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Massive Supercarrier nerf intentional?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Illectroculus Defined	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:12:00 - [1081] Originally by: Trent Nichols Originally by: JZIM 30 minute supercapital redock timer please kthx Aye. At the very least its time for different redock timers for different ship classes. I mean really, wouldn't it be more difficult to tractor a supercarrier into a station than a shuttle? And while we're at it - repairing a ship using a station's facilities shouldn't be instantaneous, you shouldn't be able to repair more than say 250,000 hp per minute.
Dramaticus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:19:00 - [1082] go back to where we were last week no ducking ~12b cost 3 drones per level un****ed explosion radius nothing more, nothing less. Please don't use RL pictuers of players in Sig without permission. - WeatherMan
Lord Power	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:23:00 - [1083] Ok this can be solved if ccp is willing to listen. 1. Super Carriers only allowed to dock in 0.0 space with station upgrade inplace. 2. Super Carriers cannot dock in anything other than 0.0 3. Super Carriers be allowed to fit Jump Portal Generators like the titan, for bridging. That would make something about the name go along with "SUPER" 4. For reimbursement. Make those ships Pre dominion Insurable in stations, for say X-amount 15bil or something, that way when they die, money rembursed minus mods. 5. 5 minute agression timer in 0.0 to avoide station dock/undock games just like the titan cool down timer... That said alot of supercarrier problems solved.
sg3s Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:27:00 - [1084] Edited by: sg3s on 13/11/2009 22:31:52 Originally by: CCP Nozh Hey, We've made some further changes to super carriers after taking your feedback into consideration. It's quite understandable that the changes made were a disappointment to many of you, but I wanted to remind you that Singularity is a test server and all changes, even these are subject to change. Compact Citadel Torpedo Changes: Explosion Velocity: 60 Damage: 3200 Super Carrier Changes: Can deploy 2 additional Fighter or Drone per level Can dock at stations Furthermore we're looking into solutions to reimburse current mothership pilots for the drop in construction cost. That's all for now. -Nozh Dear Nozh, No rant this time, I have nothing against you, however I oppose the choice of letting super carriers dock. Why would it be a bad idea? Well, from the start, super capitals were supposed to never be 100% safe (unless logged of), I still like this philosophy a lot, and eve should keep it, for titans AND super carriers. Instead I would opt for an alternative for docking, an option / feature that would allow supercapital pilots to leave their ship in safety for a finite amount of time, time which they can use to do other stuff like shooting reds in other ships / attending to meetings in empire (I dunno) or simply picking up some modules form the nearby outpost. An idea like this has existed for the longest time already although as a subfeature of the 'modular POSs', a recap was recently made where we iterated a bit further upon the idea of 'Mooring points' for POSs. I realize that it is possibly not the intention of having super capitals dock to be safe, but to insure them that made you make this change, however I find it hard to believe no alternative options can be realized to insure ships... En fin the implementation of 'mooring points' would of course come down to the details of the mechanics, I have my ideas about that (ask me to iterate upon it and I will), like how to protect the capitals from being stolen by corp members which have roles to offline stuff at POSs (my idea: offline time is 12 or so hours, and has it's own 'reinforced' mode to protect from spies that infiltrate only to turn of the POS shields). Regards, PS. Talk to your co-workers a bit more often
fairimear Gallente Esto Perpetua	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:28:00 - [1085] Originally by: Lord Power Ok this can be solved if ccp is willing to listen. 1. Super Carriers only allowed to dock in 0.0 space with station upgrade inplace. 2. Super Carriers cannot dock in anything other than 0.0 3. Super Carriers be allowed to fit Jump Portal Generators like the titan, for bridging. That would make something about the name go along with "SUPER" 4. For reimbursement. Make those ships Pre dominion Insurable in stations, for say X-amount 15bil or something, that way when they die, money rembursed minus mods. 5. 5 minute agression timer in 0.0 to avoide station dock/undock games just like the titan cool down timer... That said alot of supercarrier problems solved. Wrong. this will still lead to the problem of 20-30 just undocking defending a station and then redocking. no one will take station in 0.0 it will be a disaster. besides we dnt want to dock. we want our expensive but semi usefull dread killer. *Bringing a type of class to PL.*
John Zorg Caldari The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:30:00 - [1086] Why make a comprimise with the repair. The extra drone per level is removed and Nozh has said the plus is now that they can dock. I personally feel that this is very broken. The initial idea was great changes and meant that players will finally get to use these ships properly as weapons of mass destruction. With making them dockable and reducing their value are the BPOs coming down in price? Will we be able to build them in stations? I don't like the feel of these new changes. The whole class has just been reduced to "another ship". I am glad to see CCP is coming to the table on this but these changes are not being properly worked through.
