar double clicked open the can and then drug it to wherever I want. two shift clicks and at least 8 click selections to do the same thing as a click, double click and drag used to do. Not to mention the lag of the tree navigation. so from 3 movements to 10. Now what if I have to organize a can full of rat loot...were talking thousands of clicks and shift clicks to stash all the high meta stuff i want to keep and pile up stuff for reprocessing. I don't want to do it.
Please fix this for us.
P.S. Why was right clicking open things so bad? It was fast simple and easy and opened to the exact place I wanted. Tree not so much... Please bring back right clicks. |
Challu
Wishful Desires Inc. Armada Assail
19
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Posted - 2012.06.07 23:34:00 -
[427] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:There's a reason why MANY softwares have moved the hell away from tree views and implemented tabs.
It's called basic, simple sense.
Writings are horizontal (western ones). That is, they take lots of horizontal real estate.
Tree views make already large windows unnecessarily larger by putting horizontal information to the left of the window. Tabs make large windows functional because they take small vertical real estate and zero horizontal real estate.
The very fact you are going against all the accepted modern UI designs and find it good enough to "not going anywhere" is worrysome.
You are implementing outdated and unpractical concepts. The day the UI is bug fee, it will still be conceptually wrong.
See, many times I wanted to send CCP my curriculum but with decision makers taking this kind of directions and then sticking to them, I would feel embarassed. I would probably be bound to some "you won't publicly state your superiors borked grand time" legal agreement as well so I'd be put together the same people who can think these kinds of designs.
No way.
Listen to this man.
You should have implemented this UI in lieu of the Asset tab allowing Eve-wide searches, and left the old system as is..
Least you can do is bring back the exact functionality as before, including right-click options, neocon buttons etc.
CCP, I realize you like the tree, but it gets in the way the moment you have more than a few things to work with. |
Jame Jarl Retief
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
145
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Posted - 2012.06.07 23:51:00 -
[428] - Quote
Challu wrote:Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:There's a reason why MANY softwares have moved the hell away from tree views and implemented tabs.
It's called basic, simple sense.
Writings are horizontal (western ones). That is, they take lots of horizontal real estate.
Tree views make already large windows unnecessarily larger by putting horizontal information to the left of the window. Tabs make large windows functional because they take small vertical real estate and zero horizontal real estate.
The very fact you are going against all the accepted modern UI designs and find it good enough to "not going anywhere" is worrysome.
You are implementing outdated and unpractical concepts. The day the UI is bug fee, it will still be conceptually wrong.
See, many times I wanted to send CCP my curriculum but with decision makers taking this kind of directions and then sticking to them, I would feel embarassed. I would probably be bound to some "you won't publicly state your superiors borked grand time" legal agreement as well so I'd be put together the same people who can think these kinds of designs.
No way. Listen to this man. You should have implemented this UI in lieu of the Asset tab allowing Eve-wide searches, and left the old system as is.. Least you can do is bring back the exact functionality as before, including right-click options, neocon buttons etc. CCP, I realize you like the tree, but it gets in the way the moment you have more than a few things to work with.
Yeeah, see, it's too bad CCP doesn't actually give a hoot about player feedback until players start to leave in droves.
I mean, look at Incarna and population collapse. We got Crucible out of it, more communication, more transparency. Now a year passed, and we're back to not knowing what's coming until it's almost here and it's too late to change anything because too much time was already invested in it.
Sad state of affairs, really. Worst thing is, I don't think anyone even wanted the new UI. The only feature people got excited about was being able to see the estimated value. Which, in my experience so far is still not worth it because the estimate is usually wrong by 40-200%. And this could have been done with the old UI without massively screwing things up with the new one and setting the other development back by who knows how long while they fix this one.
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Par'Gellen
173
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Posted - 2012.06.07 23:52:00 -
[429] - Quote
Acks wrote:"We did this thing because one of us thought it was a good idea. We got attached to the idea and ran with it and we are not looking back damn the consequences. You can yell and scream and kick all you want and while we will tweak a few things for you to make it suck slightly less, we are not going to actually listen to you or give you what you want. Here is some lube, grab your ankles and learn to like it because this is going to happen and there is nothing you can do to stop it." This is a very good analogy and sums up CCP's attitude in my opinion.
