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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
rValdez5987 Amarr 32nd Amarrian Imperial Navy Regiment.	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:06:00 - [451] Originally by: CCP Wrangler We have discovered an exploit involving starbases that made it possible for some players to gain an unfair advantage over others. We have taken measures to address this by removing the starbases used in the exploit. Additionally, assets gained from its use have been seized and bans levied against the players involved. We will continue to monitor the game for issues such as this one. We encourage players to create a petition if become aware of any activities which may permit others to gain an unfair advantage in the game. I just wanted to add a bit of irony. In the real world money has literally disappeared with financial's and banking disappearing or otherwise going bankrupt. Now in eve, trillons of isk are supposedly gained through exploitation. Luckily for us, no matter what the situation is in the markets, there will always be a base income until CCP changes it. There will always be missions to run.
Glasyra	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:08:00 - [452] Fanfest we talked about issues with making money with moon mins, the margins were small to nonexistant on almost everything and as a non exploiter doing the moon stuff for almost 6 months, I think I ended up with 2bil total. Keep in mind I carrier rated to get the money to buy a rorqual in about a month so the amount of work I put in to make T2 equipment components was HUGE and after a while, not worth it. (cost of time != value) I had 4 large, 3 med, and a host of small towers going mind you, I was lucky to see much profit after I counted the time spent making it work. What really gets me is the fact people were geting mins for free while I had to do it the hard way, basicly stealing from the honest producers. If anything the prices should go through the roof, real people will have to actully make the stuff now, if anything the exploit wasent limited to ferogel eather, apperntly anything would have duped (I wont say how its done) Ferogel was just the one that got found out.
Resetgun Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:18:00 - [453] It is very hard to believe that CCP missed bug of this scale frakking 4 years!!!! ... and I don't believe single second that they would have seized ALL goods gained from this bug. If they would seize all - entire economy would be fubared by now. "As long as there are greedy people and the devs do nothing, it will work." - Dentara Rast, billionaire
destinationZERO Minmatar Pain Management Services	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:20:00 - [454] Edited by: destinationZERO on 11/12/2008 08:20:35 Originally by: Resetgun It is very hard to believe that CCP missed bug of this scale frakking 4 years!!!! Keep in mind CCP missed out on a 'bug' of ghost training for 5 years, which was a widely known and used by the eve community... /me wonders what else is hiding in those POS mechanics... I'm pretty sure there's more interesting stuff to come :) -- yes. That would be me, not you.
Bodhisattvas Crepitus Ventris	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:23:00 - [455] Originally by: Baske Edited by: Baske on 11/12/2008 08:00:24 Originally by: PROTOCOL Quote: This is just sick, how many alliances have been funded by this for 4 years while others have been working there asses off to to maintain there outposts A post on the forums ran by the emotards of this game, by a banned player who is likely retaliating is the only indication of the length of this exploit. They had lot's of ferrogel in their hanger just doesnt cut it as proof. Why don't you wait to see what ccp has to say. Do all you tin foil hatters think that they can provide an answer right away? This came to light in the middle of the damn night in iceland, you know that place where ccp work and live. This will take an investigation, ccp doesnt have a button they can push to spit out a list like you all want. Sit back, relax and I bet when the facts come out it is nowhere near the scope that this mob mentality has made it out to be. But keep screaming, you all look like fools. You sound more guilty than anyone in this thread, trying to stop people from complaining about an issue which most likely has had 10 times more impact on the game than 9/11 had to real life. Time out you muppet !! how could you even imagine the impact of 9/11 and even dare to disrespect the people that died in comparing it to a bloody game economy. You and the rest of the emotards whinging about nothing need a reality check. **** really does happen and if your virual empire is destroyed because of whatever get over it! play another game or something!!
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:23:00 - [456] Hmm, why all this panic about a game economy collapsing, I mean someone can just edit a few database fields and our spaceships need half the materials to build if there is any real problems with shortages. Interesting times if you were quick enough to place your bet in the market game, might win or lose a fortune
Furb Killer Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:24:00 - [457] While i dont doubt certain people/corporations/alliances got rich by doing this, is there any reason to assume like many here do that it did have a significant impact on the economy, and that prices are going to skyrocket like some people want you to believe? btw lol @ the one who thinks servers should be reset now. --------------------------------------------- Originally by: Neth'Rae Military experts are calling this a troll.
Solomon XI Hoist The Colors. Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:25:00 - [458] Guys, CCP will offer a detailed post about it. A CCP DEV confirmed in an entirely different thread that CCP would release a detailed statement regarding this today. Don't ask me to find it ... I'm too damn tired. Let's give them time to wake up, have some tea, and get a game-plan together. *** I frankly don't give a damn if CCP loses subscribers for doing the right thing. They messed up and should bite the bullet. I think all null-sec Sovereignty should be completely reset. All capitals which were potentially funded by this exploit removed, and all POS's for the offending alliances deleted. Course', I am a hard-ass. *** Be patient. Let's see what CCP does. I'm sure someone at CCP is getting yelled at today.
