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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 57	Posted - 2011.11.14 13:40:00 - [421] - Quote The Naga needs more PG. In order to fit large hybrids (even best named with lowest fitting reqs) you have to severely gimp your setup, I'm not talking about tank either.
Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 57	Posted - 2011.11.14 13:45:00 - [422] - Quote Pinky Denmark wrote: That is bull*** - Proteus is the singlehanded most heavily buffertanked T3 cruiser in the game even more tank than a Legion. Also it has a divine tackling bonus easily capable of working with armor fleets. That said however I'm tired of hearing "optimal bonus is a damage bonuse" talk about Caldari because range plays little to no role in current battles and it makes it impossible to mix stuff like the rokh because of difference in range and huge difference in damage/volley damage. dammit!!! Hilarious thing of note here- I do more DPS with LR ammo such as Iridium or Tungsten than I do with Antimatter even within optimal. I don't know if the numbers are skewed or if tracking just inheriently sucks that bad.

CCP Ytterbium C C P C C P Alliance 41	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:08:00 - [423] - Quote Here is the latest update on these ships: NAGA Missile role removed, now focuses as a hybrid platform 10% Torpedo velocity per level swapped for 5% to Large Hybrid Turret damage per level As pointed out, even with the velocity bonus, torpedoes have a too short of a range to be useful in practical situation with the Naga since it has the lowest mobility of all tier 3 battlecruisers and quite poor defensive options. Aligning this ship into a missile platform would have required a long range option as well, meaning the use of cruise missiles, which created a certain number of issues. Specializing for a hybrid long range platform made more sense with the Naga role, which is why the damage bonus was appealing, especially when combined with CCP Tallest changes; it also makes more sense regarding Caldari tier philosophy, where highest tech 1 tiers usually are hybrid platforms (Merlin, Moa, Rokh). TALOS 25m3 dronebay and bandwidth added Even if quite in opposition with the tier 3 battlecruiser role design, it adds an edge this ship needs over the other variants, especially since the Naga now it does the same damage with Hybrids. So, while we are looking at the blaster situation, we agreed giving the Talos a bit more survability against smaller threats was a good compromise for the time being. TORNADO Large Projectile Turret Falloff reduced from 10 to 5% per level The reason for this reduction was mainly due to the range falloff reaches on autocannons when combined with the proper rigs, Barrage and Tracking Enchancers, dwarfing blasters in the close range department; we will see how the situation evolves and possibly make further changes to compensate. Also, please note some small powergrid/CPU changes may happen to the tier 3 battlecruisers in the next build. Thanks for your time.

Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 59	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:10:00 - [424] - Quote CCP Ytterbium, you still need to boost the PG on the Naga. Please. Not much, but enough to be able to fit the shp properly. I like the role change... in testing we all found that the torpedo role didn't work at all but the hybrid platform showed some promise. edit: just saw your last line... good stuff
Yvan Ratamnim Phoenix Evolved Part Duo 48	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:29:00 - [425] - Quote Interesting changes, but honestly was hoping to see a more focus on torpedo's to make the naga the heavy bomber style platform... though now the issue arises of the naga vs the talos... choices choices.
Moonaura Swedish Aerospace Inc The Kadeshi 11	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:33:00 - [426] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Here is the latest update on these ships: NAGA Missile role removed, now focuses as a hybrid platform 10% Torpedo velocity per level swapped for 5% to Large Hybrid Turret damage per level As pointed out, even with the velocity bonus, torpedoes have a too short of a range to be useful in practical situation with the Naga since it has the lowest mobility of all tier 3 battlecruisers and quite poor defensive options. Aligning this ship into a missile platform would have required a long range option as well, meaning the use of cruise missiles, which created a certain number of issues. Specializing for a hybrid long range platform made more sense with the Naga role, which is why the damage bonus was appealing, especially when combined with CCP Tallest changes; it also makes more sense regarding Caldari tier philosophy, where highest tech 1 tiers usually are hybrid platforms (Merlin, Moa, Rokh). Thanks for the update Ytterbium. Will the Rokh and other Caldari boats get a 5% per level bonus? I would prefer the Rokh to get more tank over damage, but if it gets nothing, it will be out gunned, out DPS's by it's smaller cousin by 25% while costing the price of a top end Battleship. I know it has a better tank, but it also has a massive signature, very slow speed and it's tank and it won't be worth taking it out. It already isn't used... so... please buff the hybrid boats along with the hybrid changes. As for the gallente, I can see those pilots going off on one I can see it now... prepare for EMO RAGE LOL
Phantomania Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos 6	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:41:00 - [427] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Here is the latest update on these ships: NAGA Missile role removed, now focuses as a hybrid platform 10% Torpedo velocity per level swapped for 5% to Large Hybrid Turret damage per level As pointed out, even with the velocity bonus, torpedoes have a too short of a range to be useful in practical situation with the Naga since it has the lowest mobility of all tier 3 battlecruisers and quite poor defensive options. Aligning this ship into a missile platform would have required a long range option as well, meaning the use of cruise missiles, which created a certain number of issues. Specializing for a hybrid long range platform made more sense with the Naga role, which is why the damage bonus was appealing, especially when combined with CCP Tallest changes; it also makes more sense regarding Caldari tier philosophy, where highest tech 1 tiers usually are hybrid platforms (Merlin, Moa, Rokh). Sweet, thx for screwin over all those focused Missile pilots, appreciated! Those that have focused Hybrid Skills now have a choice of 2 new ships! Typical CCP!
