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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 13 post(s)
Qual Gallente Cornexant Research	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:31:00 - [31] SM 2.0 will do for me. Looking at what I know I have and friends have laying around as primary or "backup" systems I still see a lot of SM 2.0 out there. Cant say I know any stuck with lower than that. Personally unless something changes during the year, a move to SM 3.0 winter 2009 would forcefully end my (at that time) 6.5 year career in Eve, as my own setup only does SM 2.0, and isn't at the end of its life yet. I guess thats as good a reason as any to stop and look around at what other stuff is out there. After that long a bit of forced hand in stopping might not be that bad. "The short version: Qual is right." -Papa Smurf
Phantom Slave JUDGE DREAD Inc.	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:32:00 - [32] Originally by: Sprobe WTF - will I still be able to use my Acer Aspire netbook to watch the market and switch skills?? Don't make me throw away my netbook! Hit your Windows Key + Pause Break at the same time. Click the Hardware tab, Device Manager. Click the [+] next to Display Adapter. What does it say here? Without that information we can't tell you if you'll be able to run Premium Lite.
Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Ursa Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:33:00 - [33] Originally by: Omber Zombie I'm in the somewhat lucky position to have a laptop capable of running premium, but I run classic atm anyway. The reason for that is classic eats the battery fairly heavily as it is, I shudder to think how bad premium would be. Yes, I could just 'plug it in' but I'm one of those stubborn people that think laptops are for using while not sitting at your desk... Yeah, there's a lot of people who think since it's a laptop, it shouldn't be chained to a power-supply. I laugh, when they have to replace their battery after a year or two.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:36:00 - [34] Originally by: Gone'Postal Sounds good to me... but my amiga can't run eve :( oh no, your girlfriend can't play eve?
thelung187 Exotic Dancers Club Exalted.	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:36:00 - [35] Edited by: thelung187 on 13/01/2009 19:41:24 Quote: To accommodate older PCs and those who prefer to run twenty clients of EVE while they run SETI@Home and ray trace while compressing HD movies, we will deliver what we refer to as "Premium Lite." I almost snorted orange soda out of my nose reading that. Well played, sir. edit: This sounds like a great idea. Though, I would caution AGAINST removing Shader2 support in December (I know this is currently only under consideration), but realize that many lower-end laptops run Shader 2-series cards (Radeon Xpress 1150 boards, for example, in the Dell Vostro I'm currently writing this on). Shader 1 support is understandable, but Shader 2? I think you're asking for a bit more community backlash on that one... That said, if Shader 3 becomes the de facto standard, I'll just expense myself a new PC :P
Caiman Graystock Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:38:00 - [36] Good move, flush out the deadwood. Then you realise, after taking the time to read this sentence, that you have actually wasted your time, because this somewhat long sentence is not actually part of my post, it is my signature.
Vereesa Gallente BlackWater Research and Developement	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:38:00 - [37] I think discontinuing support for the level 2 graphics card may be a bad idea. Personally, I have a PC that supports the high detail graphics, but I often have to use a very low spec computer, which is fine for mining, but not much else. I would appreciate it if the game remained supporting the lower graphics cards (level 2)
farfrael Freelancer Union Unaffiliated	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:38:00 - [38] will this new premium thingy be supported under linux from Day 1?
Sigma Epsilon	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:39:00 - [39] I am no expert on Computer Graphic cards and have no real idea what SM2 and SM3 are. To be honest I don't care. I run 3 clients on my computer and have to use the classic graphics to ensure a good frame rate. Should eve change their specs so that I can not run 3 clients then I will simply have no choice but to pack in the game I love. I guess the only way I will find out is to try it when the versions are available. Sadly CCP spend way too much time on eye candy at the expense of the content. This is another example. Not everyone can afford to upgrade their kit. The only way I can do it is to stop paying for Eve. I am sure the 1000's of new players will more than compensate for the number of vets that may be forced to quit. Only time will tell if I can play eve.
