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Octoven
Phoenix Productions
Headshot Gaming
122
   |
Posted - 2013.05.12 04:50:00 -
[751] - Quote
Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:
Perhaps you should clarify WHERE you are measuring the 134au from before posting that you can warp 134au in a deep safe. The reason I say so is that Oipo is indeed a large system so if your book mark is on the 20au boundary from the edge fo the last planetary orbit then that is NOT classified as a deep space safe even though the size of the system is large. If you are saying your bookmark is 134au from the point of the last planetary orbit outward from the system, then yes that would be impossible.
In other words, lack of clarity can often lead to misunderstanding. TO put it quite frank, I can sit on the last planet in oipo and still not be detected by combats centered on the star, doesnt mean I claim it as a deep safe spot either.
you still misunderstand. You can have a valid deep safe on the very other side of the solar system from the planet that is farthest from the sun. so yes that most distant planet dictates the overall governing radius of the solar system but it does not mean your safe is on the same side of the solar system as that planet. got it?
Yes I understood that, so what makes you think someone wont choose to place their probes in that area??
Oipo is what like 154 au diameter, assuming you scan from the center of the system using a wide scan; and also assuming you place your probes in a circular pattern around the system you can effectively cover the whole system in two scans. Once for the interior and once for the exterior. Personally, I scan right up to that 20 au boundary no matter what system im in, and I still dont use a DSP to do it. Yeah, it takes twice as long but doesnt mean its impossible to find you using standard combats. |
Kitanga
Lowsec Border Marshals
32
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 04:55:00 -
[752] - Quote
Octoven wrote:Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:
Perhaps you should clarify WHERE you are measuring the 134au from before posting that you can warp 134au in a deep safe. The reason I say so is that Oipo is indeed a large system so if your book mark is on the 20au boundary from the edge fo the last planetary orbit then that is NOT classified as a deep space safe even though the size of the system is large. If you are saying your bookmark is 134au from the point of the last planetary orbit outward from the system, then yes that would be impossible.
In other words, lack of clarity can often lead to misunderstanding. TO put it quite frank, I can sit on the last planet in oipo and still not be detected by combats centered on the star, doesnt mean I claim it as a deep safe spot either.
you still misunderstand. You can have a valid deep safe on the very other side of the solar system from the planet that is farthest from the sun. so yes that most distant planet dictates the overall governing radius of the solar system but it does not mean your safe is on the same side of the solar system as that planet. got it? Yes I understood that, so what makes you think someone wont choose to place their probes in that area?? Oipo is what like 154 au diameter, assuming you scan from the center of the system using a wide scan; and also assuming you place your probes in a circular pattern around the system you can effectively cover the whole system in two scans. Once for the interior and once for the exterior. Personally, I scan right up to that 20 au boundary no matter what system im in, and I still dont use a DSP to do it. Yeah, it takes twice as long but doesnt mean its impossible to find you using standard combats.
who said it was impossible? the issue is removal of DSP, for no apparent reason, because even you above admit that there is no 1 to 1 replacement for them.. you have to jack around with combats, up down all around. ridiculous. |
Octoven
Phoenix Productions
Headshot Gaming
122
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 04:59:00 -
[753] - Quote
Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:
Perhaps you should clarify WHERE you are measuring the 134au from before posting that you can warp 134au in a deep safe. The reason I say so is that Oipo is indeed a large system so if your book mark is on the 20au boundary from the edge fo the last planetary orbit then that is NOT classified as a deep space safe even though the size of the system is large. If you are saying your bookmark is 134au from the point of the last planetary orbit outward from the system, then yes that would be impossible.
In other words, lack of clarity can often lead to misunderstanding. TO put it quite frank, I can sit on the last planet in oipo and still not be detected by combats centered on the star, doesnt mean I claim it as a deep safe spot either.
you still misunderstand. You can have a valid deep safe on the very other side of the solar system from the planet that is farthest from the sun. so yes that most distant planet dictates the overall governing radius of the solar system but it does not mean your safe is on the same side of the solar system as that planet. got it? Yes I understood that, so what makes you think someone wont choose to place their probes in that area?? Oipo is what like 154 au diameter, assuming you scan from the center of the system using a wide scan; and also assuming you place your probes in a circular pattern around the system you can effectively cover the whole system in two scans. Once for the interior and once for the exterior. Personally, I scan right up to that 20 au boundary no matter what system im in, and I still dont use a DSP to do it. Yeah, it takes twice as long but doesnt mean its impossible to find you using standard combats. who said it was impossible? the issue is removal of DSP, for no apparent reason, because even you above admit that there is no 1 to 1 replacement for them.. you have to jack around with combats, up down all around. ridiculous.