Rock'n'Roll Lady	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:25:00 - [459] And i have been mining and grinding mission and ratting after getting my ship blown up to buy another one and all this while people were exploiting current system with full knowledge of CCP, i m pretty angry right now, CCP should backtrack and try to ban all who benefited from this and seize every item/isk that came through this. This is very depressing at same time and we want Full CCP response to this for **** sake here we are investing our RL time and/or money to subscribe and get items mined or isk grinding and people are exploiting it right under CCP nose. disgusting.. CCP
Solaris04 Gallente Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:27:00 - [460] not a surprise, kia whit an alt corp on iitanmadan have around 50 pos reaction and evoke 25+

Lyvanna Kitaen Minmatar Noonday Sun Corp	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:32:00 - [461] Anyone remember this thread from a year ago? "Ferrofluid making a loss" http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=627156 It makes a bit more sense now.
Carniflex Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:34:00 - [462] If the 4 year claim is true then it's pretty damn bad advantage for some groups. No wonder there were T2 BPO syndicates arising over the time. It will take serious effort (and most likely considerable game mechaniks overhaul) to try to fix massive advantages offered by this exploit. Complete POS overhaul and nuking of T2 BPO's would be good start, as while some BPO's are no doubt aquired in honest way majority of them are most likely involved in schemes with dirty exploit isk. I'm however confident that CCP are doing their best at damage control now that the issue has been risen into focus.
rValdez5987 Amarr 32nd Amarrian Imperial Navy Regiment.	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:35:00 - [463] Originally by: Bodhisattvas Originally by: Baske Edited by: Baske on 11/12/2008 08:00:24 Originally by: PROTOCOL Quote: This is just sick, how many alliances have been funded by this for 4 years while others have been working there asses off to to maintain there outposts A post on the forums ran by the emotards of this game, by a banned player who is likely retaliating is the only indication of the length of this exploit. They had lot's of ferrogel in their hanger just doesnt cut it as proof. Why don't you wait to see what ccp has to say. Do all you tin foil hatters think that they can provide an answer right away? This came to light in the middle of the damn night in iceland, you know that place where ccp work and live. This will take an investigation, ccp doesnt have a button they can push to spit out a list like you all want. Sit back, relax and I bet when the facts come out it is nowhere near the scope that this mob mentality has made it out to be. But keep screaming, you all look like fools. You sound more guilty than anyone in this thread, trying to stop people from complaining about an issue which most likely has had 10 times more impact on the game than 9/11 had to real life. Time out you muppet !! how could you even imagine the impact of 9/11 and even dare to disrespect the people that died in comparing it to a bloody game economy. You and the rest of the emotards whinging about nothing need a reality check. **** really does happen and if your virual empire is destroyed because of whatever get over it! play another game or something!! I dunno your being too serious m8. I'm an American and his comment didn't hurt me at all. It wasn't offensive either. I guess its because I see what he is trying to say, and I half assed agree.
Solomon XI Hoist The Colors. Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:39:00 - [464] So ... as Chribba said ... Bin Laden is behind this whole moon scheme exploit thingy?
Bumbum George	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:46:00 - [465] OH HELL NO! Now whether all the outrageous claims are true or not, this "incident" shows once again what a drama potential Eve has As much as I enjoy all the forum hysteria, I'm afraid "an amusing time on the forums" will not be enough to attract some new players and justify 15 bucks a month. On the contrary the bad publicity might even scare of some of those scarce individuals. Oh and if the claims should really be true (which we will never find out for sure): shame on me for still playing this game!
Von Hinten	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:52:00 - [466] Edited by: Von Hinten on 11/12/2008 08:53:44 I want heads rolling. Ilost proberbly billions of isk for doing real reactions that other ppl just exploitet. Iam feeling so $º$º%º&º$34%$ OHH AND REMOVE ALL %$&/&%&%&%& T2 BPOS OF GAME THEY ARE ALL BOUGHT BY DIRTY EXPLOITER MONEY JUST A METHOD TO WASH YOUR DAMN EXPLOITER MONEX
Ephemeron Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:52:00 - [467] Originally by: Lyvanna Kitaen Anyone remember this thread from a year ago? "Ferrofluid making a loss" http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=627156 It makes a bit more sense now. That's actually pretty interesting. It is indirect evidence that the exploit was widely spread 1 year ago. I dunno about 4 years, was there even moon mining 4 years ago?
