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Sticky:[Hyperion] Heavy Assault Cruiser tweaks

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 11 post(s)
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky Natural 20 Shinjiketo 1	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:25:00 - [31] - Quote TrouserDeagle wrote: Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote: TrouserDeagle wrote: I think it's a projectiles problem. they just have no dps at any ranges, ever. but a general weapons rebalance seems unlikely, considering how long this non-change has taken. I disagree, I think the abilities of artillery is favorable because of its extremely high alpha and extreme range compared to say railguns. Yes Railguns and Beams might fire faster but the DPS is about the same I find, the huge alpha is the attraction to artillery. but they don't have extreme range. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure artillery can reach farther than rails can they just have less tracking to balance
Requiescat Truly Outrageous. Black Rise Police Department 194	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:27:00 - [32] - Quote CCP Rise wrote: PS - how would you feel about an 8/4/7 Tempest? would you kindly stop ruining solo battleship slot layouts please? hands off my nanopest. hi i'm requiescat, and i'm your best friendGÖÑ
TrouserDeagle Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 720	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:27:00 - [33] - Quote Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote: TrouserDeagle wrote: Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote: TrouserDeagle wrote: I think it's a projectiles problem. they just have no dps at any ranges, ever. but a general weapons rebalance seems unlikely, considering how long this non-change has taken. I disagree, I think the abilities of artillery is favorable because of its extremely high alpha and extreme range compared to say railguns. Yes Railguns and Beams might fire faster but the DPS is about the same I find, the huge alpha is the attraction to artillery. but they don't have extreme range. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure artillery can reach farther than rails can they just have less tracking to balance nope. they have no range, no tracking and no dps. it's all in the volley damage, and the no-cap and damage types thing.
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1443	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:28:00 - [34] - Quote The tempest main problem is, a battleship that devote BOTH bonuses to damage and yet is the among lowest damage of all on realistic fits. Only 6 lows is not enough for a competitive tank AND competitive damage mod number. It does need 7 low slots. OR one of its damage mods changed. Something like 5% rof and 7.5% Damage per level . That way the battleship with 2 damage mods would STILL not be among the highest damage ones, but would not be on the bottom as well. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Musashibou Benkei Combined Imperial Fleet Black Legion. 37	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:28:00 - [35] - Quote Tempest is fine as it is now with its versatility in choice of either shield or armor fitting. If you're going to take a slot and put it into the lows, take it from high instead of mid. As many people have stated, the problem with ishtars is their ability to use sentries and be insanely mobile as well. Outside of using bombs in null, low sec fights have no "good" way of taking away their dps unless you want to sacrifice a smarty battleship to the pvp Gods each time. On a side note, you guys at CCP need to not just "tweak the current" but also keep adding new things. The last thing you actually added to the game was a single t2 mining frigate and nothing else (I'm not counting the mordus ships because I don't consider them "line ships"). It's just a circling of encouraging/forcing people to train skills they didn't have to train before or further eyecandy. Where is the t2 smartbombing ship? Where is the mobile cyno jamming ship? Where is the sub-cap mini-triage ship? I'm not saying these ideas are good or anything but goddamn; these latest patches are seriously lacking in actual new content.
TrouserDeagle Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 720	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:28:00 - [36] - Quote Requiescat wrote: solo battleship please, rise and fozzie are delusional enough already
Gizznitt Malikite Agony Unleashed Agony Empire 4049	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:28:00 - [37] - Quote The Ishtar currently has Quote: Gallente Cruiser bonuses (per skill level): 7.5% bonus to Heavy Drone max velocity and tracking speed 10% bonus to Drone hitpoints and damage Heavy Assault Cruisers bonuses (per skill level): 5000m bonus to Drone operation range 7.5% bonus to Sentry Drone optimal range and tracking speed Role Bonus: 50% reduction in Microwarpdrive signature radius penalty Would the 7.5% bonus to Heavy drone max velocity and tracking also be nerfed to 5%? or Are we ONLY changing the Sentry Drone Optimal Range and Tracking Speed HAC bonus? I think this is a good start, but it will still be extremely powerful.