Well yes of course, and as I mentioned in a previous post Im not hating on the keep them in the game; however, if they were to stay I would only support that if CCP were to implement dynamic base signals for sites...ships meh you can leave like they are. Having that little swift guide to pop a probe out go...eh this is a 0.2 signal, dont want and move on....that is not exploration. That is just playing the lottery and getting to see the numbers before they are drawn. |
Kitanga
Lowsec Border Marshals
32
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 05:12:00 -
[754] - Quote
Octoven wrote:Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:
Perhaps you should clarify WHERE you are measuring the 134au from before posting that you can warp 134au in a deep safe. The reason I say so is that Oipo is indeed a large system so if your book mark is on the 20au boundary from the edge fo the last planetary orbit then that is NOT classified as a deep space safe even though the size of the system is large. If you are saying your bookmark is 134au from the point of the last planetary orbit outward from the system, then yes that would be impossible.
In other words, lack of clarity can often lead to misunderstanding. TO put it quite frank, I can sit on the last planet in oipo and still not be detected by combats centered on the star, doesnt mean I claim it as a deep safe spot either.
you still misunderstand. You can have a valid deep safe on the very other side of the solar system from the planet that is farthest from the sun. so yes that most distant planet dictates the overall governing radius of the solar system but it does not mean your safe is on the same side of the solar system as that planet. got it? Yes I understood that, so what makes you think someone wont choose to place their probes in that area?? Oipo is what like 154 au diameter, assuming you scan from the center of the system using a wide scan; and also assuming you place your probes in a circular pattern around the system you can effectively cover the whole system in two scans. Once for the interior and once for the exterior. Personally, I scan right up to that 20 au boundary no matter what system im in, and I still dont use a DSP to do it. Yeah, it takes twice as long but doesnt mean its impossible to find you using standard combats. who said it was impossible? the issue is removal of DSP, for no apparent reason, because even you above admit that there is no 1 to 1 replacement for them.. you have to jack around with combats, up down all around. ridiculous. Well yes of course, and as I mentioned in a previous post Im not hating on the keep them in the game; however, if they were to stay I would only support that if CCP were to implement dynamic base signals for sites...ships meh you can leave like they are. Having that little swift guide to pop a probe out go...eh this is a 0.2 signal, dont want and move on....that is not exploration. That is just playing the lottery and getting to see the numbers before they are drawn.
you should ask yourself why does that bother you that cosmic signature percentages can lead to a good guess as to what is at that sig? you can do the very same thing...
is it because you don't like to race to the final faction rat in highsec plex because Mr Tengu always shows up before you are done? so you want to stump the ability of the professional DSP using prober to find your plex?. but you forget that eve is supposed to be harsh and unforgiving. i personally love that race to that last rat. and if i lose so what.
|
Octoven
Phoenix Productions
Headshot Gaming
122
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 05:28:00 -
[755] - Quote
Kitanga wrote:
you should ask yourself why does that bother you that cosmic signature percentages can lead to a good guess as to what is at that sig? you can do the very same thing...
is it because you don't like to race to the final faction rat in highsec plex because Mr Tengu always shows up before you are done? so you want to stump the ability of the professional DSP using prober to find your plex?. but you forget that eve is supposed to be harsh and unforgiving. i personally love that race to that last rat. and if i lose so what.
Actually no lol I dont really do 4/10s or 3/10s and the ones I do, usually I am the guy swooping in and stealing the loot haha. It bothers me that people can use these to quickly dismiss signatures without even needing to bother attempting to scan down to ID the grouping of the site. If they did that then, it starts to feel more like exploring. It's pointless really to pop out a probe and know whats in the system...what is there to explore? That takes all the unknown out of it. |
Wenthrial Solamar
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
10
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 05:33:00 -
[756] - Quote
After having a chance to work with this change on Sisi ....
1. DSP's ... They still Have value, and should be left in game.
1a. Single probe launch, has value should still be possible. ( I know CCP has already said they are addressing this )
2. One of the new scanning modules needs to be a High slot, or a Low slot... all three in Mid is counter to the stated goal of making exploration more accessible, as it strongly favors one racial line early on.