CCP, I understand that "To err is human", but it shouldn't be the company motto... |
Challu
Wishful Desires Inc. Armada Assail
21
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Posted - 2012.06.08 00:20:00 -
[430] - Quote
Krystyn wrote: P.S. Why was right clicking open things so bad? It was fast simple and easy and opened to the exact place I wanted. Tree not so much... Please bring back right clicks.
The right-click option, as well as the neocon icons for ship hanger and station goodies were removed presumably to force the "Unified" in the Unified Inventory.
It cannot possibly take much coding to recreate those shortcuts/bindings to those nodes in the tree of the UI - it will really, really help in increasing the usability of this inventory system. This will mean you will have to take a step back from the enforced "unification" of stuff and activities, as counter-intuitive as that may be.
A very simple example on what's 'wrong' with the current system:
Scenario: I want to drag loot from my ship hanger to my station stash.
Old system: Double click ship, select item, drag to station hanger icon in neocon - done.
New system: Double click ship, select item, click on arrows on top left to open tree view, scroll down to station hanger (I have multiple ships so hanger's off screen), drag item from hold to hanger - done. (You could do the opposite by starting with the UI, but its about the same number of steps.)
Now, a simple action like dragging a widget from hold to hanger takes 2x steps and 4x as much time. Others have provided more elaborate descriptions. Please understand that this isn't about polishing the edges or fixing fat tail bugs - it's really about the basic, fundamental issue of usability.
It's your fault really - you spoilt us with a nicely working system before, and now we're holding you to that standard ;) |
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Davina Sienar
The Misinterpretation of Silence Mean Coalition
35
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Posted - 2012.06.08 00:22:00 -
[431] - Quote
[/quote] Shift double click solves all the things. shift double click does not work on target ship icons yet though.[/quote]
oh lol now we move from shift click to shift double click ?? hoho great improvement pls invent the tripple click mebbe ? ^^
plsplspls for any sake--- just the basic setting option, that even the win-file manager has: OPEN EVERYTHING IN NEW WINDOW
what is so diffrent ?? there is a wreck or container in space, I select from overview or direct (1 click), then click that loveley button that there is on top of overview with that open box sign, and poof magic a new window with the wreck or conti opens (2nd click)
WHAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH THAT ????? why all that shift dbl etc click stuff ??
fix the freaking basics !
CTRL + ALT + DEL solves all the things |
Yonis Kador
Transstellar Alchemy
130
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 00:27:00 -
[432] - Quote
Personally, I think with 2 shifts and a triple-click, fireworks should shoot out of your exhaust.
YK |
Maul555
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
218
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 00:39:00 -
[433] - Quote
Challu wrote:It's your fault really - you spoilt us with a nicely working system before, and now we're holding you to that standard ;)
aaaaaaaaand.... THIS! |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Royal One Piece Corporation Deadly Unknown
298
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 01:55:00 -
[434] - Quote
Maul555 wrote:I would really like to get a DEV response on this exact scenario. Please explain to me what I am doing wrong, and how the new UI can help me do things better than before. They can't, because they don't use the new UI, and there is no better example than how it worked in WH POSes. If anyone at CCP had tried using the new UI at a WH POS, they would have immediately seen the issues prior to shipping. It would have been impossible to miss. I can only guess that their testing and Q&A process doesn't include common (let alone uncommon) use cases, and as mentioned 10 million times, they ignored a lot of the feedback from testers (which has probably turned off a lot of people to testing).
I've resigned myself to the fact that Crucible was pretty good, and they shipped Inferno as a substandard release relative to Crucible. Even the youtube video is substandard. It feels like they tried to tidy up neglected aspects of the game, patch the economy and update their codebase. It doesn't feel to me that this expansion did much to push the game forward or reward people who play frequently. No new ships, the new modules are meh, no one is crazy about the new war system, no one is crazy about the missile effects (which are just eye candy and reduce tactical visuals), the only people who like the Incursions nerf are people who didnt do Incursions, the FW guys aren't exactly thrilled about the changes there either.