Lubomir Penev Dark Nexxus	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:33:00 - [1087] Originally by: Karlemgne Originally by: Darknesss CCP continue to astonish me at how out of touch they are with the common player. The common player? Seriously? The common player doesn't give two ****s about changes to supercarriers. The common player has never, nor will they ever fly one. They might encounter these ships in combat once or twice, ever. No, its YOU LOT who is totally out of touch with the "common player.? They will be everywhere if those changes go in. Even I that make no effort whatsoever to make ISK could get one relatively easily... -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog
NathanMoore Cataclysm Enterprises Ev0ke	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:34:00 - [1088] Originally by: JZIM 30 minute supercapital redock timer please kthx good idea, or even a hour or two. But this would be an amazing compromise.
Battle Tested Shiva	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:35:00 - [1089] 1- DO NOT reduce the cost to 5-6b...all mothership/supercarrier pilots are happy with them at 12b 2- ONLY dockable at an upgraded outpost 3- plus two fighters/fighterbombers/drones per level would be fine 4- compact citadel torpedo explosion radius should atl least go down to 1700 5- 3200 damage per compact citadel torpedo is fine 6- NO triage/clone vat/jump portal generator is fine 7- increase figther/fighter bomber bay to carry plenty of extra since they will definately be killed off by support ships 8- HP changes are perfect 9- a redock timer should be added to them the most important thing out of all this is the cost to build one, you definately are opening Pandora's box making them 5-6b each
Mkiaki Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:36:00 - [1090] Originally by: Lubomir Penev Originally by: Karlemgne Originally by: Darknesss CCP continue to astonish me at how out of touch they are with the common player. The common player? Seriously? The common player doesn't give two ****s about changes to supercarriers. The common player has never, nor will they ever fly one. They might encounter these ships in combat once or twice, ever. No, its YOU LOT who is totally out of touch with the "common player.? They will be everywhere if those changes go in. Even I that make no effort whatsoever to make ISK could get one relatively easily... This is why I 100% support the changes.

Kate Pole	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:37:00 - [1091] I have no idea why CCP added the docking, unless it is assumed you can only dock with the station upgrades and not just anywhere; and we are going nuts over nothing. I don't remember anyone *****ing about docking, more like dps, tank and value issues.
Quadratko	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:41:00 - [1092] What's we have at Apocrifa about motherships: - legendary ship, symbol of EvE, available just for couple peoples, but mostly used as logist, may be easily killed, low battlefield abilites. Mothership should be boosting. What's we have at dominion about "supercarriers" now: - low cost, docking to stations = massive Nyx on undock. Im thinks is bad idea, CCP just nerfed legend ship to level of fleet-BS, it's just quillwort. I thinks, CCP must come back to normally rebalancing MBs with changes worth to it's role and status. Supercarriers must be different new shiptype. Two weeks is more than enough for doing this. And it's must be calls something else then "Supercarriers", that name sounds like openly acknowledge of CCP's game designers impotence.
