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7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:21:00 - [391] Edited by: 7shining7one7 on 08/02/2009 01:21:27 Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 01:14:56 Originally by: 7shining7one7 well yeah, but then again.. when you factor in web and the immense dps it can dish out within antimatter range.. then that becomes less of an issue.. The dps of anti matter on rails awful and we both have webs while you have over double the rails tracking... Even pimped like you did the blaster setup it does less dps than my pulse/scorch fit and needs pg upgrades just to fit the giuns and t2 collision rig.....let alone a mwd or tank of any sort. i wouldn't say that.. with all 5 hardwirings and 4 heavies it ended up doing 1609dps with 20k armor and 90k ehp.. that's not too shabby.. if it fits a tracking disruptor and a web and let someone else do the pointing you can't dish out damage till it can hurt you back. which means you'd be entering a world of pain pretty quickly. anywho.. let's take a more reasonable 1100 dps hype then.. with a tracking disruptor, mwd, web, dual rep and dual cap injectors.. it'll still smoke you cause of that tracking disruptor.. just 1 tracking disruptor will render scorch completely useless.. either by reducing its tracking to tachyon class or by reducing it's optimal to 22.5km..
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:25:00 - [392] Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 01:26:05 Originally by: 7shining7one7 Originally by: Murina Originally by: 7shining7one7 well yeah, but then again.. when you factor in web and the immense dps it can dish out within antimatter range.. then that becomes less of an issue.. The dps of anti matter on rails awful and we both have webs while you have over double the rails tracking... Even pimped like you did the blaster setup it does less dps than my pulse/scorch fit and needs pg upgrades just to fit the guns and t2 collision rig.....let alone a mwd or tank of any sort. i wouldn't say that.. with all 5 hardwirings and 4 heavies it ended up doing 1609dps with 20k armor and 90k ehp.. that's not too shabby.. That is your blaster fit not the rail fit. The rail hype fit does way under 1000dps with antimatter has tracking so bad even with antimatter that your pulse with scorch needs to be tracking disrupted to get even close to as bad. And it needs pg modules just fit fit the guns and the dmg rig lol...
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:25:00 - [393] Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 01:21:17 Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 01:20:17 Originally by: Murina The dps of anti matter on rails awful and we both have webs while you have over double the rails tracking... Even pimped like you did the blaster setup it does less dps than my pulse/scorch fit and needs pg upgrades just to fit the guns and t2 collision rig.....let alone a mwd or tank of any sort. Originally by: 7shining7one7 also factor in a tracking disruptor II set on the baddon.. and you go from 0.03164 to 0.01582.. with scorch.. (if using a tracking speed script) or 22.5 optimal range with scorch if he's using optimal range disruption script.. that's f'ing nasty.. it's really not that hard to mess with an abaddon.. he's got enough to contend with, with only moderate dps, cap issues and lack of mobility.. Dude you start with more tracking so a TD on the rail hype is gonna hurt the hype more, and even with the TD on your pulse ship you have almost the same tracking as the rail hype that does not have a TD on it and is using non penalized ammo... well we're talking blaster setup, so the tracking disruptor is for the approach while you're mwd'ing you're denying the abaddon from dealing you damage unless it wants to meet you half way.. forget about the rail you don't need it then.
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:32:00 - [394] Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 01:32:22 Originally by: 7shining7one7 well we're talking blaster setup, so the tracking disruptor is for the approach while you're mwd'ing you're denying the abaddon from dealing you damage unless it wants to meet you half way.. forget about the rail you don't need it then. So now the abaddon needs to be TD'd on your approach to keep the dmg down?. Are we in a smallish ship (BCish) that can take advantage of the TD cos a BS will take ages to get close if its keeping its transversal high instead of just burning?.