I don't know what the next update is supposed to be, but it better be bigger and more rewarding than reorganizing the ship lines and forcing us to train race specific destroyer and battlecruiser skills. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
MotherMoon
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
798
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Posted - 2012.06.08 02:05:00 -
[435] - Quote
CCP Goliath wrote:Par'Gellen wrote:CCP Goliath wrote:Well, I would argue that it does, it's just that the tabs are now to the left of the window rather than at the top of the window. Would I be fair in saying that? Yes, it's not exactly the same, but surely we can compromise here in that the functionality has been retained. You can say whatever you want. Nothing changes the fact that it's harder now. It's more clicks now. It's not intuitive. For God's sake it even requires keyboard input now to do things that before were a single left click of the mouse. If I only open one inventory window a day I could live with that. Multiply it a thousand fold and bask in the glow of the worst UI in the universe. We're now getting into opinion, but as I say, I will ask the team if rebinding the shift click to be normal click as a shortcut option (note - not default behaviour) is possible. That's all for me this evening folks. Fly safe. I need to say something important.
Show info Allready works this way, with shift click opening a new window and normal click opening the new info over the old one. You even have back and forward buttons, and a check box to make shift click toggle opposite behavior.
So if show info can do it shouldn't the items window ? Why dust 514 is on Console and not PCBattle field 3 salesXbox 360: 2.2 millionPlayStation 3: 1.5 millionPC: 500,000 |
Kblackjack54
Mercurialis Inc. RAZOR Alliance
65
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Posted - 2012.06.08 02:22:00 -
[436] - Quote
If CCP is geniuine about talking sensibly to the players then maybe they would like to step up and explain to them why it was so imperative that this UI update was brought in at all, what was the motivation for it and why after so much negative feed back on it from SISI and now on TQ they want to persist with it at all.
This because I for one am baffled by the latest offering regarding the time taken in beating the current UI into some semblance of a workable product.
That you are going to take a step back from the multiple fixes and workaround scenerio is of no suprise, that it took so long is.
An even bigger suprise is that you still cling to the notion that this product can ever be made to work in the sense of returning the original intuative fuctionality to the UI at all.
Your rather weak explanation that in some way you have only moved the tab system from the top of the window to the side is an enhancement I for one found insulting, however if your full and frank disclosure regarding this forced change to game mechanics answers this it will go a long way to helping the players understand what this change is actually for. |
Maul555
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
224
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 02:43:00 -
[437] - Quote
Might I be displaying too much hubris in explaining that CCP has lost sight of its mandate? The UI is for the people to decide how to use it... Not for CCP to decide how the people use it. |
Jonuts
The Arrow Project CORE.
172
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Posted - 2012.06.08 02:52:00 -
[438] - Quote
Quote:I was referring to wrecks and cargo containers in my earlier post. I am not aware of the intended functionality of this as fits POSes, but will check out the old behaviour on a reference server tomorrow along with current behaviour as you describe.
Why the hell would the functionality be different between wrecks/cargo containers and ANYTHING ELSE? What kind of drug use is going on in CCP, and where the hell can I get some? It HAS to be some good stuff.
Quote: Which I assume you mean to be that you do not want to use the tree view at all on basic principle? The team are doing everything they can to make this of minimal impact to you, but the tree view itself is not going anywhere so I hope that you can come to terms with it in some way.
Does this mean I can look forward to having full 100% feature parity with the old inventory UI and NEVER have to open a window that has that awful craptastic tree on it? As in, every inventory window I open doesn't even have it minimized, but unattached? Let the people who want the tree menu open it up with the "inventory" window, while the rest of us use neocom shortcuts/right click menus to open up unburdened windows. Pretty simple really. "Inventory" should have been a completely seperate function, like an assets screen that you can do stuff with. That would have worked much better than gutting the UI. I don't foresee me coming to "terms" with the undue burden any time soon, since I'm pretty sure 99% of the performance issues are related to the way the game handles the tree. Then again, maybe I'm wrong, and it isn't the source of untold suffering and agony to the games performance, but I'd still rather never see it again. Ever. It can go **** itself.
Quote: And in general....good Lord, people, how much crap do you own!?!? More tree entries than you have screen height? I gotta see this, please post a screen shot.
