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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
jurgen b
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:15:23 -
[391] - Quote
So nul sec groups roaming in FW systems, fighting FW members without gaining LP just for kills because they dont find that in nul sec, ok all good non complains, even tho they also dont gain LP by it. Nul sec groups, ganking in high sec and war dec in high sec because again they are bored in nul sec so they start to fight people who dont want to be in war in high sec. So maybe CCP tought, lets all combine everything from FW low and war decs and ganks in high all into 1 combined mechanic into nul sec because that is what people in nul sec search for, in LOW and high sec, so lets give them that. Is that plausible? If that was what people ware searching for in low and high sec, why do they complain when possible more action will happen. because that is what the nul sec peeps accoarding the forums wanted all along. Eve mercs can play a hugh part in this as well as attacker. you can rent a merc millitary force as attacker.
And also CCP stated it is open for feedback and tweaks will happen in the mechanics that is why they released the dev blog. so constructive feedback can happen and so everything can be tweaked and adjusted and good ideas go in and bad out again |
Apokolypse
Royal Black Watch Highlanders DARKNESS.
2
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:15:47 -
[392] - Quote
this is absolutely horrid. Noones doing FW so lets make sov resemble it so someone actually does it? Everyone in CSM who recommended this travesty of a system should be voted out in the coming elections. |
Adrie Atticus
Shadows of Rebellion The Bastion
913
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:15:57 -
[393] - Quote
Tiberian Deci wrote:X Gallentius wrote:xartin wrote:gment the nullsec playerbase as entire major regions of eve's active timezones will be excluded from participating in content.
Think from the perspective of an attacker wanting to capture alliance held space that is only vulnerable during EUtz.
UStz and AUtz will be completely excluded from any ability to be useful or participate. the same scenario would apply for defenders as well.
How is this different than properly stronting a timer, or a POCO timer? Defender picks his advantageous time, and everybody adjusts accordingly. BECAUSE OMG IT'S DIFFERENT AND HARD AND CCP ARE KILLING MY PLAYSTYLE AND MAKING SOV WORTHLESS!!!!!
No, sov is largerly worthless already, only thing the vast majority of buffer zones allow you to do is get an early warning that a Random Legion is knocking on your door.
Then again, I'm sure Test could live in a region full of -0.05's just because it's sov. |
Nyan Lafisques
Fairly Ganked
16
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:16:24 -
[394] - Quote
Heptameron wrote:So you took away hot drops You took away fast moving cap warfare You took away large supercap fights You gave me space aids
and now you effectively taken away offensive deployment away from my 'home'....
Oh but you have given the griefer in a kestrel a great tool to get their s**ts and giggles....
Nice CCP nice..... *slow clap*
If all your neighbors weren't blue you wouldn't need to "deploy away from your home". |
X Gallentius
Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop
2809
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:16:31 -
[395] - Quote
Tiberian Deci wrote:Quote:How is this different than properly stronting a timer, or a POCO timer? Defender picks his advantageous time, and everybody adjusts accordingly.
BECAUSE OMG IT'S DIFFERENT AND HARD AND CCP ARE KILLING MY PLAYSTYLE AND MAKING SOV WORTHLESS!!!!! It was an honest question. Players could come back with "Stront timers can be gamed - which leads to a chance of off-TZ defense", or "I'd be OK with this if the timers could be Constellation Based instead of universally applied to the entire alliance. Now my AUTZ buds in the alliance could have something to do."
JUSTK is recruiting.
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Olya Tsarev
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
5
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:17:02 -
[396] - Quote
Total Newbie wrote:Rowells wrote:Total Newbie wrote:Since the proposed change is out, I would think that the meeting minutes of The current CSM and it's members who are supporting this be published as well. The NDA seems to be null and void now. what makes you say that Transparency mate. Non-disclosure agreement should be null and void on the proposed changes, because CCP posted them here. CSM minutes as to who supported this should be published for all to see.
Well as I said earlier, I have proof Sion endorsed this change with the full details prior to the announcement today over on Goonfleet.com
Seems he is very supportive of these changes and is perfectly content with the breaking of his NDA since, as you said, it was released by CCP eventually. |
Total Newbie
Deadly Shadow Clan Executive Outcomes
28
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:17:03 -
[397] - Quote
Emmy Mnemonic wrote:Generally - interesting gameplay to be had! Nice work CCP, now you just need to tweak this a bit...
