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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1311
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 21:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
As a CSM 7 member I am extremely disappointed with Mittens behavior at Fanfest this year.
The CSM should not only represent the players that elected them but also represent Eve itself to the general public. Mittens in the past has shown himself to be very adept at messaging both in and out of Eve. I can't believe he could have been so misguided in calling for harassment of a possibly suicidal player.
I understand we can expect all manner of crazy behavior at Fanfest and previous goon leaders at the alliance panel have certainly made themselves "controversial" but I think this incident violates a boundary between what happens in Eve and real world damage. Whether or not the player in question was suicidal isn't the point. The point is, in a world where cyber bullying is an emerging issue, we have a prominent figure in Eve clearly calling encourage a real life suicide. That can't be defended on ant level.
Mittens, I've supported the right for folks to act out in Eve as a valid part of the "sandbox", but I can't support your recent actions.
At a minimum we need Mittens to apologize and admit he crossed the line with his behavior. I call to the other elected members of the CM7 join me in this demand!
If the CSM is remain a viable part of Eve we have to adhere to some code of conduct. This recent event is a black eye for the CSM and Eve in general.
CSM 7 join me in protesting this disappointing public display of poor judgement!
We in the CSM owe Eve a much higher standard of behavior!
Issler Dainze |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
120
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 21:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Totally agree. CCP should be taking him out of CSM altogether and he should be left with a feeling that he's lucky he still has his accounts.
People have been banned for less.
My EVE YouTube Channel |
esc shk
Handelskrieg Industries Goonswarm Federation
119
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 21:52:00 -
[3] - Quote
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH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|
Xeross155
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
105
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 21:55:00 -
[4] - Quote
esc shk wrote:HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHA
The "victim" doesn't give a ****, why do you? |
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
477
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 21:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
here come the goosn posting brigate |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
675
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 21:58:00 -
[6] - Quote
man i hate goons |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
675
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:00:00 -
[7] - Quote
give it thirty seconds and darius III's fuckgoons detector will go off.
he sometimes confuses it with his nda-to-break detector, but both are addressed with the same zeal. |
Joepopo
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:01:00 -
[8] - Quote
I am extremely disapointed by your lack of tolerance and urge you to respect The Mittani's different point of view.
Also, ~10058~ |
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
477
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:05:00 -
[9] - Quote
fofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofofo |
Triskian
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
156
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
z |
|
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
477
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
0 |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
680
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:07:00 -
[12] - Quote
z |
Xeross155
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
108
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:07:00 -
[13] - Quote
0 |
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
479
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:07:00 -
[14] - Quote
seriously |
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
479
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:07:00 -
[15] - Quote
**** i ruined it |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
680
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:07:00 -
[16] - Quote
nice one |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
541
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:08:00 -
[17] - Quote
man i can't wait for the first CSM skype meeting |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
680
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:09:00 -
[18] - Quote
z |
esc shk
Handelskrieg Industries Goonswarm Federation
122
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:09:00 -
[19] - Quote
z |
Xeross155
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
108
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:09:00 -
[20] - Quote
z |
|
Wirbin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
0 |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
680
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:10:00 -
[22] - Quote
r |
Xeross155
NED-Clan Goonswarm Federation
108
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:11:00 -
[23] - Quote
z |
Eben Harper
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:11:00 -
[24] - Quote
Goonshat n. The flooding of forums with troll posts by Goonswarm Federation members whenever someone points out how much of a d**k their leader is. |
Triskian
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
157
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:12:00 -
[25] - Quote
0 |
Triskian
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
157
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:12:00 -
[26] - Quote
Eben Harper wrote:Goonshat n. The flooding of forums with troll posts by Goonwaffe members whenever someone points out how much of a d**k their leader is.
MY z0r CHAIN BACKBONE! |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:12:00 -
[27] - Quote
Eben Harper wrote: whenever someone points out how much of a d**k their leader is.
Mittani is NOT a dork :mad: |
Blawrf McTaggart
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
680
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:13:00 -
[28] - Quote
z |
Wirbin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:16:00 -
[29] - Quote
Eben Harper wrote:Goonshat n. The flooding of forums with troll posts by Goonswarm Federation members whenever someone points out how much of a d**k their leader is.
**** posting for a **** forum
nothing of value was lost |
Kratisto
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
0 |
|
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
177
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 22:57:00 -
[31] - Quote
Thankfully you and every other member of the current CSM were out voted to such a large degree that your opinion is irrelevant.
Edit: And I'm sure you've never said anything stupid while drunk either. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3441
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 23:10:00 -
[32] - Quote
Issler, capitalizing on a depressed player for your own in-game political gain makes you a hypocrite. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
177
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 23:18:00 -
[33] - Quote
Andski wrote:Issler, capitalizing on a depressed player for your own in-game political gain makes you a hypocrite.
And a very sick person. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1317
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 23:23:00 -
[34] - Quote
Tarsus Zateki wrote:Thankfully you and every other member of the current CSM were out voted to such a large degree that your opinion is irrelevant.
Edit: And I'm sure you've never said anything stupid while drunk either.
Actually I have said lots of stupid things while drunk. And when I sobered up and realized I made an asshat of myself I offered a sincere apology.
Of course these days I've learned to temper my adult beverage consumption so I am not as likely to make an asshat of myself, well not from drinking anyways!
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1328
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:01:00 -
[35] - Quote
Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1328
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:04:00 -
[36] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
One thing despite the apology this was an action that was started before the panel, the whole presentation was created prior to the fanfest and I assume in a more sober frame of mind. So humiliation of the player in question was definitely intended. I think the drunkenness let Mittens cross a line but how much further was that from the actual intent?
Issler
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1460
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:13:00 -
[37] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
One thing despite the apology this was an action that was started before the panel, the whole presentation was created prior to the fanfest and I assume in a more sober frame of mind. So humiliation of the player in question was definitely intended. I think the drunkenness let Mittens cross a line but how much further was that from the actual intent?
Issler
No it isn't enough.
He cannot continue as the chairman after this behaviour and if he tries to (and the other members of the CSM let him) then you are going to be tarred with the same brush. Even on the assumption the apology was genuine he is going to need to step back and allow another CSM member untainted by the televised cyberbullying and abuse episide speak for the player council for the next cycle.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1329
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:22:00 -
[38] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
One thing despite the apology this was an action that was started before the panel, the whole presentation was created prior to the fanfest and I assume in a more sober frame of mind. So humiliation of the player in question was definitely intended. I think the drunkenness let Mittens cross a line but how much further was that from the actual intent?
Issler No it isn't enough. He cannot continue as the chairman after this behaviour and if he tries to (and the other members of the CSM let him) then you are going to be tarred with the same brush. Even on the assumption the apology was genuine he is going to need to step back and allow another CSM member untainted by the televised cyberbullying and abuse episide speak for the player council for the next cycle.
I would have to say that for a lot of players if he remains it will undermine the gains the CSM seems to have made recently with player confidence.
I also think players need to be looking very closely at the total lack of reaction from any other CSM 7 members. How can I be the only one here that will take a stand?
Issler
|
Mechael
Team Pizza Viro Mors Non Est
59
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:35:00 -
[39] - Quote
Seriously, where is the rest of the CSM on this? Did they stop reading here now that the elections are over? I'd rather die in battle against a man who will lie to me, than for a man who will lie to me. |
Arakkis Melanogaster
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:43:00 -
[40] - Quote
The Mittani's behavior was not at all in keeping with the kind and friendly atmosphere EVE Online engenders. Amidst the clean pure dck and fart jokes of Fanfest, a dark stain spread and leaked out into all of our lives. |
|
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
545
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:43:00 -
[41] - Quote
hey issler can you record the skype meeting when you bring this matter to the rest of the CSM's attention, because i don't wana wait until darius sends it off to riverini first |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 01:58:00 -
[42] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:hey issler can you record the skype meeting when you bring this matter to the rest of the CSM's attention, because i don't wana wait until darius sends it off to riverini first
Here's to a year of Darius NDA jokes. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1331
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 02:15:00 -
[43] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:hey issler can you record the skype meeting when you bring this matter to the rest of the CSM's attention, because i don't wana wait until darius sends it off to riverini first
One thing I hope to do is be one of the more communicative CSM members so I will and try to do my best to let the players know what happened as soon as possible.
Issler
|
Nick Bison
Bison Industrial Inc Thundering Herd
48
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 02:19:00 -
[44] - Quote
"Deal with it." - and - "You're not a valid subscriber, you're a NPC alt. The opinions of NPC alts don't count for anything." ~10,058~
I just can't reconcile these Mittani initial responses with "The Appology" he posted.
Quit clearly in his early replies demonstrate both his knowledge of his wrongdoing and his complete disregard or dismissal of it. Perhaps too full of himself or beleiving he is above taking responsibility for his actions?
Once he completes all three steps he outlined, this inlcuded resgination from CSM, we can all move on.
Nothing clever at this time. |
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
187
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 02:20:00 -
[45] - Quote
So is anyone surprised that The Mittani behaves the same in real life as in-game? He consistently mixes the two when posting in forums. He's a self-admitted sadist. That's not roleplaying. I'm boggled that anyone is boggled by anything he said at fanfest. Have you been paying any attention at all?
In vino veritas.
The only thing being drunk did is bring out his true nature as a human being. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1333
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 02:42:00 -
[46] - Quote
Princess Bride wrote:So is anyone surprised that The Mittani behaves the same in real life as in-game? He consistently mixes the two when posting in forums. He's a self-admitted sadist. That's not roleplaying. I'm boggled that anyone is boggled by anything he said at fanfest. Have you been paying any attention at all? In vino veritas.The only thing being drunk did is bring out his true nature as a human being.
I've commented repeatedly that behavior in game reveals a truth about a person in their real life as well. Never has that been demonstrated so successfully in the alliance panel this year at Fanfest.
When the truth lube is applied in large quantities folks show you who they really are.
Issler
|
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 03:58:00 -
[47] - Quote
ITT: buttmad nerds writing for their masters in internet psychology. Please, continue to explain the underpinning workings of The Mittani's mind as only internet spaceship forum warriors can~ |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
203
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:10:00 -
[48] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
One thing despite the apology this was an action that was started before the panel, the whole presentation was created prior to the fanfest and I assume in a more sober frame of mind. So humiliation of the player in question was definitely intended. I think the drunkenness let Mittens cross a line but how much further was that from the actual intent?
Issler
you know i was thinking the same thing... my guess was he was originally going to mock the wiz (why he dressed like a dr. Seuss character) and have it be some sort of lame introduction to the next hulkageddon or some bull like that... but the guy got totally waisted and took it way too far... whcih can be seen even from his twitter posts from fanfest...
kinda scarry that this guy plays eve so damn much that he has become his in game persona in real life... if i were alex i would resign and take a break from eve to get back to reality and then plunge right back in...
worst part about this whole thing is the poor guy who just wanted to be left alone.... noob goon drone are like well he says he ok so stop being mean to "Brittney spears"... here's looking at you andski... but if the guy is really depressed and an adult you think he is going to react like a teenage depressed girl? no way... i am sorry for the guy cuss of how embarrassed he must feel... loosing a mining ship is ok for embarrassment but having your condition posted and re posted all over the internet and mocked is just a damn shame...
and for this alone mittenz should resign. |
Highauger's animated corpse
Stargate SG-1 Fatal Ascension
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:19:00 -
[49] - Quote
Alcohol - Eve Online - Reason anyone? |
Highauger's animated corpse
Stargate SG-1 Fatal Ascension
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:29:00 -
[50] - Quote
Isslers 1st post in : The Office of the Chairman: A ~chill place~ for constituent issues
Issler Dainze wrote:Have you stopped beating your wife in the wormholes you hate so much
No, seriously, no actual questions from me at the moment but I think you doing this thread is a great idea, I hope you get some good questions
Issler
+1 for a balanced fair discourse.
Scumbag |
|
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
121
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:43:00 -
[51] - Quote
Only way for Mittens to redeem himself is by taking a lesser position in the CSM and work from there. Wait till next CSM election to get the chair, but as it is now the only thing that would come from him being chair this CSM that everything will get tainted by this.
If he really wants to take his mandate forward he will accept the fact that even though he is unacceptable as chair for this period, he still has 10,058 votes for him and by completely resigning from the CSM he would openly admit he wasn't in it to make EVE better but only ran for the E-Peen position of chairman by landslide.
|
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:43:00 -
[52] - Quote
Alexander Michael Gianturco of Madison, Wisconsin. ie Mittens
^^ Simple google search.
|
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:45:00 -
[53] - Quote
I mean, if we're gonna put people real life **** on blast. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1336
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:47:00 -
[54] - Quote
Highauger's animated corpse wrote:Isslers 1st post in : The Office of the Chairman: A ~chill place~ for constituent issues Issler Dainze wrote:Have you stopped beating your wife in the wormholes you hate so much
No, seriously, no actual questions from me at the moment but I think you doing this thread is a great idea, I hope you get some good questions
Issler +1 for a balanced fair discourse. Scumbag
People doing good things can loose their way and screw up. And when they do they need to "own it" as Mittens said repeatedly i the alliance panel.
Issler |
Darius III
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
1127
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 04:51:00 -
[55] - Quote
Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it. CCP has rededicated themselves to improving Eve and are by and large doing a terrific job at it. My personal faith in them is largely restored. I think the coming changes will revitalize Eve and bring joy to the masses. |
Wolodymyr
Breaking Ambitions
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 05:00:00 -
[56] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:give it thirty seconds and darius III's fuckgoons detector will go off.
Oh come on now I think you might be exaggerating a little there....
Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it. .... oh well, shine on you beautiful butthurt diamond.
Also Issler welcome to the harsh realities of the rest of eve that isn't highsec. May your own butthurt confirm every negative stereotype I have ever heard about carebears. |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1028
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 05:00:00 -
[57] - Quote
Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it.
This man knows what he's talking about when it comes to punishments that warrant removal from the CSM. |
Scooter McCabe
SUNDERING Goonswarm Federation
23
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 05:17:00 -
[58] - Quote
Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it.
You have the lotion, tissues and ostrich feather by the computer if that happens don't you? |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1336
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 05:40:00 -
[59] - Quote
Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it.
Thanks for joining my call for action!
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1336
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 05:43:00 -
[60] - Quote
Wolodymyr wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:give it thirty seconds and darius III's fuckgoons detector will go off.
Oh come on now I think you might be exaggerating a little there.... Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it. .... oh well, shine on you beautiful butthurt diamond. Also Issler welcome to the harsh realities of the rest of eve that isn't highsec. May your own butthurt confirm every negative stereotype I have ever heard about carebears.
I've spent plenty of time outside high sec and even a "high sec care bear" can spot someone being an asshat and crossing the line of all reasonable standards of behavior.
Sorry your hero mittens threw anything he ever did good away in one act of absolute stupidity.
Issler
|
|
Arkady Vachon
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 05:53:00 -
[61] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it. Thanks for joining my opportunistic ploy to increase my own power! Issler
Fixed that for you. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1337
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:04:00 -
[62] - Quote
Arkady Vachon wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it. Thanks for being the first CSM to step up can call this behavior what it was! Flat out unacceptable Issler Jumped in to show mittens I am a loyal lap dog!! Bark Bark!!!!
Right,
This is about not letting some very bad behavior undo all the gains the CSM has made in gaining player support.
And pro-mittens trolls will just make the anti-mittens backlash even greater.
I am still questioning where the other CSM 7 are on this, this should be a unanimous call for at a minimum censure.
Folks that just voted, ask yourself why your candidates haven't joined this protest!
Issler |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
126
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:07:00 -
[63] - Quote
I have to agree, you and I - especially during voting week (hey what happens in voting week stays in voting week) - haven't agreed on much, but we agree on this.
This kind of predatory behavior shouldn't be tolerated.
It's akin to watching a Rodney King tape - the fact that the beating was psychological and not physical doesn't make it any less evil.
CCP shouldn't be just sitting on the sidelines saying "Oh the EULA and TOS weren't breached" on this one either. My EVE YouTube Channel |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:11:00 -
[64] - Quote
consequences on this one should be of the real world grown ass variety..... |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:13:00 -
[65] - Quote
I don't think this will even be anything to do with the CSM7 except The Mittani himself of course, CCP is getting further in the whole as time goes on with less choices. The only thing that could make this worse now was if a real news agency picked up the story to fill a slow news day. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:19:00 -
[66] - Quote
how was a prepubescent mouthbreather allowed to speak on behalf of this game in the first place? |
Yuki 0nna
The White Rose Conventicle
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:30:00 -
[67] - Quote
CCP should take this opportunity to lose TheMitanni, who has long fomented and exploited hatred of high sec players, especially miners, as persons. "I have found the average hisec dweller to be truly execrable." This recent outburst was in no way a departure from his usual behavior and "leadership." It merely brings into focus an ugly element in EVE that has got way out of hand recently, thanks in no small part to TheMittani.
This incident reminds me, in may ways, of the PR disaster of the last Alliance Tournament, for which CCP, ready to impress its then recently announced Sony partner, had even managed to lineup some genuine advertisers, only to discover that player arrogance had turned a potentially dramatic virtual "World Cup Final" into a pathetically staged World Wide Wrestling Federation match. How many times does CCP have to take a hit like this before it wakes up to the fact that too many members of its veteran player base, including many it coddles closest, are little but a millstone around its neck. |
Highauger's animated corpse
Stargate SG-1 Fatal Ascension
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:32:00 -
[68] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Highauger's animated corpse wrote:Isslers 1st post in : The Office of the Chairman: A ~chill place~ for constituent issues Issler Dainze wrote:Have you stopped beating your wife in the wormholes you hate so much
No, seriously, no actual questions from me at the moment but I think you doing this thread is a great idea, I hope you get some good questions
Issler +1 for a balanced fair discourse. Scumbag People doing good things can loose their way and screw up. And when they do they need to "own it" as Mittens said repeatedly in the alliance panel. Issler
Fair enough, respect.
And you have recognised elsewhere his apology. What has been asked is 'is that enough' that's a different and valid question. On this?, I would take the movement to Crucible, the efforts on monoclegate and the fact that the best possible penance would be CSM chair into consideration. Let's say it straight, chair is a very difficult job, and this will be awkward in that role for a long time. I wouldn't want to do it.
For those who missed the apology....
The Mittani wrote:This has been hanging over my head since Thursday when I stumbled away from the Alliance Panel with a vague sense that I had done something horrible. I didn't know the extent of how much of a shitheel I had been until today, when footage of the presentation went up. As many of you now know, I gave out the in-game character name of a Mackinaw miner if anyone had wanted to blow him up - except that I was so smashed that I didn't recall exactly what I said (as anyone who was there can tell you). When I came to the forums the other day and saw threads complaining about my behavior - not remembering what I'd said - I assumed that I was enduring the usual anti-Goonswarm trolls, and posted something like "deal with it~" in my usual "The Mittani" way.
Then I landed, and saw the article listing my actual quote.
Christ.
I feel absolutely ashamed of my behavior at the Alliance Panel. It's one thing to play a villain in an online roleplaying game - when I post on these forums or on twitter, I usually do so as 'The Mittani', and do my level best to convince everyone that I'm an unrepentant space villain, as that kind of facade provides an in-game advantage to me and my alliance. But I am not that character in real life, as anyone who has met me can attest. I went way, way, /way/ past the line on Thursday night by mocking the Mackinaw miner at a real-life event. I, as a person, am not the entity that I play in EVE; I am not actually a sociopath or a sadist, and I certainly don't want people to kill themselves in real life over an internet spaceship game, no matter what I may say or do within the game itself. CCP may say 'EVE is Real', but EVE is not real - and the line between the game and reality should not be overstepped.
I'm relieved to discover that the Mackinaw miner is doing fine and mining away, despite being blown up by Goonswarm in-game. He deserves, and he has, my heartfelt apologies - here in public as well as a private apology. There's no excuse for what I did - while some might try to use my inebriation as a mitigating factor, I put myself in that compromised mental state, and the guilt of that is entirely mine.
If I could go back in time and not have included the slide mentioning the miner, I would do so. While the Eve Online character "The Mittani" would never apologize for any sort of villany in game, I myself, as Alex Gianturco, feel utterly ashamed and sickened by my behavior.
|
Ravan Hekki
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:38:00 -
[69] - Quote
Am not looking forward to watching Eve vilified in the popular press, hopefully they wont get hold of the story. Be intersting to see Sony's response too. Hope they arent looking at thease forums for any idea about what the Eve player bases is like. |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
The I and F Taxation Trust
376
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 06:53:00 -
[70] - Quote
Apparently CCP is investigating it, but don't count on this issue having any consequence. PR wise, the best CCP can do about it is to cover up and shut up until it fades away.
And politically-wise, Issler just damaged a lot her chances to be listened to at the CSM, and likely killed any chance she had to be taken seriously by the CSM chairman. EVE residents: 5% WH; 8% Lowsec; 20% Nullsec; 67% Highsec. CSM 7: 1 highsec resident out of 14.-á
CSM demographics vs EVE demographics, nothing to worry about... |
|
Lenni Lennipe
Gladuim Quinque
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 07:08:00 -
[71] - Quote
Leadership is about taking on a level of responsibility beyond the norm, and as such, the consequences of bad decisions must also be beyond the norm. Mr. Gianturco took that responsibility on when he campaigned for CSM.
Sure he apologized, but the decisions he made, under the influence or not, must be held to account regardless. Whether he feels bad or not, whether the victim in question is OK or not, in any other situation like this, involving someone who is supposed to represent us, he would have already been forced out. In some jurisdictions, he would be subject to arrest or a civil action.
In other words, the only punishment that fits the crime is resignation. He committed a ban-able offense, stepping down from a position of elected leadership is the very least he should do. I truly think he should be banned, not permanently, but for a significant enough time that CCP proves that they're serious about one, protecting their players from such reprehensible behavior, and two, enforcing their own rules.
In RL The Mittani, by my understanding, is a lawyer, so I would expect such an apology from him in this situation. What the hell ELSE would he say? What would ANY of us say if in his shoes? OF COURSE he's gonna apologize- that should happen no matter what. What I think we need to question are his motives for doing so, and knowing what we do, I think it's more political than regretful.
If The MIttani does not resign, as far as I'm concerned it proves that his 'apology' is nothing more than a political maneuver meant to save his own skin.
|
Lenrir Andven
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 08:22:00 -
[72] - Quote
Lenni Lennipe wrote:Leadership is about taking on a level of responsibility beyond the norm, and as such, the consequences of bad decisions must also be beyond the norm. Mr. Gianturco took that responsibility on when he campaigned for CSM.
Sure he apologized, but the decisions he made, under the influence or not, must be held to account regardless. Whether he feels bad or not, whether the victim in question is OK or not, in any other situation like this, involving someone who is supposed to represent us, he would have already been forced out. In some jurisdictions, he would be subject to arrest or a civil action.
In other words, the only punishment that fits the crime is resignation. He committed a ban-able offense, stepping down from a position of elected leadership is the very least he should do. I truly think he should be banned, not permanently, but for a significant enough time that CCP proves that they're serious about one, protecting their players from such reprehensible behavior, and two, enforcing their own rules.
In RL The Mittani, by my understanding, is a lawyer, so I would expect such an apology from him in this situation. What the hell ELSE would he say? What would ANY of us say if in his shoes? OF COURSE he's gonna apologize- that should happen no matter what. What I think we need to question are his motives for doing so, and knowing what we do, I think it's more political than regretful.
If The MIttani does not resign, as far as I'm concerned it proves that his 'apology' is nothing more than a political maneuver meant to save his own skin.
Right, right, I guess we should sack every scientists out there because they made a 'mistake' during research. Or maybe we should sack the politburo when their polices do not go as intended. Only one chance rite?
In fact, I bet you made a mistake during your career Lenni. You should apologise then 'resign' from the game. |
Lenni Lennipe
Gladuim Quinque
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 08:35:00 -
[73] - Quote
Lenrir Andven wrote:Lenni Lennipe wrote:Leadership is about taking on a level of responsibility beyond the norm, and as such, the consequences of bad decisions must also be beyond the norm. Mr. Gianturco took that responsibility on when he campaigned for CSM.
Sure he apologized, but the decisions he made, under the influence or not, must be held to account regardless. Whether he feels bad or not, whether the victim in question is OK or not, in any other situation like this, involving someone who is supposed to represent us, he would have already been forced out. In some jurisdictions, he would be subject to arrest or a civil action.
In other words, the only punishment that fits the crime is resignation. He committed a ban-able offense, stepping down from a position of elected leadership is the very least he should do. I truly think he should be banned, not permanently, but for a significant enough time that CCP proves that they're serious about one, protecting their players from such reprehensible behavior, and two, enforcing their own rules.
In RL The Mittani, by my understanding, is a lawyer, so I would expect such an apology from him in this situation. What the hell ELSE would he say? What would ANY of us say if in his shoes? OF COURSE he's gonna apologize- that should happen no matter what. What I think we need to question are his motives for doing so, and knowing what we do, I think it's more political than regretful.
If The MIttani does not resign, as far as I'm concerned it proves that his 'apology' is nothing more than a political maneuver meant to save his own skin.
Right, right, I guess we should sack every scientists out there because they made a 'mistake' during research. Or maybe we should sack the politburo when their polices do not go as intended. Only one chance rite? In fact, I bet you made a mistake during your career Lenni. You should apologise then 'resign' from the game.
LOL fail |
knobber Jobbler
Seniors Clan Get Off My Lawn
86
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 08:36:00 -
[74] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:
This is about not letting some very bad behavior undo all the gains the CSM has made in gaining player support.
And most of the support is for Mittens and the CSM's profile has been raised because of him.
Just get over it already and stop having a little drama lama. I'm embarrassed for you and more to the point, you welcome support from the EULA breaking Darius. |
Lomarro
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 08:49:00 -
[75] - Quote
you really need to try harder to get enough member kicked so you and darius get a trip to iceland |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1055
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 08:58:00 -
[76] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Arkady Vachon wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it. Thanks for being the first CSM to step up can call this behavior what it was! Flat out unacceptable Issler Jumped in to show mittens I am a loyal lap dog!! Bark Bark!!!! Right, This is about not letting some very bad behavior undo all the gains the CSM has made in gaining player support. And pro-mittens trolls will just make the anti-mittens backlash even greater. I am still questioning where the other CSM 7 are on this, this should be a unanimous call for at a minimum censure. Folks that just voted, ask yourself why your candidates haven't joined this protest! Issler
You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:13:00 -
[77] - Quote
I think standing up for what is right, definitely sounds like less of a PR stunt than shutting up on an issue this large, because you haven't worked with them yet. Trying not to actually pick a side or share in the outrage.
Before you say anything, I have always said we need more newbies, publicly advertising that we are a game full of cyber bullies is not a good start. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
895
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:15:00 -
[78] - Quote
Lomarro wrote:you really need to try harder to get enough member kicked so you and darius get a trip to iceland
|
Seleene
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
1382
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:17:00 -
[79] - Quote
Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****.
I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons:
The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. Seleene's Sandbox - My Blog, where I say stuff. Follow Seleene on Twitter |
Mechaet
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
15
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:27:00 -
[80] - Quote
Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. Ladies and Gents, the recently re-elected Seleene, showing why repeated re-election is possible. |
|
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
221
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:28:00 -
[81] - Quote
So this all is becoming "I cheated my wife, but i was drunk, so its ok" talk??? |
Hrald
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:31:00 -
[82] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:So this all is becoming "I cheated my wife, but i was drunk, so its ok" talk??? The Mittani has repeatedly disavowed using alcohol as an excuse for his behaviour. Reading comprehension, get some. |
Hrald
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 09:33:00 -
[83] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:
You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****.
Also he signs his own posts.
Hrald |
Red Templar
Raging Ducks Goonswarm Federation
204
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:09:00 -
[84] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:I think standing up for what is right, definitely sounds like less of a PR stunt than shutting up on an issue this large, because you haven't worked with them yet. Trying not to actually pick a side or share in the outrage.
Before you say anything, I have always said we need more newbies, publicly advertising that we are a game full of cyber bullies is not a good start. 1. It is a PR stunt. She is trying to gain some points by being on a winning side of "moralists". Or at least the thinks they are going to win. Though i doubt that. 2. It is a good start. Cyber bullies will notice Eve and we get more players this way. And those who hate cyber bullies will also join, because they will get chance to get back at them in game, where you can actually inflict significant loses on your adversary.
TL:DR: shut the **** up frying pan. For Love. For Peace. For Honor.
For None of the Above.
For Pony! |
Taiwanistan
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
236
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:21:00 -
[85] - Quote
frying doom is a nutjob, go back to his posts supporting issler, he still plagues issler's efforts wis shall not be a cesspool of all-you-can-eat social /dance o7m8 dressup, unrestrained do ask do tell out and proud at the space bar dollhouse, bunch of dudes emoting each other, devoid of gameplay and consequnces. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
31
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:24:00 -
[86] - Quote
Taiwanistan wrote:frying doom is a nutjob, go back to his posts supporting issler, he still plagues issler's efforts Thanks, I love criticism from such a morally upstanding, obviously sane individual. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Di Mulle
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:35:00 -
[87] - Quote
Vile rat wrote: you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****.
This probably is not bad thing on itself ? I recall certain CSM6 members enjoyed that tactics pretty much in their time... CCP is unable to implement simpliest things. Like settting to hide signatures. So they sweep it under a rug . Children do that in their pre-shool years, CCP does it being adults. Probably because it is fearless enough. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
3161
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:38:00 -
[88] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:As a CSM 7 member I am extremely disappointed with Mittens behavior at Fanfest this year.
The CSM should not only represent the players that elected them but also represent Eve itself to the general public. Mittens in the past has shown himself to be very adept at messaging both in and out of Eve. I can't believe he could have been so misguided in calling for harassment of a possibly suicidal player.
I understand we can expect all manner of crazy behavior at Fanfest and previous goon leaders at the alliance panel have certainly made themselves "controversial" but I think this incident violates a boundary between what happens in Eve and real world damage. Whether or not the player in question was suicidal isn't the point. The point is, in a world where cyber bullying is an emerging issue, we have a prominent figure in Eve clearly calling encourage a real life suicide. That can't be defended on ant level.
Mittens, I've supported the right for folks to act out in Eve as a valid part of the "sandbox", but I can't support your recent actions.
At a minimum we need Mittens to apologize and admit he crossed the line with his behavior. I call to the other elected members of the CM7 join me in this demand!
If the CSM is remain a viable part of Eve we have to adhere to some code of conduct. This recent event is a black eye for the CSM and Eve in general.
CSM 7 join me in protesting this disappointing public display of poor judgement!
We in the CSM owe Eve a much higher standard of behavior!
Issler Dainze
Alex got drunk and made a fool of himself, for which he has now unreservedly apologized.
You, on the other hand, are coldly and calculatingly seeking to whip up and further spread the controversy around a private individual who never wanted any of this, purely to serve your own spiteful, vengeful powerseeking purposes.
Alex was clumsy and stupid in his attempt to make a bad joke. You are being callously manipulative in pursuit of political power.
You and all the other hypocrites doing the same disgust me. You are a far worse stain on the CSM than mittens could be even if he tried, because he lacks your talent for petty spite.
Get out. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:53:00 -
[89] - Quote
The thing I find scariest of all is the fact that so many people, seem to consider asking a crowd to try and get someone to kill them selves as foolish behavior or something that an apology and 200 bucks makes go away.
I do wonder if this is something to do with the culture of the United States, or if its a global concept. Yes he stuffed up but he did it on camera to a large audience in front of a large audience. I do actually feel sorry for the guy but worry about the future. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
3162
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:56:00 -
[90] - Quote
The thing I find scariest of all is a howling mob who completely disregard that an apology has been made and accepted, but believe that it's their business to keep this whole thing escalating, regardless of the effect on the person they claim to be defending. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:01:00 -
[91] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:The thing I find scariest of all is a howling mob who completely disregard that an apology has been made and accepted, but believe that it's their business to keep this whole thing escalating, regardless of the effect on the person they claim to be defending. I thought the apology was good actually but does an apology really cut it for what was said. That leads down the path of can you make real life death treats and just apologize later in the game now? Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
47
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:04:00 -
[92] - Quote
Won't matter, the actions in questions violate the ToS on several counts .. he'll likely be kicked from council (if he doesn't leave on his own accord) and his account itself may be "audited".
We have all asked for CCP to throw the book at offenders when a violation is obvious in the past and applauded when CCP does so on their own .. Question is if the threat of Goons having their head and only functioning brain severed (can't be good!) with the resulting rampage/rage-quits is enough to make CCP run away/cave in as they have done in the past. Hell, the Jita idiocy last summer will be dwarfed by what 10k players with what is essentially infinite ISK can do of damage to Eve. |
esc shk
Handelskrieg Industries Goonswarm Federation
139
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:08:00 -
[93] - Quote
It's funny because his actions weren't under the EULA or TOS. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
32
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:10:00 -
[94] - Quote
esc shk wrote:It's funny because his actions weren't under the EULA or TOS. I agree they were in real life in-front of thousands of people. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
3165
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:33:00 -
[95] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Malcanis wrote:The thing I find scariest of all is a howling mob who completely disregard that an apology has been made and accepted, but believe that it's their business to keep this whole thing escalating, regardless of the effect on the person they claim to be defending. I thought the apology was good actually but does an apology really cut it for what was said. That leads down the path of can you make real life death treats and just apologize later in the game now?
It's not up to you to decide if it "really cuts it", is it? Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
stierkobb
Silent Society Ineluctable.
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:33:00 -
[96] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Totally agree. CCP should be taking him out of CSM altogether and he should be left with a feeling that he's lucky he still has his accounts.
People have been banned for less.
I agree. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:42:00 -
[97] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Malcanis wrote:The thing I find scariest of all is a howling mob who completely disregard that an apology has been made and accepted, but believe that it's their business to keep this whole thing escalating, regardless of the effect on the person they claim to be defending. I thought the apology was good actually but does an apology really cut it for what was said. That leads down the path of can you make real life death treats and just apologize later in the game now? It's not up to you to decide if it "really cuts it", is it? Did I say that it did or didn't, personally no, it doesn't or if it does this could be a very fun game Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Sano Hekki
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:50:00 -
[98] - Quote
This is the perfect example of why this whole thing is a farce, Issler doesn't care about the Miner in question neither does the majority of the people flooding the general forums it's all about seeing The Mittani removed a nothing else. |
Deceduto
Sons Of Alexander AL3XAND3R.
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:56:00 -
[99] - Quote
Blawrf McTaggart wrote:man i hate goons
We all do, its okay. |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1073
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 11:59:00 -
[100] - Quote
Deceduto wrote:Blawrf McTaggart wrote:man i hate goons We all do, its okay.
Man how do you end up with a dot in your alliance name after you changed letters for numbers already? |
|
Allataria
Martyr's Vengence Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 12:12:00 -
[101] - Quote
Sano Hekki wrote:This is the perfect example of why this whole thing is a farce, Issler doesn't care about the Miner in question neither does the majority of the people flooding the general forums it's all about seeing The Mittani removed a nothing else.
+1
Issler should step down. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 12:20:00 -
[102] - Quote
Allataria wrote: Anyone with half a brain knows this happens all the time in pvp and everyone does it. Not just the CFC. All of 0.0 and pvp alliances/corps are guilty of it. ****ing all over people for being dumb and losing ships is every pvp players right. Thats why everyone at the panel found it funny. The only people not laughing are the sec prudes who do nothing but carebear and mine all day and hardly ever pvp. The people in null sec who are voicing that this is disgusting are all hypocrites because they themselves have done this and they know it.
What people get up on a stage and in-front of cameras? Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
lanyaie
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:01:00 -
[103] - Quote
Hmm should i troll this thread or not?
Anyhow I'm not a fan of mittani,(hell im not a fan of anyone)but to me all these threads seems to get rediculous. I know some have good intentions but I know most of you just don't like mittani and want him out of the game regardless of the victims condition, only mittani knows if he really ment his apology and if he wouldn't have said what he did if he wasn't drunk. I myself think anyone in the position of mittani would respond to all of this in the way he did even tho he made an apology, seeming as he knowns they are just out to get him and not in behalf of supporting the victim.
I myself hope mittani really means he's sorry but as I said only he knows if he's is.
Either way Yaaay no troll posting from lanyaie
I dont post often, but when I do i'm probably trolling you |
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
481
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:03:00 -
[104] - Quote
fyi it's not trolling when you announce it |
lanyaie
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:03:00 -
[105] - Quote
MITTENS CAN I HAZ YOUR STOOFF
Sorry i have to balance serious posts and troll posts or bad things happen I dont post often, but when I do i'm probably trolling you |
lanyaie
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:06:00 -
[106] - Quote
Woo Glin wrote:I have no idea what i'm talking about
Now I my first point wasn't trolling was it? And I may troll however the **** I like :) I dont post often, but when I do i'm probably trolling you |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
660
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:24:00 -
[107] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote: One thing despite the apology this was an action that was started before the panel, the whole presentation was created prior to the fanfest and I assume in a more sober frame of mind. So humiliation of the player in question was definitely intended. I think the drunkenness let Mittens cross a line but how much further was that from the actual intent?
Issler
Sad - way to spin the story more for your own gain Issler.
The presentation had no names and ridiculed players anonymously for various levels of stupidity in their gameplay.
The line-crossing when he named the character was in response to an audience question after all the presentations were done and was totally off the cuff.
I have to agree with the sentiment that Issler and most of the rabble are only perpetuating this out of hate for The Mittani and motivated for personal gain. Nobody thought about the embarassment they'd be causing the "victim" here by spreading the audience beyond fanfest watchers to the entire MMO news community. They just saw a chance to attack The Mittani and jumped at it.
Hypocrites. Here's your sign... |
Dank Man
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:53:00 -
[108] - Quote
As much as I avoid trying to even give goons the respect of responding to their crap and trolls, the mittani is a RL piece of sh*t. If hes gonna get drunk and be a total prick it just goes to show what sheep he has in his herd of goons. Sad to see 8000 people voted for this guy, and still defend him... Eve is a game about people and this guy doesn't care about them, he doesn't care about real people, certainly not about his allies and not about his own members. He uses you for your votes and your blob help build his ego and you all follow lol. You all get what you deserve and this piece of crap definitely deserves to represent you. Any goon or allies of the goons that dont demand his resignation from lead of CSM/GOONS and CFC is clearly complacent and doesn't care about the community or the RL welfare of people. Sad to see that the game goons play "for fun" and from the person who always claims others take this game seriously.... Wow dude.. Well folks thats the truth of this guy, f him and f goons who support this a-hole. And until CCP does something they are just as responsible for giving this prick a stage to speak on in my opinion. Go ahead goons troll away i wanna see which ones of you have the balls to continue to push this, i mean i know you hold your anonymous racism close to you, and maybe you can justify that being ok in a video game daily, but this is just disgraceful, sadly even disgraceful for goons. As for the goon community I would think they had enough self respect to reject this guy as well but likely seeing as how they all supported him in the past I'm not expecting much more. He's a lawyer he says whatever gets him out of things as his job, doesn't have to be the truth or even close, him being drunk shows his true colors, his apology means nothing as his words haven't meant anything for years as any person in the eve community could have told you. I hope he gets what he deserves, boot from CSM, ban of his accounts, ban from fanfest, etc. you just don't do this kind of stuff, this is real life before eve if you all haven't forgotten.
- Dank
|
Woo Glin
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
482
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:55:00 -
[109] - Quote
lanyaie wrote: I'm a bad poster
lmao look what i did |
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
137
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 14:11:00 -
[110] - Quote
Darius III wrote:Nothing but removal from the CSM will show that CCP cares about this issue. What would have turned out to be possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in free good publicity for CSM now turns out to be PR nightmare and unmitigated disaster for our whole community. Just step down and be done with it.
I disagree with Darius. His agenda is purely on a personal agenda and in no way is to the benefit of EVE as a game.
Yes Mittani made a big mistake at the Fanfest pannel. But the mistake wasn't only his. Content to the presentation is checked by CCP first and they must have had a blast reading a mail of someone they just discarded as being a whiney one and should be mocked at. They know Mittani's ingame reputation and they would have known he wasn't up to anything good in regards of that slide. They let is pass through without even checking anything about that player. Their suicide hotline failed there. Their ability to see what is acceptable and what not went out of the door at that point.
However we also must not forget that 10,058 accounts voted for Mittani. They wanted to give him a landslide victory and they did. Like it or not he has the back up of a large part of the customer base that bothered to vote.
By discarding Mittani completely as CSM you retrospectivly also discard 10,058 accounts which voted for him. This would be unacceptable.
I say let him serve his term, or even make him serve his term. However not as chairman but in another position.
We would be stupid and narrowminded if we would listen to the likes of Darius whom we all know and trust just as much as we trust a Goon.
I don't see Alexander as Mittani, nor do I see Mitanni as Alexander.
I do see Alexander as someone who has a mandate and who would work well in another position within the CSM to shed off the taint of this incident and not let the smudge come over the chair due to personal gain.
|
|
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
223
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 14:11:00 -
[111] - Quote
I will only say this, presidents and ministers of real life countries resigned for smaller things.
This all is not because he said that, its because he is elected and he is, because of it, responsible for his actions and words. |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1079
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 14:24:00 -
[112] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:I will only say this, presidents and ministers of real life countries resigned for smaller things.
This all is not because he said that, its because he is elected and he is, because of it, responsible for his actions and words.
You just compared an advisory lobbyist position in a video game with a real life elected politician, wow. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
37
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 14:36:00 -
[113] - Quote
The worst part is where does the game go from here. If nothing is done what can CCP say if someone else starts making RL death threats or threats of a beating? What about their liability if nothing is done?
We are only talking about an advisory position to a company generating 60 million a year.
Honestly I believe he is sorry and there was no way he could know getting drunk that night would do so much. Over here we have "Don't drink and drive" ads every where, maybe someone should get him a "Don't drink and Speak on Camera" T-Shirt. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Vile rat
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1080
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 14:40:00 -
[114] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:The worst part is where does the game go from here. If nothing is done what can CCP say if someone else starts making RL death threats or threats of a beating? What about their liability if nothing is done?
We are only talking about an advisory position to a company generating 60 million a year.
Honestly I believe he is sorry and there was no way he could know getting drunk that night would do so much. Over here we have "Don't drink and drive" ads every where, maybe someone should get him a "Don't drink and Speak on Camera" T-Shirt.
The game moves right along and barely remembers this in a week. |
Weloriavia
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 14:40:00 -
[115] - Quote
I have read this entire thread and have decided to way in my thoughts!
The Mittani is our representative. The players. Due to the large outcry by both players and CSM comrades alike it is clear that he is no longer going to be able to represent us all from a neutral position.
If we put aside the fact this is a game to start with and focus on the actual comments. Cyberbullying is a serious, serious accusation. As a representative of CCP I imagine any other employee would at least be stood down pending investigation. As we enter into the age of information technology our reps on CSM7 need to realize that they are not only representing a vast majority of players from different ethnic and religious backgrounds but also that anything they say is going to be read. This in some cases was not only an attack on the playr but also an attack on various faiths who believe suicicde to be unacceptable. In ANY workplace it is unacceptable to make comments such as was made.
I am the first to advocate freedom of speech and Non-PC comments but this was taking it too far. Fanfest is the biggest event in our diary, it is a time to get to know each nother outside of game and enjoy ourselves, instead it has been tarnished by a man who self gratifys himself as a sadistic game player. As Chairman of CSM I would expect a professional aura to be given off at all times especially when in such a public situation as Fanfest. The thing that continues to bug me the most is his continual display of being "the bad guy", I appreciate he got the votes and that is why he is where he is, but why on EARTH would you not have to characters your in game character and your proffessional charismatic self out side of game who deals with "in game press".
I do hope that if nothing else a warning is given. As this is the chance to make an example for the ENTIRE MMO community that Cyber harrasment will NOT be tolerated. I can only imagine what would have been the reaction of in game moderators if this comment had been broadcast over chat...
|
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
303
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:23:00 -
[116] - Quote
Looks like we have a new Ankhwhatevethatnamewas candidate.
Have fun lmao |
Weloriavia
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:41:00 -
[117] - Quote
Jack bubu wrote:Looks like we have a new Ankhwhatevethatnamewas candidate.
Have fun lmao
Haha No thank you, No CSM for me )
|
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:45:00 -
[118] - Quote
Weloriavia wrote: This in some cases was not only an attack on the playr but also an attack on various faiths who believe suicicde to be unacceptable.
I find this interesting. Would you expect a public figure to apologise for expressing his enjoyment of eating pork? After all, various faiths object to the eating of pork.
Not that I agree or disagree with any of this but I couldn't help but laugh at this well thought out statement. It's ridiculous that people in the public eye have to watch everything they say for fear of making an unintentional attack on "various faiths". Even more ridiculous is the idea that an objection to suicide as a matter of faith is something that holds a special place above that of a purely moral objection. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
207
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:51:00 -
[119] - Quote
if i had as pathetically low a vote count as issler i'd be trying to get rid of anyone else as well |
REDBIERD
Space Gear Productions
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:58:00 -
[120] - Quote
The guy already said he's stepping down in light of this fiasco. He should follow through with his promise.
Also he needs to show some leadership and get the Goonwaffe attack dogs posting here in his defense to shut up... e.g. The Mittani admitted his actions were indefensible, so why are you defending him ?
Really, in the face of this PR disaster, it would be best for Goonwaffe to simmer down and Mittani do the right thing.
|
|
Weloriavia
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:01:00 -
[121] - Quote
Aruken Marr wrote:Weloriavia wrote: This in some cases was not only an attack on the playr but also an attack on various faiths who believe suicicde to be unacceptable.
I find this interesting. Would you expect a public figure to apologise for expressing his enjoyment of eating pork? After all, various faiths object to the eating of pork. Not that I agree or disagree with any of this but I couldn't help but laugh at this well thought out statement. It's ridiculous that people in the public eye have to watch everything they say for fear of making an unintentional attack on "various faiths". Even more ridiculous is the idea that an objection to suicide as a matter of faith is something that holds a special place above that of a purely moral objection.
And yet if this were a real life employee, they would have to consider everything that came out of their mouths would they not? If this comment was made by the director of CCP would we not all expect to see his resignation the following day? How is our representative any different? He is given a privilege, which he abused.
What I am referring to here is not the exact example, I am instead trying to refer to a path that should never have been walked down. There are certain topics it is just bad taste to raise.
If we are a society that does not object to jokes on a humans life, then I personally have just a little more faith in humanity.
|
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:08:00 -
[122] - Quote
Weloriavia wrote:Aruken Marr wrote:Weloriavia wrote: This in some cases was not only an attack on the playr but also an attack on various faiths who believe suicicde to be unacceptable.
I find this interesting. Would you expect a public figure to apologise for expressing his enjoyment of eating pork? After all, various faiths object to the eating of pork. Not that I agree or disagree with any of this but I couldn't help but laugh at this well thought out statement. It's ridiculous that people in the public eye have to watch everything they say for fear of making an unintentional attack on "various faiths". Even more ridiculous is the idea that an objection to suicide as a matter of faith is something that holds a special place above that of a purely moral objection. And yet if this were a real life employee, they would have to consider everything that came out of their mouths would they not? If this comment was made by the director of CCP would we not all expect to see his resignation the following day? How is our representative any different? He is given a privilege, which he abused. What I am referring to here is not the exact example, I am instead trying to refer to a path that should never have been walked down. There are certain topics it is just bad taste to raise. If we are a society that does not object to jokes on a humans life, then I personally have just a little more faith in humanity.
I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with your post. Just pointing out how silly that quoted statement is.
