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| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 19 post(s) |
The VC's
Spack Force 5
20
   |
Posted - 2012.08.16 13:15:00 -
[31] - Quote
@ CCP Fozzie
Could you tell us your thinking behind the Tristan only having 9 slots compared to the others 10?
Not that I want a MSE II double DDA II kite b@stard or anything. |
Deena Amaj
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
29
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 13:20:00 -
[32] - Quote
Looks mostly solid to me.
Tristan is more a "Fat man" now :).
Although I wish the 10% explosion dmg on Breacher would have stayed, it is just fine as it is now and it can sting stuff.
I wish Tristan had an Assault Frigate variant... 
confirthisposmed
Yes. I'm a writer. And I'm a writer. |
DenadanA
Cosmic Clowns Killers
Red Alliance
1
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 13:26:00 -
[33] - Quote
How about amarr drone frigate? |
Takeshi Yamato
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
357
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 13:28:00 -
[34] - Quote
CCP Fozzie
Is there any chance that the -10% laser cap usage bonus will be looked at while you're rebalancing T1 ships? It's something that you guys probably want to address sooner or later, and in this case, sooner would save you some work.
There are about 20 ships with this bonus and many of the T1 ships with it are just not competitive due to it. I've written some of my thoughts about it here. If you want to look at it, seeing the affected ships in a list makes you realize how far reaching this issue is.
I also want to mention that I'd really like the Inquisitor to be a Khanid ship (rocket damage bonus, armor resist bonus).
An analysis: fixing active tanking in a logical manner:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1693846 |
Keras Authion
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
103
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 13:41:00 -
[35] - Quote
I'm liking the changes for the most part.
Kestrel has finally the grid to fit light launchers without a mapc and the other additions should make it a great mission boat, a kiter or a tanky rocket boat. With the light missile buff it should be a very competetive ship. The cargobay decrease will lose the ability to be a low-level hauler but the exploration frigates should pick up that role even better.
Tristan has the full flight of lights but the split weapon bonus isn't usually something that could be called good. It looks like it's supposed to stay at range and support the drone dps with rails. It gets about 120 dps with warrior IIs and 125mms, which is still more than the kestrel's 90-ish or whatever it will be after the patch without damage mods on either so I suppose there is some reasoning done there. However the ship will be more expensive to fit with tech 2 drones than the rest.
The breacher is a... tanky rocket boat with some drones? Is the shield supposed to be as strong as the caldari shield? It makes sense but it might be good to ask if it's intentional since most of the other changes have shown that minmatar has a lower shield amount and the rest of the stats follow the usual layout. Other than that I can't really think of about this ship.
The previous post was rated "C" for capsuleer. |
Michael Harari
The Hatchery
Team Liquid
236
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 13:58:00 -
[36] - Quote
Takeshi Yamato wrote:CCP Fozzie
Is there any chance that the -10% laser cap usage bonus will be looked at while you're rebalancing T1 ships? It's something that you guys probably want to address sooner or later, and in this case, sooner would save you some work.
Its a perfectly good bonus. Particularly on hulls that cant really fit a cap booster.
|
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:07:00 -
[37] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Like I said, some plans have changed in the past few months. The Navitas will be in the last set of frigates we reveal, but it's no longer planned as a drone damage frigate.
I'm looking forward to that last reveal most of all. Running the latest design past the CSM now, will get it to you asap.
NOOOOOOO! I wanted the Tristan as a missile boat and the Navitas as a Drone boat. Please reconsider. This is worth protesting over.
Also I am sicking the CSM on you:
https://twitter.com/aideronrobotics/status/236100917680803841
https://twitter.com/aideronrobotics/status/236101435492802560
https://twitter.com/aideronrobotics/status/236100917680803841 |
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:10:00 -
[38] - Quote
Now I am getting the people that brought the frill back to help:
https://twitter.com/aideronrobotics/status/236102442129960960 |
Marian Devers
Rage and Terror
Against ALL Authorities
4
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:12:00 -
[39] - Quote
I assumed that the current t1 frigates already on TQ (Merlin, Rifter, etc.) would offer close-range brawlers, while these three would be long range ships - with long-range weapons. Beams, Railguns, Blasters.
As far as I can see, only the Kestrel can utilize long-range weapons effectively. Why aren't the Tristan/Breacher being redefined as Rail/Arty kitting ships? |
Omnathious Deninard
Extrinsic Operations
43
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
Missiles aside, does the navitas not look like it should be a drone ship? |
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:16:00 -
[41] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Missiles aside, does the navitas not look like it should be a drone ship?
Exactly! It looks like the Vexor and Dominix. Well at least the lines of the ship. |
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:19:00 -
[42] - Quote
Also drone tracking speed? This thing is suppose to be a drone sniper with one sentry? It can't even fit two of them. Please go back to the drawing board with this one. |
Michael Harari
The Hatchery
Team Liquid
236
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:24:00 -
[43] - Quote
Marcel Devereux wrote:Also drone tracking speed? This thing is suppose to be a drone sniper with one sentry? It can't even fit two of them. Please go back to the drawing board with this one.