Pros: * Small gangs can take sov and will harass bigger entities empty sov-space (there is a LOT of totally empty sov-systems today!). Excellent! Using WHs to harass enemy sov will be done a lot! * Freeport station for 48h - awsome id+Ža! * Constellation-wide conflict - awsome! Making tactical use of the "geography" of constellations will be a key in caoturing sov - nice! * Non-scaling of entosis-modules - nice! A fleet of 1 or 1000 doesn't matter. Power to the solo/small-gangs!
Cons: * Small gangs will never be able to hold on to sov once they have taken it, but I guess that was never the thought with this anyway?! * This was supposed to be simpler than the current sov-grind?! My eyes bleed after all this text! ;-) * The "Primetime"-concept is a bit awkward - there is a big risk that certain Tz:s will never be part of any fun sov-harassment or serious sov-warfare. Also a "primetime" in a week-day is usually not the "primetime" in week-ends. Fights will always be within the Tz:s and that is a bit boring really. So rethink pls!
Questions: * Once a structure/station has a new owner; what will the default prime-time be set to? Will changing this default prime-time the first time always induce the 96h transition period where the structure has 2 vulnerability-periods during this transition? I think this might need a bit of rethinking too... * What determins the owning corp of a captured structure? Will it default to the executor corp of the alliance no matter what, or will it be the corp that had the "killing-entosis-cycle" or how will that work?
And the final most important question: * What the h*ll shall I use my Super Carrier for now?! Can't shoot POSes, no need to grind structures because "entosis", power-projection-nerfs effectively killed hotdropping capitals....Unsubbing is the best option, or does CCP plan to add some new "role" instead of the role of "main structure grinder"? DPS is not king anymore...(death to all supers - I know, I know! Just didn't expect CCP to kill them in this way!)
To add onto your post.... how does one transfer a station? The transferee uses his link and waits 96 hours?
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Cassandra Masami
Silnare Care Factor
0
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:17:42 -
[398] - Quote
I can foresee more I-Hubs and TCUs getting destroyed from these changes. Will some of the larger sov structures that require T1 freighters (like I-Hubs) to move around be reduced in size or even expense? |
Lena Lazair
Khanid Irregulars Khanid's Legion
267
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:18:54 -
[399] - Quote
Apokolypse wrote:this is absolutely horrid. Noones doing FW so lets make sov resemble it so someone actually does it? Everyone in CSM who recommended this travesty of a system should be voted out in the coming elections.
ATM, more people do FW than do sov structure grinds (some > none). Large coalition leaders are on record as stating that they won't be responsible for starting ANY war that could devolve into the horrible structure mechanic grind. Honestly, practically ANY system would be better than what exists now. This is a case where movement in any direction is better than standing still for CCP. Even if they get it completely wrong the first time around, it will shake things up and make other solutions more apparent. |
virm pasuul
Viziam Amarr Empire
214
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:20:14 -
[400] - Quote
If I was a dev I wouldn't ever read any post feedback thread until 48 hours after the dev blog. Better still lock it for 48 hours for the information to sink into people's skulls and percolate a little before posting. Then open the threads. So much throwing of toys out of prams. The price of toys in Jita is going through the roof.
If you are upset you should realise a few things:
It's not possible for one solution to make everyone happy. Some sort of best for everyone compromise is necessary.
Stagnation is bad for the game. Just because a crumb from top table drops in your lap occasionally does not means things should not change. Think of the wider picture of the game a a whole.
If **** ain't blowing up regularly what's the point in being rich? It becomes meaningless.
The devs laid out clear goals in the post. If you think they missed those goals, or can think of a better way to reach those goals then maybe explain your idea and reasoning. |
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Schmell
Russian Thunder Squad The Afterlife.
47
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:20:55 -
[401] - Quote
Man, chaos is coming.
What are gonna do with sov upgrades? They grow for like month, and won'be viable in current state when a system can switch owners like 3 times a week |
Tiberian Deci
Sleeper Slumber Party Test Alliance Please Ignore
62
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:21:21 -
[402] - Quote
Adrie Atticus wrote:Tiberian Deci wrote:X Gallentius wrote:xartin wrote:gment the nullsec playerbase as entire major regions of eve's active timezones will be excluded from participating in content.
Think from the perspective of an attacker wanting to capture alliance held space that is only vulnerable during EUtz.
UStz and AUtz will be completely excluded from any ability to be useful or participate. the same scenario would apply for defenders as well.
How is this different than properly stronting a timer, or a POCO timer? Defender picks his advantageous time, and everybody adjusts accordingly. BECAUSE OMG IT'S DIFFERENT AND HARD AND CCP ARE KILLING MY PLAYSTYLE AND MAKING SOV WORTHLESS!!!!! No, sov is largerly worthless already, only thing the vast majority of buffer zones allow you to do is get an early warning that a Random Legion is knocking on your door. Then again, I'm sure Test could live in a region full of -0.05's just because it's sov.