Pattern Clarc Aperture Harmonics 290	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:44:00 - [428] - Quote Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction
Naomi Knight Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 37	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:44:00 - [429] - Quote Oh nice changes Ytterbium, looks like you at ccp read the threads after all. For those who qq about no more missiles , torp fitted was useless anyway or would be needed like +3 bonuses just to make them viable. Oh and saying that missile users ****** up is nonsense, there is still the drake or raven for that.
Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 60	Posted - 2011.11.14 16:55:00 - [430] - Quote Phantomania wrote: Sweet, thx for screwin over all those focused Missile pilots, appreciated! Those that have focused Hybrid Skills now have a choice of 2 new ships! Typical CCP! You have the Drake which does the job of the Naga with a tank. What are you smoking? Have you even tried to use a torp Naga? It's worthless because of the range.

Phantomania Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos 6	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:01:00 - [431] - Quote Naomi Knight wrote: Oh nice changes Ytterbium, looks like you at ccp read the threads after all. For those who qq about no more missiles , torp fitted was useless anyway or would be needed like +3 bonuses just to make them viable. Oh and saying that missile users ****** up is nonsense, there is still the drake or raven for that. Nice for you, I'm sure you'll have a nice new Ship Model that you can make use of! I guess I'll have to stick with my Tengu which costs $$$$ Once again, Thx CCP!
Phantomania Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos 6	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:02:00 - [432] - Quote Vincent Gaines wrote: Phantomania wrote: Sweet, thx for screwin over all those focused Missile pilots, appreciated! Those that have focused Hybrid Skills now have a choice of 2 new ships! Typical CCP! You have the Drake which does the job of the Naga with a tank. What are you smoking? Have you even tried to use a torp Naga? It's worthless because of the range. Nice for you, I'm sure you'll have a nice new Ship Model that you can make use of! I guess I'll have to stick with my Tengu which costs $$$$ Once again, Thx CCP!
Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 60	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:06:00 - [433] - Quote Phantomania wrote: Nice for you, I'm sure you'll have a nice new Ship Model that you can make use of! I guess I'll have to stick with my Tengu which costs $$$$ Once again, Thx CCP! DRAKE. TENGU GOLEM RAVEN ROOK SCORPION WIDOW HAWK HOOKBILL GILA CARACAL CERB Get over yourself. Dedicated hybrid ships: Rokh Moa Eagle A torp Naga is WORTHLESS. It can't do anything in PvP and would be stupid in PvE. Christ have you even tried flying one?
Hellen Bach Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 8	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:18:00 - [434] - Quote \o/ Hooray for Naga as a focused hybrid platform :)
Pattern Clarc Aperture Harmonics 290	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:30:00 - [435] - Quote Vincent Gaines wrote: Phantomania wrote: Nice for you, I'm sure you'll have a nice new Ship Model that you can make use of! I guess I'll have to stick with my Tengu which costs $$$$ Once again, Thx CCP! DRAKE. TENGU GOLEM RAVEN ROOK SCORPION WIDOW HAWK HOOKBILL GILA CARACAL CERB Get over yourself. Dedicated hybrid ships: Rokh Moa Eagle A torp Naga is WORTHLESS. It can't do anything in PvP and would be stupid in PvE. Christ have you even tried flying one? Quit falling for the obvious troll. Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction
Joe D'Trader Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 34	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:32:00 - [436] - Quote NO!!!! I don't want yet another hybrid ship, I want to be able to fire 8 torpedos.
Phantomania Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos 6	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:38:00 - [437] - Quote Vincent Gaines wrote: Phantomania wrote: Nice for you, I'm sure you'll have a nice new Ship Model that you can make use of! I guess I'll have to stick with my Tengu which costs $$$$ Once again, Thx CCP! DRAKE. TENGU GOLEM RAVEN ROOK SCORPION WIDOW HAWK HOOKBILL GILA CARACAL CERB Get over yourself. Dedicated hybrid ships: Rokh Moa Eagle A torp Naga is WORTHLESS. It can't do anything in PvP and would be stupid in PvE. Christ have you even tried flying one? Hybrid Ships w/ Hybrid bonus: Rokh Vulture Ferox Eagle Falcon Moa Cormorant Harpy Raptor Bantam Merlin Daredevil Vigilant Vindicator + Most Gallente Ships could have had cruise missiles, Talos gets drones!!!
