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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Mohamad Transporte
Yulai Guard 1st Fleet Yulai Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:33:00 -
[1] - Quote
just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp... |
Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
717
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
I was about to talk of null sec warfare but then I remembered you just mentioned "Goons" so I think I'm going to wait and have fun reading all the funky stuff you guys are going to rabble about this.
brb |
William Walker
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
58
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Just don't undock in niarja et al? :P |
Sugar Kyle
The humbleless Crew Capital Punishment.
95
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
Because OP does not like something it will destroy the game.
OP, you have great power.
Also, how dare a 0.0 alliance enter high sec. Tilde soaked words from something kinda like a pirate. |
Solstice Project
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
1742
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:43:00 -
[5] - Quote
*lol* look at the random guy whining about people playing the game as it's meant to be played.
edit:
Mohamad Transporte wrote:that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
Oh ... either trolling or really dumb. ^_^ Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire |
Jim Hazard
Scrubfleet
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
Yes.. it is totally destroying eve... ganking in high sec has always been around and still the game kept growing every year. If the freighter pilots carry around enough cargo so that it is worth suiciding them it is their own fault.
You might as well ask for an ibis to be buffed to 1 million EHP because one guy thought its smart to undock in a rookie ship with plexs worth 60 billions or how much it was.
In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1421
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
718
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
Jim Hazard wrote:Yes.. it is totally destroying eve... ganking in high sec has always been around and still the game kept growing every year. If the freighter pilots carry around enough cargo so that it is worth suiciding them it is their own fault.
You might as well ask for an ibis to be buffed to 1 million EHP because one guy thought its smart to undock in a rookie ship with plexs worth 60 billions or how much it was.
In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds.
Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo.
Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here.
brb |
Robus Muvila
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
60
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:51:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:I was about to talk of null sec warfare but then I remembered you just mentioned "Goons" so I think I'm going to wait and have fun reading all the funky stuff you guys are going to rabble about this.
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE http://themittani.com - Because EvE has needed a proper news site for ages |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1421
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:Yes.. it is totally destroying eve... ganking in high sec has always been around and still the game kept growing every year. If the freighter pilots carry around enough cargo so that it is worth suiciding them it is their own fault.
You might as well ask for an ibis to be buffed to 1 million EHP because one guy thought its smart to undock in a rookie ship with plexs worth 60 billions or how much it was.
In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo. Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here. "Ganking was never intended to be profitable"
Oh dear, morons who carry far too much stuff make ganking profitable.
Better nerf ganking Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
|
Cede Forster
54
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
i'd go with troll here
also: "somebody is having fun in eve at my expense, please make them stop"-thread |
Virgil Travis
Non Constructive Self Management Unified Church of the Unobligated
734
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:55:00 -
[12] - Quote
Looks like we need Derp Sec, as some people are too dumb even to keep themselves from losing isk in high sec. Unified Church of the Unobligated - madness in the method Mamma didn't raise no victims. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1422
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:59:00 -
[13] - Quote
Virgil Travis wrote:Looks like we need Derp Sec, as some people are too dumb even to keep themselves from losing isk in high sec. Derpsec, yes... all of highsec will become that safe... Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Borlag Crendraven
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
81
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 11:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
That freighter died because the people who tried to defend it had no clue on what they were doing. The freighter was bumped all the way to 800km off of the gate, not one person even tried spawning concord there during that time. Not one person thought it'd be wise to sacrifice some cheap blackbirds to jam the attackers. In short, the defenders did nothing that mattered.
No, I wasn't there. I was simply reading about it in chat real time, laughing at the stupidity of the defending side.
Btw, the defending side was incursioners trying to defend a shipment full of their own boats, a bhaal, legion and some other junk that'd be much better off dying in actual combat. |
TheGunslinger42
Bite Me inc Elysian Empire
370
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
Troll thread? Troll thread.
Ganking industrials/frieghters/etc has been part of EVE forever. If anything threatens to destroy the game it's catering to risk-averse wowscrub hisec dwellers. This is not a game where your characters and stuff are "safe". Deal with it.
Or just wait until CCP turn hisec into hello kitty online with failwatch and subsequent expansions |
William Walker
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
58
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:02:00 -
[16] - Quote
Borlag Crendraven wrote:That freighter died because the people who tried to defend it had no clue on what they were doing. The freighter was bumped all the way to 800km off of the gate, not one person even tried spawning concord there during that time. Not one person thought it'd be wise to sacrifice some cheap blackbirds to jam the attackers. In short, the defenders did nothing that mattered.
No, I wasn't there. I was simply reading about it in chat real time, laughing at the stupidity of the defending side.
Btw, the defending side was incursioners trying to defend a shipment full of their own boats, a bhaal, legion and some other junk that'd be much better off dying in actual combat.
I read that in an Italian accent. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
107
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
It is just plain stupid to transport so much ISK at one time without a fleet. Loot well deserved. |
Jonah Gravenstein
1112
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:05:00 -
[18] - Quote
Those freighter pilots are slacking, I don't see epic amounts of exotic dancers in the cargo.
The 6ish billion isk drops were nice though.
lol@ derpsec, let's hope they never make hisec safer than it already is. Situational awareness FTW CCP can't patch stupid. |
Souisa
WESCORP 2.0
2
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:05:00 -
[19] - Quote
Arent you suppose to use secure cans to avoid being ganked? |
TharOkha
0asis Group
27
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:05:00 -
[20] - Quote
Im sorry dude, but freighter pilots need to be more carefull. Niarja is well known gank heaven. I never transport more than 1-2B in freighter (at least not through Niarja and peak times). GÇ£If reality can destroy the dream, why shouldn't the dream destroy reality?GÇ¥ |
|
Jonah Gravenstein
1112
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:10:00 -
[21] - Quote
Souisa wrote:Arent you suppose to use secure cans to avoid being ganked?
Nope use someone else to haul your stuff, much safer and if it dies (even to "friendly fire"), collateral
CCP can't patch stupid. |
Souisa
WESCORP 2.0
2
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:12:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Souisa wrote:Arent you suppose to use secure cans to avoid being ganked? Nope use someone else to haul your stuff, much safer and if it dies (even to "friendly fire"), collateral
But if they cant see whats in ur cargo hold, or even access the cans if they blow you up. Less chance of being gank0red. |
Solstice Project
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
1742
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:14:00 -
[23] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Im sorry dude, but freighter pilots need to be more carefull. Niarja is well known gank heaven. I never transport more than 1-2B in freighter (at least not through Niarja and peak times). Crap, i didn't know that. Niarja ... here i come ! :D Inappropriate signature removed. Spitfire |
Jonah Gravenstein
1112
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:16:00 -
[24] - Quote
Souisa wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Souisa wrote:Arent you suppose to use secure cans to avoid being ganked? Nope use someone else to haul your stuff, much safer and if it dies (even to "friendly fire"), collateral But if they cant see whats in ur cargo hold, or even access the cans if they blow you up. Less chance of being gank0red.
Secure cans aren't secure unless they're both anchored and passworded, if they drop from cargo they are neither and anybody can open them and claim the contents. I believe, but can't be sure (someone please confirm or laugh at my ignorance ), that the contents also show up on a shipscan even if it is in a container unless it's a courier contract. CCP can't patch stupid. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4559
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:16:00 -
[25] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
Agreed. Let's reduce the cargo bay of freighters and JFs to the point where it's impossible for them to carry enough cargo to make them worth ganking. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Misunderstood Genius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
59
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:35:00 -
[26] - Quote
When you can afford to move 20bil in a freighter you should be able to escort it by a few logistics cruiser and suicide ganking is history. Remember the times where freighter had to be escorted through null-sec by a 50 men fleet? Epic times. |
Volar Kang
Quartz Research Strategic Alliance
37
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
Robus Muvila wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:I was about to talk of null sec warfare but then I remembered you just mentioned "Goons" so I think I'm going to wait and have fun reading all the funky stuff you guys are going to rabble about this.
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
OMG, Hamburgler! I finally found you! |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9430
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:44:00 -
[28] - Quote
Humour. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Mallak Azaria
605
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:47:00 -
[29] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
Here's a better idea.
Instead of demanding CCP to make it easier for you, stop making yourselves profitable targets. Suicide ganking happens because the victim makes it profitable. By the way, miners are still being ganked.
Mining Barge buff: CCP-áhas acknowledged that miners in general-áare too stupid to make the correct fitting choices to make ganking them unprofitable. |
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
907
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:48:00 -
[30] - Quote
You guys are insane to think that hauler buffs aren't on CCP's short-list. The only reason we didn't get them now is because they're afraid to cross the red line by moving too fast. You really think that after everything that's happened in the past couple of years, we won't see Skiffed-out Iteron threes autopiloting through Sivala before the 2013 winter holidays?
Please. (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST) |
|
Geoscape
RvB - BLUE Republic
39
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 12:49:00 -
[31] - Quote
Misunderstood Genius wrote:When you can afford to move 20bil in a freighter you should be able to escort it by a few logistics cruiser and suicide ganking is history.. You would be better off using the extra pilots for hauling instead. Split the cargo between several ships to reduce the risk if getting suicide ganked. |
Reicheck
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
9
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 13:30:00 -
[32] - Quote
Tinfoil hat firmly in place.
I'm sure those freighters belonged to one of the Goons uberloften eucher directors and another director decided he had a plan to make tons of isk by changing the market value on faction warfare items destroyed in the freighter and.. no wait.. this is a plot to raise the price of freighters and tritanium reinforced metal plates.
Nonconsensual pvp, working as intended. No sig here. |
Doddy
Excidium. Executive Outcomes
133
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 13:43:00 -
[33] - Quote
Misunderstood Genius wrote:When you can afford to move 20bil in a freighter you should be able to escort it by a few logistics cruiser and suicide ganking is history. Remember the times where freighter had to be escorted through null-sec by a 50 men fleet? Epic times.
Suicide ganking is mostly about alpha strike so logitics are of limited help, and easily countered by the gankers piling ecm in thier spare sots.
Far better idea would just be to split the cargo up and send it in different freighters thus making no one freighter worth ganking. But that is too obvious.
|
Joe Skellington
Sarz'na Khumatari The Unthinkables
69
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 13:48:00 -
[34] - Quote
Don't fly afk? Please note that ASCII art is not permitted in the forum signatures. Spitfire |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
834
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 13:50:00 -
[35] - Quote
Funny I thought Lord Zim said the only Goons in High sec were moth breathers and subsequently war decs would not effect them.
Hmm Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
|
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
78
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:03:00 -
[36] - Quote
To Be or not to Be: That is the question!
To Gank or to Be Ganked: That it EvE! |
Elvis Fett
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:16:00 -
[37] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Those freighter pilots are slacking, I don't see epic amounts of exotic dancers in the cargo.
The 6ish billion isk drops were nice though.
lol@ derpsec, let's hope they never make hisec safer than it already is. Situational awareness FTW
They weren't all slacking. This dude brought enough exotic dancers to the party for everybody. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4647
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:17:00 -
[38] - Quote
beats all the tinfoil about our ganks gettin da loot please leave |
Ifly Uwalk
Empire Tax Collection Agency
302
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:17:00 -
[39] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:lol@ derpsec, let's hope they never make hisec safer than it already is. Situational awareness FTW If Crimewatch goes through as planned that hope will be in vain. CW will effectively shard the server into non- and pvp zones. |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks The Marmite Collective
2348
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:17:00 -
[40] - Quote
Odds on the OP being an alt for an attention-seeking goon? The Skunkworks is recruiting. -áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1540711#post1540711 |
|
Lucy Ferrr
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
188
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:21:00 -
[41] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Funny I thought Lord Zim said the only Goons in High sec were moth breathers and subsequently war decs would not effect them.
Hmm Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended... |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4647
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:23:00 -
[42] - Quote
Lucy Ferrr wrote:Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended...
ahahaha look at your tinfoil
you missed a spot the goon mind control rays are still reaching your brain please leave |
Xavier Holtzman
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
43
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:26:00 -
[43] - Quote
I've started noticing a new phenomenon. It is a lot like Godwin's Law, but involves Goons instead of that one guy. |
Jonah Gravenstein
1136
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:31:00 -
[44] - Quote
Xavier Holtzman wrote:I've started noticing a new phenomenon. It is a lot like Godwin's Law, but involves Goons instead of that one guy.
Mittens Law?
If hisec becomes a PVP free zone, I'm going back to wormholes and ninjaing around in other peoples space, well either that or when shipskins eventually make an appearance I'll be bearing it up in a Pink Golem with rainbow go faster stripes. CCP can't patch stupid. |
Robert Warner
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
52
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:33:00 -
[45] - Quote
Xavier Holtzman wrote:I've started noticing a new phenomenon. It is a lot like Godwin's Law, but involves Goons instead of that one guy.
Goons are merely extensions of one guy. |
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
78
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:35:00 -
[46] - Quote
Lucy Ferrr wrote: Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended...
Maybe nobody wardecs Goons because ppl simply don't want to wardec them? You can't say...
|
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:43:00 -
[47] - Quote
The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... |
Jonah Gravenstein
1136
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:48:00 -
[48] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person..........
Hmmm what a way to kill the game, or at least hisec.
CCP can't patch stupid. |
Anunzi
High House Of Shadows Tribal Band
39
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:53:00 -
[49] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
Not sure if troll, or just so far beyond the bounds of human stupidity he canGÇÖt see sense on a clear dayGǪ
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4562
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:55:00 -
[50] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person..........
You seem to be under the impression that high sec is supposed to be safe. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
|
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:55:00 -
[51] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... Hmmm what a way to kill the game, or at least hisec.
What i am saying is that if you are mining and some heavy hitters show up on grid, your choices are limited, you run faster then they can point or die. In low sec, i could fire on the incoming before they get a lock on whatever if set up correctly.
What set up allows to defend in high sec ? Is it leave fast or die only ? |
OmniBeton
OmniBeton Metatech
19
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:56:00 -
[52] - Quote
There is no defense against alpha. Make guns use of LoS. Then freighters can be protected by surrounding them with tanked escort. |
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
78
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 14:56:00 -
[53] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
Good news: There is one simple "solution" that already exists.
A ganks B. B is mad about it. So B goes out to gank A. That's the circle of life EvE. |
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:00:00 -
[54] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... You seem to be under the impression that high sec is supposed to be safe.
Not safe. But there should always be a way to have a chance to react to something. |
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
78
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:05:00 -
[55] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:Not safe. But there should always be a way to have a chance to react to something.
Friends / escorts for example.
|
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:10:00 -
[56] - Quote
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Bloutok wrote:Not safe. But there should always be a way to have a chance to react to something. Friends / escorts for example.
What's the escort going to do VS alpha ?
I do not know if it's true or whatever. If that guy had his ship bumped 800km away from a gate in high sec, the only way to defend without GCCing first was to counter bump ? Seriously ? |
Jonah Gravenstein
1136
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:10:00 -
[57] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... Hmmm what a way to kill the game, or at least hisec. What i am saying is that if you are mining and some heavy hitters show up on grid, your choices are limited, you run faster then they can point or die. In low sec, i could fire on the incoming before they get a lock on whatever if set up correctly. What set up allows to defend in high sec ? Is it leave fast or die only ?
- Don't mine on a belts warp in point, it gives you a little leeway for getting an exhumers fat arse up to speed.
- Mine in groups with Orca support, gang links and mutual webs, mine aligned while webbed.
- Don't AFK.
- Set known gank/ninja corps so that they show up in the overview as all round nasty buggers.
- Do pay attention to local.
- Don't fly what you can't replace at least 3 times over.
- Have a safespot or 3.
- Have insta-undock bookmarks.
the list is pretty much endless, the main thing is to be aware of what's going on around you, you see a terrible standing flag on the overview GTFO, it's called situational awareness. I only indulge in PvP when I have to, most of the time I'm bearing it up shooting red crosses and rocks but I do all of the above in the systems I frequent. CCP can't patch stupid. |
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
78
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:16:00 -
[58] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Bloutok wrote:Not safe. But there should always be a way to have a chance to react to something. Friends / escorts for example. What's the escort going to do VS alpha ?
Alpha back of course.
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
653
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:20:00 -
[59] - Quote
YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY FREIGHTER PILOTS, ONCE ******** CRIMEWATCH COMES AROUND NOBODY WILL GANK YOUR PRECIOUS FREIGHTER FULL OF 50 BILL ISK CARGO BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SCOOP IT WITHOUT BEING FREELY SHOT AT BY ANYONE.
http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:20:00 -
[60] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Bloutok wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... Hmmm what a way to kill the game, or at least hisec. What i am saying is that if you are mining and some heavy hitters show up on grid, your choices are limited, you run faster then they can point or die. In low sec, i could fire on the incoming before they get a lock on whatever if set up correctly. What set up allows to defend in high sec ? Is it leave fast or die only ?
- Don't mine on a belts warp in point, it gives you a little leeway for getting an exhumers fat arse up to speed.
- Mine in groups with Orca support, gang links and mutual webs, mine aligned while webbed.
- Don't AFK.
- Set known gank/ninja corps so that they show up in the overview as all round nasty buggers.
- Do pay attention to local.
- Don't fly what you can't replace at least 3 times over.
- Have a safespot or 3.
- Have insta-undock bookmarks.
the list is pretty much endless, the main thing is to be aware of what's going on around you, you see a terrible standing flag on the overview GTFO, it's called situational awareness. I only indulge in PvP when I have to, most of the time I'm bearing it up shooting red crosses and rocks but I do all of the above in the systems I frequent.
In my mind, everything you said means GTFO or die. Exept don't AFK.
If there was a way to react, someone who's afk would miss that opportunity every time. |
|
TheGunslinger42
Bite Me inc Elysian Empire
371
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:22:00 -
[61] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person..........