I would actually like to see one High, one Low one Mid, allowing all the exploration ships to be able to fit both a Data and a Relic module, and still scan at full effect ( instead of just 3 of them that can now ) .
Alternately, moving the Relic module to a High would accomplish the same goal.
3. Time to Hack... the Mini game is a good idea, but the implementation is not there yet.
It takes too long to interact with, and is not sufficiently interesting to be worth the effort that goes in to it.
3a. Stacking of modules, the old interaction allowed many modules to try for access in parallel, effectively making the hack much faster. The New system is fully serial, and gains nothing from use of a second module, the effect is to extend the time to hack by 3-5 fold. This may be the intent ... but that is a big change.
4. Scanner overlay; very cool... but not so useful; the looking around in space is a wonderful bit of RP, but not really an effective interface for the job your trying to do with a (probes based) system scan.
Praise where it is due, it works really well with the tracking camera and D-Scan, just not with Probes.
4a. If the Signatures show on the Overlay with out probes now... they should be in the progress bar list as well after I run a system scan.
5. Grav sites in the system scanner..... It adds little or nothing, and makes it necessary ( and boring ) to now actively guard mining fleets ( especially true in W-space ) .
This is really a game play issue, I want more PvP, and this in theory should add more oppertunty for that interaction, but Space is big, and if I'm on "guard duty" I will have to literally sit and twiddle my thumbs waiting for some one to try and jump the mining fleet.
But If I warp off and go run a combat site... my response time becomes too long to matter... so Miners go boom... and I don't get any Pew.
Seems to fail it's goal on both counts.
6. Copy paste ... thank you for fixing this ( I hope to see it on Sisi soon )
Overall, Interface changes are good
|
Kitanga
Lowsec Border Marshals
32
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 05:38:00 -
[757] - Quote
Octoven wrote:Kitanga wrote:
you should ask yourself why does that bother you that cosmic signature percentages can lead to a good guess as to what is at that sig? you can do the very same thing...
is it because you don't like to race to the final faction rat in highsec plex because Mr Tengu always shows up before you are done? so you want to stump the ability of the professional DSP using prober to find your plex?. but you forget that eve is supposed to be harsh and unforgiving. i personally love that race to that last rat. and if i lose so what.
Actually no lol I dont really do 4/10s or 3/10s and the ones I do, usually I am the guy swooping in and stealing the loot haha. It bothers me that people can use these to quickly dismiss signatures without even needing to bother attempting to scan down to ID the grouping of the site. If they did that then, it starts to feel more like exploring. It's pointless really to pop out a probe and know whats in the system...what is there to explore? That takes all the unknown out of it.
but, from what you have written above, i see that you want to dictate how others play.
you personally can explore every single signature down to 100% that you wish to. nothing is stopping you. is DSP stopping you? no. but you want to remove DSP to force others to play as you prefer to play? Eve is a complex game and people should be able to play it as they wish. removing DSP (or even removing readable percentages) is a dumbing down of the game, there is no question about it.
|
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
97
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 08:22:00 -
[758] - Quote
Kitanga wrote:Eve is a complex game and people should be able to play it as they wish. removing DSP (or even removing readable percentages) is a dumbing down of the game, there is no question about it.
Making it more complicated to determine what a signature is not means dumbing down? Currently with 1 DSP I can: See every uncloaked ship in the system, every tower, every drone, every anom, every signature. By using the leet skill known as "reading" I can then ignore sigs I'm not interested in. That sounds like easy mode dumbed down to me.
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
995
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 08:30:00 -
[759] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Kitanga wrote:Eve is a complex game and people should be able to play it as they wish. removing DSP (or even removing readable percentages) is a dumbing down of the game, there is no question about it.
Making it more complicated to determine what a signature is not means dumbing down? Currently with 1 DSP I can: See every uncloaked ship in the system, every tower, every drone, every anom, every signature. By using the leet skill known as "reading" I can then ignore sigs I'm not interested in. That sounds like easy mode dumbed down to me.
So giving scanning a "local chat" of its own is not dumbing it down? Why should you get all the information for free as soon as you enter a system?
DSPs are not easy mode, takes a siginificant time investment, special ships and equipment to use them.
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Rockstara
Epidemic.
Space Immigration
0
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 08:50:00 -
[760] - Quote
I would rather an improvement to the scanning system increase the amount of information available not decrease it.