Face612 Predator's Inc. 0	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:40:00 - [438] - Quote This just makes the Naga a Rokh with a far less favorable tank. Rokh: 10% to hybrid range 5% to shield resists. Naga: 10% to hybrid range 5% to hybrid damage. With the prices bound to be similar between them and the speed of the Naga not being it's selling point, what benefit is there to having the Naga over the Rohk? If the Naga could be used as a high speed blaster or torp boat it would give it an applicable role, smash and grab assault. Wit this ballancing the Naga does no better in cap or BS warfare than the Rokh which can stay in the fight a lot longer due to it's tank, increased PG and similar price/skills. IMHO, the Naga is out of place with this bonus set, simply making it a less favorable version of the tier three BS and no real individual role.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts 99	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:47:00 - [439] - Quote Face612 wrote: This just makes the Naga a Rokh with a far less favorable tank. Rokh: 10% to hybrid range 5% to shield resists. Naga: 10% to hybrid range 5% to hybrid damage. With the prices bound to be similar between them and the speed of the Naga not being it's selling point, what benefit is there to having the Naga over the Rohk? If the Naga could be used as a high speed blaster or torp boat it would give it an applicable role, smash and grab assault. Wit this ballancing the Naga does no better in cap or BS warfare than the Rokh which can stay in the fight a lot longer due to it's tank, increased PG and similar price/skills. IMHO, the Naga is out of place with this bonus set, simply making it a less favorable version of the tier three BS and no real individual role. Rokh - 120 mill, very slow, poor agility Naga - 50 mill, considerably faster and more agile, and 25% more damage than the Rokh. Naga gets damage and mobility, Rokh gets EHP. That almost sounds balanced! Being a high-speed assault boat is not the Naga's job, that's what the Talos is there for.
Pattern Clarc Aperture Harmonics 290	Posted - 2011.11.14 17:47:00 - [440] - Quote More turret DPS??? Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction

Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts 99	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:28:00 - [441] - Quote CCP Ytterbium wrote: Here is the latest update on these ships: NAGA Missile role removed, now focuses as a hybrid platform 10% Torpedo velocity per level swapped for 5% to Large Hybrid Turret damage per level This is good. The Naga makes sense as a rail platform now, there's a reason to use it. Previously, the damage bonus of the Talos meant that it was pretty easy to get the Talos to outdamage the Naga at what counts for long range these days. Of course, the former Tornado wiped the floor with them both, but now the falloff bonus reduction means that a rail Naga actually gets a damage advantage at a useful range, relative to the others. The arty Tornado gets alpha, selectable damage and no-cap-use, the tachyOracle gets instant ammo swaps and good tracking, the Naga finally gets good raw DPS. Does the Talos still looks a bit weak, though, really? The drones help give it a damage advantage close up, but it's really a one-trick pony, and having to go inside tackle range to apply your blaster DPS isn't a particularly great trick. Especially when the Tornado is also still quite good at that trick.
Phantomania Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos 6	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:35:00 - [442] - Quote Ignore my previous posts, just been on SiSi. The GFX and Space depth are awesome, I can live without the Naga ;P Nice Job CCP!
Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 63	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:46:00 - [443] - Quote Phantomania wrote: Hybrid Ships w/ Hybrid bonus: Rokh Vulture Ferox Eagle Falcon Moa Cormorant Harpy Raptor Bantam Merlin Daredevil Vigilant Vindicator + Most Gallente Ships could have had cruise missiles, Talos gets drones!!! Bonuses thrown in for ***** & giggles don't count: Vulture - command ship not rail DPS platform Ferox - used as missile platform (split system) Falcon - rails used for km whoring, not DPS... EW ship Cormorant - lol Harpy - more useful with blasters, Taranis can take it down. Raptor - lol x 2 but I'll give you that Bantam - wtf Merlin - split Daredevil - blaster bonused Vigilant - blaster bonused Vindi - blaster bonused a cruise platform on the Naga? yeah, um...
BarryBonez Ixion Defence Systems Tactical Narcotics Team 5	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:49:00 - [444] - Quote so what was wrong with increasing the torpedo velocity to 20 or 30% per level?
oldmanst4r oldmanst4r's Corporation 25	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:52:00 - [445] - Quote Amazing, with the 50% range and 25% damage boost, large blasters are nearly a viable weapons system.