You're right, some things shouldn't be jested about. But to go so far as to call it an attack on various faiths is a joke lol |
Weloriavia
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:16:00 -
[123] - Quote
True true, got your attention though didnt it?
|
Zombatar
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:35:00 -
[124] - Quote
I support CSM, but not Mittani. As such I ask the other CSM members to make all that they can to remove The Mittani from CSM and distance themselves from such individuals (aka The Mittani/Alex) and restore faith in CSM and to repair the image of the community which has been stained by such individuals.
Thus I support this thread and its mission!
Moreover I ask the CSM to consider revising the rules for the Alliance Board Panel during fanfest and ensure that all presentations are done in a respectable yet funny manner in the future (no alcohol on display or drunk people).
CCP should act together with CSM on this issue, have a common voice. |
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:37:00 -
[125] - Quote
Err yeah... I guess it did? |
Macon Chalaise
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:46:00 -
[126] - Quote
The chairman seems to be guilty of being human and showing poor and alcoholically impaired judgement, yes, but of thought crime, I think not.
If Icelandic law was broken, let their authorities handle it but otherwise let it go. Embracing anger and outrage only makes YOU feel bad and if for some reason the chairman is amused by, and enjoys, this attention then you are just feeding him your tears.
Tread carefully in the mine fields of thought crime lest you lose a leg or worse, your freedom of speech.
This is not to say Free Speech is NOT often abused, as it often IS abused, but as a veteran and a US citizen I value my freedom to speak and my freedom to vote and I value it for others as well, even the racists and gay-bashers whom I abhor.
In forum speak, being so easily butthurt about so many things and complaining so much about them is how censorship happens and the more censorship we excuse the more freedom we lose.
Pick your censorship and thought crime battles carefully lest you wake up one day in jail just for "saying the wrong thing."
While we are here remember that the CSM is a group of lobbyists and If you didn't vote in the election or chose to abstain, you also chose to let others think and act for you and have no reason to complain about the results. "It won't make a difference anyway" or "It will make things worse" are both incorrect and feeble excuses. You failed in your duty to yourself to influence the development of this game in a direction you prefer.
You chose to give up some of your freedom and freedom is a muscle that needs to be used. If it isn't used it can atrophy so don't be surprised if it shrinks a little each time you choose not to use it and you wake up bedridden and covered in sores one day wondering where your freedom went.
You threw it out with the trash.
Any time you can influence anything anywhere to your advantage by voting, you either need to vote or admit you didn't want it that badly.
The chairman behaved the way many people expect him to behave. Why is there so much surprise and outrage? He even apologized. Here's to fire. Not the fast and furious kind that burns down shacks and shanties, but the slow, seductive kind that takes down pants and panties - Irish Toast |
PleaseDONTblow Myship
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:47:00 -
[127] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
Issler
Whats sad about fact that you are only CSM7 member who is attention seeking,unloyal drama queen?
I was very positively surprised by this fact and also by fact that even some of mittens enemies show him their support because in my book he really didnt do anything bad,which i cant say about you... |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
661
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:52:00 -
[128] - Quote
Weloriavia wrote:True true, got your attention though didnt it?
Wait, so you said something over-the-top that you didn't really mean, just to get people's attention?
Hmm, I wonder if anyone else in this thread may have been found guilty of such a low, despicable act.
BTW, how did you turn ridiculing someone's suicidal cry for attention into slander against religions that abhor suicide? Aren't you trying to stretch the victim list just a wee bit here? Here's your sign... |
Jack bubu
GK inc. Pandemic Legion
303
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:05:00 -
[129] - Quote
Weloriavia wrote:Jack bubu wrote:Looks like we have a new Ankhwhatevethatnamewas candidate.
Have fun lmao Haha No thank you, No CSM for me ) i actually ment the OP ;) |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:12:00 -
[130] - Quote
PleaseDONTblow Myship wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
Issler Whats sad about fact that you are only CSM7 member who is attention seeking,unloyal drama queen? I was very positively surprised by this fact and also by fact that even some of mittens enemies show him their support because in my book he really didnt do anything bad,which i cant say about you... Personally I would have liked to have seen the CSMs opinions about this before they got together, but if trying to get a crowd to pressure someone into suicide (joke or not) isn't bad what the hell is?
Will admit I do wonder about how much of this current argument between if it was bad or not has to do with cultural opinions from different places on the earth, or its just individual concepts. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Blatant Forum Alt
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:30:00 -
[131] - Quote
I knew this would start soon enough.
Tell me, why wait a few days before opening up the fountain of 'I lost the election' tears? |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:36:00 -
[132] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:The thing I find scariest of all is the fact that so many people, seem to consider asking a crowd to try and get someone to kill them selves as foolish behavior or something that an apology and 200 bucks makes go away.
I do wonder if this is something to do with the culture of the United States, or if its a global concept. Yes he stuffed up but he did it on camera to a large audience in front of a large audience. I do actually feel sorry for the guy but worry about the future.
^^^This
People found it hilarious. Gianturco was in no way shape or form "joking" or just blurting out drunken nonsense. The dude was tipsy but he was not falling out smashed. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:38:00 -
[133] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Malcanis wrote:The thing I find scariest of all is a howling mob who completely disregard that an apology has been made and accepted, but believe that it's their business to keep this whole thing escalating, regardless of the effect on the person they claim to be defending. I thought the apology was good actually but does an apology really cut it for what was said. That leads down the path of can you make real life death treats and just apologize later in the game now? It's not up to you to decide if it "really cuts it", is it?
I know the person who the apology was sent to personally.....and no the apology didn't "cut it". lawls |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:39:00 -
[134] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:People found it hilarious. Gianturco was in no way shape or form "joking" or just blurting out drunken nonsense. The dude was tipsy but he was not falling out smashed. Joking or Having a laugh if you prefer as to how drunk he was well he didn't look very sober to me and I am prepared to give him the benefit of saying he was drunk at the time. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:52:00 -
[135] - Quote
And for everyone's fyi wis is just fine. The letter was taken out of context to make it sound like he was asking them not to gank him because he was going through a rough patch irl. He was not. He was, in a foolish way, trying to explain to human waste why he plays the game the way he does....it is his outlet from real life in which he was having problems, problems most of you pubies couldn't even comprehend. His mistake was not realizing he was just feeding little human piggies with their treasured tears. He never did anything of any consequence to the goons so while I understand the ganking, that's part of the game, i simply don't understand calling on people to troll this harmless hi sec bear into killing himself. If you don't get that ur garbage. If you keep up that real life **** and forget this is a video game.....people may show up at your public functions with this same idea in mind, that this is about to get "real" right quick. Then what? Eve over is what. |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
157
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 17:53:00 -
[136] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Frying Doom wrote:The thing I find scariest of all is the fact that so many people, seem to consider asking a crowd to try and get someone to kill them selves as foolish behavior or something that an apology and 200 bucks makes go away.
I do wonder if this is something to do with the culture of the United States, or if its a global concept. Yes he stuffed up but he did it on camera to a large audience in front of a large audience. I do actually feel sorry for the guy but worry about the future. ^^^This People found it hilarious. Gianturco was in no way shape or form "joking" or just blurting out drunken nonsense. The dude was tipsy but he was not falling out smashed.
More of ^^this.
It was premeditated, and is very in-character for him - everyone knows it, it's indefensible which I would imagine is why we haven't heard from him at all.
It has far more to do wtih his culture, attitude and personality than whether or not someone should find it acceptable behaviour. I find it extremely amusing that more goons pile onto the forums TO DEFEND THE BEHAVIOUR. Only once again showing - the culture.
Lets face it, I haven't seen the US start wars with China like they have with every 3rd world country that couldn't fight back. It's entirely cultural to prey on the weak. My EVE YouTube Channel |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 18:02:00 -
[137] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:[quote=michaelthered][quote=Frying Doom]
Lets face it, I haven't seen the US start wars with China like they have with every 3rd world country that couldn't fight back. It's entirely cultural to prey on the weak.
I'm american and i can see you have a point. But hold off on the China thing...soon as them and Russia want to go off the dollar as the worlds reserve you'll see your China war. True story. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
661
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 18:06:00 -
[138] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote: Lets face it, I haven't seen the US start wars with China like they have with every 3rd world country that couldn't fight back. It's entirely cultural to prey on the weak.
Let's face it, its entirely genetic to prey on the weak. That's more or less the definition of the predator / prey relationship and is seen in behavior of every species on earth.
Perhaps when your "every 3rd world country" starts preying on it's neighbors or poking at large animals with sticks, it would do well to remember there are much bigger predators out there.
Here's your sign... |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1363
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 18:19:00 -
[139] - Quote
Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland.
I have had my NDA in place since CSM 2. Waiting for the Skype information now. I am very sure Mittens had a lot to do with the success of the CSM 6 but as other people have pointed out there is a higher standard applied to leaders. I am not at all happy to have had to take this stand. I did want to work with Mittens but I think he crossed a line and I am surprised to see you not stand by me and support that this was planned before the incident and showed an extreme lack of judgement. It hurt the CSM in the player's eyes (you even have goons calling for him to resign) and it is a black eye for Eve in the general public.
I've promised everyone that voted for me I'd speak the truth and that is exactly what I'm doing here. It is my job to fight for the integrity of the CSM and to be open and honest to the players of Eve. I'm doing what I promised.
Issler |
Blake Zacary
Nobilium Coalition Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 18:35:00 -
[140] - Quote
Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have to disagree with this.This isn't an ingame matter or something covered with the NDA,this was a real life mistake that even Alex said he feels absolutely ashamed about.
I'm sure I'm not the only voter who is curious as to what each individual CSM rep thinks about this.This isn't the time to go into your CSM channels and work out some joint damage control.This is one of those times where people have to stand up and be counted as individuals and not hide behind a collective !
|
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1364
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 18:39:00 -
[141] - Quote
I started this thread because I saw repeated posted in other threads that asked the CSM for their position related to this event.
If the rest of the CSM 7 can't find it in themselves to take a stand then I wonder how they think they deserve their position in the CSM.
I really am disappointed that Mittens did this. He ultimately let down the 10K folks that supported him in this election. Clearly many of those voters don't seem to care, but many clearly do.
At first I thought the apology would be enough, but as I thought more about it I couldn't accept that Mittens set out to do this before the panel and in a sober state of mind. In addition his initial responses and the "I didn't know until I got home and watched the video because I was so drunk" in my mind is a failure on his part to "own it" as he repeatedly said on stage.
So I'm sorry, I'm asking him to "own it" and I think for the benefit of the CSM and Eve, that means at a minimum he is out of the CSM this term. I also agree with folks that pointed out this seems to be a clear violation of the ToS and many have been removed from Eve with less evidence. We also need to hold CCP accountable and demand they clearly explain whatever action they take relative to enforcement against less famous players.
And to say I'm doing this for power is insane. I knew this would further polarize any opinions about me but I didn't sign up for this to win some sort of popularity contest. I did this to server the players of Eve and it looks to me like a lot of them want more than just a "I'm sorry, I was drunk and was an asshat, can we hug and make up, I swear I'll never do it again".
I really looked forward to working with Mittens, by all accounts he is very effective in the CSM and I wanted to see how the "new" structure of the CSM worked compared to the older and less effective model I was involved in.
Here is one final point. The original purpose if the CSM was to make sure that the players had direct representation when scandals in Eve occurred. To give the player's a voice when scandals happen. If this isn't a scandal then I'm confused about the meaning of the word.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1364
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 18:41:00 -
[142] - Quote
Blake Zacary wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have to disagree with this.This isn't an ingame matter or something covered with the NDA,this was a real life mistake that even Alex said he feels absolutely ashamed about. I'm sure I'm not the only voter who is curious as to what each individual CSM rep thinks about this.This isn't the time to go into your CSM channels and work out some joint damage control. This is one of those times where people have to stand up and be counted as individuals and not hide behind a collective !
I wish I could triple like this post!
Issler |
Doctor Eezee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:12:00 -
[143] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote: I also agree with folks that pointed out this seems to be a clear violation of the ToS and many have been removed from Eve with less evidence.
How is something a player does in the real life against the ToS? "My rule is: If you meet the weakest vessel, attack; if it is a vessel equal to yours, attack; and if it is stronger than yours, also attack..." - Admiral Stepan O. Makarov |
Weloriavia
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:34:00 -
[144] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Weloriavia wrote:True true, got your attention though didnt it? Wait, so you said something over-the-top that you didn't really mean, just to get people's attention? Hmm, I wonder if anyone else in this thread may have been found guilty of such a low, despicable act. BTW, how did you turn ridiculing someone's suicidal cry for attention into slander against religions that abhor suicide? Aren't you trying to stretch the victim list just a wee bit here?
Not at all. I used an extreme scenario that is still relevant to the topic. There is nothing despicable about what I said at all. Again, not at all. He is a representative of the community. If this was just another player being slanderous towards then im sure CCP would have instigated a ban on the account. This however is the chairman of CSM7. Personally speaking I have no issue with The Mittani, his comment however hit a moral chord and I was simply trying to prove a point that a member of CSM has to think about every word that comes out. Stand down or not, it does not worry me. He seems genuinely apologetic and at the end of the day one can but hope that such comments would not be made again. The fact he recognised his behavior as being abhorrent to also shows that he has genuinely considered his actions. I am not on a witch hunt and I appreciate your viewpoint as well.
This is a game however when people are offended, someone needs to speak up. I would hope anyone with half a conscience would stand up for what they believe in. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1368
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:35:00 -
[145] - Quote
Doctor Eezee wrote:Issler Dainze wrote: I also agree with folks that pointed out this seems to be a clear violation of the ToS and many have been removed from Eve with less evidence. How is something a player does in the real life against the ToS?
By asking someone to harass someone else in game.
Issler |
Doctor Eezee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:39:00 -
[146] - Quote
Maybe you should read the ToS again.
Quote:We are not responsible for actions taken by our subscribers that occur outside the jurisdiction of our game servers or web site. "My rule is: If you meet the weakest vessel, attack; if it is a vessel equal to yours, attack; and if it is stronger than yours, also attack..." - Admiral Stepan O. Makarov |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2157
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:45:00 -
[147] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:If the rest of the CSM 7 can't find it in themselves to take a stand then I wonder how they think they deserve their position in the CSM.
As Seleene already said, the CSM is discussing the matter internally before making any public statements. You should probably think about participating, if this is an important matter to you. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Kerensky White
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:46:00 -
[148] - Quote
My question is this. Did the harassed individual in question accept Mittens personal, in game apology. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
661
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:46:00 -
[149] - Quote
Doctor Eezee wrote:Maybe you should read the ToS again. Quote:We are not responsible for actions taken by our subscribers that occur outside the jurisdiction of our game servers or web site.
Possible monkey-wrench in that argument: His actions were broadcast live through their website. Here's your sign... |
Seleene
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
1400
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:48:00 -
[150] - Quote
Blake Zacary wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have to disagree with this.This isn't an ingame matter or something covered with the NDA,this was a real life mistake that even Alex said he feels absolutely ashamed about. I'm sure I'm not the only voter who is curious as to what each individual CSM rep thinks about this.This isn't the time to go into your CSM channels and work out some joint damage control.This is one of those times where people have to stand up and be counted as individuals and not hide behind a collective !
No one is hiding behind anything, m8. But, as I said before, the CSM is a group of people and we've worked hard to not just REACT to things. Mittens / Alex did something really dumb and I've no doubt there will be consequenses. Seleene's Sandbox - My Blog, where I say stuff. Follow Seleene on Twitter |
|
Seleene
Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion
1400
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:49:00 -
[151] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have had my NDA in place since CSM 2. Waiting for the Skype information now.
Regardless, you've got email waiting to be answered it seems. v0v
Issler Dainze wrote:I started this thread because I saw repeated posted in other threads that asked the CSM for their position related to this event. If the rest of the CSM 7 can't find it in themselves to take a stand then I wonder how they think they deserve their position in the CSM.
This kind of talk is only going to alienate every other member of the CSM before you are even involved. Right now I think it's beyond debate that Mittens did something really dumb. He's owned it and apologized for it. Now we need to decide what the result of all this is. It is only fair that we allow every member of the CSM to have time to do things like get back from Iceland before any decisions are made. (Two Step is literally IN THE AIR as I type this).
I considered doing a point by point to many of your statements but I'll just leave it at this: the campaign is over and most of your posts on this subject read like you are still campaigning for something. You've earned your spot on the team so come on board and start being a team member. o7 o7
Seleene's Sandbox - My Blog, where I say stuff. Follow Seleene on Twitter |
Highauger's animated corpse
Stargate SG-1 Fatal Ascension
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:50:00 -
[152] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Blake Zacary wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have to disagree with this.This isn't an ingame matter or something covered with the NDA,this was a real life mistake that even Alex said he feels absolutely ashamed about. I'm sure I'm not the only voter who is curious as to what each individual CSM rep thinks about this.This isn't the time to go into your CSM channels and work out some joint damage control. This is one of those times where people have to stand up and be counted as individuals and not hide behind a collective ! I wish I could triple like this post! Issler
Your kind of bias is percisely why you can't 'triple like this post.'
In fact when you think about it 'OP' that says quite alot doesn't it.
Cheap and tasteless, gotta be said tho, it has something in common with Alex's comments that began all this.
However, he sir has recognised publicly his error. So do you continue now to persue?, with your motives this clear for all to see.
|
Highauger's animated corpse
Stargate SG-1 Fatal Ascension
10
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:52:00 -
[153] - Quote
Seleene wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have had my NDA in place since CSM 2. Waiting for the Skype information now. Regardless, you've got email waiting to be answered it seems. v0v Issler Dainze wrote:I started this thread because I saw repeated posted in other threads that asked the CSM for their position related to this event. If the rest of the CSM 7 can't find it in themselves to take a stand then I wonder how they think they deserve their position in the CSM. This kind of talk is only going to alienate every other member of the CSM before you are even involved. Right now I think it's beyond debate that Mittens did something really dumb. He's owned it and apologized for it. Now we need to decide what the result of all this is. It is only fair that we allow every member of the CSM to have time to do things like get back from Iceland before any decisions are made. (Two Step is literally IN THE AIR as I type this). I considered doing a point by point to many of your statements but I'll just leave it at this: the campaign is over and most of your posts on this subject read like you are still campaigning for something. You've earned your spot on the team so come on board and start being a team member. o7 o7
Respect |
Doctor Eezee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:59:00 -
[154] - Quote
Also, while I completely agree that it was out of line to ask for other people to message him, somehow there are a few things people are forgetting.
1. CCP had access to all presentations beforehand and obviously didn't object to anything. The Alliance Panel is traditionally pretty laissez-faire. People presenting drunk is not something new on this particular panel and CCP obviously doesn't mind.
2. Mittens wasn't on the alliance panel in his capacity as a CSM member. He was there to represent Goonswarm. I wasn't a particular fan of the slide in question, since Depression is unfortunately a pretty serious condition, but other people didn't seem to mind. During the CSM panel where he actually spoke in an official capacity, he was not drunk and he behaved completely professional, doing exactly the job that was expected from him.
3. Nobody seemed to mind for 2 days after the alliance panel was presented. There were no sanctions by CCP, very few comments on the slide. Not even Evenews picked it up and Riverini and Mittens are not exactly the closest of friends.
I agree he did something wrong, but he apologized and I seriously doubt he will anything like that ever happen again. The absolute most he should do is step down as chairman of the CSM and let TwoStep take over, while remaining on the CSM panel as a normal member. Removing him from the CSM alltogether will undoubtedly hurt Eve and that can't be in the interest of any player. "My rule is: If you meet the weakest vessel, attack; if it is a vessel equal to yours, attack; and if it is stronger than yours, also attack..." - Admiral Stepan O. Makarov |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
214
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:01:00 -
[155] - Quote
michaelthered wrote: I know the person who the apology was sent to personally.....and no the apology didn't "cut it". lawls
no you don't |
Doctor Eezee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:01:00 -
[156] - Quote
Oh snap, missed the snipe.
Also we saw the chatlog from The Wis, he didn't even remember that mail... "My rule is: If you meet the weakest vessel, attack; if it is a vessel equal to yours, attack; and if it is stronger than yours, also attack..." - Admiral Stepan O. Makarov |
Kerensky White
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
38
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:03:00 -
[157] - Quote
Shalee Lianne wrote:It is revolting that Mittens said what he did, and he should suffer heavy consequences for his casual disregard for someone suffering.
He should suffer more than stepping down from CSM as chair, he should be OFF CSM. He should not be allowed to represent the players of EVE at all.
You people give this jerk entirely too much pretend power.
CCP has stepped away from making pretty clothes and stepped back towards making spaceships better.
That's what this 'pretend power' has done. |
Sollana
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
233
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:07:00 -
[158] - Quote
i watched this on HD stream and tbh Mittens and Michael bolton showed just how arrogant they are.
It embarrassed they other panel members and pointed out that eve is full of "wankers", which is not the case.
CCP should ban them from attending fanfest again or anything public.
As for mittens and the CSM, well a public apology should be enuff, and appoint a new chairman |
Ad'Hakim Tahous
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
33
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:08:00 -
[159] - Quote
Seleene wrote:Blake Zacary wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have to disagree with this.This isn't an ingame matter or something covered with the NDA,this was a real life mistake that even Alex said he feels absolutely ashamed about. I'm sure I'm not the only voter who is curious as to what each individual CSM rep thinks about this.This isn't the time to go into your CSM channels and work out some joint damage control.This is one of those times where people have to stand up and be counted as individuals and not hide behind a collective ! No one is hiding behind anything, m8. But, as I said before, the CSM is a group of people and we've worked hard to not just REACT to things. Mittens / Alex did something really dumb and I've no doubt there will be consequenses.
Thank you Seleene!!! As the new CSM members consider how best to respond, might I suggest that the members also keep a channel open to CCP? If this controversy begins to spill over into media outlets beyond the gaming community, initial perceptions and reactions by the general public could have adverse consequences for further growth in Eve Online and in Dust. I suspect that CCP may be keeping a very close eye on other media outlets.
Right or wrong, good or bad, wider coverage of this controversy may begin to influence how CCP and the CSM prioritize any possible 'options' for a coordinated response. |
Elise Randolph
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
759
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:11:00 -
[160] - Quote
While I was posting Seleene made some very poised and polite comments. Nonetheless, I feel it is necessary for me to chime in because you asked me to.
Issler Dainze wrote:I started this thread because I saw repeated posted in other threads that asked the CSM for their position related to this event.
If the rest of the CSM 7 can't find it in themselves to take a stand then I wonder how they think they deserve their position in the CSM.
Not only do I find this comment to be the furthest thing from constructive, I find it deeply offensive as both a member of CSM 6 and CSM 7. Previous incarnations of the CSM proved that when the CSM act as a disjointed set of individuals, very little is achieved. However, as CSM 6 illustrated, when they step off the soap box to actually communicate with one another and act with a united front, they are able to make waves.
While you are absolutely entitled to your opinion, it is downright shameful for you to pass judgement onto CSM members while you are the only one who has yet to join in the Skype channel and the only one who is not involved in our communication.
Quote:
I knew this would further polarize any opinions about me but I didn't sign up for this to win some sort of popularity contest. I did this to server the players of Eve and it looks to me like a lot of them want more than just a "I'm sorry, I was drunk and was an asshat, can we hug and make up, I swear I'll never do it again".
I really looked forward to working with Mittens, by all accounts he is very effective in the CSM and I wanted to see how the "new" structure of the CSM worked compared to the older and less effective model I was involved in.
Here is one final point. The original purpose if the CSM was to make sure that the players had direct representation when scandals in Eve occurred. To give the player's a voice when scandals happen. If this isn't a scandal then I'm confused about the meaning of the word.
We do agree that the CSM is not a "popularity contest" and it is in fact best utilized as a communication tool between the players and CCP. Going out as a lone wolf with a megaphone and a soap box is fine as an individual, but while representing a greater body tact and communication are vital. I look forward to working with you, but please take the leap and join us so you can communicate with the CSM without blindly throwing us under the bus. The most active in-game of any CSM, ever! Vote Elise Randolph for CSM 7, there is no substitute for activity! |
|
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
158
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:18:00 -
[161] - Quote
Elise Randolph wrote:We do agree that the CSM is not a "popularity contest" and it is in fact best utilized as a communication tool between the players and CCP. Going out as a lone wolf with a megaphone and a soap box is fine as an individual, but while representing a greater body tact and communication are vital. I look forward to working with you, but please take the leap and join us so you can communicate with the CSM without blindly throwing us under the bus.
And yet you still cannot bring yourselves to give any negative feedback about your imperious leader - did he display the poise and tact that you're accusing Issler of now not having? I notice you'll do THAT publically.
Guess it'll be another year of "no shade between us".
"Then we shall CSM in the shade!" My EVE YouTube Channel |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1370
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:23:00 -
[162] - Quote
Doctor Eezee wrote:Also, while I completely agree that it was out of line to ask for other people to message him, somehow there are a few things people are forgetting.
1. CCP had access to all presentations beforehand and obviously didn't object to anything. The Alliance Panel is traditionally pretty laissez-faire. People presenting drunk is not something new on this particular panel and CCP obviously doesn't mind.
2. Mittens wasn't on the alliance panel in his capacity as a CSM member. He was there to represent Goonswarm. I wasn't a particular fan of the slide in question, since Depression is unfortunately a pretty serious condition, but other people didn't seem to mind. During the CSM panel where he actually spoke in an official capacity, he was not drunk and he behaved completely professional, doing exactly the job that was expected from him.
3. Nobody seemed to mind for 2 days after the alliance panel was presented. There were no sanctions by CCP, very few comments on the slide. Not even Evenews picked it up and Riverini and Mittens are not exactly the closest of friends.
I agree he did something wrong, but he apologized and I seriously doubt he will anything like that ever happen again. The absolute most he should do is step down as chairman of the CSM and let TwoStep take over, while remaining on the CSM panel as a normal member. Removing him from the CSM alltogether will undoubtedly hurt Eve and that can't be in the interest of any player.
Protests, even a cry from goons for Mittens to step down started almost immediately after the panel. So it wasn't quiet for several days. I was up till 2:00 AM trying to catch the repeat feed (which I think CCP broke on purpose) to figure out what the kerfuffle was about. It wasn't till someone posted a link to a youtube of the panel that I saw what the protesters were going on about.
I actually am concerned about your point that CCP had this material in advance. I'm expecting CCP meeds to explain that.
Issler
|
Arkady Vachon
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
20
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:24:00 -
[163] - Quote
To Seleene, Elise, and Hans - I am curious, is there a procedure in place for transfer of the Chair to another CSM member? Is it just appointed by the current Chair, or is there a voting process involved?
Of course, that makes me curious about instances where a CSM Chair would have to be removed from their position if they did not resign willingly, does CCP make that call, or does the rest of the CSM initiate something along the lines like a vote of 'No Confidence' to enable their removal.
Note that on this last part I am not saying that this is what should be done, obviously, but am curious as to the procedures involved, if any.
Thanks in advance. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2158
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:25:00 -
[164] - Quote
Ad'Hakim Tahous wrote: Thank you Seleene!!! As the new CSM members consider how best to respond, might I suggest that the members also keep a channel open to CCP?
As has been stated many times throughout the campaign, the CSM and CCP work together constantly through a persistent conversation over Skype. So yes, we do have a channel open, and we make good use of it.
Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:25:00 -
[165] - Quote
[quote=Elise Randolph]While you are absolutely entitled to your opinion, it is downright shameful for you to pass judgement onto CSM members while you are the only one who has yet to join in the Skype channel and the only one who is not involved in our communication. [quote]
He shoots, he scores. |
LtTysander
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:27:00 -
[166] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Doctor Eezee wrote:Also, while I completely agree that it was out of line to ask for other people to message him, somehow there are a few things people are forgetting.
1. CCP had access to all presentations beforehand and obviously didn't object to anything. The Alliance Panel is traditionally pretty laissez-faire. People presenting drunk is not something new on this particular panel and CCP obviously doesn't mind.
2. Mittens wasn't on the alliance panel in his capacity as a CSM member. He was there to represent Goonswarm. I wasn't a particular fan of the slide in question, since Depression is unfortunately a pretty serious condition, but other people didn't seem to mind. During the CSM panel where he actually spoke in an official capacity, he was not drunk and he behaved completely professional, doing exactly the job that was expected from him.
3. Nobody seemed to mind for 2 days after the alliance panel was presented. There were no sanctions by CCP, very few comments on the slide. Not even Evenews picked it up and Riverini and Mittens are not exactly the closest of friends.
I agree he did something wrong, but he apologized and I seriously doubt he will anything like that ever happen again. The absolute most he should do is step down as chairman of the CSM and let TwoStep take over, while remaining on the CSM panel as a normal member. Removing him from the CSM alltogether will undoubtedly hurt Eve and that can't be in the interest of any player. Protests, even a cry from goons for Mittens to step down started almost immediately after the panel. So it wasn't quiet for several days. I was up till 2:00 AM trying to catch the repeat feed (which I think CCP broke on purpose) to figure out what the kerfuffle was about. It wasn't till someone posted a link to a youtube of the panel that I saw what the protesters were going on about. I actually am concerned about your point that CCP had this material in advance. I'm expecting CCP meeds to explain that. Issler
No we are not calling for him to step down you are being stupid for fabricating such information. If you're going to say something like that, back it up. Unless you want to keep up with your hyperbole and make yourself look even more ridiculous. |
knobber Jobbler
Seniors Clan Get Off My Lawn
97
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:37:00 -
[167] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Doctor Eezee wrote:Also, while I completely agree that it was out of line to ask for other people to message him, somehow there are a few things people are forgetting.
1. CCP had access to all presentations beforehand and obviously didn't object to anything. The Alliance Panel is traditionally pretty laissez-faire. People presenting drunk is not something new on this particular panel and CCP obviously doesn't mind.
2. Mittens wasn't on the alliance panel in his capacity as a CSM member. He was there to represent Goonswarm. I wasn't a particular fan of the slide in question, since Depression is unfortunately a pretty serious condition, but other people didn't seem to mind. During the CSM panel where he actually spoke in an official capacity, he was not drunk and he behaved completely professional, doing exactly the job that was expected from him.
3. Nobody seemed to mind for 2 days after the alliance panel was presented. There were no sanctions by CCP, very few comments on the slide. Not even Evenews picked it up and Riverini and Mittens are not exactly the closest of friends.
I agree he did something wrong, but he apologized and I seriously doubt he will anything like that ever happen again. The absolute most he should do is step down as chairman of the CSM and let TwoStep take over, while remaining on the CSM panel as a normal member. Removing him from the CSM alltogether will undoubtedly hurt Eve and that can't be in the interest of any player. Protests, even a cry from goons for Mittens to step down started almost immediately after the panel. So it wasn't quiet for several days. I was up till 2:00 AM trying to catch the repeat feed (which I think CCP broke on purpose) to figure out what the kerfuffle was about. It wasn't till someone posted a link to a youtube of the panel that I saw what the protesters were going on about. I actually am concerned about your point that CCP had this material in advance. I'm expecting CCP meeds to explain that. Issler
Dude, you're in the CSM, please start behaving like it. You're not here in the capacity of a CEO to a major null sec alliance.
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1372
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:40:00 -
[168] - Quote
Elise Randolph wrote:While I was posting Seleene made some very poised and polite comments. Nonetheless, I feel it is necessary for me to chime in because you asked me to. Issler Dainze wrote:I started this thread because I saw repeated posted in other threads that asked the CSM for their position related to this event.
If the rest of the CSM 7 can't find it in themselves to take a stand then I wonder how they think they deserve their position in the CSM.
Not only do I find this comment to be the furthest thing from constructive, I find it deeply offensive as both a member of CSM 6 and CSM 7. Previous incarnations of the CSM proved that when the CSM act as a disjointed set of individuals, very little is achieved. However, as CSM 6 illustrated, when they step off the soap box to actually communicate with one another and act with a united front, they are able to make waves. While you are absolutely entitled to your opinion, it is downright shameful for you to pass judgement onto CSM members while you are the only one who has yet to join in the Skype channel and the only one who is not involved in our communication. Quote:
I knew this would further polarize any opinions about me but I didn't sign up for this to win some sort of popularity contest. I did this to server the players of Eve and it looks to me like a lot of them want more than just a "I'm sorry, I was drunk and was an asshat, can we hug and make up, I swear I'll never do it again".
I really looked forward to working with Mittens, by all accounts he is very effective in the CSM and I wanted to see how the "new" structure of the CSM worked compared to the older and less effective model I was involved in.
Here is one final point. The original purpose if the CSM was to make sure that the players had direct representation when scandals in Eve occurred. To give the player's a voice when scandals happen. If this isn't a scandal then I'm confused about the meaning of the word.
We do agree that the CSM is not a "popularity contest" and it is in fact best utilized as a communication tool between the players and CCP. Going out as a lone wolf with a megaphone and a soap box is fine as an individual, but while representing a greater body tact and communication are vital. I look forward to working with you, but please take the leap and join us so you can communicate with the CSM without blindly throwing us under the bus.
I'm not throwing anyone under the bus, I'm responding to the players that elected me to take a stand. And that only a few other of the CSM feels a need to provide the same player representation is puzzling. To stay quiet and worry about "the message" behind closed doors is exactly what the players fear about the CSM's lack of transparency to the players.
There isn't anything to think about. Either you thought what Mittens did was OK and sit on the sidelines (or even seem to support him) or you honestly address the players with your thoughts and what outcomes you think are appropriate.
Boy CSM 7 is off to a great start!
Issler
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1372
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:42:00 -
[169] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Ad'Hakim Tahous wrote: Thank you Seleene!!! As the new CSM members consider how best to respond, might I suggest that the members also keep a channel open to CCP?
As has been stated many times throughout the campaign, the CSM and CCP work together constantly through a persistent conversation over Skype. So yes, we do have a channel open, and we make good use of it.
I am sure the players will be very impressed with your strong statement regarding the issue at hand.
Issler |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
216
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:48:00 -
[170] - Quote
ahahaha issler showing why nobody let her on a csm since #2 |
|
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
216
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:48:00 -
[171] - Quote
gonna matter less than d3 at this rate |
Mr Vrix
Vrix Nation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:50:00 -
[172] - Quote
Kerensky White wrote:Shalee Lianne wrote:It is revolting that Mittens said what he did, and he should suffer heavy consequences for his casual disregard for someone suffering.
He should suffer more than stepping down from CSM as chair, he should be OFF CSM. He should not be allowed to represent the players of EVE at all.
You people give this jerk entirely too much pretend power. CCP has stepped away from making pretty clothes and stepped back towards making spaceships better. That's what this 'pretend power' has done.
mayby if ya pull ya head out of his ass ya not so blind anymore, alot blind sheeps in goons
csm is a pr program for ccp nothingh more,
its because crapload of ppl stopped paying there accounts and the mass protest at jita that ccp was all OMG and changed stuff
they yust feed csm somestuff but the important stuff is not for csm eyes, except when ccp has alrdy decided todoit they tell csm yust a little before they do the playerbase |
LtTysander
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:50:00 -
[173] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Ad'Hakim Tahous wrote: Thank you Seleene!!! As the new CSM members consider how best to respond, might I suggest that the members also keep a channel open to CCP?
As has been stated many times throughout the campaign, the CSM and CCP work together constantly through a persistent conversation over Skype. So yes, we do have a channel open, and we make good use of it. I am sure the players will be very impressed with your strong statement regarding the issue at hand. Issler
The thing is it is a non-issue that you are actively trying to make into an issue. The player of which you are so concerned about is fine. Mittani has apologized and has made amends, that is the end of the story. What you are trying to do here is exasperate what is essentially an offhand comment made by somebody that was drunk in a forum in which he was there in no official capacity. He was on the alliance panel not there as CSM. |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
428
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:50:00 -
[174] - Quote
My statement on the Mitanni (and incidentally Issler "accepting" his apology though she sure doesn't act like it)
For me statement on Isslergate: At this point, you're doing more harm to the CSM than anything Mitanni has done. And I'd tell you that in person if you bothered talking to the rest of us. www.noirmercs.com Now Recruiting CSM7, CSM 4 |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:54:00 -
[175] - Quote
I am literally becoming less impressed with issler by the minute. She is completely unwilling to work with a team, reactionary, hysterical, accusatory, and generally offensive not only to her fellow CSM members, but players of this game.
I suggest she step down from the CSM as she is incapable of keeping a level head and working through this issue calmly. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Dovinian
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1039
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:59:00 -
[176] - Quote
Other members of the CSM have summed up what I would have said so I won't just recycle what they have stated.
It's pretty simple. Alex made a mistake, he owned it and is working on taking the steps to make it right.
Issler, you're not doing your constituents any favors by your actions and decisions, you're absolutely causing more harm than solving whatever issues you have. |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1987
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:59:00 -
[177] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I'm not throwing anyone under the bus, I'm responding to the players that elected me to take a stand. And that only a few other of the CSM feels a need to provide the same player representation is puzzling. To stay quiet and worry about "the message" behind closed doors is exactly what the players fear about the CSM's lack of transparency to the players. Michelle, might I suggest that the best way you could be of service to the players is to get your NDA signed so we can get you on skype and explain what is going on?
I do not think it is unreasonable for us to take a collective breath and take a day or two to decide on the best course of action, and that decision is one that you should be involved in.
Best Trebor The Sarcasm is Strong with Me GÇó Member of CSM 5-7 GÇó Blog |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
320
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:04:00 -
[178] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
Issler
No, Issler, it isn't. And being an experienced political operator, I think you know why.
Despite how utterly reprehensible that was, there is nothing of morality in this, it is simple political reality:
Any perceived support of Mittani through this will tar you all with that brush, especially as a lot of people still see the CSM as a monolithic "nullsec mafia," and given how disgusting that incident was, that would be political--and ergo sum, operational in the year ahead--suicide for even the most respected CSMs.
You need to cut your losses and wash your hands of that filth, in as harsh, open, and expedient a manner as possible.
Sorry, Mittens: But maybe this'll teach you a thing or two about holding your liquor? Typical yuppie lightweight!
TL/DR:
Mittani has turned himself into a very, very big loose end for you on the CSM, and arguably for EVE in general if some of what I've seen in the broader gaming press is any indication.
Tie up that loose end. Like, immediately.
In irae, veritas. |
Ajita al Tchar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
164
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:06:00 -
[179] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:
There isn't anything to think about. Either you thought what Mittens did was OK and sit on the sidelines (or even seem to support him) or you honestly address the players with your thoughts and what outcomes you think are appropriate.
Why isn't there anything to think about? Sometimes "the right thing to do" and "the best thing to do" are not the same thing, even if all involved agree as far as whether something was right or wrong (questions of morality do often tend to polarize people, especially if those who view things as mostly black and white become involved). (NB, I'm using "right" here as meaning something synonymous with "moral" rather than "the right course of action", which I'm explicitly saying are not always one and the same.)
I think it's necessary for the CSM to eventually communicate their stance on the situation, but it's completely unnecessary for the *entire* dialog to be conducted in public, or to demand that each person take a stance at once. They may have their mind made up on the subject of whether what Mittens said was okay or not, but they may not necessarily feel comfortable saying with certainty what their stance on Mitts and the CSM position is because they may not be sure if they are missing something (as a result of personal bias, not being privy to some information, hangovers, travel stress, you name it). Deciding on a course of action that will have fairly significant effects is usually a good idea after you've viewed the issue from many sides and, if possible, discussed it with others. Once again, the decision you come to believe is a good one when it comes to Mittens staying or leaving may contradict your personal opinion of the morality of his actions, and that's okay because sometimes you have to put your opinions aside when working for others' benefit.
Anyway, I think it would be good if you chilled out on the passionate posting until after this Skype meeting, Issler. It's beginning to feel like a stubborn rant. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1375
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:06:00 -
[180] - Quote
I'm pretty sure when the players in multiple threads in general asked what the CSM thought of the incident they expected an answer in the forums, not in a private Skype channel.
Sorry, but this didn't need a hive mind meeting to come up with a cleverly crafted collective message. The rest of the CSM staying quiet is what is damaging the CSM.
Ask yourself what your message from your silence is to the people the elected you.
Even if the other CSM members had share something as simple as "Yes, it seems as though many found the action offensive we are happy to see Mittens has offered an apology in the forums and we are working with CCP to make sure the best interests of the players and Eve in general are the focus of whatever action results from their investigation." you would have been better than trying to focus this on me because I responded to the players and took a stand.
I've said what I needed to say. I hope the other CSM will now give the players what they deserve when they elected you.
As for Skype and not talking to you, not really an option while I'm at work, sorry. I'll be on soon enough, can't wait for that.
Issler |
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1375
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:07:00 -
[181] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:I'm not throwing anyone under the bus, I'm responding to the players that elected me to take a stand. And that only a few other of the CSM feels a need to provide the same player representation is puzzling. To stay quiet and worry about "the message" behind closed doors is exactly what the players fear about the CSM's lack of transparency to the players. Michelle, might I suggest that the best way you could be of service to the players is to get your NDA signed so we can get you on skype and explain what is going on? I do not think it is unreasonable for us to take a collective breath and take a day or two to decide on the best course of action, and that decision is one that you should be involved in. Best Trebor
My NDA is on place, has been for years. I've posted my last post in my position.
I should be on Skype this evening.
Issler |
Della Monk
Broski Enterprises Elite Space Guild
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:10:00 -
[182] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I'm pretty sure when the players in multiple threads in general asked what the CSM thought of the incident they expected an answer in the forums, not in a private Skype channel.
Nah, I expected to hear they were discussing it and for a collective response to come shortly after. You know, like CSM6 did to great effect. Keeping track of all you politikers is too much effort |
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
109
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:23:00 -
[183] - Quote
Della Monk wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:I'm pretty sure when the players in multiple threads in general asked what the CSM thought of the incident they expected an answer in the forums, not in a private Skype channel. Nah, I expected to hear they were discussing it and for a collective response to come shortly after. You know, like CSM6 did to great effect. Keeping track of all you politikers is too much effort Why bother present a unified front? Michelle here obviously feels she can take the reigns and charge ahead without any concern for Alex or the rest of the CSM. You people elected this emotionally unstable child. Congrats~ |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
428
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:31:00 -
[184] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I'm pretty sure when the players in multiple threads in general asked what the CSM thought of the incident they expected an answer in the forums, not in a private Skype channel. Sorry, but this didn't need a hive mind meeting to come up with a cleverly crafted collective message. The rest of the CSM staying quiet is what is damaging the CSM. Ask yourself what your message from your silence is to the people the elected you. Even if the other CSM members had share something as simple as "Yes, it seems as though many found the action offensive we are happy to see Mittens has offered an apology in the forums and we are working with CCP to make sure the best interests of the players and Eve in general are the focus of whatever action results from their investigation." you would have been better than trying to focus this on me because I responded to the players and took a stand. I've said what I needed to say. I hope the other CSM will now give the players what they deserve when they elected you. As for Skype and not talking to you, not really an option while I'm at work, sorry. I'll be on soon enough, can't wait for that. Issler
1. I think the players deserve more than knee jerk reactions, or in your case gleeful political dog piling, when they ask us for answers on this or any issue.
2. The CSM has not been quiet, we just haven't been trying to start up a mob with a megaphone.
3. That's pretty much exactly what my post said. It's good to know that not only do you lack the respect for the CSM to talk to your colleague before you publicly ask for his resignation or talk to any of us directly as opposed to public flame posting, but you lack the fundamental respect for us, the CSM, and the players to actually read what we say to you in public (the only manner in which you will communicate at all).
4. I believe the players deserve a lot better than what you're giving them. Never before has any CSM acted like this office was the place to launch a 24/7/365 reelection campaign, nor so thoroughly and transparently tried to advance their personal aggrandizement by bull-dogging a fellow CSM member who is doing everything he can do make thing right after an unfortunate mistake.
5. Your actions are insulting to me, insulting to the other CSMs, insulting to the institution of the CSM, and a fundamental failure of your primary duty to serve the interests of the players and the game. Frankly, it is absolutely disgusting and I am both very surprised and very disappointed to have to say that about you. Unlike you, however, I plan on waiting till I CAN talk to you privately before doing something like calling for your resignation. www.noirmercs.com Now Recruiting CSM7, CSM 4 |
Ajita al Tchar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
164
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:34:00 -
[185] - Quote
I make most of my EVE spacebucks via industry and as such I'm pretty interested in industry-related stuff being much improved upon (including high sec mining though it's not something I do myself, but I do benefit from it not going the way of the dodo). That said, I'm sorry, Issler, but I'm very happy I gave my votes to the person I gave my votes to and not you after reading all you've written during this whole CSM-Mittani debacle. My reasons are pretty simple. One can have tons of great ideas and generally be a pretty smart cookie, but if they have no political acumen, they can do more harm than good by getting involved in politics, and probably watch their ideas go up in smoke. This is precisely the reason why I think Mittani should stay in the CSM, he's pretty good at this politics thing and can lead an effective council that helps get good things done. If you end up with a reputation of being a ranty crazy high sec carebear miner, your ideas might end up marked as not so good despite their actual merit, just by association.
But maybe I'm just being callous by being pretty convinced that booting Mittani would be a mistake. I do have firsthand experience with depression and suicidal impulses and quite literally start every day with medication that keeps me from going over the edge, but even this doesn't change my opinion since I, for one, would like to see an effective CSM 7. |
knobber Jobbler
Seniors Clan Get Off My Lawn
97
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:34:00 -
[186] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I'm pretty sure when the players in multiple threads in general asked what the CSM thought of the incident they expected an answer in the forums, not in a private Skype channel. Sorry, but this didn't need a hive mind meeting to come up with a cleverly crafted collective message. The rest of the CSM staying quiet is what is damaging the CSM. Ask yourself what your message from your silence is to the people the elected you. Even if the other CSM members had share something as simple as "Yes, it seems as though many found the action offensive we are happy to see Mittens has offered an apology in the forums and we are working with CCP to make sure the best interests of the players and Eve in general are the focus of whatever action results from their investigation." you would have been better than trying to focus this on me because I responded to the players and took a stand. I've said what I needed to say. I hope the other CSM will now give the players what they deserve when they elected you. As for Skype and not talking to you, not really an option while I'm at work, sorry. I'll be on soon enough, can't wait for that. Issler
You're damaging it. You're 1 step away from Darius right now.
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1566
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:34:00 -
[187] - Quote
Lets keep a sense of perspective here. Issler Dainze is not the person who has currently dragged the reputation of both the CSM chair and the wider Eve community through the mud in the eyes of the gaming press and ruined what should have been a clean sweep of good coverage following an exceptional fanfest.
And if this CSM starts looking like a playground gang seeking to give Issler a kicking because its become upset that the golden boy Mittani has become unsupportable as chair, then its going to have next to zero credibility going forwards.
I'm happy that CSM takes some time to formulate a collective positive on who should be the next chair and how to announce Alexander Gianturco's resignation - I'm less happy to see the rather pathetic and florid displays of sychopantic bleating issued on several threads today from pretty gutless CSM's bleating out pledges of eternal loyality to the "great leader" despite the grevious errors of judgement and behaviour he has recently displayed.
And some clue for those without a clue.
The approach that CSM 6 in terms of "collective presentation" was not universally appreciated. A lot of players wanted to see who believed what and who had argued for which policy and idea. Having Mittens as the frontman to a shadowy council of collective decision-making without us getting to see the votes and breakdown of the arguments looked quite dodgy on some levels. This discontent was apparent with the reveal of the winter minutes you might remember.