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 01:55:00 - [395] Edited by: 7shining7one7 on 08/02/2009 01:56:30 Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 01:32:22 Originally by: 7shining7one7 well we're talking blaster setup, so the tracking disruptor is for the approach while you're mwd'ing you're denying the abaddon from dealing you damage unless it wants to meet you half way.. forget about the rail you don't need it then. So now the abaddon needs to be TD'd on your approach to keep the dmg down?. Are we in a smallish ship (BCish) that can take advantage of the TD cos a BS will take ages to get close if its keeping its transversal high instead of just burning?. what's the matter with just burning and reducing the optimal rendering scorch pretty useless till you get there.. i guess the point is amarr is far from overpowered.. if range seems to be your main issue then negate it..
fuxinos Caldari Guys 0f Sarcasm	Posted - 2009.02.08 02:09:00 - [396] Edited by: fuxinos on 08/02/2009 02:10:58 Originally by: Murina Edited by: Murina on 07/02/2009 13:47:33 Originally by: fuxinos But will CCP do all that, just to give 2 Races longrange capability, even if their not supposed to have longrange ships? Who says they are not supposed to have long range ships?, nobody decides that and if they do they can easily change their minds as they did when they gave the apoc a range bonus. Its odd how ppl say these available "ranges" and "roles" are set in stone AFTER their race ships get the buff.... Doesnt matter, the point is still up. I would expect you to be the first who says "shut up Caldariwhiner" if someone says Caldari have no shortrange ship.... Just get it, Gallente is all about shortrange like Caldari is damn all about long range... Cant you even see how the races are supposed to counter each other? If you demaned a Gallente longrangeship, i demaned a Caldari shortrangeship...
Captator Universal Securities	Posted - 2009.02.08 02:10:00 - [397] Just thought I could put up some other graphs: Megathron in red, Geddon in green, Abaddon in blue, Hyperion in cyan. All have: 3 damage mods faction close range ammo max skills full gank drone loadout (mega/geddon 5 ogre, hype 4 ogre, abaddon 2/2/1 h/m/l thermal). no implants no weapon rigs Target is a myrmidon, standard tank lows, 0 m/s transversal, range marker is placed on point where gallente dps first drops below amarr dps. As above but with null/scorch loaded, range marker is placed on point where gallente dps first drops below amarr dps. With transversal ~200m/s As first graph (faction ammo), but with the transversal maxed, range marker is placed on point of peak dps from megathron (hyperion's lack of a tracking bonus really hinders it here, if you add a tracking comp it will do better damage than the amarr ships out to about 24km). As 2nd graph (null/scorch), but with transversal maxed, range marker is placed on point of peak dps from megathron (hyperion's lack of a tracking bonus really hinders it here, if you add a tracking comp it will do better damage than the amarr ships out to about 29km). As is obvious from these graphs, Gallente have absolute damage superiority inside 10km, and when using long range ammo, have damage superiority upto around 18km. When transversal is introduced the dps applied starts to go heavily in favour of the high tracking blasters on the megathron, out to about 25 km with close range faction ammo, and 32km with t2 long range ammo. If the Hyperion was fit with a tracking computer the dps applied would exceed amarr ships out to 24 and 29 km respectively. Using hybrid ambit rigs would increase this superiority range further, but all of these fits are trimarked for realism.
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 02:19:00 - [398] Edited by: 7shining7one7 on 08/02/2009 02:19:42 well.. not much needs saying after that
Arcelian	Posted - 2009.02.08 02:58:00 - [399] Who posted saying crystals affect tracking? I know I read that somewhere. And lasers pwn you infidels, get used to it. har har.
Theron Gyrow Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.02.08 03:03:00 - [400] Originally by: Captator With transversal ~200m/s That's with about double of that, with BS going full tilt in one direction and the BC likewise in the other (perhaps with a speed module on?). Please correct for that. -- Gradient forum

Letifer Deus 181st Legion	Posted - 2009.02.08 04:02:00 - [401] -why are they going side by side in opposite directions? -webs exist. don't just give me that 10km and less webbed crap. nearly all PvP is gang related and thus almost any target will be double webbed (if not more) -no one uses null because swapping back and fourth between null and navy AM during a fight is extremely impractical. scorch can be switched to instantly. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Brought to you by the letter ARRR!"