Battle Tested Shiva	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:43:00 - [1093] Originally by: Battle Tested 1- DO NOT reduce the cost to 5-6b...all mothership/supercarrier pilots are happy with them at 12b 2- ONLY dockable at an upgraded outpost 3- plus two fighters/fighterbombers/drones per level would be fine 4- compact citadel torpedo explosion radius should atl least go down to 1700 5- 3200 damage per compact citadel torpedo is fine 6- NO triage/clone vat/jump portal generator is fine 7- increase figther/fighter bomber bay to carry plenty of extra since they will definately be killed off by support ships 8- HP changes are perfect 9- a redock timer should be added to them the most important thing out of all this is the cost to build one, you definately are opening Pandora's box making them 5-6b each also should add a "sensor recalibration timer" on them upon undocking, say 10-15 minutes, and docking upgrade on outpost should be limited to one per constellation
Uzume Ame Gallente	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:48:00 - [1094] Originally by: NathanMoore Originally by: JZIM 30 minute supercapital redock timer please kthx good idea, or even a hour or two. But this would be an amazing compromise. This could actually make sense. Do that and fix compact citadels and we are set-up. Also remove insurance from supercaps enterelly (basic insurance included, specially with cheaper supercarriers). - Then make titans worth something and not a glorified dread (seriouslly, there hasn't been much outcry, but that's because there is MUCH less people which considered flying onw at all, and less titan pilots). - Then go and fix disparity between armor/shield tanking supercaps. - Then fix citadel torps, and citadel cruise; and un-nerf capital guns as current iteration. And fix failgars. - Then fix screw up of moon goo rebalance. - Then make system upgrades worth something considering and not a joke. And then we have a decent expansion, far from perfect (not very original gamedesign in some aspects and still some not so bright decissions with sov system), but much better than current abortion.
fairimear Gallente Esto Perpetua	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:51:00 - [1095] Originally by: Lord Power Ok this can be solved if ccp is willing to listen. 1. Super Carriers only allowed to dock in 0.0 space with station upgrade inplace. 2. Super Carriers cannot dock in anything other than 0.0 3. Super Carriers be allowed to fit Jump Portal Generators like the titan, for bridging. That would make something about the name go along with "SUPER" 4. For reimbursement. Make those ships Pre dominion Insurable in stations, for say X-amount 15bil or something, that way when they die, money rembursed minus mods. 5. 5 minute agression timer in 0.0 to avoide station dock/undock games just like the titan cool down timer... That said alot of supercarrier problems solved. Wrong. this will still lead to the problem of 20-30 just undocking defending a station and then redocking. no one will take station in 0.0 it will be a disaster. besides we dnt want to dock. we want our expensive but semi usefull dread killer. The reason half say it wnt be used and the other half say they will be every where is cus this is one of those changes that is so imbalanced and wrong that it litteraly is going to go 1 of those 2 ways. the first nerf before we got the docking and increase to 15 fb. That nerf would of lead to NO one using them. The nerf of docking i lead to a abuse of their hp. Now if he removes the hp they will once again be useless as no one will use a ship that can still get ganked on station by 20 dreads and costs 6-10 bill. And they wnt be used on the field cus they will be as bad as they are now. - some firepower. the only real soloution is the original one. expensive ship. can't dock. can kill dreads but wnt survive without fleet backup. THE reason i think he has done this is because they assume there is a chance that 2030 of these could show up and start raping fields of ships. IF it was lag from drones it was a simple matter of lowering the number and making up the dps with less. The fix to the problem of 20+ attacking is: A. probably not a issue cus once 1-10 fights happen where 30 turn up then 40 counter them. It just will balance out with less of them cus they get killed by each other. or they wnt be fielded without backup. This will mean super caps will be fighting each other probably. support will be ducking it out around them. B. The real issue is having more than say 10 super dps ships shooting 1 target any way.. Its boring when 40 dreads shoot 1 dread. It's boring when 40 supercarriers shoot 1 dread. Its still boring when 40 super carriers shoot 1 super carrier. The problem is people primarying 1 target. its across the board. If you want more sandbox tactics and a eliment of planning a fight ranges ect. YOU MUST LIMIT THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE WHO CAN SHOOT THE SAME THING *Bringing a type of class to PL.*