TEST can stand on it's own without aid from 15,000 other people too, collapsing 2 alliances into iself, and being under the thumb of Mittani too. Now if we are done measuring e-peen, sov isn't worthless. The people that own the majority of it have turtled up and decided that it's in their best interest to be friends and make money off of it without actually using it themselves. This is nerfing that, and will hopefully bring about a more active and dynamic sov ecosystem where gudfites are easily found and people deploying across the map for fights because they allied with everyone next door is a thing of the past. |
Destoya
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
368
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:21:51 -
[403] - Quote
To me the mechanics themselves aren't as the important as the single fact that you guys are finally giving the stagnated nullsec the shake it needs to wake up.
I commend CCP for making some truly radical changes, though waiting as long as you have with the current system was definitely a mistake in my opinion.
Not even mad that my 150bn of supercapitals are essentially left without a practical use from my initial understanding of the system. To all those complaining, yes some things aren't going to be as easymode as they were. However, please realize that the current state of sov is not healthy whatsoever, and that for the good of the game something needed to be done. |
X Gallentius
Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop
2810
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:21:59 -
[404] - Quote
Lena Lazair wrote:Even if they get it completely wrong the first time around, it will shake things up and ..... lead to more pew until they iterate on it.
Change is good. Proven to lead to more pew until ruthless optimization takes hold.
JUSTK is recruiting.
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M1k3y Koontz
Aether Ventures Surely You're Joking
656
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:24:11 -
[405] - Quote
virm pasuul wrote:Lots of tears in this thread. You should consider buying a crying permit before James sets his sights on 0.0.
The insults to the devs are a bit off. Try being more constructive and using more reasoning.
A level headed post?! Not in my EVE Online!
Seriously though, this thread is General Discussion bad.
How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
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Lena Lazair
Khanid Irregulars Khanid's Legion
267
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:26:01 -
[406] - Quote
Cassandra Masami wrote:I can foresee more I-Hubs and TCUs getting destroyed from these changes. Will some of the larger sov structures that require T1 freighters (like I-Hubs) to move around be reduced in size or even expense?
Why make it cheaper or easier to move expensive conflict drivers? Large alliances should still have the ability to do things small alliances cannot. In particular, things like the IHUB should allow large alliances to increase the player density their systems can support by virtue of the fact that placing and defending IHUBs in a station system will certainly take far more people and effort than dropping a TCU in a backwater constellation. It should remain a difficult and risky thing to do because an alliance willing and able to do this SHOULD get some benefit from doing so.
The point is that small alliances can hold sov without requiring an ihub. You can just drop a TCU and some POS's and have your little corner of space. The purpose is NOT to homogenize sov to the point that small alliance sov is just as powerful or meaningful as large alliance sov. |
Proton Stars
OREfull
23
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:26:05 -
[407] - Quote
M1k3y Koontz wrote:virm pasuul wrote:Lots of tears in this thread. You should consider buying a crying permit before James sets his sights on 0.0.
The insults to the devs are a bit off. Try being more constructive and using more reasoning. A level headed post?! Not in my EVE Online! Seriously though, this thread is General Discussion bad.
and the major em pires are yet to get involved!
When PL and goons decide which side of the line they sit on, thats when eve goes full retardo |
Tyr Dolorem
Snuff Box Snuffed Out
42
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:27:03 -
[408] - Quote
RIP any timezone that isn't US.... who thought that was a good idea, I wan't them to explain it to me. |
Olya Tsarev
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
5
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:28:15 -
[409] - Quote
Tyr Dolorem wrote:RIP any timezone that isn't US.... who thought that was a good idea, I wan't them to explain it to me.
Canadian Jesus did. Do you dare question the word of Christ our Lord? |
Aiwha
Infinite Point Nulli Secunda
826
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:28:30 -
[410] - Quote
Gypsien Agittain wrote:Aiwha wrote:Aight, here's a more serious post. I like the "command node" system. Spreading the actual fighting to the constelation vs several grids in the same system spreads out lag, adds a little more strategy, gives jump bridges and titans a little more use for defenders, its okay. "One sov structure per system", again, good idea. Cuts down on station spam, makes pve riskier, less structures, good idea. "Freeport mode" also a good idea, gives people a reasonable timeframe to organize actual move ops vs. installing a JC and waiting a month.
Now here's the bad ****. Timed "vulnerability". Bullshit. Everything should be vulnerable to people ******* with it all the time. Any TZ should be able to roam around reinforcing **** whenever they want. Now the actual reinforcement timers themselves should obviously stay, the defender gets to pick when they want to start the fight, but not when somebody wants to be a **** and turn off all your station stuff and/or reo a region.