Don't make the mistake of believing the Mittani approach was very popular with eve at large. Plenty of people want to see more transparency and to see for ourselves that work is actually being done and decisions made by genuine discussion and honest process.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:39:00 -
[188] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lets keep a sense of perspective here. You are reading a Jade Constantine post, and I am only marginally better than Issler on my best of days.
hey i thought i would fix this for you |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
219
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:40:00 -
[189] - Quote
Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. |
Blake Zacary
Nobilium Coalition Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:43:00 -
[190] - Quote
Seleene wrote:Blake Zacary wrote:Seleene wrote:Vile rat wrote: You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****. I'm going to +1 this for a couple reasons: The last CSM was very effective because we worked hard to stay in touch and not get publicly combative and look dysfunctional. Issler, you should probably sort out your NDA and get into Skype with the rest of us. We obviously have an issue to resolve but this isn't the way to go about it. Hell, some of us are asleep, just waking up or even still in Iceland. I have to disagree with this.This isn't an ingame matter or something covered with the NDA,this was a real life mistake that even Alex said he feels absolutely ashamed about. I'm sure I'm not the only voter who is curious as to what each individual CSM rep thinks about this.This isn't the time to go into your CSM channels and work out some joint damage control.This is one of those times where people have to stand up and be counted as individuals and not hide behind a collective ! No one is hiding behind anything, m8. But, as I said before, the CSM is a group of people and we've worked hard to not just REACT to things. Mittens / Alex did something really dumb and I've no doubt there will be consequenses. I'm not asking anyone to 'just react' to it,what I would like to see is open,honest and clear opinions from individual CSM reps.What I don't think is good for the CSM is closing ranks and keeping things secret till you release a joint blanket statement,which is what appears to be happening !
|
|
Kallynda Nai
Tightpants Inc
26
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:44:00 -
[191] - Quote
Who voted for this idiot, honestly? |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
160
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:44:00 -
[192] - Quote
Blake Zacary wrote:No one is hiding behind anything, m8. But, as I said before, the CSM is a group of people and we've worked hard to not just REACT to things. Mittens / Alex did something really dumb and I've no doubt there will be consequenses. I'm not asking anyone to 'just react' to it,what I would like to see is open,honest and clear opinions from individual CSM reps.What I don't think is good for the CSM is closing ranks and keeping things secret till you release a joint blanket statement,which is what appears to be happening !
[/quote]
^^ This.
What happened was a matter of personal degredation and it happaned because of a lack of character by the CSM Chair.
Now what people are wondering is ... are the rest of them like that?
Closing ranks and issuing a joint statement says "yes".
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
44
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:47:00 -
[193] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lets keep a sense of perspective here. Issler Dainze is not the person who has currently dragged the reputation of both the CSM chair and the wider Eve community through the mud in the eyes of the gaming press and ruined what should have been a clean sweep of good coverage following an exceptional fanfest.
And if this CSM starts looking like a playground gang seeking to give Issler a kicking because its become upset that the golden boy Mittani has become unsupportable as chair, then its going to have next to zero credibility going forwards.
I'm happy that CSM takes some time to formulate a collective positive on who should be the next chair and how to announce Alexander Gianturco's resignation - I'm less happy to see the rather pathetic and florid displays of sychopantic bleating issued on several threads today from pretty gutless CSM's mewling out mealy mouthed pledges of eternal loyality to the "great leader" despite the grevious errors of judgement and behaviour he has recently displayed.
And some clue for those without a clue.
The approach that CSM 6 in terms of "collective presentation" was not universally appreciated. A lot of players wanted to see who believed what and who had argued for which policy and idea. Having Mittens as the frontman to a shadowy council of collective decision-making without us getting to see the votes and breakdown of the arguments looked quite dodgy on some levels. This discontent was apparent with the reveal of the winter minutes you might remember.
Don't make the mistake of believing the Mittani approach was very popular with eve at large. Plenty of people want to see more transparency and to see for ourselves that work is actually being done and decisions made by genuine discussion and honest process.
Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here.
i cant even figure out what the hell hes really even on about
apparently 'the people' are up in arms about something stupid said by a drunk that got posted on a blog and blah blah transparency and something something pro-mittani csm conspiracy
e: this is not a fake post, i sincerely dont get it
also, snype |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1571
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:48:00 -
[194] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here.
Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide.
Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure.
That about covers it
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:49:00 -
[195] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lets keep a sense of perspective here. Issler Dainze is not the person who has currently dragged the reputation of both the CSM chair and the wider Eve community through the mud in the eyes of the gaming press and ruined what should have been a clean sweep of good coverage following an exceptional fanfest. She has, however, fanned the flames of a volatile issue for her own perceived political gain. Rather than work with a team and possibly post a dissenting opinion after the fact, or even stress to her team the need for individual opinions, she goes off half-cocked without even discussing the matter with The Mittani himself. The lack of respect she has shown to her fellow CSM members in this thread convinces me she is not at all suitable for the post. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
44
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:49:00 -
[196] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Blake Zacary wrote:I'm not asking anyone to 'just react' to it,what I would like to see is open,honest and clear opinions from individual CSM reps.What I don't think is good for the CSM is closing ranks and keeping things secret till you release a joint blanket statement,which is what appears to be happening !
^^ This. What happened was a matter of personal degredation and it happaned because of a lack of character by the CSM Chair. Now what people are wondering is ... are the rest of them like that? Closing ranks and issuing a joint statement says "yes".
and i would like to propose a much deeper queston, on the assumption that everything in your post is 100% correct
so what? |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
44
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:50:00 -
[197] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it
having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power' |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:54:00 -
[198] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it
Can you please stop trying to fluff up bad ideas and bad posting by being overly verbose and using terrible metaphors like "monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker"? It doesn't impress anyone.
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1571
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:55:00 -
[199] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lets keep a sense of perspective here. Issler Dainze is not the person who has currently dragged the reputation of both the CSM chair and the wider Eve community through the mud in the eyes of the gaming press and ruined what should have been a clean sweep of good coverage following an exceptional fanfest. She has, however, fanned the flames of a volatile issue for her own perceived political gain. Rather than work with a team and possibly post a dissenting opinion after the fact, or even stress to her team the need for individual opinions, she goes off half-cocked without even discussing the matter with The Mittani himself. The lack of respect she has shown to her fellow CSM members in this thread convinces me she is not at all suitable for the post.
In any rational assessment the Mittani (Alexander Gianturco) is finished as CSM chair. I imagine at this point he's literally holding his head in his hands and talking to his wife about whether he can even afford to continue being associated with the game of eve online after his performance at fanfest. The quite literal professional "suicide" he committed there IS that bad.
As for Issler she looks like being scapegoated at the moment. Understand, I didn't vote for her, I didn't much like her policies. But she is trying to push an agenda of personal responsibility from the current CSM team where we get to see what each of them actually *think* about this crisis rather than disappearing behind a magic curtain and letting the "wizard" tell us how its going to be.
Sure she could probably be handling it better, could have waited to say something, could have done skype from a laptop or something, could be in coms somehow whatever. But I do get the impression she is at least in tune with the understanding a lot of us have about how far off message into the hinterlands of lunacy the current CSM chair has gone.
Other CSM's seem to closing ranks and trying to laugh it off and tell us how it doesn't matter because the mining barge guy didn't actually die - but that is so not the point.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
162
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:56:00 -
[200] - Quote
Sir Marksalot wrote:
and i would like to propose a much deeper queston, on the assumption that everything in your post is 100% correct
so what?
You're right, I guess we'll go back to being indifferent about CSM - after all, what's the point right ?
My EVE YouTube Channel |
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Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
219
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:56:00 -
[201] - Quote
much like jade needed to fluff up his avatar for his space brothel to hide his hideous self he needs to fluff up his posting to hide its hideous ideas |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:56:00 -
[202] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:michaelthered wrote: I know the person who the apology was sent to personally.....and no the apology didn't "cut it". lawls
no you don't
actually I do. ANd not just since fanfest happened..... |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
220
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:58:00 -
[203] - Quote
no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
220
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 21:58:00 -
[204] - Quote
like come on put a little effort into your fakeposting |
thatboydc
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:00:00 -
[205] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:HURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
every time i think that the pubbies on GOONFLEET DOT COM are terrible posters i somehow find one of your posts and jesus christ you make thunderwaffe look like OG SA posters
i mean seriously you are terrible your posts are terrible and you should feel terrible |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
220
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:01:00 -
[206] - Quote
yes lets all ask the creepy looking aspie who ran a space brothel about normal human behavior this is sure to generate useful information
|
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:03:00 -
[207] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lets keep a sense of perspective here. Issler Dainze is not the person who has currently dragged the reputation of both the CSM chair and the wider Eve community through the mud in the eyes of the gaming press and ruined what should have been a clean sweep of good coverage following an exceptional fanfest. She has, however, fanned the flames of a volatile issue for her own perceived political gain. Rather than work with a team and possibly post a dissenting opinion after the fact, or even stress to her team the need for individual opinions, she goes off half-cocked without even discussing the matter with The Mittani himself. The lack of respect she has shown to her fellow CSM members in this thread convinces me she is not at all suitable for the post. In any rational assessment the Mittani (Alexander Gianturco) is finished as CSM chair. I imagine at this point he's literally holding his head in his hands and talking to his wife about whether he can even afford to continue being associated with the game of eve online after his performance at fanfest. The quite literal professional "suicide" he committed there IS that bad. As for Issler she looks like being scapegoated at the moment. Understand, I didn't vote for her, I didn't much like her policies. But she is trying to push an agenda of personal responsibility from the current CSM team where we get to see what each of them actually *think* about this crisis rather than disappearing behind a magic curtain and letting the "wizard" tell us how its going to be. Sure she could probably be handling it better, could have waited to say something, could have done skype from a laptop or something, could be in coms somehow whatever. But I do get the impression she is at least in tune with the understanding a lot of us have about how far off message into the hinterlands of lunacy the current CSM chair has gone. Other CSM's seem to closing ranks and trying to laugh it off and tell us how it doesn't matter because the mining barge guy didn't actually die - but that is so not the point.
First, mittens did a stupid goddamn thing. Now that the introduction is over with...
Second, it doesn't really matter because the guy was a typical internet attention *****. They're everywhere.
But more importantly!
Quote:In any rational assessment the Mittani (Alexander Gianturco) is finished as CSM chair. I imagine at this point he's literally holding his head in his hands and talking to his wife about whether he can even afford to continue being associated with the game of eve online after his performance at fanfest. The quite literal professional "suicide" he committed there IS that bad.
That, that right there. Explain to me how exactly this means mittens has to quit eve? Or the chair? Am I falling for a giant troll? |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
220
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:04:00 -
[208] - Quote
you're falling for a giant troll, it's just from god in the form of jade constatine being an actual human being |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:05:00 -
[209] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:yes lets all ask the creepy looking aspie who ran a space brothel about normal human behavior this is sure to generate useful information
Retar Aveymone wrote:you're falling for a giant troll, it's just from god in the form of jade constatine being an actual human being
hahaha he did what?
**** me I fell for the troll |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:07:00 -
[210] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:In any rational assessment the Mittani (Alexander Gianturco) is finished as CSM chair. I imagine at this point he's literally holding his head in his hands and talking to his wife about whether he can even afford to continue being associated with the game of eve online after his performance at fanfest. The quite literal professional "suicide" he committed there IS that bad. I highly doubt that. I think he's probably wondering what sort of idiotic world we live in where someone playing a video game uses real-life suicide as a bargaining device.
Jade Constantine wrote:As for Issler she looks like being scapegoated at the moment. Understand, I didn't vote for her, I didn't much like her policies. But she is trying to push an agenda of personal responsibility from the current CSM team where we get to see what each of them actually *think* about this crisis rather than disappearing behind a magic curtain and letting the "wizard" tell us how its going to be.
Sure she could probably be handling it better, could have waited to say something, could have done skype from a laptop or something, could be in coms somehow whatever. But I do get the impression she is at least in tune with the understanding a lot of us have about how far off message into the hinterlands of lunacy the current CSM chair has gone. IMO, Issler is doing more damage to the CSM than The Mittani did with his drunken outburst. The Mittani will probably just fade away. Issler, on the other hand, we seem to be stuck with. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
|
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
150
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:07:00 -
[211] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lets keep a sense of perspective here. Issler Dainze is not the person who has currently dragged the reputation of both the CSM chair and the wider Eve community through the mud in the eyes of the gaming press and ruined what should have been a clean sweep of good coverage following an exceptional fanfest. She has, however, fanned the flames of a volatile issue for her own perceived political gain. Rather than work with a team and possibly post a dissenting opinion after the fact, or even stress to her team the need for individual opinions, she goes off half-cocked without even discussing the matter with The Mittani himself. The lack of respect she has shown to her fellow CSM members in this thread convinces me she is not at all suitable for the post.
Yeah I can see him literally sitting in the dining room, one hand on his head covering his eyes so no one can see his tears and the other clutching feebly at his wifes hand as she reassures him that there is no way he could lose...
~all of this~ |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:14:00 -
[212] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you
yes i really do. I know Wis...have spoken to him on coms. A very nice man. **** we ran some missions together one night cause we were bored. The dude is a straight up nice guy.
Here's my point cause i give a **** about all this eve politics bullshit and whether this dude has to step down or not....it's so inconsequential to me. But if it's ok to step into somebody's real life in such a disgusting, vile manner....than the consequences should also be "real life", and not this eve video game bullshit. Maybe we all should have a real life meat up and get this **** settled then......you guys think it's ok, and others don't.....let's get out from the safety of our parents firewalls for a moment and see whats what. If you want to step outside the parameters of this game cause "eve is real" you know....then lets see what y'all are capable of when you have to look a man eye to eye. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1574
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:15:00 -
[213] - Quote
D Derp wrote:Quote:In any rational assessment the Mittani (Alexander Gianturco) is finished as CSM chair. I imagine at this point he's literally holding his head in his hands and talking to his wife about whether he can even afford to continue being associated with the game of eve online after his performance at fanfest. The quite literal professional "suicide" he committed there IS that bad. That, that right there. Explain to me how exactly this means mittens has to quit eve? Or the chair? Am I falling for a giant troll?
He might choose to quit eve himself. He might choose to resign from csm chair himself (it is the right thing to do) he might quit csm himself (also perhaps the right thing). But if he doesn't then CCP is going to need to act and they would be immeasurably helped by the remaining CSM actually manning up and realizing that one of them is going to need to be chair in order to return a bit of self-respect to the office after the disaster that was the fanfest alliance panel.
Now perhaps you are a bit insulated from the almost universal disgust at what happened on that panel by virtue of your peers (who admittedly don't seem to realize what was wrong about what happened) but I assure you the wider gaming media is in now such state of confusion and eyes are looking to Iceland to resolve this matter appropriately (or to feast on the scandal if it is not).
Short version the Chair of the CSM broke codes of conduct binding the behaviour of ordinary players. He did something that other player have been permabanned for. For him to remain in place after this would make a mockery of the CSM and CCP's own reputation for even-handed enforcement of rules.
The decent thing for Alexander Gianturco to do at this point is resign, quickly and efficiently and disappear for a time so that the CSM can announce a new chair and CCP can get back to harvesting the remaining benefits of a successful fanfest and exciting program of upcoming game developments.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
222
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:15:00 -
[214] - Quote
ahahahaha you've got to be kidding me |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
320
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:16:00 -
[215] - Quote
Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power'
I wonder how many of those votes are/were alts? Given the not-insignificant percentage of votes from under-30d-old characters and all
That number doesn't mean **** one way or the other without an explicit breakdown of account-vs-RL-player, and of what in-game demographic those accounts represent, and if they are alt-accounts, and for what purpose they are, if they are, among other factors.
Enough with this puerile crap already
TL/DR: That number means nothing given the prevalence of alt-accounts in this game. You should find a "meatier" statistic to play with.
Next! In irae, veritas. |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
50
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:16:00 -
[216] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you yes i really do. I know Wis...have spoken to him on coms. A very nice man. **** we ran some missions together one night cause we were bored. The dude is a straight up nice guy. Here's my point cause i give a **** about all this eve politics bullshit and whether this dude has to step down or not....it's so inconsequential to me. But if it's ok to step into somebody's real life in such a disgusting, vile manner....than the consequences should also be "real life", and not this eve video game bullshit. Maybe we all should have a real life meat up and get this **** settled then......you guys think it's ok, and others don't.....let's get out from the safety of our parents firewalls for a moment and see whats what. If you want to step outside the parameters of this game cause "eve is real" you know....then lets see what y'all are capable of when you have to look a man eye to eye.
this, is a quality fakepost
+1 like |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:17:00 -
[217] - Quote
[quote=Karl Hobb I highly doubt that. I think he's probably wondering what sort of idiotic world we live in where someone playing a video game uses real-life suicide as a bargaining device.
[.[/quote]
except that's not what wis did. And Mitt knows that because he knows the context of the emails in their entirety. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
222
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:17:00 -
[218] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you yes i really do. I know Wis...have spoken to him on coms. A very nice man. **** we ran some missions together one night cause we were bored. The dude is a straight up nice guy. Here's my point cause i give a **** about all this eve politics bullshit and whether this dude has to step down or not....it's so inconsequential to me. But if it's ok to step into somebody's real life in such a disgusting, vile manner....than the consequences should also be "real life", and not this eve video game bullshit. Maybe we all should have a real life meat up and get this **** settled then......you guys think it's ok, and others don't.....let's get out from the safety of our parents firewalls for a moment and see whats what. If you want to step outside the parameters of this game cause "eve is real" you know....then lets see what y'all are capable of when you have to look a man eye to eye.
quoting so you cant edit |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:19:00 -
[219] - Quote
Sir Marksalot wrote:michaelthered wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you yes i really do. I know Wis...have spoken to him on coms. A very nice man. **** we ran some missions together one night cause we were bored. The dude is a straight up nice guy. Here's my point cause i give a **** about all this eve politics bullshit and whether this dude has to step down or not....it's so inconsequential to me. But if it's ok to step into somebody's real life in such a disgusting, vile manner....than the consequences should also be "real life", and not this eve video game bullshit. Maybe we all should have a real life meat up and get this **** settled then......you guys think it's ok, and others don't.....let's get out from the safety of our parents firewalls for a moment and see whats what. If you want to step outside the parameters of this game cause "eve is real" you know....then lets see what y'all are capable of when you have to look a man eye to eye. this, is a quality fakepost +1 like
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1574
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:22:00 -
[220] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:michaelthered wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you yes i really do. I know Wis...have spoken to him on coms. A very nice man. **** we ran some missions together one night cause we were bored. The dude is a straight up nice guy. Here's my point cause i give a **** about all this eve politics bullshit and whether this dude has to step down or not....it's so inconsequential to me. But if it's ok to step into somebody's real life in such a disgusting, vile manner....than the consequences should also be "real life", and not this eve video game bullshit. Maybe we all should have a real life meat up and get this **** settled then......you guys think it's ok, and others don't.....let's get out from the safety of our parents firewalls for a moment and see whats what. If you want to step outside the parameters of this game cause "eve is real" you know....then lets see what y'all are capable of when you have to look a man eye to eye. quoting so you cant edit
This is the part where some sweaty handed goon in their parent's basement excitedly knuckle types out a harrassment petition against "michaelthered" on the grounds he's been "rl threatened on the internet" because somebody suggested that being an irritating numpty can get you thumped at the local tavern.
Seen it all before and the irony is priceless.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
Aryndel Samson
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:23:00 -
[221] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:As a CSM 7 member I am extremely disappointed with Mittens behavior at Fanfest this year.
The CSM should not only represent the players that elected them but also represent Eve itself to the general public. Mittens in the past has shown himself to be very adept at messaging both in and out of Eve. I can't believe he could have been so misguided in calling for harassment of a possibly suicidal player.
I understand we can expect all manner of crazy behavior at Fanfest and previous goon leaders at the alliance panel have certainly made themselves "controversial" but I think this incident violates a boundary between what happens in Eve and real world damage. Whether or not the player in question was suicidal isn't the point. The point is, in a world where cyber bullying is an emerging issue, we have a prominent figure in Eve clearly calling encourage a real life suicide. That can't be defended on ant level.
Mittens, I've supported the right for folks to act out in Eve as a valid part of the "sandbox", but I can't support your recent actions.
At a minimum we need Mittens to apologize and admit he crossed the line with his behavior. I call to the other elected members of the CM7 join me in this demand!
If the CSM is remain a viable part of Eve we have to adhere to some code of conduct. This recent event is a black eye for the CSM and Eve in general.
CSM 7 join me in protesting this disappointing public display of poor judgement!
We in the CSM owe Eve a much higher standard of behavior!
Issler Dainze
You still aren't going to Iceland. |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
18
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:24:00 -
[222] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:except that's not what wis did. And Mitt knows that because he knows the context of the emails in their entirety. Then please explain to us all what The Wis actually did and what the context of those emails are. Because claiming you are suicidal after losing assets in a video game sure sounds to me like you are trying to bargain sympathy from the aggressors. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
49
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:24:00 -
[223] - Quote
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power' I wonder how many of those votes are/were alts? Given the not-insignificant percentage of votes from under-30d-old characters and allThat number doesn't mean **** one way or the other without an explicit breakdown of account-vs-RL-player, and of what in-game demographic those accounts represent, and if they are alt-accounts, and for what purpose they are, if they are, among other factors. Enough with this puerile crap already TL/DR: That number means nothing given the prevalence of alt-accounts in this game. You should find a "meatier" statistic to play with. Next!
The bolded part is ******* ********. No accounts less than 30 days old were allowed to vote. The numbers posted were for accounts greater than 30 days but less than 250 days old. Which is actually a huge portion of players.
All this chest slapping over <30 day old accounts is stupid and you are all idiots. |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:26:00 -
[224] - Quote
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power' I wonder how many of those votes are/were alts? Given the not-insignificant percentage of votes from under-30d-old characters and all That number doesn't mean **** one way or the other without an explicit breakdown of account-vs-RL-player, and of what in-game demographic those accounts represent, and if they are alt-accounts, and for what purpose they are, if they are, among other factors. Enough with this puerile crap already TL/DR: That number means nothing given the prevalence of alt-accounts in this game. You should find a "meatier" statistic to play with. Next!
someone else can crosspost it from our forums, but according to our own polls (of just goons!) on average everyone put in somewhere around 1.8-2 votes hth
Jade Constantine wrote: He might choose to quit eve himself. He might choose to resign from csm chair himself (it is the right thing to do) he might quit csm himself (also perhaps the right thing). But if he doesn't then CCP is going to need to act and they would be immeasurably helped by the remaining CSM actually manning up and realizing that one of them is going to need to be chair in order to return a bit of self-respect to the office after the disaster that was the fanfest alliance panel.
Now perhaps you are a bit insulated from the almost universal disgust at what happened on that panel by virtue of your peers (who admittedly don't seem to realize what was wrong about what happened) but I assure you the wider gaming media is in now such state of confusion and eyes are looking to Iceland to resolve this matter appropriately (or to feast on the scandal if it is not).
Short version the Chair of the CSM broke codes of conduct binding the behaviour of ordinary players. He did something that other player have been permabanned for. For him to remain in place after this would make a mockery of the CSM and CCP's own reputation for even-handed enforcement of rules.
The decent thing for Alexander Gianturco to do at this point is resign, quickly and efficiently and disappear for a time so that the CSM can announce a new chair and CCP can get back to harvesting the remaining benefits of a successful fanfest and exciting program of upcoming game developments.
yes, clearly goons are just insulated because they dont care about a thing a blog said, and because they dont care what you say and we are definitely insulated because we understand that nobody gives a rat's ass about what a legion of npc corp posters are posting
so far i've seen no real scandal that would catch the attention of any real news outlet, gaming or otherwise, just a seriously impressive amount of forum trolling (you) that completely overshadows the real actual moral outrage that some people have over this. come check out sa some time the eve thread had a right fun time calling him a jerk!
fakeedit; i hate to ruin your dream but he doesn't seem to be quitting eve |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:27:00 -
[225] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:michaelthered wrote:except that's not what wis did. And Mitt knows that because he knows the context of the emails in their entirety. Then please explain to us all what The Wis actually did and what the context of those emails are. Because claiming you are suicidal after losing assets in a video game sure sounds to me like you are trying to bargain sympathy from the aggressors. nope, its never that
we should alert the press about this clearly suicidal man |
BringerMC
The Ghost Division
23
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:28:00 -
[226] - Quote
Using your position on a public panel to call on people to terrorize someone into killing themselves is the wrong answer.
CCP should removed Mittani from the CSM and make him conduct a live apology on EveTV. It is totally deplorable attitude and don't give me the he was drunk story. Yes you may do stupid things when you are drunk but you choose to drink so are still held accountable for your actions.
I am in the military and if anyone ever did anything like that specially in the publics eye they would be demoted and have a field grade article 15 slammed on them. Pretty sure if you work for any company and do that you will also probably get canned. Would not be suprised if the CCP employee that was at the event doesn't get fired or at the least a suspension. Hire-áThe Ghost Division Today! Because Pac-man ghosts driving Panzers can't be beat. |
Sir Marksalot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:28:00 -
[227] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:michaelthered wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:no you really don't and nobody is going to believe you yes i really do. I know Wis...have spoken to him on coms. A very nice man. **** we ran some missions together one night cause we were bored. The dude is a straight up nice guy. Here's my point cause i give a **** about all this eve politics bullshit and whether this dude has to step down or not....it's so inconsequential to me. But if it's ok to step into somebody's real life in such a disgusting, vile manner....than the consequences should also be "real life", and not this eve video game bullshit. Maybe we all should have a real life meat up and get this **** settled then......you guys think it's ok, and others don't.....let's get out from the safety of our parents firewalls for a moment and see whats what. If you want to step outside the parameters of this game cause "eve is real" you know....then lets see what y'all are capable of when you have to look a man eye to eye. quoting so you cant edit This is the part where some sweaty handed goon in their parent's basement excitedly knuckle types out a harrassment petition against "michaelthered" on the grounds he's been "rl threatened on the internet" because somebody suggested that being an irritating numpty can get you thumped at the local tavern. Seen it all before and the irony is priceless.
jade constantine confirmed for awful forum troll |
Ajita al Tchar
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
165
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:29:00 -
[228] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:much like jade needed to fluff up his avatar for his space brothel to hide his hideous self he needs to fluff up his posting to hide its hideous ideas
It didn't even turn out all that well Looks kind of greasy and the eyeshadow is a little tacky. Wait, does this count as an ad hominem insult? Well, most of this thread is crap anyway, don't care.
Also, RE: "Shadow Council" or whatever other cloak and dagger game some people think the CSM is playing. IMO it shouldn't be a requirement that stuff like votes on known issues and whatnot are kept quiet, the members should be able to divulge some information about their own actions if they want to. Nor should total openness be a requirement! I think that throwing everything up for public scrutiny as it happens is a pretty terrible idea. A lot of stuff that's discussed by CSM members is just idea-bouncing and tidbits of some thought process, but it won't stop drama mongers from seizing it and starting a shitposting flamefest. Additionally, discussion might touch ever so lightly on information that isn't meant to be released to the masses just yet (because it's not fully fleshed out, or whatever the reason). The NDA covers that, of course, but it is sometimes difficult to avoid the slightest mentions of something that someone keen might pick up on, lines can get blurry.
Electing representatives means that you trust them to act wisely on behalf of the constituency rather than making every decision directly guided by said constituency. Whether you think this is good or bad is irrelevant: this is how the CSM works, if you think it's awful and terrible then work to change it or STFU. IF the representative thinks there's good reason for them to keep something off public forums, there might be a good reason for it. If they never ever talk to the people they represent, then consider this a negative point on their record and feel free to feel cheated, betrayed, etc, and rescind your support if you counted on it being different based on what the candidate said in the past. There must be accountability and this demands transparency, but transparency doesn't necessarily mean that EVERYTHING must be put up for the players to inspect. For one, the forums would explode
Otherwise, trust the representatives to make a good decision, criticize them for a bad one, etc, but don't assume that they will act 100% of the time in a way that you personally agree with, and that if they act in a manner you disagree with it automatically means they aren't suitable for their post. Some things are a matter of opinion. Though if enough people express it, it's wise to listen to it and perhaps do more than merely take note, at least if re-election or public image are a concern |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:32:00 -
[229] - Quote
BringerMC wrote: I am in the military and if anyone ever did anything like that specially in the publics eye they would be demoted and have a field grade article 15 slammed on them. Pretty sure if you work for any company and do that you will also probably get canned. Would not be suprised if the CCP employee that was at the event doesn't get fired or at the least a suspension.
My god, do you take being in your country's armed forces as seriously as you do eve, or do you take this videogame as seriously as you do the military? Which is it? |
Allandi
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:35:00 -
[230] - Quote
Whether this is purely politically motivated or not is really unimportant. If you set yourself up as a world class dbag in a position of pseudo-power, someone is going to take advantage of it. If not Issler, then someone else.
Issler, most other CSM members are not speaking out because, sadly, they are better politicians than you. Wanting to discuss it, get the facts, wait for investigations, and other such excuses are just ploys to buy more time in neutrality while waiting for others (CCP or Mttani) to do the work for them. The evidence is public and irrefuteable, and not taking a stance immediately is simply being political.
I wish there were more like you. |
|
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:39:00 -
[231] - Quote
BringerMC wrote:D Derp wrote:BringerMC wrote: I am in the military and if anyone ever did anything like that specially in the publics eye they would be demoted and have a field grade article 15 slammed on them. Pretty sure if you work for any company and do that you will also probably get canned. Would not be suprised if the CCP employee that was at the event doesn't get fired or at the least a suspension.
My god, do you take being in your country's armed forces as seriously as you do eve, or do you take this videogame as seriously as you do the military? Which is it? What he did was in the public and acting as a Person not a player behind a screen. He did not do it in an inpersonal fashion. He was live in person telling people to tell another living human being to commit suicide. Its one thing in game to say things but telling another person in game or in person to commit suicide that says they are suicidal is the wrong answer. When it comes to a beating heart and blood in the viens that is real life mate.
And once again another person on eve-o misses the point that people like Wis, especially on the internet, claim to be suicidal or have x problem to garner sympathy -all the damn time-. It's common, even. Especially among the younger crowd.
Yes, mittens did a dumb thing, but comparing his actions and him being on the CSM to being court marshaled or whatever is just ever so slightly blowing things out of proportion. |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:40:00 -
[232] - Quote
Tergerom Loregeron wrote:LOOK AT ME GUEIS IM AN INTERNET POLITIK.
IM FINALLY IMPORTANT MOM!
My god man, you distilled the entire thread into 12 words |
Tergerom Loregeron
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:42:00 -
[233] - Quote
Oh by the way I once told an Assisted Suicide advocate he should kill himself. Maybe some of you white knight moral crusaders could tell me what to think and how to feel about it?
BTW the clothes you wear and the electronics you use are made by people who are frequently forced into conditions where they would WILLINGLY commit suicide as an escape. Maybe you can do something about that for me, or are you guys hypocrites?
Need a hint? |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:44:00 -
[234] - Quote
D Derp wrote:BringerMC wrote:D Derp wrote:BringerMC wrote: I am in the military and if anyone ever did anything like that specially in the publics eye they would be demoted and have a field grade article 15 slammed on them. Pretty sure if you work for any company and do that you will also probably get canned. Would not be suprised if the CCP employee that was at the event doesn't get fired or at the least a suspension.
My god, do you take being in your country's armed forces as seriously as you do eve, or do you take this videogame as seriously as you do the military? Which is it? What he did was in the public and acting as a Person not a player behind a screen. He did not do it in an inpersonal fashion. He was live in person telling people to tell another living human being to commit suicide. Its one thing in game to say things but telling another person in game or in person to commit suicide that says they are suicidal is the wrong answer. When it comes to a beating heart and blood in the viens that is real life mate. And once again another person on eve-o misses the point that people like Wis, especially on the internet, claim to be suicidal or have x problem to garner sympathy -all the damn time-. It's common, even. Especially among the younger crowd. Yes, mittens did a dumb thing, but comparing his actions and him being on the CSM to being court marshaled or whatever is just ever so slightly blowing things out of proportion.
except that it's a very real possiblity he may get sued irl. And any of u mouthbreathing pubies that actually emailed wis a "do it man" email......that's stepping in it. I hate things like this end up getting settled in court. These things were meant to be settled like grown ass men. Alas I speak of a world long gone unfortunately. |
Eidric
Shadows of HyperSpace Wormholes Holders
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:45:00 -
[235] - Quote
With all this Drama around this CSM looks more like Pre-CSM6.
I DID NOT VOTE FOR THAT
What I want is effective CSM that can delegate player opinions to the CCP - and perform it's role in the SCRUM process of development.
What Mittani did is wrong, but Issler what you are doing right now is also not the proper way of CSM Member.
People voted for you because they agreed with your vision - they share it and they want that vision to successfully reach CCP.
They didn't vote for you so you can start all this political drama. Not one bit. (If they did I am afraid they misunderstood the purpose of CSM)
TL.DR. I dont care about this drama as long as you do your job - This isnt your job. |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
321
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:50:00 -
[236] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote:Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power' I wonder how many of those votes are/were alts? Given the not-insignificant percentage of votes from under-30d-old characters and allThat number doesn't mean **** one way or the other without an explicit breakdown of account-vs-RL-player, and of what in-game demographic those accounts represent, and if they are alt-accounts, and for what purpose they are, if they are, among other factors. Enough with this puerile crap already TL/DR: That number means nothing given the prevalence of alt-accounts in this game. You should find a "meatier" statistic to play with. Next! The bolded part is ******* ********. No accounts less than 30 days old were allowed to vote. The numbers posted were for accounts greater than 30 days but less than 250 days old. Which is actually a huge portion of players. All this chest slapping over <30 day old accounts is stupid and you are all idiots.
OK, 30d-plus. Like 1 day makes a real difference in whom one would vote for if they were alt-characters, assuming they were created in time?
Whatever.
L2inferfromcontext
In irae, veritas. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5816
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:50:00 -
[237] - Quote
GǪso really, the only conclusion that can be drawn from this thread is that Issler should resign from the CSM for enticing people to harass a fellow player. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
321
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:50:00 -
[238] - Quote
Tippia wrote:GǪso really, the only conclusion that can be drawn from this thread is that Issler should resign from the CSM for enticing people to harass a fellow player.
How is she doing this exactly?
E: And no, I didn't vote for her--her interests are not much aligned with mine. In irae, veritas. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5816
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:57:00 -
[239] - Quote
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:How is she doing this exactly? Read the OP (and most of her other posts): demands of condemnation and guilt-by-association rhetorics. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 22:58:00 -
[240] - Quote
Tergerom Loregeron wrote:Oh by the way I once told an Assisted Suicide advocate he should kill himself. Maybe some of you white knight moral crusaders could tell me what to think and how to feel about it?
BTW the clothes you wear and the electronics you use are made by people who are frequently forced into conditions where they would WILLINGLY commit suicide as an escape. Maybe you can do something about that for me, or are you guys hypocrites?
Need a hint?
"white knight moral crusaders"....said with such sarcasm and derision as if people being repulsed by someone petitioning people to troll another human being to kill himself for really no particular good reason, can't really think of a good reason but I digress. That's a really irritating sentiment.....mocking being a decent human being. wtf? |
|
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
321
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:03:00 -
[241] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:How is she doing this exactly? Read the OP (and most of her other posts): demands of condemnation and guilt-by-association rhetorics.
Ugh, ::threadnought::
But, alright, re-reading OP, and wading through the goonie-dross now...
E: Or, should I just go play SW: tOR? I've only got 2-odd days left in my free trial account they gave me from being a beta-tester. And say what you will about "WoW with lightsabres"--I wouldn't disagree there!--but SW: tOR's PvE component is much more engaging than EVE's is In irae, veritas. |
Hailey Sunweaver
MAFIA PlAYGROUND.
2
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:05:00 -
[242] - Quote
Issler
I believe before you come out calling for Mittens to stand down you should work with your fellow CSM 7 members. At this point it just sounds like your headhunting and trying to push your OWN personal agenda. So how about you get off your soapbox and work with the CSM elect before someone starts a recall thread for you. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5817
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:07:00 -
[243] - Quote
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Ugh, ::threadnought::
Bit, alright, re-reading OP, and wading through the goonie-dross now... Actually, it's easier than that, so don't sweat it.
At this point, anyone who joins this ridiculous baying-for-blood mob is no better (and in a couple of very explicit cases much, much worse) than the person they're going after. The sheer hypocrisy of the of harassment that has been levelled is just appalling GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2163
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:09:00 -
[244] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: As for Issler she looks like being scapegoated at the moment. Understand, I didn't vote for her, I didn't much like her policies. But she is trying to push an agenda of personal responsibility from the current CSM team where we get to see what each of them actually *think* about this crisis rather than disappearing behind a magic curtain and letting the "wizard" tell us how its going to be.
...
Other CSM's seem to closing ranks and trying to laugh it off and tell us how it doesn't matter because the mining barge guy didn't actually die - but that is so not the point.
The only thing that is being consistently asked of Issler is that she participate in CSM discussions before trying to discredit all of us because we didn't all rush to publish scathing remarks alongside her. If that's being scapegoated, so be it. I don't think its too much to ask that we discuss things among ourselves before making public statements.
Especially for those of us that are new to the council, I don't see any value in refusing to listen to every party involved first and foremost. Not just to the players, but to Alex, and to the CCP staff as well. It's a bit unfair to say that because most of us would prefer to get a full 360-degree view of the situation before speaking about it that it means we are somehow "closing ranks", or "laughing it off", or letting "the wizard" tell us what to say. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
321
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:17:00 -
[245] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Ugh, ::threadnought::
Bit, alright, re-reading OP, and wading through the goonie-dross now... Actually, it's easier than that, so don't sweat it. At this point, anyone who joins this ridiculous baying-for-blood mob is no better (and in a couple of very explicit cases much, much worse) than the person they're going after. The sheer hypocrisy of the of harassment that has been levelled is just appalling
That's going to happen regardless, though:
Regardless of whether the OP is trying to make political hay or not, Mittens did cross a line that should never be crossed, IMHO, and did so in an utterly reprehensible manner.
[cynicism]
Yes, he's apologised--although how sincere that is, I couldn't really guess. It's not like he could have done anything else in the name of damage-control, yes?
[/cynicism]
Some posters in this and other threads are right--a statement from the CSM is needed, and/or one from CCP, bearing in mind that this could set an..."interesting" precedent for the future.
Mittens: You should practise and get some experience holding your liquor before the next FanFest!
In irae, veritas. |
Doctor Eezee
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
88
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:28:00 -
[246] - Quote
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power' I wonder how many of those votes are/were alts? Given the not-insignificant percentage of votes from under-30d-old characters and all That number doesn't mean **** one way or the other without an explicit breakdown of account-vs-RL-player, and of what in-game demographic those accounts represent, and if they are alt-accounts, and for what purpose they are, if they are, among other factors. Enough with this puerile crap already TL/DR: That number means nothing given the prevalence of alt-accounts in this game. You should find a "meatier" statistic to play with. Next!
Do your really think you should be weighing in on a debate, if you can't read a simple table? It's really not so hard to understand, so maybe take a good hard look at it again and you may see that 0 players under 30 days voted and the players you refer to were indeed 30-250 days old.
How do you expect anyone to respect your opinion if you are blatantly lieing or too stupid to read.
"My rule is: If you meet the weakest vessel, attack; if it is a vessel equal to yours, attack; and if it is stronger than yours, also attack..." - Admiral Stepan O. Makarov |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1575
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:32:00 -
[247] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:[quote=Jade Constantine] Especially for those of us that are new to the council, I don't see any value in refusing to listen to every party involved first and foremost. Not just to the players, but to Alex, and to the CCP staff as well. It's a bit unfair to say that because most of us would prefer to get a full 360-degree view of the situation before speaking about it that it means we are somehow "closing ranks", or "laughing it off", or letting "the wizard" tell us what to say.
Well I'm referring specifically to CSM's who posted in the apology thread with things like "I completely support Mittani as chair and he has my sword for life!" in advance of any kind of discussion or resolution. If we the players are supposed to have patience and wait for these matters to be discussed (genuinely and openly) within the CSM council then is it too much to ask that the CSM's on the council wait a bit before declaring their eternal loyalty and devotion to the "king of space"?
It does give the wrong impression of when the notion of a serious discussion is prefaced with certain CSM's spoiling the outcome with florid pledges of loyalty and vassal service to their space lord.
Bottom line Hans, if this discussion of the Mittani scandal is swift and has a clear outcome and we get to see who said what to whom and why in the making of any decisions you are empowered to make then thats fair enough.
If on the other hand it ends up like the candy-coated whitewash nonsense of the previous CSM where the intention was to deny us players a view of who was for and against particular proposals then it will be decidedly unsatisfactory and end up wreaking of corruption and responsibility-evasion.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
431
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:36:00 -
[248] - Quote
Jade, you've pretty much explicitly stated you're not concerned about condeming what Mitanni said, for you this is about condeming Mitanni's approach to the chairmanship.
Attacking the CSM for being silent and then attacking the many of us who posted stuff.. you dont have to do that. We get it. www.noirmercs.com Now Recruiting CSM7, CSM 4 |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
321
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:43:00 -
[249] - Quote
Doctor Eezee wrote:Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:Sir Marksalot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Jade you are generally regarded as the worst CSM chairman and it is generally accepted every idea you had on how to run the CSM was wrong, why do you feel your input is useful here. Because pretty much everything I advocated on the CSM is already in the game or about to arrive, because under my chairmanship Eve online had excellent press coverage in the gaming press and mainstream media from New York to London and Paris, because I managed to keep my dignity and temper and didn't get righteously drunk on stage at fanfest and embarrass myself and every decent player of this game by coughing out cod-sadistic nonsense and calling on my fellow players to be trolled into suicide. Plus I had the good grace to give the next guy a go when my term was up rather than trying to cling on to power like some kind of monomaniac limpet-brained bloodsucker with an desperate need to be loved and feared in equal measure. That about covers it having 10,000 votes is not 'clinging to power' I wonder how many of those votes are/were alts? Given the not-insignificant percentage of votes from under-30d-old characters and all That number doesn't mean **** one way or the other without an explicit breakdown of account-vs-RL-player, and of what in-game demographic those accounts represent, and if they are alt-accounts, and for what purpose they are, if they are, among other factors. Enough with this puerile crap already TL/DR: That number means nothing given the prevalence of alt-accounts in this game. You should find a "meatier" statistic to play with. Next! Do your really think you should be weighing in on a debate, if you can't read a simple table? It's really not so hard to understand, so maybe take a good hard look at it again and you may see that 0 players under 30 days voted and the players you refer to were indeed 30-250 days old. How do you expect anyone to respect your opinion if you are blatantly lieing or too stupid to read.
So I spoke imprecisely--I meant plus-30d.
But the question still stands:
How many of those are alts, whose alts are they, and for what purpose were they created?
E: I really couldn't ******* care less if you think I should be weighing in on a debate or not, by the way. This is the Internet: HTFU and deal with it! In irae, veritas. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1575
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:46:00 -
[250] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Jade, you've pretty much explicitly stated you're not concerned about condeming what Mitanni said, for you this is about condeming Mitanni's approach to the chairmanship.
I've said I don't believe his actions are appropriate for the chair of the CSM in Eve Online and he's brought the game into disrepute on a significant out of character level. I think its also quite arguable that he has breached eula/tos and there is a real danger of him being treated differently to another player who did these things.
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Attacking the CSM for being silent and then attacking the many of us who posted stuff.. you dont have to do that. We get it.
I'm not attacking you guys for being :silent: while you discuss who the new chair is and how to announce the outcomes. I'm attacking you for coming out of a gate and declaring your loyalty and support to Mittani as the csm chair before you even have any kind of discussion about this.
If you can't see how those statements pretty much make a sham out of the current "discussions" then *shrug* really. It looks damned fishy.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
|
Ender Black
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
95
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:05:00 -
[251] - Quote
ITT Issler Dainze proves to be an absolute and unmitigated disaster. You obviously don't play well with others, so GET OUT. Holy crap, do you have any sense of leadership, political acumen, or even common sense. I don't believe you do? You seek attention like ghetto trash seek crack.
I would expect more political acumen from a middle school class council. The Pod Goo Podcast http://www.podgoo.com
Pod Goo also publishes editorials, guest blogs, and guides for free. -áJust email [email protected] your material. |
Wolodymyr
Breaking Ambitions
87
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:10:00 -
[252] - Quote
OK first things first.
It's pretty obvious that Issler doesn't give a damn about The Wis, this whole thread is just some weird soap boxing power play. Maybe she thinks the CSM works like The Highlander and if she can take out all the CSMs above her she gets to be chairman v0v
Second. If this was just eve players beefing with one another in our own little enclosure then I'd say go for it. Run around the monkey house hooting as loud as you want flinging poo at one another. But I don't know if you've looked at The Escapist or Massively this morning. It's not just us, we are in the spot light now, try to act like adults.
Maybe if your politically motivated rant is loud enough you'll attract the attention of that one lady on Fox news. Who I am sure will treat Eve with the same level of respect and nuance as she did Mass Effect. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKzF173GqTU
This is probably the best reason to present a unified message. Something like, "Eve is a good game full of good people. It is also a harsh game and we have some harsh people. We have one bad guy. He has done some bad things. He's very sorry for doing bad things. And steps have been taken to make sure bad things never happen again."
Also an "I'm not dead" statement from The Wis would help too.
Third, Fanfest will probably never be the same. You'll probably see two things out of this. People's power point slides will be more heavily screened before they are let on stage to cut out anything that could be offensive to anyone. And the hard alcohol will probably be downgraded to beer. Also the broadcast might be delayed by a few minutes from the event so that CCP can censor out anything embarrassing.
Fourth, depending on what we sacrifice on the altar of the PR Gods to appease their wrath, the entire eve social landscape will be very different. You could ban all of The Mittanni's accounts, take him off the CSM, and take away all the GSF tech moons or whatever. Then you create an environment where butthurt becomes an effective tactical weapon.
Watch the rest of the alliance panel. It was 90% smack-talk. People were being ransomed and forced to sing over comms under the threat of losing something expensive. Then they were publicly shamed on a public broadcast for their awful singing voices. I thought this bit was pretty funny and kind of cute, but hypothetically if one jilted player was enraged about his forced karaoke, and the forum butthurt got OVER NINE THOUSAAAAAND!!! Then Mr. Wormhole could find himself in the same hot water. |
Vorlain
Viziam Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:18:00 -
[253] - Quote
One does not have to consult any other members of the CSM to make a statement condemning what happened, **** I expect any decent representative to come out and quite clearly say it was wrong and is in no way condoned by the CSM.
Personally I have no issue with IsslerGÇÖs statement and think it is quite welcome and if the other CSM members have an issue with that and wonGÇÖt work with Issler over it they need to take a good hard look at their own ethics.
We have asked for more Transparency from the CSM and they seem to want to hide away behind closed doors, the CSM is not meant to be some private boys club. |
Karsa Egivand
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:21:00 -
[254] - Quote
Sigh, this thread now adds a 2nd CSM-member to the list of trying-their-best-to-****-over-CSM8.
Issler Dainze, go silent for a few days and talk to CSM/CCP. Do you think this self-righteous stand over The Mittani's fuckup on the evo-o-forums is going to help anybody? |
Nair Alderau
EVE University Ivy League
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:24:00 -
[255] - Quote
Nair Alderau is not amused.