Millsy1	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:51:00 - [1096] Honestly I hate that so many people are against docking. I mean it's a game. Forcing someone to put their character in a single ship, which they can never leave just sucks. Especially for those people who aren't able to pay for 2 characters. Everyone who says "They should only be able to dock in an upgraded station" Look, not everyone who has a mom is going to be in an alliance. Why punish someone who has been playing for 5 years, who has worked their ass off to make enough isk, or mine enough minerals to build/buy one of these ships? And if you say "they can only be built by alliances" sure, but they can be bought by anyone with the right price. It's a slap in the face to say "alright, you got the 'endgame' good luck trying to enjoy the game now". As for docking games. I have zero problem with them adding in something to only allow them to dock once an hour or something (or whatever number ends up making sense) just so they don't make the things impossible to kill. It shouldn't be hard to add that code. There is already 4 different types of docking timers (cyno into system, shoot a rat, shoot a player, just undocked)
Kate Pole	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:52:00 - [1097] Edited by: Kate Pole on 13/11/2009 22:53:28 Originally by: Battle Tested 1- DO NOT reduce the cost to 5-6b...all mothership/supercarrier pilots are happy with them at 12b 2- ONLY dockable at an upgraded outpost 3- plus two fighters/fighterbombers/drones per level would be fine 4- compact citadel torpedo explosion radius should atl least go down to 1700 5- 3200 damage per compact citadel torpedo is fine 6- NO triage/clone vat/jump portal generator is fine 7- increase figther/fighter bomber bay to carry plenty of extra since they will definately be killed off by support ships 8- HP changes are perfect 9- a redock timer should be added to them the most important thing out of all this is the cost to build one, you definately are opening Pandora's box making them 5-6b each I'm not ok with 15 and not ok with the dps. If CCP wants them to be used they need dps. rest I agree And someone with good organization skills should make a post in a format where we can all vote on the most common wants and do not want.. THREAD NOUGHT HOOOOOOO!!
Battle Tested Shiva	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:55:00 - [1098] Originally by: Kate Pole Edited by: Kate Pole on 13/11/2009 22:53:28 Originally by: Battle Tested 1- DO NOT reduce the cost to 5-6b...all mothership/supercarrier pilots are happy with them at 12b 2- ONLY dockable at an upgraded outpost 3- plus two fighters/fighterbombers/drones per level would be fine 4- compact citadel torpedo explosion radius should atl least go down to 1700 5- 3200 damage per compact citadel torpedo is fine 6- NO triage/clone vat/jump portal generator is fine 7- increase figther/fighter bomber bay to carry plenty of extra since they will definately be killed off by support ships 8- HP changes are perfect 9- a redock timer should be added to them the most important thing out of all this is the cost to build one, you definately are opening Pandora's box making them 5-6b each I'm not ok with 15 and not ok with the dps. If CCP wants them to be used they need dps. rest I agree And someone with good organization skills should make a post in a format where we can all vote on the most common wants and do not want.. THREAD NOUGHT HOOOOOOO!! The DPS wil increase drastically if you look @ reducing the explosion radius to 1700
The Navigator	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:55:00 - [1099] nuff said. FREE ABATHUR!
Artemis Rose Sileo In Pacis THE SPACE P0LICE	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:56:00 - [1100] * No on the docking. Seriously? Seriously? The only thing you could use Carriers for the Supercarrier couldn't do is jump longer distances. It hauls better, more HP, E-war immune and extra slots for roughly 4-5 extra bil. It will completely outclass the current form a Carrier in every way. * Give it a bonus to fighter/fighterbomber damage to reflect it having 15 effective fighters at Racial Carrier V. There is no reason you should have even more objects on the grid in large fights anyhow. Its not like any of the crybaby mothership pilots assign their fighters to anybody currently. They wouldn't get their FEARSOME UNIQUE AWESOME DPS that way. * Do not, ever reimburse a single person because of the different build cost. You bought when it was worth X and now its worth Y now. You can't exactly go scream at retailer selling you an LCD TV back when they first hit the market at 20 times the price they are now. ...and if you just recently bought it, You got BURNED speculating. Harsh hyper-capitalist world, deal with it. If you are a capital pilot, you have been around EVE to see how the expansions work. Look in the mirror, scream at them. And well, best of luck to CCP. No matter where you step, you'll get screamed at, keep on keeping on! *** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats

Jazuz Krist	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:56:00 - [1101] lol @ you guys, you were all adamant during discussions that they should never be able to dock. now they can dock.... luls shooting yourselves in the foot with all your whining.