Phantomania Alien Ship Builders Caedite Eos 6	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:54:00 - [446] - Quote Vincent Gaines wrote: Phantomania wrote: Hybrid Ships w/ Hybrid bonus: Rokh Vulture Ferox Eagle Falcon Moa Cormorant Harpy Raptor Bantam Merlin Daredevil Vigilant Vindicator + Most Gallente Ships could have had cruise missiles, Talos gets drones!!! Bonuses thrown in for *** & giggles don't count: Vulture - command ship not rail DPS platform Ferox - used as missile platform (split system) Falcon - rails used for km whoring, not DPS... EW ship Cormorant - lol Harpy - more useful with blasters, Taranis can take it down. Raptor - lol x 2 but I'll give you that Bantam - wtf Merlin - split Daredevil - blaster bonused Vigilant - blaster bonused Vindi - blaster bonused a cruise platform on the Naga? yeah, um... Previous Post- I don't care! You can stick it far enough up your A that it reaches your mouth and you can chew it for a couple of hours!!!!
xxxak Intergalactic Syndicate Nulli Secunda 65	Posted - 2011.11.14 19:06:00 - [447] - Quote Why is this so hard... Just make blasters far more similar to lasers than they currently are. Give them more range, and similar DPS. Yes, it makes them less unique.... But anything else is simply broken/unfair/stupid/silly. You are smart people.. why is this so hard? Gameplay > silly background story Nerfing supers is not going to help the N+1/Blob problem. It will just mean that superpilots will be even more likely to want to blob. Think more creatively. Support the idea of a subcap "assault bomber."
Vincent Gaines Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi 63	Posted - 2011.11.14 19:18:00 - [448] - Quote Phantomania wrote: Previous Post- I don't care! You can stick it far enough up your A** that it reaches your mouth and you can chew it for a couple of hours!!!! Shouldn't you be playing MW3 with the rest of the 13 year olds?
Master Akira Shiva Morsus Mihi 2	Posted - 2011.11.14 19:43:00 - [449] - Quote So Naga was useless as torp platform because of range, and so it's best to completely remove the only missile platform from this line of ships than to balance around the torp/cruise range... It's ok, I'll use it anyway if it's good enough so v0v And lol at the mouth-foamers in here saying "BUT YOU ALREADY HAVE THE DRAKE LOLOLOL".
Moonaura Swedish Aerospace Inc The Kadeshi 11	Posted - 2011.11.14 20:17:00 - [450] - Quote Gypsio III wrote: Face612 wrote: This just makes the Naga a Rokh with a far less favorable tank. Rokh: 10% to hybrid range 5% to shield resists. Naga: 10% to hybrid range 5% to hybrid damage. With the prices bound to be similar between them and the speed of the Naga not being it's selling point, what benefit is there to having the Naga over the Rohk? If the Naga could be used as a high speed blaster or torp boat it would give it an applicable role, smash and grab assault. Wit this ballancing the Naga does no better in cap or BS warfare than the Rokh which can stay in the fight a lot longer due to it's tank, increased PG and similar price/skills. IMHO, the Naga is out of place with this bonus set, simply making it a less favorable version of the tier three BS and no real individual role. Rokh - 120 mill, very slow, poor agility Naga - 50 mill, considerably faster and more agile, and 25% more damage than the Rokh. Naga gets damage and mobility, Rokh gets EHP. That almost sounds balanced! Being a high-speed assault boat is not the Naga's job, that's what the Talos is there for. Not sure if you are being ironic - but the Rokh tank numbers are not 'balanced' compared to their armor brethen; the Amarr Abaddon. Like the Rokh it also gets 5% resist bonus, but unlike the Rokh, it doesn't lose a tank slot to a MWD, and still has mid slots left for Cap Boost and a scram. The Rokh has to use those slots for tank and the low slots for cap stability and tracking, and with a like for like shield extender for plate etc - the Abaddon comes out at an average of 80% resists versus 75% on the Rokh, while having a vastly smaller signature, similar speed, longer range and more damage. Depending on how you want to fit it, you can end up with 70-150,000 EHP difference in tank numbers. Amarr also get, a damnation that can fit a 400,000 EHP buffer tank (yes, it can go that high) - that will increase with the new T2 gang links to even more, a guardian logistics ship with the smallest signature almost twice the EHP of the Basilisk, with a better overall fit, and a triage carrier with the best cap regeneration. Combined with lasers, this is why armor fleet gang = best fleet gang. The Caldari Hybrid boats should be level pegging with the Amarr, but the difference is quite vast in fleet viability at present because of the Vulture tank and signature / EHP size of the Basilisk. Even with the hybrid fixes Caldari pilots can only stare at the Drake and ECM boats as really useful in PvP.



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