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Zukira Al'Kalish	Posted - 2008.07.29 14:59:00 - [31] Edited by: Zukira Al''Kalish on 29/07/2008 15:00:03 The frequency of these complaints is just growing and growing right now because we have an influx of 14 - 17 year olds getting into the game. Here's some news folks. A Falcon couldn't do enough DPS to peel the paint off the side of a barn. Sure they can jam you, but then what are they goign to do? They cant' even crack a half decent tank. Sounds pretty effing scary. But there's this really crazy method for dealing with being jammed. Ever heard of FoF Missiles? Gee... seems to me you don't need a target lock to use those. What is it the falcon does again? Oh... right... it disrupts your target lock. Well, gee... it would seem to me that there's a simple method of negating the effects of the Falcon. Then there are the obvious ECCM modules... which you really should be fitting when you know/suspect you're goign to be comming across some evil b@st@rd with ECM. If you think about the fact that fitting a good rack of ECM on the Falcon ensures that the ship may as well be made of paper mache. You're GUARANTEED to be fighting a glass boat if it's a falcon with ECM. FoF FTW. In closing... OP needs to learn to rig their ship. If they can't wrap their mind around that, they should ask their mommy to stop paying for a big kids' game for them... maybe stick to something more their level... like colouring books.
Queen Ba'Ku The-Secret-Service Retribution.	Posted - 2008.07.29 14:59:00 - [32] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. Oh whatever you must be the 1% of eve who firstly counters ECM cos you just would not normally, secondly there are a few thousand agree with what i say, and yes falcons can permajam - FACT!
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:01:00 - [33] Edited by: Borat Sangdiev on 29/07/2008 15:02:14 Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish Edited by: Zukira Al''Kalish on 29/07/2008 15:00:03 The frequency of these complaints is just growing and growing right now because we have an influx of 14 - 17 year olds getting into the game. Here's some news folks. A Falcon couldn't do enough DPS to peel the paint off the side of a barn. Sure they can jam you, but then what are they goign to do? They cant' even crack a half decent tank. Sounds pretty effing scary. But there's this really crazy method for dealing with being jammed. Ever heard of FoF Missiles? Gee... seems to me you don't need a target lock to use those. What is it the falcon does again? Oh... right... it disrupts your target lock. Well, gee... it would seem to me that there's a simple method of negating the effects of the Falcon. Then there are the obvious ECCM modules... which you really should be fitting when you know/suspect you're goign to be comming across some evil b@st@rd with ECM. If you think about the fact that fitting a good rack of ECM on the Falcon ensures that the ship may as well be made of paper mache. You're GUARANTEED to be fighting a glass boat if it's a falcon with ECM. FoF FTW. In closing... OP needs to learn to rig their ship. If they can't wrap their mind around that, they should ask their mommy to stop paying for a big kids' game for them... maybe stick to something more their level... like colouring books. in closing, you need to realize that no one listened to the many counters to counter nano, so no one will use the counters to counter ECM. So, just nerf it.
Forced Evil	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:02:00 - [34] Edited by: Forced Evil on 29/07/2008 15:02:41 oh God, what a bunch of f.u.c.k.ing noobs
Ignatious Mei	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:03:00 - [35] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. You are correct. They can perma jam 3-4 ships 80 percent of the time though. And theres the problem. I said in the other post that we were arguing about (That you didn't refute by the way) That the thing you seem to be forgetting with the chance based is this. Even though you may not hit every jam cycle on every ship you hit a hell of a lot more then you miss. Your not taking into consideration that even if you miss a jam cycle the cycle time is fast enough that by the time the person you are jamming actually gets their target locked again and their guns back on your cycle time is just about up. So they may get off a salvo and then they are jammed again.
Callib Gor'Karrithe Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:03:00 - [36] Unfortunately, nanos were a problem resulting from the introduction of an additional modification for ships known as the Polycarbon Engine Housing. Do your research kiddo. The difference being counters for ECM as well as ECM have existed since the inception of the game. Learn to use the equipment that is out there, or go back to playing world of warcrack, kiddo. This game is for people who can use their brains, not little kids who want to cry and whine. Throwing temper tantrums only works to get you what you want from mommy.... not from CCP.