Strap Adiktume	Posted - 2009.11.13 22:59:00 - [1102] Originally by: CCP Nozh Super Carrier Changes: Can deploy 2 additional Fighter or Drone per level Can dock at stations Furthermore we're looking into solutions to reimburse current mothership pilots for the drop in construction cost. That's all for now. -Nozh CCP I Salute you o7 I like the way all the tears now are from the people saying Wha Wha to the SC/MOM pilots a few pages back XD - And as for recompensing the people with Nyx/Hel/Aeon/Wyvern in production / already - BRAVO!!!! As for docking well that means they can be insured making it sure that these ships are going to be used and loved by all (that fly in / with them) If your one of the people now crying however, suck it up and instead of spending ur time bi-yatching about them do what every end-game player has done and train to get one, if it takes you a year and u wanna bi-yatch about that then now you understand the frustrations of all the pilots above. With the price drop they are not only an alliance level toy, they can be enjoyed by all!!!
ByFstugan Caldari Big Shadows Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:03:00 - [1103] Edited by: ByFstugan on 13/11/2009 23:04:55 Some upset MS owners it seems, and some others abit more pleased. There are no use to discuss what image ppl have about what a super-carrier is or should be imo - the MS's is remade to SC's and will be a new ship - however similar in hull and some bonuses. But with the pricetag reduced I'm not sure it's fruitful to use the term supercapital as foundation for an argument. I wanna mention the changes one by one and make some comments on them. Since the question of SC's being able to dock is the new topic that gets the most emo since the drones per level was fixed I start with that one: Docking: I think it's a good thing in general not to trap pilots in their ships, however the issue about them being overpowered at station is not to be ignored. For most people the solution are "no docking", but I think that's not the best one. Change this instead: Make the SC's unable to use drones or offensive modules within X km from docking range in same manner Smartbombs are disabled in empire. This is a problem solved solution imo. Price and EHP: Reduction of cost is a very good thing imo. I see many ppl thinking they should stay expensive and rare, and probably much due to their view upon what Super capitals is or should be (or that they wanna be more special and own what others cannot afford). However I feel no such feeling, but instead embrace the door to open up to not only the filthy rich to have an capital with the little extra something (I can myself buy more than 3 of them in todays price, so the argument isn't made due to my small wallet). I think EVE has evolved so far from the time when this ships was virtually indestructable (due to insane dreadfleets, dictors and HIC's) that the old pricetag is to big when the space is so much more lethal and full of traps. Not even with the new HP buff will these ships be even close to have such survivalability as they had when introduced - and with the new titans role the EHP is needed since I don't think SC's should be able to instapop, and not even close to it. So even the EHP and the levels it's changed to seems as a good solution when it comes to balance the game. Number of Drones/Fighters: I'm not saying that the change to two d/f per level is a bad thing, but I think it needs an addition: Change this also: Make the Drone Control Unit also add two d/f per module on the SC's so that the nerf of drones in space doesn't get to big, a module that's rather useless (especially on MS/SC) get a function and that players has to think more when they balance their fit to offensive/defensive setups. Fighter Bombers: Good move to make this for SC's and assign this new role. Let their damage be decided by the last thing I talked about, how many drones one should be able to launch (if the Drone Control Unit get's 2 per level on SC's). Active Tank: I know the active tank is almost nothing compared to the EHP this ships will get, but it disrupts my circles to see a Carrier active tank almost 4x as good when in Triage. Therefor I think it should get at least 100% bonus to repair amount on capital reppers/boosters. It still won't compete with a triage carrier in active tank, but it will at least not suck hard in this area compared to it's little brother. _______________________________ The wise knows what he knows not.