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 04:10:00 - [402] Originally by: Arcelian Who posted saying crystals affect tracking? I know I read that somewhere. And lasers pwn you infidels, get used to it. har har. scorch has a 0.75x tracking multiplier.
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.02.08 06:03:00 - [403] Originally by: Murina And Beams with aurora 205 x 325 = 62525 and i didn't even try hard to boost the dmg..... NULL = OPTIMAL 11 FALLOFF 16, Tracking on a nuetron hyperion 0.04059 MF = OPTIMAL 15 FALLOFF 10, Tracking on mega pulse baddon 0.04219 You still don't understand the complaint do you?
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 10:06:00 - [404] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: Murina NULL = OPTIMAL 11 FALLOFF 16, Tracking on a nuetron hyperion 0.04059 MF = OPTIMAL 15 FALLOFF 10, Tracking on mega pulse baddon 0.04219 You still don't understand the complaint do you? Well it seems to me that you want ppl to match ammo by tracking penalty instead of the comparative range they give their systems... Originally by: 7shining7one7 Lasers get reduced dmg inside optimal if you are approaching with 0 transversal Originally by: NightmareX Yes i support 7shining7one7 in EVERY ing way
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 10:16:00 - [405] Originally by: Captator As is obvious from these graphs, Gallente have absolute damage superiority inside 10km, and when using long range ammo, have damage superiority upto around 18km. Dude your graphs are not very good and you cannot say that blasters have dmg superiority out to 18km cos they do not unless amarr are using the wrong ammo. Your null/scorch range marker is right but why would the amarr ship use scorch under 15km?, we both know they would not they would use MF and it out damages null by far at 15km. Originally by: 7shining7one7 Lasers get reduced dmg inside optimal if you are approaching with 0 transversal Originally by: NightmareX Yes i support 7shining7one7 in EVERY ing way
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 10:31:00 - [406] Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 10:34:44 Originally by: Letifer Deus -why are they going side by side in opposite directions? So it makes lasers look worse than they are, its the same reason he is using scorch vs null comparisons instead on MF vs null even tough MF gives a very similar optimal/fall off compared to null. Originally by: Letifer Deus -webs exist. don't just give me that 10km and less webbed crap. nearly all PvP is gang related and thus almost any target will be double webbed (if not more) 13km overheated bud, and you are right what you say although these guys only pitch the "amarr are gang ships" line when it suits their purposes and on this occasion it does not. Originally by: Letifer Deus -no one uses null because swapping back and fourth between null and navy AM during a fight is extremely impractical. scorch can be switched to instantly. Null is used when you are shooting at summat over 9-10km but MF is much better at that range, a point that was avoided. Originally by: 7shining7one7 Lasers get reduced dmg inside optimal if you are approaching with 0 transversal Originally by: NightmareX Yes i support 7shining7one7 in EVERY ing way
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 10:37:00 - [407] Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 10:40:57 Captator, it would also be nice to know the exact fits on all ships as 3 mag stab mega is not very descriptive.
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 10:48:00 - [408] Originally by: 7shining7one7 what's the matter with just burning and reducing the optimal rendering scorch pretty useless till you get there.. i guess the point is amarr is far from overpowered.. if range seems to be your main issue then negate it.. Bud if you need the amarr BS to be tracking disrupted just to stand a chance against it: 1. That shows its to powerful especially if it needs ewar used on it to give you a chance. 2. Claiming that gallente should "just fit rails" is also blown out of the water as the TD makes pulse have similar tracking to rails with antimatter..