Why don't we all take a collective breath - those responsible start talking it through, not slinging posts on the forums - and then you try to clean up the mess in a few days when heads have cooled off some?
|
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
20
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:27:00 -
[256] - Quote
Vorlain wrote:Personally I have no issue with IsslerGÇÖs statement and think it is quite welcome and if the other CSM members have an issue with that and wonGÇÖt work with Issler over it they need to take a good hard look at their own ethics. While The Mittani made a drunken mistake and will undoubtedly pay for it, no matter how idiotic the entire situation is, Issler is using it for political grandstanding. The issue is not that Issler made a statement, the issue is that she threw her teammates under the bus while doing so. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Golar Crexis
the boltzmann experience Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:30:00 -
[257] - Quote
Wolodymyr wrote:OK first things first. It's pretty obvious that Issler doesn't give a damn about The Wis, this whole thread is just some weird soap boxing power play. Maybe she thinks the CSM works like The Highlander and if she can take out all the CSMs above her she gets to be chairman v0v Second. If this was just eve players beefing with one another in our own little enclosure then I'd say go for it. Run around the monkey house hooting as loud as you want flinging poo at one another. But I don't know if you've looked at The Escapist or Massively this morning. It's not just us, we are in the spot light now, try to act like adults. Maybe if your politically motivated rant is loud enough you'll attract the attention of that one lady on Fox news. Who I am sure will treat Eve with the same level of respect and nuance as she did Mass Effect. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKzF173GqTUThis is probably the best reason to present a unified message. Something like, "Eve is a good game full of good people. It is also a harsh game and we have some harsh people. We have one bad guy. He has done some bad things. He's very sorry for doing bad things. And steps have been taken to make sure bad things never happen again." Also an "I'm not dead" statement from The Wis would help too. Third, Fanfest will probably never be the same. You'll probably see two things out of this. People's power point slides will be more heavily screened before they are let on stage to cut out anything that could be offensive to anyone. And the hard alcohol will probably be downgraded to beer. Also the broadcast might be delayed by a few minutes from the event so that CCP can censor out anything embarrassing. Fourth, depending on what we sacrifice on the altar of the PR Gods to appease their wrath, the entire eve social landscape will be very different. You could ban all of The Mittanni's accounts, take him off the CSM, and take away all the GSF tech moons or whatever. Then you create an environment where butthurt becomes an effective tactical weapon. Watch the rest of the alliance panel. It was 90% smack-talk. People were being ransomed and forced to sing over comms under the threat of losing something expensive. Then they were publicly shamed on a public broadcast for their awful singing voices. I thought this bit was pretty funny and kind of cute, but hypothetically if one jilted player was enraged about his forced karaoke, and the forum butthurt got OVER NINE THOUSAAAAAND!!! Then Mr. Wormhole could find himself in the same hot water.
I completely agree.
I understand that some people don't get eve's dark humour or how things said on the internet shouldn't be taken seriously. What mittens said was in front of an internet spaceship nerd audience and I found it to be funny. I was also concerned for the wis and attempted to contact him about 4 months ago when the original chatlogs were posted on kugu, but I did not get though to him.
I also agree that Isller is displaying frankly disgraceful behaviour on top of mittens already "disgraceful" behaviour. I find her whole take on this to be highly insulting to all parties involved (ccp, wis, mittani, the csm and the eve playerbase as a whole.) To be fair I did not expect much out of a hi-sec candidate (especially one who served on the more irrelvant csm's) but I'm saddened to have my prejudices completely justified.
Finally I voted for the mittani (I'm not in goons and I'm red to test) simply because he was an effective communicator and represented my style of gameplay. I'd rather not see mine and 10000 other people's votes thrown away by people like Pissler and Darius 3.
Also a message to the CSM. If/When the mittani is replaced please continue the good work of CSM 6 and encourage future CSM's to do the same. I admire most of you and I love the dedication you guys put into this game.
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Tergerom Loregeron
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
14
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Posted - 2012.03.28 00:35:00 -
[258] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Tergerom Loregeron wrote:Oh by the way I once told an Assisted Suicide advocate he should kill himself. Maybe some of you white knight moral crusaders could tell me what to think and how to feel about it?
BTW the clothes you wear and the electronics you use are made by people who are frequently forced into conditions where they would WILLINGLY commit suicide as an escape. Maybe you can do something about that for me, or are you guys hypocrites?
Need a hint? "white knight moral crusaders"....said with such sarcasm and derision as if people being repulsed by someone petitioning people to troll another human being to kill himself for really no particular good reason, can't really think of a good reason but I digress. That's a really irritating sentiment.....mocking being a decent human being. wtf?
Yeah, because that's why people are in such a rage about this whole "scandal", my has nothing to do with people using this guy as a tool to get back at Mittani. |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
166
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:40:00 -
[259] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Vorlain wrote:Personally I have no issue with IsslerGÇÖs statement and think it is quite welcome and if the other CSM members have an issue with that and wonGÇÖt work with Issler over it they need to take a good hard look at their own ethics. While The Mittani made a drunken mistake and will undoubtedly pay for it, no matter how idiotic the entire situation is, Issler is using it for political grandstanding. The issue is not that Issler made a statement, the issue is that she threw her teammates under the bus while doing so.
And I'm guessing this metaphoric bus was being driven by a high level wizard?
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1384
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:41:00 -
[260] - Quote
Wolodymyr wrote:OK first things first.
It's pretty obvious that Issler doesn't give a damn about The Wis, this whole thread is just some weird soap boxing power play. Maybe she thinks the CSM works like The Highlander and if she can take out all the CSMs above her she gets to be chairman v0v
I take suicide very seriously. I've had people in my life make that very unfortunate decision so you couldn't be more wrong. I also have been on the receiving end of similar forms of harassment.
You can go on about my not meeting your expectations and try and invent bizarre motives for "power grabs" but how on earth could that work?
I'll grant you that you may disagree with my methods but you can't claim that my motives aren't genuine. This situation all comes down to a very simple fact, if someone wants to be an asshat in game, awesome, welcome to Eve! If that same person takes it out of game, now I have issues.
As to the other CSM members. I'm sorry that what I have said in this thread was viewed as an attack. You have the right to take a stand or not in your own time. But by the same measure, so do I.
I wasn't going to post more in this thread but I felt I needed to correct this poster. I take harassment of someone that may be struggling with depression (a very real and life threatening condition) very seriously. I've seen the effects first hand.
I feel sorry for both parties. Wis should not have been treated the way he was and Mittens is going to have to live with a rash act that will be a dark shadow over much of what he accomplished here in Eve. There are no winners here.
This really is the last post from me until the "official" announcements arrive.
And thanks to everyone that has contacted me directly with your support.
Issler
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Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
166
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Posted - 2012.03.28 00:46:00 -
[261] - Quote
Quote:Yeah, because that's why people are in such a rage about this whole "scandal", my has nothing to do with people using this guy as a tool to get back at Mittani.
It's nothing to do with Mittani, however easily it might be perceived to be.
I would be JUST AS HAPPY if CCP gave mittani a warning and told everyone that such behaviour wouldn't be tolerated, and people won't get warnings they will get banned.
The problem right now is the whole "oh you can't say that without us all sitting in skype getting our stories straight" attitude that the CSM is relatively famous for. They worked fairly hard to get rid of the stigma of all being known to "agree on absotively everything" last CSM with pretty much the same people involved all led by - yep the same guy.
And how dare someone stand up and say that the behaviour shouldn't be tolerated - and let's face it - it's an individual character assessment at this point not a CSM stance - without first having checked with Mittani on skype.
"Our CSM will blot out the sun!"
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Tergerom Loregeron
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
14
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 00:46:00 -
[262] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Wolodymyr wrote:OK first things first.
It's pretty obvious that Issler doesn't give a damn about The Wis, this whole thread is just some weird soap boxing power play. Maybe she thinks the CSM works like The Highlander and if she can take out all the CSMs above her she gets to be chairman v0v
I'll grant you that you may disagree with my methods but you can't claim that my motives aren't genuine.
Then you're an idiot, congratulations on trying to get your vengeance at the expense of the victim. Mittani made a mistake, he's just as human as you are. Until he repeatedly acts in a manner such as what he did at the alliance panel there is absolutely no reason to get worked up about it.
Don't **** up now, or ever, ya hear? You might lose your CSM spot. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
45
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:05:00 -
[263] - Quote
Tergerom Loregeron wrote: Then you're an idiot, congratulations on trying to get your vengeance at the expense of the victim. Mittani made a mistake, he's just as human as you are. Until he repeatedly acts in a manner such as what he did at the alliance panel there is absolutely no reason to get worked up about it.
So The Mittani's original idea wasn't at the expense of the victim, let alone the comments he made? So he should be forgiven until he behaves like this repeatedly, are you insane?
His behavior has given EvE a worse name than it already had, he should do what he said and resign or this will blow up even worse than it has now. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Tergerom Loregeron
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
14
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:11:00 -
[264] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Tergerom Loregeron wrote: Then you're an idiot, congratulations on trying to get your vengeance at the expense of the victim. Mittani made a mistake, he's just as human as you are. Until he repeatedly acts in a manner such as what he did at the alliance panel there is absolutely no reason to get worked up about it.
So The Mittani's original idea wasn't at the expense of the victim, let alone the comments he made? So he should be forgiven until he behaves like this repeatedly, are you insane? His behavior has given EvE a worse name than it already had, he should do what he said and resign or this will blow up even worse than it has now.
Two wrongs make a right, right? He apologized already, he was pretty damn sincere about it too. Go find something else to have a witch hunt about, something more productive and beneficial to society. This isn't going to blow up and be "even worse". |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
25
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:19:00 -
[265] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Wolodymyr wrote:OK first things first.
It's pretty obvious that Issler doesn't give a damn about The Wis, this whole thread is just some weird soap boxing power play. Maybe she thinks the CSM works like The Highlander and if she can take out all the CSMs above her she gets to be chairman v0v
I take suicide very seriously. I've had people in my life make that very unfortunate decision so you couldn't be more wrong. I also have been on the receiving end of similar forms of harassment. You can go on about my not meeting your expectations and try and invent bizarre motives for "power grabs" but how on earth could that work? I'll grant you that you may disagree with my methods but you can't claim that my motives aren't genuine. This situation all comes down to a very simple fact, if someone wants to be an asshat in game, awesome, welcome to Eve! If that same person takes it out of game, now I have issues. As to the other CSM members. I'm sorry that what I have said in this thread was viewed as an attack. You have the right to take a stand or not in your own time. But by the same measure, so do I. I wasn't going to post more in this thread but I felt I needed to correct this poster. I take harassment of someone that may be struggling with depression (a very real and life threatening condition) very seriously. I've seen the effects first hand. I feel sorry for both parties. Wis should not have been treated the way he was and Mittens is going to have to live with a rash act that will be a dark shadow over much of what he accomplished here in Eve. There are no winners here. This really is the last post from me until the "official" announcements arrive. And thanks to everyone that has contacted me directly with your support. Issler
I too, have had family members and close ones commit suicide. We all have. Same with depression. Don't try to garner pity after being called out.
e: I just wanted to be the first poster to make this comment.
They killed themselves because of my posting!
e2: Lost some family to cancer too. Send me isk. |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
25
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:22:00 -
[266] - Quote
Tergerom Loregeron wrote:This isn't going to blow up and be "even worse".
Basically this. Stop trying to blow everything out of proportion you terrible publords. |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
1571
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 01:34:00 -
[267] - Quote
Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. You do realize that the election is over, and now is the time to work together for the good of the people that voted for us, not to try to stir up a shitstorm? Vote Two step for CSM7 CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog |
Lomarro
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:36:00 -
[268] - Quote
Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. You do realize that the election is over, and now is the time to work together for the good of the people that voted for us, not to try to stir up a shitstorm?
you got mroe votes than her so you are a possible target for her
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D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
29
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:41:00 -
[269] - Quote
Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. You do realize that the election is over, and now is the time to work together for the good of the people that voted for us, not to try to stir up a shitstorm?
What you clearly don't understand is that the CSM should be treated like the sad sideshow that is Modern American Politics. Right after an election is the best time to start campaigning!
Didn't get elected? Start whining and crying about how horrible The Other Guys are. It's a tactic that's been proven effective*
*that tactic is being misused by terrible internet dwelling sperglords with no sense of how to communicate to people, or which battles they should fight. |
Wolodymyr
Breaking Ambitions
90
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:57:00 -
[270] - Quote
....Until 2012.03.27 00:09 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=86980 OK it looks pretty sincere and heartfelt, or at least well written, he is space Satan after all, can't believe anything he says. Oh well it's an apology, and if you aren't going to believe this one, you aren't going to believe anything else he says either. Time to move on with our lives I guess.
Issler Dainze wrote:Sad to see I was the only CSM 7 member to go on the record with my outrage at the incident.
We got what I believe is a sincere apology now the question I believe is before CSM 7, CCP and most importantly the players. "is that enough"?
Issler No! Because owning your mistakes and "People doing good things can loose their way and screw up." is bullshit now! It's not enough! Also where is his long form birth certificate? THE PEOPLE WANT ANSWERS!
Also where is the rest of the CSM? In a secret closed doors meeting? Hung over on a plane ride back from Iceland that doesn't allow wireless internet? Who knows? Let's fire them too!
OK so during this entire 13 page mess you have been **** slinging pretty much everyone Mittens, the rest of the CSM, random posters. And it's not even internally consistent. An apology is a free pass for you but not someone else when being offensive. Wait until the CSM is hung over and on an airplane before criticizing them for being silent and secretive.
And what about The Wis, the guy at the heart of all this? How does he feel? Is he still around? Has anyone even checked up on him or told him what's going on? Who cares enough about his well being to pop round and say hello?
Never thought I'd say this. But thank god for random EN24 reporters. http://www.evenews24.com/2012/03/27/failing-in-so-many-ways-the-mittani-%E2%80%93-hero/
March 27th 21:10:18 A full day after your post. The Wis finally finds out what's going on.
Quote:[21:10:18] Xeross155 > Heya [21:10:22] The Wis > Hello [21:10:29] Xeross155 > Getting swarmed with interviews I can imagine [21:10:50] The Wis > No why? [21:11:57] Xeross155 > With this BS and all http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/03/26/ccp-investigates-player-panel-that-encouraged-cyber-bullying/[21:12:21] Xeross155 > Pretty sure the name Mittani called out was GÇ£The WisGÇ¥ [21:12:31] The Wis > Oh I will have to check that out.. What is going on? [21:12:58] Xeross155 > You sent him a mail when you got scammed and your Mackinaws destroyed or smth [21:13:41] Xeross155 > Or at least one of his alliance mates [21:14:13] The Wis > Could have.. been a long time. Might have been when they had the safe mining offer when you guys were doing your anti ice thing. [21:15:08] The Wis > I did have someone ask me if I was ok.. Becouse he said that I had killed myself afterwards and he thought it was funny.. I did not see it so I have no clue what was said. [21:15:52] Xeross155 > Basically some idiots are all butthurt and are calling for him to step down from CSM and **** [21:16:51] Xeross155 > Basically, enjoy your 5 minutes of fame, multiple gaming press websites are putting the story up [21:16:58] Xeross155 > Leaving out your name though [21:16:59] Xeross155 > one sec [21:19:54] The Wis > Well I am not sure what is going on.. I know I have had some people say I should put a pentition in. Witch I have not. Since I have not seen the video or anything. But that would also explain why the goons are moving into my system now and starting [21:19:57] The Wis > ganking here. [21:24:54] Xeross155 > http://youtu.be/E7Ki91U-mBE?t=1h11m55s[21:26:17] Xeross155 > ThatGÇÖs basically the snippet that people are upset about for some reason [21:29:34] Xeross155 > Anyway, CCP is doing an internal audit and **** about it, 3 game news websites have reported it so far, basically tagging it cyber-bullying [21:30:50] The Wis > Ok.. Well that is nice. Hmm.. wait.. If i do kill my self they might arrest him and prosicute him since he is in the US.. That would really be bad for him. [21:31:01] The Wis > Just kidding of course but a thought. [21:31:20] The Wis > Fly safe. I have real life stuff to do now.. ANd to watch for goons in system.. Fun Fun.
So yeah right from the start you were just interested in bashing the CSM. You didn't give a crap about the Wis enough to even make sure he is still alive. And on top of that how does this massive rant of yours even help out anyway? By dragging this whole sordid affair throught he mud again? If anything seeing that he is still around, feeling better, and actually in good enough spirits to make light of the situation kind of hurts the credibility of your entire rant.
Would your little power play have been more effective if he had gotten more depressed, or gone to the hospital, or done something more drastic? Do his best interests really align with your best interests? |
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Vorlain
Viziam Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2012.03.28 01:59:00 -
[271] - Quote
Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term.
How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM.
You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did.
Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite?
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Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
48
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:02:00 -
[272] - Quote
Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. You do realize that the election is over, and now is the time to work together for the good of the people that voted for us, not to try to stir up a shitstorm? I don't think they will get anything done now in CSM7 no matter the out come of this anything done by CSM7 will be overshadowed by this. Like The Mittani was campaigning 12 months later on the Incarna "summer of rage" and riding his actions for more votes. So there will probably be comments of the CSM being a puppet if The Mittani is thrown out, or steps down or comments about "How many people did you have to get to kill themselves to do that" if he doesn't.
Oh and the shitstorm was already here before any CSM member reacted. But it is good to see the CSM playing duck and cover for a few days while this escalates rather than a decisive stand on the matter. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Funkert
Stimulus Rote Kapelle
17
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:02:00 -
[273] - Quote
D Derp wrote:Didn't get elected? Start whining and crying about how horrible The Other Guys are. It's a tactic that's been proven effective*
i still remember when Larkonis got CYBERBULLIED out of the CSM by Issler and his/her goons!
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Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1394
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:06:00 -
[274] - Quote
Funkert wrote:D Derp wrote:Didn't get elected? Start whining and crying about how horrible The Other Guys are. It's a tactic that's been proven effective* i still remember when Larkonis got CYBERBULLIED out of the CSM by Issler and his/her goons!
I wasn't going to post again but that was one of the funniest things I've ever read!! I have goons??
Uhm, it was days after the Larkgate thing before I even knew I was bumped up to an active member.
I'm going to try and go find my goons now..... wonder where I left them...
Issler |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1577
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:09:00 -
[275] - Quote
Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite?
No idea who you are guy without an avatar but thats a good post and I'm happy to give you a support for it. Completely agree.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
32
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:10:00 -
[276] - Quote
Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite?
Nice alt bro. Mind posting the same on your main? |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1577
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:11:00 -
[277] - Quote
D Derp wrote:Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite? Nice alt bro. Mind posting the same on your main?
He's probably worried that 10,000 goons will be ordered to troll him into suicide.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Henriette Malia Alette
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
20
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:11:00 -
[278] - Quote
Doctor Eezee wrote:Oh snap, missed the snipe.
Also we saw the chatlog from The Wis, he didn't even remember that mail...
Assuming it was real. The picture of another chatlog contradicts it.
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D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
32
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:13:00 -
[279] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite? No idea who you are guy without an avatar but thats a good post and I'm happy to give you a support for it. Completely agree.
Going off this post and the regdates of both the accounts, I'm betting it's yours. Mostly because that would be funny, and you're... you. |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
32
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Posted - 2012.03.28 02:14:00 -
[280] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:D Derp wrote:Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite? Nice alt bro. Mind posting the same on your main? He's probably worried that 10,000 goons will be ordered to troll him into suicide.
Because there are 10,000 goons in eve. You're adorable. |
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Taiwanistan
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
245
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:15:00 -
[281] - Quote
are the bears roaring now dowager issler wis shall not be a cesspool of all-you-can-eat social /dance o7m8 dressup, unrestrained do ask do tell out and proud at the space bar dollhouse, bunch of dudes emoting each other, devoid of gameplay and consequnces. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1578
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:17:00 -
[282] - Quote
D Derp wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite? No idea who you are guy without an avatar but thats a good post and I'm happy to give you a support for it. Completely agree. Going off this post and the regdates of both the accounts, I'm betting it's yours. Mostly because that would be funny, and you're... you. e; then again that post didnt seem to be written with a thesaurus
Hmmm hasn't the last half dozen years of relentlessly mocking you people proven I really don't have the slightest inkling of fear for tubby neckbeard spaceship cultists and no need whatsoever for anonymous sockpuppets....
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Nair Alderau
EVE University Ivy League
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:22:00 -
[283] - Quote
Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. .... Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for ....
Way to twist Two Step's words into something he never said.
Go forth, sully the chances of getting those two CSMs to properly talk to each other.
|
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:25:00 -
[284] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: Hmmm hasn't the last half dozen years of relentlessly mocking you people proven I really don't have the slightest inkling of fear for tubby neckbeard spaceship cultists and no need whatsoever for anonymous sockpuppets....
I will give you credit where credit is due. You post poorly on your main. That puts you above at least 95% of people here.
But that was mainly meant as a swipe against whoever owns that sockpuppet. (It was you wasn't it) |
Henriette Malia Alette
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
23
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:26:00 -
[285] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:I'm pretty sure when the players in multiple threads in general asked what the CSM thought of the incident they expected an answer in the forums, not in a private Skype channel. Sorry, but this didn't need a hive mind meeting to come up with a cleverly crafted collective message. The rest of the CSM staying quiet is what is damaging the CSM. Ask yourself what your message from your silence is to the people the elected you. Even if the other CSM members had share something as simple as "Yes, it seems as though many found the action offensive we are happy to see Mittens has offered an apology in the forums and we are working with CCP to make sure the best interests of the players and Eve in general are the focus of whatever action results from their investigation." you would have been better than trying to focus this on me because I responded to the players and took a stand. I've said what I needed to say. I hope the other CSM will now give the players what they deserve when they elected you. As for Skype and not talking to you, not really an option while I'm at work, sorry. I'll be on soon enough, can't wait for that. Issler 1. I think the players deserve more than knee jerk reactions, or in your case gleeful political dog piling, when they ask us for answers on this or any issue.
Here's a hint, i voted for her, and im an alt player.. corp members voted for her, alliance menbers voted for her.. I WANT to know what MY representative thinks, and what she wanna do. I dont need another fubar person whom cant think or write his/her own opinion, hiding in a large group hoping this either blows over, or CCP acts,. so they dont have to.
|
Vorlain
Viziam Amarr Empire
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:29:00 -
[286] - Quote
Hey maybe I like being a sockpuppet? been doing it for 7+ years might as well continue the trend right? Never the less it doesn't lesson the message does it?
I am not attacking nor defending mittani or anyone else really, just saying it as I see it. |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:33:00 -
[287] - Quote
Henriette Malia Alette wrote: Here's a hint, i voted for her, and im an alt player.. corp members voted for her, alliance menbers voted for her.. I WANT to know what MY representative thinks, and what she wanna do. I dont need another fubar person whom cant think or write his/her own opinion, hiding in a large group hoping this either blows over, or CCP acts,. so they dont have to.
You voted for her with an alt. Grats. Welcome to CSM elections.
Vorlain wrote:Hey maybe I like being a sockpuppet? been doing it for 7+ years might as well continue the trend right? Never the less it doesn't lesson the message does it?
I am not attacking nor defending mittani or anyone else really, just saying it as I see it.
It kind of does. Sockpuppet posting is the white noise of the eve-o forums. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1582
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:33:00 -
[288] - Quote
D Derp wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Hmmm hasn't the last half dozen years of relentlessly mocking you people proven I really don't have the slightest inkling of fear for tubby neckbeard spaceship cultists and no need whatsoever for anonymous sockpuppets....
I will give you credit where credit is due. You post poorly on your main. That puts you above at least 95% of people here. But that was mainly meant as a swipe against whoever owns that sockpuppet. (It was you wasn't it)
I'll tell you what mmm "Doctor Derp" is it?
If I'm ever in need of a posting critique from a no-name goonswarm recruit with a penchant for third hand memes handed down from bad posters of yesteryear I'll look you up okay? But until then I'll soldier old regardless. Chin chin and all that!
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Henriette Malia Alette
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
23
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:35:00 -
[289] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Sure she could probably be handling it better, could have waited to say something, could have done skype from a laptop or something, could be in coms somehow whatever. But I do get the impression she is at least in tune with the understanding a lot of us have about how far off message into the hinterlands of lunacy the current CSM chair has gone.
IMO, Issler is doing more damage to the CSM than The Mittani did with his drunken outburst. The Mittani will probably just fade away. Issler, on the other hand, we seem to be stuck with.
We can put it to the test you know.. our news are a bit boring.. im sure i can get some news channel to pick it up..i even be fair.. i give them a link to Mitanni's performance on the fanfeast, and one to Issler's statement.. wanna beat which one gonna be in the news?
|
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
152
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:37:00 -
[290] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:D Derp wrote:BringerMC wrote:D Derp wrote:BringerMC wrote: I am in the military and if anyone ever did anything like that specially in the publics eye they would be demoted and have a field grade article 15 slammed on them. Pretty sure if you work for any company and do that you will also probably get canned. Would not be suprised if the CCP employee that was at the event doesn't get fired or at the least a suspension.
My god, do you take being in your country's armed forces as seriously as you do eve, or do you take this videogame as seriously as you do the military? Which is it? What he did was in the public and acting as a Person not a player behind a screen. He did not do it in an inpersonal fashion. He was live in person telling people to tell another living human being to commit suicide. Its one thing in game to say things but telling another person in game or in person to commit suicide that says they are suicidal is the wrong answer. When it comes to a beating heart and blood in the viens that is real life mate. And once again another person on eve-o misses the point that people like Wis, especially on the internet, claim to be suicidal or have x problem to garner sympathy -all the damn time-. It's common, even. Especially among the younger crowd. Yes, mittens did a dumb thing, but comparing his actions and him being on the CSM to being court marshaled or whatever is just ever so slightly blowing things out of proportion. except that it's a very real possiblity he may get sued irl. And any of u mouthbreathing pubies that actually emailed wis a "do it man" email......that's stepping in it. I hate things like this end up getting settled in court. These things were meant to be settled like grown ass men. Alas I speak of a world long gone unfortunately.
This post is cyber-bullying of your poor English teacher who probably killed herself IRL. |
|
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
152
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:40:00 -
[291] - Quote
Henriette Malia Alette wrote:Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Sure she could probably be handling it better, could have waited to say something, could have done skype from a laptop or something, could be in coms somehow whatever. But I do get the impression she is at least in tune with the understanding a lot of us have about how far off message into the hinterlands of lunacy the current CSM chair has gone.
IMO, Issler is doing more damage to the CSM than The Mittani did with his drunken outburst. The Mittani will probably just fade away. Issler, on the other hand, we seem to be stuck with. We can put it to the test you know.. our news are a bit boring.. im sure i can get some news channel to pick it up..i even be fair.. i give them a link to Mitanni's performance on the fanfeast, and one to Issler's statement.. wanna beat which one gonna be in the news?
Oh you'd get the effect you would want. But it would kind of blow the whole e-bushido "We want him to step down for EEEVEEEE" point out of the water and prove what all the whining in this forum is really about: the wrong man won the CSM chair. I couldn't be arsed to vote. Now I'm outraged. |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
43
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:40:00 -
[292] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:D Derp wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Hmmm hasn't the last half dozen years of relentlessly mocking you people proven I really don't have the slightest inkling of fear for tubby neckbeard spaceship cultists and no need whatsoever for anonymous sockpuppets....
I will give you credit where credit is due. You post poorly on your main. That puts you above at least 95% of people here. But that was mainly meant as a swipe against whoever owns that sockpuppet. (It was you wasn't it) I'll tell you what mmm "Doctor Derp" is it? If I'm ever in need of a posting critique from a no-name goonswarm recruit with a penchant for third hand memes handed down from bad posters of yesteryear I'll look you up okay? But until then I'll soldier old regardless. Chin chin and all that!
To receive such a sick :iceburn: from Jade Constantine himself, it is an honor! But if I ever need the opinion of an irrelevant idiot as to my lack of internet fame, I know who to ask! Chin Chin Fly safe o7o7o7 and all that!
Ceo of The xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub D Derp |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
152
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:47:00 -
[293] - Quote
D Derp wrote: To receive such a sick :iceburn: from Jade Constantine himself, it is an honor! But if I ever need the opinion of an irrelevant idiot as to my lack of internet fame, I know who to ask! Chin Chin Fly safe o7o7o7 and all that!
Ceo of The xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub D Derp
No no, when you want to belittle Jade Constantine you point out that he ran a brothel in a video game about spaceships.
Meanwhile Second Life is right around the corner. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1586
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 02:55:00 -
[294] - Quote
SmilingVagrant wrote:D Derp wrote: To receive such a sick :iceburn: from Jade Constantine himself, it is an honor! But if I ever need the opinion of an irrelevant idiot as to my lack of internet fame, I know who to ask! Chin Chin Fly safe o7o7o7 and all that!
Ceo of The xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub D Derp
No no, when you want to belittle Jade Constantine you point out that he ran a brothel in a video game about spaceships. Meanwhile Second Life is right around the corner.
Isn't second life that game with the boutiques and giant dongs where the goonswarm last proved slightly relevant?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:01:00 -
[295] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:SmilingVagrant wrote:D Derp wrote: To receive such a sick :iceburn: from Jade Constantine himself, it is an honor! But if I ever need the opinion of an irrelevant idiot as to my lack of internet fame, I know who to ask! Chin Chin Fly safe o7o7o7 and all that!
Ceo of The xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub D Derp
No no, when you want to belittle Jade Constantine you point out that he ran a brothel in a video game about spaceships. Meanwhile Second Life is right around the corner. Isn't second life that game with the boutiques and giant dongs where the goonswarm last proved slightly relevant?
It's the game with brothels and furries and lots of yiffing and dongs where a few goons set up shop, called themselves w-hat or something, and got banned. If what SmilingVagrant said was true, then it's probably right up your alley. Except perhaps for the furry thing.
And maybe you're unaware ,but goons come from somethingawful.com. Also, not everyone there is in goonwaffe!
edit: If there's a game out there, goons likely play it! WoW, SW:ToR, that startrek game, Rift, even Runescape! |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
27
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:02:00 -
[296] - Quote
Henriette Malia Alette wrote:We can put it to the test you know.. our news are a bit boring.. im sure i can get some news channel to pick it up..i even be fair.. i give them a link to Mitanni's performance on the fanfeast, and one to Issler's statement.. wanna beat which one gonna be in the news? The Mittani is most likely going away. Issler, within days of winning a seat, is already belittling her colleagues and players of this game. The Mittani is not going to be on the CSM anymore. Issler has a year to be completely divisive. Tell me again who is doing more damage to the CSM?
News outlets have nothing to do with it. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:12:00 -
[297] - Quote
This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:23:00 -
[298] - Quote
Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue.
do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? |
Henriette Malia Alette
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:26:00 -
[299] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Henriette Malia Alette wrote:We can put it to the test you know.. our news are a bit boring.. im sure i can get some news channel to pick it up..i even be fair.. i give them a link to Mitanni's performance on the fanfeast, and one to Issler's statement.. wanna beat which one gonna be in the news? The Mittani is most likely going away. Issler, within days of winning a seat, is already belittling her colleagues and players of this game. The Mittani is not going to be on the CSM anymore. Issler has a year to be completely divisive. Tell me again who is doing more damage to the CSM? News outlets have nothing to do with it.
Actually, i find her refreshingly open, and honest.. pretty muc everything most politicians isnt.. and ppl wonder why other ppl never vote? - why ? - bcause politicians dont stand up, speak theyre mind, and do so truthfully.. "He is a politician - u cant trust him" - rings a bell?
Issler, like any other candidate ISNT on the CSM to play nice with mittens, she is there to represent people, and ensure that what goes on in CSM, what she stands for and what every one else stands for isnt sweept under the carpet, and hidden in "joint statements" saying nothing. We had enuff of that crap already.. to much null in CSM, to much politics. The part where we vote, and the ppl voted for just "vanish" to emerge a year later stating "i worked in CSM" meaning nothing - its a part we need removed from this game..
And trust me, if u wanna see eve fail epicly, burning to the ground, all it takes is CSM to pretend as nothing, CCP to pretend as nothing, Mittani - as usual not giving a **** RL or in eve.. and a a clever reporter with some free time on his hands to see Mittani's little stunt, and read this forums.. i can see the tv-show host already: "SO this game has a playervoted leader whom not only mocks a suicidal player, OPENLY states his names - no - , he encourages players to help him out drive the guy to the ground, and if you thought thats bad, just wait until you find out that EVE's playerbase supports his actions" *WHOMP* kiss ure eve-ass goodbye... Elected CSM members like Issler making statements may be what actually would SAVE EVE in such a situation.
|
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:27:00 -
[300] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl?
Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time. |
|
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
47
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:34:00 -
[301] - Quote
Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time.
Your point? Why do you care if I tell another goon to kill himself, or that his post was so bad that I'm going to kill myself? |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
47
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:34:00 -
[302] - Quote
oh right, pubbies with axes to grind |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:39:00 -
[303] - Quote
Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time.
is it now? can goons verify this? |
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:54:00 -
[304] - Quote
D Derp wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time. Your point? Why do you care if I tell another goon to kill himself, or that his post was so bad that I'm going to kill myself?
I don't. I don't care at all, in fact I've come to expect it from goons.
Hence why I don't see what the fuss is about what Mittens said at the panel. My point was that it'd be hypocritical to be upset over that and not over goons posting "kill yourself irl" on various fora. Which, for the record, I don't think anyone should be. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:56:00 -
[305] - Quote
Steph Wing wrote:D Derp wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time. Your point? Why do you care if I tell another goon to kill himself, or that his post was so bad that I'm going to kill myself? I don't. I don't care at all, in fact I've come to expect it from goons. Hence why I don't see what the fuss is about what Mittens said at the panel. My point was that it'd be hypocritical to be upset over that and not over goons posting "kill yourself irl" on various fora. Which, for the record, I don't think anyone should be.
then you shouldn't have a problem telling it to someone's face. |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 03:57:00 -
[306] - Quote
Henriette Malia Alette wrote:Issler, like any other candidate ISNT on the CSM to play nice with mittens, she is there to represent people, and ensure that what goes on in CSM, what she stands for and what every one else stands for isnt sweept under the carpet, and hidden in "joint statements" saying nothing. We had enuff of that crap already.. to much null in CSM, to much politics. The part where we vote, and the ppl voted for just "vanish" to emerge a year later stating "i worked in CSM" meaning nothing - its a part we need removed from this game.. So rather than working with the team to come up with a statement, and maybe posting a dissenting opinion after the fact if she didn't agree with the statement, she should start up another threadnought on the forums by calling out her colleagues? Man, talk about "Going Rogue".
Henriette Malia Alette wrote:And trust me, if u wanna see eve fail epicly, burning to the ground, all it takes is CSM to pretend as nothing, CCP to pretend as nothing, Mittani - as usual not giving a **** RL or in eve.. and a a clever reporter with some free time on his hands to see Mittani's little stunt, and read this forums.. i can see the tv-show host already: "SO this game has a playervoted leader whom not only mocks a suicidal player, OPENLY states his names - no - , he encourages players to help him out drive the guy to the ground, and if you thought thats bad, just wait until you find out that EVE's playerbase supports his actions" *WHOMP* kiss ure eve-ass goodbye... Elected CSM members like Issler making statements may be what actually would SAVE EVE in such a situation. You literally didn't read or comprehend a ******* thing I wrote.
Bottom line: CCP is running an investigation into the matter, which means they're consulting with lawyers (calmly) rather than stirring up a complete shitstorm. They've already issued a statement condemning the action, now it's time to figure out what to do. People like Issler are making a huge deal out of a terrible situation by not being the patient voice of calm. I don't see that as leadership. Issler really isn't fit to sit in that CSM seat. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:04:00 -
[307] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:D Derp wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time. Your point? Why do you care if I tell another goon to kill himself, or that his post was so bad that I'm going to kill myself? I don't. I don't care at all, in fact I've come to expect it from goons. Hence why I don't see what the fuss is about what Mittens said at the panel. My point was that it'd be hypocritical to be upset over that and not over goons posting "kill yourself irl" on various fora. Which, for the record, I don't think anyone should be. then you shouldn't have a problem telling it to someone's face.
And indeed I would not. It's just words.
|
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:06:00 -
[308] - Quote
Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:
then you shouldn't have a problem telling it to someone's face.
And indeed I would not. It's just words.
Walk up to a real goon at a bar this weekend, if you're old enough to drink, and tell him with all heartfelt sincerity he should kill himself because he's a waste of space. Go on....see what happens. That's my whole point..in the real world there are grown ass consequences for talking this kind of sht to people. |
Hailey Sunweaver
MAFIA PlAYGROUND.
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:13:00 -
[309] - Quote
He's probably worried that 10,000 goons will be ordered to troll him into suicide.
That statement is way out of line. Everyone is entitled to the right of due process even Mittens. And before you call be a fan boy no I am not a fan. But I believe that CCP and the CSM should handle this matter and take the action that's appropriate. |
D Derp
xXxSePhIrOtHSSJ420xXx W33D4LYFE Fanclub
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:16:00 -
[310] - Quote
Hailey Sunweaver wrote:He's probably worried that 10,000 goons will be ordered to troll him into suicide.
That statement is way out of line. Everyone is entitled to the right of due process even Mittens. And before you call be a fan boy no I am not a fan. But I believe that CCP and the CSM should handle this matter and take the action that's appropriate.
There aren't 10000 goons.
michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:
then you shouldn't have a problem telling it to someone's face.
And indeed I would not. It's just words. Walk up to a real goon at a bar this weekend, if you're old enough to drink, and tell him with all heartfelt sincerity he should kill himself because he's a waste of space. Go on....see what happens. That's my whole point..in the real world there are grown ass consequences for talking this kind of sht to people.
I think something similar happened once. The offending stranger got punched in the face.
But your ridiculous scenario? He would be made fun of. |
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EnderCapitalG
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
708
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:23:00 -
[311] - Quote
Hello Issler.
I came here to tell you that you are stupid.
Just so you know~~ |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:24:00 -
[312] - Quote
D Derp wrote:I think something similar happened once. The offending stranger got punched in the face. But your ridiculous scenario? He would be made fun of.
not even in a beverly hills polo club would that not lead to hands being thrown. |
Hailey Sunweaver
MAFIA PlAYGROUND.
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:31:00 -
[313] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:D Derp wrote:Vorlain wrote:Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term. How is coming out to condemn something that need's condemning causing a **** storm? pretty sure Mittani created that don't you think? If you are saying you are going to make another CSM's life more difficult and block what they do in the CSM on the basis of coming out and condemning what happened then you don't deserve to be on the CSM. You are there to represent us and have our interests at heart, not to be some upset fanboi. If you can't work for the betterment of eve you don't belong there. The CSM needs to make it clear it doesn't support what happened, and that's all Issy did. Oh and if you can't work with them for saying it, I take it you won't work with Mittani for coming out and saying pretty much the same thing, pretty sure he didn't run his apology by you and got your permission before posting it. Or are you going to just ignore that and be a hypocrite? Nice alt bro. Mind posting the same on your main? He's probably worried that 10,000 goons will be ordered to troll him into suicide.
That's what I was trying to quote sorry i am to lazy to edit. The fact remains the suicide comment is out of line |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
370
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:53:00 -
[314] - Quote
Hailey Sunweaver wrote:
That's what I was trying to quote sorry i am to lazy to edit. The fact remains the suicide comment is out of line
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvo08_uYjHI
01:12:00
decide for yourself, he seems very eager to say make him kill himself.
Drunk or not.
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
51
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:53:00 -
[315] - Quote
EnderCapitalG wrote:Hello Issler.
I came here to tell you that you are stupid.
Just so you know~~ As opposed to someone who supports Mr. I just lost 10058 votes? Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 04:55:00 -
[316] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Hailey Sunweaver wrote:
That's what I was trying to quote sorry i am to lazy to edit. The fact remains the suicide comment is out of line
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvo08_uYjHI01:12:00 decide for yourself, he seems very eager to say make him kill himself. Drunk or not.
the whole presentation was premeditated |
Hailey Sunweaver
MAFIA PlAYGROUND.
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:01:00 -
[317] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Hailey Sunweaver wrote:
That's what I was trying to quote sorry i am to lazy to edit. The fact remains the suicide comment is out of line
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvo08_uYjHI01:12:00 decide for yourself, he seems very eager to say make him kill himself. Drunk or not.
I'm not disputing what was said at fanfest. I am saying it is not the place Issler to speak out of turn. She is not the judge and jury. She is trying to use this event to fuel her personal goals / ambitions by not speaking with the rest of the CSM on this matter. We elect the CSM to be our sounding board to CCP. So i think that we should allow both the CSM and CCP to do thier jobs and handle the matter before them in the correct manner. |
Sephiroth CloneIIV
Vitriol Ventures BLACK-MARK
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:29:00 -
[318] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:EnderCapitalG wrote:Hello Issler.
I came here to tell you that you are stupid.
Just so you know~~ As opposed to someone who supports Mr. I just lost 10058 votes?
He has not lost a single vote, pubies who hate him still hate him, and would have never voted for him.
Resign or not, he still won with 10k votes. That would be like saying the millions who voted for bill clinton or nixon were 'lost', when they went into scandal. |
Kai Tel
State War Academy Caldari State
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:49:00 -
[319] - Quote
Issler has more justification than most CSM members to go on a rant. Particularly, if she doesnGÇÖt like the way the current situation is being handled. Aside from a statement, it makes no sense for the CSM to be involved at this point. ItGÇÖs not their place. This is an issue waiting for a CCP ruling and they seem to have lost their balls. Any other player and this would have been over and done with days ago. But it seems a little favoritism has come into play...
Mittens claimed he did wrong himself, claimed he would resign himself, and left no question as to wrong doing in his own words. There is nothing more to discuss. Does he want to back out of those promises now? Does he think he has some form of voter mandate? Well, so did Nixon.
Was Mittens just talking "drunk again?" If he will not man up and take care of this himself as he said he would then let CCP apply the ban hammer to help him stiffen that spine.
I know all the little wall boogers want to swarm to their king nose picker's defense in face of the evil pubbie onslaught but there is simply no escape this time. And it's your own fault. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:51:00 -
[320] - Quote
Sephiroth CloneIIV wrote:Frying Doom wrote:EnderCapitalG wrote:Hello Issler.
I came here to tell you that you are stupid.
Just so you know~~ As opposed to someone who supports Mr. I just lost 10058 votes? He has not lost a single vote, pubies who hate him still hate him, and would have never voted for him. Resign or not, he still won with 10k votes. That would be like saying the millions who voted for bill clinton or nixon were 'lost', when they went into scandal. Yes because they all went on to do productive things as commander and chief of the United States after they were thrown out. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Mr R4nd0m
Retribution.
90
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:51:00 -
[321] - Quote
Sephiroth CloneIIV wrote:Frying Doom wrote:EnderCapitalG wrote:Hello Issler.
I came here to tell you that you are stupid.
Just so you know~~ As opposed to someone who supports Mr. I just lost 10058 votes? He has not lost a single vote, pubies who hate him still hate him, and would have never voted for him. Resign or not, he still won with 10k votes. That would be like saying the millions who voted for bill clinton or nixon were 'lost', when they went into scandal.
Oh stop please he got those votes purely by powe bloc voting, 8000 goons and their alts so stop trying to make out he got 10k votes by random people! Can't believe people are still trying to pull that one
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:52:00 -
[322] - Quote
Kai Tel wrote:Issler has more justification than most CSM members to go on a rant. Particularly, if she doesnGÇÖt like the way the current situation is being handled. Aside from a statement, it makes no sense for the CSM to be involved at this point. ItGÇÖs not their place. This is an issue waiting for a CCP ruling and they seem to have lost their balls. Any other player and this would have been over and done with days ago. But it seems a little favoritism has come into play...
Mittens claimed he did wrong himself, claimed he would resign himself, and left no question as to wrong doing in his own words. There is nothing more to discuss. Does he want to back out of those promises now? Does he think he has some form of voter mandate? Well, so did Nixon.
Was Mittens just talking "drunk again?" If he will not man up and take care of this himself as he said he would then let CCP apply the ban hammer to help him stiffen that spine.
I know all the little wall boogers want to swarm to their king nose picker's defense in face of the evil pubbie onslaught but there is simply no escape this time. And it's your own fault. Hear Hear Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Araviel
Spiritus Draconis
13
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 05:57:00 -
[323] - Quote
Two step wrote:Wow, way to make absolutely sure that you will not get anything at all done during your CSM 7 term.
WTF!? |
knobber Jobbler
Seniors Clan Get Off My Lawn
101
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:04:00 -
[324] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:
Short version the Chair of the CSM broke codes of conduct binding the behaviour of ordinary players. He did something that other player have been permabanned for. For him to remain in place after this would make a mockery of the CSM and CCP's own reputation for even-handed enforcement of rules.
No, he didn't. He didn't do anything to break any rules according to the EULA/TOS. Besides, he was in that panel as an alliance leader and Michael Boltons presentation was far more offensive...if you've an easily offended conservative who takes everything far to seriously.
Personally the whole thing, the whole reaction is hilarious, its of Daily Mail/Fox News proportions and you're acting like Glenn Beck.
No one seems to take into account that Wis guy might be have been trolling himself (this is EVE) and he might also have been botting with those 23 accounts. His reaction to this was certainly in good humour. Why not ask the person in question about how they feel about this? Because that might disarm this entire witch hunt.
Also no one seems to want to take into account that this sort of thing is a daily occurrence in most online games (note, this did not happen while in game or a game related service covered by the EULA). Some of the stuff you can hear on Xbox live makes mittanis comments look quite timid. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
52
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:11:00 -
[325] - Quote
knobber Jobbler wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: Short version the Chair of the CSM broke codes of conduct binding the behaviour of ordinary players. He did something that other player have been permabanned for. For him to remain in place after this would make a mockery of the CSM and CCP's own reputation for even-handed enforcement of rules.
No, he didn't. He didn't do anything to break any rules according to the EULA/TOS. Besides, he was in that panel as an alliance leader and Michael Boltons presentation was far more offensive...if you've an easily offended conservative who takes everything far to seriously. Sorry can see where Jade Constantine says EULA/TOS I believe that the reference was too
"They are also expected to adhere to the EULA/TOS and carry themselves in a manner that sets an example for other players to follow. " As listed at http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/What_is_the_CSM
So yes he clearly broke that rule unless RL threats are suddenly allowed. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
378
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:14:00 -
[326] - Quote
knobber Jobbler wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:
Short version the Chair of the CSM broke codes of conduct binding the behaviour of ordinary players. He did something that other player have been permabanned for. For him to remain in place after this would make a mockery of the CSM and CCP's own reputation for even-handed enforcement of rules.
No, he didn't. He didn't do anything to break any rules according to the EULA/TOS. Besides, he was in that panel as an alliance leader and Michael Boltons presentation was far more offensive...if you've an easily offended conservative who takes everything far to seriously. Personally the whole thing, the whole reaction is hilarious, its of Daily Mail/Fox News proportions and you're acting like Glenn Beck. No one seems to take into account that Wis guy might be have been trolling himself (this is EVE) and he might also have been botting with those 23 accounts. His reaction to this was certainly in good humour. Why not ask the person in question about how they feel about this? Because that might disarm this entire witch hunt. Also no one seems to want to take into account that this sort of thing is a daily occurrence in most online games (note, this did not happen while in game or a game related service covered by the EULA). Some of the stuff you can hear on Xbox live makes mittanis comments look quite timid.
Bolton didn't end up calling for someones IRL death.
And it being a daily occurrence does not make it right.
This is basic stuff you are getting wrong. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:24:00 -
[327] - Quote
What I said earlier is the CSM should have released a statement individually or together even if it was a simple, "we are reviewing it but we believe that real life threats are inexcusable" or for that matter any rubbish other than we are running away see you in a few days.
Apparently the BBC now has this so we are all boned. The fact that this has not been acted upon by the CSM or CCP will get them all hung. Actually I suppose we can say "Members of the CSM have condemned this action" as 2 of them spoke out before they were shut down. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
michaelthered
The Logistical Nightmare
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:25:00 -
[328] - Quote
knobber Jobbler wrote:
[.