The real problem is how wrong you are. You absolutely CAN defend against gankers in hisec. Just because you're terrible and wont even try doesn't mean it isn't possible and CCP should turn the game into hello kitty online for babies |
Denidil
Evocations of Shadow Eternal Evocations
496
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:23:00 -
[62] - Quote
don't carry too much value in a single freighter. when the isk:ehp ratio exceeds a certain value then it becomes profitable to gank for cargo drop. always has been this way ALWAYS SHOULD BE THIS WAY. If you don't see a problem in 0.0 eroding into two big super-coalitions and a few hangers on in areas nobody cares about.. then you don't have brains. |
TheGunslinger42
Bite Me inc Elysian Empire
371
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:25:00 -
[63] - Quote
Even when failwatch drops and makes hisec that much more wowlike and terrible, the idiots will STILL complain about losing a ship as a result of their own bad decisions, like carrying 17 plex in a frigate |
Jonah Gravenstein
1137
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:26:00 -
[64] - Quote
TheGunslinger42 wrote:Even when failwatch drops and makes hisec that much more wowlike and terrible, the idiots will STILL complain about losing a ship as a result of their own bad decisions, like carrying 17 plex in a frigate
That didn't drop CCP can't patch stupid. |
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:29:00 -
[65] - Quote
TheGunslinger42 wrote:Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... The real problem is how wrong you are. You absolutely CAN defend against gankers in hisec. Just because you're terrible and wont even try doesn't mean it isn't possible and CCP should turn the game into hello kitty online for babies
You forgot to put something that as meaning in your post, so i will answer at your level of thinking.
The real problem is how wrong you are because your mother gave you everything except a brain.
You can absolutely not defend in high sec and i do not see any reason to say why because ... because. Well, because.
The hello kitty part. it's so dumb to begin with that i just cant find a way to reach your low brain power, i have no idea how to go that far down in the monkey chain of life. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
653
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:31:00 -
[66] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... All of these suggestions are absolutely pants-on-head ********. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4647
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:32:00 -
[67] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:You can absolutely not defend in high sec and i do not see any reason to say why because ... because. Well, because.
Did You Know that anybody with a GCC is a legal target? please leave |
Wibla
Tactical Narcotics Team
83
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:34:00 -
[68] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
A bloo bloo bloo?
|
Dramaticus
Goonswarm Federation
277
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:36:00 -
[69] - Quote
WHY DOES MY AFK DEFENSELESS SHIP NOT SURVIVE AN ATTACK THIS IS AN OUTRAGE CCP MUST DO SOMETHING BECAUSE I WILL NOT This post was crafted by a member of the GoonSwarm Federation Economic Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2579
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:37:00 -
[70] - Quote
TheGunslinger42 wrote:Even when failwatch drops and makes hisec that much more wowlike and terrible, the idiots will STILL complain about losing a ship as a result of their own bad decisions, like carrying 17 plex in a frigate
And people like you will still whine about people complaining, which btw is far more annoying. |
|
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:37:00 -
[71] - Quote
Andski wrote:Bloutok wrote:You can absolutely not defend in high sec and i do not see any reason to say why because ... because. Well, because. Did You Know that anybody with a GCC is a legal target?
O_o
Yes, what's your point ?
In the case here, someone may have been bumped 800km away from a gate, to defend, whoever would have wanted to, needed to GCC first or counter bump.... Wow !!!!
Else, you cannot counter alpha. There isn't even a point to firing back cause the guy is gonna die anyway, unless you like kill mails. |
Bloutok
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:43:00 -
[72] - Quote
Dramaticus wrote:WHY DOES MY AFK DEFENSELESS SHIP NOT SURVIVE AN ATTACK THIS IS AN OUTRAGE CCP MUST DO SOMETHING BECAUSE I WILL NOT
What i am saying is that there should be a way to react. Someone AFK will obviously not whatever the way to react may be. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9430
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:44:00 -
[73] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:Yes, what's your point ? His point is that you can defend yourself (and others) in highsec. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
stoicfaux
1556
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:44:00 -
[74] - Quote
You can't fix Stupid, but you can at least let them pull the trigger themselves and absolve all responsibility with a clearly visible warning message.
The statistics for profitable cargo ganking are pretty well established. Now that the GUI lists the estimated ISK price of the goods in our cargo, we just add a warning message that pop-ups when you undock with goods exceeding a certain threshold versus your ship's EHP (as per fitting window.) For bonus points CCP can add the 'number of ships destroyed in the last 24 hours' statistic to the warning. Just print the total for your route.
"Do you really want to undock with 2.3 billion isk worth of cargo in a 833 EHP Kestrel, bearing in mind that 1,234 ships have been destroyed in the last 24 hours along the route you have chosen." Click 'Yes' or 'No'.
For redundancy, the same message can appear when you click on auto-pilot with high-value cargo.
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head.
|
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2414
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:48:00 -
[75] - Quote
One web from a corp mate would have solved the issue. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Lady Ayeipsia
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
337
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:50:00 -
[76] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY FREIGHTER PILOTS, ONCE ******** CRIMEWATCH COMES AROUND NOBODY WILL GANK YOUR PRECIOUS FREIGHTER FULL OF 50 BILL ISK CARGO BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SCOOP IT WITHOUT BEING FREELY SHOT AT BY ANYONE.
You put too much faith in people being kind. Why would any of us drop what we are doing to hunt some crimenal for no incentive? Ooooo... That guy has a crime flag, let's stop our current profitable endeavour that we enjoy to go ahoot someone who most likely is better prepared and is hoping we come to our deaths.
Sorry, just because someone can be shot by anyone does not mean everyone will come running to shoot them. |
Buck Futz
Suddenly Violence Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
76
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:52:00 -
[77] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote: Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo.
Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here.
Totally gutless. Translation? "See, I fly Exhumers, so when Hulks get ganked its totally ridiculous and therefore deserve a buff." "Freighter pilots? F those guys."
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
653
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 15:57:00 -
[78] - Quote
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY FREIGHTER PILOTS, ONCE ******** CRIMEWATCH COMES AROUND NOBODY WILL GANK YOUR PRECIOUS FREIGHTER FULL OF 50 BILL ISK CARGO BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SCOOP IT WITHOUT BEING FREELY SHOT AT BY ANYONE.
You put too much faith in people being kind. Why would any of us drop what we are doing to hunt some crimenal for no incentive? Ooooo... That guy has a crime flag, let's stop our current profitable endeavour that we enjoy to go ahoot someone who most likely is better prepared and is hoping we come to our deaths. Sorry, just because someone can be shot by anyone does not mean everyone will come running to shoot them. Except when they're in a freighter and just happen to be carrying juicy loot. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
The Slayer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
20
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:03:00 -
[79] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:One web from a corp mate would have solved the issue.
This exactly. Teaming up with ONE whole other person makes you nearly immune to ganks AND lowers your travel time (shorter align time = faster travelling) so splitting up your 20bil stack of goods into smaller bits doesn't hurt as much. Lazy stupid people don't deserve their nice expensive loot, this is why we take it from them. |
Kult Altol
Republican Industries Epsilon Fleet
66
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:16:00 -
[80] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh.
How is it PVP when the other player can't fight back? Hmm makes sense. A narrow mind is a focused mind. |
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
653
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:19:00 -
[81] - Quote
Kult Altol wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh. How is it PVP when the other player can't fight back? Hmm makes sense. They can. Derp. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2600
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:23:00 -
[82] - Quote
Freighters should be allowed to be able to add mods for tanking. Makes no sense that the people who designed such ships to be carrying large amounts of things through space thought they would never need any type of defense ever. 3-4 lows and 3 or 4 mids would be nice. |
Kult Altol
Republican Industries Epsilon Fleet
66
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:24:00 -
[83] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Kult Altol wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh. How is it PVP when the other player can't fight back? Hmm makes sense. They can. Derp.
Enlightening, you are full of wisdom. you should write a book on Eve defense strategy.
edit, spelling correction A narrow mind is a focused mind. |
handige harrie
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:25:00 -
[84] - Quote
Goons are doing EVE a favor by removing stupid and restoring the NAV/smarts balance |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2600
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:27:00 -
[85] - Quote
handige harrie wrote:Goons are doing EVE a favor by removing stupid and restoring the NAV/smarts balance
I found the hidden msg you cleverly hid in there. |
Ghazu
153
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:29:00 -
[86] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:handige harrie wrote:Goons are doing EVE a favor by removing stupid and restoring the NAV/smarts balance I found the hidden msg you cleverly hid in there. hur hur hur poo booger |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2600
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:30:00 -
[87] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:handige harrie wrote:Goons are doing EVE a favor by removing stupid and restoring the NAV/smarts balance I found the hidden msg you cleverly hid in there. hur hur hur poo booger
That's all I hear when you Goons talk, no matter what you say...just sounds like that. |
March rabbit
R.I.P. Legion
245
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:31:00 -
[88] - Quote
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Bloutok wrote:Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Bloutok wrote:Not safe. But there should always be a way to have a chance to react to something. Friends / escorts for example. What's the escort going to do VS alpha ? Alpha back of course. good joke |
Ghazu
153
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:33:00 -
[89] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:handige harrie wrote:Goons are doing EVE a favor by removing stupid and restoring the NAV/smarts balance I found the hidden msg you cleverly hid in there. hur hur hur poo booger That's all I hear when you Goons talk, no matter what you say...just sounds like that. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1903756#post1903756 |
Spurty
V0LTA Verge of Collapse
442
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:34:00 -
[90] - Quote
Puts pants on head, steps onto soap box and reads the tea leafs
- This time next year 0.0 space will be 100% blue and all parties will have sing-songs across the regions of law-less space about being space pirates "YAAH!" - Low sec will be revisited and what is low sec will stretch encroaching on current high sec leaving only 0.9 and higher systems secure and protected by concord - Unicorns will spring forth from wormholes and block Alpha strikes screaming "ALPHA STRIKE BACK OF COURSE, OF COURSE, NO, I'M A UNICORN, NOT A HORSE!" - EVE Will gain millions of new subscribers
- takes pants off of head - steps down - takes a breath - laughs with an old friend, 'Mr Max Zim' and he's old saying "don't undock in what you can't afford to lose".
---- CONCORD arrested two n00bs yesterday, one was drinking battery acid, the other was eating fireworks. They charged one and let the other one off. |
|
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
576
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:37:00 -
[91] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp... No matter how much CCP buffs freighters / JF - CCP has no control over stupid.
These freighters died because of stupid.
CCP buffs freighters / JF because of this?
Freighters / JF will still die when loaded with stupid.
Hope that helps.
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
Kult Altol
Republican Industries Epsilon Fleet
66
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:46:00 -
[92] - Quote
Asuri Kinnes wrote:Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp... No matter how much CCP buffs freighters / JF - CCP has no control over stupid. These freighters died because of stupid. CCP buffs freighters / JF because of this? Freighters / JF will still die when loaded with stupid. Hope that helps.
Yes, hauling freight is hi-sec is sooooo stupid. lol dummies. A narrow mind is a focused mind. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
500
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:47:00 -
[93] - Quote
A freighter has 200k EHP.... It died because the pilot was just plain ignorant and/or dump to try to carry that much value in cargo in an unprotected freighter....
IMO, a REASONABLE call, would be to allow freighter's some fitting options.... Give them 8 lows, No mids, No Highs, and maybe rig slots.... Reduce their base Freight to 200k m3 or something similarly moderate, and make it so they can carry 900k+ m3 by fitting all cargo expanders, or they can fit a tank by fitting all buikheads and a damage control (and double their align times), or they can fit a bunch of nanofibers and halve their EHP.... (note: numbers/slots/etc need major tweaking).
The dirty truth, this change wont matter, as even with 1m EHP, it will still be profitable to gank a pilot that undocks with 21b in cargo!!!! |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2414
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 16:48:00 -
[94] - Quote
Mechanics and strategies were in place at every step of the way to avoid being in this situation, they were ignored.
From planning how much value to be carried on each ship, to how you set up your contracts (assuming there was one, or preferably 2), to how your scouting was done (if any), to the logistics of the actual move (corp webbing ship), to defensive steps implemented (webbing again, logistics, fleet bonuses, or even the classic but dishonorable log off after jump), and if you really want to split hairs the choice of implants for the freighter pilots.
There is a big difference between needing the game mechanics to be changed and simply choosing not to use the game mechanics available. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:01:00 -
[95] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo.
Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here.
You're a moron on so many levels that you make me sad. Do you have any idea how much freight moves in EVE? Any idea at all? Do realize how many escorts that would take? Are you volunteering for this escort duty? Do you know ANYONE who would want to do it, day in and day out? Do you not understand what a suicide gank is? Can you please explain to me how this escort will prevent the gank? Do you know anything about ganking freighters? It is neither hard nor expensive. Can you count or read? Show me the freighter or JF with "millions HP hull."
Just STFU and quit posting. |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:02:00 -
[96] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Kult Altol wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh. How is it PVP when the other player can't fight back? Hmm makes sense. They can. Derp. Show me how to fight off a suicide gank. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2414
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:08:00 -
[97] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo.
Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here.
You're a moron on so many levels that you make me sad. Do you have any idea how much freight moves in EVE? Any idea at all? Do realize how many escorts that would take? Are you volunteering for this escort duty? Do you know ANYONE who would want to do it, day in and day out? Do you not understand what a suicide gank is? Can you please explain to me how this escort will prevent the gank? Do you know anything about ganking freighters? It is neither hard nor expensive. Can you count or read? Show me the freighter or JF with "millions HP hull." Just STFU and quit posting.
I'll ignore the essay that could be written to address your other points and simply point out that many of us have pulled escort duty for a corp or alliance freighter runs of significant value.
How that escort should operate (with proper scouting and webbing) is something every freigther pilot should know, or at the very least attempt to find out before hauling extremely high value cargo. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2414
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:11:00 -
[98] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Kult Altol wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh. How is it PVP when the other player can't fight back? Hmm makes sense. They can. Derp. Show me how to fight off a suicide gank.
Your best options are to either avoid the suicide gank, make the attempt financially unappealing, or be set up to give better chances of surviving it long enough for Concord to arrive... all of which fall under the category of PVP (player vs player) activity. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9430
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:11:00 -
[99] - Quote
Kult Altol wrote:Yes, hauling freight is hi-sec is sooooo stupid. lol dummies. Good thing that no-one claimed that it was, so your sarcasm completely falls flat.
Yes, hauling more freight than your hull (and buddies) can protect is stupid. Being in highsec is not a factor.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4565
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:13:00 -
[100] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Kult Altol wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Perhaps that "pvp" thing in highsec is getting a bit inconvenient for some people, huh. How is it PVP when the other player can't fight back? Hmm makes sense. They can. Derp. Show me how to fight off a suicide gank.
Eg: Split off the high-value, low volume items and move those in the appropriate ship-class: blockade runners (If you can fly a freighter, then you're a day away from being able to fly a properly fight BR)
Eg: send ahead "decoy" ships (T1 industrials with BPCs, etc) through particularly high risk areas like the WELL KNOWN BOTTLENECK BETWEEN AMARR AND JITA
Eg: employ a friend or alt in corp with a webbing ship (This is one of the few unironic uses for a Hyena) to near-instawarp your freighter
Eg: take a longer but less dangerous route when moving especially high-value cargoes
Eg: move especially high value cargoes when EVE is relatively quiet
Eg: Train up Leadership skills to increase EHP - suicide ganking with Alpha is expensive, and gank operations often operate with tight margins. You might just tip the balance. You can also increase your freighter's agility this way
But really, the first suggestion is the important one. All the rest are for if you don't follow it. Seriously: put the high value stuff into a fully expanded and rigged BR. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9431
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:16:00 -
[101] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:But really, the first suggestion is the important one. All the rest are for if you don't follow it. Seriously: put the high value stuff into a fully expanded and rigged BR. GǪor the corp hangar of an Orca. More EHP, quicker movement (compared to a freighter/JF), unscannable, and zero reason to gank it since it won't drop any loot. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1580
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:17:00 -
[102] - Quote
It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is created. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Borlag Crendraven
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
81
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:23:00 -
[103] - Quote
It's not the tier 3 battlecruisers that have an advantage over the freighter, it's the numbers of them. If those wouldn't exist, it'd be the exact same boats that were being used for that before those bc's were introduced to the game. The thoraxes, brutixes etc etc. If you end up buffing freighters because a single freighter pilot can't cope with being attacked by 15 battlecruiser/cruiser pilots (that's the count on the killmail) then you're really approaching the issue completely wrong. A single player should not survive when outnumbered that greatly unless they work their way around that camp in the first place. |
Trendon Evenstar
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
37
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:24:00 -
[104] - Quote
There was one day last week where the fine fellows of Bat Country destroyed 78b worth of assets.
These are great days we're living bros. |
Idris Helion
University of Caille Gallente Federation
65
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:29:00 -
[105] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo.
Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here.
I'm the biggest hisec carebear in the world, and even I agree with this. Too many hisec industrialists throw tens of billions of ISK worth of stuff into their freighters, set the destination to Jita 4-4, and then click the autopilot button and go have lunch. AFK-ing while you have 20B+ ISK worth of stuff slowboating twenty or thirty jumps to Jita is just colossally stupid. Throwing all your worldly possessions into a single freighter-load is even more stupid. (Just because you can fit all your crap into the freighter's hold doesn't mean you should.) It drives me bonkers to see people moving such expensive stuff through dodgy systems in an unescorted (and often AFK'd) freighter.
If you can't be bothered to babysit your freight to Jita, then you deserve to lose it. No pity from me.
Also: use an Impel with loads of tank. The attackers will get Concordokken long before your Impel's tank breaks. For runs through dodgy systems in hisec (like the run to Jita), an Impel is my favorite freight boat. A bunch of s**t-fit Catalysts aren't going to dent the tank on that beast.
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9431
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:30:00 -
[106] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Not really, because people would use those slots to bring in stuff into highsec that isn't allowed there, so they would have to reduce the base stats for the ship to the point where they'd be much much worse (in every way) than they are today. So instead, they're given the exact stats they need for what they're intended to do GÇö the defensive capabilities are built into the ship and are non-negotiable.
Quote:Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected Not really, since the ships used before did the exact same thing for the exact same cost. In fact, the implication is that the balance has remained the same: even though the cost of a gank has gone up (due to the removal of insurance), the cost is unaffected because of these new ships that deliver the same damage at a lower cost. Instead of 80M battleships delivering 10k alpha, they're now using 80M battlecruisers delivering 10k alpha. No imbalance exists. In fact, it would be imbalanced without these ships. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
577
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:36:00 -
[107] - Quote
Kult Altol wrote:Yes, hauling freight in hi-sec with a value of N>attacking ships loss to concord is sooooo stupid. lol dummies. FYP.
What? You one of those people who think freighters/JF should move about risk free?
To paraphrase what I said earlier, you can't fix stupid.
Also: Darwins Law.
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
|
ISD Praetoxx
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
35
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:41:00 -
[108] - Quote
Thread cleaned.