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 10:55:00 - [409] Edited by: 7shining7one7 on 08/02/2009 10:55:56 [Abaddon, Golden Castle] Capacitor Power Relay II Capacitor Power Relay II Amarr Navy Large Armor Repairer Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II ECCM - Radar II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Cap Recharger II Cap Recharger II Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Capacitor Control Circuit I Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1 dps 442 without drones. dps 652 with drones. ehp 106k, 82.7%, 77.5%, 74%, 72.3% 52km scorch range with optimal script. cap stable at 52%.. removing any cap module will make the abaddon loose its cap stability. as you can clearly tell... active tanking with just 1 frigging repper whilst attempting to fit anything but cap mods in the mids, ruins the abaddons cap to such a degree that you need 4 cap mods and 3 cap rigs just to make it cap stable.. so what are the abaddons options.. plate itself up the wazoo.. yielding great tankage but similarly poor dps but allowing more versatility in the midslots or.. going gank with a moderate tank and cap for as long as it has cap boosters (you can't make the gank fit cap stable without cap boosters) and that severely limits its mid slot options.. or.. going with "full gank" (really not feasible on an abaddon tbqh) and reaching 1000/1200 dps but ending up a paper tiger in the process since it tank will crumble so darn easily.. thus a feasible abaddon fit will end up around 6-800 dps.. which is not a whole lot.. take it as you will..
Carniflex Caldari StarHunt Systematic-Chaos	Posted - 2009.02.08 11:17:00 - [410] Originally by: Gierling Amarr are the only race that get a dedicated long range fleet gun incomparable to the other races. Can we please get an equivelant for the other races already. Say a 600mm railgun and 1500mm arty. Neutron blasters.

Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 11:25:00 - [411] Edited by: Murina on 08/02/2009 11:26:26 Dude why are you fitting a single repper?. Anyway this is a pure and standard T2 setup with a very cheap cpu implant: HIGHS 8 x mega pulse. MIDS 1 x mwd 1 x web 1 x point 1 x heavy cap booster LOWS 3 x heat sinks 2 x plates (or 1 plate and 2 eanm my preferred fit tbh) 1 x eanm 1 x dcu RIGS 1 x T1 dmg rig 2 x T1 trimarks Drones 2 x ogres 2 x hammers 1 x hobs 645ms max speed. cap stable w/o mwd running 960dps with MF 0-15+km 835dps with scorch 0-45km+ 113,618 ehp 72.5%em, 64.3%therm, 58.8%kin, 56.1%ex OR 105,815 ehp 78.3 em, 71.8therm, 67.4kin, 65.2 ex A nice setup it seems although could benefit from a few very cheep implants but i left them off to keep costs down, also in a good gang setup the tackle can be swapped out for cap mods.
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 11:44:00 - [412] it was to illustrate the immense cap issues on an abaddon, which rules out active repping unless you want to fit cap mods all over the place.. sure you can go full plate (as i suggested above as the most viable option for an abaddon) and throw on a heavy cap booster and then pretend like you have infinite charges and that it's fine and not going to matter how horrible the abaddons cap management is.. but when you fly it, it might not be that simple. let's see how many charges you can have in your can in the cargohold and then figure out the maximum amount of cap you can suck out of it, cause when you run out, you will be absolutely dead in the water.. it's allways easy to make a gank fit and then just throw on 1 or maybe 2 cap boosters to make it all look like it all plays nicely and that there's no issues.. and then say omg.. dps etc.. that's exactly what i did with the 1609 dps hyperion.. oh wait.. it was actually cap stable without cap boosters.. but that's fair right cause i mean amarr dps n fittings are clearly so uber that they can will their way through their cap issues if you just fit enough gank so that the dps looks awesome.