No one seems to take into account that Wis guy might be have been trolling himself (this is EVE) and he might also have been botting with those 23 accounts. His reaction to this was certainly in good humour. Why not ask the person in question about how they feel about this? Because that might disarm this entire witch hunt.
Also no one seems to want to take into account that this sort of thing is a daily occurrence in most online games (note, this did not happen while in game or a game related service covered by the EULA). Some of the stuff you can hear on Xbox live makes mittanis comments look quite timid.
wis has been investigated by CCP...he is "not" a botter, confirmed. He runs a ridiculous multi screen setup I can't even begin to comprehend. He's got a blog somewhere that has a picture of it. You can see it for yourself. |
Townsend Harris
The Milkmen Test Alliance Please Ignore
25
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:41:00 -
[329] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:The worst part is where does the game go from here. If nothing is done what can CCP say if someone else starts making RL death threats or threats of a beating? What about their liability if nothing is done?
We are only talking about an advisory position to a company generating 60 million a year.
Honestly I believe he is sorry and there was no way he could know getting drunk that night would do so much. Over here we have "Don't drink and drive" ads every where, maybe someone should get him a "Don't drink and Speak on Camera" T-Shirt. You idiot. Seriously you think this many people can be this buttmad at Mitanni, Goons, the CFS, TEST, etc and in a moment of extreme stupidity, send an eve mail that says "I'm going to kill you!". Apparently people have even threatened Mittens dog. Heard anything about anyone being arrested for that? I haven't. Heard of CCP banning any accounts cause of stuff like that? I haven't. Just. Stop. Posting. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
53
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 06:50:00 -
[330] - Quote
Townsend Harris wrote:Frying Doom wrote:The worst part is where does the game go from here. If nothing is done what can CCP say if someone else starts making RL death threats or threats of a beating? What about their liability if nothing is done?
We are only talking about an advisory position to a company generating 60 million a year.
Honestly I believe he is sorry and there was no way he could know getting drunk that night would do so much. Over here we have "Don't drink and drive" ads every where, maybe someone should get him a "Don't drink and Speak on Camera" T-Shirt. You idiot. Seriously you think this many people can be this buttmad at Mitanni, Goons, the CFS, TEST, etc and in a moment of extreme stupidity, send an eve mail that says "I'm going to kill you!". Apparently people have even threatened Mittens dog. Heard anything about anyone being arrested for that? I haven't. Heard of CCP banning any accounts cause of stuff like that? I haven't. Just. Stop. Posting. Oh you seem confused, Im not talking about something done in game. If his dog, family or he has been threatened in Real Life, he should contact the police immediately. Threats of this kind in real life should not be tolerated by anyone. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
60
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 07:18:00 -
[331] - Quote
So Issler, how does it feel to basically tell the entire CSM to suck your **** just days before you have to start working with them for a year? Do you feel that this will help you in your goals to make eve a better place for miners? |
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 07:40:00 -
[332] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:
then you shouldn't have a problem telling it to someone's face.
And indeed I would not. It's just words. Walk up to a real goon at a bar this weekend, if you're old enough to drink, and tell him with all heartfelt sincerity he should kill himself because he's a waste of space. Go on....see what happens. That's my whole point..in the real world there are grown ass consequences for talking this kind of sht to people.
Honestly, if I walked up to a goonie and told him to kill himself, while grinning the same grin that Mittens grinned on the panel, I'm pretty confident it'd get laughed off. I'd probably even get laughed at.
Goonies, back me up here. |
Mechaet
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 07:54:00 -
[333] - Quote
Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:
then you shouldn't have a problem telling it to someone's face.
And indeed I would not. It's just words. Walk up to a real goon at a bar this weekend, if you're old enough to drink, and tell him with all heartfelt sincerity he should kill himself because he's a waste of space. Go on....see what happens. That's my whole point..in the real world there are grown ass consequences for talking this kind of sht to people. Honestly, if I walked up to a goonie and told him to kill himself, while grinning the same grin that Mittens grinned on the panel, I'm pretty confident it'd get laughed off. I'd probably even get laughed at. Goonies, back me up here. Confirming I would ask for a deposit of 1 billion isk to accomplish this task, with 500 million due up front. |
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
180
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:08:00 -
[334] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote:So Issler, how does it feel to basically tell the entire CSM to suck your **** just days before you have to start working with them for a year? Do you feel that this will help you in your goals to make eve a better place for miners?
I too am curious what possessed Issler to run off and make this thread without consulting the rest of the CSM about how to approach MittaniGate. It would have made a lot more sense for them to discuss the situation privately, decide what they were going to do (after seeing what CCP wanted/required out of the situation)) and then make a united public front about the post. Having one of them run off and immediately condemn her fellow CSM member's actions (while arguably morally justifiable to an extent) is not a very politically thought out move.
Is Issler really so quick to stab her fellow CSM in the back? She has to work with the rest of the CSM for a year, and I don't think this is a very good way to start off for her. They probably see her as some kind of rogue element that does whatever she wants for her own purposes. Not a very good first impression.
But, you know, to each their own or whatever. Hans Jagerblitzen for CSM7 |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
54
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:15:00 -
[335] - Quote
I thought it was good a couple of them spoke out. I wish they all had rather than just tow the party line.
Especially when the party line seems to be "Duck and Cover" Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
180
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:20:00 -
[336] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:I thought it was good a couple of them spoke out. I wish they all had rather than just tow the party line.
Especially when the party line seems to be "Duck and Cover"
We've seen the effects of a CSM member acting without thinking. I think it isn't appropriate to immediately rush off and post your first instinct without consulting your co-workers about what happened, what now needs to happen, etc. It just doesn't seem very professional to me, and professionalism from the CSM is what started this whole shebang. Hans Jagerblitzen for CSM7 |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2178
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:36:00 -
[337] - Quote
In evolutionary psychology and in cognitive neuroscience, patience is studied as a decision-making problem, involving the choice of either a small reward in the short term, or a more valuable reward in the long term. When given a choice, all animals, humans included, are inclined to favour short term rewards over long term rewards. This is despite the often greater benefits associated with long term rewards.
In a 2005 study involving common marmosets and cottontop tamarins, animals of both species faced a self-control paradigm in which individuals chose between taking an immediate small reward and waiting a variable amount of time for a large reward. Under these conditions, marmosets waited significantly longer for food than tamarins. This difference cannot be explained by life history, social behaviour or brain size. It can, however, be explained by feeding ecology: marmosets rely on gum, a food product acquired by waiting for exudate to flow from trees, whereas tamarins feed on insects, a food product requiring impulsive action. Foraging ecology, therefore, may provide a selective pressure for the evolution of self-control. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:38:00 -
[338] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:So Issler, how does it feel to basically tell the entire CSM to suck your **** just days before you have to start working with them for a year? Do you feel that this will help you in your goals to make eve a better place for miners? I too am curious what possessed Issler to run off and make this thread without consulting the rest of the CSM about how to approach MittaniGate. It would have made a lot more sense for them to discuss the situation privately, decide what they were going to do (after seeing what CCP wanted/required out of the situation)) and then make a united public front about the post. Having one of them run off and immediately condemn her fellow CSM member's actions (while arguably morally justifiable to an extent) is not a very politically thought out move. Is Issler really so quick to stab her fellow CSM in the back? She has to work with the rest of the CSM for a year, and I don't think this is a very good way to start off for her. They probably see her as some kind of rogue element that does whatever she wants for her own purposes. Not a very good first impression. But, you know, to each their own or whatever.
You mean this isn't the official CSM response?
Wow. I'd assumed it was, since, you know, it has CSM stamped all over it.
Ball = dropped, well done Issler. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:38:00 -
[339] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:Frying Doom wrote:I thought it was good a couple of them spoke out. I wish they all had rather than just tow the party line.
Especially when the party line seems to be "Duck and Cover" We've seen the effects of a CSM member acting without thinking. I think it isn't appropriate to immediately rush off and post your first instinct without consulting your co-workers about what happened, what now needs to happen, etc. It just doesn't seem very professional to me, and professionalism from the CSM is what started this whole shebang. I can see your point if The Mittani had run this past the CSM in the first place we wouldn't be here and here stinks. It would be nice to know the remaining CSM members had morals though.
Currently it just looks like that they can't deal with a crisis with out The Mittani. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Francisco Bizzaro
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:41:00 -
[340] - Quote
This CSM is going places. And they haven't even taken office yet. Looking forward to an eventful year. |
|
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
180
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:41:00 -
[341] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:In evolutionary psychology and in cognitive neuroscience, patience is studied as a decision-making problem, involving the choice of either a small reward in the short term, or a more valuable reward in the long term. When given a choice, all animals, humans included, are inclined to favour short term rewards over long term rewards. This is despite the often greater benefits associated with long term rewards.
In a 2005 study involving common marmosets and cottontop tamarins, animals of both species faced a self-control paradigm in which individuals chose between taking an immediate small reward and waiting a variable amount of time for a large reward. Under these conditions, marmosets waited significantly longer for food than tamarins. This difference cannot be explained by life history, social behaviour or brain size. It can, however, be explained by feeding ecology: marmosets rely on gum, a food product acquired by waiting for exudate to flow from trees, whereas tamarins feed on insects, a food product requiring impulsive action. Foraging ecology, therefore, may provide a selective pressure for the evolution of self-control.
I think Hans just ninja-compared Issler to a small marsupial. Cool. Sa souvraya niende misain ye. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:48:00 -
[342] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:In evolutionary psychology and in cognitive neuroscience, patience is studied as a decision-making problem, involving the choice of either a small reward in the short term, or a more valuable reward in the long term. When given a choice, all animals, humans included, are inclined to favour short term rewards over long term rewards. This is despite the often greater benefits associated with long term rewards.
In a 2005 study involving common marmosets and cottontop tamarins, animals of both species faced a self-control paradigm in which individuals chose between taking an immediate small reward and waiting a variable amount of time for a large reward. Under these conditions, marmosets waited significantly longer for food than tamarins. This difference cannot be explained by life history, social behaviour or brain size. It can, however, be explained by feeding ecology: marmosets rely on gum, a food product acquired by waiting for exudate to flow from trees, whereas tamarins feed on insects, a food product requiring impulsive action. Foraging ecology, therefore, may provide a selective pressure for the evolution of self-control. I think Hans just ninja-compared Issler to a small marsupial. Cool. I think the CSM might have evolved to far and are starving to death Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2182
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 08:59:00 -
[343] - Quote
I wasn't trying to make a statement about anyone here, I was simply meditating on the value of patience during times like this. I came across that anecdote and found it interesting.
Besides, monkeys are totally awesome. Especially little ones with pouches. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:03:00 -
[344] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:I wasn't trying to make a statement about anyone here, I was simply meditating on the value of patience during times like this. I came across that anecdote and found it interesting.
Besides, monkeys are totally awesome. Especially little ones with pouches. Thank you for your speedy clarification. And yes monkey are really cool. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
knobber Jobbler
Seniors Clan Get Off My Lawn
101
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:05:00 -
[345] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:
Bolton didn't end up calling for someones IRL death.
And it being a daily occurrence does not make it right.
This is basic stuff you are getting wrong.
No, you're naive.
Calling for someones death and harrasing someone is totally different. He didn't say "Go round his house and kill him".
I agree, it wasn't right but you're taking on not just the entire of null sec but the larger gaming community. This sort of stuff happens all the time. You don't think just because this was the first time someone said to do this publicly its not been said 1000 times before? Some people just play EVE to make sure you have a bad day.
So what is you're reaction to people user the 'N' word in both comms and local all over nullsec? Putting **** links (and actual stuff that might offend) in chat?
Your little witch hunt and 5000 post threads may have unintended consequences for EVE.
michaelthered wrote:
wis has been investigated by CCP...he is "not" a botter, confirmed. He runs a ridiculous multi screen setup I can't even begin to comprehend. He's got a blog somewhere that has a picture of it. You can see it for yourself.
It doesn't mean he isn't a massive troll does it? This witch hunt is not only ridiculous but utterly naive. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:12:00 -
[346] - Quote
knobber Jobbler wrote:
Calling for someones death and harrasing someone is totally different. He didn't say "Go round his house and kill him".
No he told a crowd and all the people watching remotely to make him so depressed he would kill himself. This was not in game spam but even then if you said it in game to a group of people so public, maybe you would deserve banning for that. Threatening someone with an in-game effect like shooting someones ship is one thing but when it comes with the attachment that this is so they kill them selves in RL that's something different. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2184
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:30:00 -
[347] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote: I can see your point if The Mittani had run this past the CSM in the first place we wouldn't be here and here stinks. It would be nice to know the remaining CSM members had morals though.
Currently it just looks like that they can't deal with a crisis with out The Mittani.
Everyone needs to step back here for a moment and understand that while group discussion is important, and teamwork necessary to work on behalf of the players to get things accomplished with CCP, the CSM at the end of the day is 14 individual human beings.
Those that want instant gratification regarding a big CSM statement are going to have to wait. Everyone needs to talk about it, and frankly not all of us have heard all sides of the story. This is EVE. Nothing it ever as it seems.
Personally, without having been at Fan Fest, without having ever spoken to The Wis, without knowing what the CSM / CCP involvement is in the Alliance presentation preparation, I'm just not comfortable coming out and waving a sword with righteous anger without having listened to the full story so I can assess what the problem here is, and think about how we can prevent it from happening again. CSM7 haven't even taken office yet, we're still getting set up.
I really appreciate those of you in this thread that have shown respect for the fact that this is all happening literally while many of the CSM7 members are in planes travelling. Please give everyone a day or so to get home, get paperwork in, get into the conversation, and than we can get to work.
Its extremely premature to go doomsdaying about how we "can't deal with a crisis", and its certainly not fair to accuse those of us who want to handle this the right way as somehow lacking in morals. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Nair Alderau
EVE University Ivy League
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:38:00 -
[348] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I can see your point if The Mittani had run this past the CSM in the first place we wouldn't be here and here stinks. It would be nice to know the remaining CSM members had morals though.
Currently it just looks like that they can't deal with a crisis with out The Mittani.
Everyone needs to step back here for a moment and understand that while group discussion is important, and teamwork necessary to work on behalf of the players to get things accomplished with CCP, the CSM at the end of the day is 14 individual human beings. Those that want instant gratification regarding a big CSM statement are going to have to wait. Everyone needs to talk about it, and frankly not all of us have heard all sides of the story. This is EVE. Nothing it ever as it seems. Personally, without having been at Fan Fest, without having ever spoken to The Wis, without knowing what the CSM / CCP involvement is in the Alliance presentation preparation, I'm just not comfortable coming out and waving a sword with righteous anger without having listened to the full story so I can assess what the problem here is, and think about how we can prevent it from happening again. CSM7 haven't even taken office yet, we're still getting set up. I really appreciate those of you in this thread that have shown respect for the fact that this is all happening literally while many of the CSM7 members are in planes travelling. Please give everyone a day or so to get home, get paperwork in, get into the conversation, and than we can get to work. Its extremely premature to go doomsdaying about how we "can't deal with a crisis", and its certainly not fair to accuse those of us who want to handle this the right way as somehow lacking in morals.
This.
Thank you.
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
393
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:42:00 -
[349] - Quote
knobber Jobbler wrote:
Calling for someones death and harrasing someone is totally different. He didn't say "Go round his house and kill him".
No he basically did exactly that, he said find him and drive him to suicide. Your just quibbling semantics when the end result would have been similar had the community not gotten up in arms about it.
Its not funny. Its not excusable.
And FYI a witch hunt would imply we are trying to get an innocent person. I got news for you...Hes on tape clear as day. |
LtTysander
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:47:00 -
[350] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:knobber Jobbler wrote:
Calling for someones death and harrasing someone is totally different. He didn't say "Go round his house and kill him".
No he basically did exactly that, he said find him and drive him to suicide. Your just quibbling semantics when the end result would have been similar had the community not gotten up in arms about it. Its not funny. Its not excusable. And FYI a witch hunt would imply we are trying to get an innocent person. I got news for you...Hes on tape clear as day.
No, it is two completely different things you god damned idiot. Stop trying to equate the two it just makes you look like a kneejerking, reactionary fool. |
|
Steph Wing
Fantabulously Terrific Wonderment
65
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:53:00 -
[351] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:knobber Jobbler wrote:
Calling for someones death and harrasing someone is totally different. He didn't say "Go round his house and kill him".
No he basically did exactly that, he said find him and drive him to suicide. Your just quibbling semantics when the end result would have been similar had the community not gotten up in arms about it. Its not funny. Its not excusable.
Since when has Goonswarm ever been funny or excusable? |
buck herrick
101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda
8
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:58:00 -
[352] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:[quote=Frying Doom] I can see your point if The....etc., etc. (shortened to avoid unecessary screen real-estate waste - not to mis-quote or remove context).
Personally, without having been at Fan Fest, without having ever spoken to The Wis, without knowing what the CSM / CCP involvement is in the Alliance presentation preparation, I'm just not comfortable coming out and waving a sword with righteous anger without having listened to the full story so I can assess what the problem here is, and think about how we can prevent it from happening again. CSM7 haven't even taken office yet, we're still getting set up.
I really .....etc., etc.
I have no opinion that i wish to post here on the future of the CSM, its delegates, goats, FW, Goons, BoB, Miners, Mackinaws or Issler D or, indeed, the matter at hand. What happens happens.
Perhaps i should not post at all, but what the hell, the worst that can happen is goons tell me i am irrelevant as an NPC ALT or circle quote me until i am reduced to a gibbering, depressed, mentally unstable shell of a man. However, i do have a point of clarity and I find myself compelled to poast.
"having ever spoken to The Wis"
How is this relevant ? infact speaking to him should not even enter into the debate/conversation/thought process. "The Wis" whoever he may be is not the issue. He may be the trigger of the whole sorry chain of events, but other than that speaking to him serves no purpose.....unless [tinfoil] he is to be spoken to to provide an alibi or a cover story......[/tinfoil]
Seriously no one person's state of mind is of relevance. What is relevant is the reference to it, whether it accurate or not. however i also believe that context and circumstance play an equally large part here.
Just my 2 cents. Gonna sit back now and try to order a new F5 button. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1596
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 09:59:00 -
[353] - Quote
knobber Jobbler wrote: No, you're naive. Calling for someones death and harrasing someone is totally different. He didn't say "Go round his house and kill him".
Come on this is sounding like some pretty pathetic wriggling legalize now. He called on his followers to troll the guy into suicide! It'd be like some church minister in the real world calling on the congregation to camp outside somebodies house with signs about how they and their family were going to hell! Its harrassment and you can't really claim it isn't. Is it legally actionable in the real world? Probably not. And neither should it be. But its certainly actionable within the terms of the game company's rules of conduct and certainly can be used as a brutal example of the leader of the csm not being able to be a good ambassador of the game to fellow players and the news media.
knobber Jobbler wrote:I agree, it wasn't right but you're taking on not just the entire of null sec but the larger gaming community. This sort of stuff happens all the time. You don't think just because this was the first time someone said to do this publicly its not been said 1000 times before? Some people just play EVE to make sure you have a bad day.
See thats exactly the argument that Aris Bakhtanians made about casual and persuasive sexism being core to the "fighting game community" in the recent cross assault event. http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2012/02/is-pervasive-sexism-holding-the-professional-fighting-game-community-back.ars
By arguing this stuff happens all the time and cannot be held to account you are making precisely the same claim Bakhtanias does and it really won't wash for a game universe like Eve that is trying to go forward and expand and attract new players. There isn't a place in this game for people that call on their followers to troll people into suicide on stage at fanfest.
knobber Jobbler wrote:So what is you're reaction to people user the 'N' word in both comms and local all over nullsec? Putting **** links (and actual stuff that might offend) in chat?
I'll tell you right now. You come to Hek tonight where I'm going to be and start messing up local chat with racist/homophobic/hate language and I will petition you. If you keep doing it you will be banned under the terms of eula and tos. I have done this before and I will do it again because I don't believe this kind of behaviour is conducive to a healthy game environment for any of the players. Just because you have convinced yourself that this kind of vile stuff is the norm for whatever society you operate inside doesn't suddenly make it an acceptable part of the game. And this is really where Alexander Gianturco messed up big time - he was acting as if his organization had already "culturally assimilated" eve online and this stuff would be accepted by the populous. He was wrong.
knobber Jobbler wrote:Your little witch hunt and 5000 post threads may have unintended consequences for EVE.
If those "unintended consequences" are that we demonstrate to the gaming world at large that though Eve is an absolutely ruthless pvp game where you can lose all your possessions in an instant if you mess up it can still be a place where you will not be subjected to continuous out of character harrassment and urging to suicide then frankly ... good. If the consequence is that Alexander Gianturco is forced to resign and urges goons to quit the game then its on hilm really. But the best consequence would be he grows up a bit and realizes that he's welcome to remain in this game and game world by learning to differentiate between players and characters / people and spaceships and understands in the future that calling on people to be trolled into suicide is completely beyond the pale.
Quote:It doesn't mean he isn't a massive troll does it? This witch hunt is not only ridiculous but utterly naive.
I listened to the mining barge guy on Eve Radio last night. He doesn't sound like a troll to me, just a guy who got targetted by goons and had a letter taken out of context for the purpose of a fanfest mocking by a drunken powertripper using his CSM chair fame and alliance panel seat as a bully pulpit to enhance harrassment.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
231
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:00:00 -
[354] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:No he basically did exactly that, he said find him and drive him to suicide. Your just quibbling semantics when the end result would have been similar had the community not gotten up in arms about it. .
You can say this over and over again all you want, but the 3 day gap between his stupid joke and the community getting all "up in arms" is always going to be there, laughing in your face, having a beer with the Monday chatlog of The Wis seeming genuinely confused about what people are even on about (the harassment must have been *that bad*!). |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:06:00 -
[355] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Those that want instant gratification regarding a big CSM statement are going to have to wait. Everyone needs to talk about it, and frankly not all of us have heard all sides of the story. This is EVE. Nothing it ever as it seems.
Personally, without having been at Fan Fest, without having ever spoken to The Wis, without knowing what the CSM / CCP involvement is in the Alliance presentation preparation, I'm just not comfortable coming out and waving a sword with righteous anger without having listened to the full story so I can assess what the problem here is, and think about how we can prevent it from happening again. CSM7 haven't even taken office yet, we're still getting set up.
I really appreciate those of you in this thread that have shown respect for the fact that this is all happening literally while many of the CSM7 members are in planes travelling. Please give everyone a day or so to get home, get paperwork in, get into the conversation, and than we can get to work.
Its extremely premature to go doomsdaying about how we "can't deal with a crisis", and its certainly not fair to accuse those of us who want to handle this the right way as somehow lacking in morals.
Ok I will admit my statement was over the top, especially with you guys not even set up yet. as to "Cant deal with a crisis" that was an it appears which left by its self is what it looks like. Two threats totaling over 300 pages and no response, it would appear your real lives have gotten in the way, fair enough. We probably do expect to much from a voluntary non-paid group TBH, but with the only thing released at all from the CSM looking like a duck and cover you will get flak from nutters like me.
On the moral issue yes it would have been nice for a generic platitude like "Threats involving real life consequences are not acceptable." It says nothing about anyone's guilt or innocence, so if later you determine it was a CCP act for instance (I doubt it was but its an example) you can still say Real Life threats are not acceptable.
I actually started on this on the other foot, it was so tiny the first time I posted I believed it was nothing, and it really isn't anything ( I went to sleep on page 3 of the forum and woke up somewhere in the 60's) except now it is so large with so many media references to it, by the time the CSM puts out a statement this might and probably will have a life of its own.
So I too must apologize for my behavior towards the CSM, I'm not in it so I can't resign from it. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Thomas Kugisa
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:23:00 -
[356] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:As a CSM 7 member I am extremely disappointed with Mittens behavior at Fanfest this year.
...
We in the CSM owe Eve a much higher standard of behavior!
Issler Dainze if you only try hard enough maybe you can become the new spaceship queen! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1598
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:37:00 -
[357] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I can see your point if The Mittani had run this past the CSM in the first place we wouldn't be here and here stinks. It would be nice to know the remaining CSM members had morals though.
Currently it just looks like that they can't deal with a crisis with out The Mittani.
Everyone needs to step back here for a moment and understand that while group discussion is important, and teamwork necessary to work on behalf of the players to get things accomplished with CCP, the CSM at the end of the day is 14 individual human beings. Those that want instant gratification regarding a big CSM statement are going to have to wait. Everyone needs to talk about it, and frankly not all of us have heard all sides of the story. This is EVE. Nothing it ever as it seems. Personally, without having been at Fan Fest, without having ever spoken to The Wis, without knowing what the CSM / CCP involvement is in the Alliance presentation preparation, I'm just not comfortable coming out and waving a sword with righteous anger without having listened to the full story so I can assess what the problem here is, and think about how we can prevent it from happening again. CSM7 haven't even taken office yet, we're still getting set up. I really appreciate those of you in this thread that have shown respect for the fact that this is all happening literally while many of the CSM7 members are in planes travelling. Please give everyone a day or so to get home, get paperwork in, get into the conversation, and than we can get to work. Its extremely premature to go doomsdaying about how we "can't deal with a crisis", and its certainly not fair to accuse those of us who want to handle this the right way as somehow lacking in morals.
And just to clarify, what I've primarily criticised the CSM members for on this thread is for what I perceived to be double standards in the treatment of the Alexander Gianturco issue.
On the one hand Issler Dainz is strongly criticised for coming out with an individual position against the Mittani remaining as chair by CSM members here in advance of the meeting.
Which might well have flown with me.
If certain CSM members hadn't already come straight out of the gate with pledges of support and loyalty to Alexander Gianturco continuing as chair in general discussion!
That Hans is a pretty horrible double standard I think you'll agree.
If nobody is to make a statement in advance of discussion then nobody should make a bloody statement. Its simply not reasonable to censure only those making one kind of statement while allowing the other kind to go without question.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:46:00 -
[358] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I can see your point if The Mittani had run this past the CSM in the first place we wouldn't be here and here stinks. It would be nice to know the remaining CSM members had morals though.
Currently it just looks like that they can't deal with a crisis with out The Mittani.
Everyone needs to step back here for a moment and understand that while group discussion is important, and teamwork necessary to work on behalf of the players to get things accomplished with CCP, the CSM at the end of the day is 14 individual human beings. Those that want instant gratification regarding a big CSM statement are going to have to wait. Everyone needs to talk about it, and frankly not all of us have heard all sides of the story. This is EVE. Nothing it ever as it seems. Personally, without having been at Fan Fest, without having ever spoken to The Wis, without knowing what the CSM / CCP involvement is in the Alliance presentation preparation, I'm just not comfortable coming out and waving a sword with righteous anger without having listened to the full story so I can assess what the problem here is, and think about how we can prevent it from happening again. CSM7 haven't even taken office yet, we're still getting set up. I really appreciate those of you in this thread that have shown respect for the fact that this is all happening literally while many of the CSM7 members are in planes travelling. Please give everyone a day or so to get home, get paperwork in, get into the conversation, and than we can get to work. Its extremely premature to go doomsdaying about how we "can't deal with a crisis", and its certainly not fair to accuse those of us who want to handle this the right way as somehow lacking in morals. And just to clarify, what I've primarily criticised the CSM members for on this thread is for what I perceived to be double standards in the treatment of the Alexander Gianturco issue. On the one hand Issler Dainz is strongly criticised for coming out with an individual position against the Mittani remaining as chair by CSM members here in advance of the meeting. Which might well have flown with me. If certain CSM members hadn't already come straight out of the gate with pledges of support and loyalty to Alexander Gianturco continuing as chair in general discussion! That Hans is a pretty horrible double standard I think you'll agree. If nobody is to make a statement in advance of discussion then nobody should make a bloody statement. Its simply not reasonable to censure only those making one kind of statement while allowing the other kind to go without question. I missed posts of CSM members pledging loyalty and support. Why do I have a bad feeling if he doesn't resign we will be looking at a thread marked "[Proposal] Disband The CSM" and a high digit page count. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
135
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 10:52:00 -
[359] - Quote
You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
63
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:06:00 -
[360] - Quote
JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. I don't agree with statements that he should get banned or perma banned as some people have called for but if he gets away free from this the rage will be so great as to make the "Summer of Rage" look like a storm in a tea kettle.
When I first saw this it was really nothing but now it's so massive there will be no forgetting or forgiving. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Prince Kobol
419
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:08:00 -
[361] - Quote
Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored *** |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
182
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:09:00 -
[362] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. I don't agree with statements that he should get banned or perma banned as some people have called for but if he gets away free from this the rage will be so great as to make the "Summer of Rage" look like a storm in a tea kettle. When I first saw this it was really nothing but now it's so massive there will be no forgetting or forgiving.
I think one thing that is totally funny about this whole thing is that a week ago a few of us couldn't agree on anything in the CSM voting fortnight, and this has totally polarized many of us - we're in total agreement.
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
232
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:10:00 -
[363] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored ***
Whoa, he sent that at 92:46 AM, it MUST be legit! |
JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
135
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:16:00 -
[364] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. I don't agree with statements that he should get banned or perma banned as some people have called for but if he gets away free from this the rage will be so great as to make the "Summer of Rage" look like a storm in a tea kettle. When I first saw this it was really nothing but now it's so massive there will be no forgetting or forgiving.
When I first saw this it was a few people moaning about CCP, CSM and alliance reps using foul language in their presentations the same evening as the first day was broadcasted. Now it's an all out desperate war against The Mittani which just so happens to have exploded right after he was re-elected instead of two days earlier when the actual presentation was held.
Storm in a kettle is giving it too much credit; compared to monoclegate this is more like furiously stirring cups of tea.
Take that with a grain of salt, it's just my viewpoint. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:20:00 -
[365] - Quote
JamesCLK wrote:Frying Doom wrote:JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. I don't agree with statements that he should get banned or perma banned as some people have called for but if he gets away free from this the rage will be so great as to make the "Summer of Rage" look like a storm in a tea kettle. When I first saw this it was really nothing but now it's so massive there will be no forgetting or forgiving. When I first saw this it was a few people moaning about CCP, CSM and alliance reps using foul language in their presentations the same evening as the first day was broadcasted. Now it's an all out desperate war against The Mittani which just so happens to have exploded right after he was re-elected instead of two days earlier when the actual presentation was held. Storm in a kettle is giving it too much credit; compared to monoclegate this is more like furiously stirring cups of tea. Take that with a grain of salt, it's just my viewpoint. not really sure why it grew so much as it did other than it was during the US time slot but everyone has known before the election started that Mittens was going to be the CSM Chairman anyway. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1601
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:21:00 -
[366] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored ***
Hate to break it to you but that was me taking the mickey for the fact that the general discussion threads were being trolled off topic by goons talking incessantly about roadhouse movie. I made that up as a satire. For all I know Mittani MAY have given such an order or one of his lieutenents might have, but that jabber quote is me just changing the text of his "let jita burn" jabber from a couple of days ago. I didn't work that hard on disguising it tbh.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1601
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:35:00 -
[367] - Quote
This was one of the posts from a CSM member that led me to feel Issler was being unfairly picked on for speaking out btw:
Quote:I think everyone who voted for Mitanni had and has a pretty good idea of who he is in this game and what his alliance does. Did he get drunk and carry it over the line? Sure. And now he has sincerly apologized for it.
Nothing about this situation changes anything about who The Mitanni was before FanFest or will be now. He remains an excellent chairman, elected with a record breaking +10,000 votes, with the experience and savvy the players need to get the best possible results out of the CSM process.
Like a proper adult he took responsibility for his mistake, personally apologized to the player, and has made one of the most heartfelt apologies a person can make to the players as a whole. I suggest we in turn, as a community, also show the maturity to realize everyone makes mistakes; it's how they deal with them that reveals their character. I am willing to accept his apology and move on.
Alexander Gianturco has my full confidence and support to continue as chairman of CSM7.
Thats a resolution post not a "we're going into conclave to discuss a resolution post" - and I question its fair play to post a full endorsement of support for Alexander Gianturco's chairmanship as a single CSM voice while decrying another CSM's right to speak against it in a single voice.
(I've left off the ID for the specific CSM btw because I really don't want to pick on people or single anyone out, I'd just like to hear that the CSM collectively realizes it should not be doing singular pledges of loyalty and support to Gianturco while hammering on other CSM's who dare speak against him.)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:40:00 -
[368] - Quote
Thanks for that, I didn't see that one. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 11:41:00 -
[369] - Quote
I copied this from one of the general discussion treads as it seems highly relevant and shouldn't be missed
Temulkar Blaine wrote:Protection from Harassment Act 1997
This Act was passed following concerns that stalking was not dealt with effectively under the existing legislation. The Act des not refer solely to stalking but also covers harassment in a wider sense. The Act states that it is unlawful to cause harassment, alarm or distress by a course of conduct and states that GÇÿA person must not pursue a course of conduct, which:
amounts to harassment of another he knows, or ought to know, amounts to harassment of the other.GÇÖ
Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 This Act defines a criminal offence of intentional harassment, which covers all forms, including sexual harassment. A person is guilty of an offence if, with intent to cause a person harassment, alarm or distress, he/she
uses threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour or disorderly behaviour; or displays any writing, sign or other visible representation which is threatening, abusive or insulting, thereby causing that or another person harassment, alarm or distress.
Malicious Communications Act 1998/Telecommunications Act 1984 Under this Act it is an offence to send an indecent, offensive or threatening letter, electronic communication or other article to another person. Under section 43 of the Telecommunications Act 1984 it is a similar offence to send a telephone message which is indecent, offensive or threatening.
Both these offences are punishable with up to six months imprisonment and/or a fine. The Malicious Communications offences are wider ranging, but under the Telecommunications offences, it is likely that the Police will use the former Act to bring a charge.
The Communications Act 2003 The Communications Act 2003 is by far the most recent Act to be passed. Section 127 states that a person is guilty of an offence if he/she
sends by means of a public electronic communications network a message or other matter that is grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character; or causes any such message or matter to be so A person is guilty of an offence if, for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience or needless anxiety to another by means of a public electronic communications network, a message that he/she knows to be false, causes such a message to be sent; or persistently makes use of a public electronic communications network
Thats UK law on cyberbullying.
1. Alexander pursued a course of conduct that amounted to harrassment of another individual, as a former lawwyer he knows or ought to know that would be harrassment. Inebriation is not an excuse. So there is an argument that he has breached the protection from harrassment act in the uk.
2. Alexandeer used threatening and abusive language with an intent to cause harm whether in jest or not is not material. That is a breach of the criminal justice act.
3. Alexander sent a clear and threatening electronic message which is in breach of the malicious communication act.
4. Alexander sent a public commuciaction wth the purpose of causing annoyance and needless anxiety to another in breach of the communications act.
Maybe those of you trivialising this issue need to take a good look at yourselves. Cyberbullying costs lives. We are fortunate in this case that it hasnt however Eve wont be so fortunate in the future if this behaviiour is allowed to go unchallenged.
Alexander was incredibly stupid whilst drunk he made an odious statement that is clearly in breach of UK/EU law. Laws which were used on monday to sentence a twitter user for six months in prison for abusing Patrick Muamba after his collapse. In effect a student got sent down for mocking Muamba and saying he hoped he would die. That student didnt incite others to harrass anyone which is considered a more serious offence.
Suicide is an incredibly emotive issue one I would have thought the goons of all people would be sensitive to. Maybe those of you trolling on this thread need to take a look at yourselves. YOur defending the indefesible.
Alexander has said he will do the right thing and resign and I applaud him for that. It is an act of contrition that would go some way to rehabilitating him in my eyes. To try and weasel out of that action now would be reprehensible.
As far as the legal situation in Iceland is concerned they have applied for EU membership and are currently alighning their legal system to reflect EU law. CCP dont really have any choice but to investegate this and act accordingly. If they do not then they leave themselves open to litigation and or prosecution is situations like this happen and sombody stupid acts on it.
Alexander man up and do the right thing, resign.
Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
668
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:29:00 -
[370] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored ***
LOL
You got trolled by a serious internet spaceships brothel pimp that thinks she's relevant. Learn to internet and stop believing the first thing you read. Here's your sign... |
|
Jack Parr
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:34:00 -
[371] - Quote
I love how the csm is so quiet. I guess most of the members are truly scared to say something bad about alex. Isn't there supposed to be some transparency here? I guess the csm really is only interested in their own little worlds. If they cared about the players they would at least SAY SOMETHING. It's funny that the only csm player who stepped up and started a forum thread gets bashed by the other csm members. I guess she didn't get the memo about how nobody on the csm can say anything bad about the king of space.
The csm is worthless. Just disband because you people aren't going to support us. How much did alex bribe the other csm's to stay quiet? |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:40:00 -
[372] - Quote
Jack Parr wrote:I love how the csm is so quiet. I guess most of the members are truly scared to say something bad about alex. Isn't there supposed to be some transparency here? I guess the csm really is only interested in their own little worlds. If they cared about the players they would at least SAY SOMETHING. It's funny that the only csm player who stepped up and started a forum thread gets bashed by the other csm members. I guess she didn't get the memo about how nobody on the csm can say anything bad about the king of space.
The csm is worthless. Just disband because you people aren't going to support us. How much did alex bribe the other csm's to stay quiet? Issler, Hans and Darius have said something. Apparently they are not all returned home ect.. I said something similar myself a few hours ago. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1607
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:44:00 -
[373] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored *** LOL You got trolled by a serious internet spaceships brothel pimp that thinks she's relevant. Learn to internet and stop believing the first thing you read.
Well it was satire for a reason you know. Who knows WHY the goons all started trying to derail those threads. My post might have reflected reality, might not, but it did have the desired effect and managed to get things back on topic so :shrugs: did the job.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
668
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:44:00 -
[374] - Quote
Jack Parr wrote:I love how the csm is so quiet. I guess most of the members are truly scared to say something bad about alex. Isn't there supposed to be some transparency here? I guess the csm really is only interested in their own little worlds. If they cared about the players they would at least SAY SOMETHING. It's funny that the only csm player who stepped up and started a forum thread gets bashed by the other csm members. I guess she didn't get the memo about how nobody on the csm can say anything bad about the king of space.
The csm is worthless. Just disband because you people aren't going to support us. How much did alex bribe the other csm's to stay quiet?
I've seen commentary from nearly all the CSM members in some form or another. Which rock are you living under? Here's your sign... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5831
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:44:00 -
[375] - Quote
JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. People were mad at Mittens before this; they were mad at Mittens during the presentation; they were mad at Mittens while the CSM announcement was made; and they'll continue to be mad at him.
The kind of witch-hunt that has grown out of his misstep more and more has the air of people finally getting a tiny gripping point that they can try to pry on to get some kind of release for all that anger and a sliver of hope that maybe they can hurt himGǪ and that's why what they're doing is no better than what he did.
The thread in response to the actual presentation and statement, compared to the furious flood of threads that came after he had been re-elected, makes it abundantly clear that this is no longer a matter of what he said or did, and has everything to do with politics and getting revenge. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 12:59:00 -
[376] - Quote
Tippia wrote:JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. People were mad at Mittens before this; they were mad at Mittens during the presentation; they were mad at Mittens while the CSM announcement was made; and they'll continue to be mad at him. The kind of witch-hunt that has grown out of his misstep more and more has the air of people finally getting a tiny gripping point that they can try to pry on to get some kind of release for all that anger and a sliver of hope that maybe they can hurt himGǪ and that's why what they're doing is no better than what he did. The thread in response to the actual presentation and statement, compared to the furious flood of threads that came after he had been re-elected, makes it abundantly clear that this is no longer a matter of what he said or did, and has everything to do with politics and getting revenge. I honestly don't believe that, I think some of the threads are just hate for him yes, but as to the election result, it was a forgone conclusion, anyone who even spent 5 minutes reading the forums knew that.
The problem is he seems to have really hit a nerve with some people, on cyber bullying with some people wanting him arrested. That is way over the line from my perspective but the jail Mittens crew is starting to build up momentum. With so much momentum from people wanting him off the CSM (only a few want him just to loose the chairmanship), to people wanting him temp banned (quite alot) to the perma ban group(also alot) and now the arrest him people gaining momentum, the time is past where he could ever go back to the Chairman ship and not have a huge rage storm that would make this look tiny. Also it would be picked up by the media for sure that CCP is soft on cyber bullying and death threats. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
232
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:05:00 -
[377] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:The problem is he seems to have really hit a nerve with some people, on cyber bullying with some people wanting him arrested. .
The only thing that hit anyone's nerve was seeing the name "The Mittani" with more than double the amount of votes as the next highest candidate when the results were announced on Saturday. "GoonWaffe" and "Goonswarm Federation" probably didn't help either.
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
5834
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:06:00 -
[378] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Also it would be picked up by the media for sure that CCP is soft on cyber bullying and death threats. The funny/paradoxical thing about that is that, at this point, they'd probably be far better served to show their stance by banning a large swathe of the Mittens-hater crew than going after Mittens. They can't, of course, since that would blow up spectacularly and I haven't have the chance to invest in any tinfoil business yet, but stillGǪ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:18:00 -
[379] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:Frying Doom wrote:The problem is he seems to have really hit a nerve with some people, on cyber bullying with some people wanting him arrested. . The only thing that hit anyone's nerve was seeing the name "The Mittani" with more than double the amount of votes as the next highest candidate when the results were announced on Saturday. "GoonWaffe" and "Goonswarm Federation" probably didn't help either. I have heard the goons go on and on about the number of votes he got but really it is less than 3% of the games population and it doesn't really matter as he got the number 1 spot, by 1 vote or 10 million doesn't matter much. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:20:00 -
[380] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Also it would be picked up by the media for sure that CCP is soft on cyber bullying and death threats. The funny/paradoxical thing about that is that, at this point, they'd probably be far better served to show their stance by banning a large swathe of the Mittens-hater crew than going after Mittens. They can't, of course, since that would blow up spectacularly and I haven't have the chance to invest in any tinfoil business yet, but stillGǪ edit: Correction. I do have investments in the tinfoil industry. I though they were mainly into copper and iron. So go ahead! You are probably right. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
161
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:28:00 -
[381] - Quote
Issler, seeing you are becomming a target in the media aswel now, can we expect your resignation?
|
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
233
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:28:00 -
[382] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:I have heard the goons go on and on about the number of votes he got but really it is less than 3% of the games population and it doesn't really matter as he got the number 1 spot, by 1 vote or 10 million doesn't matter much.
It really does matter, though given how politically clueless you were with the whole Issler campaign thing, I'm not surprised you don't get that. ANYWAY, moving on...
The point was that the words themselves weren't the source of outrage, it was the person who said them. If it well and truly was the words, the outpouring of rage that took off on Monday would have happened within minutes of him actually saying what he did. Funny how that didn't happen, though. |
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
161
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:37:00 -
[383] - Quote
Just to be clear about my personal stance.
Regardless who. If I would have seen ANYONE with influence on a larger part of EVE say those things I would have done exactly the same.
I myself don't care who you are. I would even do the same if the player who went over the line were my brother. This isn't about liking or not liking for me. This is about right and wrong for me.
Those ingame who know me know this to be true. Those who don't know me I actually don't care what they think of my actions in this.
However I do mind the way this community is behaving towards someone who's already down. I look at Issler and Darius as opportunists who just are after their personal agenda's and lost track of the better for EVE and the community. But also as people who lost sight that behind The Mittani is a person.
They show calousness in this matter and without any remorse keep firing just to further their own goals.
Those who voted for those 2 should take a step back and rethink if these 2 are actually representing the community and the game.
|
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
74
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:47:00 -
[384] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:War Kitten wrote:Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored *** LOL You got trolled by a serious internet spaceships brothel pimp that thinks she's relevant. Learn to internet and stop believing the first thing you read. Well it was satire for a reason you know. Who knows WHY the goons all started trying to derail those threads. My post might have reflected reality, might not, but it did have the desired effect and managed to get things back on topic so :shrugs: did the job.
Jade, the Roadhouse spam came out of the MichaeltheRed's internet tough guy posts, wherein he explained to the Goonies that he would take them all on in a fist fight. And also that he is old enough to get into bars and gets into brawls.
If anything the Roadhouse spam was started by me. Because Roadhouse is just that awesome of a movie. |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
74
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:49:00 -
[385] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Just to be clear about my personal stance.
Regardless who. If I would have seen ANYONE with influence on a larger part of EVE say those things I would have done exactly the same.
I myself don't care who you are. I would even do the same if the player who went over the line were my brother. This isn't about liking or not liking for me. This is about right and wrong for me.
Those ingame who know me know this to be true. Those who don't know me I actually don't care what they think of my actions in this.
However I do mind the way this community is behaving towards someone who's already down. I look at Issler and Darius as opportunists who just are after their personal agenda's and lost track of the better for EVE and the community. But also as people who lost sight that behind The Mittani is a person.
They show calousness in this matter and without any remorse keep firing just to further their own goals.
Those who voted for those 2 should take a step back and rethink if these 2 are actually representing the community and the game.
FYI, mostall of the people who voted for Darius III were scammed into it. Much like last year. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1617
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:52:00 -
[386] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:War Kitten wrote:Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored *** LOL You got trolled by a serious internet spaceships brothel pimp that thinks she's relevant. Learn to internet and stop believing the first thing you read. Well it was satire for a reason you know. Who knows WHY the goons all started trying to derail those threads. My post might have reflected reality, might not, but it did have the desired effect and managed to get things back on topic so :shrugs: did the job. Jade, the Roadhouse spam came out of the MichaeltheRed's internet tough guy posts, wherein he explained to the Goonies that he would take them all on in a fist fight. And also that he is old enough to get into bars and gets into brawls. If anything the Roadhouse spam was started by me. Because Roadhouse is just that awesome of a movie.
lol fair enough then :)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
74
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 13:56:00 -
[387] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:War Kitten wrote:Prince Kobol wrote:Just to show that the Mittani really loves us all
92:46:27 AM) directorbot: Gentlegoons, While I have the spaceship council work on their pleas for my resignation pledge retraction I need my "lolapology thread" locked or otherwise removed from front page. Till further notice spam Roadhouse references until publord scum rage out and burn the thread.
*** This was a broadcast from the_mittani to all-all, replies are not monitored *** LOL You got trolled by a serious internet spaceships brothel pimp that thinks she's relevant. Learn to internet and stop believing the first thing you read. Well it was satire for a reason you know. Who knows WHY the goons all started trying to derail those threads. My post might have reflected reality, might not, but it did have the desired effect and managed to get things back on topic so :shrugs: did the job. Jade, the Roadhouse spam came out of the MichaeltheRed's internet tough guy posts, wherein he explained to the Goonies that he would take them all on in a fist fight. And also that he is old enough to get into bars and gets into brawls. If anything the Roadhouse spam was started by me. Because Roadhouse is just that awesome of a movie. lol fair enough then :)
The guy was being a huge redneck and giving the southern states an even worse reputation than they already have. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:02:00 -
[388] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:Frying Doom wrote:I have heard the goons go on and on about the number of votes he got but really it is less than 3% of the games population and it doesn't really matter as he got the number 1 spot, by 1 vote or 10 million doesn't matter much. It really does matter, though given how politically clueless you were with the whole Issler campaign thing, I'm not surprised you don't get that. ANYWAY, moving on... The point was that the words themselves weren't the source of outrage, it was the person who said them. If it well and truly was the words, the outpouring of rage that took off on Monday would have happened within minutes of him actually saying what he did. Funny how that didn't happen, though. The CSM election was just that an election. I deliberately went for the conspiracy nuts, homophobic's and haters of a certain WW2 german political party and then sympathy. It was spin to see how much an election could be altered by some utter crap. Given the result I would say it worked. So the election is kind of easy for a nutter to swing how much attention should really be paid to an organizations ability to get votes.