Malcanis We are Legend	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:05:00 - [37] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. you say it like they should be able to jam a single hac 100% of the time. they shouldnt be able to even get close to permajamming even a single ship. 60% of the time is fair. Nerf falcons/ECM. You're a troll or a fool. Either that or this is a masked nano-whine. I don't know which and a don't really care. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
SereneSally Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:06:00 - [38] Edited by: SereneSally on 29/07/2008 15:06:26 Originally by: Callib Gor'Karrithe Unfortunately, nanos were a problem resulting from the introduction of an additional modification for ships known as the Polycarbon Engine Housing. Do your research kiddo. The difference being counters for ECM as well as ECM have existed since the inception of the game. Learn to use the equipment that is out there, or go back to playing world of warcrack, kiddo. This game is for people who can use their brains, not little kids who want to cry and whine. Throwing temper tantrums only works to get you what you want from mommy.... not from CCP. I wish you lot would listen as a general setup for ships IT IS NOT VIABLE to be putting ECCMs on, simple as, you would need at least 2 if not more...Since when does anyone fit a ship to combat every eventuality they can be attacked by - so stop talking total rubbish.
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:08:00 - [39] Originally by: Callib Gor'Karrithe Unfortunately, nanos were a problem resulting from the introduction of an additional modification for ships known as the Polycarbon Engine Housing. Do your research kiddo. The difference being counters for ECM as well as ECM have existed since the inception of the game. Learn to use the equipment that is out there, or go back to playing world of warcrack, kiddo. This game is for people who can use their brains, not little kids who want to cry and whine. Throwing temper tantrums only works to get you what you want from mommy.... not from CCP. actually... this game is not for people who want to use their brains. Why?, because everything else that is good gets nerfed. Nerf Falcons too.
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:10:00 - [40] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. you say it like they should be able to jam a single hac 100% of the time. they shouldnt be able to even get close to permajamming even a single ship. 60% of the time is fair. Nerf falcons/ECM. You're a troll or a fool. Either that or this is a masked nano-whine. I don't know which and a don't really care. Here's your chance, you internet legend. Tell us why your ship should be able to take away another ship's ability to fight back, close to 100% of the time?

Broegitte Bardot BINFORD Solidus Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:20:00 - [41] range is the problem. it is totally possible to participate in long-range fleet fights in that thing, well beyond BS snipe range. that's a job for the scorpion, not some ship with a covert ops cloak. 220+ km w/ racial jammers can be considered invulnerable, with a speed nerf as is being tested right now even more so. but i could live with similar optimal bonuses for painters, dampeners and tracking disruptors. alt of Roemy Schneider (probably lacking game time again)
Rexthor Hammerfists The Movement	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:22:00 - [42] Originally by: Broegitte Bardot range is the problem. it is totally possible to participate in long-range fleet fights in that thing, well beyond BS snipe range. that's a job for the scorpion, not some ship with a covert ops cloak. 220+ km w/ racial jammers can be considered invulnerable, with a speed nerf as is being tested right now even more so. but i could live with similar optimal bonuses for painters, dampeners and tracking disruptors. Agreed, with the speedchanges ranges got a whole lot harder to cross and falcons staying 170km away harder to countger, ruining many good small fights - for both sides. - Any good reason for gateguns shooting drones and thus removing dronebased ships from pirating?
Trojanman190 D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:22:00 - [43] Why do people keep remaking these threads?
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:23:00 - [44] Originally by: Trojanman190 Why do people keep remaking these threads? why does anyone ever do anything? let's not get philisophical.