Please keep your posts constructive and in-line with the Forum Rules ISD Praetoxx Ensign Community Communication Liasons (CCLs) Interstellar Service Department |
|
No More Heroes
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1370
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:42:00 -
[109] - Quote
Destruction of assets is a necessary and vital part of the economy. If ships did not explode, your ore would be worthless, all your sell orders, your manufacturing, your LP, your standings and ultimately your isk.
2 wars, one in the north and one south plus the tireless efforts of Goonswarm Federation and pioneers like James 315 keep this economy healthy and vibrant. http://www.themittani.com Bringing balance to the world of Eve news |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
577
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:43:00 -
[110] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote: *snip*
Content Removed.
Please ensure your posts are constructive and not of a 'flaming' manner. Forum hamsters get scared when so many harsh words are used.
- ISD Praetoxx
Why, yes I have escorted freighters of ours on loot runs. We usually use two inties to dbbl web the freighter as it comes out of jump cloak. Usually have a falcon around as well. Usually its not necessary though, as we break up our cargo into multiple runs, or use Red Frog Freight (and insure it for the value of the contents). Red Frog is cheaper than loosing all your loot...
So yeah, even though your post got snipped, some of us have done escorts. It's not unreasonable to expect that when your moving $$$$$ loot, someone might try to steal it.
To paraphrase what I said earlier...
"CCP can't patch stupid - and those freighters died to stupid".
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
|
Aruken Marr
BSC LEGION Tactical Narcotics Team
326
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 17:47:00 -
[111] - Quote
I can technically fill a Tech 1 frigate full of Tech 2 BPO's and lose ridiculous amounts of isk to a destroyer. Does this mean they should buff tech 1 frigates to be ungankable?
What you put in a ships cargo hold is your own prerogative and neither should it be considered in terms of a ships vulnerability to ganks. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4565
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:00:00 -
[112] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Malcanis wrote:But really, the first suggestion is the important one. All the rest are for if you don't follow it. Seriously: put the high value stuff into a fully expanded and rigged BR. GǪor the corp hangar of an Orca. More EHP, quicker movement (compared to a freighter/JF), unscannable, and zero reason to gank it since it won't drop any loot.
I keep forgetting the Orca! Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4565
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:01:00 -
[113] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created.
Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things! Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1599
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:04:00 -
[114] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created. Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things! Last I checked irl oil tankers don't usually have to worry about fleets of pirates in battlecruisers with battleship sized guns blowing them up. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9432
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:07:00 -
[115] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Malcanis wrote:Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things! Last I checked irl oil tankers don't usually have to worry about fleets of pirates in battlecruisers with battleship sized guns blowing them up. That's because you don't need something as ridiculous as a battlecruiser (which, by definition has battleship-sized gunsGǪ that was the whole point of inventing them) to take one on. Instead, they have to worry about fleets of pirates in dinghies. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Senshi Hawk
Occupational Hazzard Get Off My Lawn
44
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:12:00 -
[116] - Quote
I don't think the OP realizes how much the Goons hate ratting. It is a chore to get that sec status back up. Don't fool yourself into thinking that ganking your defenseless freighter is easy. They're earning their loot by F1'ing Guristas over, and over, and over.
Game is balanced. Move on. |
luZk
x13
71
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:12:00 -
[117] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created. Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M93od9fbpWM
Yeah?
|
Gevlin
SMANews.net SpaceMonkey's Alliance
192
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:13:00 -
[118] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
CCP does not nerf stupidity. Why was a freighter taking so much value of goods in a ship. Freighter is ment for bulky items, Those people be idled to make play content and be lazy and ship too much value in a load
Some day I will have the internet and be able to play again. |
Lord Regent
Northstar Cabal Fatal Ascension
3
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:31:00 -
[119] - Quote
You jelly?
Seriously, grow up. It's eve. People die. Get over it.
Sincerely,-á Lord Regent. |
Gary Bell
Odyssey Inc SpaceMonkey's Alliance
15
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:32:00 -
[120] - Quote
Simple way for said idiots to not get ganked...
1. When hauling ships, take the shiney mods off and stick them in the cargo holds before you make your courier contract. This shows an unfit ship in the scan. In the case of these current idiots it dropped the value by like 10Bil, IE not worth a gank.
2. When hauling lots of expensive modules and minerals the same rules can be applied. You place the crap in fit Itty fives the courier contract and derp... TADA all you see is a few Ittys in a freighter. Granted it will take more runs because of the assembled ship but you reduce your chances of getting killed by 90%.
-Okay now that I have shown all the secret I am going to guess that goons still kill 60-90 BIl in stupid peoples stuff next week. You know why boys and girls. Because people are DUMB AS HELL!
Rant complete..
PS When I ran Missions I have hauled 10 Bil plus in modules in a Bantam. You know why it worked, Because I used my brain. No one ever scans a bantam...
PS ..
Stupid is just stupid and there will always be stupid no matter how many Nerfs there are.. |
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4566
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:42:00 -
[121] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Malcanis wrote:Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things! Last I checked irl oil tankers don't usually have to worry about fleets of pirates in battlecruisers with battleship sized guns blowing them up. That's because you don't need something as ridiculous as a battlecruiser (which, by definition has battleship-sized gunsGǪ that was the whole point of inventing them) to take one on. Instead, they have to worry about fleets of pirates in dinghies.
Boost Rookie ships!
(Oh wait...) Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2414
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:45:00 -
[122] - Quote
luZk wrote:Malcanis wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created. Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M93od9fbpWMYeah?
Yes, the oil tanker hired support. What a concept.
By the way, they also did so in defiance of Maritime Law and if caught could suffer legal repercussions.
Still, it does highlight the concept that taking precautions can save you from a gank. It's just that in EVE those precautions tend to take other forms. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:51:00 -
[123] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Yes, the oil tanker hired support. What a concept. By the way, they also did so in defiance of Maritime Law and if caught could suffer legal repercussions. Still, it does highlight the concept that taking precautions can save you from a gank. It's just that in EVE those precautions tend to take other forms.
Vice Admiral Bill Gortney, Commander of the United States General Command wrote: GÇ£Due to Maersk Alabama following maritime industryGÇÖs best-practices such as embarking security teams, the ship was able to prevent being successfully attacked by pirates. This is a great example of how merchant mariners can take pro-active action to prevent being attacked.GÇ¥
I know it's a bit of a derail, but how are private security contractors a violation of Maritime Law? |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1440
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 18:56:00 -
[124] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Tippia wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Malcanis wrote:Ever seen an oil tanker? Man, the armor and guns on those things! Last I checked irl oil tankers don't usually have to worry about fleets of pirates in battlecruisers with battleship sized guns blowing them up. That's because you don't need something as ridiculous as a battlecruiser (which, by definition has battleship-sized gunsGǪ that was the whole point of inventing them) to take one on. Instead, they have to worry about fleets of pirates in dinghies. Boost Rookie ships! (Oh wait...) Gankalyst. Let's do this thing Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
245
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:03:00 -
[125] - Quote
Stupidly is lethal, as it should be....Haven't these morons heard of Jump Freighters?
Of course, it could just bee Bee's ganking their alts to become relevent again....Things like that happen when you have endless isk and no way to waste it ....
"CCP, is a cutting edge developer, they have found a way to sell lag to their customers, and make them believe it's a feature." |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Journies End
138
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:04:00 -
[126] - Quote
Bloutok wrote:The only real problem with high sec is that one cannot defend, we are all sitting ducks, you cannot counter someone who knows he is going to die whatever the result of his attack will be. The ganking side will do it right and you die or you will smile a big smile.
I have no idea how to fix that in a way that is "sandbox thinking people" friendly.
CCP could always code something like, if someone red box you in high sec, you get 5 seconds while the ganking side guns do not fire, but they are GCC. Falcon to the rescue.
Or make all kinds of transport, mining ships have a 1 million armor and shield bonus in high sec.
Or make it impossible to fire at someone if you are not at war with that person.......... This is actually a decent idea in its form.
Ganker goes GCC to the person they have targeted and engaged as well as their entire corporation/alliance for the 5 sec period.
There is NO GCC until the 5 sec time period is over and the guns and mods activate. Gate guns and faction police then engage as per normal times and rules.
Ganker GCC is activated when the warning screen YES button is clicked as is the 5 sec hold period.
Only way this is not initiated is if the target is -5 or under so KOS in high sec anyway.
Red boxed ship and ganker basically freeze, ie no warping off for the target even if warp is engaged, but any corp or target ship can engage ganker within that 5 sec time period. Theres no running, its fight or you die after 5 secs. Anyone truly afk or too slow still gets ganked but at least now you have a 5 second window to fight back, preemptive strike.
Right now ganking in high sec is effectively someone approaching a security guard with a money bag in hand and a pistol on his hip with a loaded gun pointed at the guard. The guard cannot pull his gun out and shoot the ganker even though you know hes going to one shot you in the head and take your money.
5 secs is a small window. Basically you can "draw and shoot first" Han Solo style. But the rest is all over but the crying once it flies. Large freighter ganks are still viable as are small solo ganks. Itll be a slightly less aware target that will be able to be ganked, or a true afk one without any sort of protection. This would allow basically ECM, or one shot defensive measures. Moar DPS will counter it of course, and theres still the % dice roll of ECM mods to be effective. Can you jam that many? Etc etc. And all afk targets are stil juicy. Only the effective, organized and aware pilots, corps and alliances can pull this off.
Also because its limited to corps and alliances it means noob corp hauler alts, mining alts, indy alts are all still fair game. Only corp or alliance members can defend anyway. Forcing these pilots into corps or alliances to make use of this measure. Allowing them to be wardecced in turn and therefore still vulnerable to another form of piracy.
As long as the target ship cannot "escape" and warp off, or log out within the 5 secs timer, but ONLY defend themselves, this could potentially work. Strength isnt measured in numbers but in force of will. For if one motived willful individual stands many will fall around him that are weak.
http://tinyurl.com/YarrFace |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
25
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:04:00 -
[127] - Quote
Actually the PSC derail leads to an interesting point,
From The Journal of International Buisness & The Law 4/15/2010:
PIRATES, BLACKWATER AND MARITIME SECURITY: THE RISE OF PRIVATE NAVIES IN RESPONSE TO MODERN PIRACY wrote: Another concern with the use of PSCs is that many flag states discourage the use of armed guards and also restrict commercial vessels from carrying arms aboard. 56 Members of the U.S. Navy have expressed their support of the use of private security contractors. 57 Surprisingly, Somali official Abdulkadir Muse Yusuf, the deputy marine minster of Puntland, has stated that PSCs are GÇ£welcomeGÇ¥ in SomaliaGÇÖs waters. 58 Minister Yusuf even asserts that the presence of PSC personnel might not only deter piracy in Somali waters but also other harmful acts being committed off of SomaliaGÇÖs coast, such as illegal fishing and waste dumping. 59
It would seem to suggest, that coupled with the upcoming changes in GCC flagging under crime watch it might be in the interests of High Sec industrialist to organize professional security corporations to patrol known problem systems. A Sandbox version of CONCORD if you will. Surely such emergent game play is preferable to heavy handed systematic changes. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1442
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:05:00 -
[128] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:It would seem to suggest, that coupled with the upcoming changes in GCC flagging under crime watch it might be in the interests of High Sec industrialist to organize professional security corporations to patrol known problem systems. A Sandbox version of CONCORD if you will. Surely such emergent game play is preferable to heavy handed systematic changes. And thus it must be irrelevant to our internet spaceships game.
Buff CONCORD, only the magical police can save us from "teh g4nk3rs" Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1442
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:06:00 -
[129] - Quote
Oh wow, Firefox crashed but not before sending the above post. How lucky ! Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1614
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:07:00 -
[130] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:It would seem to suggest, that coupled with the upcoming changes in GCC flagging under crime watch it might be in the interests of High Sec industrialist to organize professional security corporations to patrol known problem systems. A Sandbox version of CONCORD if you will. Surely such emergent game play is preferable to heavy handed systematic changes. I love this idea, one could purchase security from this mercenary market thing I read is coming. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
654
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:08:00 -
[131] - Quote
Beekeeper Bob wrote:Stupidly is lethal, as it should be....Haven't these morons heard of Jump Freighters? Less cargo, higher cost, higher agility, higher EHP. Can't cyno in highsec though. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
NEONOVUS
Saablast Followers
10
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:09:00 -
[132] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:
I know it's a bit of a derail, but how are private security contractors a violation of Maritime Law?
Yes, you are technically a privateer/pirate due to old British law of the seas. Get a writ of plunder and hoist the Jolly Apple, me maties we be hauling great bootie tonight. Hard to port my Goons this thread be under new writing! |
baltec1
Bat Country
2107
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:14:00 -
[133] - Quote
Greetings from Bat Country!
Apologies for our late reply to this thread but alas we have been hard at work. To be honest I am shocked it has taken this long for a thread of this nature to pop up, we were banking on a bit more rage from beople losing billions. Now, as many of you remember we tried to teach miners how to tank their ships with mixed results. Miners for the most part remained stupid, ice value went up and scores of bots were torn apart.
Well now its the turn of the traders. For years frieghters have been chugging around their baggage with not a care in the world, safe in the knolage that they are too big for the average ganker Joe, who could only look on as billions sail past is tornado. Poor Joe.
Well as of last month this is no longer the case. You see, we too have looked at these supersized metal pinatas and decided to use out staggering pile of gankboats to once again teach the bleating masses of highsec a lesson. This lesson is not to fill your cargohold with too much isk. Under the ever wise Warr Aki and now with extended access to people not in Bat Country we will attempt to educate the dumb for the good of EVE.
As well as making ourselves filthy rich. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2414
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:14:00 -
[134] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:Yes, the oil tanker hired support. What a concept. By the way, they also did so in defiance of Maritime Law and if caught could suffer legal repercussions. Still, it does highlight the concept that taking precautions can save you from a gank. It's just that in EVE those precautions tend to take other forms. Vice Admiral Bill Gortney, Commander of the United States General Command wrote: GÇ£Due to Maersk Alabama following maritime industryGÇÖs best-practices such as embarking security teams, the ship was able to prevent being successfully attacked by pirates. This is a great example of how merchant mariners can take pro-active action to prevent being attacked.GÇ¥
I know it's a bit of a derail, but how are private security contractors a violation of Maritime Law? Pardon, my bad. Civilian crew of commercial vessels have always been restricted from carrying firearms onboard their vessels, and until recently these restrictions defacto included "hired security personnel"... however this policy seems to be changing in recent times (as of last year or so). This approach is still under intense criticism and restriction by many port cities that are concerned with the weaponry coming into their ports. On the other hand, may of these private defense companies charge enough for their services that they simply drop their armament overboard when approaching a highly restricted port and manage to aquire fresh armament when they leave. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1442
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:15:00 -
[135] - Quote
NEONOVUS wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote:I know it's a bit of a derail, but how are private security contractors a violation of Maritime Law? Yes, you are technically a privateer/pirate due to old British law of the seas. Get a writ of plunder and hoist the Jolly Apple, me maties we be hauling great bootie tonight. Hard to port my Goons this thread be under new writing! Oh look, there's a freighter, let's "stop and search" it.
With large guns~~ Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1442
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:16:00 -
[136] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:You see, we too have looked at these supersized metal pinatas and decided to use out staggering pile of gankboats to once again teach the bleating masses of highsec a lesson. This lesson is not to fill your cargohold with too much isk. Under the ever wise Warr Aki and now with extended access to people not in Bat Country we will attempt to educate the dumb for the good of EVE. You're never going to succeed in reeducating them.
You are however, making great progress in culling them. Do your best ~~
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
baltec1
Bat Country
2108
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:18:00 -
[137] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote: You're never going to succeed in reeducating them.
You are however, making great progress in culling them. Do your best ~~
We can but try. |
Jonah Gravenstein
1151
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:22:00 -
[138] - Quote
On the subject of private security contractors, many countries will not let you dock with armed personnel on board unless those personnel & the ship belong to a friendly nations armed forces. There is also the risk of vessels being hit not only for their cargo but for their crews weapons, especially in countries where the supply, ownership & use of firearms is extremely regulated. CCP can't patch stupid. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9434
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:23:00 -
[139] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Greetings from Bat Country! By the way, I'm seeing an awful lot of you guys in ones or twos in local (since I live right on top of two pipelines)GǪ I sure hope those aren't your scouts because that would be ridiculously obvious.
Then again, with customers like these, I suppose that finesse and discretion isn't all that necessary. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
baltec1
Bat Country
2108
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:31:00 -
[140] - Quote
Tippia wrote:By the way, I'm seeing an awful lot of you guys in ones or twos in local (since I live right on top of two pipelines)GǪ I sure hope those aren't your scouts because that would be ridiculously obvious. Then again, with customers like these, I suppose that finesse and discretion isn't all that necessary.
All part of the lesson we are teaching |
|
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1616
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:34:00 -
[141] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:baltec1 wrote:You see, we too have looked at these supersized metal pinatas and decided to use out staggering pile of gankboats to once again teach the bleating masses of highsec a lesson. This lesson is not to fill your cargohold with too much isk. Under the ever wise Warr Aki and now with extended access to people not in Bat Country we will attempt to educate the dumb for the good of EVE. You're never going to succeed in reeducating them. You are however, making great progress in culling them. Do your best ~~ Tippia wrote:baltec1 wrote:Greetings from Bat Country! By the way, I'm seeing an awful lot of you guys in ones or twos in local (since I live right on top of two pipelines)GǪ I sure hope those aren't your scouts because that would be ridiculously obvious. Then again, with customers like these, I suppose that finesse and discretion isn't all that necessary. Mean people suck. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
NEONOVUS
Saablast Followers
10
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:34:00 -
[142] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote:I know it's a bit of a derail, but how are private security contractors a violation of Maritime Law? Yes, you are technically a privateer/pirate due to old British law of the seas. Get a writ of plunder and hoist the Jolly Apple, me maties we be hauling great bootie tonight. Hard to port my Goons this thread be under new writing! Oh look, there's a freighter, let's "stop and search" it. With large guns~~ Aye, why use these newfangled cargo scanners when we can be sending them on their journey faster.
The real issue is that a pmc could be very easily a bridgehead, and a lot of the world does not like a well armed foreign national in their country, much less a citizen.