Neckbeard Nolyfe Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:28:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Rise wrote: Ishtar: Bonus to drone tracking and optimal range from 7.5% per level -> 5% per level Max Velocity from 195 -> 185 Just reduce the cap regen on the ishtar by 20%.
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1443	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:30:00 - [39] - Quote Requiescat wrote: CCP Rise wrote: PS - how would you feel about an 8/4/7 Tempest? would you kindly stop ruining solo battleship slot layouts please? hands off my nanopest. Whatever you can do with the current tempest you can do better with the typhoon (specially the nano niche) . The tempest, havign 2 bonuses for guns directly should be able to do more damage and that a 7th low slot would help into. But I woudl stil prefer to keep current layout and make the DAMAGE bonus to 7.5% per level 12.5% more damage would not break ANYTHING and would make it competitive. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky Natural 20 Shinjiketo 1	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:30:00 - [40] - Quote TrouserDeagle wrote: Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote: TrouserDeagle wrote: Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote: TrouserDeagle wrote: I think it's a projectiles problem. they just have no dps at any ranges, ever. but a general weapons rebalance seems unlikely, considering how long this non-change has taken. I disagree, I think the abilities of artillery is favorable because of its extremely high alpha and extreme range compared to say railguns. Yes Railguns and Beams might fire faster but the DPS is about the same I find, the huge alpha is the attraction to artillery. but they don't have extreme range. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure artillery can reach farther than rails can they just have less tracking to balance nope. they have no range, no tracking and no dps. it's all in the volley damage, and the no-cap and damage types thing. Yea you're right, just looking at pyfa shows the artillery trades some optimal range for fall off and the rails have more optimal but less fall off, leading to about the same overall range

colera deldios 187	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:31:00 - [41] - Quote A 10 ms and 2.5% bonus reduction to drones won't really do anything that impressive. Like most people pointed that will still be more than enough to hit for about the same DPS as they do now. If you wan't to do a proper nerf that will keep Ishtar viable but bring it down to be somewhat inline with then simply remove 1 low slot or do a reduction in power grid so that you cannot fit 2x 1600 II Plate + resist mods. You get unreasonable raw HP in armor combined with high resists of HAC and then you also get extra low slots to fit in a DCU + active hardners to plug in pretty much every dps hole. - 1 Low slot - 5% Power Grid
Arkon Olacar Imperial Guardians Spaceship Samurai 370	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:33:00 - [42] - Quote CCP Rise wrote: Ishtar: Bonus to drone tracking and optimal range from 7.5% per level -> 5% per level Max Velocity from 195 -> 185 We expect that some of you will feel this is far too gentle on the Ishtar, and we understand that (it's what we heard from the CSM as well), but we get releases very often now and we're happy to be conservative here, rather than nuke it out of the game, and just make more changes if they're needed in the following release. You've tickled the ishtar when you should be taking a hammer to the damn thing. Warping to zero
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1443	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:33:00 - [43] - Quote Harvey James wrote: i expected the ishtar change ... will the domi change aswell then? Eagle - i did say in the HAC page it was far too slow .. would be nice at 200 along with some drones .. it has a dronebay now on the model and would allow for blaster variants then instead of only rails ... Vagabond - please nerf its speed ... resilience is the theme of HACS remember so why is it just as quick as a stabber and cynabal??? You nuts? The vagabond is already MUCH slower than it used to be. It was suposed to be the fastest cruiser in game. Hacs are about SPECIALIZATION. It SHOUdl be as quick as the stabber because it is an ENHANCED STTABBER!!! Vagabonds are already barely used on mobility based warfare. On other hand you want the caldari sniper to go faster? "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Guth'Alak EVE University Ivy League 17	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:34:00 - [44] - Quote CCP Rise wrote: Ishtar: Bonus to drone tracking and optimal range from 7.5% per level -> 5% per level Max Velocity from 195 -> 185 Of course you had to nerf them 1 week after i trained into them!
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1443	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:35:00 - [45] - Quote Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote: Yea you're right, just looking at pyfa shows the artillery trades some optimal range for fall off and the rails have more optimal but less fall off, leading to about the same overall range Nope. rails ahve far more effective range. 100km range and 20 falloff is SEVERAL times better than 20 range and 100 falloff. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
TrouserDeagle Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 720	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:35:00 - [46] - Quote Guth'Alak wrote: CCP Rise wrote: Ishtar: Bonus to drone tracking and optimal range from 7.5% per level -> 5% per level Max Velocity from 195 -> 185 Of course you had to nerf them 1 week after i trained into them! a tiny nerf like this confirms that there won't be a real nerf for a long time or possibly ever.