Malcanis We are Legend	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:27:00 - [45] Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. Oh whatever you must be the 1% of eve who firstly counters ECM cos you just would not normally, secondly there are a few thousand agree with what i say, and yes falcons can permajam - FACT! Falcons can't permajam anything HAC/BC or above - FACT! Falcons can be countered or mitigated by: drones long range guns long range missiles FoF missiles fast ships ECCM modules Sensor Integrity Gang Link (I use this myself, it's pretty sweet.) warping Assign a few light drones to an inty and put him on chase duty. He will completely negate the falcon, I promise you. How you can claim that such a fragile, limited ship is overpowered escapes me. They are are useful for fighting poorly prepared cookie-cutter DPS-fit gangs, though. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Xiaodown XERCORE	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:28:00 - [46] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Cahpimon so, what do you want it to be able to do? sit there and look cool? go back to the way it used to be, so it has a greater chance to miss a cycle. This, This, a THOUSAND TIMES This! Bumping the bonus on the falcon from 10% to 20% has had a hugely detrimental effect to warfare, especially considering that it's made the rook a worthless ship (whereas the rook used to be on top of its game, who would fly it now? it can't fly cloaked!). Put it back to 10%! -- Sig under construction.
Malcanis We are Legend	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:28:00 - [47] Originally by: Ignatious Mei Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. You are correct. They can perma jam 3-4 ships 80 percent of the time though. And theres the problem. I said in the other post that we were arguing about (That you didn't refute by the way) That the thing you seem to be forgetting with the chance based is this. Even though you may not hit every jam cycle on every ship you hit a hell of a lot more then you miss. Your not taking into consideration that even if you miss a jam cycle the cycle time is fast enough that by the time the person you are jamming actually gets their target locked again and their guns back on your cycle time is just about up. So they may get off a salvo and then they are jammed again. Perma-jam 4 ships? T1 frigates, perhaps. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Vanguard.	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:29:00 - [48] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. you say it like they should be able to jam a single hac 100% of the time. they shouldnt be able to even get close to permajamming even a single ship. 60% of the time is fair. Nerf falcons/ECM. You're a troll or a fool. Either that or this is a masked nano-whine. I don't know which and a don't really care. Here's your chance, you internet legend. Tell us why your ship should be able to take away another ship's ability to fight back, close to 100% of the time? It cant. I got myself jammed in my geddon by one of these and when it missed a cycle I got it down to half armour in just a few vollies. Lucky for him I didnt have my 3 heatsink setup so he got another cycle and managed to warp off. See a falcon can only solo up to a point. If it runs into anything with ECCM then its screwed, if it gets hit then it melts like butter, if it gets jammed itself its screwed, if it gets hit by heavy drones its screwed, if it meets a small gang its as good as a chocolate fireguard.
Malcanis We are Legend	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:31:00 - [49] Originally by: Xiaodown Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Cahpimon so, what do you want it to be able to do? sit there and look cool? go back to the way it used to be, so it has a greater chance to miss a cycle. This, This, a THOUSAND TIMES This! Bumping the bonus on the falcon from 10% to 20% has had a hugely detrimental effect to warfare, especially considering that it's made the rook a worthless ship (whereas the rook used to be on top of its game, who would fly it now? it can't fly cloaked!). Put it back to 10%! OK, but then it gets +75m/s base speed and -10 mass, plus an extra high-slot. Might as well make it a half-decent prober since it'll be worthless as a jammer. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Xiaodown XERCORE	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:34:00 - [50] Edited by: Xiaodown on 29/07/2008 15:34:59 Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish Edited by: Zukira Al''Kalish on 29/07/2008 15:00:03 The frequency of these complaints is just growing and growing right now because we have an influx of 14 - 17 year olds getting into the game. How's the view from up there on your pedestal? Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish But there's this really crazy method for dealing with being jammed. Ever heard of FoF Missiles? Gee... seems to me you don't need a target lock to use those. QUOTIN' SOMEONE WHO'S NEVER JAMMED OR BEEN JAMMED FROM 150KM AWAY!!!!LOL! Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish What is it the falcon does again? Oh... right... it disrupts your target lock. Well, gee... it would seem to me that there's a simple method of negating the effects of the Falcon. Then there are the obvious ECCM modules... which you really should be fitting when you know/suspect you're goign to be comming across some evil b@st@rd with ECM. If you think about the fact that fitting a good rack of ECM on the Falcon ensures that the ship may as well be made of paper mache. You're GUARANTEED to be fighting a glass boat if it's a falcon with ECM. FoF FTW. In closing... OP needs to learn to rig their ship. If they can't wrap their mind around that, they should ask their mommy to stop paying for a big kids' game for them... maybe stick to something more their level... like colouring books. Wow, dude. Seriously. Do you even play this game? If a falcon jams you from 150km away, what can you do? Your answers are 1.) gimp your setup with ECCM modules 2.) Kill the falcon. Ever chased a falcon down? As soon as he realizes you're headed for him, he disengages and cloaks. There is no other force recon in the game that can affect ships from as far away as a falcon. Pilgrim has no range bonus to NOS or tracking disruptor, rapier's webs can hit out to only 40km unless you're using faction or overloading, lachesis scrams can hit to what, 50-60km? Plus the lachesis doesn't shut down your ability to fight. No, the falcon is overpowered. It just is. Accept it, and then, gtfo. ~X -- Sig under construction.

Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:35:00 - [51] Originally by: baltec1 Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku tbh he has a point, they are way overpowered. Falcons can permajam a few ships at once basically rendering a fleet useless and thats just silly especially when some can jam way over 150km and cloak as well! no they aren't and no they can't. they can't even permajam a single HAC 100% of the time. So stop making things up because you cant be bothered to learn to counter them. you say it like they should be able to jam a single hac 100% of the time. they shouldnt be able to even get close to permajamming even a single ship. 60% of the time is fair. Nerf falcons/ECM. You're a troll or a fool. Either that or this is a masked nano-whine. I don't know which and a don't really care. Here's your chance, you internet legend. Tell us why your ship should be able to take away another ship's ability to fight back, close to 100% of the time? It cant. I got myself jammed in my geddon by one of these and when it missed a cycle I got it down to half armour in just a few vollies. Lucky for him I didnt have my 3 heatsink setup so he got another cycle and managed to warp off. See a falcon can only solo up to a point. If it runs into anything with ECCM then its screwed, if it gets hit then it melts like butter, if it gets jammed itself its screwed, if it gets hit by heavy drones its screwed, if it meets a small gang its as good as a chocolate fireguard. It's a must have ship that alot of players train on an alt account that they take with them when they "solo" pvp. Why? because it's an i-win ship for soloers, to compliment their main. needs to be nerfed.
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:37:00 - [52] Originally by: Xiaodown Edited by: Xiaodown on 29/07/2008 15:34:59 Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish Edited by: Zukira Al''Kalish on 29/07/2008 15:00:03 The frequency of these complaints is just growing and growing right now because we have an influx of 14 - 17 year olds getting into the game. How's the view from up there on your pedestal? Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish But there's this really crazy method for dealing with being jammed. Ever heard of FoF Missiles? Gee... seems to me you don't need a target lock to use those. QUOTIN' SOMEONE WHO'S NEVER JAMMED OR BEEN JAMMED FROM 150KM AWAY!!!!LOL! Originally by: Zukira Al'Kalish What is it the falcon does again? Oh... right... it disrupts your target lock. Well, gee... it would seem to me that there's a simple method of negating the effects of the Falcon. Then there are the obvious ECCM modules... which you really should be fitting when you know/suspect you're goign to be comming across some evil b@st@rd with ECM. If you think about the fact that fitting a good rack of ECM on the Falcon ensures that the ship may as well be made of paper mache. You're GUARANTEED to be fighting a glass boat if it's a falcon with ECM. FoF FTW. In closing... OP needs to learn to rig their ship. If they can't wrap their mind around that, they should ask their mommy to stop paying for a big kids' game for them... maybe stick to something more their level... like colouring books. Wow, dude. Seriously. Do you even play this game? If a falcon jams you from 150km away, what can you do? Your answers are 1.) gimp your setup with ECCM modules 2.) Kill the falcon. Ever chased a falcon down? As soon as he realizes you're headed for him, he disengages and cloaks. There is no other force recon in the game that can affect ships from as far away as a falcon. Pilgrim has no range bonus to NOS or tracking disruptor, rapier's webs can hit out to only 40km unless you're using faction or overloading, lachesis scrams can hit to what, 50-60km? Plus the lachesis doesn't shut down your ability to fight. No, the falcon is overpowered. It just is. Accept it, and then, gtfo. ~X so true. ^^
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Vanguard.	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:42:00 - [53] I have seen at the most 5 falcons in the past few months and only one has ended up killing me (with the help of 5 hugginns/rapiers) Not only are they rare but they are also not that fantastic. I only fit one ECCM since realy thats all I need, a 10-20 second window can be the end for a falcon. Also in fleet fights you might as well paint a giant crosshair on the hull and call it primary. I am just getting the feeling you are angry over the nerf of nano and want to vent your range on something else.