It is partly the person because some people hate him, some want to see him in jail over this. Some from hate some from hatred of cyber bullying. The majority of people are against him now because of cyber bullying and the fact it was real life in front of cameras with him telling people to get someone to kill them selves.
As for it would of happened there, that would depend on how drunk the crowd was and if anyone there was listening. It kicked off from the American TZ and it was broadcast all over the planet. Actually Im surprised a christian league of some kind hasn't weighed in yet. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Andrea Griffin
203
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:06:00 -
[389] - Quote
Issler, although I agree with you on several points, I don't agree with this thread. The CSM should discuss the matter internally and produce a combined statement about the matter. It is important that the CSM has a unified front otherwise you guys end up looking like a bunch of bickering brats.
Although I did consider voting for you this time around, this kind of unprofessional behavior ensures that will never happen in the future. CCP Sreegs is my favorite developer. |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
234
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:08:00 -
[390] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:[As for it would of happened there, that would depend on how drunk the crowd was and if anyone there was listening. It kicked off from the American TZ and it was broadcast all over the planet. Actually Im surprised a christian league of some kind hasn't weighed in yet.
We're talking a difference of DAYS, and you're talking about timezones?
Also if you're going to be surprised any time some form of non-gaming media doesn't touch this story with a ten foot clown pole, you might want to get some heart pills ready because it's going to keep happening. |
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:12:00 -
[391] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:Frying Doom wrote:[As for it would of happened there, that would depend on how drunk the crowd was and if anyone there was listening. It kicked off from the American TZ and it was broadcast all over the planet. Actually Im surprised a christian league of some kind hasn't weighed in yet. We're talking a difference of DAYS, and you're talking about timezones? Also if you're going to be surprised any time some form of non-gaming media doesn't touch this story with a ten foot clown pole, you might want to get some heart pills ready because it's going to keep happening. I wasn't talking about media I was talking about Christians with protestors, blogs. Suicide is a sin ect...
As to why it took days as I have said before buggered if I know. When I first saw it, it was a tiny story. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
My Neutral Toon
Knights Who Til Recently Said Ni
40
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:14:00 -
[392] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Totally agree. CCP should be taking him out of CSM altogether and he should be left with a feeling that he's lucky he still has his accounts.
People have been banned for less.
People have not been banned for less, as Mittens didn't break the EULA. CCP has no grounds to ban him from game. This isnt WoW
...Can't. Tell. If ...Troll? Or Serious.... |
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
161
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:16:00 -
[393] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote: As to why it took days as I have said before buggered if I know. When I first saw it, it was a tiny story.
So if the story had remained tiny you wouldn't have bothered to post an opinion. But now that it is huge you can't wait to |
Macon Chalaise
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
24
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:35:00 -
[394] - Quote
Politically (in)correct compromise:
1.) Two Step moves up to #1 and the chair. 2.) Hans moves up to #7. 3.) Mittens drops to #14. 4.) Move on. It's a game. Here's to fire. Not the fast and furious kind that burns down shacks and shanties, but the slow, seductive kind that takes down pants and panties - Irish Toast |
Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
121
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:47:00 -
[395] - Quote
So much holier than thou in this thread. Ronald Reagan: I do not like Sweden, they support communism. Minister: Sir, but Sweden are anti-communist, Sir.-á Ronald Reagan: I do not care what kind of communists they are. |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
185
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 14:54:00 -
[396] - Quote
Tippia wrote:JamesCLK wrote:You'd be seeing those threads anyway; people are going to be mad at Mittens regardless of the outcome. People need to learn to forgive and forget - and let the CSM do their job. People were mad at Mittens before this; they were mad at Mittens during the presentation; they were mad at Mittens while the CSM announcement was made; and they'll continue to be mad at him. The kind of witch-hunt that has grown out of his misstep more and more has the air of people finally getting a tiny gripping point that they can try to pry on to get some kind of release for all that anger and a sliver of hope that maybe they can hurt himGǪ and that's why what they're doing is no better than what he did. The thread in response to the actual presentation and statement, compared to the furious flood of threads that came after he had been re-elected, makes it abundantly clear that this is no longer a matter of what he said or did, and has everything to do with politics and getting revenge.
This is just about stomping on a particular type of behaviour outside of the game. It wouldn't matter who had done this.
The fact that it was Mittani speaks more to the fact that people disliked him FOR THE RIGHT REASONS.
if you wish to try and pronounce that this was a "tiny gripping point" that's fine. I can see how the tiny brains of the fellow sociopaths that follow mittani can see it that way.
If you wish to see how the world sees it, merely check out your local gaming site to read what they have to say about it - certainly they have ALL picked up on it by now. Showing that it is not some "tiny gripping point".
Grow the **** up guys.
This is my ISP - not even a gaming site I regularly visit - but my ISP's take on it: http://games.on.net/article/15232/EVE_Online_SM_Council_Chairman_to_Resign_After_Public_Mockery_of_Suicidal_Player_at_Fanfest My EVE YouTube Channel |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1619
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:06:00 -
[397] - Quote
My Neutral Toon wrote:Revolution Rising wrote:Totally agree. CCP should be taking him out of CSM altogether and he should be left with a feeling that he's lucky he still has his accounts.
People have been banned for less.
People have not been banned for less, as Mittens didn't break the EULA. CCP has no grounds to ban him from game. This isnt WoW
Many people have been banned for much less.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:07:00 -
[398] - Quote
name them |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:08:00 -
[399] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Frying Doom wrote: As to why it took days as I have said before buggered if I know. When I first saw it, it was a tiny story. So if the story had remained tiny you wouldn't have bothered to post an opinion. But now that it is huge you can't wait to Actually I did post on it. I considered the whole thing as bugger all as it was at that point before the massive thread naughts and the external media interest. I hadn't even seen the footage at that point. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:10:00 -
[400] - Quote
i will explain in such excruciating detail that even your tiny and warped mind that thought owning and operating a space brothel was a good idea will be able to understand the depths of your wrongitude |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1619
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:11:00 -
[401] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:name them
Well me for one. I was banned from posting on the Eve forums for 4 years for 10 minor infractions including such things as laughing at somebodies use of emotes, suggesting that an enemy alliance leader rode the "short bus" to battle and for telling halseth durn to "end himself".
What Alexander Gianturco did on the stage at fanfest was immeasurely worse than this stuff and hugely damaging to the reputation of eve online.
But of course if you want a more recent example the HB banning for what that person said to zinfandel by pm last year. Telling a dev to "die in a fire" gets a permaban. Calling on 10,000 goons to harrass a guy into suicide ? What does that get?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:13:00 -
[402] - Quote
being banned on the eveo forums is not being banned in game |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:14:00 -
[403] - Quote
many people have gotten eveo forum bans: only one - Captain Gordon, who went on a goatse posting spree - had their eveo forum ban translated into an in-game ban
i hope this has been edifying to your tiny brain |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:15:00 -
[404] - Quote
do you know who got banned in the last few months from the eveo forums (a temp-ban of course, much like yours)
go on, guess
i'll give you one hint: it is extremely embarrassing for your hilariously dumb argument |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:17:00 -
[405] - Quote
But Jade, CCP eventually revoked your forum ban thereby undoing all their good work and nullifying your point. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:17:00 -
[406] - Quote
some guy got banned unjustly therefore other people should too ooga booga logic logic |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
673
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:18:00 -
[407] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:name them Well me for one. I was banned from posting on the Eve forums for 4 years for 10 minor infractions including such things as laughing at somebodies use of emotes, suggesting that an enemy alliance leader rode the "short bus" to battle and for telling halseth durn to "end himself".
One =/= Many
And you're obviously a repeat offender. Shame on you.
Here's your sign... |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1620
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:21:00 -
[408] - Quote
I notice the goon posting crew have nimbly side-stepped the HB issue as always.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:25:00 -
[409] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: I notice the goon posting crew have nimbly side-stepped the HB issue as always.
let's do one matter at a time because I can crush that too
do you now agree that it was hilariously dumb to cite your eveo forum ban and that you should feel ashamed and stupid you did that |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:26:00 -
[410] - Quote
once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time |
|
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
673
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:29:00 -
[411] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: I notice the goon posting crew have nimbly side-stepped the HB issue as always.
Tellling a CCP dev to die in a fire in anger is a lesser offense than inviting people to shoot at another character and laughing at his alluding to suicide?
Here's your sign... |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
186
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:32:00 -
[412] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:i will explain in such excruciating detail that even your tiny and warped mind that thought owning and operating a space brothel was a good idea will be able to understand the depths of your wrongitude
And I thought this thread wouldn't get ANY good new game feature ideas.
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1628
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:40:00 -
[413] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Jade Constantine wrote: I notice the goon posting crew have nimbly side-stepped the HB issue as always.
Tellling a CCP dev to die in a fire in anger is a lesser offense than inviting people to shoot at another character and laughing at his alluding to suicide?
Telling a dev to die in a fire vs asking people to harrass a guy into suicide?
tricky one really.
Should one be banned and other not?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:41:00 -
[414] - Quote
panda kitten this is why you don't respond to the second one until he admits how shamefully wrong he was on the first: he will merely start avoiding the issue
jade constantine do you now recognize how shamefully dumb it was to claim your eveo forum ban was relevant or must we discuss it further |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:41:00 -
[415] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time That's part of the problem isn't it the whole HB thing.
And the fact Mittens latest out burst In real life was a lot worse. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
258
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:43:00 -
[416] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time That's part of the problem isn't it the whole HB thing. And the fact Mittens latest out burst In real life was a lot worse. i will happily address this issue once jade has recognised the depths of his shameful wrongitude regarding the relevance of his eveo forum ban |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1629
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:47:00 -
[417] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time That's part of the problem isn't it the whole HB thing. And the fact Mittens latest out burst In real life was a lot worse. i will happily address this issue once jade has recognised the depths of his shameful wrongitude regarding the relevance of his eveo forum ban
lols, it doesn't really matter if you are prepared to discuss the HB thing or not, if you stop posting there are 9999 other goons to ask the question to
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
188
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:48:00 -
[418] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time That's part of the problem isn't it the whole HB thing. And the fact Mittens latest out burst In real life was a lot worse. i will happily address this issue once jade has recognised the depths of his shameful wrongitude regarding the relevance of his eveo forum ban lols, it doesn't really matter if you are prepared to discuss the HB thing or not, if you stop posting there are 9999 other goons to ask the question to
I believe the exact number was 10058
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:48:00 -
[419] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time That's part of the problem isn't it the whole HB thing. And the fact Mittens latest out burst In real life was a lot worse. i will happily address this issue once jade has recognised the depths of his shameful wrongitude regarding the relevance of his eveo forum ban Well you can't really address it, if Mittens got something less for doing something so much worse, CCP really would get flamed in the forums and by the press as well as exposing them to the ravages of lawyers everywhere. Personally I don't think he deserves a ban but then I didn't think HB deserved one either. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
261
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:49:00 -
[420] - Quote
I am entirely prepared and will happily rend that argument to shreds as well. However, it appears you are unwilling to accept the depths of your woeful ignorance and shoddy reasoning demonstrated by your belief that somehow your eveo forum ban was the same thing as an ingame ban. Would you like to explain your reasoning about how you are not wrechedly dimwitted with arguments unworthy of attention? |
|
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
261
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 15:51:00 -
[421] - Quote
my apologies frying doom the above post is directed at our genetic-lottery-losing friend Jade, not you |
Glarealot
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
23
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:21:00 -
[422] - Quote
lol I'm confused why folks are still ragging on Mittani. He's stepping down. He's gone. Whats the point in continuing to trash him after he's already taken the initiative and removed himself from his post? |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
67
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:26:00 -
[423] - Quote
Glarealot wrote:lol I'm confused why folks are still ragging on Mittani. He's stepping down. He's gone. Whats the point in continuing to trash him after he's already taken the initiative and removed himself from his post? The problem is that he hasn't removed him self, he just said he would but hasn't yet. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:34:00 -
[424] - Quote
Glarealot wrote:lol I'm confused why folks are still ragging on Mittani. He's stepping down. He's gone. Whats the point in continuing to trash him after he's already taken the initiative and removed himself from his post?
Everybody with a titan or a grudge against GS is terrified he won't step down now, because as soon as the immediacy of the situation was over it became obvious he really doesn't need to. |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:38:00 -
[425] - Quote
Daviclond wrote:Everybody with a titan or a grudge against GS is terrified he won't step down now, because as soon as the immediacy of the situation was over it became obvious he really doesn't need to. Not empty quoting. Also, I love how the media is still saying The Wis is "suicidal" when it's pretty obvious he isn't. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
164
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:43:00 -
[426] - Quote
michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time. is it now? can goons verify this?
It's been a goon catchphrase for at least the last five years. |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
205
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:53:00 -
[427] - Quote
tbh mittenz has lost of confidence of his constituents and should step down as chairman but he should remain as a member of the CSM. I think this is a fair compromise because no one is happy with it and if no one is happy it must be the right decision. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1642
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:55:00 -
[428] - Quote
Glarealot wrote:lol I'm confused why folks are still ragging on Mittani. He's stepping down. He's gone. Whats the point in continuing to trash him after he's already taken the initiative and removed himself from his post?
I think as soon as it becomes evident that is what he's done things will begin to settle down.
The problem is at the moment the delay is giving the impression he's trying to snake out of it somehow and convince the csm to beg him to stay or some such nonsense.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
674
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 16:56:00 -
[429] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Daviclond wrote:Everybody with a titan or a grudge against GS is terrified he won't step down now, because as soon as the immediacy of the situation was over it became obvious he really doesn't need to. Not empty quoting. Also, I love how the media is still saying The Wis is "suicidal" when it's pretty obvious he isn't.
They have to believe he was genuinely suicidal. Otherwise Mittens was just making a joke at another guy's hyperbole and their foaming at the mouth is unfounded.
Here's your sign... |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
34
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:02:00 -
[430] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:They have to believe he was genuinely suicidal. Otherwise Mittens was just making a joke at another guy's hyperbole and their foaming at the mouth is unfounded. Thank you for clarifying the actual situation. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
|
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
239
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:25:00 -
[431] - Quote
just found one comment under one article:
"So people are attacking Issler Dainze for being the only one CSM that does not lick Mittanis ass."
and i see this as 100% true. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
419
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:27:00 -
[432] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:once we have done that I will explain in excruiciating detail the HB issue but i find it is best to nail one issue to the wall at a time That's part of the problem isn't it the whole HB thing. And the fact Mittens latest out burst In real life was a lot worse. i will happily address this issue once jade has recognised the depths of his shameful wrongitude regarding the relevance of his eveo forum ban Well you can't really address it, if Mittens got something less for doing something so much worse, CCP really would get flamed in the forums and by the press as well as exposing them to the ravages of lawyers everywhere. Personally I don't think he deserves a ban but then I didn't think HB deserved one either.
This a million times over. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
419
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:29:00 -
[433] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Karl Hobb wrote:Daviclond wrote:Everybody with a titan or a grudge against GS is terrified he won't step down now, because as soon as the immediacy of the situation was over it became obvious he really doesn't need to. Not empty quoting. Also, I love how the media is still saying The Wis is "suicidal" when it's pretty obvious he isn't. They have to believe he was genuinely suicidal. Otherwise Mittens was just making a joke at another guy's hyperbole and their foaming at the mouth is unfounded.
Actually weather or not the person was or was not genuinely suicidal does not enter into it at all.
All that enters into it is that someone was calling for another persons death vie suicide through harassment to push him too it.
You might as well be taking the stance that women get raped cause of the clothing they have on. Do you think that if they dress sexy that they were asking for it too? Just curious?
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
419
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:30:00 -
[434] - Quote
SmilingVagrant wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:michaelthered wrote:Steph Wing wrote:This is not a CSM issue.
Mittens was on the panel not as the chairman of the CSM, but as the leader of Goonswarm. And the leadership of Goonswarm routinely tells people to kill themselves.
Not seeing an issue. do they really "routinely" tell people to kill themselves irl? Actually, yes. Yes they do. "Kill yourself irl" is a thing you see goons, esp Mittens, say all the time. is it now? can goons verify this? It's been a goon catchphrase for at least the last five years.
They should have been reported every time that they used it.
The tag IRL brings it into objectionable territory. As you are now stepping outside the game.
|
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
419
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:31:00 -
[435] - Quote
Glarealot wrote:lol I'm confused why folks are still ragging on Mittani. He's stepping down. He's gone. Whats the point in continuing to trash him after he's already taken the initiative and removed himself from his post?
He hasnt stepped down yet and no offical word or stance from CCP on punishment. |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
194
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:45:00 -
[436] - Quote
Avila Cracko wrote:just found one comment under one article:
"So people are attacking Issler Dainze for being the only one CSM that does not lick Mittanis ass."
and i see this as 100% true.
Kinda shocked to find myself agreeing... :\
The newer CSM's I can understand them wanting to chill and find out what to do.. but...there it is. My EVE YouTube Channel |
knobber Jobbler
104
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:47:00 -
[437] - Quote
I can't believe you're all still going on about this. It's a game for adults, get over ir already. You'll end up pressuring ccp so much they'll turn it into wow in space. |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:48:00 -
[438] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Actually weather or not the person was or was not genuinely suicidal does not enter into it at all.
All that enters into it is that someone was calling for another persons death vie suicide through harassment to push him too it.
You might as well be taking the stance that women get raped cause of the clothing they have on. Do you think that if they dress sexy that they were asking for it too? Just curious? I find your alliance ticker offensive. It's an obvious attempt to disguise the word "gay", a slur against homosexual people, by using a seemingly innocuous misspelling. It's pretty obvious to me that you are all deeply homophobic and, by using such a misspelling in a public arena, are calling for others to be homophobic as well.
Now, whether or not you are all genuinely homophobic really doesn't enter into this at all, right? Your intentions are perfectly clear: to make people homophobic. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1651
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:50:00 -
[439] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:RougeOperator wrote:Actually weather or not the person was or was not genuinely suicidal does not enter into it at all.
All that enters into it is that someone was calling for another persons death vie suicide through harassment to push him too it.
You might as well be taking the stance that women get raped cause of the clothing they have on. Do you think that if they dress sexy that they were asking for it too? Just curious? I find your alliance ticker offensive. It's an obvious attempt to disguise the word "gay", a slur against homosexual people, by using a seemingly innocuous misspelling. It's pretty obvious to me that you are all deeply homophobic and, by using such a misspelling in a public arena, are calling for others to be homophobic as well. Now, whether or not you are all genuinely homophobic really doesn't enter into this at all, right? Your intentions are perfectly clear: to make people homophobic.
Lets just hope he doesn't win the CSM and get up on stage drunk at fanfest and then ask for some gay guys to get harrassed into suicide eh?"
Because then we'd have to use the same punishment the Mittani got.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Gideon Tyler
EVE University Ivy League
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:52:00 -
[440] - Quote
My read on this is simple. The Mittani Apology was merely an attempt by said person to get out from under the heat his conduct has generated and save his place on the CSM, if he can.
The thunderous silence of CCP is indicative, in my view, of an attempt to wait for uproar this event has caused to dissipate. It is my impression, that for some reason, CCP seems to actually want to keep this guy on the CSM and thus are delaying a judgement with an eye towards riding this out without removing him.
Also, with the way Devs are locking threads on this left, right and center, the intent seems more to squelch discussion of the matter by paying customers, rather than a desire on the part of CCP to actually listen to the people that financially make the continuation of EVE possible,
Simply put, the Mittani does not get it, and CCP does not seem to either. I would be very happy to be proven wrong on both these points.
|
|
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
264
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:58:00 -
[441] - Quote
Jade Constantine could you please explain why you continue to post in this thread without so much as a peep justifying your incredibly dimwitted statements that have been proven nonsense beyond any spectre of a doubt, or admitting your unjustifiable errors and retreating to your shame cave for penitence
after all, a discussion is pointless when you cannot deal in any way when one of your core arguments has been completely destroyed |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 17:58:00 -
[442] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lets just hope he doesn't win the CSM and get up on stage drunk at fanfest and then ask for some gay guys to get harrassed into suicide eh?"
Because then we'd have to use the same punishment the Mittani got. Why does the venue matter? It's still offensive and people see it every day within the game. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
264
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:00:00 -
[443] - Quote
you continue to whine "but the goons have not addressed my other point" but, of course, we are busy demonstrating that even after we have proven that 2+2 does not equal 5, you are incapable of understanding this or responding in any way but shutting down and whimpering until you've lost all memory of the incident
it makes it...unlikely...that you will be able to comprehend why your other arguments are wrong and that elaborating on why they are so wrong it hurts any person of nomal intelligence would be a waste of intellect |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1655
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:03:00 -
[444] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lets just hope he doesn't win the CSM and get up on stage drunk at fanfest and then ask for some gay guys to get harrassed into suicide eh?"
Because then we'd have to use the same punishment the Mittani got. Why does the venue matter? It's still offensive and people see it every day within the game.
Because the leader of a RL corporation staggering around drunk and falling into the dustbins has the same impact on share price and market tracking as the janitor doing it right?
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1432
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:04:00 -
[445] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Issler, seeing you are becomming a target in the media aswel now, can we expect your resignation?
I think it just reenforces to the folks that elected me that they picked the right candidate.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1433
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:06:00 -
[446] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:Frying Doom wrote:I have heard the goons go on and on about the number of votes he got but really it is less than 3% of the games population and it doesn't really matter as he got the number 1 spot, by 1 vote or 10 million doesn't matter much. It really does matter, though given how politically clueless you were with the whole Issler campaign thing, I'm not surprised you don't get that. ANYWAY, moving on... The point was that the words themselves weren't the source of outrage, it was the person who said them. If it well and truly was the words, the outpouring of rage that took off on Monday would have happened within minutes of him actually saying what he did. Funny how that didn't happen, though.
But the rage started immediately in the forums. There were calls of outrage within minutes of the panel ending.
Issler |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
428
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:06:00 -
[447] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:RougeOperator wrote:Actually weather or not the person was or was not genuinely suicidal does not enter into it at all.
All that enters into it is that someone was calling for another persons death vie suicide through harassment to push him too it.
You might as well be taking the stance that women get raped cause of the clothing they have on. Do you think that if they dress sexy that they were asking for it too? Just curious? I find your alliance ticker offensive. It's an obvious attempt to disguise the word "gay", a slur against homosexual people, by using a seemingly innocuous misspelling. It's pretty obvious to me that you are all deeply homophobic and, by using such a misspelling in a public arena, are calling for others to be homophobic as well. Now, whether or not you are all genuinely homophobic really doesn't enter into this at all, right? Your intentions are perfectly clear: to make people homophobic.
Umm gay is not a slur. Least not with anyone Im familiar with.
Also how do you know that we dont have gays in our alliance mate?
Hows all these assumptions working out for you.
With the mittani we dont have to assume, its ON TAPE. And in context. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
428
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:08:00 -
[448] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lets just hope he doesn't win the CSM and get up on stage drunk at fanfest and then ask for some gay guys to get harrassed into suicide eh?"
Because then we'd have to use the same punishment the Mittani got. Why does the venue matter? It's still offensive and people see it every day within the game.
I really need you to tell me if you know the difference between Real life and In game?
No seriously.
|
Avila Cracko
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
240
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:10:00 -
[449] - Quote
I love that guy more and more:
first: "So people are attacking Issler Dainze for being the only one CSM that does not lick Mittanis ass."
then: "Whats the purpose of CSM if everybody must bow to Chairman??? This CSM is all "lets be friends" and "what you say i will agree" and thats not democracy. If we elected someone we want their voice to be heard and not just tongue when licking Mittanis ass."
Then one guy responded: "There is no doubt, that The Mittanis has the cleanest ******* in eve. And there are many who carry the odor of **** when they open their mouths."
|
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:11:00 -
[450] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Because the leader of a RL corporation staggering around drunk and falling into the dustbins has the same impact on share price and market tracking as the janitor doing it right? So whether the janitor does it or not makes no difference because he's not a public figure tied into profit. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
|
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:13:00 -
[451] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:I really need you to tell me if you know the difference between Real life and In game? Not I, but you might need to explain that to The Wis, he seems to have mixed up RL and IG. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
428
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:16:00 -
[452] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:RougeOperator wrote:I really need you to tell me if you know the difference between Real life and In game? Not I, but you might need to explain that to The Wis, he seems to have mixed up RL and IG.
Wis didnt try to get someone killed on a live stream outside of game.
Keep trying to spin this, its not working. More like a car spinning its wheels in the mud. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1661
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:17:00 -
[453] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Because the leader of a RL corporation staggering around drunk and falling into the dustbins has the same impact on share price and market tracking as the janitor doing it right? So whether the janitor does it or not makes no difference because he's not a public figure tied into profit.
You seem to have lost the plot. maybe you need to unplug your keyboard.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:32:00 -
[454] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Wis didnt try to get someone killed on a live stream outside of game.
Keep trying to spin this, its not working. More like a car spinning its wheels in the mud. I see no difference between what The Mittani did and what happens in C&P on any given day in order to humiliate victims who try to bargain sympathy. In the end, it's all in the public record on the internet; medium makes no difference. The only reason this is such a huge issue is because it's The Mittani. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
264
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:34:00 -
[455] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: You seem to have lost the plot. maybe you need to unplug your keyboard.
excuse me jade "i am unable to distinguish between the eveo forums and the eve online game" constantine why do you feel your opinion has any validity when you have been so completely crushed that you are unable to even discuss the claim you once made |
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
185
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:44:00 -
[456] - Quote
I'm just going to leave this here for all to see: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1008590#post1008590
Interesting. Sa souvraya niende misain ye. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1663
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:47:00 -
[457] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:RougeOperator wrote:Wis didnt try to get someone killed on a live stream outside of game.
Keep trying to spin this, its not working. More like a car spinning its wheels in the mud. I see no difference between what The Mittani did and what happens in C&P on any given day in order to humiliate victims who try to bargain sympathy. In the end, it's all in the public record on the internet; medium makes no difference. The only reason this is such a huge issue is because it's The Mittani.
It doesn't matter who the heck the guy is - its the CSM CHAIR using his position as a bully-pulpit to channel harrassment through CCP's telecoms support direct through the INTERNET.
try and keep up.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
37
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:47:00 -
[458] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:You seem to have lost the plot. maybe you need to unplug your keyboard. What you're really trying to say is that little incidences really don't matter, only the big ones. So while we allow "tear collecting" to go on behind our backs, humiliating victims right and left, once someone in a sufficiently high enough place of power does it, it actually becomes a problem. The Mittani's only real problem is that he picked on someone who used suicide to bargain sympathy and he's a famous person in an alliance that is, according to its detractors, trying to ruin the game. I'm ******* terrible at EVE.
"Fun fact: carebears are not necessary for the game to function." --áTippia |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
264
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 18:55:00 -
[459] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote: It doesn't matter who the heck the guy is - its the CSM CHAIR using his position as a bully-pulpit to channel harrassment through CCP's telecoms support direct through the INTERNET.
try and keep up.
dear jade "not the brightest bulb in the box" could you elaborate on what grounds you feel able to talk down to...well, anyone, after getting so completely owned regarding the difference between an eveo forums account and an eve account |
Allataria
Martyr's Vengence Test Alliance Please Ignore
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:04:00 -
[460] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Snow Axe wrote:Frying Doom wrote:I have heard the goons go on and on about the number of votes he got but really it is less than 3% of the games population and it doesn't really matter as he got the number 1 spot, by 1 vote or 10 million doesn't matter much. It really does matter, though given how politically clueless you were with the whole Issler campaign thing, I'm not surprised you don't get that. ANYWAY, moving on... The point was that the words themselves weren't the source of outrage, it was the person who said them. If it well and truly was the words, the outpouring of rage that took off on Monday would have happened within minutes of him actually saying what he did. Funny how that didn't happen, though. But the rage started immediately in the forums. There were calls of outrage within minutes of the panel ending. Issler
Step down Issler. The fact you are trying to spin this story to further you own personal gain and political position makes you a hypocrite. If you really had the players hearts and minds in consideration and you really knew anything about how pvp and EVE works you would know this happens all the time and this was quite tame to some of the stuff that goes on. You are completely oblivious to the facts that what Mittani said was in fact very very tame.
Griefing other players for being terrible in game or for shedding tears over their losses is every pvp players right. Its what keeps us coming back for more and more kills. Its what makes this game great and it doesnt just happen here. It happens in every single MMO FPS RTS multiplayer game out there. What about all the little 12 year old kids screaming obscenities while playing MW3 on XBOX360? Giving people grief is what makes pvp fun and enjoyable and its our right to do so. Anyone who doubts otherwise is a hypocrite or has never pvped before in their life. Everyone who pvp's in game is guilty of it sometime or another. All the alliances corporations regardless of who they are have done this and far worse than this in the past.
So get off your high throne of moral judgement because obviously you dont know what happens at all in this game or others or even in pvp for that matter.
You are either a high sec carebear who has never done pvp in their life or you are a hypocrite because everyone who has pvped in EVE has done this. Go take a look on kugu or evenews24 or any 3rd party site or hell even in CAOD on the forums. This was quite tame. The only ones who through an outrage were the prudes who are oblivious to this happening in games or people who just want to see Mittani go down in a fire and are using this to throw fuel on the fire for their own personal gain.
If anyone needs to step down for corrupting what the CSM stands for and for not representing the community and how it works it should be you Issler.
All these threads are disgusting. Mittani has done nothing different than what any other pvp playing person would have done in the same situation. EVE needs Mittani as the CSM head. It was Mittani that helped get the players thoughts about Incarna to CCP and helped turned it around. He has brought more pressing issues to the front table than any other CSM chairman yet. Its an insult to the playerbase to see you using this to further yourself when everyone who pvps knows they would have done the same thing in the same situation. It was funny even the victim the Wis knows it was and laughs about it now and doesnt care anymore. So drop the discussion already he apologized although he really shouldn't have in my opinion but whatever. |
|
Prince Kobol
425
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:07:00 -
[461] - Quote
From the My Apology Thread on GD
The Wis wrote:OK.. I really do not know what to say. I am at a loss for words with all that is going on.
I guess I should say that this is not about someone alt in eve. This is not about someone losing isks they worked for. This is not about someone losing a machanaw in the game. This is not something I started. I was really shocked to see the video monday night when I finaly had time.
This is all really about a person that is over joyed in making some one hurt as much as they can in real life not in game. Going by his power point I have to say he thought about it long before getting drunk. If thowing my name out there was something he planed to do or not that I can not say, and we will never know for sure. But when reflect the way he talked about my mail. I am sure that was an option he was holding on to and tossing up becouse he was really enjoying tomenting someone.
I am sorry this is not the alt in the game that is talk but the person playing the alt.
There are allot of people out there that have real life problems, but they are warned when they join Eve. Whats said and done in the game doesn't bother me, its all part of Eve.
To me this **** got real and hurt full when I watched a video where a complete stranger urged other complete strangers to try make me kill myself.
The Wis |
Mechael
Team Pizza Viro Mors Non Est
68
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:10:00 -
[462] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:dear jade "not the brightest bulb in the box" constantine could you elaborate on what grounds you feel able to talk down to...well, anyone, after getting so completely owned regarding the difference between an eveo forums account and an eve account
Personal attacks? Really? 6 years ago I believed that the goons in general would have grown up by now. The culture has proven far too insular for that.
Back to the subject, please. Issler, mad props for actually taking a stand. The rest of the CSM really ought to have that same quality. It's a damn shame that they don't. Get out from behind the curtain, CSM.
As to the state of things, it's pretty simple. The moment the media picked up on what Alex said, CCP contacted him and said something along the likes of, "Dude, we could be in really hot water if a lawsuit comes our way now, especially if people actually do what you suggested, and even more especially if the guy actually hurts himself. We need you to apologize and make nice or else we'll have to ask you to step down. If the waters calm down after that, we might not have to remove you from the CSM." So, Alex promptly apologizes, bribes the guy with 10bil ISK (surprised at how public the bribe was!), and now everyone over at CCP and in the CSM is just waiting for everyone to forget about it. We won't.
Issler, don't back down. Not on this specific issue, anyway. I'd rather die in battle against a man who will lie to me, than for a man who will lie to me. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
264
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:13:00 -
[463] - Quote
Mechael wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:dear jade "not the brightest bulb in the box" constantine could you elaborate on what grounds you feel able to talk down to...well, anyone, after getting so completely owned regarding the difference between an eveo forums account and an eve account Personal attacks? Really? 6 years ago I believed that the goons in general would have grown up by now. The culture has proven far too insular for that.
informing those with wrechedly bad ideas they ought not post is our chosen service to the greater eve community
it is with the greatest pride i carry on this legacy |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
264
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:14:00 -
[464] - Quote
while we're on the subject you are a pretty wrechedly bad poster and ought not post |
XavierVE
Concordiat Spaceship Samurai
102
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:33:00 -
[465] - Quote
Grats, you just picked up a bunch of votes for CSM 8 that you wouldn't have otherwise.
Nice to see a CSM member be forthright, honest and act with integrity. Lord knows the rest of that rabble are sitting around keeping silent because they are not leaders, but followers. |
Xien Anh
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:37:00 -
[466] - Quote
I'm lost. Isn't this that outerspace game with people in bubbles and shooty guns?
Only a ginger can call a ginger a ginger! |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
448
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:48:00 -
[467] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:From the My Apology Thread on GD The Wis wrote:OK.. I really do not know what to say. I am at a loss for words with all that is going on.
I guess I should say that this is not about someone alt in eve. This is not about someone losing isks they worked for. This is not about someone losing a machanaw in the game. This is not something I started. I was really shocked to see the video monday night when I finaly had time.
This is all really about a person that is over joyed in making some one hurt as much as they can in real life not in game. Going by his power point I have to say he thought about it long before getting drunk. If thowing my name out there was something he planed to do or not that I can not say, and we will never know for sure. But when reflect the way he talked about my mail. I am sure that was an option he was holding on to and tossing up becouse he was really enjoying tomenting someone.
I am sorry this is not the alt in the game that is talk but the person playing the alt.
There are allot of people out there that have real life problems, but they are warned when they join Eve. Whats said and done in the game doesn't bother me, its all part of Eve.
To me this **** got real and hurt full when I watched a video where a complete stranger urged other complete strangers to try make me kill myself.
The Wis
After the rash of horrible comments the goons made when he posted this in the other thread Im not longer looking for Alex to just step down from the CSM.
He needs to be banned. |
Mechael
Team Pizza Viro Mors Non Est
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:52:00 -
[468] - Quote
I do have a question for you, Issler, that is related. Could you clarify this please? Where exactly do you stand? (It's okay to not know exactly, so long as you're honest!)
And I should also note that I don't want to derail the thread completely with this, it just seems related due to the seeming incongruity. I'd rather die in battle against a man who will lie to me, than for a man who will lie to me. |
Aryndel Samson
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
22
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:54:00 -
[469] - Quote
RougeOperator wrote:Prince Kobol wrote:From the My Apology Thread on GD The Wis wrote:OK.. I really do not know what to say. I am at a loss for words with all that is going on.
I guess I should say that this is not about someone alt in eve. This is not about someone losing isks they worked for. This is not about someone losing a machanaw in the game. This is not something I started. I was really shocked to see the video monday night when I finaly had time.
This is all really about a person that is over joyed in making some one hurt as much as they can in real life not in game. Going by his power point I have to say he thought about it long before getting drunk. If thowing my name out there was something he planed to do or not that I can not say, and we will never know for sure. But when reflect the way he talked about my mail. I am sure that was an option he was holding on to and tossing up becouse he was really enjoying tomenting someone.
I am sorry this is not the alt in the game that is talk but the person playing the alt.
There are allot of people out there that have real life problems, but they are warned when they join Eve. Whats said and done in the game doesn't bother me, its all part of Eve.
To me this **** got real and hurt full when I watched a video where a complete stranger urged other complete strangers to try make me kill myself.
The Wis After the rash of horrible comments the goons made when he posted this in the other thread Im not longer looking for Alex to just step down from the CSM. He needs to be banned.
Nobody really cares what you're looking for.
|
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 19:55:00 -
[470] - Quote
Retar Aveymone has asked me to convey "ahahahaha jade was so furious at being proven wrong he mashed the report button on every post until he got me temp-banned" |
|
Mechael
Team Pizza Viro Mors Non Est
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:03:00 -
[471] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:Retar Aveymone has asked me to convey "ahahahaha jade was so furious at being proven wrong he mashed the report button on every post until he got me temp-banned"
While this does clearly indicate who was proven wrong, I do not think your logic is sound. Or his logic, rather, since you're just the messenger. I'd rather die in battle against a man who will lie to me, than for a man who will lie to me. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1673
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:04:00 -
[472] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote:Retar Aveymone has asked me to convey "ahahahaha jade was so furious at being proven wrong he mashed the report button on every post until he got me temp-banned"
dear oh dear what a terrible tragedy.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
206
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:04:00 -
[473] - Quote
The Wis wrote:OK.. I really do not know what to say. I am at a loss for words with all that is going on.
I guess I should say that this is not about someone alt in eve. This is not about someone losing isks they worked for. This is not about someone losing a machanaw in the game. This is not something I started. I was really shocked to see the video monday night when I finaly had time.
This is all really about a person that is over joyed in making some one hurt as much as they can in real life not in game. Going by his power point I have to say he thought about it long before getting drunk. If thowing my name out there was something he planed to do or not that I can not say, and we will never know for sure. But when reflect the way he talked about my mail. I am sure that was an option he was holding on to and tossing up becouse he was really enjoying tomenting someone.
I am sorry this is not the alt in the game that is talk but the person playing the alt.
There are allot of people out there that have real life problems, but they are warned when they join Eve. Whats said and done in the game doesn't bother me, its all part of Eve.
To me this **** got real and hurt full when I watched a video where a complete stranger urged other complete strangers to try make me kill myself.
The Wis
|
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:09:00 -
[474] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:EvilweaselSA wrote:Retar Aveymone has asked me to convey "ahahahaha jade was so furious at being proven wrong he mashed the report button on every post until he got me temp-banned" dear oh dear what a terrible tragedy. Jade, perhaps you could explain to me how, using Retar Aveymone as an example, a eve-o ban is the same thing as a real ban. I'm sure you have a perfectly reasonable explanation that you have somehow been unable to type until now. |
EvilweaselSA
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:10:00 -
[475] - Quote
I would hate to think you were a coward hiding from defending arguments you put forward that were later demolished, I have the greatest of respect for you and would hate to be wrong on that count. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1446
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:11:00 -
[476] - Quote
Mechael wrote:I do have a question for you, Issler, that is related. Could you clarify this please? Where exactly do you stand? (It's okay to not know exactly, so long as you're honest!) And I should also note that I don't want to derail the thread completely with this, it just seems related due to the seeming incongruity.
I'm trying not to post anymore in this thread because I think I've been pretty clear in where I stand.
But fair question, how did I come to where I am now?
" A lot of folks may not find just the apology enough. Either way, you took the right first step." from my post you reference.
At first I thought an apology, that should be enough. As I began to think about where that leaves us and I finally found the panel video my position evolved based on the following:
- Several mittens comments and tweets made me doubt the sincerity of the apology, particularly the "I didn't remember I did it because I was blacked out drunk". Even when you are drunk and stupid you need to "own" what you did.
- I realized this was pre-planned act staged in a sober state. He had to know what he was doing when he made the slides.
- I realized that if Mittens isn't punished beyond some public apology the player confidence in the CSM would plummet and all the gains made recently would evaporate.
- I realized the if CCP didn't take action the reputation of Eve outside the game would also be diminished (or even reinforced as game for sociopaths). Players would also wonder how CCP is so irregular in the actions sanctioning player misdeeds. A fair claim of favoritism will be made.
- At a minimum I felt every member of the CSM should go on the record as individuals to the players decrying this unacceptable behavior.
I have evolved my position to say it is up to each CSM member to decide if they need to take a stand or not. I felt I needed to so here we are. I still think the apology was the right first step but I no longer think that is all that is required.
I hope that clears it up.
Issler
|
Mechael
Ouroboros Executor Collective
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 20:15:00 -
[477] - Quote
Thanks, Issler. That clears it up quite a bit. Good on you. I'd rather die in battle against a man who will lie to me, than for a man who will lie to me. |
Blatant Forum Alt
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
138
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 21:38:00 -
[478] - Quote
Out of interest, are you content with what has happened (his declination of chair), and are you prepared to move forward with the CSM and work for the benefit of the game? Or are you going to sit in the corner with Darius crying about not getting chair, demanding Mittens removal from the CSM altogether and thus opening yourself up to relentless trolling? |
doombreed52
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
35
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 21:39:00 -
[479] - Quote
WE ARE RETURNED!!! BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD !!!!
jita will burn and so shall your alliance and your precious 40b missioning ships
muhahahahaha
SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE!!! |
Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
188
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 21:49:00 -
[480] - Quote
I see the 12 relevant members of CSM7 doing a fine job this year in guiding CCP's development of the game we all love. Sa souvraya niende misain ye. |
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1449
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:14:00 -
[481] - Quote
Blatant Forum Alt wrote:Out of interest, are you content with what has happened (his declination of chair), and are you prepared to move forward with the CSM and work for the benefit of the game? Or are you going to sit in the corner with Darius crying about not getting chair, demanding Mittens removal from the CSM altogether and thus opening yourself up to relentless trolling?
Since the chair is ceremonial his stepping down has not meaning. He needs to resign from the CSM. Since we have no official response from CCP what he has said so far has no meaning. This absolutely meaningless jester shows he really doesn't intended to "own" what he did.
So I'll continue to work with the CSM and CCP to see that a proper conclusion is reached in this sad incident. His remaining will only undermine the support of the CSM by the majority of the players and shows that world that in Eve no amount of bad behavior has consequence is you are one of the cool kids.
Waiting to hear from CCP.
Issler |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
115
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:14:00 -
[482] - Quote
IK ban op, gas thred. |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
74
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:21:00 -
[483] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Blatant Forum Alt wrote:Out of interest, are you content with what has happened (his declination of chair), and are you prepared to move forward with the CSM and work for the benefit of the game? Or are you going to sit in the corner with Darius crying about not getting chair, demanding Mittens removal from the CSM altogether and thus opening yourself up to relentless trolling? Since the chair is ceremonial his stepping down has not meaning. He needs to resign from the CSM. Since we have no official response from CCP what he has said so far has no meaning. This absolutely meaningless jester shows he really doesn't intended to "own" what he did. So I'll continue to work with the CSM and CCP to see that a proper conclusion is reached in this sad incident. His remaining will only undermine the support of the CSM by the majority of the players and shows that world that in Eve no amount of bad behavior has consequence is you are one of the cool kids. Waiting to hear from CCP. Issler
hahahaha, he has so much political capital that you're going to be marginalised from the CSM just by taking this position. Say hi to Darius for us, and try not to leak anything to EN24. |
Kai Tel
State War Academy Caldari State
66
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:28:00 -
[484] - Quote
I could actually write a rather compelling article regarding how fans at festivals all over the world for games like World of Warcraft mange to represent themselves as more intelligent and productive members of society both on stage on off than Goon Swarm manages to represent EVE Online to the world from one yearly gathering. Even Francis, all six hundred pounds of him, does a better job of coming across as an actual human being with a future job on you tube. I guess itGÇÖs trueGǪ Delve really has collected itself into a kind of global cesspool for online gaming that not even Booty Bay or Goldshire can compete with. IGÇÖd almost call it tragic but in truth itGÇÖs just typical. |
Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
215
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:28:00 -
[485] - Quote
Now that The Mittani has stepped down from his position will you follow in his footsteps. Will you publicly apologize for using the illness of a real life person to further your video game political goals? Will you give him all your money and resign from the CSM?
Are you willing to put aside all your hypocrisy and admit that you used a person's sickness to peruse a personal vendetta against someone? |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
79
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:46:00 -
[486] - Quote
Kai Tel wrote:Delve really has collected itself into a kind of global cesspool
I think your ex-IT main is showing a bit there.
|
Notorious BIG
Spiritus Draconis
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:47:00 -
[487] - Quote
The Current CSM and CCP need to make a statement ASAP. sitting and waiting around to get this cooled down and blown over, the **** storm won't stop.
Also the Chair is like many and also Mittens said just a position, but has no more right then any other member in the CSM, so him stepping down from that but still remaining in the CSM isn't imo a consequence.
@TheMittani Just landed. Step one, apologize profusely. Step two, resign. Step three, send all my isk to the victim. Entirely my fault and unacceptable.
^this he has to follow
the third step however is just something to ease his mind.
also I hope the nxt CSM starts with a fresh start, doing the awesome job they did in CSM 6 but with more transparency towards their Voters, as the first few CSM's had great minutes CSM 6 didn't have. And that would be a nxt step forward, get CCP and eve online back in the fixing up and new stuff and report back to the members in the meaning of minutes from the CSM meetings, I know that there is alot of dealings with the skype channel but that's just how it goes but the official meeting at Iceland should be recorded and put down in minutes to be viewed by the eve community.
[edit] just saw the tweet about the banhammer being dropped and the removal of mittens from CSM7 |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1452
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 22:58:00 -
[488] - Quote
I just read the dev blog and in all the celebrating the bees seemed to have missed this......
"He has also resigned from his position as Chairman of CSM 6 and has forfeited his right to serve on CSM 7. As per our policies, this candidate may be eligible to run at a later date subject to candidacy review."
I am now satisfied the correct steps were taken. Can't wait to get to work as part of CSM 7.
Thanks to everyone that supported me in this.
Issler |
Tergerom Loregeron
Eighty Joule Brewery Goonswarm Federation
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.28 23:13:00 -
[489] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I just read the dev blog and in all the celebrating the bees seemed to have missed this......"He has also resigned from his position as Chairman of CSM 6 and has forfeited his right to serve on CSM 7. As per our policies, this candidate may be eligible to run at a later date subject to candidacy review." I am now satisfied the correct steps were taken. Can't wait to get to work as part of CSM 7. Thanks to everyone that supported me in this. Issler
Good job using a sick person to your own advantage. You're just as bad, if not worse then Goonswarm now, congratulations. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:17:00 -
[490] - Quote
Yay for political sabotage.
I say we re-run the whole CSM election and see what happens. |
|
Mechael
Ouroboros Executor Collective
71
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:34:00 -
[491] - Quote
Whatever anyone else is saying, I just wanted to say thanks for being up front about everything, Is.
It's a shame that Alex is off the CSM for a few reasons, he brought a lot of much needed and good changes to the table, and managed to push a lot of them through. I can't say I'm sad to see him go, though. I can only hope that having two PL people going to Iceland with the mentality that supercaps and the economy don't need a solid restructuring doesn't kill a lot of the good things that the CSM has been pushing so far. Without anyone to counterbalance them, it very well could have some bad results.
Hopefully people like Alex and yourself can be a voice of reason, even if you're not going to Iceland for a face-to-face with the devs. I'd rather die in battle against a man who will lie to me, than for a man who will lie to me. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1456
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:38:00 -
[492] - Quote
Mechael wrote:Whatever anyone else is saying, I just wanted to say thanks for being up front about everything, Is.
It's a shame that Alex is off the CSM for a few reasons, he brought a lot of much needed and good changes to the table, and managed to push a lot of them through. I can't say I'm sad to see him go, though. I can only hope that having two PL people going to Iceland with the mentality that supercaps and the economy don't need a solid restructuring doesn't kill a lot of the good things that the CSM has been pushing so far. Without anyone to counterbalance them, it very well could have some bad results.
Hopefully people like Alex and yourself can be a voice of reason, even if you're not going to Iceland for a face-to-face with the devs.
Thanks,
I wish I could go back in time catch him before the panel and kept the whole thing from happening. No one is better off for this this display of poor judgement.
But lets face it he will still have huge influence in Eve and likely will get elected with 20K+ votes in CSM 8.