Also I hardly feel bad for these people in the standard industrials. The freighters a bit more so unless some one dissuades me through explaining how you can bump a ship off grid. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9434
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:37:00 -
[143] - Quote
Quite right. Haulers should stop being so angry and learn how to have fun instead.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1443
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:39:00 -
[144] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Goonswarm Customs and Excise, searching your freight for shinies erryday Well now I know what to call my altcorp if I ever have to make one. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Horatioh Kane
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:52:00 -
[145] - Quote
I think the funniest part of this thread is that the guy with the incursion stuff was cool about losing it. He literally said, "it's just isk, I'll make it back in a couple months. GF." |
Jonah Gravenstein
1152
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 19:55:00 -
[146] - Quote
Horatioh Kane wrote:I think the funniest part of this thread is that the guy with the incursion stuff was cool about losing it. He literally said, "it's just isk, I'll make it back in a couple months. GF."
Kudos to him, he gets Eve. CCP can't patch stupid. |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 20:10:00 -
[147] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo.
Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here.
*snip*Content Removed.
Please ensure your posts are constructive and not of a 'flaming' manner. Forum hamsters get scared when so many harsh words are used.
- ISD Praetoxx Are you kidding me? Now you guys are editing for the word "moron"?
Quote:You're [wrong] on so many levels [, let me frame my argument in the form of questions]. Do you have any idea how much freight moves in EVE? Any idea at all? Do realize how many escorts that would take? Are you volunteering for this escort duty? Do you know ANYONE who would want to do it, day in and day out? Do you not understand what a suicide gank is? Can you please explain to me how this escort will prevent the gank? Do you know anything about ganking freighters? It is neither hard nor expensive. Can you count or read? Show me the freighter or JF with "millions HP hull."
I can see no logical reason for you to remove anything else from this post. You should not have deleted the whole thing. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9434
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 20:12:00 -
[148] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:Are you kidding me? Now you guys are editing for the word "moron"? No, they're editing for general personal abuse with no point to it. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
656
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 20:14:00 -
[149] - Quote
ISD just wanted to make a preemptive strike against badposting. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
579
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 20:17:00 -
[150] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:ISD just wanted to make a preemptive strike against badposting. Preemptive?
Little late for that, I'd say... ;)
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
|
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
28
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 20:49:00 -
[151] - Quote
Really there are a number of techniques, easy to implement, and inexpensive to maintain that would make the jobs of us pirates much more difficult. But, seeing as the greater part of my income currently depends on dumb freighter pilots I won't go into details. I refuse to go back to ratting Guristas. |
Maki Osa
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:07:00 -
[152] - Quote
Some dumbasses put their freighters on autopilot, and now we have to hear how it is 'breaking the game'?
High sec is safer, not safe. Pirates simply have to adjust their bottom line in considering risk vs. return. The whole point in EVE is that you can do what you want, provided you are willing to deal with the consequences. |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
295
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:08:00 -
[153] - Quote
Sugar Kyle wrote:Because OP does not like something it will destroy the game. OP, you have great power. Also, how dare a 0.0 alliance enter high sec. Some of us never left after burn jita.
Nullsec Alliances need Highsec. We buy all of our stuff here and export it out. Some of us grind missions for standings, some of us have production alts, some of us have secret fun here.
Highsec and Nullsec are symbiotic.
Now saying that, we killed 620bil in freighters/jump freighters/cargo over the last 31 days. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
28
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:11:00 -
[154] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Pardon, my bad. Civilian crew of commercial vessels have always been restricted from carrying firearms onboard their vessels, and until recently these restrictions defacto included "hired security personnel"... however this policy seems to be changing in recent times (as of last year or so). This approach is still under intense criticism and restriction by many port cities that are concerned with the weaponry coming into their ports. On the other hand, may of these private defense companies charge enough for their services that they simply drop their armament overboard when approaching a highly restricted port and manage to aquire fresh armament when they leave.
I know I was being needlessly pedantic, and I apologize. I just wanted to point out that despite criticism, territorial maritime laws, general advisability, and the preference of insurance companies it is not a violation of international maritime law.
Either way, as an active high sec pirate, I oppose any private security corporations as I feel they would needlessly escalate potentially violent confrontations, create legal confusion in already complex territorial disputes (low sec), and contribute to the an unacceptable increase in armaments in the public spaceways. We live in a society founded upon laws, gentlemen. Laws enforced by the judicious and rigorous actions of CONCORD, and to allow such mercenary actions would jeopardize the very bedrock of our civilization (and my bottom line, seriously how did you let us raid 620billion? We're terrible at this game). |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9434
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:12:00 -
[155] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:Now saying that, we killed 620bil in freighters/jump freighters/cargo over the last 31 days. I'm sorry. You didn't phrase that in the form of ISK/h, so you are obviously an impostor that doesn't live in highsec at all, so there!
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1621
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:21:00 -
[156] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:Now saying that, we killed 620bil in freighters/jump freighters/cargo over the last 31 days. Learning a bit more everyday why goons are so universally hated.
It's not griefing It's "emergent gameplay". "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9436
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:23:00 -
[157] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:It's not griefing It's "emergent gameplay". Certainly more the latter than the former, that's for sure, especially if all they're doing is blowing up ships.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
pussnheels
The Fiction Factory
586
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:28:00 -
[158] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp... 4 of them smells like inside information and freighter flying with several billions around unescorted good job of them and stupid freighter pilots I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
656
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:31:00 -
[159] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Now saying that, we killed 620bil in freighters/jump freighters/cargo over the last 31 days. Learning a bit more everyday why goons are so universally hated. It's not griefing It's "emergent gameplay". You're right, you should be allowed to move billions of ISK of assets in your cargo anywhere you want in highsec in absolute safety without doing anything to defend yourself. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Jonah Gravenstein
1158
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:43:00 -
[160] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote: seriously how did you let us raid 620billion? We're terrible at this game.
They're worse than you but still better than TEST
CCP can't patch stupid. |
|
Jimmy Gunsmythe
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
150
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:46:00 -
[161] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:Yes.. it is totally destroying eve... ganking in high sec has always been around and still the game kept growing every year. If the freighter pilots carry around enough cargo so that it is worth suiciding them it is their own fault.
You might as well ask for an ibis to be buffed to 1 million EHP because one guy thought its smart to undock in a rookie ship with plexs worth 60 billions or how much it was.
In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo. Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here. "Ganking was never intended to be profitable" Oh dear, morons who carry far too much stuff make ganking profitable. Better nerf ganking
Ganking is fine, nerf profiting. It is the greatest inequality to try to make unequal things equal. |
Mallak Azaria
606
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:50:00 -
[162] - Quote
Jimmy Gunsmythe wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:Jim Hazard wrote:Yes.. it is totally destroying eve... ganking in high sec has always been around and still the game kept growing every year. If the freighter pilots carry around enough cargo so that it is worth suiciding them it is their own fault.
You might as well ask for an ibis to be buffed to 1 million EHP because one guy thought its smart to undock in a rookie ship with plexs worth 60 billions or how much it was.
In the end if you buff freighters most likely you will only make suicide ganking more profitable as people will feel a lot more secure and will carry around even more in their cargo holds. Those freighter pilots could also set an escort fleet and take care of their business but no, they rather play alone with their dozen alts scouting systems and then cry their millions HP hull got gank with several dozens times the ship value in their cargo. Gank mining barges with destroyers is silly, really really mongoloid game play. Gank freighters it's serious business and only serious gankers can afford to know when and how to do it, I see no problem here. "Ganking was never intended to be profitable" Oh dear, morons who carry far too much stuff make ganking profitable. Better nerf ganking Ganking is fine, nerf profiting.
People make themselves profitable targets. You can't really fix this.
Mining Barge buff: CCP-áhas acknowledged that miners in general-áare too stupid to make the correct fitting choices to make ganking them unprofitable. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9436
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 21:51:00 -
[163] - Quote
Jimmy Gunsmythe wrote:Ganking is fine, nerf profiting. Profit is fine, nerf people thinking their stupidity is a systemic error.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Hypercake Mix
Magical Rainbow Bakery
42
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:13:00 -
[164] - Quote
If there was a freighter buff, haulers would just ride the risk limit of that buff, and it would just end up like nothing happened at all. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1454
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:13:00 -
[165] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote: seriously how did you let us raid 620billion? We're terrible at this game. They're worse than you but still better than TEST How many of those freighters were from TEST. I really do wonder, though they might also use NPC corp alts. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Jonah Gravenstein
1167
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:15:00 -
[166] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote: seriously how did you let us raid 620billion? We're terrible at this game. They're worse than you but still better than TEST How many of those freighters were from TEST. I really do wonder, though they might also use NPC corp alts.
I was being facetious
CCP can't patch stupid. |
KarmaHotelLobby
Aliastra Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:32:00 -
[167] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Im sorry dude, but freighter pilots need to be more carefull. Niarja is well known gank heaven. I never transport more than 1-2B in freighter (at least not through Niarja and peak times).
Nobody is going to gank for less than 4b.
If you are going to transport more than that, don't go through consistent ganking locations, do scout ahead, web yourself with a heavily tanked ship.
If it is small and valuable take it in an orca.
Personally though, I'd break it into packages of less than 3b and move it in parts. Risk management is a large part of eve - designed that way. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
656
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:37:00 -
[168] - Quote
Why does the webbing ship have to be heavily tanked? http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9437
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:43:00 -
[169] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Why does the webbing ship have to be heavily tanked? Because it becomes an obvious target if they're really out to get you: nuke the thing that lets you gtfo and then take on the sitting duck? Granted, they'll have to do that beforehand, or it'll be able to do its job one last time, at which point the actual target should be clever enough to dock up, but stillGǪ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
656
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:45:00 -
[170] - Quote
Tippia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Why does the webbing ship have to be heavily tanked? Because it becomes an obvious target if they're really out to get you: nuke the thing that lets you gtfo and then take on the sitting duck? It just seems to me like the webbing ship is a target of such low consequence that nobody's going to bother getting their ganking ships blown up over it.
Then again a frigate would take just a handful of volleys from a destroyer... http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9437
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 22:52:00 -
[171] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:It just seems to me like the webbing ship is a target of such low consequence that nobody's going to bother getting their ganking ships blown up over it.
Then again a frigate would take just a handful of volleys from a destroyer... True enough. It also gives your target a bit of fore-warning and summons CONCORD a bit earlier, so it'll be very behaviour-dependent: if they've displayed some pretty sloppy behaviour then it just might be worth it to get rid of that layer of protection.
GǪand depending on what ship it is, it may in and of itself be a nice addition to the killmailGǪ eh, I mean loot pile. I have seen freighter-slinging ships sporting high-meta webs in the past just to get a bit more range or (back in the day) more webbing power, because hey, they're not the target, right? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
The Slayer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
21
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:08:00 -
[172] - Quote
Jimmy Gunsmythe wrote:Ganking is fine, nerf profiting.
You know if you carry less than about 3 or 4 billion you can do this yourself right? Stop being so stupid.
|
Lord Regent
Northstar Cabal Fatal Ascension
3
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:16:00 -
[173] - Quote
The tears are just flowing like glacial melt water in this thread.
Pubbies need to grow up. If you don't like risk, the threat of death around every corner, and the possibility to lose everything you were stupid enough to put into your spaceship
WHY
ARE
YOU
PLAYING
EVE
?
(WOW is exactly what you're looking for)
Highsec pubbies completely lose perspective on the game. Destruction fuels the very same industry they are supporting.
If no one killed stuff, nothing would need replacing.
No 1 million gazillion shields in highsec for you. No warnings, double warnings, second chances, third chances. Grow up. Stop being mindless auto-piloting fools.
No wait, please don't.
You are only safe in a station. When you undock with your wares, you expose yourself to others. If you want to completely avoid this risk, just stay docked and skill train or something, and chat.
It is the very same uncertainty, danger, risk, and potential for reward you are suggesting be removed that makes the game so wonderfully entertaining.
If you cannot accept risk, don't play a game where risk such a fundamental component. Sincerely,-á Lord Regent. |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
295
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:20:00 -
[174] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Funny I thought Lord Zim said the only Goons in High sec were moth breathers and subsequently war decs would not effect them.
Hmm I would recommend you learn your place, considering the only trips you make into highsec are too and from market hubs and your wormhole. http://i.imgur.com/85JJl.png You've been in 5 corps since my highsec crew started our work. We have our own hilarious standards. The fact that you have to cower in a wormhole as a result of highsec diaspora is proof enough. ((soz m8))
Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Now saying that, we killed 620bil in freighters/jump freighters/cargo over the last 31 days. Learning a bit more everyday why goons are so universally hated. It's not griefing It's "emergent gameplay". I'm sorry sir if you think we are just warping in and pressing shoot.
A great deal of effort and work goes into this. We have a production team to keep us in ships. We started the gank fest with a 1bil investment. The cost of the gank usually mirrors the cost of the freighter hull, unlike miners who can be owned by 2 destroyers at a fraction of the cost. Lots of coordination is required on the production, scanning, bumping, hauling, salvaging, market clearing, and ultimately execution. These strikes are surgical. It is a gamble every time that we execute one of these ganks, and we have a risk/reward formula that we use to ensure that our ganks are free until the end of time.
Every one of our gankers gets a free ship because our previous ganks (seed of 1bil) fund future ganks. This is a playstyle. If you autopilot in a freighter, you die. If you cruise around with 10bil worth of stuff and don't double-wrap, you die. To clarify, 4 different freighter pilots have died to us TWICE within 30 days (some within 48hours) because they failed to evolve. Mind your surroundings. Be more cautious, hell even be smart. We kill individuals who lack this capacity. Several people have slipped through our fingers by using just a modicum of intelligence. Poetic Stanziel wrote a great piece on how not to be dumb when you have expensive stuff to move. Always use collateral. General Freight cans exist for a reason. If you are a dumb and lazy freighter pilot, chances are you will die if you move through a tradehub pipe.
When you are the very best at something, you take pride in it. How many of you can say you are the best at something? |
KarmaHotelLobby
Aliastra Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:28:00 -
[175] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Tippia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Why does the webbing ship have to be heavily tanked? Because it becomes an obvious target if they're really out to get you: nuke the thing that lets you gtfo and then take on the sitting duck? It just seems to me like the webbing ship is a target of such low consequence that nobody's going to bother getting their ganking ships blown up over it. Then again a frigate would take just a handful of volleys from a destroyer...
For a 10b isk freighter, blowing up the webber is a ******* great idea. One can do this whilst also pointing the freighter so it doesn't warp.
Once the webber is blown up it is simply a challenge to pull 1 group of concord and gank before the freighter can warp. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9438
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:38:00 -
[176] - Quote
And since we're giving away tips to the terminally unteachable, I'll throw in my standard latecomer addition:
Since we now have auto-dock and corp bookmarks, have one of your scouts run ahead to the station you're docking in and snuggle riiiiight up against the hull of that station. Not Gǣwarp to zeroGǥ, but many many km beyond thatGǪ and bookmark that spot for the corp.
When the freighter comes out of the gate, don't warp to the station. Instead, set it as your destination and warp to the newly made bookmark (and if it's a station you indent to come back to, keep it around for later). Once you've started warping, activate autopilot and kick back. For a normal highsec station, you will arrive somewhere 20GÇô40km inside of docking range rather than -¦2.5km away from it; you will dock instantly when coming out of warp; if, by the strangest happenstance, you get a second of exposure between warp invulnerability and docking invulnerability, you will be faaaaar away from awaiting ganking ships and bumping frigates and whatever else might be in store for you. If someone set up a classic casual smartbomb gank on the normal landing spotGǪ well, hey, you're not even going there so lol@them. Yes, you will most likely bump off the station, but since you are already cleared for docking and half-way through a session change by then, it doesn't matter.
GǪoh, and while your making those last few warps, that scout can take the opportunity to set up a nice insta for when you want to undock and toss it in with the warp-in bookmark in the proper corp folder. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
301
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:40:00 -
[177] - Quote
TLDR there are enough dumb people in this game that a few can stand to lose a little bit for their errors in judgement. We have nullsec FC's who lose whole fleets for their idiocy and errors in judgement. |
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
679
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:51:00 -
[178] - Quote
4 freighters with 20bil in loot means 4 idiots had at least 5bil inside a freighter. either A make multiple trips B sell it somewhere else and buy it back somewhere C go right after downtime and have a scout see if there is a gank camp. |
AdmiralJohn
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
70
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:52:00 -
[179] - Quote
Wait wait I have a solution.
People are saying that you can't retaliate to ganker in high sec. The obvious answer is that it should be much easier to PvP in high-sec. You could retaliate, or even strike preemptively, but Concord is holding you down!
I say it's time we all rally to have Concord step out permanently. This will at once get rid of ganking, and allow people to protect their assets preemptively. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1633
|
Posted - 2012.09.10 23:56:00 -
[180] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:TLDR there are enough dumb people in this game that a few can stand to lose a little bit for their errors in judgement. We have nullsec FC's who lose whole fleets for their idiocy and errors in judgement. You lost my attention when you started bragging about being good at a video game and calling other people dumb. That and your smug avatar really makes me wanna punch you.
I'm done with this topic, it seems that all it has to offer are a bunch of holier than thou null jockeys trying to **** in the highsec cheerios because they've made their own part of the sanbox a bore. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9438
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 00:04:00 -
[181] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:I'm done with this topic, it seems that all it has to offer are a bunch of holier than thou null jockeys trying to **** in the highsec cheerios because they've made their own part of the sanbox a bore. May I suggest a closer reading?
It rather seems to offer a people explaining how to solve very simple issues and a few who don't quite grasp what GÇ£griefingGÇ¥ means. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
The Slayer
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
21
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 00:20:00 -
[182] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:[quote=Powers Sa]I'm done with this topic, it seems that all it has to offer are a bunch of holier than thou null jockeys trying to **** in the highsec cheerios because they've made their own part of the sanbox a bore.
We are explaining to you, in very simple easy to understand details, how to avoid the very ganks that we are carrying out. It is hilariously simple to not get ganked. There are 11 pages of people explaining how to do it, to summarize :
Don't carry too much stuff in one freighter Don't fly through known dangerous pipes Don't fly at peak times Don't fly solo (use a scout/webber/logistics) Think about your cargo and maybe use a different ship to haul it (low volume? Blockade Runner. High Value? Jump freighter has twice the EHP of a regular one.)
