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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
602
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Posted - 2014.01.17 16:07:00 -
[571] - Quote
Angelica Dreamstar wrote:As many as all the carebears, who have powerfull friends in nullsec alliances that will come to hunt and kill us? XD
Run for you lives!!!!
Also Jeff Bidermaier!!!
"You should just create one thread and put all of your complaints in it instead of littering the forums with multiple threads." ~CCP Falcon
Paranoia never killed anyone. -áA complete absence of it has. |
Angelica Dreamstar
Epic Boo Bees
186
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Posted - 2014.01.17 16:14:00 -
[572] - Quote
Kimmi Chan wrote:Angelica Dreamstar wrote:As many as all the carebears, who have powerfull friends in nullsec alliances that will come to hunt and kill us? XD Run for you lives!!!! Also Jeff Bidermaier!!! Hahaha Jeff! Almost forgot him! xD Create a new, pretty, female character! Make the name count! Join the epic boo bees! (RP,PvE/PvP,wardecs,new players!) You're at it from day 0! |
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
610
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Posted - 2014.01.17 16:39:00 -
[573] - Quote
Angelica Dreamstar wrote:Kimmi Chan wrote:Angelica Dreamstar wrote:As many as all the carebears, who have powerfull friends in nullsec alliances that will come to hunt and kill us? XD Run for you lives!!!! Also Jeff Bidermaier!!! Hahaha Jeff! Almost forgot him! xD
The best part of that whole thing for me was that he put it in his Bio.
Jeff is a ******* rock star!!!
"You should just create one thread and put all of your complaints in it instead of littering the forums with multiple threads." ~CCP Falcon
Paranoia never killed anyone. -áA complete absence of it has. |
E-2C Hawkeye
State War Academy Caldari State
461
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Posted - 2014.01.17 16:54:00 -
[574] - Quote
MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:Dave Stark wrote:E-2C Hawkeye wrote:You mean the goons with their alts in hi-sec? Yea your right, that why the front line goon has an average of 8 accounts. source? I think that was a tongue-in-cheek comment. I've seen plenty of null sec players claim that 'many' of them have alts in hi sec. So I guess that would be the source. Unless, of course, these claims are bullshit. <== tongue-in-cheek as well . Mittani.com....but wear the tin foil hat before you go |
Dave Stark
4217
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Posted - 2014.01.17 17:12:00 -
[575] - Quote
i just thought 8 sounded a bit low. vOv |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
4672
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Posted - 2014.01.17 18:05:00 -
[576] - Quote
Money Makin Mitch wrote:CCP Falcon wrote:It's quite clear that there are very mixed opinions on this, and we'll be looking to gather the feedback from this thread and hand it over to game design. That said, if people are annoyed, it's still not justification for taking a dump all over the forum rules. Make sure that your feedback is presented in a calm and concise manner. Cheers. the opinions don't seem to be very mixed to me... seems almost everyone hates it. we're ridiculing it for a reason. welp, back to the drawing board
I wouldn't say everyone hates it...just the nullsec children who think everything needs to be in their favor. |
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
611
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Posted - 2014.01.17 18:08:00 -
[577] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Money Makin Mitch wrote:CCP Falcon wrote:It's quite clear that there are very mixed opinions on this, and we'll be looking to gather the feedback from this thread and hand it over to game design. That said, if people are annoyed, it's still not justification for taking a dump all over the forum rules. Make sure that your feedback is presented in a calm and concise manner. Cheers. the opinions don't seem to be very mixed to me... seems almost everyone hates it. we're ridiculing it for a reason. welp, back to the drawing board I wouldn't say everyone hates it...just the nullsec children who think everything needs to be in their favor.
<---- Doesn't live in Nullsec.
<----Thinks ESS is dumb.
<----Likes breakfast food.