Now hopefully the real work of the CSM 7 can begin.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1456
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:39:00 -
[493] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Yay for political sabotage.
I say we re-run the whole CSM election and see what happens.
Since he'd still be ineligible for CSM 7 I expect some other goon candidate would get around the same number of votes.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1456
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:52:00 -
[494] - Quote
One final thing. I've been accused of taking this stand for some political agenda. That's nonsense. This was about someone representing Eve and the CSM doing something absolutely unacceptable, damaging the CSM 7 and Eve in general.
I believe the goons have a place in Eve as part of the sandbox. I respected mittens and looked forward to working with him. I certainly didn't make him act the way he did, but he did and he needed to "own it".
I knew taking a stand would put my alliance at risk and already there is talk of my alliance being war-dec-ed permanently by the goons. This really will show that mittens has no remorse for his acts if he does go through with it. That he didn't see what he did as wrong and the apology was just one more act of clever manipulation to skirt the consequences of acing out.
There is no upside in this for me but I got elected to do a job and I did it. Good news is it looks like I will have a lof of feedback on the new wardec mechanisms in the next expansion!
So to the folks that said I did this for my own agenda, could you please explain that to me, because its hard to see how that could possibly be the case.
Issler |
Clyde ElectraGlide
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
89
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 00:58:00 -
[495] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:Yay for political sabotage.
I say we re-run the whole CSM election and see what happens. Since he'd still be ineligible for CSM 7 I expect some other goon candidate would get around the same number of votes. Issler
What other goon candidate? Lyris was the only other one and he dropped out halfway into the election. If we let a re-election happen, everyone that voted for someone other than Mittens can just do so again. This gives people who had their votes completely invalidated the chance to vote for someone else, so it's a win-win. Who knows? Even you might get some more votes. Allow for a CSM revote - Don't Throw 10k+ Votes Under the Bus |
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
39
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:08:00 -
[496] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I knew taking a stand would put my alliance at risk and already there is talk of my alliance being war-dec-ed permanently by the goons. This really will show that mittens has no remorse for his acts if he does go through with it
I'd pay the dec fee's myself sweetie. Not like isk is a problem anymore (THANKS ARYTH + WEASELIOR) |
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
39
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:09:00 -
[497] - Quote
Clyde ElectraGlide wrote:What other goon candidate? Lyris was the only other one and he dropped out halfway into the election. If we let a re-election happen, everyone that voted for someone other than Mittens can just do so again. This gives people who had their votes completely invalidated the chance to vote for someone else, so it's a win-win. Who knows? Even you might get some more votes.
I was looking forward to voting for xenuria :(
|
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:47:00 -
[498] - Quote
Yeah, I did not mention him running again in the re-election. If he got booted(he did), then the whole thing should be re-done anyway.
Way to play the "meta-game" guys.
I think some of the complainers should seriously "Win at EvE". |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1456
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:51:00 -
[499] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Yeah, I did not mention him running again in the re-election. If he got booted(he did), then the whole thing should be re-done anyway.
Way to play the "meta-game" guys.
I think some of the complainers should seriously "Win at EvE".
So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler |
Sidus Sarmiang
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
163
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 01:58:00 -
[500] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote: I knew taking a stand would put my alliance at risk and already there is talk of my alliance being war-dec-ed permanently by the goons. This really will show that mittens has no remorse for his acts if he does go through with it. That he didn't see what he did as wrong and the apology was just one more act of clever manipulation to skirt the consequences of acing out.
You decided to be a political opportunist in a matter that did not involve you. Now I and other goons will be pushing for a wardec so we can burn your alliance to the ground.
I think an appropriate fate for you would be for us to ruin the gameplay of everyone in your alliance while we make it absolutely clear that we're doing this because of your inability to control yourself. I don't know if this will happen, but there's absolutely nothing you can do about it at this point. |
|
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2196
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:02:00 -
[501] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote: So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Once again, you could start by talking with the rest of the CSM first before publicly posting on critical situations. You would probably have a better idea of how it might work. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
111
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:04:00 -
[502] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:
So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Your tone has changed considerably? WTF happened? Reading back a bit...
Hope you didn't attract TEST's attention. TEST is like a drunk, fat, greasy date with Herpes who sorta just shows up and leaves shortly after the rest of your alliance mates leave. |
Sidus Sarmiang
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
163
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:04:00 -
[503] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:
So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Your tone has changed considerably? WTF happened? Reading back a bit... Hope you didn't attract TEST's attention. TEST is like a drunk, fat, greasy date with Herpes who sorta just shows up and leaves shortly after the rest of your alliance mates leave.
She's attracted a whole lot of attention I'd say, which was probably her original attention. Unfortunately for her, her alliance has too. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:07:00 -
[504] - Quote
Sidus Sarmiang wrote:Issler Dainze wrote: I knew taking a stand would put my alliance at risk and already there is talk of my alliance being war-dec-ed permanently by the goons. This really will show that mittens has no remorse for his acts if he does go through with it. That he didn't see what he did as wrong and the apology was just one more act of clever manipulation to skirt the consequences of acing out.
You decided to be a political opportunist in a matter that did not involve you. Now I and other goons will be pushing for a wardec so we can burn your alliance to the ground. I think an appropriate fate for you would be for us to ruin the gameplay of everyone in your alliance while we make it absolutely clear that we're doing this because of your inability to control yourself. I don't know if this will happen, but there's absolutely nothing you can do about it at this point.
So much this.
This was a CCP PR issue, NOT a CSM issue. CSM should have HTFU until CCP made a decision, they are NOT supposed to have any directional input on the matter.
The Mittani was not affecting gameplay, ship balance, or the direction of development with his statement. He was just being a drunken douche. CCP gets to decide his fate due to it being in a public venue, the CSM itself has no say and should not try to abuse its power in such a situation.
My hat goes off to the CSM members who let CCP deal with the issue themselves without trying to start a public uproar. Trying to threaten a whole BUSINESS for your politics is childish and selfish. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:09:00 -
[505] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Issler Dainze wrote: So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Once again, you could start by talking with the rest of the CSM first before publicly posting on critical situations. You would probably have a better idea of how it might work.
Wow Hans, I was on the Skype chat for about 6 hours total yesterday and no one brought anything related to this up. You were there all the time. Great chats about guns, food and stuff.
But, sure,
Issler |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
111
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:13:00 -
[506] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:
Wow Hans, I was on the Skype chat for about 6 hours total yesterday and no one brought anything related to this up. You were there all the time. Great chats about guns, food and stuff.
But, sure,
Issler
Public flippancy. Wonderful. I encourage you to continue this sort of behavior. You are doing fine. |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2196
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:14:00 -
[507] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:This was a CCP PR issue, NOT a CSM issue. CSM should have HTFU until CCP made a decision, they are NOT supposed to have any directional input on the matter.
The Mittani was not affecting gameplay, ship balance, or the direction of development with his statement. He was just being a drunken douche. CCP gets to decide his fate due to it being in a public venue, the CSM itself has no say and should not try to abuse its power in such a situation.
My hat goes off to the CSM members who let CCP deal with the issue themselves without trying to start a public uproar. Trying to threaten a whole BUSINESS for your politics is childish and selfish.
This guy gets it. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:18:00 -
[508] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Sidus Sarmiang wrote:Issler Dainze wrote: I knew taking a stand would put my alliance at risk and already there is talk of my alliance being war-dec-ed permanently by the goons. This really will show that mittens has no remorse for his acts if he does go through with it. That he didn't see what he did as wrong and the apology was just one more act of clever manipulation to skirt the consequences of acing out.
You decided to be a political opportunist in a matter that did not involve you. Now I and other goons will be pushing for a wardec so we can burn your alliance to the ground. I think an appropriate fate for you would be for us to ruin the gameplay of everyone in your alliance while we make it absolutely clear that we're doing this because of your inability to control yourself. I don't know if this will happen, but there's absolutely nothing you can do about it at this point. So much this. This was a CCP PR issue, NOT a CSM issue. CSM should have HTFU until CCP made a decision, they are NOT supposed to have any directional input on the matter. The Mittani was not affecting gameplay, ship balance, or the direction of development with his statement. He was just being a drunken douche. CCP gets to decide his fate due to it being in a public venue, the CSM itself has no say and should not try to abuse its power in such a situation. My hats go off to the CSM members who let CCP deal with the issue themselves without trying to start a public uproar. Trying to threaten a whole BUSINESS for your politics is childish and selfish.
I threatened a whole business??? Wow, now that is the furthest stretch to date. You need to take a step back and remember who did the thing what caused this whole ruckus.
How can this not be a CSM issue? It goes to the very issue of CSM member accountability and credibility with the player base. Players were calling on the CSM to share their opinions on the matter. Some did. Some choose not to. I did exactly what I promised if elected, I was honest and transparent.
I did what I was elected to do. More people get than than not.
Issler
|
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
112
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:19:00 -
[509] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Great chats about guns, food and stuff.
Guns! I love guns. Please tell me more! |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
72
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:20:00 -
[510] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:This was a CCP PR issue, NOT a CSM issue. CSM should have HTFU until CCP made a decision, they are NOT supposed to have any directional input on the matter.
The Mittani was not affecting gameplay, ship balance, or the direction of development with his statement. He was just being a drunken douche. CCP gets to decide his fate due to it being in a public venue, the CSM itself has no say and should not try to abuse its power in such a situation.
My hat goes off to the CSM members who let CCP deal with the issue themselves without trying to start a public uproar. Trying to threaten a whole BUSINESS for your politics is childish and selfish. This guy gets it. But another member of the CSM posted in the general discussions that they would issue a statement about this. And it wasn't Hans or Issler or darius. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:20:00 -
[511] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:
So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Your tone has changed considerably? WTF happened? Reading back a bit... Hope you didn't attract TEST's attention. TEST is like a drunk, fat, greasy date with Herpes who sorta just shows up and leaves shortly after the rest of your alliance mates leave.
My position on mittens and what CCP did hasn't. I do realize a large group of players now feel unrepresented and I think that is the sad reality of the result of someone's very poor judgement.
Issler |
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2197
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:21:00 -
[512] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote: Wow Hans, I was on the Skype chat for about 6 hours total yesterday and no one brought anything related to this up. You were there all the time. Great chats about guns, food and stuff.
Well, stuff happens fast. The stuff everyone is talking about now, like the dev blog and what that means for CSM7, happened after the fun chats. That's why I'm recommending checking in with the CSM before making casual public comments. It's totally fine if you can't be on Skype all day, just please try to wait till you get home and get up speed, than comment away. Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
112
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:22:00 -
[513] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:
I threatened a whole business??? Wow, now that is the furthest stretch to date. You need to take a step back and remember who did the thing what caused this whole ruckus.
How can this not be a CSM issue? It goes to the very issue of CSM member accountability and credibility with the player base. Players were calling on the CSM to share their opinions on the matter. Some did. Some choose not to. I did exactly what I promised if elected, I was honest and transparent.
I did what I was elected to do. More people get than than not.
Issler
Yeah I have to admit I am with Issler on this. You are not going to get Issler to budge using silly tricks or threats, advice or different opinions.
Take a stand and let NOBODY tell you what to do. Go get 'em tiger! |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:23:00 -
[514] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Great chats about guns, food and stuff. Guns! I love guns. Please tell me more!
At one point I used to help a casual friend that owned a large collection of machine guns put on "club" shooting weekends with a lot of automatic weapons out in the deserts of AZ. I mentioned one of these days I will get around to owning a BAR.
I'm not sure why I'd ever need one, but if I did find I needed one I can't think of an easy substitue!
Issler |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:25:00 -
[515] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:] But another member of the CSM posted in the general discussions that they would issue a statement about this. And it wasn't Hans or Issler or darius.
And when was this post made? Did they post anything before the banhammer?
Also, CSM is not here to discuss politics, it is here to help the direction of enhancements to the game. The only involvement the CSM should have had was discussing any beefing up (or clarification) of the ToS and EULA in the aftermath.
And if a CSM member was unhappy that it was not brought up in Skype chat... WHY DID THEY NOT BRING IT UP THEMSELVES. |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
113
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:25:00 -
[516] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:At one point I used to help a casual friend that owned a large collection of machine guns put on "club" shooting weekends with a lot of automatic weapons out in the deserts of AZ. I mentioned one of these days I will get around to owning a BAR. I'm not sure why I'd ever need one, but if I did find I needed one I can't think of an easy substitue! Issler
So coy. You old rascal you.
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:29:00 -
[517] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Frying Doom wrote:] But another member of the CSM posted in the general discussions that they would issue a statement about this. And it wasn't Hans or Issler or darius. And when was this post made? Did they post anything before the banhammer? Also, CSM is not here to discuss politics, it is here to help the direction of enhancements to the game. The only involvement the CSM should have had was discussing any beefing up (or clarification) of the ToS and EULA in the aftermath. And if a CSM member was unhappy that it was not brought up in Skype chat... WHY DID THEY NOT BRING IT UP THEMSELVES.
Because, honestly I was happy with the posts I made. My only regret was that I made comments that were unfairly critical of the CSM that had chosen to not share their opinions, it was their right not to respond. My posts accurately represented what I was asked by players to share.
Issler |
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
333
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:30:00 -
[518] - Quote
Frankly I was disgusted by the CSM members who failed to recognize that The Mittani staying on the CSM was never an option from the second he opened his mouth and inserted his foot at the panel. You all played it safe and waited to see what would happen. I would have thought it was pressure from CCP to remain silent had it not been for Issler out here raising cane about it like EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN DOING.
Frankly, in my opinion the only right thing to do would have been to demand his immediate termination from the CSM and failing that, resigned from an organization that would clearly have become a mockery had he been allowed to stay. If I were Issler I would be embarrassed to work with any of you at this point. Absolutely weak and sad advocacy of what Alex did through silence. Or maybe it was just your own cowardice or fear of Alex. Either way, you're not fit to represent yourselves, not to mention the Eve community. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:32:00 -
[519] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:
Because, honestly I was happy with the posts I made. My only regret was that I made comments that were unfairly critical of the CSM that had chosen to not share their opinions, it was their right not to respond. My posts accurately represented what I was asked by players to share.
Issler
Yes, but you should have held your tongue until CCP had handed down punishment.
And threatening a business, was referencing the people trying to get SONY involved, effectively trying to hold DUST ransom for their cause. |
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
447
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:36:00 -
[520] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Issler Dainze wrote: So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Once again, you could start by talking with the rest of the CSM first before publicly posting on critical situations. You would probably have a better idea of how it might work. Wow Hans, I was on the Skype chat for about 6 hours total yesterday and no one brought anything related to this up. You were there all the time. Great chats about guns, food and stuff. But, sure, Issler You're a liar, I brought it up. And that's all I'll say about stuff in the PRIVATE (NDA COVERED) channel. www.noirmercs.com Now Recruiting CSM7, CSM 4 |
|
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
115
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:37:00 -
[521] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote: Yes, but you should have held your tongue until CCP had handed down punishment.
And threatening a business, was referencing the people trying to get SONY involved, effectively trying to hold DUST ransom for their cause.
I think it is a good sign that Issler is getting Sony involved and creating some waves to get his point across. I mean if you make a moral stand you have to take all means to get to a moral end.
Say what you will but you cannot smudge character like that. |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
115
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:39:00 -
[522] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote: You're a liar, I brought it up. And that's all I'll say about stuff in the PRIVATE (NDA COVERED) channel.
Oh shizzle, did someone just let slip some info about NDA covered material? Wonder what else was discussed in the channel... |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:43:00 -
[523] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Alekseyev Karrde wrote: You're a liar, I brought it up. And that's all I'll say about stuff in the PRIVATE (NDA COVERED) channel.
Oh shizzle, did someone just let slip some info about NDA covered material? Wonder what else was discussed in the channel... Probably cooking recipes. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:44:00 -
[524] - Quote
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Issler Dainze wrote: So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair?
All in all, sad turn of events.
Issler
Once again, you could start by talking with the rest of the CSM first before publicly posting on critical situations. You would probably have a better idea of how it might work. Wow Hans, I was on the Skype chat for about 6 hours total yesterday and no one brought anything related to this up. You were there all the time. Great chats about guns, food and stuff. But, sure, Issler You're a liar, I brought it up. And that's all I'll say about stuff in the PRIVATE (NDA COVERED) channel.
You never said a word. Sorry.
Issler |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:44:00 -
[525] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote: Yes, but you should have held your tongue until CCP had handed down punishment.
And threatening a business, was referencing the people trying to get SONY involved, effectively trying to hold DUST ransom for their cause.
I think it is a good sign that Issler is getting Sony involved and creating some waves to get his point across. I mean if you make a moral stand you have to take all means to get to a moral end. Say what you will but you cannot smudge character like that.
CSM is a privilege, not a right. With this fiasco and boneheads like you, I could see CCP killing the CSM.
You would be playing with the livelihoods of hundreds of people, for virtual politics.
And you speak of the moral high road... |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1457
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:50:00 -
[526] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote: Yes, but you should have held your tongue until CCP had handed down punishment.
And threatening a business, was referencing the people trying to get SONY involved, effectively trying to hold DUST ransom for their cause.
I think it is a good sign that Issler is getting Sony involved and creating some waves to get his point across. I mean if you make a moral stand you have to take all means to get to a moral end. Say what you will but you cannot smudge character like that.
To be fair I would have no idea how to get Sony involved. But I expect they were contacted by other folks. All I did was pretty simple, I shared my opinion on the situation here in the forums. One critique that was repeated regularly about the CSM 6 was they weren't very open or transparent and particularly reluctant to have an individuals position on an issue shared publicly. I've no intention of reinforcing that impression.
I can see however that I've riled up some folks.
Issler
|
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
117
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:56:00 -
[527] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Time Funnel wrote:
I think it is a good sign that Issler is getting Sony involved and creating some waves to get his point across. I mean if you make a moral stand you have to take all means to get to a moral end.
Say what you will but you cannot smudge character like that.
CSM is a privilege, not a right. With this fiasco and boneheads like you, I could see CCP killing the CSM. You would be playing with the livelihoods of hundreds of people, for virtual politics. And you speak of the moral high road...
Heh, if CCP wanted to kill the CSM they would first have to get rid of a bunch of people they didn't like on it. Then they would have to marginalize it by cutting off the lines of communication using excuses like certain delegates are using the mechanisms to further their own personal agendas.
I think it is high time that there were more people like Issler out there who will NOT COMPRIMISE their beliefs in the face of overwhelming adversity. Even if it is the "voice of reason" as other people would have you believe. It is time for change! and that change is through Issler. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 02:58:00 -
[528] - Quote
Issler, The thing about SONY was not directed at you, my apologies if people thought that.
In your position, I would have simply told people that I was waiting for CCP to handle the situation before commenting. If anything to keep it out of the political argument arena.
After that though, I would have let mittens have it. I do not agree with what he did, but its known practice in this game. If anything I would have also attacked the people raging on the forums when they do the same stuff in their day to day EvE activities. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:00:00 -
[529] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:
Heh, if CCP wanted to kill the CSM they would first have to get rid of a bunch of people they didn't like on it. Then they would have to marginalize it by cutting off the lines of communication using excuses like certain delegates are using the mechanisms to further their own personal agendas.
I think it is high time that there were more people like Issler out there who will NOT COMPRIMISE their beliefs in the face of overwhelming adversity. Even if it is the "voice of reason" as other people would have you believe. It is time for change! and that change is through Issler.
And this is why you could never be a leader, HTFU. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
73
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:00:00 -
[530] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote: Heh, if CCP wanted to kill the CSM they would first have to get rid of a bunch of people they didn't like on it. Then they would have to marginalize it by cutting off the lines of communication using excuses like certain delegates are using the mechanisms to further their own personal agendas.
I think it is high time that there were more people like Issler out there who will NOT COMPRIMISE their beliefs in the face of overwhelming adversity. Even if it is the "voice of reason" as other people would have you believe. It is time for change! and that change is through Issler.
I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
|
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:06:00 -
[531] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Time Funnel wrote: Heh, if CCP wanted to kill the CSM they would first have to get rid of a bunch of people they didn't like on it. Then they would have to marginalize it by cutting off the lines of communication using excuses like certain delegates are using the mechanisms to further their own personal agendas.
I think it is high time that there were more people like Issler out there who will NOT COMPRIMISE their beliefs in the face of overwhelming adversity. Even if it is the "voice of reason" as other people would have you believe. It is time for change! and that change is through Issler.
I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.
The only thing any of the CSM members should have said (being able to keep a professional approach) was that they do not condone the actions of said board members.
And time-funnel obviously believes in dictatorships, as that is how they start. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
74
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:15:00 -
[532] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Time Funnel wrote: Heh, if CCP wanted to kill the CSM they would first have to get rid of a bunch of people they didn't like on it. Then they would have to marginalize it by cutting off the lines of communication using excuses like certain delegates are using the mechanisms to further their own personal agendas.
I think it is high time that there were more people like Issler out there who will NOT COMPRIMISE their beliefs in the face of overwhelming adversity. Even if it is the "voice of reason" as other people would have you believe. It is time for change! and that change is through Issler.
I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more. The only thing any of the CSM members should have said (being able to keep a professional approach) was that they do not condone the actions of said board members. And time-funnel obviously believes in dictatorships, as that is how they start. Yep that would have been fine. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1459
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:16:00 -
[533] - Quote
And let me say this. The CSM brought a lot of good into the process of the CSM. But that isn't to say that there wasn't a fair amount of criticism of aspects of the CSM 6.
One thing I saw repeated over and over what there was a perception that the individual members actions and opinions were never properly revealed, Even Seleene blogged about that.
Another was that the CSM 6 too long to respond to things that required timely responses.
I wasn't asked to provide the position of the entire CSM as a group or CCP and I didn't. I offered MY opinion as I was asked to do by the players that elected me.
That somehow I am not allowed to share MY thoughts on something before being coached on what to say is never going to be my style. If I allowed the hive mind to tell me how to think I wouldn't have run because I was told over and over the folks that elected me could never come together and elect someone like me.
I was elected because of what I think, not what I'll be coached to think.
When I started this thread I felt it was a no brainer! Of course all the members of the CSM 7 would want to assure the players that they recognized this was a serious matter and no one could support what mittens did. Beyond that was up to them but the basic issue was simple. Did the individual CSM member see this as an issue? I couldn't believe this could be at all controversial. What debate could there be?
What I expected was a lot of goon trolling and the rest of the CSM saying something to the effect "we take this seriously and we are actively discussing this among ourselves and with CCP". Instead this became the censor Issler thread for speakig out of turn.
This is a CSM of many styles of player interaction. My style seems to be an outlier but I am committed to work hard in the CSM 7 for the folks that elected me. I'm sorry I ruffled some feathers before we've even started but I am committed to making the CSM 7 the most open and transparent CSM to date. I hope the rest of the CSM can reflect and see there is value in addressing some of the past criticisms of the CSM 6 in our upcoming term.
We owe the players that elected us that.
Issler |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:16:00 -
[534] - Quote
You have to remember that most of the CSM isnt the best at PR.
My intention isnt so much to censor outright, more of tone the opinion down a little (not totally stfu or anything). Mostly because people in general will blow things way out of proportion.
Many people who responded in here wanted the CSM to DO something to CCP out of spite for mittens even being in there. Which would have been way out of place for the CSM in general. If anything (I dont know what comms transpired between CSM and CCP) a simple, "Hey, that was not cool, possible ToS/EULA problem there CCP dudes." to CCP should have been it. People calling for more are kinda out of line.
CCP PR can hopefully handle itself. |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
118
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:21:00 -
[535] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:
The only thing any of the CSM members should have said (being able to keep a professional approach) was that they do not condone the actions of said board members.
And time-funnel obviously believes in dictatorships, as that is how they start.
I believe in dictatorships? Why would I be supporting the one person who has the courage to speak his own beliefs on the council?
Duh.
Cyrina Manto wrote:You have to remember that most of the CSM isnt the best at PR.
Yeah they are only good at getting elected.
|
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:24:00 -
[536] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:I believe in dictatorships? Why would I be supporting the one person who has the courage to speak his own beliefs on the council? Duh. Cyrina Manto wrote:You have to remember that most of the CSM isnt the best at PR. Yeah they are only good at getting elected.
Getting elected and having good PR are two different things, you need to stay out of politics. |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
215
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:25:00 -
[537] - Quote
We all know what really went on in CSM Skype.
Trebor was sitting behind his dungeon master screen, rolls some dice.
Seleene is yelling about how he's casting heal spells on mittani's wizard.
Trebor calmly turns to mittani "About your wizard dude"
"He..."
"He didn't make it."
Personally, I'd want to make sure everyone had signed their NDA too. My EVE YouTube Channel |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
118
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:26:00 -
[538] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote: Getting elected and having good PR are two different things, you need to stay out of politics.
Implying that I am in, or intending to get into politics. If you call this whole farce politics. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:27:00 -
[539] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:We all know what really went on in CSM Skype.
Trebor was sitting behind his dungeon master screen, rolls some dice.
Seleene is yelling about how he's casting heal spells on mittani's wizard.
Trebor calmly turns to mittani "About your wizard dude"
"He..."
"He didn't make it."
Personally, I'd want to make sure everyone had signed their NDA too.
Best post ever. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:28:00 -
[540] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote: Getting elected and having good PR are two different things, you need to stay out of politics.
Implying that I am in, or intending to get into politics. If you call this whole farce politics.
You post like a political zealot, just giving advice to stay away from politics before you hurt your representatives image... |
|
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
118
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:30:00 -
[541] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:
You post like a political zealot, just giving advice to stay away from politics before you hurt your representatives image...
Nothing can hurt Issler's image. His moral position keeps him above the fray. And this is pretty obvious to anyone who is paying any attention at all.
|
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:32:00 -
[542] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:
You post like a political zealot, just giving advice to stay away from politics before you hurt your representatives image...
Nothing can hurt Issler's image. His moral position keeps him above the fray. And this is pretty obvious to anyone who is paying any attention at all.
Point proven, political zealotry. Haha.
|
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
215
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:35:00 -
[543] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Revolution Rising wrote:We all know what really went on in CSM Skype.
Trebor was sitting behind his dungeon master screen, rolls some dice.
Seleene is yelling about how he's casting heal spells on mittani's wizard.
Trebor calmly turns to mittani "About your wizard dude"
"He..."
"He didn't make it."
Personally, I'd want to make sure everyone had signed their NDA too. Best post ever.
Well after watching the evetv interview of Trebor, he looks like the guy rolling dice behind the dungeon master screen telling you your paladin is dead.
My EVE YouTube Channel |
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
118
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:38:00 -
[544] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Point proven, political zealotry. Haha.
So you are saying that there is still a career for me in PR. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:38:00 -
[545] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:
Well after watching the evetv interview of Trebor, he looks like the guy rolling dice behind the dungeon master screen telling you your paladin is dead.
Plus he made wizardry which I played and played back in the day ;)
Indeed, that game was awesome. Gonna get me reminiscing about the good old days. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:40:00 -
[546] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:Point proven, political zealotry. Haha. So you are saying that there is still a career for me in PR.
In the same way Jessie Jackson does PR... Yes.
|
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
118
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:41:00 -
[547] - Quote
Cyrina Manto wrote:Revolution Rising wrote:
Well after watching the evetv interview of Trebor, he looks like the guy rolling dice behind the dungeon master screen telling you your paladin is dead.
Plus he made wizardry which I played and played back in the day ;)
Indeed, that game was awesome. Gonna get me reminiscing about the good old days.
You guys are such Nerds. With a capital N.
|
Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
2198
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:45:00 -
[548] - Quote
[quote=Frying Doom I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.[/quote
Has anyone considered that Alex's behavior was so clearly reprehensible that it seemed silly to need to go "ON THE RECORD" with such immediacy, especially when this has nothing to do with CSM7, and it has nothing to do with us individually
Many of us weren't at fanfest, Alex only represented himself in his actions, CCP makes ultimate the call regarding ToS and EULA stuff, and the CSM7 doesn't yet exist
There's just no reason for anyone to go around castigating the CSM7 candidates who haven't even taken office for not coming out and making a dog and pony show out of their piety. I think it's both tedious and unnecessary to expect that each one of us individually affirms that every inappropriate act is indeed inappropriate, and frankly I consider it one of our responsibilities as CSM members to learn all the information we can about a situation before we start pointing the finger at each other publicly.
Missed an interview or debate? Check my CSM7 blog for details.
Many thanks to all of my friends and supporters for the kind words! |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:45:00 -
[549] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:
You guys are such Nerds. With a capital N.
Don't get me started, D&D hasnt been the same since v2. Then again, neither have computers since the great downfall of Rendition and 3DFX. |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
215
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 03:57:00 -
[550] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:Revolution Rising wrote:
Well after watching the evetv interview of Trebor, he looks like the guy rolling dice behind the dungeon master screen telling you your paladin is dead.
Plus he made wizardry which I played and played back in the day ;)
Indeed, that game was awesome. Gonna get me reminiscing about the good old days. You guys are such Nerds. With a capital N.
So in 20 years when you tell someone, oh yeah I used to play Eve.
And they go "You're such a nerd" your response will be what ?
srsly... think before u poast. My EVE YouTube Channel |
|
Time Funnel
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
118
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:00:00 -
[551] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:
So in 20 years when you tell someone, oh yeah I used to play Eve.
And they go "You're such a nerd" your response will be what ?
srsly... think before u poast.
My response will be to light a 2,000$ note or whatever 100$ has inflated up to by then and say. Yeah, well at least I am rich. |
Cyrina Manto
Masons of New Eden The Laughing Men
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:03:00 -
[552] - Quote
Time Funnel wrote:Revolution Rising wrote:
So in 20 years when you tell someone, oh yeah I used to play Eve.
And they go "You're such a nerd" your response will be what ?
srsly... think before u poast.
My response will be to light a 2,000$ note or whatever 100$ has inflated up to by then and say. Yeah, well at least I am rich.
I see, you take the Rick James approach...
I'M RICH *****!!! |
yoyaz
Oberon Incorporated RAZOR Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:08:00 -
[553] - Quote
Remove ALL CSM's.
They are ******* pointless anyway. |
Demon Azrakel
Bite Me inc Exhale.
69
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:14:00 -
[554] - Quote
Andski wrote:Issler, capitalizing on a depressed player for your own in-game political gain makes you a hypocrite.
What if he commits suicide, how would the piece of **** OP feel then? |
Kai Tel
State War Academy Caldari State
80
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:25:00 -
[555] - Quote
*YAWN* I would think that by now it's all moot thanks to CCP. I can't even come up with a good troll much less a substantive post for "this" thread right now. Y'all have fun. I'll plus one like you if you can entertain me. |
Sidus Sarmiang
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
164
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 04:58:00 -
[556] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.
Has anyone considered that Alex's behavior was so clearly reprehensible that it seemed silly to need to go ON THE RECORD! with such immediacy, especially when this has nothing to do with CSM7, and it has nothing to do with us individually? Many of us weren't at fanfest, Alex only represented himself in his actions, CCP makes the ultimate the call regarding ToS and EULA stuff, and the CSM7 doesn't even exist yet. There's just no reason for anyone to go around castigating the CSM7 candidates who haven't even taken office for not coming out and making a dog and pony show out of their piety. I think it's both tedious and unnecessary to expect that each one of us individually affirms that every inappropriate act is indeed inappropriate, and frankly I consider it one of our responsibilities as CSM members to learn all the information we can about a situation before we start pointing the finger at each other publicly.
Even if I'm against you, you sound too damn reasonable.
I'm glad not all pubbies are like you or screwing with them wouldn't be nearly as fun.
Fortunately, plenty are like Issler, including Issler, and hopefully her alliance.
|
Macon Chalaise
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
26
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:12:00 -
[557] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.
Has anyone considered that Alex's behavior was so clearly reprehensible that it seemed silly to need to go ON THE RECORD! with such immediacy, especially when this has nothing to do with CSM7, and it has nothing to do with us individually? Many of us weren't at fanfest, Alex only represented himself in his actions, CCP makes the ultimate the call regarding ToS and EULA stuff, and the CSM7 doesn't even exist yet. There's just no reason for anyone to go around castigating the CSM7 candidates who haven't even taken office for not coming out and making a dog and pony show out of their piety. I think it's both tedious and unnecessary to expect that each one of us individually affirms that every inappropriate act is indeed inappropriate, and frankly I consider it one of our responsibilities as CSM members to learn all the information we can about a situation before we start pointing the finger at each other publicly.
This.
No ones votes were wasted. Mittens was in fact elected to the CSM and the chair...and then he screwed up.
He's the ONLY person any of you "I CAN HAZ RELECTION?" people should be mad at.
Besides, once he committed himself to stepping down his fate was sealed anyway if he wanted to have any integrity.
Mittens did the right thing by stepping down even if only because he said he would.
Here's to fire. Not the fast and furious kind that burns down shacks and shanties, but the slow, seductive kind that takes down pants and panties - Irish Toast |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
77
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 05:33:00 -
[558] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.
Has anyone considered that Alex's behavior was so clearly reprehensible that it seemed silly to need to go ON THE RECORD! with such immediacy, especially when this has nothing to do with CSM7, and it has nothing to do with us individually? Many of us weren't at fanfest, Alex only represented himself in his actions, CCP makes the ultimate the call regarding ToS and EULA stuff, and the CSM7 doesn't even exist yet. There's just no reason for anyone to go around castigating the CSM7 candidates who haven't even taken office for not coming out and making a dog and pony show out of their piety. I think it's both tedious and unnecessary to expect that each one of us individually affirms that every inappropriate act is indeed inappropriate, and frankly I consider it one of our responsibilities as CSM members to learn all the information we can about a situation before we start pointing the finger at each other publicly. Ok personally I really don't see the need to continue this but I will respond to this dreg.
You are saying that as people voted in a representatives of EVE you believe you should be quiet at things that are "clearly reprehensible" and should not comment during a crisis. As for nothing to do with the CSM, he didn't do it as the CSM chairman but he was the CSM6 chairman and about to be made the chairman for the CSM 7, so yes I would definitely say it was concerning the CSM, when their chairman is acting with "behavior was so clearly reprehensible". As to individually it would have been a good thing to show that you are a body of individuals capable of independent thought.
But yet you have poked fingers at other CSM members independently of the CSM just not your former chairman, for what you claim was inappropriate behavior. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
RougeOperator
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
552
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 06:55:00 -
[559] - Quote
Macon Chalaise wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.
Has anyone considered that Alex's behavior was so clearly reprehensible that it seemed silly to need to go ON THE RECORD! with such immediacy, especially when this has nothing to do with CSM7, and it has nothing to do with us individually? Many of us weren't at fanfest, Alex only represented himself in his actions, CCP makes the ultimate the call regarding ToS and EULA stuff, and the CSM7 doesn't even exist yet. There's just no reason for anyone to go around castigating the CSM7 candidates who haven't even taken office for not coming out and making a dog and pony show out of their piety. I think it's both tedious and unnecessary to expect that each one of us individually affirms that every inappropriate act is indeed inappropriate, and frankly I consider it one of our responsibilities as CSM members to learn all the information we can about a situation before we start pointing the finger at each other publicly. This. No ones votes were wasted. Mittens was in fact elected to the CSM and the chair...and then he screwed up. He's the ONLY person any of you "I CAN HAZ RELECTION?" people should be mad at. Besides, once he committed himself to stepping down his fate was sealed anyway if he wanted to have any integrity. Mittens did the right thing by stepping down even if only because he said he would.
Pretty much this.
There is no reason for a revote.
You were not disfranchised you got to vote.
Your boy blew it for you.
Take it up with him. He is the one the thew away your votes not ccp.
Alternates exist or a reason.
Space wizards are real, they can make 10058 votes vanish. "and for a moment i hurd 10k goons cry out, then silence"-á |
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:40:00 -
[560] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:Yeah, I did not mention him running again in the re-election. If he got booted(he did), then the whole thing should be re-done anyway.
Way to play the "meta-game" guys.
I think some of the complainers should seriously "Win at EvE". So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair? All in all, sad turn of events. Issler
It's actually laid out in the original CSM white paper. If you'd made the effort to work with the rest of the CSM rather than spend your time attempting to score quick political points at their expense, you'd know this already...... |
|
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:41:00 -
[561] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:Frying Doom wrote: I agree completely, this one was pretty straight forward and we should have heard from each CSM member as they got home ect.. condemning it. Not a we will get back to you in a few days message. Why does the world believe that because you are elected we should expect less of people not more.
Has anyone considered that Alex's behavior was so clearly reprehensible that it seemed silly to need to go ON THE RECORD! with such immediacy, especially when this has nothing to do with CSM7, and it has nothing to do with us individually? Many of us weren't at fanfest, Alex only represented himself in his actions, CCP makes the ultimate the call regarding ToS and EULA stuff, and the CSM7 doesn't even exist yet. There's just no reason for anyone to go around castigating the CSM7 candidates who haven't even taken office for not coming out and making a dog and pony show out of their piety. I think it's both tedious and unnecessary to expect that each one of us individually affirms that every inappropriate act is indeed inappropriate, and frankly I consider it one of our responsibilities as CSM members to learn all the information we can about a situation before we start pointing the finger at each other publicly. Ok personally I really don't see the need to continue this but I will respond to this dreg. You are saying that as people voted in a representatives of EVE you believe you should be quiet at things that are "clearly reprehensible" and should not comment during a crisis. As for nothing to do with the CSM, he didn't do it as the CSM chairman but he was the CSM6 chairman and about to be made the chairman for the CSM 7, so yes I would definitely say it was concerning the CSM, when their chairman is acting with "behavior was so clearly reprehensible". As to individually it would have been a good thing to show that you are a body of individuals capable of independent thought. But yet you have poked fingers at other CSM members independently of the CSM just not your former chairman, for what you claim was inappropriate behavior.
She's still not going to sleep with you. You're obviously batshit insane.
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:44:00 -
[562] - Quote
Vashan Tar wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Cyrina Manto wrote:Yeah, I did not mention him running again in the re-election. If he got booted(he did), then the whole thing should be re-done anyway.
Way to play the "meta-game" guys.
I think some of the complainers should seriously "Win at EvE". So I am sympathetic to the idea of replacement candidate to take his seat. Not sure how that would work but some sort of election for a new chair? All in all, sad turn of events. Issler It's actually laid out in the original CSM white paper. If you'd made the effort to work with the rest of the CSM rather than spend your time attempting to score quick political points at their expense, you'd know this already...... Is that the one that is outdated and still says 9 CSM's go to Iceland and 4 alternates. I haven't seen one for the new layout please give me a link. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 07:46:00 -
[563] - Quote
Vashan Tar wrote:I am obviously batshit insane.
There I fixed it for you. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:19:00 -
[564] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote: There I fixed it for you.
You should probably make another ~puppetmaster~ post, that worked out so well for you last time.
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
81
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 08:21:00 -
[565] - Quote
Vashan Tar wrote:Frying Doom wrote: There I fixed it for you.
You should probably make another ~puppetmaster~ post, that worked out so well for you last time. Yes it did thanks for noticing. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Vashan Tar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
42
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:03:00 -
[566] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Vashan Tar wrote:Frying Doom wrote: There I fixed it for you.
You should probably make another ~puppetmaster~ post, that worked out so well for you last time. Yes it did thanks for noticing.
Indeed Mr Creepy Internet Stalker |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
82
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 09:14:00 -
[567] - Quote
Vashan Tar wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Vashan Tar wrote:Frying Doom wrote: There I fixed it for you.
You should probably make another ~puppetmaster~ post, that worked out so well for you last time. Yes it did thanks for noticing. Indeed Mr Creepy Internet Stalker Read more then you will understand. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Kai Jyokoroi
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
37
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:18:00 -
[568] - Quote
Well I'm bored of this whole charade but I AM looking forward to your entire alliance being solidly wardecced for an entire year or more |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
94
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 11:53:00 -
[569] - Quote
Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Well I'm bored of this whole charade but I AM looking forward to your entire alliance being solidly wardecced for an entire year or more Oh threats from Jokeswarm.
Here is one for you ~Deal with it~ Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Yuki 0nna
The White Rose Conventicle
41
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:41:00 -
[570] - Quote
Issler Dainze,
Thanks for your early stand on this issue. |
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1778
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:45:00 -
[571] - Quote
Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Well I'm bored of this whole charade but I AM looking forward to your entire alliance being solidly wardecced for an entire year or more
Me too because it means every hisec random pvp trade hub ganking corp in eve will be able to wardec goonswarm for free when INFERNO hits :)
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
doombreed52
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
36
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 14:59:00 -
[572] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Well I'm bored of this whole charade but I AM looking forward to your entire alliance being solidly wardecced for an entire year or more Me too because it means every hisec random pvp trade hub ganking corp in eve will be able to wardec goonswarm for free when INFERNO hits :)
sigh you do know that the cost to wardec an alliance is like 50m plus 500k isk per alliance member look at test that's going to cost about 3.2b a week. good luck, you're going to need it. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1781
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 15:06:00 -
[573] - Quote
doombreed52 wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Kai Jyokoroi wrote:Well I'm bored of this whole charade but I AM looking forward to your entire alliance being solidly wardecced for an entire year or more Me too because it means every hisec random pvp trade hub ganking corp in eve will be able to wardec goonswarm for free when INFERNO hits :) sigh you do know that the cost to wardec an alliance is like 50m plus 500k isk per alliance member look at test that's going to cost about 3.2b a week. good luck, you're going to need it.
Learn to play eve (and read the wardec devblog properly.)
In inferno it will be possible for the defender in a wardec to invite "allies" into the war for free.
Say Goonswarm dec Isslers alliance that will cost goonswarm (whatever) 500k per member per week.
But she can invite (pay) mercs to join the war and they will pay NOTHING.
Hence having a permawar against Issler's alliance will potentially give any hisec hub ganker corp in eve the chance to get involved in that as long as Issler (or whoever leads her alliance) fancies making the invite.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Deen Wispa
Screaming War Eagles Incorporated
210
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:09:00 -
[574] - Quote
Seriously Issler. This is not a war you're going to win. In the words of my father who was a diplomat for the Gallente Federation;
"It is easier to argue in public and seek the approval of many. Than it is to converse in private and seek the approval of one."
The one or few people you need to really get along with here is your CSM members.
I'm not a miner nor an industrialist so it doesn't affect me if you get booted. But you worked soooooo hard to get on the CSM to help improve the gameplay in these areas. Please stop arguing here in public and try to work on improving relations with the other CSM members.
Let cooler heads prevail . |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
109
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:23:00 -
[575] - Quote
Deen Wispa wrote:Seriously Issler. This is not a war you're going to win. In the words of my father who was a diplomat for the Gallente Federation;
oh dear |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1474
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:26:00 -
[576] - Quote
Deen Wispa wrote:Seriously Issler. This is not a war you're going to win. In the words of my father who was a diplomat for the Gallente Federation;
"It is easier to argue in public and seek the approval of many. Than it is to converse in private and seek the approval of one."
The one or few people you need to really get along with here is your CSM members.
I'm not a miner nor an industrialist so it doesn't affect me if you get booted. But you worked soooooo hard to get on the CSM to help improve the gameplay in these areas. Please stop arguing here in public and try to work on improving relations with the other CSM members.
Let cooler heads prevail
Thanks for that advice. You might have noticed I haven't been arguing in this thread for a while now. I made my opinion clear as I was asked to do. My only regret and I've shared this with the CSM is that I should have made it clear that I was stating MY views and left it up to the other CSM to comment or not. It was wrong of me to call for their action in a manner that may not have been their choosing and I've apologized to the CSM 7 members on Skype.
The way I messaged this wasn't fair to the other CSM 7. It is their choice to communicate to the player base in whatever manner they like. The folks in the CSM 7 that had issues with me in this thread felt that had responded in other threads and some where still catching up from fanfest.
In the future I'll still "speak my mind" as I think I was elected to do but I'll make it clear it is "my" mind and not the other CSM and I have promised to include the other CSM in discussions of any significant issues before making any major statements.
This was a very unusual situation and particular aspects of this were just "too close to home" for me not to have spoken out like I did. So I stand by that, but I won't be dragging other CSM into it the way I did this time in the future.
It is for them to communicate however they choose.
Issler |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
227
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:39:00 -
[577] - Quote
I have to say I think it was refreshing to hear Issler say something about this.
The issue here wasn't what the CSM as a body thought of what Mittani had done. This was purely an individual character assessment. The fact that they had to come out as an organisation to say something about it doesn't say anything about them as people at all.
At least we know where Issler stands on it. CSM7 Skype Leak
|
Deen Wispa
Screaming War Eagles Incorporated
210
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 19:51:00 -
[578] - Quote
Daviclond wrote:Deen Wispa wrote:Seriously Issler. This is not a war you're going to win. In the words of my father who was a diplomat for the Gallente Federation; oh dear
LOL. Had to throw in the RP for lolz :) . |
Daviclond
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
110
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 20:10:00 -
[579] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Deen Wispa wrote:Seriously Issler. This is not a war you're going to win. In the words of my father who was a diplomat for the Gallente Federation;
"It is easier to argue in public and seek the approval of many. Than it is to converse in private and seek the approval of one."
The one or few people you need to really get along with here is your CSM members.
I'm not a miner nor an industrialist so it doesn't affect me if you get booted. But you worked soooooo hard to get on the CSM to help improve the gameplay in these areas. Please stop arguing here in public and try to work on improving relations with the other CSM members.
Let cooler heads prevail Thanks for that advice. You might have noticed I haven't been arguing in this thread for a while now. I made my opinion clear as I was asked to do. My only regret and I've shared this with the CSM is that I should have made it clear that I was stating MY views and left it up to the other CSM to comment or not. It was wrong of me to call for their action in a manner that may not have been their choosing and I've apologized to the CSM 7 members on Skype. The way I messaged this wasn't fair to the other CSM 7. It is their choice to communicate to the player base in whatever manner they like. The folks in the CSM 7 that had issues with me in this thread felt that had responded in other threads and some where still catching up from fanfest. In the future I'll still "speak my mind" as I think I was elected to do but I'll make it clear it is "my" mind and not the other CSM and I have promised to include the other CSM in discussions of any significant issues before making any major statements. This was a very unusual situation and particular aspects of this were just "too close to home" for me not to have spoken out like I did. So I stand by that, but I won't be dragging other CSM into it the way I did this time in the future. It is for them to communicate however they choose. Issler
you are "a bad poster" |
Valearx
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
75
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:35:00 -
[580] - Quote
Issler,
Why do you sign your posts?
Thanks. |
|
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1482
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:42:00 -
[581] - Quote
Valearx wrote:Issler,
Why do you sign your posts?
Thanks.
I am a mystery wrapped in a puzzle with a creamy enigma filled center!.
Issler
|
Cap'n Tripps
Bloodnock Industries
7
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 21:43:00 -
[582] - Quote
Tarsus Zateki wrote:Andski wrote:Issler, capitalizing on a depressed player for your own in-game political gain makes you a hypocrite. And a very sick person.
Your hypocrisy is astounding.
|
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
236
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 22:14:00 -
[583] - Quote
Yeah it's the "All of us sociopaths are together on this and you're a sick person Issler" post.
Yeah dude you're fine.
CSM7 Skype Leak
|
GetSirrus
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
5
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:12:00 -
[584] - Quote
Attention Issler
You just failed the first test?!
The CSM needs to work as a cohesive unified group.
What you should have done is canvassed the rest of CSM7 for consensus. Guess what, if I was one of those people - I would not trust you Issler. Your pre-emptive action comes across as self serving.
The game is getting a major overhaul of skills and sub-cap ships. That is where you attention should be focused. Understanding this for yourself, what it means to your constituents and finally; what it means for other CSM7 members?! Because if you break ranks on this prime issue - the CSM process is broken by you.