xplosiv	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:10:00 - [1104] Originally by: ByFstugan Edited by: ByFstugan on 13/11/2009 23:04:55 Some upset MS owners it seems, and some others abit more pleased. There are no use to discuss what image ppl have about what a super-carrier is or should be imo - the MS's is remade to SC's and will be a new ship - however similar in hull and some bonuses. But with the pricetag reduced I'm not sure it's fruitful to use the term supercapital as foundation for an argument. I wanna mention the changes one by one and make some comments on them. Since the question of SC's being able to dock is the new topic that gets the most emo since the drones per level was fixed I start with that one: Docking: I think it's a good thing in general not to trap pilots in their ships, however the issue about them being overpowered at station is not to be ignored. For most people the solution are "no docking", but I think that's not the best one. Change this instead: Make the SC's unable to use drones or offensive modules within X km from docking range in same manner Smartbombs are disabled in empire. This is a problem solved solution imo. Price and EHP: Reduction of cost is a very good thing imo. I see many ppl thinking they should stay expensive and rare, and probably much due to their view upon what Super capitals is or should be (or that they wanna be more special and own what others cannot afford). However I feel no such feeling, but instead embrace the door to open up to not only the filthy rich to have an capital with the little extra something (I can myself buy more than 3 of them in todays price, so the argument isn't made due to my small wallet). I think EVE has evolved so far from the time when this ships was virtually indestructable (due to insane dreadfleets, dictors and HIC's) that the old pricetag is to big when the space is so much more lethal and full of traps. Not even with the new HP buff will these ships be even close to have such survivalability as they had when introduced - and with the new titans role the EHP is needed since I don't think SC's should be able to instapop, and not even close to it. So even the EHP and the levels it's changed to seems as a good solution when it comes to balance the game. Number of Drones/Fighters: I'm not saying that the change to two d/f per level is a bad thing, but I think it needs an addition: Change this also: Make the Drone Control Unit also add two d/f per module on the SC's so that the nerf of drones in space doesn't get to big, a module that's rather useless (especially on MS/SC) get a function and that players has to think more when they balance their fit to offensive/defensive setups. Fighter Bombers: Good move to make this for SC's and assign this new role. Let their damage be decided by the last thing I talked about, how many drones one should be able to launch (if the Drone Control Unit get's 2 per level on SC's). Active Tank: I know the active tank is almost nothing compared to the EHP this ships will get, but it disrupts my circles to see a Carrier active tank almost 4x as good when in Triage. Therefor I think it should get at least 100% bonus to repair amount on capital reppers/boosters. It still won't compete with a triage carrier in active tank, but it will at least not suck hard in this area compared to it's little brother. u dnt know what ur on about.
the teddybear	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:12:00 - [1105] Originally by: Millsy1 Honestly I hate that so many people are against docking. I mean it's a game. Forcing someone to put their character in a single ship, which they can never leave just sucks. Especially for those people who aren't able to pay for 2 characters. Everyone who says "They should only be able to dock in an upgraded station" Look, not everyone who has a mom is going to be in an alliance. Why punish someone who has been playing for 5 years, who has worked their ass off to make enough isk, or mine enough minerals to build/buy one of these ships? And if you say "they can only be built by alliances" sure, but they can be bought by anyone with the right price. It's a slap in the face to say "alright, you got the 'endgame' good luck trying to enjoy the game now". As for docking games. I have zero problem with them adding in something to only allow them to dock once an hour or something (or whatever number ends up making sense) just so they don't make the things impossible to kill. It shouldn't be hard to add that code. There is already 4 different types of docking timers (cyno into system, shoot a rat, shoot a player, just undocked) if you are in a supercarrier and are alone (not in an alliance) and have been playing for 5 years somthing is seriously wrong. and if you have a supercarrier you sure could pay for more than just 2 subs, ie sell your useless ship and buy plex's or get stuff you can dock there is no reason to have one if you have it to just fly it.