No? Its designed as a frigate brawler. The drone tracking bonus increases dps vs frigates and other light drones |
Omnathious Deninard
Extrinsic Operations
43
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:26:00 -
[44] - Quote
I agree that drone tracking is a very useful bonus to light drones |
Harvey James
Prospero's Sight
7
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:29:00 -
[45] - Quote
actually its ingenious what ccp fozzie has done it allows the tristan to either use rail/sentry combo or blasters/lights. |
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:32:00 -
[46] - Quote
Are these meant to be brawlers? I think these are meant to be ranged ships. Look at the stats compared to the close range combat frigates. These are slower and the Tristan has one less tank slot. |
Nagarythe Tinurandir
Catholic School for Boys
A Point In Space
39
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:37:00 -
[47] - Quote
Marcel Devereux wrote:Are these meant to be brawlers? I think these are meant to be ranged ships. Look at the stats compared to the close range combat frigates. These are slower and the Tristan has one less tank slot.
not "these". breacher and kestrel are designed for medium to long range.
the tristan looks atm like it could do both. the missing slot is strange though. maybe an oversight? |
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:39:00 -
[48] - Quote
In fact the Tristan is slower than the Tormentor and Punisher in addition to the one less tank slot (every other combat frigate has 10 slots on the Tristan only 9). |
X Gallentius
Justified Chaos
401
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:40:00 -
[49] - Quote
Marcel Devereux wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Missiles aside, does the navitas not look like it should be a drone ship? Exactly! It looks like the Vexor and Dominix. Well at least the lines of the ship.
There's an easy fix for this. :)
From:
Tristan:
Frigate skill bonuses:
7.5% Bonus to Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level
10% Bonus to Drone tracking speed and hitpoints per level
To
Navitas:
Frigate skill bonuses:
7.5% Bonus to Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level
10% Bonus to Drone tracking speed and hitpoints per level
|
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:41:00 -
[50] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:Marcel Devereux wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Missiles aside, does the navitas not look like it should be a drone ship? Exactly! It looks like the Vexor and Dominix. Well at least the lines of the ship. There's an easy fix for this. :) From: Tristan: Frigate skill bonuses: 7.5% Bonus to Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level 10% Bonus to Drone tracking speed and hitpoints per level To Navitas: Frigate skill bonuses: 7.5% Bonus to Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level 10% Bonus to Drone tracking speed and hitpoints per level
Approved. |
Michael Harari
The Hatchery
Team Liquid
236
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:42:00 -
[51] - Quote
I dont really see how it makes any difference at all. |
Omnathious Deninard
Extrinsic Operations
43
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:44:00 -
[52] - Quote
Marcel Devereux wrote:X Gallentius wrote:Marcel Devereux wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Missiles aside, does the navitas not look like it should be a drone ship? Exactly! It looks like the Vexor and Dominix. Well at least the lines of the ship. There's an easy fix for this. :) From: Tristan: Frigate skill bonuses: 7.5% Bonus to Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level 10% Bonus to Drone tracking speed and hitpoints per level To Navitas: Frigate skill bonuses: 7.5% Bonus to Hybrid Turret tracking speed per level 10% Bonus to Drone tracking speed and hitpoints per level Approved.
I second this approval |
Omnathious Deninard
Extrinsic Operations
43
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 14:54:00 -
[53] - Quote
@CCP Fozzie while I like mystery, if you could say at least weather the new navitas design will be used as a drone ship, it yes I think we will be happy with the Tristan. |
Grideris
Fleet Coordination Commission
Fleet Coordination Coalition
244
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:14:00 -
[54] - Quote
Marcel Devereux wrote:In fact the Tristan is slower than the Tormentor and Punisher in addition to the one less tank slot (every other combat frigate has 10 slots on the Tristan only 9).
It doesn't have one less tank slot. It has one less High slot, and that's only because it has a whole bunch of drones. And most Gallente ships have one low traded for a mid compared to Amarrian ships.
I say Tristan being a drone boat is awesome. Less missiles on Gallente, more drones!
And why are people getting so worked up about the Drone boat slot being passed to the Tristan rather than the Navitis? There's absolutely nothing wrong with that! do still wonder about what the Navitis is going to be though, but we'll have to wait and see.
http://www.dust514.org - the unofficial forum for everything DUST 514
http://www.dust514base.com - the blog site with everything else DUST 514 you need
|
Gypsio III
Chemikals
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
320
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:16:00 -
[55] - Quote
Takeshi Yamato wrote:CCP Fozzie
Is there any chance that the -10% laser cap usage bonus will be looked at while you're rebalancing T1 ships? It's something that you guys probably want to address sooner or later, and in this case, sooner would save you some work.