jokerb Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:41:00 - [40] Would CCP be willing to introduce a method strictly for those docked to only render in station or even less just a basic character skill change area. I only ask because I do have a tablet pc that currently will only support classic. I only use it to change skills while I'm working / class But I would not be surprised to find that there are many others in a similar boat. Again if its too much hassle/work not a big deal, just a humble request :)

Dorsai3d Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:41:00 - [41] Dropping SM2 is a -bad- idea. I understand that it would make some dev's life easier, but I have a feeling that it would affect much more than the 0.3% of your userbase than you estimate. I know that an anecdote does not make data, but I hardly think that I'm unique here: I'm a college student. Will be for a few years yet. Hence, I'm broke. I just spent about $1500 a year ago on a laptop that I hope will last me for 3 - 4 years. Since I opted for more portable (don't want a big-ass laptop when I already have to lug around behemoth textbooks) I have a graphics card that only supports SM2. Put the removal of SM2 back a while. Maybe collect some hard statistics on player compatibility. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe most are SM3 by now. But dropping SM2 this year will cost CCP subscribers. My .02 ISK.
Jonah Willis	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:42:00 - [42] Edited by: Jonah Willis on 13/01/2009 19:43:23 SM 2.0 is okay. Mandating SM 3.0 would kill my EVE account. no I'm not upgrading anytime soon.
Destination SkillQueue Are We There Yet	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:43:00 - [43] Originally by: Spindeln . Shader 2.0 AGP cards cost the equivalent of roughly 2 months of EVE time, 3.0 around 5. If this becomes reality in a year they will be even less. And then I haven't looked at ebay or similar places for non-new stuff. It's going to cost a **** ton of money. I've been preparing for an update, so I'll be fine. The issue is that you can't just buy a new graphics card and call it a day. Almost any part I upgrade in my current PC would require buyin a new PC. Other parts of my rig just would not be compatible. Lets not pretend, that it's not going to hurt a lot of people with low-end machines and hard RL situations. CCP can have good, well justified reasons for doing it, but I want them to make the decitions with their eyes open and not to pretend it's all sunshine and lollipops for all involved. Premium light sounds great, but you should consider extending the 2.0 shader lifespan as the situation requires. You might want to start asking or compiling info on the hardware people use. And keep us informed in advance on any desitions you make. Several months before any changes go live would be appreciated. This devblog was a nice start.
Sir Nimmo Amarr Gun Metal Priests	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:45:00 - [44] I am actually not too surprised about this and I am in full support of the first step. I have an Nvidia 8800GT and will soon be getting one of those new and sexeh 17" MBPs, so I am not at risk of not being able to play. However, I do not think that dropping 2.0 support is that great an idea if it is going to leave a lot of players unable to play along. I reckon that, as was previously suggested, taking as full a poll of everyone's system specs as possible and then seeing who will be affected would be an idea. Was this not kind of hinted at during fanfest? Or was I ingesting too much booze? I was under the impression that the key reason behind maintaining the classic client was to allow the mac and linux clients to work, but now that the macs (and presumably the linux ones as well) can run the premium clients (in developer builds at least) it makes sense to drop the extra workload. Top work chaps, keep it up!
Zoiewu	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:48:00 - [45] Have 3850 on desktop and X300 on my Thinkpad which i like to use when not at desktop or if using an alt.
Ancy Denaries Caldari Solaris Operations	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:48:00 - [46] Semi happy about this. Premium Lite with SM 2.0 means that I will get "premium" on Linux without resorting to Wine. It's still just halfassed though, so no go for me :( I have a Nvidia 8800 so np on the SM3.0 stuff either. However, I do not believe dropping SM2.0 that fast is a good idea to be honest. There's a LOT of people stuck on old hardware. Balance is important, but you will always adapt to changing circumstances and you don't whine about stuff you can't change.