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 729	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:36:00 - [47] - Quote A question -- have you considered simply removing sentry drones from the list of drones to which the Ishtar confers a bonus? With the drone skill revamp done recently, it ought to be fairly straightforward from a technical perspective (unless, of course, I'm missing something.) Sentries are largely what make the Ishtar so strong, and it's not like the sentry drone would fall completely out of favor after being excised from the Ishtar. Doing this would provide a reason to fly a Dominix again. This post was crafted by a member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 846	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:36:00 - [48] - Quote Kagura Nikon wrote: The tempest main problem is, a battleship that devote BOTH bonuses to damage and yet is the among lowest damage of all on realistic fits. Only 6 lows is not enough for a competitive tank AND competitive damage mod number. It does need 7 low slots. OR one of its damage mods changed. Something like 5% rof and 7.5% Damage per level . That way the battleship with 2 damage mods would STILL not be among the highest damage ones, but would not be on the bottom as well. 7-5-7 ......6 turrets feel free to remove some launchers 7.5% ROF 7.5% damage maybe switch its mass with phoon and then buff its speed and agility Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name.. remove drone assist mechanic. Nerf web strength ..... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please.
NEONOVUS Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us 875	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:36:00 - [49] - Quote Ishtar role bonus: 20% reduction in bandwidth for heavy drones Ishtar bandwidth reduced from 125 to 100
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky Natural 20 Shinjiketo 1	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:38:00 - [50] - Quote Querns wrote: A question -- have you considered simply removing sentry drones from the list of drones to which the Ishtar confers a bonus? With the drone skill revamp done recently, it ought to be fairly straightforward from a technical perspective (unless, of course, I'm missing something.) Sentries are largely what make the Ishtar so strong, and it's not like the sentry drone would fall completely out of favor after being excised from the Ishtar. Doing this would provide a reason to fly a Dominix again. I think it would be no different than any other drone boat for that matter, why bring an ishtar without sentries when you can just field 2 VNI's for the same price seeing as the VNI is the closest drone boat competitor to the ishtar

Diivil Magellanic Itg Goonswarm Federation 273	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:38:00 - [51] - Quote Not big enough nerf to stop everyone from flying Ishtars so essentially nothing changes. Take a drone away from them or do something else that actually matters.
Rek Seven Probe Patrol Ixtab. 1632	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:38:00 - [52] - Quote Regarding the Ishtar, sentry drones are the problem, not the ship. Increase the signature radius or completely change their mechanics by having them stay within 5km of the ship and not be an independent stationary turret, which is unbalanced when compared to how every other weapon system works! What's going to happen when this change makes no difference whatsoever? Are you going to remove the tracking speed bonus completely? +1
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1443	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:42:00 - [53] - Quote Harvey James wrote: Kagura Nikon wrote: The tempest main problem is, a battleship that devote BOTH bonuses to damage and yet is the among lowest damage of all on realistic fits. Only 6 lows is not enough for a competitive tank AND competitive damage mod number. It does need 7 low slots. OR one of its damage mods changed. Something like 5% rof and 7.5% Damage per level . That way the battleship with 2 damage mods would STILL not be among the highest damage ones, but would not be on the bottom as well. 7-5-7 ......6 turrets feel free to remove some launchers 7.5% ROF 7.5% damage maybe switch its mass with phoon and then buff its speed and agility 7.5% ROF is TOO powerful. It increases much faster than damage. 7-5-7 5% rof 7.5% damage would be my GOLDEN attack bs. Youc an even reduce the drone bandwidth to 25... It woudl be a mobile ship focused on GUNS. I "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Loraine Gess Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists 449	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:43:00 - [54] - Quote Please do not nerf the tempest in this way. Its versatility is very good with 5 mid slots and 6 low slots means I can throw on everything I need without even the eighth slot. If you give it an eighth low it's just going to be a brick typhoon with guns.
Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 846	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:43:00 - [55] - Quote Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Greygal wrote: Is there a timetable for the Ishtar and other HAC changes to go live? I.e., will these changes be going live before, during, or after the Alliance Tournament? Thanks! GG Hyperion's release date is September 23, 2014, so after the AT. thats the oceanus release date ... august 26th is Hyperion http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/ccp-seagull-becomes-executive-producer-for-eve-online/ Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name.. remove drone assist mechanic. Nerf web strength ..... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please.
Fredric Wolf Black Sheep Down Tactical Narcotics Team 62	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:43:00 - [56] - Quote The discussion I am having in a chat channel suggest that tweaking the Sentries is not enough of a change. The proposal they are putting forward is this Ishtar to have the sentry bonus removed entirely and replaced with a bonus to medium drone tracking and speed.
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1443	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:44:00 - [57] - Quote NEONOVUS wrote: Ishtar role bonus: 20% reduction in bandwidth for heavy drones Ishtar bandwidth reduced from 125 to 100 then what you do with the other 2 bonuses? Incomplete solutions are not helpfull. Ishtar already uses only 2 of its bonuses at same time. The problem of the ishtar if no one can see is too many mids. Make shield tanking ishtars with 3 damage mods too easy. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
TrouserDeagle Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel 720	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:44:00 - [58] - Quote Rek Seven wrote: Regarding the Ishtar, sentry drones are the problem, not the ship. Increase the signature radius or completely change their mechanics by having them stay within 5km of the ship and not be an independent stationary turret, which is unbalanced when compared to how every other weapon system works! What's going to happen when this change makes no difference whatsoever? Are you going to remove the tracking speed bonus completely? they need to distinguish between different ishtar fits. brawly armour ones are not broken or OP or ever used, and yet they are getting a speed nerf because of the abusive kitey ones.
Harvey James The Sengoku Legacy 846	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:44:00 - [59] - Quote Kagura Nikon wrote: Harvey James wrote: Kagura Nikon wrote: The tempest main problem is, a battleship that devote BOTH bonuses to damage and yet is the among lowest damage of all on realistic fits. Only 6 lows is not enough for a competitive tank AND competitive damage mod number. It does need 7 low slots. OR one of its damage mods changed. Something like 5% rof and 7.5% Damage per level . That way the battleship with 2 damage mods would STILL not be among the highest damage ones, but would not be on the bottom as well. 7-5-7 ......6 turrets feel free to remove some launchers 7.5% ROF 7.5% damage maybe switch its mass with phoon and then buff its speed and agility 7.5% ROF is TOO powerful. It increases much faster than damage. 7-5-7 5% rof 7.5% damage would be my GOLDEN attack bs. Youc an even reduce the drone bandwidth to 25... It woudl be a mobile ship focused on GUNS. I well 50mb ... medium drones offer better damage application than heavies anyway Tech 3's need to be multi role ships not cruiser hulls with battleship tank and insane resists ABC's are clearly T2 in all but name.. remove drone assist mechanic. Nerf web strength ..... module tiercide FTW role based instead of tiers please.
Catherine Laartii Providence Guard Templis CALSF 233	Posted - 2014.07.29 14:45:00 - [60] - Quote Harvey James wrote: Kagura Nikon wrote: The tempest main problem is, a battleship that devote BOTH bonuses to damage and yet is the among lowest damage of all on realistic fits. Only 6 lows is not enough for a competitive tank AND competitive damage mod number. It does need 7 low slots. OR one of its damage mods changed. Something like 5% rof and 7.5% Damage per level . That way the battleship with 2 damage mods would STILL not be among the highest damage ones, but would not be on the bottom as well. 7-5-7 ......6 turrets feel free to remove some launchers 7.5% ROF 7.5% damage maybe switch its mass with phoon and then buff its speed and agility Go 8 guns, drop RoF for tracking speed. I'm fine either with them keeping the current slot setup on that or going with 4 mids and 7 lows, because it sets it up better as a proper attack battleship. It currently doesn't get any damage projection or application bonuses, and is the only attack battleship not to do so. Besides; tracking speed would help it apply its dps SIGNIFICANTLY better if you're fitting ACs on it.



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