"You should just create one thread and put all of your complaints in it instead of littering the forums with multiple threads." ~CCP Falcon
Paranoia never killed anyone. -áA complete absence of it has. |
Fix Sov
39
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Posted - 2014.01.17 18:20:00 -
[578] - Quote
CCP Falcon wrote:It's quite clear that there are very mixed opinions on this, and we'll be looking to gather the feedback from this thread and hand it over to game design. That said, if people are annoyed, it's still not justification for taking a dump all over the forum rules. Make sure that your feedback is presented in a calm and concise manner. Cheers. Clear and concise feedback: the premises behind the ESS is deeply flawed. There are absolutely no incentives that I can see for deploying this module in a system I would rat in (not that I'm going to rat, **** ratting forever), because the disadvantage to not deploying it is overshadowed by the amount of time and energy you have to spend guarding the ESS and making sure the bounties etc are shared to the right people and not stolen by some neutral, red or blue guy.
If you absolutely want to make a farms and fields style module, think of something which'll make people actually want to deploy it, such as a proper nerf to bounties if it's inactive like, say, 25-50% or whatever, which is reversed (or mostly reversed if you feel like nullsec is spewing forth too much ISK, but in that case you should probably be upfront about it and just say that there's too much isk coming into the economy so we're going to reduce payouts by x%), make it hackable/incappable by a smallish gang, and f.ex make it so a percentage of the un-nerfed bounties is sent to everyone who was in on hacking/reinforcing it. And it'll stay that way until someone fixes it by reverse-enginnering/hacking/repping it.
That way the system owner has an incentive to deploy it (because it actually matters), he doesn't have to dedicate one or more alts to just watching the structure in case some blue idiot comes derping along and presses the steal everything button, he has an incentive (albeit probably not enough, but them's the breaks) to actually defend it, and he'll have to do something to fix the situation. The current sov system is too heavily reliant on the defender saving systems by stuffing as many people as possible into the system for the final timer, instead of incentivizing attacking (and defending) multiple systems at the same time by splitting their forces into multiple fleets and using actual intelligence/strategy. This must change. |
E-2C Hawkeye
State War Academy Caldari State
462
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Posted - 2014.01.17 18:32:00 -
[579] - Quote
Jon Feist wrote:For every ESS module that is seen in Nullsec, a miner will be ganked. You should start now and get ahead to avoid the rush. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
9846
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 18:42:00 -
[580] - Quote
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:Jon Feist wrote:For every ESS module that is seen in Nullsec, a miner will be ganked. You should start now and get ahead to avoid the rush.
No miners will die over this. Thats how terrible this idea is. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
4140
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Posted - 2014.01.17 19:21:00 -
[581] - Quote
If nullsec goes to highsec to kill everybody out of revenge for the ESS, then Harry Forever will win VFK and the goons will be homeless.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
9847
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Posted - 2014.01.17 19:24:00 -
[582] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:If nullsec goes to highsec to kill everybody out of revenge for the ESS, then Harry Forever will win VFK and the goons will be homeless.
There is only one Harry Forever and we have him. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
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ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
356
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Posted - 2014.01.17 21:00:00 -
[583] - Quote
Real life link post removed. ISD Tyrozan Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department @ISDTyrozan | @ISD_CCL |
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Vald Tegor
Empyrean Guard Tactical Narcotics Team
104
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Posted - 2014.01.17 21:17:00 -
[584] - Quote
Trii Seo wrote: - Null "bears", and I'd actually use this term referring to people whom you cannot under any circumstances force to defend/pick a fight won't fight for profits from an ESS.
This may come as a shock to some people, but that ratting "person" is frequently an alt of someone currently engaged in a pvp fleet elsewhere on their main account. No, I'm not going to jump on dual comms and try to form up a gang to counter a few dudes roaming by, especially if they are in interceptors or cloakies. I'm going to dock the alt and focus on what I'm doing on the main screen.
Even if I'm not otherwise engaged, no I won't form up with the 5 dudes that happen to be awake in station to engage your 30 man cruiser gang in the next 60 seconds.
People who cry about "null bears" seem to be oblivious to an important fact. Actual pvp losses when they undock are reimbursed by the alliance anyway. There is nothing for them to be afraid of losing. What these people are really crying about is failing to gank non-reimbursable PvE boats, which by definition are not fight capable and WILL dock at every opportunity by design. The reason you don't get a fight, is you're not providing an opportunity for a decent fight. Sometimes it's as simple as not having an appropriate ship in station to engage what you brought, not just a question of numbers.