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 11:56:00 - [413] Originally by: 7shining7one7 it was to illustrate the immense cap issues on an abaddon, which rules out active repping unless you want to fit cap mods all over the place.. So you cannot for a local rep unless you have lots of cap mods or a booster, well that applies to gallente as well but although not quite as much. Originally by: 7shining7one7 that's exactly what i did with the 1609 dps hyperion.. oh wait.. it was actually cap stable without cap boosters.. but that's fair right It was cap stable without the mwd running but so was my abaddon, with the mwd running you had 3 minutes of cap while i had over 4 on the abaddon. Originally by: 7shining7one7 let's see how many charges you can have in your can in the cargohold and then figure out the maximum amount of cap you can suck out of it, cause when you run out, you will be absolutely dead in the water.. It was a very very long time without the mwd running and with the mwd running my cap lasted longer than your Hyperion's did bud. Mostly cos you fitted the hype poorly and for sheer dps while ignoring practicalities. Originally by: 7shining7one7 Lasers get reduced dmg inside optimal if you are approaching with 0 transversal Originally by: NightmareX Yes i support 7shining7one7 in EVERY ing way
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 11:57:00 - [414] Originally by: 7shining7one7 emo rage Grow up. Originally by: 7shining7one7 Lasers get reduced dmg inside optimal if you are approaching with 0 transversal Originally by: NightmareX Yes i support 7shining7one7 in EVERY ing way
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 12:00:00 - [415] Originally by: Murina Originally by: 7shining7one7 it was to illustrate the immense cap issues on an abaddon, which rules out active repping unless you want to fit cap mods all over the place.. So you cannot for a local rep unless you have lots of cap mods or a booster, well that applies to gallente as well but although not quite as much. Originally by: 7shining7one7 that's exactly what i did with the 1609 dps hyperion.. oh wait.. it was actually cap stable without cap boosters.. but that's fair right It was cap stable without the mwd running but so was my abaddon, with the mwd running you had 3 minutes of cap while i had over 4 on the abaddon. Originally by: 7shining7one7 let's see how many charges you can have in your can in the cargohold and then figure out the maximum amount of cap you can suck out of it, cause when you run out, you will be absolutely dead in the water.. It was a very very long time without the mwd running and with the mwd running my cap lasted longer than your Hyperion's did bud. Mostly cos you fitted the hype poorly and for sheer dps while ignoring practicalities. actually.. while it only had 3 minutes of mwd time.. it only used passive cap rechargers.. no cap boosters involved.. (you can't say the same for your fit) it also had 90k ehp.. and when it turned off the mwd it was completely cap stable.. and its dps was 1609.. whereas the abaddons was what again.. oh yeah.. 1000/1200 dps (scorch/multifreq) in a crammed fit using heavy cap booster to run it. but let's focus on the amarr ships since that seems to be more what you want to talk about, so go ahead and address the post above..
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 12:01:00 - [416] Originally by: Murina Originally by: 7shining7one7 emo rage Grow up. hah!
Captator Universal Securities	Posted - 2009.02.08 12:07:00 - [417] Originally by: Theron Gyrow Originally by: Captator With transversal ~200m/s That's with about double of that, with BS going full tilt in one direction and the BC likewise in the other (perhaps with a speed module on?). Please correct for that. I apologise, it is actually ~270m/s (Myrmidon in standard tank lows will go 160m/s with max skills and mwd off, the BS go around 110 on average), I will edit the post to reflect that. I used maximum possible transversal to show the best case scenario for blasters vs lasers, at 110m/s transversal the blasters still have the upper hand under 11km A comparison of Null vs AN MF: Without transversal null is worse than AN MF below 24km, which is reasonable given that it isn't the close range ammo: With transversal at 270m/s Null has damage superiority apart from in the 13-24km range: Fits are: Mega: 7x neutrons/heavy neut MWD/point/web/med cap booster 2x 1600mm/3x magstab/ANP/IFFA DC 3x trimark 5x Ogre Hype: 8x neutrons MWD/point/web/med cap booster/tracking computer 1600mm/EANM/IFFA DC/3x magstab 3x trimark 4x Ogre Geddon: 7x megapulse MWD/med cap booster/ECCM 3x heatsink/2x 1600mm/EANM/ANP/DC 3x trimark 5x Ogre Abaddon: 8x megapulse MWD/heavy cap booster/point/web 2x 1600mm/EANM/IFFA DC/3x heatsink 3x trimark 2x Ogre/2x Hammer/Goblin As to the person who said no-one uses null, all I can say is that the pilots I have rolled with have used it for gang fights to solve the problem with MWDing around a lot, and it works fine for them. Perhaps you should consider starting to use it. I will be editing and correcting my first post, so bear with me.
