if you use microwap drive you can avoid like 80% of the missile damage right?

Intentional.
The damage you could do to small cruiser gangs would be disgustingly glorious.

That makes no sense whatsoever. So we're going to introduce a new battleship weapon, apply the damage and rate-of-fire bonuses for ever other battleship hull - but then specifically exclude the Golem.

Or just tank it.

A golem can and will tank most small cruiser gangs and the new heavy rapids sting. If they had the bonus I feel the golem would have too easy a time ripping these small gangs apart if they hang around.

no i am saying if you are in a cruiser, all you do is use mwd, all the missile dps will drop to almost nothing. heavy missiles got exp velocity of 150m/s ?? no sure but it is nothing compare to 2000m/s cruiser. also, they dev say golem wont get the bonus ? or is that just a rumor?

Gives you a reason to use the others in small gangs/solo.

One more nail in the Golem coffin.

heavy missiles got exp velocity of 150m/s ?? no sure but it is nothing compare to 2000m/s cruiser.

clearly you have no clue of missile mechanics i strongly advise you to read and understand the link i posted few pages ago...

if its so clear then say it shouldnt be that hard to explain. what i observe is what it is. i dont use formulas im sorry

if its so clear then say it shouldnt be that hard to explain. what i observe is what it is. i dont use formulas im sorry

Because the Golem was the premier small gang pvp ship right?

Because the RNI will be able to utilize RHMLs to run circles around the Golem in L4s.

Ah see you completely misunderstood what I jsut said there :)
Is the Golem CURRENTLY the premier small gang PvP ship?

No it is not

Thus this changes nothing. It is no nail in the coffin of the golem. Stop being melodramatic.

Also why in the heck would you want to use RHM in Lv4 missions?!

That makes absolutely no sense.

No, I simply choose to ignore it... The vast majority of Golem owners have invested in the time and training for PvE, and this seriously curtails it's ability against cruisers and frigates. So that means running rigors instead of field extenders to even approach the base damage application of a cruise missile-outfitted RNI. You know, on those L4 missions that feature numerous cruiser/battlecruiser class NPCs. The only thing melodramatic here are your replies. Go back on your meds or get them to increase the dosage...

No, I simply choose to ignore it...

you only compare explosion velocity and velocity....but the damage modifiyer is dependent on 4 values

ship veloocity
ship signature
missile explosion velocity
missile explosion radius

you neglect 2 of the 4 ...and to those are applied :

mwd 500% malus
bonused target painters
and probably rigor rigs

so there it will be the other way arround leading to a not so big advantage on side of the cruiser (those 4 values are calculated into one a*b/(c*d)^c )

Don't know for sure yet. I trained it since I was in my int/mem map anyways

That being said, remember how CCP bent over backwards to ensure that anyone who could fly a command ship prior to the CS overhaul could fly one after?

Hmm.. Anize has still not posted TQ mission numbers.

wonder why that is.

TQ vargur can already run C3 and C4 without serious problems. solo
For c4 a rr pair is better though.

Btw, using links =/= solo

How can one like the new better then the old if one has never experienced the old?
you used three missions as your examples but have a stated tq time for only one. and one you have admitted to have never run on tq.

Its ok though, Its too late for CCP to want to revise it, bastion is was and still is a terrible idea.

My position on the uselessness of the Bastion module is well-documented.

That being said, remember how CCP bent over backwards to ensure that anyone who could fly a command ship prior to the CS overhaul could fly one after?

Seems like CCP figures that even though they and their fanbois are trumpeting the Bastion module as pretty much mandatory to fly the hull class properly post Nov 19th, here we are, where every current Marauder pilot is facing 4-7 days new training, depending on their attribute distribution.

Yeah, that is totally fair, especially when compared to the command ship skill overhaul.
Players can go their entire pilot career avoiding industrial skills, but now if you want to fly a class of ships properly, you have to learn possibly 2 new industrial skills.