Trii Seo wrote: An alliance that will fight you will fight you - if they can get numbers to go after you, or they have a remote chance of catching you. If you're in a cloaky/nullified T3 or a gang of interceptors, there's less incentive to form up simply because the other side will just run off before the fight even starts.
"But they blob!" "But they form up a counter!" well, likely you're the one that came in expecting to pick off easy targets - carebears. So it's kind of a "pot, meet kettle" situation.
If a group of players is willing to pick a fight, they don't need an ESS or any other stuff to incentivize the fighting. They just need a taget to hang around in the area long enough to form up a gang and go after it. ESS will do nothing to incentivize PvP in this case, and frankly siphons have a similar result.
That's pretty much it. If we can form up and get a fight, we will. If we do form, don't cry about blobbing and expect us to tell people who want to fight to sit it out.
Trii Seo wrote:An alliance that will not fight you will not fight you. No matter the amount of ESS, siphons, all this stuff you stack on them - they won't fight you, it's hardly ever worth losing ships over the amounts lost. At least a siphon steals something while it's there to the benefit of the attacker. The defenders will never deploy an ESS to start with in current form and it is useless for the attackers to deploy. All it does is provide a global warpin for an off gate fight. About the only positive side I see, is it provides incentive for the attackers to stay in system and take the fight after deploying one offensively. But that's not an incentive to deploy it offensively either. I guess leaving it could work as bait in a hotdrop / logoffski trap for when the ratter decides to take it down.
Then there are the issues of trying to do a coordinated "ratting op" to effectively use one of these. First and foremost, if we have enough dudes for that, we're going on a roam looking for targets instead. Not ratting. Second, an average null system can hardly support a gang ratting efficiently. Third, thanks to EvE's PvE structure, this "ratting gang" will be spread around the system and must dock up to reship before taking the fight. They can't simply fleet warp to the ESS. Which means the aggressor can set up first, bubble the undock and blap nullified ships coming to cash out. A scout for an early warning could be another ratter that just docks up without deploying the structure. An alt sitting on the ESS for emergency cash out could likewise be another ratter. One could argue that a pipe with multiple systems could handle a 20+ man ratting operation and do it profitably with a dedicated scout, but that takes us back to the first point. Why would they form up to rat instead of going to PvP? Ratting is typically something you do sporadically in downtime, solo, when there is nothing better to do with that character at the moment.
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E-2C Hawkeye
State War Academy Caldari State
463
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 21:32:00 -
[585] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:E-2C Hawkeye wrote:Jon Feist wrote:For every ESS module that is seen in Nullsec, a miner will be ganked. You should start now and get ahead to avoid the rush. No miners will die over this. Thats how terrible this idea is. So I guess thatGÇÖs part of what I am not getting. If this is Sooooo bad and no one will use it then why do so many people have their underooes in a twist? I think the FEAR comes from not knowing. With many things in Eve the full potential of items, ideas and changes is not realized until people have a chance to play with it and figure out how to meta it. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
4382
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Posted - 2014.01.17 21:45:00 -
[586] - Quote
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:baltec1 wrote:E-2C Hawkeye wrote:Jon Feist wrote:For every ESS module that is seen in Nullsec, a miner will be ganked. You should start now and get ahead to avoid the rush. No miners will die over this. Thats how terrible this idea is. So I guess thatGÇÖs part of what I am not getting. If this is Sooooo bad and no one will use it then why do so many people have their underooes in a twist? I think the FEAR comes from not knowing. With many things in Eve the full potential of items, ideas and changes is not realized until people have a chance to play with it and figure out how to meta it.
The frustration comes from watching CCP turn an old mistake into a new one. They don't seem to have learned from the systems upgrade nerf that turned null BACK into the desert it was before system upgrades were introduced.