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 12:12:00 - [418] Originally by: 7shining7one7 actually.. while it only had 3 minutes of mwd time.. it only used passive cap rechargers.. no cap boosters involved.. (you can't say the same for your fit) it also had 90k ehp.. and when it turned off the mwd it was completely cap stable.. and its dps was 1609.. whereas the abaddons was what again.. oh yeah.. 1000/1200 dps (scorch/multifreq) in a crammed fit using heavy cap booster to run it. The abaddon had 115,295 ehp, was cap stable without the mwd running, over 4 mins with the mwd running had a web and point and did 1200dps out to 0-15km and 1000dps out to 0 or 15 if you use MF upto 15(and you should) -45km. The hype was also cap stable with no mwd running, had only 3mins of cap with the mwd running, only 90k ehp, no point fitted and its 1609 dps was at 2 - 4.5km. Originally by: 7shining7one7 Lasers get reduced dmg inside optimal if you are approaching with 0 transversal Originally by: NightmareX Yes i support 7shining7one7 in EVERY ing way
7shining7one7	Posted - 2009.02.08 12:18:00 - [419] Edited by: 7shining7one7 on 08/02/2009 12:26:38 Originally by: Murina Originally by: 7shining7one7 actually.. while it only had 3 minutes of mwd time.. it only used passive cap rechargers.. no cap boosters involved.. (you can't say the same for your fit) it also had 90k ehp.. and when it turned off the mwd it was completely cap stable.. and its dps was 1609.. whereas the abaddons was what again.. oh yeah.. 1000/1200 dps (scorch/multifreq) in a crammed fit using heavy cap booster to run it. The abaddon had 115,295 ehp, was cap stable without the mwd running, over 4 mins with the mwd running had a web and point and did 1200dps out to 0-15km and 1000dps out to 0 or 15 if you use MF upto 15(and you should) -45km. The hype was also cap stable with no mwd running, had only 3mins of cap with the mwd running, only 90k ehp, no point fitted and its 1609 dps was at 2 - 4.5km. i don't know where you get that 2km from.. it's 4.5km with 13km falloff (with caldari/gallente navy antimatter) and indeed it can fit mwd and web and still be cap stable.. and if it fits point on top of that, its cap lasts 54 minutes without mwd on.. pretty decent for not using cap boosters.. and having 90k ehp and 1609 dps.. point is both fits were squeezing everything they could out of both ships.. and 1609 vs 1000 is no comparison.. especially when the 1000 dps is em/therm and not all of it is even fully lasers but includes the drones which (unless you're an idiot) makes the actual inflicted damage much much less, and the 1609 is kin/therm.. you remove the drones from yours and you get what.. 800 dps? and you're squeezing everything you can out of the abaddon.. and i remove drones and i get what.. 1400 dps.. and don't give me that 1200 bs.. for you to be able to dish that out you'd have to be within 15-20km, and that's pretty much within web range.. 1000 dps is what you are going to dish out.. gl with that when the hype can fly 200ms faster than you with the fit you presented plus you accellerate much much slower. which means the webbing strategy will not work at all.. the hype will close the gap and be halfway through murdering you before you can say bob's your uncle..
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.02.08 12:24:00 - [420] This t2 only geddon fit seems interesting: 7 x pulse 1 x mwd 1 x cap booster 1 cap recharger 3 x heat sinks 1 x dcu 2 x eanm 2 x 1600 plates 1 x pg rig 2 x trimarks 5 x orges 101,806 ehp 1027dps at 0-15km 858dps at 0-45km 752m/s top speed 11mins 41 seconds of cap with the mwd running, cap stable without mwd running. basic 3% cpu implant needed but they are cheap as chips, no other implants were used...



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