John Zorg Caldari The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:32:00 - [1106] Edited by: John Zorg on 13/11/2009 23:35:51 Originally by: Artemis Rose * No on the docking. Seriously? Seriously? The only thing you could use Carriers for the Supercarrier couldn't do is jump longer distances. It hauls better, more HP, E-war immune and extra slots for roughly 4-5 extra bil. It will completely outclass the current form a Carrier in every way. * Give it a bonus to fighter/fighterbomber damage to reflect it having 15 effective fighters at Racial Carrier V. There is no reason you should have even more objects on the grid in large fights anyhow. Its not like any of the crybaby mothership pilots assign their fighters to anybody currently. They wouldn't get their FEARSOME UNIQUE AWESOME DPS that way. * Do not, ever reimburse a single person because of the different build cost. You bought when it was worth X and now its worth Y now. You can't exactly go scream at retailer selling you an LCD TV back when they first hit the market at 20 times the price they are now. ...and if you just recently bought it, You got BURNED speculating. Harsh hyper-capitalist world, deal with it. If you are a capital pilot, you have been around EVE to see how the expansions work. Look in the mirror, scream at them. And well, best of luck to CCP. No matter where you step, you'll get screamed at, keep on keeping on! dude, are you smoked? Do you even own a MS? Do you know what effort goes into to build one of these? When I buy a brand new LCD TV I know that the technology keeps improving and I pay a premium for the new technology. Your relation doesn't work. What is happening here is my LCD TV that I bought is being traded in for a 1940's Black and white TV. I am losing value on the ship. As for the drone amount launched. By changing it from 20 to 15 it in effect drops my DPS on Fighters and Drones by 25%. This is a big decrease. Just increase the Bandwidth requirement of the fighter Bombers. This will leave normal drones/fighters as is and will restrict the number of fighter bombers you can launch. Sort of like with the Myrmidon that used to be able to launch 5 x Ogres, adjusted the bandwidth now they can only launch 1 with an assortment of other drones. Adjust the Fighter Bombers Bandwidth, not the amount it can launch, you are breaking everything about Super Carriers. Don't let them Dock, let them hold to the 20 drones they can command at lvl 5 and keep the price where they are now on the live server. You can then play with the DPS and other features of the new Fighter Bombers. There, problem solved, no fancy dock/undock timers. Just a straight, easily balanced ship that conforms to other ship standards in EVE. The code is there just use it. Personal request, please increase the ships physical size, they are so sexy yet they are not seen by anyone.
Athar Mu Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:35:00 - [1107] Just reading the last few pages I have to agree with most of the posters, the new changes aren't very well thought out in terms of repercussions. What it does mean is that if I sell my Dread and my carrier then grind alittle bit I can have a Wyvern before Christmas...and if I lose it (which is why I never really invested in one before cos replacing it would be a pain) I can spend a month or 2 getting the isk for another. And it can dock which means I can go do level 4's in highsec at no risk in my faction Golem with the same character then if I want to play docking games in OMS or Navula I can. Win for me I suppose Keep supercapitals for those with holding alts, don't let them dock!!
Ivanna Nuke Gallente Daralux	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:38:00 - [1108] I still think we must understand that only the cowbell truly knows the future as it is allied to the garlic bread.
Kate Pole	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:38:00 - [1109] I think the fact that a Super Carrier that costs 12b+ or even (6b) no matter it's a matter of semantics. Anyway, the fact that it cannot kill a well tanked hic is very telling. A multi billion ship cannot kill a 130m (well fitted) ship. I know HIC were designed to tackle an SC but not tank it without an end is lame. Hell, I can make a BS or Command ship tank 20 fighters. SUPER carriers.. SUPER, REALLY? All that said. The jump range and HP bonus is nice.
Esna Pitoojee Amarr TalCorp Enterprises	Posted - 2009.11.13 23:42:00 - [1110] Originally by: The Mittani Edited by: The Mittani on 13/11/2009 18:46:48 we'll just park our however many supercarriers on the first outpost anyone tries to take in delve or querious, it'll be pretty stress-free since they can throw ecm bursts, are immune to ewar and our various enemies will have to chew through 30m+ ehp to pop one before they redock we'll use the refund money you're giving us to make up for your catastrophic previous post to buy more docking 30m ehp bricks cool thanks, bye edit: anyone praising nozh for listening to 'reason' is little better than a quisling, this change is worse than his first one, and he shouldn't be adjusting /anything/ from the original abathur version of supercapitals QFT. Just bring back the Abathur version, CCP. You had a lot more happy subscribers back then, and the issues with the "New new Supercarriers" (AKA Superdockers) are so obvious it isn't even funny anymore. ---------------------------------------------- Say "Amarr ships suk, lol." I dare you. My statments do not represent the opinions, views, or actions of my corp.



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