Oh Well, No skin off anyone's back (except renters who will watch their system's value plummet), theres FW lp farming, incursions, SOE and thukker missions and other things. But it's CCP going backwards, they shold be setting the ground for the people who want to go to null to live to want to go there, not to want to go do high sec incursions to afford ships for null. |
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
614
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Posted - 2014.01.17 22:00:00 -
[587] - Quote
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:baltec1 wrote:E-2C Hawkeye wrote:Jon Feist wrote:For every ESS module that is seen in Nullsec, a miner will be ganked. You should start now and get ahead to avoid the rush. No miners will die over this. Thats how terrible this idea is. So I guess thatGÇÖs part of what I am not getting. If this is Sooooo bad and no one will use it then why do so many people have their underooes in a twist? I think the FEAR comes from not knowing. With many things in Eve the full potential of items, ideas and changes is not realized until people have a chance to play with it and figure out how to meta it.
SIGHTED: -->> CCP Dev Alt! <<-- TARGET ACQUIRED.
POUNCE SEQUENCE INITIATED!
"You should just create one thread and put all of your complaints in it instead of littering the forums with multiple threads." ~CCP Falcon
Paranoia never killed anyone. -áA complete absence of it has. |
Desmond Strickler
End-of-Line
22
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Posted - 2014.01.17 22:02:00 -
[588] - Quote
Fix Lag wrote:Prie Mary wrote:Fix Lag wrote:Desmond Strickler wrote:1. HTFU 2. Buy a incursion alt 3. ???? 4. Profit And that, right there, is the problem. Quick raise the deflector shields, try and move CCP onto incursions - again. Threads about ESS not nerf incursions What I'm saying has nothing to do with nerfing incursions--it's pointing out that CCP has, by virtue of making nullsec worthless, made highsec incursion running (and FW frigate crap, and maybe L4s for those too desperate or stupid to do otherwise) about the only viable way to rat money. Which makes owning and maintaining a nullsec empire pretty stupid.
Well for alliances and coalitions, moon goo is by far the best passive isk in the game and I am sure someone is going to fight for them. Just because you have an incursion alt doesn't me nullsec is completely useless, it is still the best place to find fleet pew pew. Oh, and wh's are by far the best ratting isk The Black Prince of Wormholes a.k.a The Black Prince of The East
Professional Nereus Gang Fighter
Part-Time Moon Bear and Full-Time Black Guy |
Angelica Dreamstar
Epic Boo Bees
189
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 00:04:00 -
[589] - Quote
Desmond Strickler wrote:The Black Prince of Wormholes a.k.a The Black Prince of The East THE PRINCE OF THE EAST ! Create a new, pretty, female character! Make the name count! Join the epic boo bees! (RP,PvE/PvP,wardecs,new players!) You're at it from day 0! |
Thead Enco
Killing is Business Get Off My Lawn
55
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Posted - 2014.01.18 00:09:00 -
[590] - Quote
Thread Status:
29 pages later with no CCP comment, it's not like you guys are short of "Community Reps"
"Any man who must say 'I am the king' is no true king."
Tywin Lannister-á |
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Haraukiae Youik
University of Caille Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2014.01.18 00:22:00 -
[591] - Quote
Amazing
TRULY A M A Z I N G
CCP for the last 5 years has nerfed hi sec to h (am I allowed to say it, it rhymes with bell?) and one almost inconsequential partial, lite tap on the oh so Purdy hand of nul sec and everyone goes wild.
Why don't all you hardcore pirates; dedicated players; take your own advice to us hi sec people and just learn to adjust?
Or is that asking too much?
OH, the TEARS |
Fix Sov
47
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Posted - 2014.01.18 00:27:00 -
[592] - Quote
Uh, CCP has nerfed hisec to hell the past 5 years?
Which universe are you living in? Can't be the same universe I'm living in, because for the most part it's been buffs to hisec. The current sov system is too heavily reliant on the defender saving systems by stuffing as many people as possible into the system for the final timer, instead of incentivizing attacking (and defending) multiple systems at the same time by splitting their forces into multiple fleets and using actual intelligence/strategy. This must change. |
La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1436
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:12:00 -
[593] - Quote
Infinity Ziona wrote: You need to edumudicate yourself a bit :)
Anecdotal evidence generally refers to a 'story' told regarding an event. "I was walking along a track and was abducted and anal probed by strange alien hillbillies". They provide no hard evidence, such as used anal probes or odd burn marks attributable to possible still fitted spacecraft.