Its REALLY EASY to not get ganked. But just how it was really easy to not get your Hulk exploded during hulkageddon (fit some tank instead of full cargo expanders you idiots) if you bleat hard enough CCP will probably do something. |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
301
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 00:33:00 -
[183] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:TLDR there are enough dumb people in this game that a few can stand to lose a little bit for their errors in judgement. We have nullsec FC's who lose whole fleets for their idiocy and errors in judgement. You lost my attention when you started bragging about being good at a video game and calling other people dumb. That and your smug avatar really makes me wanna punch you. I'm done with this topic, it seems that all it has to offer are a bunch of holier than thou null jockeys trying to **** in the highsec cheerios because they've made their own part of the sanbox a bore. ((i thought you guys liked to roleplay :( ))
Pirates live everywhere. This is nothing new. Guiding Hand Social Club has been doing it forever. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A19q7rysLs |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
344
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 00:52:00 -
[184] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY FREIGHTER PILOTS, ONCE ******** CRIMEWATCH COMES AROUND NOBODY WILL GANK YOUR PRECIOUS FREIGHTER FULL OF 50 BILL ISK CARGO BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SCOOP IT WITHOUT BEING FREELY SHOT AT BY ANYONE.
From the last I heard CCP pushed back crimwatch to coincide with Ring mining to protect the Goons it won't be implemented until 2020
-á"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people-ávery angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." - D. Adams |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
383
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:10:00 -
[185] - Quote
Dear OP: do us all a favor and unsub. Thanks in advance! |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1638
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:12:00 -
[186] - Quote
Dear Goon: do us all a favor and find another game to terrorize. Thanks in advance! "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
383
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:12:00 -
[187] - Quote
I hear most other MMOs in existence offer fairly risk-free gameplay; you might try one of those! |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
386
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:15:00 -
[188] - Quote
Seriously, you have no god-given right to total diplomatic immunity in highsec. If you can't deal with that reality then why torture yourself paying a monthly fee to inhabit a virtual world that you don't like? Do both of us a favor and go find something else to do with your time. You'll have more fun derping about with no anxiety about losing your pixel-things and we won't have to read your terrible whiny posts anymore. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1640
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:15:00 -
[189] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:I hear most other MMOs in existence offer fairly risk-free gameplay; you might try one of those! If I could find one with the same shared global scifi space universe EVE has I probably would.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9444
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:16:00 -
[190] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Dear Goon: do us all a favor and find another game to terrorize. Another besides which one? Are you suggesting that they should start terrorising EVE? That doesn't seem like a very nice suggestion. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
|
Raiz Nhell
DEEP CORPS
174
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:17:00 -
[191] - Quote
The Slayer wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:[quote=Powers Sa]I'm done with this topic, it seems that all it has to offer are a bunch of holier than thou null jockeys trying to **** in the highsec cheerios because they've made their own part of the sanbox a bore. We are explaining to you, in very simple easy to understand details, how to avoid the very ganks that we are carrying out. It is hilariously simple to not get ganked. There are 11 pages of people explaining how to do it, to summarize : Don't carry too much stuff in one freighter Don't fly through known dangerous pipes Don't fly at peak times Don't fly solo (use a scout/webber/logistics) Think about your cargo and maybe use a different ship to haul it (low volume? Blockade Runner. High Value? Jump freighter has twice the EHP of a regular one.) Its REALLY EASY to not get ganked. But just how it was really easy to not get your Hulk exploded during hulkageddon (fit some tank instead of full cargo expanders you idiots) if you bleat hard enough CCP will probably do something.
I ran my freighter through lowsec to an island following exactly these rules... I broke the trip in to 2 parts either side of DT, and I only carried bulky, crappy stuff, my valuables were in my blockade runner and the corp hanger of my orca...
It was a sphincter clenching ride, but I moved everything into lowsec over a couple of days, always picking a different route and checking dotlan before each jump.
You can do the same in highsec...
If you really want to prevent ganking, or at least make it difficult, remove the autopilot.
There is no such thing as a fair fight...
If your fighting fair you have automatically put yourself at a disadvantage. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1640
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:17:00 -
[192] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:Seriously, you have no god-given right to total diplomatic immunity in highsec. If you can't deal with that reality then why torture yourself paying a monthly fee to inhabit a virtual world that you don't like? Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1688
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:18:00 -
[193] - Quote
^ post circa 2011 |
Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
181
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:18:00 -
[194] - Quote
21.5bil in 4 freighters, I see nothign wrong with that, the freighter pilots should have carried less valuable cargo. thats definitely worth losing a bunch of tornados for. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9444
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:19:00 -
[195] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec. GǪthen you haven't been here long enough. The issue is that some people make silly assumptions that cost them their ships. Others are simply making sure to profit from those assumptions.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
386
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:20:00 -
[196] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Seriously, you have no god-given right to total diplomatic immunity in highsec. If you can't deal with that reality then why torture yourself paying a monthly fee to inhabit a virtual world that you don't like? Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec.
So powerful that we've literally got an 18-man gang in highsec doing things with no alliance funding? Yikes, I can see the scale of your problem. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1640
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:22:00 -
[197] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec.
So powerful that we've literally got an 18-man gang in highsec doing things with no alliance funding? Yikes, I can see the scale of your problem. Powers Sa wrote:A great deal of effort and work goes into this. We have a production team to keep us in ships. We started the gank fest with a 1bil investment. The cost of the gank usually mirrors the cost of the freighter hull, unlike miners who can be owned by 2 destroyers at a fraction of the cost. Lots of coordination is required on the production, scanning, bumping, hauling, salvaging, market clearing, and ultimately execution. These strikes are surgical. It is a gamble every time that we execute one of these ganks, and we have a risk/reward formula that we use to ensure that our ganks are free until the end of time. Every one of our gankers gets a free ship because our previous ganks (seed of 1bil) fund future ganks. This is a playstyle. If you autopilot in a freighter, you die. If you cruise around with 10bil worth of stuff and don't double-wrap, you die. To clarify, 4 different freighter pilots have died to us TWICE within 30 days (some within 48hours) because they failed to evolve. Mind your surroundings. Be more cautious, hell even be smart. We kill individuals who lack this capacity. Several people have slipped through our fingers by using just a modicum of intelligence. Poetic Stanziel wrote a great piece on how not to be dumb when you have expensive stuff to move. Always use collateral. General Freight cans exist for a reason. If you are a dumb and lazy freighter pilot, chances are you will die if you move through a tradehub pipe. When you are the very best at something, you take pride in it. How many of you can say you are the best at something? Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it? "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9444
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:24:00 -
[198] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it? You realise that the two posts you quoted don't contradict each other, right?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4662
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:25:00 -
[199] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it?
Yeah uh they don't get alliance funding, they're entirely self sufficient
I think it's fairly obvious given the fact that they're getting hilarious drops to keep going at it! please leave |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
302
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:30:00 -
[200] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it? Which one of those dead freighters were you?
Are you Gallente Citizen 20060217 or Miss Edney?
I fail to see you disputing any facts in this thread. You are just upset by truths and that's unfortunate. |
|
Ghazu
153
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:31:00 -
[201] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Seriously, you have no god-given right to total diplomatic immunity in highsec. If you can't deal with that reality then why torture yourself paying a monthly fee to inhabit a virtual world that you don't like? Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec. WE ARE DOING GOD'S WORK |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
387
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:34:00 -
[202] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it?
You're not very clever. It literally pains me to read threads like this given that the "problems" people invariably end up bitching about could be surmounted by the input of the SMALLEST amount of effort. I mean jesus christ, even WoW players generally take the time to research their characters and find the best talent builds / spell combos / whatever when they go and play. These "nerf cloaking, buff barges, buff freighters, neuter agression" threads are full of people who'd probably try and beat WoW without ever opening their skill sheets or picking up an item. "Dear Blizzard, my Paladin can't solo this dragon even though I spent literally 3 weeks in the newbie woods killing wolves, please fix your game." |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1641
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:37:00 -
[203] - Quote
Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Jonah Gravenstein
1178
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:38:00 -
[204] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it?
How is that bullshit?, 18 guys with a 1 billion isk seed don't need funding from their alliance, it's such a paltry sum that they probably put their own wallets into it and by the looks of it are getting a cracking return on their investment. CCP sell this game on the player driven content & a small squad of Goons running around ganking freighters is player driven content.
For those amongst us that think that hisec should be safe, I have found a sci-fi game, with spaceships that may appeal to you CCP can't patch stupid. |
Ghazu
153
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:39:00 -
[205] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. christ go back to that like and get liked thread, this aint a nice place for you. |
Horatioh Kane
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:40:00 -
[206] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:How many of you can say you are the best at something?
I can, boss man. :patriot:
AdmiralJohn wrote:Wait wait I have a solution.
People are saying that you can't retaliate to ganker in high sec. The obvious answer is that it should be much easier to PvP in high-sec. You could retaliate, or even strike preemptively, but Concord is holding you down!
I say it's time we all rally to have Concord step out permanently. This will at once get rid of ganking, and allow people to protect their assets preemptively.
This is obviously the best answer to everything ever. |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
302
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:40:00 -
[207] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9444
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:42:00 -
[208] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. What's self-righteous and elitist about it? Just because they know how ganks works and are willing to explain what goes into it (and what would make it no longer work) doesn't make them elitist GÇö it's outright friendly.
GǪand demonstrating by example that the supposed problem doesn't exist is just a bonus.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Horatioh Kane
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:43:00 -
[209] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow.
YOUR ELITIST ATTITUDE IS ALMOST AS BAD AS THAT JERK EVILWEASIL'S. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1644
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:49:00 -
[210] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow. Did you see "intergalactic summit" as the title of this section?
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
|
Lyrrashae
Crushed Ambitions Reckless Ambition
351
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:50:00 -
[211] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
You:
Un-install.
Now.
There is a fine and proper artistry to wielding verbal scalpels, such that the crap-poster you've slashed doesn't even know they've been cut. But verbal bludgeons -- Those are just fun. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2651
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:51:00 -
[212] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Seriously, you have no god-given right to total diplomatic immunity in highsec. If you can't deal with that reality then why torture yourself paying a monthly fee to inhabit a virtual world that you don't like? Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec. WE ARE DOING GOD'S WORK
God isn't real...EVE is. |
Jonah Gravenstein
1180
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:51:00 -
[213] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow. Did you see "intergalactic summit" as the title of this section?
MMORPG, Mostly masochists online role playing goons? CCP can't patch stupid. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9445
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 01:52:00 -
[214] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:God isn't real...EVE is. This will end well.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Agent Akari
Hobo Industries Inc
30
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 02:03:00 -
[215] - Quote
Question, where is the fleet with remote armor reppers? |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
303
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 02:25:00 -
[216] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow. Maybe you got "Intergalactic Summit" and "General Discussion" mixed up? It is a little fun leaving a swath of staggering destruction in your wake.
Role playing a jerk, while pointing out the methodology for target selection, while trying to help people might seem arrogant, I know, but this is unprecedented destruction doled out by a small group of bored goons. We surpassed burn jita destruction, which was only 515bil by my record. A certain aura of smug is really hard to shake, so a few guys will probably come off as over the top. I wouldn't read into it too much. They probably were stuck scanning freighters for 3 hours at a time. A little forum bitching keeps them going.
Every time we talk about some goofy thing we do outside of nullsec, CCP swoops in and murders the parties involved. This time we picked something that plenty of people have done on a small scale, without being exploity.
Space Thug means never havin' to say you are sorry, I guess. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2659
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 02:33:00 -
[217] - Quote
Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow. Maybe you got "Intergalactic Summit" and "General Discussion" mixed up? It is a little fun leaving a swath of staggering destruction in your wake. Role playing a jerk, while pointing out the methodology for target selection, while trying to help people might seem arrogant, I know, but this is unprecedented destruction doled out by a small group of bored goons. We surpassed burn jita destruction, which was only 515bil by my record. A certain aura of smug is really hard to shake, so a few guys will probably come off as over the top. I wouldn't read into it too much. They probably were stuck scanning freighters for 3 hours at a time. A little forum bitching keeps them going. Every time we talk about some goofy thing we do outside of nullsec, CCP swoops in and murders the parties involved. This time we picked something that plenty of people have done on a small scale, without being exploity. Space Thug means never havin' to say you are sorry, I guess.
Role playing a jerk? Is that what goonswarm is doing? Never found you guys to be jerks... more like...acting out because mommy and daddy are not home to supervise you right now. You guys seem more childish and annoying than you do jerks. |
Powers Sa
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
305
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 02:53:00 -
[218] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote: Role playing a jerk? Is that what goonswarm is doing? Never found you guys to be jerks... more like...acting out because mommy and daddy are not home to supervise you right now. You guys seem more childish and annoying than you do jerks.
Edit: As for your ingame actions... honestly I find you quite boring. Your "burn jita" event wasn't very exciting. Ganking AFK ships isn't very exciting. You guys should try to be more exciting. You might play the jerk role ingame...but you play the whine like children role on the forums.
Most of us are in our late 20's , early 30's with pretty good jobs. Its only Childish if you perceive us as such.
It is exciting for the people who were juking wardecs and blowing stuff up. Believe it or not, adrenaline is a fun thing. Blowing up stuff is a fun thing. You read far more into stuff than what is necessary. We just like to blow stuff up. It started off as AFK, and it has evolved into much much more. Your words and actions are those of someone who is frustrated by our ingame actions.
What excites you? If everything we do is so boring, then why do you care about this thread? We're just trying to have fun playing in a video game that offers many different outlets for entertainment. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
388
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 02:53:00 -
[219] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote: Role playing a jerk? Is that what goonswarm is doing? Never found you guys to be jerks... more like...acting out because mommy and daddy are not home to supervise you right now. You guys seem more childish and annoying than you do jerks.
Edit: As for your ingame actions... honestly I find you quite boring. Your "burn jita" event wasn't very exciting. Ganking AFK ships isn't very exciting. You guys should try to be more exciting. You might play the jerk role ingame...but you play the whine like children role on the forums.
We get plenty of excitement in nullsec. Sometimes it's just fun to sit back, blow off some steam and blow up some moron's freighter(s).
I like that you don't consider the people posting whiny threads about how mommy and daddy need to keep them safe from the mean, mean world because they're incapable of doing it themselves children, though. |
Ghazu
157
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:04:00 -
[220] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Powers Sa wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nah you got it all wrong Goon, I actually agree to a point with you when it comes to freighters and such, it's your self rightous elitist attitude that seems so common among you and your peers that I'm allergic to. I'm roleplaying, holy cow. Maybe you got "Intergalactic Summit" and "General Discussion" mixed up? It is a little fun leaving a swath of staggering destruction in your wake. Role playing a jerk, while pointing out the methodology for target selection, while trying to help people might seem arrogant, I know, but this is unprecedented destruction doled out by a small group of bored goons. We surpassed burn jita destruction, which was only 515bil by my record. A certain aura of smug is really hard to shake, so a few guys will probably come off as over the top. I wouldn't read into it too much. They probably were stuck scanning freighters for 3 hours at a time. A little forum bitching keeps them going. Every time we talk about some goofy thing we do outside of nullsec, CCP swoops in and murders the parties involved. This time we picked something that plenty of people have done on a small scale, without being exploity. Space Thug means never havin' to say you are sorry, I guess. Role playing a jerk? Is that what goonswarm is doing? Never found you guys to be jerks... more like...acting out because mommy and daddy are not home to supervise you right now. You guys seem more childish and annoying than you do jerks. Edit: As for your ingame actions... honestly I find you quite boring. Your "burn jita" event wasn't very exciting. Ganking AFK ships isn't very exciting. You guys should try to be more exciting. You might play the jerk role ingame...but you play the whine like children role on the forums. tell us about mining in rookie systems |
|
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1689
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:10:00 -
[221] - Quote
Ghazu wrote: tell us about mining in rookie systems
wtf are you serious? |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1656
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:10:00 -
[222] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:tell us about mining in rookie systems It sucks, older players with fleets of mining barges and orcas (which I'm coming to understand may very well be operated by a single person) come into the starter/school systems and clear cut entire fields forcing new players who barely know what they're doing to venture out into the neighboring systems where CCP's "no harassing newbs in the starter/school systems" rules don't apply, just so they can complete tutorial missions and/or make a pittance with their mining frigates/destroyers. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Karl Hobb
Stellar Ore Refinery and Crematorium
539
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:15:00 -
[223] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:It sucks, older players with fleets of mining barges and orcas (which I'm coming to understand may very well be operated by a single person) come into the starter/school systems and clear cut entire fields BUT ITS THE SAFEST PLACE TO MINE Nothing Found |
Ghazu
157
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:17:00 -
[224] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Is griefing/harassing players in rookie systems allowed? There is a guy who's been harassing rookies in a system I mine in. Are you trying to exploit rookie protection? Get out and leave the system for the rookies. I mine there to help the rookies, I give them bonuses, answer questions, and I even give away most the isk I earn to help them out. I am not doing them any harm nor am I hiding out in a rookie system for protection. Are you mining the roids there while you 'help out' I am a miner, of course I mine there. But I don't take all my accounts there to mine all their ore. Wouldn't be helping at that point now would it. But between giving away isk, ships, chasing away exhumers, reporting bots, and trying to answer any questions I might be able to answer, my tiny amount of occasional mining there isn't really an issue. Most of the time local is dead quiet, hard to get people to talk there. Was giving away isk a while back and it took almost an hour before someone finally noticed in local and said something lol. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1872878#post1872878
why of course he mines there because he's a miner and of course it's from the like and get liked thread where dudes go like each other. no because this guy is a joke and like to stroke his epeen in front of wide-eyed new players.
just leave the rookie systems no ifs and buts. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1462
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:21:00 -
[225] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:It sucks, older players with fleets of mining barges and orcas (which I'm coming to understand may very well be operated by a single person) come into the starter/school systems and clear cut entire fields BUT ITS THE SAFEST PLACE TO MINE That's... a thing, huh.
That shouldn't be a thing. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Karl Hobb
Stellar Ore Refinery and Crematorium
539
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:22:00 -
[226] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:That's... a thing, huh.
That shouldn't be a thing. That's exactly what I thought about that link in your sig... Nothing Found |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1689
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:23:00 -
[227] - Quote
I... what... I don't even...
It's like some unemployed 23 year old GROWN ASS MAN sneaking into a baby nursery wearing a diaper and a bib CRAWLING INTO A FRICKIN CRIB and going 'gaa gaa goo goo', occasionally ripping his pacifier out to call other people 'childish'. |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:27:00 -
[228] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:I... what... I don't even...