Hear the Bears Roar? All I hear is choking. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1483
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:39:00 -
[585] - Quote
GetSirrus wrote:Attention Issler
You just failed the first test?!
The CSM needs to work as a cohesive unified group.
What you should have done is canvassed the rest of CSM7 for consensus. Guess what, if I was one of those people - I would not trust you Issler. Your pre-emptive action comes across as self serving.
The game is getting a major overhaul of skills and sub-cap ships. That is where you attention should be focused. Understanding this for yourself, what it means to your constituents and finally; what it means for other CSM7 members?! Because if you break ranks on this prime issue - the CSM process is broken by you.
Hear the Bears Roar? All I hear is choking.
I don't need to canvass anyone to come to a consensus about MY opinion.
I was wrong to offer my opinion a manner that made it appear I was demanding the other CSM members to have the same opinion and to make them convey that opinion in the same manner that I had chosen. They have the right to respond to anything that happens in Eve as individuals in the manner they choose. That part of my messaging was unfair to the other members of the CSM and I apologies for that.
But those are two very different things.
Stating MY opinion in a timely fashion about an act like this one that so clearly crossed the line when specifically asked to provide my views by the folks that elected me has nothing to do with the CSM process.
Issler |
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
184
|
Posted - 2012.03.29 23:47:00 -
[586] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I don't need to canvass anyone to come to a consensus about MY opinion.
I was WRONG to offer my opinion a manner that made it appear I was demanding the other CSM members to have the same opinion and to make them convey that opinion in the same manner that I had chosen. They have the right to respond to anything that happens in Eve as individuals in the manner they choose. That part of my messaging was unfair to the other members of the CSM and I apologies for that.
But those are two very different things.
Stating MY opinion in a timely fashion about an act like this one that so clearly crossed the line when specifically asked to provide my views by the folks that elected me has nothing to do with the CSM process.
Issler Yes, you are wrong and have sullied the CSM further with your terrible antigoonism. There's a reason why all the NPC alts are on the anti mittens bandwagon. Now it's obvious that you're a kneejerking bandwagoning bad person who will gleefully swim with the sharks as soon as first blood is drawn.
Good luck on this CSM term after this ::awesome:: first step. |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1485
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 00:05:00 -
[587] - Quote
Aiden Andraste wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:I don't need to canvass anyone to come to a consensus about MY opinion.
I was WRONG to offer my opinion a manner that made it appear I was demanding the other CSM members to have the same opinion and to make them convey that opinion in the same manner that I had chosen. They have the right to respond to anything that happens in Eve as individuals in the manner they choose. That part of my messaging was unfair to the other members of the CSM and I apologies for that.
But those are two very different things.
Stating MY opinion in a timely fashion about an act like this one that so clearly crossed the line when specifically asked to provide my views by the folks that elected me has nothing to do with the CSM process.
Issler Yes, you are wrong and have sullied the CSM further with your terrible antigoonism. There's a reason why all the NPC alts are on the anti mittens bandwagon. Now it's obvious that you're a kneejerking bandwagoning bad person who will gleefully swim with the sharks as soon as first blood is drawn. Good luck on this CSM term after this ::awesome:: first step.
Please show a single anti-goon post I've made. I support the goons as a part of the Eve sandbox. I've even been a goon. I've repeatedly posted my position that the goons are a proper part of Eve. What I am against is extremely poor judgement in public by someone that has a position of influence in Eve.
If you think I control the NPC alts and I'm driving the anti-goon sentiment then I would suggest you resume taking you space madness meds because the madness is back.
So keep on misrepresenting my position, but it won't get you anything in the end.
Oh, and work on your tense, "was" happened already, like the mistake I made asking the other CSM to do something I didn't have the right to ask them and what I've apologized for. "Are" means I'm doing it now, which I'm not.
Issler
|
Darius III
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
1286
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 01:13:00 -
[588] - Quote
Goons are crap. Theres an anti-goonie post for you guys.
Bring it-D3 CCP has rededicated themselves to improving Eve and are by and large doing a terrific job at it. My personal faith in them is largely restored. I think the coming changes will revitalize Eve and bring joy to the masses. |
Mozillaa Firefox
Ore Investments
0
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 10:16:00 -
[589] - Quote
Darius III wrote: I came out guns blazing against Mittani. I didnt talk to anyone about it, still dont see the need to. YES CSM need to flesh out opinions and give a shot at unified voice before the pandering begins on some issues-this NOT being one of them. Mittani told so many lies about me I dont even know where to start, so good riddance MEIGHT MEIGHT.
Theres been some interesting conversation in Skype channels, and we arent cookie cutter people with the same views, but we are mostly committed to working together, even me. Any pandering I do, I make no excuses for. Am I happy about what happened? YOU BET YOUR SWEET POSTERIOR I AM.
Goons are crap. Theres an anti-goonie post for you guys.
Bring it-D3
Hey, I'm kind of new to all this but could you explain what contributions you made to the previous CSM? Part of the reason I re-subbed was because of Crucible, which I'm told is largely CCP's response to advocacy from the Mitanni, Selene, uaxdeath and trebor (sorry if I left out the others, but those are the names I remember off the top of my head) - I'm not trying to troll or anything, but I honestly haven't heard your name mentioned in any of the recent "we've done this" CSM threads.
As far as I understand it, Issler is running as an advocate for highsec industry, which is a good thing as it fits a lot of players' playstyles.
What's your platform, besides apparently being anti-Mitanni and anti highsec space (< I'm assuming that one because of your incursions interdiction thing, nice job by the way!)? Can I count on you to give a good representation to CCP of the playerbase? |
Darius III
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
1299
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 11:14:00 -
[590] - Quote
I am very much PRO Hisec. I did incursion interdiction because I feel CCP taking too long to fix the problem-so I did it myself. I also asked CCP to limit peoples ability to kill every incursion at once and remove this content as I think that is unfair as well. It is against my poicy to claim responsibility for anything and I think thgat the CSM works as a team.... Also last year I was an alternate, this year I am a full member. I have made contributions regarding war decs, suicide ganking, gone against several things that are in discussion currently. I will have many positions and issues that I take up as the year goes by.
PD I did not actually go fishing while in Iceland. I claimed that as a troll in my campaign, but secretly I was in the meetings-D3 CCP has rededicated themselves to improving Eve and are by and large doing a terrific job at it. My personal faith in them is largely restored. I think the coming changes will revitalize Eve and bring joy to the masses. |
|
Aiden Andraste
State War Academy Caldari State
202
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 11:43:00 -
[591] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Please show a single anti-goon post I've made. I support the goons as a part of the Eve sandbox. I've even been a goon. I've repeatedly posted my position that the goons are a proper part of Eve. What I am against is extremely poor judgement in public by someone that has a position of influence in Eve.
If you think I control the NPC alts and I'm driving the anti-goon sentiment then I would suggest you resume taking you space madness meds because the madness is back.
So keep on misrepresenting my position, but it won't get you anything in the end.
Oh, and work on your tense, "was" happened already, like the mistake I made asking the other CSM to do something I didn't have the right to ask them and what I've apologized for. "Are" means I'm doing it now, which I'm not.
Issler
Dear Issler,
Alright, fair enough. There's no specific instances of anti-goonism in your posts. You still jumped on the bandwagon as soon as possible in order to promote anti-Mittani schtick in your bid to ride the wave of anti-goonism that the majority of EVE paosters share.
But hey, if you're writing sensationalist stuff about me and my 'space-madness' then all is fair. Oh, and picking apart my grammar instead of addressing my valid points? C'mon, that's so 1990.
Finally, I guess I have to explain my line about npc alts as it went right over your head. The NPC alts are posting goonie hate because they fear goonie retaliation. Now that you have outed yourself as an anti-goon for no other reason than to coast on pubbie shouts of "Yeah! Down with Goonswarm!" all the way to Iceland, you're seeing the backlash of goons and pubbies alike. No matter what kind of apology you offer to the CSM, it's not hard to see through your self-serving turncoat politics and general badness.
Looks like you and D3 will be the only two members of the anti-goon CSM section that no one will pay attention to.
With much <3, ~Aiden
P.S. Didn't writing letters die last century? You should really consider catching up to us here in the modern world. XOXOXO |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
117
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 12:46:00 -
[592] - Quote
Aiden Andraste wrote: Dear Issler,
Alright, fair enough. There's no specific instances of anti-goonism in your posts. You still jumped on the bandwagon as soon as possible in order to promote anti-Mittani schtick in your bid to ride the wave of anti-goonism that the majority of EVE paosters share.
But hey, if you're writing sensationalist stuff about me and my 'space-madness' then all is fair. Oh, and picking apart my grammar instead of addressing my valid points? C'mon, that's so 1990.
Finally, I guess I have to explain my line about npc alts as it went right over your head. The NPC alts are posting goonie hate because they fear goonie retaliation. Now that you have outed yourself as an anti-goon for no other reason than to coast on pubbie shouts of "Yeah! Down with Goonswarm!" all the way to Iceland, you're seeing the backlash of goons and pubbies alike. No matter what kind of apology you offer to the CSM, it's not hard to see through your self-serving turncoat politics and general badness.
Looks like you and D3 will be the only two members of the anti-goon CSM section that no one will pay attention to.
With much <3, ~Aiden
P.S. Didn't writing letters die last century? You should really consider catching up to us here in the modern world. XOXOXO
Oh give it up. You sound worse than I did when I was trying to act like a total nutter. You voted you lost your vote blah blah blah... Its done, if you are finding this situation to stressful please seek professional help. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
PleaseDONTblow Myship
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 12:55:00 -
[593] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Aiden Andraste wrote: Dear Issler,
Alright, fair enough. There's no specific instances of anti-goonism in your posts. You still jumped on the bandwagon as soon as possible in order to promote anti-Mittani schtick in your bid to ride the wave of anti-goonism that the majority of EVE paosters share.
But hey, if you're writing sensationalist stuff about me and my 'space-madness' then all is fair. Oh, and picking apart my grammar instead of addressing my valid points? C'mon, that's so 1990.
Finally, I guess I have to explain my line about npc alts as it went right over your head. The NPC alts are posting goonie hate because they fear goonie retaliation. Now that you have outed yourself as an anti-goon for no other reason than to coast on pubbie shouts of "Yeah! Down with Goonswarm!" all the way to Iceland, you're seeing the backlash of goons and pubbies alike. No matter what kind of apology you offer to the CSM, it's not hard to see through your self-serving turncoat politics and general badness.
Looks like you and D3 will be the only two members of the anti-goon CSM section that no one will pay attention to.
With much <3, ~Aiden
P.S. Didn't writing letters die last century? You should really consider catching up to us here in the modern world. XOXOXO
Oh give it up. You sound worse than I did when I was trying to act like a total nutter. You voted you lost your vote blah blah blah... Its done, if you are finding this situation to stressful please seek professional help.
Wait you were trying to act like madman?I think thats clear that you are...
You know split personalities and stuff..
|
The Chronophage
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 12:58:00 -
[594] - Quote
Vile rat wrote:
You see Issler that's the problem. You are coming from a CSM time (CSM 3) where events were formal, people had meetings that accomplished little, and the entire thing was one big crowd facing publicity stunt for the people involved. Before you even have sat down to work with the other members you've already taken a stand that you're going to do your best to make a lot of political hay out of attacking one of them. I'd take some time to work with the other people first before you try to pull this ****.
Goon tears best tears.
Good work Issler. While I am actually not too concerned about the whole "morality" of this issue, I do like to see the candidate I've voted for make goons cry like a baby. So much for their HTFU attitude, eh?
3 votes well spent. |
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
117
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 13:03:00 -
[595] - Quote
PleaseDONTblow Myship wrote: Wait you were trying to act like madman?I think thats clear that you are... You know split personalities and stuff..
Oh I'm sorry where you one of the people who believed the conspiracy theories? Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
PleaseDONTblow Myship
Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore
12
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:23:00 -
[596] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Yeah it's the "All of us sociopaths are together on this and you're a sick person Issler" post. Yeah dude you're fine.
Because erryone with different opinion is sociopath... |
Captain Jean-Luc Picard
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:33:00 -
[597] - Quote
The thread totally derailed after Page 6... |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1945
|
Posted - 2012.03.30 20:44:00 -
[598] - Quote
Aiden Andraste wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:Please show a single anti-goon post I've made. I support the goons as a part of the Eve sandbox. I've even been a goon. I've repeatedly posted my position that the goons are a proper part of Eve. What I am against is extremely poor judgement in public by someone that has a position of influence in Eve.
If you think I control the NPC alts and I'm driving the anti-goon sentiment then I would suggest you resume taking you space madness meds because the madness is back.
So keep on misrepresenting my position, but it won't get you anything in the end.
Oh, and work on your tense, "was" happened already, like the mistake I made asking the other CSM to do something I didn't have the right to ask them and what I've apologized for. "Are" means I'm doing it now, which I'm not.
Issler
Dear Issler, Alright, fair enough. There's no specific instances of anti-goonism in your posts. You still jumped on the bandwagon as soon as possible in order to promote anti-Mittani schtick in your bid to ride the wave of anti-goonism that the majority of EVE paosters share. But hey, if you're writing sensationalist stuff about me and my 'space-madness' then all is fair. Oh, and picking apart my grammar instead of addressing my valid points? C'mon, that's so 1990. Finally, I guess I have to explain my line about npc alts as it went right over your head. The NPC alts are posting goonie hate because they fear goonie retaliation. Now that you have outed yourself as an anti-goon for no other reason than to coast on pubbie shouts of "Yeah! Down with Goonswarm!" all the way to Iceland, you're seeing the backlash of goons and pubbies alike. No matter what kind of apology you offer to the CSM, it's not hard to see through your self-serving turncoat politics and general badness. Looks like you and D3 will be the only two members of the anti-goon CSM section that no one will pay attention to. With much <3, ~Aiden P.S. Didn't writing letters die last century? You should really consider catching up to us here in the modern world. XOXOXO
So I'll start with the grammar. I actually thought you meant I was still doing what you accused me of and what I had stopped doing and apologized for. If that wasn't your intent, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to attack your grammar, but what I thought you were saying. I was taught English in the same AZ schools that taught Dan Quayle that potato has an "e" at the end. We actually had spelling flash cards that showed it that way! So I am no grammar expert! So it looks like I got that wrong, sorry about that.
As for the anti-goon bandwagon thing, my reaction has NOTHING to do with the goons, it has to do with a single prominent in Eve drunken asshat taking a joke already in poor taste over the line. I'd have taken the same stand if the person was in my own corp. If I had done something so lame I would have immediately apologized, resigned completely from the CSM, not just the chair, stepped down as CEO of my alliance and corp and never consider running again. The I would have prepared for the perma-ban I would have expected to see.
So many folks seem to be unable to separate mittens the person and the goons, they should be two very different things.
Issler
|
Wolodymyr
Breaking Ambitions
106
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:15:00 -
[599] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Please show a single anti-goon post I've made.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=29569&find=unread
Issler Dainze wrote:Have you stopped beating your wife in the wormholes you hate so much? Dunno if that is specifically anti goon or now, but it definitely shows a lot of personal bias before this whole mess got started.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard wrote:The thread totally derailed after Page 6... I think it got pretty good again around page 12. |
None ofthe Above
160
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 19:31:00 -
[600] - Quote
Darius III wrote:I am very much PRO Hisec. I did incursion interdiction because I feel CCP taking too long to fix the problem-so I did it myself. I also asked CCP to limit peoples ability to kill every incursion at once and remove this content as I think that is unfair as well. It is against my poicy to claim responsibility for anything and I think thgat the CSM works as a team.... Also last year I was an alternate, this year I am a full member. I have made contributions regarding war decs, suicide ganking, gone against several things that are in discussion currently. I will have many positions and issues that I take up as the year goes by.
PD I did not actually go fishing while in Iceland. I claimed that as a troll in my campaign, but secretly I was in the meetings-D3
So wait...
You are not as useless as you represented yourself to be?
You got elected as a joke candidate... but now that you are there are going to betray your constituency and serve as a responsible and competent CSM?
That's a scam and troll of EPIC proportions! Hats off to you dude.
It is going to take a little while to get used to, though. Hope you don't take offense that I presume bad faith in just about anything you do for at least a little while.
|
|
Ayla Hanaya
Hellbound Turkeys Alliance of Abandoned Cybernetic Rejects
1
|
Posted - 2012.03.31 21:21:00 -
[601] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I want to ride this wave of anti-goon sentiment right to a CSM Chair, because there is no way in hell I will get it any other way.
Really... between you, Darius and Frying Pan, this is getting out of hand. Reading your posts makes me think you would like for RL consequences to be placed on Alexander. WTF is wrong with you people. Admittedly only read the first 5 pages, 'cause after that i realized the only lines I was gonna see from Issler and Darius was "The apology wasn't enough, throw the book at him" which even then I doubt you would be satisfied. Your apparent lack of communication with other CSM members before coming out and publicly damning the CSM Chair suggests that you are trying to use this to elevate yourself at the expense of the person who was wronged... I am dissapoint
GET. OUT. ~ 10.058 ~ A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players. Bring on CSM8.
NEVER STOP POASTING
|
Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
129
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 00:04:00 -
[602] - Quote
Ayla Hanaya wrote: Really... between you, Darius and Frying Pan, this is getting out of hand. Reading your posts makes me think you would like for RL consequences to be placed on Alexander. WTF is wrong with you people.
I have never said the X-Chairman should have RL consequences, I have posted someone else's post with laws in it to show that people where taking it to far. The loss of the CSM was fair for his behavior and lets face it that's just politics, personally I believe the ban was going too far.
Its a game no one should have RL consequences. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |
Ayla Hanaya
Hellbound Turkeys Alliance of Abandoned Cybernetic Rejects
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 00:20:00 -
[603] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Ayla Hanaya wrote: Really... between you, Darius and Frying Pan, this is getting out of hand. Reading your posts makes me think you would like for RL consequences to be placed on Alexander. WTF is wrong with you people.
I have never said the X-Chairman should have RL consequences, I have posted someone else's post with laws in it to show that people where taking it to far. The loss of the CSM was fair for his behavior and lets face it that's just politics, personally I believe the ban was going too far. Its a game no one should have RL consequences.
Fair point. Like I said, I only read about 5 pages into it. As long as you realize the separation between in game and RL, then all is good.
~ 10.058 ~ A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players. Bring on CSM8.
NEVER STOP POASTING
|
cerbus
Caldari Prime Pony Club
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 08:33:00 -
[604] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:We all know what really went on in CSM Skype.
Trebor was sitting behind his dungeon master screen, rolls some dice.
Seleene is yelling about how he's casting heal spells on mittani's wizard.
Trebor calmly turns to mittani "About your wizard dude"
"He..."
"He didn't make it."
Personally, I'd want to make sure everyone had signed their NDA too.
i want to consume you so that I absorb some of your power.
inferno vid 1/5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJWGYagVXyc |
Jacob Staffuer
State War Academy Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 03:13:00 -
[605] - Quote
Goons are passe. |
Soon Shin
Caucasian Culture Club Narwhals Ate My Duck
74
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 03:21:00 -
[606] - Quote
Do you mean "We" as in the CSM or just you? As far as I can tell you don't seem to have an intention of getting along with other CSM members. Times have changed, you are a relic of old times. CSM does not need your silliness around here. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
408
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 05:38:00 -
[607] - Quote
Soon Shin wrote:Do you mean "We" as in the CSM or just you? As far as I can tell you don't seem to have an intention of getting along with other CSM members. Beautifully put.
I do hope, though, that the CSM is able to work together to embetter EVE. If you start churning out pants it will be quite a pity. Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes
Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1961
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 05:56:00 -
[608] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Soon Shin wrote:Do you mean "We" as in the CSM or just you? As far as I can tell you don't seem to have an intention of getting along with other CSM members. Beautifully put. I do hope, though, that the CSM is able to work together to embetter EVE. If you start churning out pants it will be quite a pity.
So I have a rule. I block any goon that uses "pants" in a post to me.
Issler |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1961
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 05:57:00 -
[609] - Quote
Soon Shin wrote:Do you mean "We" as in the CSM or just you? As far as I can tell you don't seem to have an intention of getting along with other CSM members. Times have changed, you are a relic of old times. CSM does not need your silliness around here.
I like both Narwhales and ducks so you leave me conflicted.......
Issler |
Harvister
Immortalis Silens Intrepid Crossing
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 10:04:00 -
[610] - Quote
Fascinating! |
|
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.11 16:42:00 -
[611] - Quote
To OP: For Christ's sake! He was standing on a stage drunk, while wearing a ******* wizard-hat. He said something stupid, and regretted it and apologized afterwards. You guys are portraying him out as a monster, a sociopath without limits and a person that wishes nothing else upon others than agony and misery. That is kinda offensive as well, isn't it? You're probably a perfect individual yourself, that never do mistakes. Oh wait.. Aren't you supposed to be in the kitchen? |
Psichotic
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 00:00:00 -
[612] - Quote
Mugged Yougot wrote:You guys are portraying him out as a monster, a sociopath without limits and a person that wishes nothing else upon others than agony and misery. That is kinda offensive as well, isn't it?
He acts like a sociopath in Eve, as he, himself has stated:
The only question is should he be allowed to act like a sadist in Eve and not be judged that way as a person? And to that I say to whatever percentage of his time he devotes to being a sociopath and a sadist, that is the extent to which he is a sociopath and a sadist. You must have some level of psychopathy to find a topic mala in se to be funny - drunk or not (in fact drunk is even worse since it is behavior as a result of lowering your guard and showing what you really think).
quot=Mugged Yougot]For Christ's sake! He was standing on a stage drunk, while wearing a ******* wizard-hat.[/quote] Again, Mittani spoke to that very point:
Mugged Yougot wrote: He said something stupid, and regretted it and apologized afterwards.
I will answer that with a quote from the aggrieved party:
The Wis wrote: [21:30:50] The Wis > Ok.. Well that is nice. Hmm.. wait.. If i do kill my self they might arrest him and prosicute him since he is in the US.. That would really be bad for him. [21:31:01] The Wis > Just kidding of course but a thought.
Anyone who has the thought of killing themselves to get back at another person has been pushed too far.
It occurs to me Mittani better hope that kid does not harm himself. If he does the police - the real life local police - may very well knock on his door. That goes the wrong way and he will be in jail learning a whole new definition of the word "butthurt".
So yeah, I'd say this is a serious issue.
|
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 01:43:00 -
[613] - Quote
Psichotic wrote:He acts like a sociopath in Eve, as he, himself has stated: The only question is should he be allowed to act like a sadist in Eve and not be judged that way as a person? And to that I say to whatever percentage of his time he devotes to being a sociopath and a sadist, that is the extent to which he is a sociopath and a sadist. You must have some level of psychopathy to find a topic mala in se to be funny - drunk or not (in fact drunk is even worse since it is behavior as a result of lowering your guard and showing what you really think). Yes, he should. Why? Because it's a ******* computer game. I don't see people passing judgement on MW 4 players just because they like to shoot and blow apart people. It's quite amusing how people are screaming about keeping rl and ig separated, yet they judge the personality based on a player's actions in the game.
I don't really understand why you post that quote? It's rather counterproductive for your case. He realizes he has only himself to blame for getting drunk before the presentation. He takes it all on his own cape and accepts his punishment. Very "sociopathic" behavior, I must say. This guy must be a monster!!!
Psichotic wrote:The Wis wrote: [21:30:50] The Wis > Ok.. Well that is nice. Hmm.. wait.. If i do kill my self they might arrest him and prosicute him since he is in the US.. That would really be bad for him. [21:31:01] The Wis > Just kidding of course but a thought.
Anyone who has the thought of killing themselves to get back at another person has been pushed too far. It occurs to me Mittani better hope that kid does not harm himself. If he does the police - the real life local police - may very well knock on his door. That goes the wrong way and he will be in jail learning a whole new definition of the word "butthurt".So yeah, I'd say this is a serious issue. So it's ok for a person to joke about him killing himself because of another person, but it's not ok to joke about said persons commiting suicide? Both are ok, because they are ******* jokes, and it seems like the only people who understand this are the ones involved.
|
Ayla Hanaya
Hellbound Turkeys Alliance of Abandoned Cybernetic Rejects
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 03:07:00 -
[614] - Quote
Stop beating a dead horse, cmon, the man accepted his guilt, gave up ALL his iskies to the fellow who was wronged, (who, BTW, DID NOT EVEN KNOW ABOUT THIS SH*T going on in the forums or at FanFest.) which if you would read the original apology, Mittani did not hide behind his character, and owned up, (which I'm sure many individuals who play EVE have tried to duck responsibility for similar things before, perhaps not involving EVE but the idea is the same and makes those individuals hypocrites), and the chat logs where Liang talked to this individual, he had no clue, and had been quietly mining ice and didn't even remember the Mittani in particular. Odds are, when he recieved to the tune of 8+BN isk in his account from The Mittani, he had no clue what that was all about. Please, let the thread die, and go back to spaceships. Its done and over, get over it.
TL;DR: The horse is dead, and is starting to smell rotten. Read this blog and actually ABSORB the info in it into your thick skulls, instead of chopping it into contextless quotes to keep your RIGHTEOUS RAEG going, and drop the thread. The Mittani - Hero? ~ 10.058 ~ A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players. Bring on CSM8. ~~~CSM8: VOTE MITTENS FOR CSM CHAIR~~~ NEVER STOP POASTING
|
Psichotic
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 05:44:00 -
[615] - Quote
Mugged Yougot wrote:So it's ok for a person to joke about him killing himself because of another person, but it's not ok to joke about said persons commiting suicide? No, it's not OK for someone to joke about someone killing themselves under any circumstances I can think of.
Mugged Yougot wrote:It's quite amusing how people are screaming about keeping rl and ig separated, yet they judge the personality based on a player's actions in the game. A game is like any other social setting, how you act in the social environment is a reflection upon you as a person. Indeed, an online setting is a particularly uninhibited expression of yourself because we are sitting at home in our PJs. If you're a griefer in an MMO, while you may not be guilty of anything per se, I wouldn't want you hanging around my family.
Is there a separation between your online personality and your offline personality? Human psychology isn't that clean-cut. There is a level of separation and a level of congruence. The extent of which depends on the person. In a case where someone spends a significant amount of time online I think there can be a great deal of bleed-over.
|
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
186
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 06:10:00 -
[616] - Quote
Psichotic wrote:Mugged Yougot wrote:So it's ok for a person to joke about him killing himself because of another person, but it's not ok to joke about said persons commiting suicide? No, it's not OK for someone to joke about someone killing themselves under any circumstances I can think of. Mugged Yougot wrote:It's quite amusing how people are screaming about keeping rl and ig separated, yet they judge the personality based on a player's actions in the game. A game is like any other social setting, how you act in the social environment is a reflection upon you as a person. Indeed, an online setting is a particularly uninhibited expression of yourself because we are sitting at home in our PJs. If you're a griefer in an MMO, while you may not be guilty of anything per se, I wouldn't want you hanging around my family. Is there a separation between your online personality and your offline personality? Human psychology isn't that clean-cut. There is a level of separation and a level of congruence. The extent of which depends on the person. In a case where someone spends a significant amount of time online I think there can be a great deal of bleed-over.
Welp, guess 75% of Eve needs to be locked up in order to protect us from society. |
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 07:18:00 -
[617] - Quote
Psichotic wrote:No, it's not OK for someone to joke about someone killing themselves under any circumstances I can think of. Not even when it involves clowns? But from joke to shotgun, and kinda back to joke again.. Have you never heard anyone say "someone please kill me/end my misery/along those lines" ? I have heard it quite a few times, especially when I start singing (hmm.. I'm starting to see a pattern here).. But yeah, back to shotgun: I think you got my point.
Psichotic wrote:A game is like any other social setting, how you act in the social environment is a reflection upon you as a person. Indeed, an online setting is a particularly uninhibited expression of yourself because we are sitting at home in our PJs. If you're a griefer in an MMO, while you may not be guilty of anything per se, I wouldn't want you hanging around my family. I used to be a gamer embracing the light side of every single game I played. I often went into a game with the mindset of being "evil" but ended up being "good" pretty fast. But then I started playing SW:TOR (quit playing it as well) and now I'm embracing being a ****. Would you say that my personality changed over night just because I started playing a new game?
Psichotic wrote:Is there a separation between your online personality and your offline personality? Human psychology isn't that clean-cut. There is a level of separation and a level of congruence. The extent of which depends on the person. In a case where someone spends a significant amount of time online I think there can be a great deal of bleed-over. Obviously, if you are a cynical person you have an easier time being a **** in games, but that doesn't necessary mean you want people to kill themselves just because they got different goals and ambitions than you.. You are trying to tug this in all different directions in order to prove that Mittani is at least a borderline sociopath, but you are dealing in absolutes. There is a grayzone between good and evil, you know? |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1929
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 15:13:00 -
[618] - Quote
Mugged Yougot wrote:]Obviously, if you are a cynical person you have an easier time being a **** in games, but that doesn't necessary mean you want people to kill themselves just because they got different goals and ambitions than you.. You are trying to tug this in all different directions in order to prove that Mittani is at least a borderline sociopath, but you are dealing in absolutes. There is a grayzone between good and evil, you know?
Look, Mittani's player probably isn't actually a borderline sociopath. He had a job as a legal clerk or something so he must be able to work in an office in some manner. But what Mittani's player is responsible for to some degree is the actions of his alliance of thousands which almost certainly includes any number of borderline sociopaths who have in the past proved quite capable of significant rl abuse, harrassment, bullying, criminality and general nutcase behaviour on the internet. The "great leader" of goonswarm says "harrass this guy to suicide" and a whole bunch of under-socialized basement kids drunk on malicious bullying and edgy troll fever are going to start looking for ways to make the target commit "suicide" for real.
We've seen the extents that goonswarm will go. We've had the reports of them spamming rl female players with obscene material to personal and workplace addresses. We've seen them make signatures to mock the bereaved father of a road-accident victim. We've seen utterly horrendous examples of harrassment and stalking from these guys. So the leader cannot just wipe his hands and claim he has no responsibility.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
ConXtionS
Jian Products Engineering Group Nulli Secunda
20
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 18:22:00 -
[619] - Quote
It was goons who took this OUT OF THE GAME and INTO REAL LIFE.
I am sickened that you guys keep saying "mittens made one drunken mistake"....
IT WAS A MISTAKE THAT WAS PLANNED FOR MONTHS!
Again, I call for the CSM to complain to CCP and read every mail from goons to see how much HARASSMENT is really out there. I call for the BANNING of anyone who behaves this way and support DARIUS because he wants the game to be JUST A GAME!
People pay for coms, stay out of their stuff.
People pay for email stay out of their stuff.
and people PAY FOR THIS GAME...
If you dont want to be treated like a goon consider NOT ACTING LIKE A GOON!
Leave people alone and stop all the "meta gaming" crap.
BAN EVERYONE WHO BREAKS THE RULES!
|
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
349
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 18:33:00 -
[620] - Quote
Jacob Staffuer wrote:Goons are passe.
^^This^^
And from the looks of it, they know it.
[/necro]
In irae, veritas. |
|
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 19:47:00 -
[621] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Look, Mittani's player probably isn't actually a borderline sociopath. He had a job as a legal clerk or something so he must be able to work in an office in some manner. But what Mittani's player is responsible for to some degree is the actions of his alliance of thousands which almost certainly includes any number of borderline sociopaths who have in the past proved quite capable of significant rl abuse, harrassment, bullying, criminality and general nutcase behaviour on the internet. The "great leader" of goonswarm says "harrass this guy to suicide" and a whole bunch of under-socialized basement kids drunk on malicious bullying and edgy troll fever are going to start looking for ways to make the target commit "suicide" for real. Care to provide proof of you claims? And even it's true, you can not blame and individual's real life actions on his digital corporation-founder.
Constantine wrote:We've seen the extents that goonswarm will go. We've had the reports of them spamming rl female players with obscene material to personal and workplace addresses. We've seen them make signatures to mock the bereaved father of a road-accident victim. We've seen utterly horrendous examples of harrassment and stalking from these guys. So the leader cannot just wipe his hands and claim he has no responsibility.
If this is true, then I will rest my case. Please provide proof. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1931
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 19:54:00 -
[622] - Quote
Mugged Yougot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Look, Mittani's player probably isn't actually a borderline sociopath. He had a job as a legal clerk or something so he must be able to work in an office in some manner. But what Mittani's player is responsible for to some degree is the actions of his alliance of thousands which almost certainly includes any number of borderline sociopaths who have in the past proved quite capable of significant rl abuse, harrassment, bullying, criminality and general nutcase behaviour on the internet. The "great leader" of goonswarm says "harrass this guy to suicide" and a whole bunch of under-socialized basement kids drunk on malicious bullying and edgy troll fever are going to start looking for ways to make the target commit "suicide" for real. Care to provide proof of you claims? And even it's true, you can not blame and individual's real life actions on his digital corporation-founder. Constantine wrote:We've seen the extents that goonswarm will go. We've had the reports of them spamming rl female players with obscene material to personal and workplace addresses. We've seen them make signatures to mock the bereaved father of a road-accident victim. We've seen utterly horrendous examples of harrassment and stalking from these guys. So the leader cannot just wipe his hands and claim he has no responsibility.
If this is true, then I will rest my case. Please provide proof.
Research smoske, lady scarlet, lead back over these threads in jita park and go take a look at the assembly hall topic calling for future anonimity of csm candidates to protect them from rl harrassment.
Currently the goon wiki has my rl picture alongside the accusation I'm a child sex abuser.
Not sure how much more "evidence" you need of these things really.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Mugged Yougot
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 20:03:00 -
[623] - Quote
Wow.. I didn't know it was that bad.. Yeah, Mittani should keep his members in line, at least to a certain degree. |
VCBee 180
State War Academy Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 20:25:00 -
[624] - Quote
why are all the RvB posters gigantic babies? i thought you guys were based on the concept of constant fighting or something |
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
259
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 20:51:00 -
[625] - Quote
VCBee 180 wrote:why are all the RvB posters gigantic babies? i thought you guys were based on the concept of constant fighting or something
Maybe they can differentiate a game from real life attacks.
|
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1931
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 22:12:00 -
[626] - Quote
VCBee 180 wrote:why are all the RvB posters gigantic babies? i thought you guys were based on the concept of constant fighting or something
Fighting in-game. With spaceships. IN A GAME.
You goonswarm people seem to think that harrassing people in real life is an appropriate way of playing a spaceship game and it really isn't.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Ayla Hanaya
Hellbound Turkeys Alliance of Abandoned Cybernetic Rejects
2
|
Posted - 2012.04.12 23:53:00 -
[627] - Quote
Dead horse thread is dead. Though in retrospect, Mittani is the king of controversy as far as EvE goes, so he seems to have beaten all records for controversy ever set, holy **** guys, INCARNA didnt have as many players tied in a knot. Why don't you go shoot a statue or something, cause this stuff is getting tired. Fanfest is over, hell, Mittani is halfway through his ban, and youre still raging about it. Find some new controversy, please, cause this is the tear factory to end all tear factories. ~ 10.058 ~ A Mittani-less CSM7 does not represent the players. Bring on CSM8. ~~~CSM8: VOTE MITTENS FOR CSM CHAIR~~~ NEVER STOP POASTING
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Zmaster BloodLust
BloodLust Enterprises Apocalypse Now.
6
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 00:08:00 -
[628] - Quote
he made the mistake... he apologised...he steped down from the CSM... wht more do u ppl wnt?? just drop it already... we all know hes an *******... all happened, all was solved...
move on kidos!!
Regards, Z |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
186
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 01:32:00 -
[629] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Mugged Yougot wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Look, Mittani's player probably isn't actually a borderline sociopath. He had a job as a legal clerk or something so he must be able to work in an office in some manner. But what Mittani's player is responsible for to some degree is the actions of his alliance of thousands which almost certainly includes any number of borderline sociopaths who have in the past proved quite capable of significant rl abuse, harrassment, bullying, criminality and general nutcase behaviour on the internet. The "great leader" of goonswarm says "harrass this guy to suicide" and a whole bunch of under-socialized basement kids drunk on malicious bullying and edgy troll fever are going to start looking for ways to make the target commit "suicide" for real. Care to provide proof of you claims? And even it's true, you can not blame and individual's real life actions on his digital corporation-founder. Constantine wrote:We've seen the extents that goonswarm will go. We've had the reports of them spamming rl female players with obscene material to personal and workplace addresses. We've seen them make signatures to mock the bereaved father of a road-accident victim. We've seen utterly horrendous examples of harrassment and stalking from these guys. So the leader cannot just wipe his hands and claim he has no responsibility.
If this is true, then I will rest my case. Please provide proof. Research smoske, lady scarlet, lead back over these threads in jita park and go take a look at the assembly hall topic calling for future anonimity of csm candidates to protect them from rl harrassment. Currently the goon wiki has my rl picture alongside the accusation I'm a child sex abuser. Not sure how much more "evidence" you need of these things really.
Hey Jade, how does one get work as a virtual wh*re? (didn't know that word was censored) I know that you have lots of experience in this industry.
FWIW, your pic is really creepy. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1931
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 01:50:00 -
[630] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote: Hey Jade, how does one get work as a virtual wh*re? (didn't know that word was censored) I know that you have lots of experience in this industry.
Still carrying on the goonswarm party line eh? Keep smearing and it might cover up the embarrassing truths about your own behaviour.
Quote:FWIW, your pic is really creepy.
I'm pretty sure I'm better looking then you are.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
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Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
259
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 01:59:00 -
[631] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote: how does one get work as a virtual wh*re?
Stick to scamming and stealing. I don't think you are social enough to make money in any descent profession. |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
187
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 03:21:00 -
[632] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Lapine Davion wrote: how does one get work as a virtual wh*re?
Stick to scamming and stealing. I don't think you are social enough to make money in any other profession.
I'm pretty good with words when I want to be. But I'm terrible at scamming.
And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel".
What "embarrassing truths" about my own behavior? |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1932
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 03:29:00 -
[633] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote:[And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel".
You really haven't.
La maison was a nightclub, all the best pilots in new eden attended in the early years of eve. You know, the time before the goons turned up
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
322
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 03:41:00 -
[634] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:[And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel". You really haven't. La maison was a nightclub, all the best pilots in new eden attended in the early years of eve. You know, the time before the goons turned up
It was a nasty, but still nicer game back then.
CSM7 Skype Leak
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Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
187
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 03:46:00 -
[635] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:[And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel". You really haven't. La maison was a nightclub, all the best pilots in new eden attended in the early years of eve. You know, the time before the goons turned up It was a nasty, but still nicer game back then.
Yes, it sure is a shame that times have changed, huh? |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1932
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 03:47:00 -
[636] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:[And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel". You really haven't. La maison was a nightclub, all the best pilots in new eden attended in the early years of eve. You know, the time before the goons turned up It was a nasty, but still nicer game back then.
Well it was a brutal red in tooth and claw PVP game with lots of ingame intrigues and betrayals and backstabbing right enough - but it was a purer environment in many ways, with people not so inclined to take their greviences into the realm of ooc harrassment and rl bullying.
I think it is part of the goon agenda to "unwrite" the early history of the game and make believe eve didn't really start until they arrived - a common tactic for an extremist imperialist entity seeking dominance over a cultural medium.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
187
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 04:46:00 -
[637] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Revolution Rising wrote:Jade Constantine wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:[And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel". You really haven't. La maison was a nightclub, all the best pilots in new eden attended in the early years of eve. You know, the time before the goons turned up It was a nasty, but still nicer game back then. Well it was a brutal red in tooth and claw PVP game with lots of ingame intrigues and betrayals and backstabbing right enough - but it was a purer environment in many ways, with people not so inclined to take their greviences into the realm of ooc harrassment and rl bullying. I think it is part of the goon agenda to "unwrite" the early history of the game and make believe eve didn't really start until they arrived - a common tactic for an extremist imperialist entity seeking dominance over a cultural medium.
Those sure were innocent times. Before the dirty Goons came and ruined your game with their intrigues and betrayals and backstabbing.
Jesus Christ, you sure do love using a whole lotta words, don't you? All I've said was that Goons came in and changed the game. You just seem mad because you "claimed" this game first.
Edit: Face it. Eve has more subscribers, more incredible stories, and more general interest because of what Goonswarm has brought to the game. I would sure be interested to see a poll about which stories it was that brought each player to the game.
Edit edit: And I'm not saying that all these people are pro-Goon, either. Plenty of people joined up because they heard about what the Goons were doing and wanted to fight them. All those people likely wouldn't be here if it weren't for them. |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
187
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 04:52:00 -
[638] - Quote
ITT, extremist imperialist entity = people playing a video game wanting to have fun |
Vetorept Fera
Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
31
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 05:16:00 -
[639] - Quote
space politics In pace requiescat |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 05:26:00 -
[640] - Quote
Vetorept Fera wrote:space politics fuckin space politics, man. |
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Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
188
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 05:56:00 -
[641] - Quote
Jade Constantine wrote:Lapine Davion wrote:[And Jade, I've seen you post before that you ran a "space brothel". You really haven't. La maison was a nightclub, all the best pilots in new eden attended in the early years of eve. You know, the time before the goons turned up
Ah, I read a bit more into La Maison. I think the reason that Goonswarm hates you so much is because of your connection to BoB. And you're still upset about that guy that died. You know, Goons had a guy who killed himself. He was well loved in the community, too. They still make fun of him.
Face it, the only way Goons would go away is if CCP killed the sandbox. So you would have to kill off the game you enjoy to get them to leave. |
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1933
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 09:50:00 -
[642] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote:ITT, extremist imperialist entity = people playing a video game wanting to have fun
That is a dishonest summary. Its not people wanting to play a video game wanting to have fun that's the issue. The problem is people prepared to use RL harrassment, e-stalking and bullying to attempt to "win" said game. Goons play by different rules to traditional eve players; believing that attacks against the out of game identity of players is a proper means of playing the game. Hence "extremist". The imperialism comes from wanting to make their culture the dominant one (listen to Mittani's own rhetoric) - I'm really not saying anything here the goonswarm doesn't already rejoice in.
Lapine Davion wrote:Ah, I read a bit more into La Maison. I think the reason that Goonswarm hates you so much is because of your connection to BoB.
I didn't really have that much of a connection to BoB truth be told. I knew players there, had good corp standings with Reikoku for early game reasons. And I helped encourage proto BoB (the corps and alliances that would later form it) to get involved with the Great Northern War to help me get revenge on Pheonix Alliance in Venal of course. What goonswarm hates me for in this respect is that I publicly spoke up against the method of their final victory (the alliance name theft and squatting as a means of combat). I did (and still do) consider it poor gameplay that a player group's identity can be so easily removed from the game without the neccessity to actually complete a war in space.
By concluding the conflict with BoB by simply disbanding their alliance I think the goons robbed themselves (and Eve as a whole) from a proper conclusion to the story and made a mockery of Eve the space opera in favour of eve the metagaming drama pit.
Now of course, I've also stood up against those mocking people in their RL grief, or for those who have been bullied out of the game, or indeed for those who have had their RL professions dragged to these forums as metagame ammunition in the form of RL personal attacks.
Does anyone really need to know that SirMolle repairs central heating systems (or whatever) for a living? Why should that be relevant to anyone playing a spaceship game? Why did we get the white collar vs blue collar supremacy nonsense in goons vs bob flamefests on coad? Does the fact that 5000 goons follow a legal clerk really make them individually superior to a couple of thousand players following a self-employed mechanic? What the hell really. Its surreal and sad.
Lapine Davion wrote: And you're still upset about that guy that died.
I flew with the guy about once in the GNW, he seemed a decent guy on comms. But whether I knew him well or not the fact remains that the mocking of a dead player is not appropriate behaviour for players of this game in my eyes. It would be more accurate to say I'm deeply disapproving of goons over this.
Lapine Davion wrote:You know, Goons had a guy who killed himself. He was well loved in the community, too. They still make fun of him.
Who is "they"? Not me or anyone in my alliance or anyone I consider in a good light in this game I assure you.
Lapine Davion wrote: Face it, the only way Goons would go away is if CCP killed the sandbox. So you would have to kill off the game you enjoy to get them to leave.
Well either that or if CCP introduced sterner rules against OOC harrassment, e-stalking, and general out of game bullying. If a couple of senior goons got caught up in that then its fairly likely the rest of the swarm would rage-quit in sympathy. Imagine if Mittani had been permanently banned fo the fanfest incident.
But again you need to understand.
I have zero issue with in-game actions the goons take in Eve Online. Ganking, scamming, 0.0 nonsense. Blobbing and napping anyone in sight. Whatever really. As long is it happens within the game rules its all fair.
What I dislike is those goons who take eve beyond the spaceship game into the realm of personal out of game harrassment and rl stalking of identities, workplaces, with the goal of driving people out of eve so they can "win" the metagame.
This is the stuff that needs to end. And this is the stuff CCP will need to intervene to prevent before somebody ends up dead over it.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
259
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 11:08:00 -
[643] - Quote
Revolution Rising wrote: It was a nasty, but still nicer game back then.
It was a game back then. What it has become isn't a game anymore.
|
Arkon Olacar
Imperial Guardians The Aurora Shadow
16
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 12:38:00 -
[644] - Quote
Oh god, why won't you stop? |
VCBee 180
State War Academy Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 15:42:00 -
[645] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Revolution Rising wrote: It was a nasty, but still nicer game back then.
It was a game back then. What it has become isn't a game anymore.
welp, we've got another poster absolutely obsessed with us. All you do is post about goons in CAOD and jita park, i pity you. |
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
189
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 15:55:00 -
[646] - Quote
Quote:Who is "they"? Not me or anyone in my alliance or anyone I consider in a good light in this game I assure you.
By "they" I meant Goons. And by the guy who killed himself, I meant RoyofCA. Who as I understand it was well liked. What I mean by all this is that Goons will make fun of whatever they want, especially if it will get a rise. |
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
351
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 16:33:00 -
[647] - Quote
You've brought this on yourselves.
That's how it works in the world of adults: Actions carry consequences, often far-reaching and unintended.
Welcome to the real world, pun intended!
In irae, veritas. |
None ofthe Above
168
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 16:37:00 -
[648] - Quote
Issler,
Any chance you could call for a lock on this thread?
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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
1935
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 17:24:00 -
[649] - Quote
Lapine Davion wrote:Quote:Who is "they"? Not me or anyone in my alliance or anyone I consider in a good light in this game I assure you. By "they" I meant Goons. And by the guy who killed himself, I meant RoyofCA. Who as I understand it was well liked. What I mean by all this is that Goons will make fun of whatever they want, especially if it will get a rise.
So you are defending the conduct of goons in mocking the RL death of an Eve player in an enemy alliance by pointing out that they also mock the RL suicide's of their friends?
Colour me unimpressed.
The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting! |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1981
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 17:57:00 -
[650] - Quote
None ofthe Above wrote:Issler,
Any chance you could call for a lock on this thread?
I will see what I can do, I think it has run its course. Thanks to the folks that understood why I felt I had to start it and again, sorry to the other CSM for how it might have been taken.
Issler |
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ISD Grossvogel
Community Communications Liaisons
58
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 18:17:00 -
[651] - Quote
Thread locked at the OP's request. ISD Grossvogel (ISD -ô-Ç-+-ü-ü-ä-+-¦-¦-+-î) Captain, Community Communication Liaisons (CCL) -Æ-+-+-+-+-é-æ-Ç -¦-Ç-â-+-+-ï -+-+ -¦-+-¦-+-+-+-¦-¦-¦-ü-é-¦-+-Ä -ü -+-¦-Ç-+-¦-¦-+-+ Interstellar Services Department |
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