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:45:00 - [54] Originally by: baltec1 I have seen at the most 5 falcons in the past few months and only one has ended up killing me (with the help of 5 hugginns/rapiers) Not only are they rare but they are also not that fantastic. I only fit one ECCM since realy thats all I need, a 10-20 second window can be the end for a falcon. Also in fleet fights you might as well paint a giant crosshair on the hull and call it primary. I am just getting the feeling you are angry over the nerf of nano and want to vent your range on something else. what ship do you fly that you can kill a falcon from 150+ km away in 20 secs. Do you go small gang roaming in a rail BS? PS if you think falcons are rare, you really don't pvp much.
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:46:00 - [55] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev you say it like they should be able to jam a single hac 100% of the time. they shouldnt be able to even get close to permajamming even a single ship. 60% of the time is fair. Nerf falcons/ECM. Translation: Make it absolutely useless to fly them. Originally by: CCP Wrangler We are pleased to aim! Or was that the other way around?
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Vanguard.	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:54:00 - [56] Edited by: baltec1 on 29/07/2008 15:55:00 Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: baltec1 I have seen at the most 5 falcons in the past few months and only one has ended up killing me (with the help of 5 hugginns/rapiers) Not only are they rare but they are also not that fantastic. I only fit one ECCM since realy thats all I need, a 10-20 second window can be the end for a falcon. Also in fleet fights you might as well paint a giant crosshair on the hull and call it primary. I am just getting the feeling you are angry over the nerf of nano and want to vent your range on something else. what ship do you fly that you can kill a falcon from 150+ km away in 20 secs. Do you go small gang roaming in a rail BS? PS if you think falcons are rare, you really don't pvp much. my min apoc range is 180 km and I can tell you now, tachs will spoil any falcons day. Sure you wont get it in 20 seconds every time but each time it fails to get a jam you are going to do alot of damage. There is very little point in a falcon being 150km away when its solo anyway since if it does get you jammed it cant do anything else. So they must get into range to fire which means that it will often get in range of my geddon which again, is armed to the teeth and has an ECCM so it can resist jams better and get its firepower down. If I am in a small gang then the falcon stands no chance.
Malcanis We are Legend	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:54:00 - [57] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis "gimp your setup with ECCMs"? So... you'd support an ECCM script for a sensor booter then? That would answer that issue completely. Because I sincerely and from experience assure you that's it's really hard to jam an ECCm'd BS. A Falcon can really only carry 5 jammers (sensor booster, MWD, 5 ECMs = 7 mids). A typical fit is 1 of each kind. An ECCm'd sniper rokh can easily sling Spike L out to further than a Falc can jam, even if it could do much about a sensor strength of 44. Likewise an ECCM Cerb with sensor strength 32. The fact is, you get owned by Falcons because you refuse to take them into account when you're making your ship fittings. You just put your EFT-tastic short-range ships together and go out and get your ass kicked by balanced gangs led by FCs who know exactly how to deal with one-dimensional blobs like yours. Most unbelievably of all someone asks "why SHOULD a falcon be able to take a single ship out of the fight?" Um, because it's a ELECTRONIC WARFARE SHIP, perhaps? What the eff else is it supposed to be for you maroon? If some guy turns up in a falc, you need him to be able to take out 2-3 ships to be worth losing the DPS, tank and tackle that he is completely unable to contribute. I might just as well complain that a brutix is able to take my ship out of a fight with it's blasters and drones. And not just for 20 seconds, I might add. tl;dr: EvE PvP is about more than just DPS vs Tank. People don't setup their ship to take in account they chance meet an arazu with damps or a curse with a tracking disruptor. Why should a falcon be any different? Then those people - ie: you - are idiots. If someone fitted a ship which took no account of the fact that he might get hit by EM damage, then he got melted by an amarr ship, you'd give him no sympathy when he whined that fitting an EM hardner gimps his tank vs Kin/Therm/Exp. EW is in the game, so deal with it or continue to fail. Your call. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