Uh. Go to a PoS? Have a bunch of containers? Plenty of ways to achieve that without actually gaming it to TRY and achieve it. More tree entries than screen height isn't even a lot of stuff, especially since MOST people have wide screens these days, meaning vertical real-estate is at a premium compared to horizontal. But meh, what do I know. According to CCP, I'm too stupid to use the UI before saying it sucks anyways. If I'm THAT stupid, I couldn't possibly understand the simplest implications of a wide screen. Really, the current design is just embarrassing. |
Maul555
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
225
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 03:03:00 -
[439] - Quote
Actually I am still working with a standard CRT display for about 80% of my eve activity, just because of the way my desk is set up according to my needs, and my PC capabilities. I have very limited screen space in a 1280 x 1024 screen space that I dual client on. The space problem I have has not been lost on me. I have adapted and am only complaining about the really big issues. I am not one to complain about little bullshit. |
Kasriel
204
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Posted - 2012.06.08 03:06:00 -
[440] - Quote
here's a question for somebody at CCP that isn't to do with how horribly broken and useless the UI is
who actually designed it? not the code the layout? because frankly it's shocking, you have an estimated price system that's really pretty innacurate and eats up a massive amount of space, why not have it on the same row as the item count to save "dead" window space? why not make that feature optional? like you push a button and it gives you it's estimate?
same with the filters/m3/icons they hog a load of screen space as well - and that's without touching the space the tree view needs to be at all effective
ignoring all the problems with this - and trust me there are so so many - i can't say it was even designed well at a graphical level let alone a usability one.
and on the whole usability level, it may well be easier for new players - who don't have much crap - but for older players who have a fair collection of ships and assets it's a nightmare, instead of opening just what i need open and drag and drop now you've gone ahead and added either more clicking to the equation or a crapload of scrolling. how was this not taken into account? |
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Swanger
Bane Inc INQUISITION.
0
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Posted - 2012.06.08 03:23:00 -
[441] - Quote
Dear CCP,
The UI tree sucks. Change it back!
20 plus pages of it sucks and your still trying to defend it! Change it back! |
Maul555
Nuts and Vindictive Remix Technologies
225
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 03:28:00 -
[442] - Quote
Eve is all about choices... and I just wanted to make sure that CCP knows that the choices they are making right now have repercussions throughout the eve universe.... |
disasteur
Tellcomtec Incorporated. Preatoriani
157
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 04:33:00 -
[443] - Quote
Bantara wrote:Haifisch Zahne wrote:Well, if the tree view is "not going anywhere", I can tell you that I will. One subscription cancelled. Smoking Blunts wrote:16 June 2012 - 1:07 pm (in 8 days), thats when my 3 indy accounts run out, may they rest in peace. Scaugh wrote: I don't know why I've posted here as I've already unsubbed. I'm getting seriously stresed at a computer game, and i didn't even get a little annoyed with Incarna (3+yrs of playing ..now what game will I play.... sigh) 1 - They don't want to read that you're unsubbing, because remember, it's what you do, not what you say, that they will be watching. 2 - So all you're doing is flooding forum with rants. Stop. And can I haz your stuff? 3, Scaugh: Why, DUST 514, of course!! ;) (In all seriousness, what about Rift? Or Secret World?) And in general....good Lord, people, how much crap do you own!?!? More tree entries than you have screen height? I gotta see this, please post a screen shot.
town idiot?
clearly you do not know much Bantara, and really people using words like HAZ, doesnt show a lot of intelligence |
Biff Rodgers
Null Sec Enterprises Fade 2 Black
11
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Posted - 2012.06.08 04:47:00 -
[444] - Quote
Guys, I'm getting a head ache over this. More people are bellyaching this than supporting it. Now it's been a few weeks since unified inventory has been out, learnt some new tricks. At the end of the day, to do the same work I did before on the previous system, I'm now having to do more mouse clicks and keyboard presses to do the same thing.
I'm not against change if the change is an improvement. But this is not an improvement. I'm having difficulty understanding why CCP is pushing this, it's like CCP is raking water up hill with this.
Now, to the point, I ask CCP, why is this unified inventory being pushed? We as a whole don't like it. Please bring/roll back to the previous system for inventory. Down the track some one will come up with another idea, try it out and if it's better, implement it. Not steam roll it out over your customers.
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Dream Five
Renegade Pleasure Androids Pleasure Syndicate
306
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Posted - 2012.06.08 04:51:00 -
[445] - Quote
Swanger wrote:Dear CCP,
The UI tree sucks. Change it back!
20 plus pages of it sucks and your still trying to defend it! Change it back!