Kesper North Caldari Epiphyte Mining and Exploration Majesta Empire	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:52:00 - [47] DEVS: How will this affect users of newer laptops which have integrated graphics cards? I usually run EVE on a Macbook Pro (YAY OSX PREMIUM IS COMING! THANK YOU!) but I like to mine or run cyno alts on my crappy secondary laptop, which has an integrated nVidia graphics card. It runs Classic mode great, but in Premium I get 3 to 6 frames per second. Not really useable at all. Will Premium-lite get me at least 15-20 FPS on an integrated card? I can live with that. It's not ideal, but I'll cope.
Astria Tiphareth Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:53:00 - [48] Edited by: Astria Tiphareth on 13/01/2009 19:55:54 Originally by: Kaya Divine Yet another CCP failure. I do hope that you will get alot of new players, because you will for sure lose huge chunk. They quote an estimate of 5% of players. What figures are you using, and from where do you source those figures? Originally by: Digital Anarchist If you want to force us to use new hardware, at least give us an option to run wireframe graphics. Whilst I'd not claim to know anything about EVE's client architecture, on our CAD modelling software, wireframe has been known to actually be more expensive, due I believe to optimisations made in the graphics drivers for the more usual filled-in polygons. Pure wireframe is also extremely hard to work with visually (e.g. spotting a ship's wireframe against a station or gate's wireframe), compared to the more intensive hidden-line form - you might be better off biting the bullet & reducing ships to more basic parametric objects like boxes or cones with limited polys if you're seeking the ultimate. After all a box doesn't need an art department. Edit: The other issue with wireframe is that you no longer have an easy 'pick' mechanism where you translate your 2D mouse click into a 3D selection. Most of what you click would be empty space and there's nothing to intersect with (or you're required to aim carefully at the lines). If you have two ships, both wireframes overlapping, and click the empty space that happens to cover both, you're required to do probably more work to work out what you just clicked by extrapolating which is closer. Originally by: Meat Missle Why doesn't CCP form a list of everyones system specs? Steam did this a while back and allowed Valve to get an excellent picture of their target audience for Halflife 2 episodes. Good idea, I'd opt to allow a dxdiag dump etc. if asked (in fact I have by reporting bugs anyway). Originally by: Morgan La'Chance Just when we get acceptable large fleet battles due to less server lag, you're gonna make them into slideshows? I'd be interested to hear your basis for why changing shader language, and potentially requiring an upgrade in graphics cards, will reduce performance automatically? ___ My views may not represent those of my corporation, which is why I never get invited to those diplomatic parties... Environmental Effects
Slaves666	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:54:00 - [49] What about the people with top notch machines what will they be expecting? I dont wanna run eve on a laptop or crappy single/dual core machine. Are you even advancing the graphics past what they are now cos theyre looking dated by the day and thats with the premium content.
Adele Lajouis	Posted - 2009.01.13 19:58:00 - [50] If you want to remove support for SM2, then that means I can no longer play Eve on my laptop. What does this mean? It means I have to disappear upstairs for half an hour and boot up the desktop every time I want to change skills! CCP - if you want to get rid of Shader Model 2, fair enough, but make damn sure you put a system in place BEFOREHAND so that users can change skills without having to load up a shiny SM3 client on a desktop to do so. Also, implement skill training queues so we don't have to keep logging in so frequently to train multiple skill paths.


CCP Spectrum	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:00:00 - [51] Originally by: Ryuga VonRhaiden I've got a ZX Spectrum I like your style!

Namco Balls of Steel	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:00:00 - [52] Edited by: Namco on 13/01/2009 20:01:46 For those Windows users who have no idea what video card they have and/or what shader model it supports, I can suggest grabbing this program, GPU-Z (found here: http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/). The download link is at the bottom of the page. It doesn't install any 3rd party programs or anything, it's small, and should give a lot of people a pretty good idea of what kind of video card they're dealing with. Also nice in that it tells you if the card is AGP or PCI-Express- unfortunately for many people with integrated video, it won't tell you if there's an actual AGP or PCI-Express slot available for a typical video card.
