Show me any kills were t3 got killed with 2 destroyers in high sec. If u put tank before balance you lose all yield bonuses , but all other ships can balance dmg ewar and tank modules and Hulks , macs and other couldn't it was tank or yield. Hulk should be on pair with BC (power grid, cpu , number of slots and so on) . Yes they or not meant for battle , but that doesn't mean they have to be paper thin.

Why in the world should the Hulk be on par with a BC? Cause you don't feel like having to make choices?

There are 3 things that matter to a mining ship. Tank, Yield, and Cargo. If you keep insisting that a mining ship is worthless without max Yield, you'll keep getting ganked.* Everyone else has to make fitting choices between elements that matter to their ship, why shouldn't Miners have to?

*No longer true, since CCP codified in game mechanics the fact that miners are too stupid to protect themselves.

But what about efficiency ? Miners are no different from pvper or pvers everyone has its goals. Be its isk/h or killmails, but everyone should be on even grounds.Before update it was hardly possible .Miners had sacrifice there efficiency for tank while other activities of eve could more or less balance it . Now its fine i can balance yield and tank( Thougth same balancing is still needed among barges ) Now i wish that ccp would do some think about mining that it would be so god damn annoying.

But what about efficiency ? Miners are no different from pvper or pvers everyone has its goals. Be its isk/h or killmails, but everyone should be on even grounds.Before update it was hardly possible .Miners had sacrifice there efficiency for tank while other activities of eve could more or less balance it . Now its fine i can balance yield and tank( Thougth same balancing is still needed among barges ) Now i wish that ccp would do some think about mining that it would be so god damn annoying.

Show me any kills were t3 got killed with 2 destroyers in high sec. If u put tank before balance you lose all yield bonuses , but all other ships can balance dmg ewar and tank modules and Hulks , macs and other couldn't it was tank or yield. Hulk should be on pair with BC (power grid, cpu , number of slots and so on) . Yes they or not meant for battle , but that doesn't mean they have to be paper thin.

My hulk looked something like this and i was ganged several times. And i had only i upgrade and still got my ass kicked.

My hulk looked something like this and i was ganged several times. And i had only i upgrade and still got my ass kicked.

You do realise that with all the hardeners off most tengu have around the same base tank as a hulk right? You catch them outside a staion or on the way to a mission and payday.

As for the hulks:

[Hulk, New Setup 1]
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Damage Control II

Small Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Survey Scanner II
Magnetic Scattering Amplifier II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Pyroxeres Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Pyroxeres Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Pyroxeres Mining Crystal II

Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I


Mining Drone II x5
Warrior II x5

Pre buff fit. Unprofitable to gank yet it still has MLU and even a rock scanner(T2 no less). Its was just like every other ship, you chose what level of gank or tank you want. Its on par with heavy assault cruisers right out of the box.

I think the reason many people didnt tank thier ship is somewhat linked to cross training for all the required skill reduced thier percived progression. Of course it's stupid to see it that way but even when I started 2 months ago, I was chain training mining and boat skill to get better yields total. The support stuff seemed useless to me back then because I wanted to mine and not fight. All that shield, armor and resistance were not linked to what I wanted to do so to hell with that right. It's a bad way of doing it but I am pretty sure many people saw it like that when they make mining thier carrer. I guess gettign ganked is supposed to be learning the hard way. Too bad some people get nothign out of this "class".

Let make it so that ur tengus and other shines would blow up from 3 thrashers or sentrys.
Since we all need to put tank.

Yes please buff ganking...cause I dont like shooting at ships that can shoot back. I also hate my life and need to make someone somewhere rage after I killed is ship when he least expected it.

There are plenty of reasons to gank miners that don't involve hating your life or a "need to make someone somewhere rage."

As for playing games, I bet when you play Uno you always unload your Draw Fours. Even if your opponent has a handful of cards already. Even if they just got skipped. Even if your opponent cries about it, you aren't getting caught with those Draw Fours in-hand. You're going to play them, grief your opponent who couldn't play because you skipped them, and win the game.

Eve is a game, too. If people cry over a game, that's too bad.

When you undock in Eve you can be shot.

Cold.

Harsh.

Universe.

HTFU much?

As for UNO, never played that game.

No doubt. The same can be said for hauler pilots and salvagers. Unfortunatly many people dont seem to be able to learn lessons when they get blown up. I spent 8 months giving out fittings and tactics to miners and they still died by the hundreds. When CCP went into testing the barge upgrades it wasn't the miners helping them with feedback it was people like me. The very people killing them sat down with CCP and tried to give them options including a gankproof ship in the form of the skiff. Unfortunatly CCP buffed the tank on the mack which means the skiff is now pointless.

Oh you should.

Retribution is all about balancing ships and what not, so why not balance out ganking a bit while you're at it? Over the last eight years, ganking has been nerfed nearly into the ground, with only a few select groups of highly skilled, well funded individuals continuing to separate stupid highsec mongoloids from their precious shiny things. Why not buff immoral activity for a change? Reward smart people for taking basic precautions against dying and loss, like not traveling around with billions in their hold, not clicking on the contracts in Jita local, and not traveling the Rancer Pipe with hundreds of PLEX in the cargo bay.

Ganking keeps getting hit with more and more nerfs: pretty soon there won't be that "cold harsh universe" left that CCP keeps going on about in their promos. EVE belongs to the violent, the venal, and the brilliant. Buff ganking. Nerf dumb people.

I dont need Eve to HTFU. I do that in real life.

As for UNO, never played that game.

Things are not balanced by cost

I would sign on to your suggestions 100% under one condition: any ganking attempt, successful or otherwise, results in an immediate -10 security AND faction standing hit, and ganker is immediately ejected in his pod to null somewhere randomly, and is unable to enter any space above .4 in any way, shape or form.

That you choose to bring your real-life essence into this argument is proof-positive that you don't have much of an argument to make. You're hard in real life so you feel comfortable whining about possibly getting ganked in a game. I can certainly respect that.

Are there any games you play besides Eve that I might use as a better metaphor for what it means to play a game, even one as rich as Eve?

Perhaps you play Sorry! and expect your opponents to never send your piece back to "start?" Maybe you play poker and expect your opponent to not bluff just because you've got a decent hand? I really wouldn't know. But I think you get the idea.

Being HTFU'd in RL is great. This is a game. HTFU'ing in a game should be, really, a whole lot easier than being HTFU'd in the real world. That's my two cents on this...

Are you saying that ganker should be able to profitable gank my ship if I tank my ship properly (this means I use money and cost goes up)?

The problem I think is many people play game to chill out after a work day. HTFU is not something they want out of a game. EvE is not the right game for them at least now since HTFU is pretty much the norm here.

The problem I think is many people play game to chill out after a work day. HTFU is not something they want out of a game. EvE is not the right game for them at least now since HTFU is pretty much the norm here.

Cold.

Harsh.

Universe.