supr3m3justic3 Caldari ACE'S OVER 8'S	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:54:00 - [58] EPIC FAIL, TROLL-O-NATOR __________________________________________________
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2008.07.29 15:58:00 - [59] Edited by: Dizeezer Velar on 29/07/2008 15:58:12 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Borat Sangdiev Originally by: Malcanis "gimp your setup with ECCMs"? So... you'd support an ECCM script for a sensor booter then? That would answer that issue completely. Because I sincerely and from experience assure you that's it's really hard to jam an ECCm'd BS. A Falcon can really only carry 5 jammers (sensor booster, MWD, 5 ECMs = 7 mids). A typical fit is 1 of each kind. An ECCm'd sniper rokh can easily sling Spike L out to further than a Falc can jam, even if it could do much about a sensor strength of 44. Likewise an ECCM Cerb with sensor strength 32. The fact is, you get owned by Falcons because you refuse to take them into account when you're making your ship fittings. You just put your EFT-tastic short-range ships together and go out and get your ass kicked by balanced gangs led by FCs who know exactly how to deal with one-dimensional blobs like yours. Most unbelievably of all someone asks "why SHOULD a falcon be able to take a single ship out of the fight?" Um, because it's a ELECTRONIC WARFARE SHIP, perhaps? What the eff else is it supposed to be for you maroon? If some guy turns up in a falc, you need him to be able to take out 2-3 ships to be worth losing the DPS, tank and tackle that he is completely unable to contribute. I might just as well complain that a brutix is able to take my ship out of a fight with it's blasters and drones. And not just for 20 seconds, I might add. tl;dr: EvE PvP is about more than just DPS vs Tank. People don't setup their ship to take in account they chance meet an arazu with damps or a curse with a tracking disruptor. Why should a falcon be any different? Then those people - ie: you - are idiots. If someone fitted a ship which took no account of the fact that he might get hit by EM damage, then he got melted by an amarr ship, you'd give him no sympathy when he whined that fitting an EM hardner gimps his tank vs Kin/Therm/Exp. EW is in the game, so deal with it or continue to fail. Your call. bzzzzzzzzzt. wrong. The answer to this question "People don't setup their ship to take in account they chance meet an arazu with damps or a curse with a tracking disruptor. Why should a falcon be any different?" is that falcons are overpowered vs other ewar, in range and effectiveness. Needs to be nerfed and there is no arguing it. I agree with OP. [/url]
Ruiryu Cosmic Castaways	Posted - 2008.07.29 16:20:00 - [60] Originally by: Queen Ba'Ku Something needs to be balanced seriously. I can jump into a system with 10 battleships vs 2 and say 2 falcons and still lose - ermmm....now thats wrong imo If this really did take place your fleet fails on the epic level, and your FC should quit the game. For all of those whining about the Falcon, have you ever flown one? Do you realize the amount of skills it takes to even get that lucky to get the so called perma-jam? You have to dedicate give the ship every freaking boosting mod and rig to even come close. With a multi-spec with perfect skills and having the ship fitted with nothing but the boosters and implants you get a 9 points worth of jam power. Your average BS is about 23 points in strength. You fit a racial you Might get 11 points. This is less then 50%, you toss on one ECCM mod and you can bet you will have no issues locking him up and setting him a blaze. A falcon is made of spit and tissue paper. Send a single interceptor after it and that falcon will run away. The falcon has 0 offense other then its ECM, all it can do is jam. I can fly it, have flown it, and hate it because thats all it can do, and it dies real easy. There are many counters to this ship such as the RSD, ECCM they have a mid slot and low slot version, if you equip just one of these to a BS, HAC, BC, Recon, I can say with 99% certainty that Falcon will be crying as it's ecms are gonna fail A LOT! The sword can only strike one enemy at a time, but tactics can defeat ten thousand men at once.



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