There's another 70 page thread dude. The whole argument is ridiculous frankly. |
Chokichi Ozuwara
Royal One Piece Corporation Deadly Unknown
300
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 05:17:00 -
[446] - Quote
Kblackjack54 wrote:If CCP is geniuine about talking sensibly to the players then maybe they would like to step up and explain to them why it was so imperative that this UI update was brought in at all, what was the motivation for it and why after so much negative feed back on it from SISI and now on TQ they want to persist with it at all. I've suggested there be a post-mortem as this is the only way to get closure for the playerbase beyond reverting the UI.
The worst part of this is, while I don't like the new UI, if CCP was more transparent and forthcoming, more people would be on their side, or at least sympathetic to their side. That wouldn't help me, but it would help CCP.
We're living in an age of relationship marketing and making your customers feel confused and ignored is horrible for any business. Companies that aren't accountable eventually implode.
I think the big takeaway from all of this, is the lack of leadership at CCP. Someone should have stood up during the first week, and explained the rationale, process and direction of this change. Answered questions until there were no more, and then moved on executing the changes which need to be made.
This half-compromise of changing little stuff and avoiding the big issues, while maintaining a stoic stiff upper lip is not the same as being responsive. Users are too smart today. People see CCP not being open and transparent, even if they like the UI, and that diminishes the prestige of the brand and the loyalty for the product.
Maul555 wrote:Eve is all about choices... and I just wanted to make sure that CCP knows that the choices they are making right now have repercussions throughout the eve universe.... I know what you are saying, but I also said this another way. We get very involved in this game. When you change the UI, that's bigger than changing ship designs or missile effects. It's bigger than tweaking drone regions or nerfing Incursions.
You're affecting the way every player interfaces with the game, a good part of the time.
This expansion was "light in the pants" and what should have been a key feature enhancement (improving the UI) has turned into CCP's 2012 Waterloo. Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round. |
disasteur
Tellcomtec Incorporated. Preatoriani
158
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Posted - 2012.06.08 05:56:00 -
[447] - Quote
i was planning a huge post... but after finishing the half of it i realized i could just as well talk to my dog, she also looks at me with a dumb smile and doesnt say anything back... well she barks but that wasnt what i wanted to hear... |
Mackenzie Hawkwood
Event Horizon Expeditionaries Apocalypse Now.
6
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Posted - 2012.06.08 06:19:00 -
[448] - Quote
Krystyn wrote:CCP Goliath wrote: Which I assume you mean to be that you do not want to use the tree view at all on basic principle? The team are doing everything they can to make this of minimal impact to you, but the tree view itself is not going anywhere so I hope that you can come to terms with it in some way.
Goliath, We don't want to use the tree view because it takes too long to find what we want in our inventory. I have cans in hangars and they have to be re navigated by the tree every time. So I have to shift-click(which I hate btw) to open another window and then click down at least 4 levels to get to where I want to go to find an item and then I have to do the whole process again to navigate to the destination of the item when before I open the corp hangar double clicked open the can and then drug it to wherever I want. two shift clicks and at least 8 click selections to do the same thing as a click, double click and drag used to do. Not to mention the lag of the tree navigation. so from 3 movements to 10. Now what if I have to organize a can full of rat loot...were talking thousands of clicks and shift clicks to stash all the high meta stuff i want to keep and pile up stuff for reprocessing. I don't want to do it. Please fix this for us. P.S. Why was right clicking open things so bad? It was fast simple and easy and opened to the exact place I wanted. Tree not so much... Please bring back right clicks.
Bring back the Right Click and cut down the tree |
Sturmwolke
230
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Posted - 2012.06.08 06:21:00 -
[449] - Quote
I think many people would agree that EVE Online is often quoted as "spreadsheet-in-space". Therefore, post Inferno changes, I would like to take this opportunity to suggest a new moniker for it.
EVE Online - "spreadsheet-in-space AND file explorer-in-space"
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Dream Five
Renegade Pleasure Androids Pleasure Syndicate
307
|
Posted - 2012.06.08 06:28:00 -
[450] - Quote
Chokichi Ozuwara wrote:
This expansion was "light in the pants" and what should have been a key feature enhancement (improving the UI) has turned into CCP's 2012 Waterloo.
They seem to enjoy shooting themselves in the foot on a fairly regular basis huh. I kinda feel for them. |
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