Mecinia Lua Galactic Express Burning Horizons	Posted - 2008.12.11 08:58:00 - [468] Originally by: Ephemeron Originally by: Lyvanna Kitaen Anyone remember this thread from a year ago? "Ferrofluid making a loss" http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=627156 It makes a bit more sense now. That's actually pretty interesting. It is indirect evidence that the exploit was widely spread 1 year ago. I dunno about 4 years, was there even moon mining 4 years ago? t2 Ships and components were introduced in Castor, so yes they were around 4 years ago. Thoughts expressed are mine and mine alone. They do not necessarily reflect my alliances thoughts. Your signature is too large. Please resize it to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Mitnal
Miyamoto Uroki Caldari Katsu Corporation	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:00:00 - [469] Yes, moon mining was introduced 4 years ago, so the guy who made this public says this bug had been ingame and working since introduction of POS system at all. Makes me a very sad panda if true. Had a hard time earning my little isk to be able to buy me my little ships and CCP doesn't survey the big economy flows? What does this Mr. Economy professor do all day long at your company? At least admit that he is only working at ccp for a day per month...
Elisa Day Shade. Penumbra Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:03:00 - [470] Originally by: Mecinia Lua Originally by: Ephemeron Originally by: Lyvanna Kitaen Anyone remember this thread from a year ago? "Ferrofluid making a loss" http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=627156 It makes a bit more sense now. That's actually pretty interesting. It is indirect evidence that the exploit was widely spread 1 year ago. I dunno about 4 years, was there even moon mining 4 years ago? t2 Ships and components were introduced in Castor, so yes they were around 4 years ago. Castor was released in December 2003, but T2 components were agent mission rewards then... Moon mining came with shiva/exodus, released in november 2004, pretty much exactly 4 years ago.

Col Callahan Caldari Oberon Incorporated Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:04:00 - [471] What has been done has been done and it has change the game in ways we will never fully know. Because this is a free economy were ever the exploit "black holed" the market will recover and go up do to the lack of supply due to the removal of the "BUG". I can't see a role back or any way to punish or take back what has been done to the game. As unfair as it feels, the ones who were doing it no long can or will be allowed to I think and the bug that has allowed them to stay alive this long will no longer allow them to be unbeatable because of unlimited amounts of isk flowing in from exploit land. In short, its unfair, it sucks, but are you going to log in tomorrow or are you going to leave. Ether way, I look forward to what the market does over this.
Makeme A'Billion Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:17:00 - [472] Isn't it funny that a big majority if not all of the people complaining here have one way or the other had or benefited from that "exploited" isk at any one time. Also quite possibly at least half the people complaining have known/been associated with someone who was doing it. Because come on, you cant all be so naive that you just think ONLY 3 "powerblocs" as the SHC post says knew about it. Either way, it's being "fixed" now be good traders and benefit from it
Hugh Ruka Exploratio et Industria Morispatia	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:19:00 - [473] Originally by: Haas Tabris Originally by: Gnulpie Originally by: royal killer Everyone got greedy, and when they found out about this exploit, nobody said anything But, 4 whole years....that's like 1460 days and nobody said anything! absurd. (didn't know about this btw.) Sorry to burst your bubble. But did you have a look at dys prices BEFORE invention? Actually there were even free dys moons because it was just not worth to harvest those moons. There were only so few t2 items built compared to the time when invention became possible that the demand for those moon production were just very low. Invention changed the demand for these things drastically. So you only can really count from this point of time. Before invention those whole moon products were more or less unsellable and worthless. actually, this is totally true. i tried moon mining before invention and you literally had to know someone who needed the stuff in order to do anything with it. there just was no market for moon materials. even in jita. so, go back two years and see who was exploiting this. i just wonderin if ccp will do anything... why do you think moon mining was not profitable? there was a good supply of basicaly free materials ? maybe that's it ? anyway this is quite fun ... just another little crisis in a fiction world ... the bets are that T2 items will increase in cost and t1 production will be worth a bit more as many people will not be able to afford T2 anymore. pirates will be happy, t2 loot will actualy make a healthy profit ... --- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed !
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:22:00 - [474] Originally by: Miyamoto Uroki Yes, moon mining was introduced 4 years ago, so the guy who made this public says this bug had been ingame and working since introduction of POS system at all. Makes me a very sad panda if true. Had a hard time earning my little isk to be able to buy me my little ships and CCP doesn't survey the big economy flows? What does this Mr. Economy professor do all day long at your company? At least admit that he is only working at ccp for a day per month... I know a bit about the moon material markets including ferrogel, fermionic condensates and such. Only the couple of last weeks there were stupidly low prices for these and big sales going on. Before that the market was quite stable and fixed to the dys (and to lesser degree prom). A decoupling of price of produced items from the prices of materials need to build these items shows that something strange is going on. You can look at the market history and see that only in the recent weeks the price of those ferrogel etc. dropped heavily (and below production costs). Also: the prices for moon materials/moon products before invention were so ridiculously low that even some dys moons were not harvested just because no one needed that stuff. So those 4 years are hugely exaggerated. Because prices were more or less okay and coupled to the dys/prom prices until a few weeks ago I think that this bug is in game and abused since the alchemy introduction. What I wonder is why no one from economic department noticed anything. They surely have numbers about production and consumption? Also: can the economic department at least give now the numbers of pre- and post-alchemy production of ferrogel etc. Compared with usage of dys and usage of the dys-substitutes? Better they do the basic stuff first instead of some fancy trends and correlations and what now. Just plain old production and consumption numbers, please.