Simen123 Caldari modro B.L.A.C.K.	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:00:00 - [53] Some people would have a problem to upgrading to 2.0 while a upgrade to 3.0 would mean EVE stops. one of the reasons is that some people are barely getting enough money to be able to pay bills+eat. taking from my own view i will most likely be able to go direcly to 2.0 at most, 3.0 is not a option. the biggest reason is the expenses i have as a student abroad. i cant afford using my money on too much hardware for my comp, one other issue is due to me not being able to afford highend comps or even the better high lowends it would mean death to my evetime if i was forced to do 3.0 as my current comp cant handle 3.0. Being a student abroad and not knowing where ill be next yr/month it does bring me a problem to comp choice as i cant do with desktop due to it would be too much trouble packing it up to use at school. Laptop is my only choice and i have to lease my laptop couse i cant afford to actually buy it when considering the money i get each yr gets sucked up in expenses (90% to regular taxes 10% to needed stuff like food clothing++) Yes yes i know, wall of text but better to say it all at once than posting 10 times
TheCatholic	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:01:00 - [54] My primary machine is a Dell laptop with the Intel GMA X3100, integrated set. I referred to the wiki article and saw that PS 4 with DirectX 10 is supported, but the current Premium version of Eve has been unusable. Every foreground image is pixellated and unrecognizable. Any chance that Premium-Lite will change all that and let me enjoy slightly better graphics? -Dave
Kurfin	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:01:00 - [55] Maybe a very stripped down client could be released, with no 3d gfx and no ability to undock, just to change skills check market orders and so on. This would allow those with crappy laptops that only use them for the above when they are out and about to carry on as before, maybe even get it on our phones To those whose only machine won't run it, you could pick up a second hand desktop that would quite cheaply. The game has to move forward or die.
Sir Nimmo Amarr Gun Metal Priests	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:02:00 - [56] Originally by: Slaves666 Are you even advancing the graphics past what they are now cos theyre looking dated by the day and thats with the premium content. Not that I am trying to be an arse, but what? I still see people being wowed by classic graphics, Ok, to a lesser degree than before Trinity, but still. Trinity is lovely. I don't think I have seen a prettier game recently. If I am missing it, then please, let me know, as I like pretty. (That's not meant to be a snide comment, I genuinely want to see some nice new pretty games again)
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:03:00 - [57] My poor Vaio only has Shader Model 1.4 This is pretty terrible news for me. Sad. Eve-Online: The Text Adventure
Klauos Hauptman	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:04:00 - [58] Quote: Step 2: In the Winter Expansion 2009 we are considering discontinuing support for ShaderModel 2 and make the minimum specification ShaderModel 3(GeForce 6 class cards or ATi x1300 or compatible) I was happy to read until I got here. I can see dropping SM1 as it's getting very old and making a "lite" version. Keep SM2 support for lite or maybe explain why you're the rush to drop SM2 so quickly out of the lite client. I'm a layman about 3D and graphic cards. Does SM2 support cause more work, like Classic does? If it's for Ambulation then just make it a Premium ONLY thing.
Animenick Mobius Rising	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:06:00 - [59] Don't have a shadermodel 2.0 capable card here so I guess I'd have to give up both my accounts.
Tale Chaser	Posted - 2009.01.13 20:08:00 - [60] well, i always hate change slike this, but i can REALLY see why it needs to be done. i, for one, have been using the same graphics card for 4+ years.. and will be able to survive the march update. for 50$, i can get a card that can survive the december one as well (and this even accounts for the fact that my computer is so old it uses PCI cards)... SO... go ahead. if i cant find 50$ by decemeber, i prolly shouldnt be playin eve anyway. and i WANT eve to upgrade... because, really, do we want to play eve, if its turned into that "old" looking space MMO? no. it needs teh newness...



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