It's like some unemployed 23 year old GROWN ASS MAN sneaking into a baby nursery wearing a diaper and a bib CRAWLING INTO A FRICKIN CRIB and going 'gaa gaa goo goo', occasionally ripping his pacifier out to call other people 'childish'. Why hasn't this post been deleted? Mine were. |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:28:00 -
[229] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Ghazu wrote: tell us about mining in rookie systems
wtf are you serious? Your post has no content, why has it not been deleted? |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:28:00 -
[230] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Seriously, you have no god-given right to total diplomatic immunity in highsec. If you can't deal with that reality then why torture yourself paying a monthly fee to inhabit a virtual world that you don't like? Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec. WE ARE DOING GOD'S WORK Your post is not constructive and has no content. |
|
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
502
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:28:00 -
[231] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created.
Losing 10b+ of stuff really, really sucks.... Sorry about that...
A core feature of EvE is that there are consequences for your actions, and CCP isn't going to hold your hand or prevent you from doing something unintelligent. This is why scamming, tricking, trapping, and taking advantage of the ignorance or poor decision of others is allowed. If you undock in a ship carrying 10b in cargo, and someone notices, you're gonna get ganked. It's just common sense... If your insurance company will pay you $$100k if you crash your $10k car, would you crash it? Would your neighbor?? In EvE, if you offer returns like this, people are going to do it....
And how could you protect against this? If they buff freighters so it takes twice or thrice as many talos's to destroy it, do you really think this will prevent the suicide gankers from ganking such a valuable target? Of course not!!! And it's not in CCP's game design to "prevent" you from making a bad choice.... nor should they...
And lets be frank, if we could fit modules to a freighter, could we really fit enough to make it safe to haul 10+b isk in cargo? I doubt it... Most people will just fit their ship for maximum utility, much like the old exhumers pilots. The old hulks could fit a 30+k EHP tank, but people CHOSE to fit for yield with pitiful sub-10k EHP tanks that a dessie or two could gank. Perhaps people don't realize how fragile a freighter is, making them a wonderful target in ignorance. But giving Burn Jita, given regular suicide ganks of freighters, given the decimation of orcas during hulkageddon, it takes a special type of ignorance not to realize that all ships are vulnerable, even in highsec. It's not CCP's job to prevent us from making bad decisions!!!
|
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:29:00 -
[232] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Oh come off it Goon, I've only been at this 18 days and even I can see the issue here is your coalition has become so powerful that the only thing left for you guys to do is wreak havoc on highsec.
So powerful that we've literally got an 18-man gang in highsec doing things with no alliance funding? Yikes, I can see the scale of your problem. Powers Sa wrote:A great deal of effort and work goes into this. We have a production team to keep us in ships. We started the gank fest with a 1bil investment. The cost of the gank usually mirrors the cost of the freighter hull, unlike miners who can be owned by 2 destroyers at a fraction of the cost. Lots of coordination is required on the production, scanning, bumping, hauling, salvaging, market clearing, and ultimately execution. These strikes are surgical. It is a gamble every time that we execute one of these ganks, and we have a risk/reward formula that we use to ensure that our ganks are free until the end of time. Every one of our gankers gets a free ship because our previous ganks (seed of 1bil) fund future ganks. This is a playstyle. If you autopilot in a freighter, you die. If you cruise around with 10bil worth of stuff and don't double-wrap, you die. To clarify, 4 different freighter pilots have died to us TWICE within 30 days (some within 48hours) because they failed to evolve. Mind your surroundings. Be more cautious, hell even be smart. We kill individuals who lack this capacity. Several people have slipped through our fingers by using just a modicum of intelligence. Poetic Stanziel wrote a great piece on how not to be dumb when you have expensive stuff to move. Always use collateral. General Freight cans exist for a reason. If you are a dumb and lazy freighter pilot, chances are you will die if you move through a tradehub pipe. When you are the very best at something, you take pride in it. How many of you can say you are the best at something? Do you guys take classes in bullshit or are you recruited for your natural talent in it? this post is insulting and should be deleted |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
656
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:30:00 -
[233] - Quote
It's not often I say this, but I'll go ahead and say it.
That (clearing out rookie system belts) is something you shouldn't be allowed to do. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9447
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:35:00 -
[234] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:It's not often I say this, but I'll go ahead and say it.
That (clearing out rookie system belts) is something you shouldn't be allowed to do. Sure you should. The problem is rather that they contain too much ore in too high concentration. Optimally, there should be no belts at allGǪ
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1465
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:37:00 -
[235] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:That's... a thing, huh.
That shouldn't be a thing. That's exactly what I thought about that link in your sig... I'll have you know that, according to one of the people featured in it, that page does not exist. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Ghazu
157
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:37:00 -
[236] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:[quote=Paul Oliver]It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created.
Tier 3 BCs trade off firepower for weak tank. You don't get to have everything in one ship, if you want tanking power use properly fitted orcas or transport ships or take 2 trips with the freighter. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
658
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:38:00 -
[237] - Quote
Tippia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:It's not often I say this, but I'll go ahead and say it.
That (clearing out rookie system belts) is something you shouldn't be allowed to do. Sure you should. The problem is rather that they contain too much ore in too high concentration. Optimally, there should be no belts at allGǪ The way I see it if you're an older player you really have no business messing about in rookie systems. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Malak Synn
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:40:00 -
[238] - Quote
OP thinks there should be a revamp to Freighters & Jump Freighters...
Got news for ya, Sunshine...
It's only going to make the ships gunning for the ganks Bigger & Badder.
The Gank Squads will adapt, and continue to profit... Business As Usual.
Such is Life in New Eden... World Without End. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1657
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:40:00 -
[239] - Quote
Tippia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:It's not often I say this, but I'll go ahead and say it.
That (clearing out rookie system belts) is something you shouldn't be allowed to do. Sure you should. The problem is rather that they contain too much ore in too high concentration. Optimally, there should be no belts at allGǪ Right because people who can barely fly their ship to an asteroid belt much less mine should be forced to fly out to systems where people in assault frigates (playing off the fact most newbs don't know about T2 ships yet and confuse them for T1) are waiting to can flip them. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:45:00 -
[240] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:That's... a thing, huh.
That shouldn't be a thing. That's exactly what I thought about that link in your sig...
The sig made me rage cuz I saw a french name then nothing else in french.
WTF???
As for ganking to be on topic, people need to stop loading thier ship with that much isk... |
|
Idris Helion
University of Caille Gallente Federation
67
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:50:00 -
[241] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:It's not often I say this, but I'll go ahead and say it.
That (clearing out rookie system belts) is something you shouldn't be allowed to do.
It's a waste of time if you're in a barge anyhow. You pop a roid in less than a full cycle of your strip miner more often than not. I never did understand why miners would bother with 1.0 or .9 systems. .8 is barely worth the effort, and that's only because that's the first time Pyroxeres start showing up.
The weird thing is that there is a whole raft of roid-heavy .5 and .6 systems further out that are almost deserted. Systems with no stations are wide open, and that's a natural habitat for an Orca-led mining crew.
I guess I would chalk it up to laziness -- they don't want to haul ore and minerals too far to a trade hub. But if you're a miner by profession (which you are by definition if you're driving an Orca), then I can't understand why you wouldn't do everything you could to maximize your ISK/hr...and you're not gonna do that by hoovering up the scraps in noob systems. (Not to mention the dickishness involved in forcing the noobs to venture further afield to get their pathetic little gobs of ore for missions.)
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9447
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:52:00 -
[242] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:The way I see it if you're an older player you really have no business messing about in rookie systems. GǪand that's why the density should be so low that anyone that has gone beyond the most basic frigate will be wasting their time going there. Even more so when any larger ship will be wasting tons of time on all the moving around (between rocks and between sites) that they'd go through, unlike said frigate, which would be nippy enough to go wherever without any real loss.
Paul Oliver wrote:Right because people who can barely fly their ship to an asteroid belt much less mine should be forced to fly out to systems Quite the opposite, actually. Again, that's why the density should be much lower. But sure, if you say so. I don't see how your suggestion would be good for newbies, though.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
502
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 03:54:00 -
[243] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:It does seem kind of strange that a ship capable of hauling that much cargo which aligns and warps as slowly as a freighter does would not have the ability to fit any sort of defensive modules or atleast a method to avoid being tackled. Also the fact that a ship type that didn't even exist when freighters were introduced is being used exclusively to do the ganking implies that an imbalance exists and should be corrected, after all it's only logical that when a weapon is created that gives one side an advantage over another that a counter is also created. Tier 3 BCs trade off firepower for weak tank. You don't get to have everything in one ship, if you want tanking power use properly fitted orcas or transport ships or take 2 trips with the freighter.
I think you missed the part where I'm quoting Paul.... those are his words, not mine.
Also, to play devil's advocate, orca's and transport ships have very limited cargo capacity compared to freighters, and hence are often not viable. And to safely carry 10+b by freighter, you probably need to make 5+ trips or so (which is a significant amount of time!!!). A more viable, albeit still moderately risky method, is to double wrap your packages to prevent gankers from determining the value of your cargo. This itself is not without problems though, as insider information can still get you caught, it's also possible that gankers might risk the gank anyway, and I'm not 100% sure double-wrapping still works to inhibit cargo scanning.
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9447
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:02:00 -
[244] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Also, to play devil's advocate, orca's and transport ships have very limited cargo capacity compared to freighters, and hence are often not viable. And to safely carry 10+b by freighter, you probably need to make 5+ trips or so (which is a significant amount of time!!!). GǪto which the standard counter-question is: which takes more time, a second and third trip or earning back the 10bn you just lost? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1465
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:04:00 -
[245] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Karl Hobb wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:That's... a thing, huh.
That shouldn't be a thing. That's exactly what I thought about that link in your sig... The sig made me rage cuz I saw a french name then nothing else in french. WTF??? As for ganking to be on topic, people need to stop loading thier ship with that much isk... I'm sure there's french stuff in the "proceedings".
But yeah, you load your freighter to the gills with expensive stuff, well then ... Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
503
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:17:00 -
[246] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Also, to play devil's advocate, orca's and transport ships have very limited cargo capacity compared to freighters, and hence are often not viable. And to safely carry 10+b by freighter, you probably need to make 5+ trips or so (which is a significant amount of time!!!). GǪto which the standard counter-question is: which takes more time, a second and third trip or earning back the 10bn you just lost?
It always boils down to, is the risk worth the reward... or how can I mitigate the risks while maximizing the long-term rewards...
If 5 trips takes you 5 hours to complete, and 1 trip takes you an hour.... and perhaps you gamble that you'll only get ganked once out every 10 times.... then the 1 hour trips could easily be worth it!!
Personally, I'd recommend breaking it into 10 1b isk trips, and courier contract them all to redfrog with collateral....
|
Agent Akari
Hobo Industries Inc
31
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:18:00 -
[247] - Quote
So to make this short, nobody likes to play support and use remote armor ships to prevent a Freighter from getting destroyed? |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1657
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:21:00 -
[248] - Quote
Agent Akari wrote:So to make this short, nobody likes to play support and use remote armor ships to prevent a Freighter from getting destroyed? I would totally offer that service were I able to. Seems the best way to deal with situations like this isn't to complain, but to adapt, and make some isk off it. I still think freighters should be looked at though, if only to provide them the ability to fit a few warp core stabilizers. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1692
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:22:00 -
[249] - Quote
look man, it's unreasonable to expect people to actually defend their 21 billion in assets when they're autopiloting them through highsec. defending it just wouldn't be worth it m8 |
Ghazu
157
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:26:00 -
[250] - Quote
I think the Maelstrom's bullshit shield boosting bonus should be rebalanced to 10% shield resist or 10% hp per level. |
|
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 04:51:00 -
[251] - Quote
Reading about all that ganking happening in that system reminds me of my 2 pod trip in there back when I didn't know about shuttle. Newbie make stupid moves sometime... |
Orzo Torasson
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
63
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 05:03:00 -
[252] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
TEST occasionally ganks freighters too. But in return, we lose them more often than any other entity in EVE. Nerf gankers. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
273
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 05:21:00 -
[253] - Quote
I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives.
It's obvious logic. You don't make a ship out of tinfoil and throw it on the ocean, then send it through pirate territory or even into potentially hazardous waters. You make it tough as hell, give it at least some means to fight off attackers for a short time and if it's carrying valuable cargo, you send an escort with it.
Even with an Escort fleet, the chances are it is going to have to survive for a time and will sustain damage, so the previous logic holds.
No reason why EVE should be any different except to favor gank bears and give them easy kills.
Nations and Corporations don't design stuff and field it with a high potential risk of profit loss. Most of the 'Industrial ships' in games however, are designed to be so easily destroyed and incapable that it makes you wonder. Even single player spaceship games suffer from this oversight.
On the other hand, provided appropriate armament, a skilled pilot, and a little focus and determination a Fighter Jet could do significant damage to a transport ship before it ran out of ammunition. It might even sink it, but for whatever reason, those things are practically capsizing just from the loads they carry. That's what happens when people grow complacent in the absence of danger I guess.
Of course, it is a heck of a lot of cargo containers to search, and most of it will probably end up on the bottom of the ocean if you even attempt to attack it with any significant armament anyway, so I'm not sure anyone would bother. I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1692
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 05:24:00 -
[254] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1664
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 05:54:00 -
[255] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly. "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1692
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 06:00:00 -
[256] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly. How does that make it a moot point? Say they bring an instalocking frig, I should be entitled to tens if not hundreds of thousands of EHP on my shuttle right? |
Borlag Crendraven
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
83
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 06:00:00 -
[257] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly.
Moot point because you can't balance freighters or anything else for that matter to withstand attacks from far greater group. Or did you perhaps ignore the fact that the killmail had 15 battlecruisers in it, that's how many it took to kill it. At what point would you consider it balanced? When it requires 150? Simply put, it's working as intended as a solo pilot should not be able to survive after making a mistake and getting cauhgt in a camp like that.
And for those asking for a nerf to the profits. That's almost like asking for the gankees to start thinking and fitting/filling their boats smarter so that they are not aloot pinata like was with these freighters that got ganked. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
504
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 06:02:00 -
[258] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives.
It's obvious logic. You don't make a ship out of tinfoil and throw it on the ocean, then send it through pirate territory or even into potentially hazardous waters. You make it tough as hell, give it at least some means to fight off attackers for a short time and if it's carrying valuable cargo, you send an escort with it.
Even with an Escort fleet, the chances are it is going to have to survive for a time and will sustain damage, so the previous logic holds.
A freighter does have a significant amount of EHP.... ~200k EHP. This is enough to withstand bombardment by multiple ships while it waits for concord to arrive.... However, no matter how much EHP you give it, there will always be a number of ships that when working together, can destroy it before concord arrives. Just like, no matter what escort your bring, nor how tanky a ship on the ocean is, if an enemy through's enough fighter bombers at it, they'll sink the ship.
The 21b Obelisk on evekill took 6 gankfit talos to destroy it.... At 80m per ship, that's about 500m to gank it, meaning they need to carry 1b in goods before it becomes statistically likely they'll break even on the gank. Where should that limit be?? Personally, I find 1b is a reasonable limit, especially when there are tricks and techniques you can use to limit your "risk of gankage"!
|
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 06:25:00 -
[259] - Quote
I actually wouldn't bother increasing a freighters ehp; it has enough already. I'd just like to see it have a fitting or two becuase it is boring.
The industrials and such are pretty wimpy though for the most part. High align times, slow, slower with tank or otherwise just easy targets that are easy to catch and kill. Not really worth much. I imagine most people just train them to get transports or to haul cheap trash around like I did.
Nicola is being his usual self I see; grossly over-exagerating and making erroneous assumptions about my intent with little or no indication as to what it might be. Not in a literal sense or directed at anything specific anyway.
Really, I just posted because I noticed it was gank-heavy in here and needed a little balance.
T1 Industrials could use some changes if anything, and Freighters could use some tuning options that wouldn't be highly exploitable. There isn't much that wouldn't be exploitable obviously, but something would be nice.
T2 Industrials could simply use a little adjustment to bring them in line with any changes to their T1 counterparts, but really, they aren't bad as they are. Maybe a little extra ehp on the non-covops transports or some changes to resistances or transport level bonuses. Guns would be nice, (just because), and it would go with the Bustards camo-scheme.
..actually, that's not a bad idea, and would make for some interesting fits, but I don't imagine it would really be that impressive or change much with regard to how they are used.
On the other hand, it would be neat to see a fleet of 20 Heavy Transports get on a kb to the detriment of some poor, unsuspecting ganker.
I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4570
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 06:56:00 -
[260] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly.
Doesn't help them when they're outpiloting though.
Honestly all this "a bloo hoo Freighters can't fight back" is bullshit, because it would matter if you gave freighters 8 doomsdays each, they'll still die because PEOPLE AUTOPILOT THEM. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
|
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:01:00 -
[261] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly. Doesn't help them when they're outpiloting though. Honestly all this "a bloo hoo Freighters can't fight back" is bullshit, because it would matter if you gave freighters 8 doomsdays each, they'll still die because PEOPLE AUTOPILOT THEM.
Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module? I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Ghazu
159
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:05:00 -
[262] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Malcanis wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly. Doesn't help them when they're outpiloting though. Honestly all this "a bloo hoo Freighters can't fight back" is bullshit, because it would matter if you gave freighters 8 doomsdays each, they'll still die because PEOPLE AUTOPILOT THEM. Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module? Read what you wrote again and tell me if it sounds stupid. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4570
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:06:00 -
[263] - Quote
Maybe you could be actively cooperating with a corp mate to web warp Your freighter? Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
GOTMYEYEONYOU
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
9
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:11:00 -
[264] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Maybe you could be actively cooperating with a corp mate to web warp Your freighter? so ganker shoots the webber first. was that your awesome solution? cause its pretty fail.
edit: also, let me point out that bumping the freighte renders all efforts moot what, not relevant enough? or have you decided to make it personal? |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1693
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:22:00 -
[265] - Quote
- wow, theres 8 paragraphs gone |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:25:00 -
[266] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I actually wouldn't bother increasing a freighters ehp; it has enough already. I'd just like to see it have a fitting or two becuase it is boring. The industrials and such are pretty wimpy though for the most part. High align times, slow, slower with tank or otherwise just easy targets that are easy to catch and kill. Not really worth much. I imagine most people just train them to get transports or to haul cheap trash around like I did. Nicola is being his usual self I see; grossly over-exagerating and making erroneous assumptions about my intent with little or no indication as to what it might be. Not in a literal sense or directed at anything specific anyway. Really, I just posted because I noticed it was gank-heavy in here and needed a little balance. T1 Industrials could use some changes if anything, and Freighters could use some tuning options that wouldn't be highly exploitable. There isn't much that wouldn't be exploitable obviously, but something would be nice. T2 Industrials could simply use a little adjustment to bring them in line with any changes to their T1 counterparts, but really, they aren't bad as they are. Maybe a little extra ehp on the non-covops transports or some changes to resistances or transport level bonuses. Guns would be nice, (just because), and it would go with the Bustards camo-scheme. ..actually, that's not a bad idea, and would make for some interesting fits, but I don't imagine it would really be that impressive or change much with regard to how they are used. On the other hand, it would be neat to see a fleet of 20 Heavy Transports get on a kb to the detriment of some poor, unsuspecting ganker.