It would be a complete waste of time to pause Tiericide to rework Amarr ships - many of which are balanced fine with the cap use bonus - and then have to rework them again when the delayed Tiericide was resumed. |
Zoofelynn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:18:00 -
[56] - Quote
How come "small" balance changes have to come along a big expansion? Why not just continuously balance and put these changes and other upcoming balance changes into small patches that can be applied during a regular maintenance?
To be fair, it doesn't take months to come up with the changes currently suggested. With this pace it's gonna take until 2020 before all ships have been looked at. |
mkint
869
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:28:00 -
[57] - Quote
So... Tristan is going to be a better drone boat than ishkur? Same bandwidth plus drone bonuses. |
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
132
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:29:00 -
[58] - Quote
Grideris wrote:Marcel Devereux wrote:In fact the Tristan is slower than the Tormentor and Punisher in addition to the one less tank slot (every other combat frigate has 10 slots on the Tristan only 9). It doesn't have one less tank slot. It has one less High slot, and that's only because it has a whole bunch of drones. And most Gallente ships have one low traded for a mid compared to Amarrian ships. I say Tristan being a drone boat is awesome. Less missiles on Gallente, more drones! And why are people getting so worked up about the Drone boat slot being passed to the Tristan rather than the Navitis? There's absolutely nothing wrong with that! do still wonder about what the Navitis is going to be though, but we'll have to wait and see.
I would like one missile ship in Gallente other than the Nemesis. I'm not saying less drone ships. What I am saying is that the Navitas looks like a space fish like the Vexor and Dominix. The Tristan does not.
I'm not sure how you are counting but the Tristan does have one less slot than the other ships. This would be a low slot not a high slot. |
Grideris
Fleet Coordination Commission
Fleet Coordination Coalition
244
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:30:00 -
[59] - Quote
mkint wrote:So... Tristan is going to be a better drone boat than ishkur? Same bandwidth plus drone bonuses.
For now that will be the case. Ishkur will still be tougher and do more damage itself, but I'm hoping they add the same bonus to the Ishkur (it currently only has the drone HP bonus, no drone tracking).
http://www.dust514.org - the unofficial forum for everything DUST 514
http://www.dust514base.com - the blog site with everything else DUST 514 you need
|
Brunaburh
Aurora Security
NZAU Alliance
60
|
Posted - 2012.08.16 15:39:00 -
[60] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Bouh Revetoile wrote:This Tristan look nice ; though I thought the navitas should be a drone boat ; which role will the navitas have ? Drone brawler ?
Is the bonus of the Kestrel for all missiles ? Or only for kinetic ones ? All missiles. It's a break from the usual Caldari bonuses but in this case we felt it was appropriate. Spugg Galdon wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Like I said, some plans have changed in the past few months. The Navitas will be in the last set of frigates we reveal, but it's no longer planned as a drone damage frigate. Then I'm sorry CCP Fozzie. I'm going to have to "unlike" this purely for the Tristen having no synergy with it's T2 counterpart. I don't know what the final plan is for the Tristan and the Navitas but I do really like the idea of the Kestrel and Breecher being so different but the same. WTB Drone Navitas and Missile Tristan if possible  We didn't like giving Gallente a missile bonused t1 frigate and then leaving them with a stealth bomber (for which skills in rockets and light missiles actually have 0 impact) as the only possible upgrade.
So what's the point of having a Gallente T2 stealth bomber at all?
Seriously, you've now laid out that there isn't a single Gallente frigate that requires any missile skills. The whole "racial" combat platform of drones + blasters sounds good in your head maybe, but doesn't make sense from a gameplay standpoint. Blaster boats have to be point blank and are armor tanked, so are slow to get into range and do their damage. Drone - focused boats aren't practical in PvP unless you are a suicide PVP player, because of drone recall times in GTFO situations. You've taken one of the most offensive ships in the Gallente frigate fleet and crippled it.
In addition, you've now set up a good number of Gallente T2 frigates to be suboptimal straight off of the T1 frigates. due to a lack of any missile boats. Gallente have always had a harder time due to mixed platform training for weapons (drones, guns, missiles) and now you take away one of the useful cross-train paths. Seriously, think about it.
Just a reminder about the supposed upgrade to the Tristan:
Name: Nemesis
Hull: Tristan Class
Role: Stealth Bomber
Specifically engineered to fire torpedoes, stealth bombers represent the next generation in covert ops craft. The bombers are designed for sneak attacks on large vessels with powerful missile guidance technology enabling the torpedoes to strike faster and from a longer distance.
Developer: Duvolle Laboratories
Duvolle Labs manufactures sturdy ships with a good mix of offensive and defensive capabilities. Being the foremost manufacturer of particle blasters, its ships tend to favor turrets and thus have somewhat higher power output than normal.
Gallente Frigate Skill Bonus:
10% bonus to torpedo explosion velocity and flight time per level
20% bonus to torpedo velocity per level
To even touch this ship now you have to train a month of missile skills that have no bearing whatsoever to any other gallente frigate. |
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