Pr1ncess Alia Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:22:00 - [475] Edited by: Pr1ncess Alia on 11/12/2008 09:24:16 Originally by: Makeme A'Billion Isn't it funny that a big majority if not all of the people complaining here have one way or the other had or benefited from that "exploited" isk at any one time. Also quite possibly at least half the people complaining have known/been associated with someone who was doing it. Because come on, you cant all be so naive that you just think ONLY 3 "powerblocs" as the SHC post says knew about it. Either way, it's being "fixed" now be good traders and benefit from it benefited? i think everyone but those directly obtaining the isk were victimized. it diminishes the game for everyone pure and simple. how do you know the exploit itself didn't play a large part in the formation (not from ground up, but as they are now), continued growth and preservation of the powerblocs we have today? sure x bloc has 2000 members, but would they had they not been so successful given such a strong economic backbone. would other alliances that did not have that advantage perhaps have prevailed in battles vs these entities without the exploit. would some have been able to bounce back so quickly from defeats.... it goes on and on and on.....
Carniflex Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:25:00 - [476] Originally by: Makeme A'Billion Isn't it funny that a big majority if not all of the people complaining here have one way or the other had or benefited from that "exploited" isk at any one time. Also quite possibly at least half the people complaining have known/been associated with someone who was doing it. Because come on, you cant all be so naive that you just think ONLY 3 "powerblocs" as the SHC post says knew about it. Either way, it's being "fixed" now be good traders and benefit from it I would speculate that all titans in game have some taint on them. Propably most T2 BPO's that are no longer in the hands of their originial winners also. Ofc I'm a bit agitated over this - even if this does not hit me directly, as the advantage gained thru that kind of operations seems from my perspective way massive. A lot bigger effect on EVE market propably than those T20 BPO's were - there was only like 4 of them afterall.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:26:00 - [477] I get this feeling the person who said they reported this 4 years ago was lying. I mean think about it, it's a dark horrible sceret, but most people wuldn't report it becausde they would be paid not to. SO basicly someone told the wrong person and BAM the dorrs blew wide open. I bet it was a player that was really a dev.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:27:00 - [478] This gives "The minerals I mine are free." a completely new meaning.... No wonder that there were quite a few T2 modules and especially ships priced below manufacturing cost. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Carniflex Caldari StarHunt Fallout Project	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:29:00 - [479] Originally by: Gnulpie Originally by: Miyamoto Uroki Yes, moon mining was introduced 4 years ago, so the guy who made this public says this bug had been ingame and working since introduction of POS system at all. Makes me a very sad panda if true. Had a hard time earning my little isk to be able to buy me my little ships and CCP doesn't survey the big economy flows? What does this Mr. Economy professor do all day long at your company? At least admit that he is only working at ccp for a day per month... I know a bit about the moon material markets including ferrogel, fermionic condensates and such. Only the couple of last weeks there were stupidly low prices for these and big sales going on. Before that the market was quite stable and fixed to the dys (and to lesser degree prom). A decoupling of price of produced items from the prices of materials need to build these items shows that something strange is going on. You can look at the market history and see that only in the recent weeks the price of those ferrogel etc. dropped heavily (and below production costs). Also: the prices for moon materials/moon products before invention were so ridiculously low that even some dys moons were not harvested just because no one needed that stuff. So those 4 years are hugely exaggerated. Because prices were more or less okay and coupled to the dys/prom prices until a few weeks ago I think that this bug is in game and abused since the alchemy introduction. What I wonder is why no one from economic department noticed anything. They surely have numbers about production and consumption? Also: can the economic department at least give now the numbers of pre- and post-alchemy production of ferrogel etc. Compared with usage of dys and usage of the dys-substitutes? Better they do the basic stuff first instead of some fancy trends and correlations and what now. Just plain old production and consumption numbers, please. The 'issue' was most likley not that bad before invention, bcos production was capped by the amount of T2 BPO's - However - it might have provided the exploiters needed initial capital to start T2 Syndicate by using those funds to buy additional T2 BPO's from the winners of lottery.
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.12.11 09:33:00 - [480] ITT: Alts of banned players out for BLOOD. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan



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