Scanning is an extremely powerful feature in the eve universe, it is vital to the game. It has many, many users with a variety of interests. Explorers need to find the sites to run, wormholers need to find the holes, pvpers need to find things to warp to (and at the right range)
The current iteration of scanning is actually really close:
Don't give me one click default probe formations. Give me the ability to save probe formations that are independent of size (I want the same overlap at 4 AU as 1 AU). Right now I've got to reform it every time.
Give me the ability to figure out what signature I want to scan fast, this is the majority of the reason I like the dsp.
Give me the ability to center a formation on a celestial for my pvp warp-ins |
Jelani Akinyemi Affonso
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
15
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 12:40:00 -
[761] - Quote
Quick you tube video of an Eve Uni guy showing how to use the current scanning system now on SISI..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXKFqpEUHPQ
Great job CCP!. Like what i see so far |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
97
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 12:55:00 -
[762] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
So giving scanning a "local chat" of its own is not dumbing it down? Why should you get all the information for free as soon as you enter a system?
DSPs are not easy mode, takes a siginificant time investment, special ships and equipment to use them.
You don't get "all the information" for free. You get a overview of anomalies and signatures, nothing about ships or structures. Time investment is a non-argument (waiting is not a skill) and I don't consider a Heron with a expanded probelauncher and a prototype cloak special ships and equipment.
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1001
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 13:37:00 -
[763] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:
So giving scanning a "local chat" of its own is not dumbing it down? Why should you get all the information for free as soon as you enter a system?
DSPs are not easy mode, takes a siginificant time investment, special ships and equipment to use them.
You don't get "all the information" for free. You get a overview of anomalies and signatures, nothing about ships or structures. Time investment is a non-argument (waiting is not a skill) and I don't consider a Heron with a expanded probelauncher and a prototype cloak special ships and equipment.
Astrometrics V is a time investment, the heron low and behold is a specialized ship for scanning, and the expanded probe launcher is specialized equipment required for the DSP.
Not being able to see ships and structures is the reason why we want the DSP left in game. The discovery scanner is easy mode for cosmic signatures and anolamies, essencialy the "local chat" of scanning.
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
97
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 14:05:00 -
[764] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Astrometrics V is a time investment, the heron low and behold is a specialized ship for scanning, and the expanded probe launcher is specialized equipment required for the DSP.
Not being able to see ships and structures is the reason why we want the DSP left in game. The discovery scanner is easy mode for cosmic signatures and anolamies, essencialy the "local chat" of scanning.
Ok, understood. You want to keep the game dumbed down, not more complicated (by having to use combat probes). Glad to hear ;-)
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
Fae Toledo
EVE University
Ivy League
5
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 16:41:00 -
[765] - Quote
Aimee Maken wrote:The removal of DSP without some form of skill comp is just unfair.
At least refund the entire old skill and let us decide to put how much into it again.
Agree with Aimee Maken. We speaking about significant time investment become pointless.
|
Sulvorati Kunoki
Global Economy Experts
Stellar Economy Experts
4
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 17:13:00 -
[766] - Quote
Octoven wrote:Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:Octoven wrote:
it literally is infinite
Please do NOT combine literally and infinite. The stupidity of that combination makes my eyes hurt. You may wish to look up both words. The stupidity for one to say they are not infinite when CCP Fozzie clearly stated they were in a previous post hurts my eyes as well  IF a game developer says that an object has an infinite point of view then it does, I chose to use the word literally (meaning exactly) to indicate to the player in question that when a dev says infinite it means boundless and is not being used as a metaphor; however, if you prefer this long winded explanation I would be happy to yield to such a process to ease the pain of your eyes. Until then I stand by my original statement, "it literally (Exactly) is infinite."
As you say yourself, infinite means boundless. Clearly the scanner is bounded by the solar system you are in. Hence not infinite. |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
98
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 17:33:00 -
[767] - Quote
Fae Toledo wrote:Aimee Maken wrote:The removal of DSP without some form of skill comp is just unfair.
At least refund the entire old skill and let us decide to put how much into it again.
Agree with Aimee Maken. We speaking about significant time investment become pointless.
It is opening a can of worms: Give back Astrometrics skill points, then the Orca pilots complain (no more mining barge needed), then the carrier pilots (no more BS IV needed), then the Command ship pilots complain (No more Logi/HAC needed).... etc. I could understand a rebalance if Astro V wasn't needed at all, but it still is a prereq to jump portal generators and thus should not just be removed/reimbursed.