Sample size is irrelevant given some data is better than no data, which is what you offer. Data representative of the average null seccers is the opposite of what we need since my stance is that your income is being deliberately curtailed by your voluntary restrictions against utilizing other peoples space due to your bluing every and all in your area out of fear.
Don't try to out science me unless you know what basic science is actually about.
That TNT guy knows his stuff, you on the other hand are highly suspect. You moved the goalposts from "nullsec income is better than highsec income" to ":goonspiracy:." There is still no breakdown of where bounties come from by sec area and as the TNT guy pointed out all you've shown is that nullsec could use a buff.
Based on your anecdote the ESS should be exclusively in highsec. This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. |
General Yazimi
Nexus Incorporated
0
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:19:00 -
[594] - Quote
Someone is afraid that their entrenched alliances needs to work a little more for said entrenchment. I love the concept of ESS. |
Fix Sov
48
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:20:00 -
[595] - Quote
General Yazimi wrote:Someone is afraid that their entrenched alliances needs to work a little more for said entrenchment. I love the concept of ESS. Please, do tell how ESS is supposed to make "entrenched alliances work a little more for said entrenchment". The current sov system is too heavily reliant on the defender saving systems by stuffing as many people as possible into the system for the final timer, instead of incentivizing attacking (and defending) multiple systems at the same time by splitting their forces into multiple fleets and using actual intelligence/strategy. This must change. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
2134
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 01:21:00 -
[596] - Quote
General Yazimi wrote:Someone is afraid that their entrenched alliances needs to work a little more for said entrenchment. I love the concept of ESS.
So, aside from "Grr Goons", what do you actually like about it? Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
General Yazimi
Nexus Incorporated
0
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:30:00 -
[597] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:General Yazimi wrote:Someone is afraid that their entrenched alliances needs to work a little more for said entrenchment. I love the concept of ESS. So, aside from "Grr Goons", what do you actually like about it?
"Anyone can access an ESS, not just the owner."
I'll enjoy stealing your ISK when you are out farming - I enjoy the fact that you have to guard the ESS. I like the fact we can fight over it.
Oh btw when you leave - Can I have your stuff? |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
2134
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 01:33:00 -
[598] - Quote
General Yazimi wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:General Yazimi wrote:Someone is afraid that their entrenched alliances needs to work a little more for said entrenchment. I love the concept of ESS. So, aside from "Grr Goons", what do you actually like about it? "Anyone can access an ESS, not just the owner." I'll enjoy stealing your ISK when you are out farming - I enjoy the fact that you have to guard the ESS. I like the fact we can fight over it. Oh btw when you leave - Can I have your stuff?
I wouldn't ever drop one. (I don't live in nullsec, but I'd have to be out of my mind).
Anyone who actually stays in null after this (most of them will just leave), would be insane to risk 20% of their earnings for an extra 5% they won't see.
They'll just dock up or try and go to a different system if they can.
You won't be stealing anything, "they" won't be guarding anything, and nothing will be fought over.
Because 5% isn't worth fighting over. Especially not when they can just go mission. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Angelica Dreamstar
Epic Boo Bees
189
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:34:00 -
[599] - Quote
General Yazimi wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:General Yazimi wrote:Someone is afraid that their entrenched alliances needs to work a little more for said entrenchment. I love the concept of ESS. So, aside from "Grr Goons", what do you actually like about it? "Anyone can access an ESS, not just the owner." I'll enjoy stealing your ISK when you are out farming - I enjoy the fact that you have to guard the ESS. I like the fact we can fight over it. Oh btw when you leave - Can I have your stuff? How can you steal their ISK, if they don't deploy it? Create a new, pretty, female character! Make the name count! Join the epic boo bees! (RP,PvE/PvP,wardecs,new players!) You're at it from day 0! |
Fix Sov
48
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Posted - 2014.01.18 01:41:00 -
[600] - Quote
Angelica Dreamstar wrote:How can you steal their ISK, if they don't deploy it? Pubbie magic. The current sov system is too heavily reliant on the defender saving systems by stuffing as many people as possible into the system for the final timer, instead of incentivizing attacking (and defending) multiple systems at the same time by splitting their forces into multiple fleets and using actual intelligence/strategy. This must change. |
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