How can one like the new better then the old if one has never experienced the old?
you used three missions as your examples but have a stated tq time for only one. and one you have admitted to have never run on tq.

Seems like CCP figures that even though they and their fanbois are trumpeting the Bastion module as pretty much mandatory to fly the hull class properly post Nov 19th, here we are, where every current Marauder pilot is facing 4-7 days new training, depending on their attribute distribution.

As to the enjoyment, as it is currently I'd say my enjoyment has at least been doubled with Rubicon Vargur. I've been running and plexing my 2 accounts with solo vargur for more than a year before I moved to a wh corp. I still run missions every now and then because a little bit is fun every now and then.

Don't have the drone skills to say regarding sentry domis. I hear they are very good in anoms but it's too passive for me, too boring.

It's a lot of things actually. The rapid redeployment with 1min MJD. The auto salvaging of my salvage drones (only have to tractor the wrecks) the sitting in a room and never having to worry about my tank again. The not having to fly around so I can focus on prioritising targets and grabbing wrecks. The opening of wreck and the huge isk ticks I've been getting (18mill, 15mill, 13 mill)

I'd probably be ok with plexing my account on running anoms if I was part of a null corp. Just sitting there nuking wave after wave of enemies (but with a bit more input than making sure my drones stay alive + the salvaging/looting at the same time.

ok explain this to me. I was in test server in a golem using 2x t2 rigors, 5 target painters, cruise missiles 4x bcs. went rattling on null sec belt. fired a few volleys at an angel bs he was using mwd for speed of 600m/s to 700m/s my volley damage was around 1000. normally it is 3.8k to 4.4k . As soon as the BS got close to me and speed went back to 200m/s i was doing full damage.

so please explain to me how mwd doesnt reduce missile damage?

I've waited for my Vargur's weaknesses to be adressed for a long time

Well I can say that my bounty ticks are 4-5mill behind the bounty ticks I was getting on Sisi. Also they were 2-3mill behind WITH A DRAKE HELPING ME. It was a pretty low skilled drake to be fair but still, omg so slow. Problem is living in a wh I will need to make the time to do a thorough test as I did on Sisi. Problem is of course that I have far more bling on my Marauder on TQ since, you know, I don't want to lose it so is it really a fair test?

Regardless It is far slower on TQ than on Sisi. That is what my numbers show.

Oh and regarding the links: Thats STANDARD C5 kit. Please learn to wh before making inane comments about it. Unless you are a WH guru then I'd like to know how YOU guys run C5s without them. when I say running C5 solo I mean with links.

The Marauders WILL be able to solo, without links, C1-4 BETTER than they can now because of increased range (C4) and increased tracking (C1-3). Heck they might even be able to solo the Gas and Ore sites in C5 (with ASB of course) without links but I will need to test that to be sure.
Incidentally I ran Serpentis extravaganza on TQ and the speed was slower, bounty ticks lower though by not a huge margin around 2-3mill because of the nature of serp rats (most of them like to close in).

actually their utility in c1-4 will be of lower value because of the lack of escape and logistics options. when in bastion mode.
Transients in linked wh will have much more time to find and warp to bastioned marauders and find reinforcements to come kill said marauders with competing wh groups at a much higher advantage then previously because they bring both logistics and cap warfare which is the glaring weakness of marauders in bastion.


Was this mission run the same way that the Sisi version was run, and its not the amount on the ticks that are an issue but the total mission run time. also does not describe/state how many ticks were recorded for the mission (which would have alluded to but not stated total mission runtime).

Still lack of posted numbers on blinged vargur, what kind of fit were you using? it doesnt have to be exact but i could go out and run missions on sisi and tq with different fits (as you have) and intentionally made one bad (as it is unknown if you did) to prove my point. Please describe your fitting in numbers that can be compared.

Please also post times of completion. much like you did for the sisi version of that mission you tested.
[quote=Anize Oramara]
But since you want everything spoonfed I will make a comprehensive study of missions as they become available to me and as I get the chance to get out of the wormhole.