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1002
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 17:59:00 -
[768] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Astrometrics V is a time investment, the heron low and behold is a specialized ship for scanning, and the expanded probe launcher is specialized equipment required for the DSP.
Not being able to see ships and structures is the reason why we want the DSP left in game. The discovery scanner is easy mode for cosmic signatures and anolamies, essencialy the "local chat" of scanning.
Ok, understood. You want to keep the game dumbed down, not more complicated (by having to use combat probes). Glad to hear ;-)
So a day old scanning alt in a t1 scanning ship being able to do close to what a DSP did is not dumbing the game down at all?
That is what the new system will bring.
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Messoroz
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
360
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 18:00:00 -
[769] - Quote
Octoven wrote:Kitanga wrote:Octoven wrote:Rammix wrote:
And don't forget that some people still have deep safe spots (i.e. in the outer space far beyond the last planet). Not as deep as they were in 'ancient' days, but far enough.
Right, legacy deep safes STILL exist; however, I dare you to try to warp to one. Warping to a bookmark more then 10 AU from the last planet in the system is disabled, thus you can use standard combats probes to hunt people just fine. i have a legacy safe that is 134au from the nearest planet, and yes i just warped to it without a problem. stopped reading right there... http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/the-not-so-great-after-all-deep-safe-nerf-of-2010/The blog continues by saying: Quote:The neatest solution would be to move all affected objects in a given system closer to the sun. However, EVE Development's resident DB guys were booked pretty solid for Tyrannis production, so the quickest solution was to instead make a few code changes to render deep-safe locations effectively inaccessible. THAT is a confirmation that NO deep space book marks made now or since the beginning of time will work. If you are still using your then A) CCP has overlooked it and it needs to be reported or B) you are lying, I suggest providing a screen shot  Eitherway, that blog doesn't say safes made before the fix were still usable, it states very clearly that NO safes beyond 20 AU will function...PERIOD. Sorry lol but its right there in teh full glory of a dev blog. I provided my proof that they are disabled...lets see yours
Imagine a 60 AU system, now imagine all the planets are on one half of the system if there was a line going through the center. If you make a safe on the other half of the system with no celestials with bugs that still exists i.e. carriers with fighters. Then you can make yourself a safe where nobody thinks to look.
Many people do this in nullsec to rat, you just assign fighters from a cloaky carrier to a tengu. |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
98
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 18:14:00 -
[770] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:So a day old scanning alt in a t1 scanning ship being able to do close to what a DSP did is not dumbing the game down at all?
That is what the new system will bring.
Placing probes to cover a whole system is evidently more skill requiring than just launching 1 DSP and pressing "Scan". Just look what the game developers at CCP managed to produce with their spread pattern.
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1002
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 18:26:00 -
[771] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:So a day old scanning alt in a t1 scanning ship being able to do close to what a DSP did is not dumbing the game down at all?
That is what the new system will bring. Placing probes to cover a whole system is evidently more skill requiring than just launching 1 DSP and pressing "Scan". Just look what the game developers at CCP managed to produce with their spread pattern.
because pressing "spread formation" and scan is so hard.
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
98
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 18:36:00 -
[772] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:So a day old scanning alt in a t1 scanning ship being able to do close to what a DSP did is not dumbing the game down at all?
That is what the new system will bring. Placing probes to cover a whole system is evidently more skill requiring than just launching 1 DSP and pressing "Scan". Just look what the game developers at CCP managed to produce with their spread pattern. because pressing "spread formation" and scan is so hard.
You know that the Spread Formation pattern is bad and has gaps in it?
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
ISquishWorms
201
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 18:44:00 -
[773] - Quote
Ueberlisk wrote:I HATE HATE HATE the fact that you launch all the probes when you want to launch just one to quickly check systems. It just doesn't make sense to me. (yes i know deep space probes have been removed.)
Is it going to be possible to change the amount of probes launched or can i set my own quick formations?
I normally only use 4 combat probes as it is what I'm used to and it minimizes the effect probes have on dscan. Based on this I would also love to keep the ability to have at least 8 probes inside the launcher for the ability to launch multiple sets without having to spend so much time reloading.