You must have had a point to quoting this; I'm just not sure what it was. Actually, I'd guess that you think I just validated your previous post indicating that I wanted to boost Freighter ehp to some monstrous level that would require maybe another 3-4 Battlecruisers to gank effectively.
..except that I just indicated the only thing I'd like to see on Freighters is some unexploitable mods to make them more interesting instead of the floating beachballs they are currently.
Do you read?
..nevermind, it was shuttles, which are hardly industrials with only 10 m3 of cargo capacity. Either way.. if it had been freighters, at least your point would have been at least partially relevent. I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1693
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:28:00 -
[267] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote: You must have had a point to quoting this; I'm just not sure what it was. Actually, I'd guess that you think I just validated your previous post indicating that I wanted to boost Freighter ehp to some monstrous level that would require maybe another 3-4 Battlecruisers to gank effectively.
..except that I just indicated the only thing I'd like to see on Freighters is some unexploitable mods to make them more interesting instead of the floating beachballs they are currently.
Do you read?
No actually the forum ate my lengthy post in reply. Settle down beavis. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:30:00 -
[268] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote: You must have had a point to quoting this; I'm just not sure what it was. Actually, I'd guess that you think I just validated your previous post indicating that I wanted to boost Freighter ehp to some monstrous level that would require maybe another 3-4 Battlecruisers to gank effectively.
..except that I just indicated the only thing I'd like to see on Freighters is some unexploitable mods to make them more interesting instead of the floating beachballs they are currently.
Do you read?
No actually the forum ate my lengthy post in reply. Settle down beavis.
ah.. you do know the forum has a draft feature right? click, copy, pasty, and we're all good. Bit late now though maybe. I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
111
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:31:00 -
[269] - Quote
Wow this is still not dead? |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:48:00 -
[270] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Maybe you could be actively cooperating with a corp mate to web warp Your freighter?
I've actually done that. Not my freighter, but someone elses. Wasn't much fun.
@previous poster: It was deeply entrenched sarcasm. Freighters don't have modules.
My point was the Freighter can't really do anything and aside from that little trick, (which doesn't help much), is essentially a large beach ball that you pop in the air and wait for it to land. Hopefully nobody pops it with a fork along the way.
Sure, you can bring a big fleet to escort it, but how does that help against the gang of 30 Tornados come to one shot gank it, and the Neutral ship to scoop the loot?Sure, you could also be present and accounted for and warp to zero, but it doesn't stop somebody from bumping you off course when you are trying to align from a gate and preventing you warping.
Now all they need is the fork and the bumper is a neutral party.
You could get a Fleet member to gank the Neutral party, (bumper or grinder), but what if they have more than one? Industrials are cheap; they could have a dozen, or a couple dozen.
Beachball < Fork
..or spork if you like.
So all the tricks in the book will net you one thing: The gankers will counter them with the appropriate measure. It's not even challenging for them; just spend ISK and receive cookies.
So, why not autopilot?
Because it's so much more fun ganking a Freighter with an active pilot than the one where the autopilot is on and the guy isn't going to know until he gets back from watching 4 hours of that Red Dwarf marathon.
No juicy tears to savor until he posts a whine thread in C&P or comments on the killboards, no screams in local until he comes back and sees his pod floating in space next to a can labelled "We pwned you and has your stuffz," long after you're gone, etc...
So really, no reason.
I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
|
Jonah Gravenstein
1183
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:50:00 -
[271] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:Wow this is still not dead?
It'll die eventually and then be resurrected when more freighters/exhumers/badly fitted ships of choice die to suicide ganks.
The circle of gank.
CCP can't patch stupid. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
388
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 07:56:00 -
[272] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Malcanis wrote:Paul Oliver wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Mars Theran wrote:I'm still firmly of the opinion that anything without guns to defend itself, flying through any space that has potential hostiles should have been designed to survive most attacks until support arrives. how many tens of thousands of EHP should shuttles have exactly? Moot point, shuttles don't need lots of hitpoints because warp almost instantly. Doesn't help them when they're outpiloting though. Honestly all this "a bloo hoo Freighters can't fight back" is bullshit, because it would matter if you gave freighters 8 doomsdays each, they'll still die because PEOPLE AUTOPILOT THEM. Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module?
You are literally what is wrong with empire dwellers. |
Michael1995
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:02:00 -
[273] - Quote
I agree, suicide ganking freighters in HS is way too easy, doesn't require effort, and is 100% guaranteed to kill. PROOF THAT THIS IS TRUE.
Mind you, it took them another 30 minutes to bump him out of range of concord to finish the job, in that time he must've been batphoning his buddies for help... That or he was just afk. :) One does not simply buy their way into Goonswarm. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:04:00 -
[274] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:Mars Theran wrote:
Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module?
You are literally what is wrong with empire dwellers.
Have you ever piloted a freighter over more than 5-6 jumps? I did once. That was the first and last time, and I sold it shortly after. It was Hek to Jita iirc and it was the slowest space transit of my life.
It's not bad enough that they take forever to align, but once you're in warp you stay there, literally. Sit back, twiddle your thumbs, read a book, because you're not getting there anytime soon, and when you do, you just end up hopping gate and repeating the whole process over again, for every system.
gah..
I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Jonah Gravenstein
1184
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:05:00 -
[275] - Quote
heh love the name of the Obelisk in that screenie CCP can't patch stupid. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:05:00 -
[276] - Quote
Michael1995 wrote:I agree, suicide ganking freighters in HS is way too easy, doesn't require effort, and is 100% guaranteed to kill. PROOF THAT THIS IS TRUE.Mind you, it took them another 30 minutes to bump him out of range of concord to finish the job, in that time he must've been batphoning his buddies for help... That or he was just afk. :)
I think once you know you are fubar, you just walk away, watch tv, and wait for it to be over. I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4572
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:06:00 -
[277] - Quote
GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:Malcanis wrote:Maybe you could be actively cooperating with a corp mate to web warp Your freighter? so ganker shoots the webber first. was that your awesome solution? cause its pretty fail. edit: also, let me point out that bumping the freighte renders all efforts moot
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:10:00 -
[278] - Quote
As usual the mechanics around killing freighters in high-sec are crap.
Those doing the bumping and those that pick up the loot remain neutral. It's like a gang of bank robbers that get caught and the get away drivers are not considered part of the crime.
The mechanics around suicide ganking in high-sec were crap and still are crap.
As for t3 BCs what was CCP thinking, oh that's right they weren't as usual. |
Michael1995
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:13:00 -
[279] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote: I think once you know you are fubar, you just walk away, watch tv, and wait for it to be over.
During that 30 minute wait he could've logged off past the 15 minute time, as they didn't have anything *CHEAP* to aggress the freighter, he would've warped off and disappeared after a minute. So unless they had a combat scanner on standby he probably would've gotten away.
But I'm assuming the guy had hit autopilot several hours earlier and went afk. One does not simply buy their way into Goonswarm. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:28:00 -
[280] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:GOTMYEYEONYOU wrote:Malcanis wrote:Maybe you could be actively cooperating with a corp mate to web warp Your freighter? so ganker shoots the webber first. was that your awesome solution? cause its pretty fail. edit: also, let me point out that bumping the freighte renders all efforts moot
What was this about gankers shooting the webber. The problem with people like you is that you misquote in an attempt to summarize while missing the whole point of the post.
Let me point it out carefully for you:
Neutral ship in league with the 30 Tornados sitting off gate, (most likely an Inty or fast Frigate), bumps the Freighter as it goes to align off gate and warp to the next gate on route, (autopilot or no autopilot), and the bumped freighter does the typical bob and try to align and so on until the pilot cancels warp, (if he's there), and tries to realign to another point or head back to gate.
Bumper, (in League with Pirates/Gankers), simply bumps him off course again or otherwise keeps him from aligning to any celestials or returning to the gate.
Pretty simple tactics here; I think I learned them when I was 3.
So, the Freighter pilot, (That's the victim btw), has a fleet. He gets a Fleet member to pop the Neutral Frigate and that member is subsequently Concorded.
Poof, we have Concord. We've also lost a Destroyer or something, but that's not particularly important.
Okay, the Freighter could bring Neutral Logis. Look, we have Crimewatch - not sure how this works, but irrelevent.
Logis are an active Rep and not a buffer. Alpha beats active Rep. Simple; maybe need one more Nado.
Concord is going to kill the Nados anyway, so they are here but who cares unless the Nados, (just an example), need to fire 2 shots each right?
Wait, so now we need 3 more Nados? Better be worth it.
How many ships can Concord kill at once anyway? ..never bothered to figure that out.
All that can be solved easily enough I assume; just start firing before Concord gets there. All you really need to do is bump the Freighter off course long enough to lock him up in range of good dps. Given he's leaving a gate and within 12km of it, that means you're likely no more than 25 km away.
You figure it out.
So.. big guns, SEBOs and Damage Mods/Rigs, Neutral MWD frigate for bumping, ignore the webber and logis because they aren't going to do any good anyway, kill it before Concord gets there, ganglink and off-grid boosting for effect, and bring a Freighter to pick everything up with because surely they won't have the ships to counter gank that, and if they do, maybe you should wait for a better target.
Have I got it about right? I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
|
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:28:00 -
[281] - Quote
Michael1995 wrote:Mars Theran wrote: I think once you know you are fubar, you just walk away, watch tv, and wait for it to be over.
During that 30 minute wait he could've logged off past the 15 minute time, as they didn't have anything *CHEAP* to aggress the freighter, he would've warped off and disappeared after a minute. So unless they had a combat scanner on standby he probably would've gotten away. But I'm assuming the guy had hit autopilot several hours earlier and went afk.
That's weird, because it was an Anshar.
..also, just thinking I remember something about nerfing the logoffski to save your ship, but not sure if it ever happened.
nvm, you addressed that and they have I gather. But still, that doesn't really explain it. If he wasn't locked up and was just being bumped, you'd think he would have tried something. Maybe he was setting up his cyno on an alt in a hurry and got ganked. Who knows? I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
William Walker
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
60
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:36:00 -
[282] - Quote
HERE is your solution: do not autpilot in highsec! Warp to zero. Got aggressed by someone? Jump/Dock. AMAZING |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:38:00 -
[283] - Quote
William Walker wrote:HERE is your solution: do not autpilot in highsec! Warp to zero. Got aggressed by someone? Jump/Dock. AMAZING
Won't help as they jump through the game and are bumped off course on the other side. |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 08:56:00 -
[284] - Quote
pussnheels wrote:William Walker wrote:HERE is your solution: do not autpilot in highsec! Warp to zero. Got aggressed by someone? Jump/Dock. AMAZING that is part of the solution Problem is that a few freighter pilots were carrying way to much in value wise in their ships, it is not the game mechanic that is at fault it is the pilots and their corp that is for allowing this to happen , also pretty much sounds and looks like a inside job to me Ganking exhumers has been rebalanced , but there never was and there isn't a need to nerf the ganking of haulers and freighters in my opinion it takes much more team work to set up and has more risks involved than ganking exhumers ( still remember how i witnessed the ganking of a freighter in Niarja and the rage when a third party ran off with the loot that was hiilarious) my opinion and reading thru this thread that most people think the same way about this
But would be better to make someone that keeps bumping a ship an aggressor. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1695
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:03:00 -
[285] - Quote
I'm going to try and retype a brief version what I said before the forum ate it.
Mara's dissatisfaction with the freighter gameplay are not related to any flaw with the freighters themselves, they're merely relics of a bygone era when highseccers were expected to work together as part of teams to achieve goals. The problems are centered around the fact that the freighter hauler in highsec has little recourse to all those blobs of blaster BCs hanging around the gates and clearing them out. In nullsec, my home, these are simple matters - you shoot all the people in your way then keep moving the freighter through. Or you don't and the freighter dies. Any solutions provided to highsec players to resolve this problem would necessarily involve increasing the scope and effectiveness of war declarations/initiatiing PVP over a contested resource (use of a stargate). But carebears reject those sort of personal responsibility-based solutions out of hand, even if it'll benefit them in the long run.
So the other option is making suicide ganking of freighters less effective somehow. However, keep in mind that if freighter hauling becomes even safer and easier then it is now, then it follows that more people will do it, and will do it more often. Given that EVE is a player-driven economy, a large increase in supply (of 'freighter hauling service') would mean prices for those services would lower and freighter pilots would as individuals make less ISK.
Given the nature of cumulative wealth and profit in EVE Online (people using their wealth to invest in making even more wealth), one asks, in a game where some veteran is multiboxing 32 freighters to autopilot 20 bil each in goods in total safety because he'll get a 0.15% return at the end of the journey, where does this leave the newbie hauler with a bestower trying to eke out an income where 0.15% returns (of in his case very little) are the norm?
Suicide ganking helps newbies because, in the lack of effective wardecs and resource contention, it prevents rich veterans from boating around in utterly ultra-pimp fit PVE machines in a feedback loop of ISK accumulation, trouncing poorer. The axiom of "Don't fly what you can't afford to lose" gives less wealthy characters a fighting chance in the EVE economy in terms of resources.
So, with that in mind, is someone losing a 21 bil unescorted, unscouted freighter to a suicide gank a problem? I don't think so. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4572
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:05:00 -
[286] - Quote
Sabrina Solette wrote:pussnheels wrote:William Walker wrote:HERE is your solution: do not autpilot in highsec! Warp to zero. Got aggressed by someone? Jump/Dock. AMAZING that is part of the solution Problem is that a few freighter pilots were carrying way to much in value wise in their ships, it is not the game mechanic that is at fault it is the pilots and their corp that is for allowing this to happen , also pretty much sounds and looks like a inside job to me Ganking exhumers has been rebalanced , but there never was and there isn't a need to nerf the ganking of haulers and freighters in my opinion it takes much more team work to set up and has more risks involved than ganking exhumers ( still remember how i witnessed the ganking of a freighter in Niarja and the rage when a third party ran off with the loot that was hiilarious) my opinion and reading thru this thread that most people think the same way about this But would be better to make someone that keeps bumping a ship an aggressor.
No it wouldn't, that would cause a host of other problems.
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
388
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:06:00 -
[287] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Mars Theran wrote:
Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module?
You are literally what is wrong with empire dwellers. Have you ever piloted a freighter over more than 5-6 jumps? I did once. That was the first and last time, and I sold it shortly after. It was Hek to Jita iirc and it was the slowest space transit of my life. It's not bad enough that they take forever to align, but once you're in warp you stay there, literally. Sit back, twiddle your thumbs, read a book, because you're not getting there anytime soon, and when you do, you just end up hopping gate and repeating the whole process over again, for every system. gah..
Yes I have, you idiot. I ran a slew of runs between Jita and Chardalane when my alliance lived in Cloud Ring. I was too poor to afford a JF then, but had a Charon and a Rorqual. You may notice that Chardalane is a lowsec system. I always made sure to only carry a few billion in reactants and I used alts to scout the route and the lowsec drop system as well as to be present as emergency webs should anything nasty decloak or appear on d-scan when I was initiating warp from the lowsec gate to the station. I never lost a freighter.
If you don't want to lose your **** in EVE online, pay the f**k attention and take the appropriate precautions. Otherwise be prepared to deal with the consequences. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
388
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:08:00 -
[288] - Quote
That's sixteen jumps each way, btw, for people like you who are probably too lazy to look at a map. All that flying manually, then usually 1-5 hours of observing Chardalane before attempting a jump in. Sometimes it took more than a day. If things look too hairy, you wait. |
Mars Theran
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
275
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:10:00 -
[289] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:Mars Theran wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Mars Theran wrote:
Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module?
You are literally what is wrong with empire dwellers. Have you ever piloted a freighter over more than 5-6 jumps? I did once. That was the first and last time, and I sold it shortly after. It was Hek to Jita iirc and it was the slowest space transit of my life. It's not bad enough that they take forever to align, but once you're in warp you stay there, literally. Sit back, twiddle your thumbs, read a book, because you're not getting there anytime soon, and when you do, you just end up hopping gate and repeating the whole process over again, for every system. gah.. Yes I have, you idiot. I ran a slew of runs between Jita and Chardalane when my alliance lived in Cloud Ring. I was too poor to afford a JF then, but had a Charon and a Rorqual. You may notice that Chardalane is a lowsec system. I always made sure to only carry a few billion in reactants and I used alts to scout the route and the lowsec drop system as well as to be present as emergency webs should anything nasty decloak or appear on d-scan when I was initiating warp from the lowsec gate to the station. I never lost a freighter. If you don't want to lose your **** in EVE online, pay the f**k attention and take the appropriate precautions. Otherwise be prepared to deal with the consequences.
No need for the name calling. You make goons look bad, and you should feel bad.
P.S. Don't take it so personal and rage. I've never actually lost an Industrial or mining ship that I can recall. Battleships, BCs, Frigates, AFs, but no Indies. I have deleted and cleared my signature 7 times and it still won't go away. |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:14:00 -
[290] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Sabrina Solette wrote:pussnheels wrote:William Walker wrote:HERE is your solution: do not autpilot in highsec! Warp to zero. Got aggressed by someone? Jump/Dock. AMAZING that is part of the solution Problem is that a few freighter pilots were carrying way to much in value wise in their ships, it is not the game mechanic that is at fault it is the pilots and their corp that is for allowing this to happen , also pretty much sounds and looks like a inside job to me Ganking exhumers has been rebalanced , but there never was and there isn't a need to nerf the ganking of haulers and freighters in my opinion it takes much more team work to set up and has more risks involved than ganking exhumers ( still remember how i witnessed the ganking of a freighter in Niarja and the rage when a third party ran off with the loot that was hiilarious) my opinion and reading thru this thread that most people think the same way about this But would be better to make someone that keeps bumping a ship an aggressor. No it wouldn't, that would cause a host of other problems.
