Curse has a bonus to drone damagere

That d-scan invisibility seems rather powerful in some situations.

Falcon and Rook

• -50% ECM cycle time
• +50% ewar optimal/falloff

This would make ECM more reliable and/or allow them to fit non-bonused ewar with significantly increased range. Target painting effectively from 150km for example. Something similar could be done with the scorpion as well.

[
Im not saying do a 180 on ecm, im just saying make them more effective than they are currently, because at the moment they are pretty pointless, may as well just load up the rook with a full midslot tank instead haha
Missiles would make more sense on the falcon too agreed.

Just finished reading everything that was posted over night. Here's what I can update with at the moment:

Biggest concern at the moment is the added EHP. Making recons a more realistic fleet option next to T3 cruisers is good, making them too tanky in smaller situations where their ewar already gives them a lot of damage evasion may be too much. Not sure if change is needed but will keep looking at this and update again asap.

Dscan immunity is staying. We understand a lot of the concerns raised, but for most of them you guys are doing a great job making strong counter-arguments and I think it will be very interesting to see how this mechanic plays out on TQ. I want to put together a lengthier post soon with more explanation for this mechanic and why we feel comfortable with it, but you will have to wait a bit longer for that.

The Pilgrim. Opinions seem mixed, gaining neut range is obviously nice but many of you still feel that giving up neut strength is too harsh, or that some other added power is needed (more damage for instance). Will get back to you on this as soon as possible but it's possible that we will make adjustments.

RLML for Rook. Sure. Consider it done.

More low slots for Lachesis. Not sure yet on this one, will talk it over here and see what we can do.

Hope that answers some questions. I'm sure many of you would rather have more explanation for the dscan immunity change so I'll try to get that post together as soon as I can.

Thanks for all the feedback.

[...]and the smaller your gang, the more likely you are to be punched in the face by those implications.

BECAUSE THAT is 1 trillion times more powerful. Think before you post please.

When Rice says that lack on information or intel makes people take chances is right...up to a point. After getting punched one too many times (as Ripard says) you start NOT taking chances and not engaging.

It's so they can say they "consulted" the player base before they made the change.

Which is exactly what they have done, they consulted the player base, granted he's then gone on to ignore the views of the eve players, their paying customers, but what the hell our opinion's clearly unimportant, after all, we only have to play the game once they've made the PVP experience into an even worse abortion than it already is.

As a guesstimate, I'd say 75-80-% of the people posting in here dislike the d-scan change, but like I said why should the majority view of the players of the game matter to it's developers? They've already made the decision to foist a change we don't want on us, they're not consulting with us they're simply informing us of their decision, and we can either like it or lump it.

In many of the later patches you introduce a SPECIAL bonus that is not in line with all the rest of the general mechanics and there is always a SPECIAL ship that brakes the rules (bubble immunity ceptors, micro jump drives which apart from the ridiculous 100km warp they are immune to warp disruptors, ships that have old school nosferatus which drains cap continiously and now... ships that they are immune to scanner! without a cloaking device..).

As for DSCAN immunity, the whiners can suck it. People need to learn to be less risk averse. .

They don't :)

Today: X people in local, Y on dscan => the rest are cloaky ships.
After Proteus: X people in local, Y on dscan => the rest are either combat recons or cloaky ships.

Plan accordingly ...

Correction - Today: X people in local, Y on dscan => The rest are in cloaky ships, docked up, or outside of dscan range.

This is very important since many fights are taken because you think they can potentially be over before the people not on D-scan can warp to you. The combat recons will be able to warp to you from a pounce AND be really effective combat ships.

I think giving the Combat Recons the dscan immunity AND increased combat ability is over the top. Leave them as they were or decrease their power a little bit if you're going to give them dscan immunity.

Basicly, the whole dscan feature is outdated.
All ships have the same equipment
- same dscan range
-100% chances to work (except 0% chance on cloak / minute)
- same visibility on dscan of others -ability to see the ship name like a beacon :)

It would be good to include scanner strength and range, and partial results. Using target' signature radius would make sense.
Advanced dscan ability could include ability to reminder given ship's signature and links with combat probe scanner.

I guess CCP Rise answer pointed in a dscan change direction

Correction - Today: X people in local, Y on dscan => The rest are in cloaky ships, docked up, or outside of dscan range.

This is very important since many fights are taken because you think they can potentially be over before the people not on D-scan can warp to you. The combat recons will be able to warp to you from a pounce AND be really effective combat ships.

I think giving the Combat Recons the dscan immunity AND increased combat ability is over the top. Leave them as they were or decrease their power a little bit if you're going to give them dscan immunity.

Gryla and her Yule Lads are coming to eat all the FW kids.

Make Huginn missile boat to just like the belli and rapier.

Yes, people are risk averse, they want to make good decisions when they're taking risks and that often leads being conservative. That's exactly why I like this kind of mechanic. People want to do the fun thing and take more engagements, but when they have enough information to know that they aren't the favorite they shy away from fighting. However, when some information is obscured they become optimistic and take more risks. I've seen players so willing to make decisions that are likely too risky simply because they lack perfect information. Jumping into gate camps where positional information isn't guaranteed, engaging on stations with people docked, fighting in systems with more in local than can be accounted for, etc. These mechanics that obscure information give people the excuses needed to take risks. Take the example given somewhere in this thread of a low sec camp with 2 Vexors and 2 Rooks. Before these changes, the gang considering fighting them never would because they know they can't deal with the Rooks. After, they won't see them and so they will probably engage. That's more fights because people are risk averse.

The negative side for me is your other bullet point. Because people don't want to take unnecessary risk they will work very hard, sometimes doing something very boring or difficult, just to get at those last pieces of information. And they should. But we would want to avoid mechanics that obligate people to this kind of behavior too heavily without enough positive side to make the mechanic worthwhile.

I would be more worried with this mechanic that people have to spend a lot of time running probe scans when they really don't want to be than that they are avoiding engagements because of the possibility of Recons. I don't think this will be a problem but we'll have to wait and see.

No ship in EvE had that trait yet..and for a reason.

Getting all snarky and butthurt at the guy making a change is a surefire and foolproof way to get him to change his mind!

Well done.

Psycology is nto simple.. even the psycology of eve players. Players that react as your view are the ones that likely are already too coward to provide enough content in the game.

So Rise point of view seems to be, invest on the players that already have gut enough to be useful content generators and if the ones that already do not generate much generate even less.. whatever...

He might be wrong.. but he has a line of tought that can be understood.

Literally what I have been saying for years. So happy to know you guys realize this too.

as several peopel pointed. Stratios can already do that.. and is barely used to do that.

So this will happen, but not as much as some people believe.

Never thought so many people would be terrified of Schrodinger's recon. I mean his proteus has been or not been lurking for quite some time.

Yeah, especially when Schrodinger's Falcon has been or has not been lurking around for ages.

literrature