I agree. Why are you assuming I want to launch 7 probes at 16AU. Flexibility is always key I find not trying to force people to do it a way that is perceived the norm.
. |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1002
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 18:54:00 -
[774] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:So a day old scanning alt in a t1 scanning ship being able to do close to what a DSP did is not dumbing the game down at all?
That is what the new system will bring. Placing probes to cover a whole system is evidently more skill requiring than just launching 1 DSP and pressing "Scan". Just look what the game developers at CCP managed to produce with their spread pattern. because pressing "spread formation" and scan is so hard. You know that the Spread Formation pattern is bad and has gaps in it?
You it takes 2 seconds to fill those gaps by holding alt + shift right?
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
98
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 19:15:00 -
[775] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
You it takes 2 seconds to fill those gaps by holding alt + shift right?
Yes. So, which is faster and takes less skill? Launching 1 probe or launching 7/8 probes and adjusting them?
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1003
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 19:35:00 -
[776] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:
You it takes 2 seconds to fill those gaps by holding alt + shift right?
Yes. So, which is faster and takes less skill? Launching 1 probe or launching 7/8 probes and adjusting them?
7/8 and adjusting them takes rolling a new character and putting it in the right ship, a DSP take almost 2 weeks to train to use, so you do the math.
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Sipphakta en Gravonere
4S Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
98
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 19:38:00 -
[777] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
7/8 and adjusting them takes rolling a new character and putting it in the right ship, a DSP take almost 2 weeks to train to use, so you do the math.
You... you are joking, right? You know that you can reload probes and don't need to biomass every time your probe launcher is empty?
I wish I were a cat. That way, I could kill things and people would applaud - instead of screaming out "OH GOD NO, NOT MY DAUGHTER!" |
ISquishWorms
201
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 19:50:00 -
[778] - Quote
The more I see of this new scanning the less I like it. Seems to me like it has become a move something over a dot and click fest now even less variation and skill required than before. At least before there was the option and scope for trying out different formations and some had their own preferred formation which would need adjusting in accordance with probe resizing. Now it seems like a move over dot resize routine to the point that why even bother with formations at all as everyone will be doing exactly the same thing. There will be even less variation about how people choose to scan you could almost replace the probes now with a button that you click a different amount of times based on your skill points in exploration.
What I have seen so far has just made me want to ditch probing altogether. 
. |
Roel Yento
Black Rain Cartel
5
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 19:56:00 -
[779] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Astrometrics V is a time investment, the heron low and behold is a specialized ship for scanning, and the expanded probe launcher is specialized equipment required for the DSP.
Not being able to see ships and structures is the reason why we want the DSP left in game. The discovery scanner is easy mode for cosmic signatures and anolamies, essencialy the "local chat" of scanning.
Ok, understood. You want to keep the game dumbed down, not more complicated (by having to use combat probes). Glad to hear ;-)
How about we make it even harder and only allow combats to read at 16au? Will take more skill to fully check a system and be even more complex? Where do you decide to draw the line on what is complex enough to be implemented? DSP's are easy mode for those that chose to invest into them. Why did you train astro to 5? For 8 combats? I did it for 8 probes and using dsp's but more so for dsp's. I am not saying scanning is impossible without them or i won't continue on without them but as has been stated before they have a function that is completely being removed. I could understand them being reworked to not let people cherry pick sites but regardless there is no reason to do that. Everyone can train astro to 5 to make scanning faster and easy. If you don't want to then you don't have too.
The only reason to actually remove dsp's is for pve reasons to make it a more level playing field for new accounts. They are pushing exploration and if new players get into exploration that means more people out roaming and having fun, thus more accounts. That is the reason why i am fine with their pve use being removed. Still no valid reason to remove their pvp use though, hence why they haven't responded to comments about the dsp's combat use.
At the least, i just want to hear why their pvp use is being removed. Whatever they say goes regardless but info is always nice to have. |
Omnathious Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
1004
|
Posted - 2013.05.12 20:09:00 -
[780] - Quote
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:
7/8 and adjusting them takes rolling a new character and putting it in the right ship, a DSP take almost 2 weeks to train to use, so you do the math.
You... you are joking, right? You know that you can reload probes and don't need to biomass every time your probe launcher is empty?
Wow really I never new
Lets see per odyssey time to make a scanning alt for WH is at the minimum 16 days, post odyssey time to make a WH scanning alt, at the maximum 4 days.
Ideas For Drone Improvement
Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
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