Next up, the whole entosis module ****. This is just going to promote putting as many warm bodies into stabbed interceptors as possible and blitzing command nodes. Thats no fun. The entosis module needs to promote actual fleet fighting rather than 9k/s games of tag. A good compromise might be rendering an entosis ship completely immobile like a siege/triage which would promote taking and holding grid BEFORE you start flipping a command node.
Thirdly, Why should we attack/defend anything? Currently, the major reason to hold nullsec space is to rent it out. Because to be perfectly honest, when compared to other areas of EVE, null income is pretty goddamn ****. With our massive renter empire, N3 is able to squeeze out actual income for our pvp pilots and alliance operations, but without the scale of a rental empire, there's just no point in holding any sov at all. Most of the people who actually do "sov null" would just stop caring about sov at all, we're gonna end up staking out areas of NPC space to live in and pretty much making our own sov system. Hell, a good chunk of null already has alt in highsec farming incursions for our personal incomes. So whats the solution? BUFF NULL PVE. Give me a reason to want to carebear in nullsec. Because otherwise, farming incursions in highsec and running roams out of NPC null is a better way to live than earning shittastic nullbear income and playing interceptor tag ever day. Whats your opinion about Supercapitals use due to this changes?
Well, Titans are getting a use, as I mentioned, because mobile jump bridge? Hell yes. I'd say give them a bit more of a reduction on jump fatigue for bridged pilots but that's a number balancing thing. Supercarriers? They're in a sort of semi-****** space right now. As it stands, in the new system, supers get used to kill capitals and other supers. Now in the grand scheme of things, that could be more than enough, but dreads/carriers are also in this semi-****** space with supers in that they don't have a real use outside of a POS timer.
I see two options, either we have another massive rebuild of supers (remember when they were motherships?) to fill an entirely new role, or CCP needs to give capital warfare a BIG shot in the arm. Personally, I'm for buffing and expanding capital roles.
I want to be your representative for CSMX!
Please EVEmail me with any quesitons, comments or concerns you have about myself or EVE.
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Tyr Dolorem
Snuff Box Snuffed Out
42
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:30:13 -
[411] - Quote
Olya Tsarev wrote:Tyr Dolorem wrote:RIP any timezone that isn't US.... who thought that was a good idea, I wan't them to explain it to me. Canadian Jesus did. Do you dare question the word of Christ our Lord?
Are those the churches where they serve mapel syrup instead of wine?
I like those churches.
Go Canadian Jesus! |
Brakoo
Shiva Nulli Secunda
14
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:30:57 -
[412] - Quote
If we are going to have the military and industry indexes matter for the "occupancy" bonus I would like to see the way they are measured overhauled.
The Industry Index needs to include PI, Industry jobs run, and maybe even moon mining/reactions done in those systems to truly reflect usage.
The Military Index on that same note should include some kind of pilots in space metric, maybe Isk value of PVP ship kills or something along those lines.
In their current state the occupancy bonuses will just encourage compulsory PVE ops to increase defense levels. |
Aryndel Vyst
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
941
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:31:00 -
[413] - Quote
Olya Tsarev wrote:Total Newbie wrote:Rowells wrote:Total Newbie wrote:Since the proposed change is out, I would think that the meeting minutes of The current CSM and it's members who are supporting this be published as well. The NDA seems to be null and void now. what makes you say that Transparency mate. Non-disclosure agreement should be null and void on the proposed changes, because CCP posted them here. CSM minutes as to who supported this should be published for all to see. Well as I said earlier, I have proof Sion endorsed this change with the full details prior to the announcement today over on Goonfleet.com Seems he is very supportive of these changes and is perfectly content with the breaking of his NDA since, as you said, it was released by CCP eventually.
Sounds like you should report this to security and provide proof instead of being a big baby *****. |
Antillie Sa'Kan
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
932
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:31:04 -
[414] - Quote
Data and relic sites should contribute to the industry index if they are run by a member of the alliance that owns the system. This allows explorers to contribute to the system and gives a reason to interdict and defend said sites. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
1354
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:31:23 -
[415] - Quote
Proton Stars wrote:claw, 10mn mwd, snakes, 249km mod.
20k m/s. good luck keeping up or applying webs long enough with a cruiser gang I would like to see this fit, especially one that is A) cap stable and 2) can lock that far.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Iski Zuki DaSen
Icarus Academy
8
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:32:01 -
[416] - Quote
wtb iHubs 10m3 wtb upgrades 1m3 wtb tcu 5m3 at the price of 1 mil each also wtb upgrades that actually upgrade a crappy pve wise system to a system that actully can be used
also bb AU TZ peeps was nice playing with you
and gl taking sov from the Russians |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
2715
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:32:27 -
[417] - Quote
I love every one of those 7000+ words.
Ram it home.
Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
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Edward Olmops
DUST Expeditionary Team Good Sax
255
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:32:32 -
[418] - Quote
Gevlon Goblin wrote:The system is surprisingly good overall, but I see one critical problem: the price of Entosis links are low enough to allow trolling. I mean you park a throwaway ship next to the structure or command node and go AFK. If no one responds, you forced the owners into a command node whack-a-mole or took their home. If someone shows up, you lost a worthless ship.
We know that jump beacon gankers can kill capitals in the enemy staging system with 200+ in local, because everyone minds his own business. The VFK beacon was infamous for it. The same thing will happen here: a single attacker can take the IHUB from 200+ "defenders" as no one will interrupt his gameplay for a 30M kill report. So an FC must sit 4 hours every day on defense duty, grabbing players into the extremely boring job of "do N jumps because the station there is pinged, just to pop a single T1 cruiser. Now do N jump back, because the IHUB is on fire".
The problem is the extreme difference of risk on the sides: if the "attack" succeeds, the defender loses his home. If the "attack" fails, the attacker loses a T1 cruiser.
Since it comes up so often, I will address it. Yes, the change from grinding fleets to single "hacking" ships is HUGE. Yes, it has a great potential for trolling. But call it rather "knocking at the door and asking for a fight".
Many people have complained about the fixed 4-hour-window. I believe this fixed window (and please no larger than 4 hours) is a CRUCIAL and MANDATORY part of the whole plan.
CCP basically removes the "fleet size floor" for sov holders. To avoid the "500 Interceptors conquering nullsec in 1 day" scenario, you need some other limitation. This will be the small time window.
If your alliance wants to hold sov, you must be able to keep your space clean of enemies for 4 hours per day. Completely clean. If you fail to remove one ship or to respond to a small gang, you get timers. Those 4 hours are long for the defender and it's absolutely fair that the defender gets to choose them.
It's also ok if they are fixed, because I know the similar POCO mechanism quite well. If you need to defend a lot of POCOs and basically you are not willing, you will set the timers randomly to wear down the enemy without fighting yourself. The new system wants to prevent this, which is good.
However, I do see the problem. On the one hand, a small defending group (which should be viable in nullsec by design) cannot defend anything but a small time window in their own prime time. Period. No small window selectable by defender -> no small groups holding sov.
But it also works the other way round. If I am in a small group with only one prime time zone, I can hardly attack anything in a different timezone. This IS an issue.
Suggestion: FORCE alliances to choose one different time window for each constellation where they hold sov. -I am a small group, 1 timezone: I can hold sov in one constellation, people will have to fight in my prime time. -I want to be bigger and hold multiple constellations: I need to be able to defend multiple 4-hour-windows in different timezones -if I want to attack CFC or N3 with a small group, I will always find a constellation where they are vulnerable in my timezone. The other way round does not work. They have to fight me where I am strongest. -if 2 large entities battle each other, there will be all sorts of shenanigans. They will have to carefully choose which constellations get vulnerable in which timezone, but generally they will be vulnerable somewhere 24/7.
I really like the new approach. Sounds promising. I see many people in this thread though who fail to see the implications, because they are thinking in the old ways. |
MajorScrewup
Thundercats The Initiative.
7
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:33:23 -
[419] - Quote
Example...
'Unknown Corporation A' all start playing the game, learn how to fly ships together etc, recruit people from the same timezone that they play in (07:00 to 11:00 EvE Time) and generally all get along and become the best PvP's in the game.
Their corporation slowly builds to around 50 and decide that while fighting wars and PvPing in lo-sec is nice. They would like to expand and add some sov in nul-sec so that they can experience all the things that EvE offers.
They look around at all the regions nearest to them and see that the sov owners all play at a different time and have set their prime time for a time that none of them could log in for. They look further afield and then across the entire map and realize that they can never experience an attempt to gain sov as no-one has set a prime-time when this group of players can log in.
EvE Online: Experience Everything (except those currently in timezones that will never get to play or own sov) |
Candente
Navy Veteran Club
37
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Posted - 2015.03.03 18:33:40 -
[420] - Quote
This sounds and should actually be much better than structure grinds... but how it actually would turn out needs can only be judged after patch deployment.
I also think making Entosis module initially only for BS is a good start... the battleships need some love, and this is the perfect chance to reduce trolling the system with throwaway ships. |
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