I know like undocking in a busy station, but it should not really happen anywhere else not multiple times anyway. So I'm sure something could be programmed. |
|
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:16:00 -
[291] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote: No need for the name calling. You make goons look bad, and you should feel bad.
Where Goons are concerned they can't look any worse than they're already. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
389
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:17:00 -
[292] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Mars Theran wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:Mars Theran wrote:
Maybe they autopilot them because there isn't anything else you could do with them. What are you going to do, cycle a module?
You are literally what is wrong with empire dwellers. Have you ever piloted a freighter over more than 5-6 jumps? I did once. That was the first and last time, and I sold it shortly after. It was Hek to Jita iirc and it was the slowest space transit of my life. It's not bad enough that they take forever to align, but once you're in warp you stay there, literally. Sit back, twiddle your thumbs, read a book, because you're not getting there anytime soon, and when you do, you just end up hopping gate and repeating the whole process over again, for every system. gah.. Yes I have, you idiot. I ran a slew of runs between Jita and Chardalane when my alliance lived in Cloud Ring. I was too poor to afford a JF then, but had a Charon and a Rorqual. You may notice that Chardalane is a lowsec system. I always made sure to only carry a few billion in reactants and I used alts to scout the route and the lowsec drop system as well as to be present as emergency webs should anything nasty decloak or appear on d-scan when I was initiating warp from the lowsec gate to the station. I never lost a freighter. If you don't want to lose your **** in EVE online, pay the f**k attention and take the appropriate precautions. Otherwise be prepared to deal with the consequences. No need for the name calling. You make goons look bad, and you should feel bad. P.S. Don't take it so personal and rage. I've never actually lost an Industrial or mining ship that I can recall. Battleships, BCs, Frigates, AFs, but no Indies.
You make humans look bad. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
389
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:19:00 -
[293] - Quote
hth |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1695
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:25:00 -
[294] - Quote
that was very helpful ganth, your hopes were not in vain |
TharOkha
0asis Group
31
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:53:00 -
[295] - Quote
Instead of nerfing ganking i propose to have 4 different freighters with specific roles.
Charon - largest cargohold, paperboat (aka status quo), medium align time Providence - Thick armor with resists, veeeeery hard to gank, veeery slow align time, medium cargo Fernir - Fastest of the four, smallest cargohold, very fast align time. paperboat Obelisk - medium cargo, medium tank... something in between
GÇ£If reality can destroy the dream, why shouldn't the dream destroy reality?GÇ¥ |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
389
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:57:00 -
[296] - Quote
Hahaha, yes, ships with 180k EHP are "paperboats."
If you want more EHP, you could always sacrifice some cargo space and fly a JF instead. They have over 320k EHP, align faster than regular freighters, and have jump drives for skirting around ganking hotzones to boot! |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 09:59:00 -
[297] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Instead of nerfing ganking i propose to have 4 different freighters with specific roles.
Charon - largest cargohold, paperboat (aka status quo), medium align time Providence - Thick armor with resists, veeeeery hard to gank, veeery slow align time, medium cargo Fernir - Fastest of the four, smallest cargohold, very fast align time. paperboat Obelisk - medium cargo, medium tank... something in between
No, they're race specific which means people would have to cross train to use the type they want. Unless you make them ORE ships of course but then they would have to redesign the looks of them. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4572
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 10:06:00 -
[298] - Quote
Sabrina Solette wrote:TharOkha wrote:Instead of nerfing ganking i propose to have 4 different freighters with specific roles.
Charon - largest cargohold, paperboat (aka status quo), medium align time Providence - Thick armor with resists, veeeeery hard to gank, veeery slow align time, medium cargo Fernir - Fastest of the four, smallest cargohold, very fast align time. paperboat Obelisk - medium cargo, medium tank... something in between
No, they're race specific which means people would have to cross train to use the type they want. Unless you make them ORE ships of course but then they would have to redesign the looks of them.
People already have to do this if they want a Blockade Runner with 2 highslots, for instance. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 10:11:00 -
[299] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Sabrina Solette wrote:TharOkha wrote:Instead of nerfing ganking i propose to have 4 different freighters with specific roles.
Charon - largest cargohold, paperboat (aka status quo), medium align time Providence - Thick armor with resists, veeeeery hard to gank, veeery slow align time, medium cargo Fernir - Fastest of the four, smallest cargohold, very fast align time. paperboat Obelisk - medium cargo, medium tank... something in between
No, they're race specific which means people would have to cross train to use the type they want. Unless you make them ORE ships of course but then they would have to redesign the looks of them. People already have to do this if they want a Blockade Runner with 2 highslots, for instance.
Yeah, but you could say that about any ship when comparing slots on race equivalent ships. But what TharOkha has based this on is the changes to the mining ships (ORE) which is not the same as just having an extra slot. |
Mohamad Transporte
Yulai Guard 1st Fleet Yulai Federation
17
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 10:28:00 -
[300] - Quote
nice to see all the rational and non-rational full of hate posts..
however, majority of post are not realizing the issue here... ganking can't be prevented by having an alt scout or not carrying too much (because this is what freighter supposed to do) and having escort for your frieghter is 90% not feasible practicle
Having an alt scout in high sec is not usefull... u can have ur ganking team sitting in a tactical and aligned to target gate with a cloacky warpin scout, that will give u a direct warp in and u keep bumping the freighter so that he can't align and warp (and also he can't crash gate as well due to his slow movement..)
so practically, freighter is a dump ship with no mean of defense
My suggestion: A- Freighter and jump freighter cant be bumped (that eliminate the cheap cost of blaster ganking ships, however, doesnt solve the alfa-nado kinda ganking)
B- Concorded ships receive 0 isk from insurance due to violation of inter-galactic Laws of high sec ;=)
this means ... ganking will remain possible, however, at high cost, and more isk on stake if nothing drops........ |
|
Ghazu
160
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 10:55:00 -
[301] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:nice to see all the rational and non-rational full of hate posts..
however, majority of post are not realizing the issue here... ganking can't be prevented by having an alt scout or not carrying too much (because this is what freighter supposed to do) and having escort for your frieghter is 90% not feasible practicle
Having an alt scout in high sec is not usefull... u can have ur ganking team sitting in a tactical and aligned to target gate with a cloacky warpin scout, that will give u a direct warp in and u keep bumping the freighter so that he can't align and warp (and also he can't crash gate as well due to his slow movement..)
so practically, freighter is a dump ship with no mean of defense
My suggestion: A- Freighter and jump freighter cant be bumped (that eliminate the cheap cost of blaster ganking ships, however, doesnt solve the alfa-nado kinda ganking)
B- Concorded ships receive 0 isk from insurance due to violation of inter-galactic Laws of high sec ;=)
this means ... ganking will remain possible, however, at high cost, and more isk on stake if nothing drops........
A- If titans can be bumped why can't freighters? Make it so you people are magically protected? You want protection and countermeasures? Use transport ships and orcas, because roles what are they for?
B- Already in effect genius. |
William Walker
House Aratus Fatal Ascension
61
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 11:21:00 -
[302] - Quote
But... what if the freighter pilot just logged off if he was getting bumped? I am not entirely sure but I think he just disappears. Unless of course he aggresses something... in his freighter. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
112
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 11:39:00 -
[303] - Quote
William Walker wrote:But... what if the freighter pilot just logged off if he was getting bumped? I am not entirely sure but I think he just disappears. Unless of course he aggresses something... in his freighter. ...finally... Disclaimer; Works not in Low Sec or 0.0. Requires to be NOT afk |
Michael1995
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 12:07:00 -
[304] - Quote
William Walker wrote:But... what if the freighter pilot just logged off if he was getting bumped? I am not entirely sure but I think he just disappears. Unless of course he aggresses something... in his freighter.
Unless they have already attempted to suicide gank him and failed, he can log off and he will e-warp away and then disappear after a minute, no way he can be aggressed if he isn't after he logs off. One does not simply buy their way into Goonswarm. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9447
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 13:31:00 -
[305] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Have you ever piloted a freighter over more than 5-6 jumps? Only on a 4-or-6-times-per-week:ly basisGǪ and guess what? It's a piece of cake to be at the keyboard for it. It most certainly isn't a reason to blame the game for your own unwillingness to be attentive and active in the process.
Mars Theran wrote:Sure, you can bring a big fleet to escort it, but how does that help against the gang of 30 Tornados come to one shot gank it, and the Neutral ship to scoop the loot?Sure, you could also be present and accounted for and warp to zero, but it doesn't stop somebody from bumping you off course when you are trying to align from a gate and preventing you warping. GǪhence the use of a webber, so your exposure to that bumpmaniac is, oh, much less than the time it takes for him to accelerate, travel the distance needed, and hit the ship.
Shooting the webber does one thing: it alerts the freighter pilot and calls CONCORD early, giving him a way out and you less time to do your dirty work. End result: one dead neutral that is no longer useful and must be biomassed (that's 10 hours gone), and maybe, with a bit of luck, one tiny frigate lost on the freighter side.
Oh, and what's this about saying that people don't quote in full when they quite in full? Are you not reading or are you just being dishonest? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4572
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 13:42:00 -
[306] - Quote
Mars Theran wrote:Sure, you can bring a big fleet to escort it, but how does that help against the gang of 30 Tornados come to one shot gank it, and the Neutral ship to scoop the loot?
Why shouldn't 31 guys working together, and sacrificing >3 billion ISK worth of ships whether or not the operation succeeds, be able to gank a freighter? Are you honestly trying to say that this is too low a bar to set? How many should it take? Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
172
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 13:47:00 -
[307] - Quote
Tippia wrote:End result: one dead neutral that is no longer useful and must be biomassed (that's 10 hours gone), and maybe, with a bit of luck, one tiny frigate lost on the freighter side.
And a ban...
Malcanis wrote:Mars Theran wrote:Sure, you can bring a big fleet to escort it, but how does that help against the gang of 30 Tornados come to one shot gank it, and the Neutral ship to scoop the loot? Why shouldn't 31 guys working together, and sacrificing >3 billion ISK worth of ships whether or not the operation succeeds, be able to gank a freighter? Are you honestly trying to say that this is too low a bar to set? How many should it take?
Of course they can do it, but it would be more fun if they shoot 700k EHP Damnation... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9447
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:01:00 -
[308] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:And a ban... Not really, or at least it's an edge-case, since it's a one-shot deal that doesn't incur enough of a sec status loss. But sure, come to think of it, they come of easy if they get the kill at an earlier attempt. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
30
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:18:00 -
[309] - Quote
Why should spaceships in a game about spaceships being blown up because of treachery, war, and crime be immune to being blown up?
Here's a point. It doesn't matter how much tank you give it. You put enough loot in it we'll find a way to blow it up http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14307479 because that's the point of this game. This game expressly bills itself as a gritty universe of crime where hard, grim folks team up to pull one over on each other.
Even so, you're not without recourse. I can think of five strategies off the top of my head that would ruin my day. All your theory crafting and hand waving aside, pulling concord early works, neutral reppers work, neutral blackbirds work, and webbing works. And what works most of all is making sure that you're not carrying something that costs more than 7-9 Tech 2 fitted Tier 3 battlecruisers.
If you do, and decide to do it on autopilot without friends near us, we will take it. Then, we'll use it to plex our accounts and buy more ships to do it to the next idiot. All while raising profits for every intelligent industrialists out there in one integrated, ecumenical, and holistic system of capitalistic symbiosis. This is as is should be, forever and ever, world without end. Amen. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2727
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:27:00 -
[310] - Quote
Ghazu wrote: tell us about mining in rookie systems
You're far to interested in me that it's becoming a little creepy. Don't be that guy.
|
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9448
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:38:00 -
[311] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote: If you do, and decide to do it on autopilot without friends near us, we will take it. Then, we'll use it to plex our accounts and buy more ships to do it to the next idiot. All while raising profits for every intelligent industrialists out there in one integrated, ecumenical, and holistic system of capitalistic symbiosis.
GǪand then people wonder why I'm in favour of more ganking. It's because I profit from their activitites, you dummies. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2734
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:41:00 -
[312] - Quote
Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
172
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:46:00 -
[313] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:And what works most of all is making sure that you're not carrying something that costs more than 7-9 Tech 2 fitted Tier 3 battlecruisers.
Except I could spend 1,5B to tank T2 battlecruiser and undock in Jita without any problems... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9448
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:48:00 -
[314] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank. How much cargo space are you willing to give up? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2736
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:49:00 -
[315] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank. How much cargo space are you willing to give up?
None. There is no need to reduce the cargo space to fit tank. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
1727
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:50:00 -
[316] - Quote
Just how do you defend a suicide gank target in high sec? |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
30
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:54:00 -
[317] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank.
Yes, but only if they nerf the existing tank so they can only be buffed up to current levels and achieve similar align times. Allowing them to forgo tank in favor of faster align, or both in favor of increased cargo hold. Because I'll tell you what we'll see, even slower fatter, weaker loot pinata's, and that's good for the economy and player interest.
We need more ships being blown up, more risk, and more pilots thinking they can make some quick isk if they take those risks. What makes this game fun, interesting, and ultimately worth playing is not bitter vets watching netflix as meaningless fortunes AFK from belt to station to Jita. That is a useless, stagnant world that reeks of decay and rot.
We need a group of friends excited to try their first act of piracy, uncertain whether they have the fit, and the numbers, and the time to pull it off. We need the industrialist sweating bullets, getting away in 3% structure, glowing with relief at his fortune secured and thanking his corp mate over comms.
This is the path forward, this is why we all joined after watching all those trailers, and hearing breathless accounts from our friends. This is the narrative we need to be working towards. Not more 'iskies' for my 'toonies' to fund officer fit ratting tengus we never fly. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2741
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:58:00 -
[318] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank. Yes, but only if they nerf the existing tank so they can only be buffed up to current levels and achieve similar align times. Allowing them to forgo tank in favor of faster align, or both in favor of increased cargo hold. Because I'll tell you what we'll see, even slower fatter, weaker loot pinata's, and that's good for the economy and player interest. We need more ships being blown up, more risk, and more pilots thinking they can make some quick isk if they take those risks. What makes this game fun, interesting, and ultimately worth playing is not bitter vets watching netflix as meaningless fortunes AFK from belt to station to Jita. That is a useless, stagnant world that reeks of decay and rot. We need a group of friends excited to try their first act of piracy, uncertain whether they have the fit, and the numbers, and the time to pull it off. We need the industrialist sweating bullets, getting away in 3% structure, glowing with relief at his fortune secured and thanking his corp mate over comms. This is the path forward, this is why we all joined after watching all those trailers, and hearing breathless accounts from our friends. This is the narrative we need to be working towards. Not more 'iskies' for my 'toonies' to fund officer fit ratting tengus we never fly.
For once, I agree with a Goon. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 14:59:00 -
[319] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:Just how do you defend a suicide gank target in high sec?
Tactics that work have already been mentioned; I'm not going to go into details of mechanics and numbers. We reap the rewards of our research, experience, and our risks; why should we give that up to you who has taken no risk and made no effort? Have you even looked at the kill mails and asked yourself, why these ships in this place with those numbers? If not you haven't even made a bare minimum attempt at playing the game. |
Ghazu
164
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:00:00 -
[320] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Tippia wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank. How much cargo space are you willing to give up? None. There is no need to reduce the cargo space to fit tank. Fit a tank at the cost of what? Painfully foregoing cargo expander IIs? |
|
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
81
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:01:00 -
[321] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:Just how do you defend a suicide gank target in high sec?
Hint: prevention. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
4572
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:02:00 -
[322] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Freighters deserve slots for fitting tank. Yes, but only if they nerf the existing tank so they can only be buffed up to current levels and achieve similar align times. Allowing them to forgo tank in favor of faster align, or both in favor of increased cargo hold. Because I'll tell you what we'll see, even slower fatter, weaker loot pinata's, and that's good for the economy and player interest. We need more ships being blown up, more risk, and more pilots thinking they can make some quick isk if they take those risks. What makes this game fun, interesting, and ultimately worth playing is not bitter vets watching netflix as meaningless fortunes AFK from belt to station to Jita. That is a useless, stagnant world that reeks of decay and rot. We need a group of friends excited to try their first act of piracy, uncertain whether they have the fit, and the numbers, and the time to pull it off. We need the industrialist sweating bullets, getting away in 3% structure, glowing with relief at his fortune secured and thanking his corp mate over comms. This is the path forward, this is why we all joined after watching all those trailers, and hearing breathless accounts from our friends. This is the narrative we need to be working towards. Not more 'iskies' for my 'toonies' to fund officer fit ratting tengus we never fly.
*Applause* Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9448
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:07:00 -
[323] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Tippia wrote:How much cargo space are you willing to give up? None. There is no need to reduce the cargo space to fit tank. Yes there is. If you give them lowslots GÇö the kind they need to tank in any meaningful way GÇö then people will not use those lowslots for tank and instead fill them with cargo expanders. Since one of the design limitations is that no freighter can be allowed to carry 1M m3 (so they can't bring caps into highsec), every lowslot they get will mean that their base cargo capacity must be reduced to counteract the possibility that some nutcase fits expanders in order to carry even more valuables in an even less sturdy ship.
End result: all freighters will now be much less capable to carry cargo, and getting them up to their old carrying capacity entails fitting modules that makes the ship weaker than before. All in all, the ship is worse than before. Balance is a female dog, isn't it?
So, again, how much cargo are you willing to give up, because you will have to if you want to gain the ability to make it stronger. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2751
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:11:00 -
[324] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Tippia wrote:How much cargo space are you willing to give up? None. There is no need to reduce the cargo space to fit tank. Yes there is. If you give them lowslots GÇö the kind they need to tank in any meaningful way GÇö then people will not use those lowslots for tank and instead fill them with cargo expanders. Since one of the design limitations is that no freighter can be allowed to carry 1M m3 (so they can't bring caps into highsec), every lowslot they get will mean that their base cargo capacity must be reduced to counteract the possibility that some nutcase fits expanders in order to carry even more valuables in an even less sturdy ship. So, again, how much cargo are you willing to give up, because you will have to if you want to gain the ability to make it stronger.
So simply don't allow cargo expanders to be able to be fit to freighters. Though they will make themselves even slower and more easy of a target so...that only hurts the ones who choose not to fit a tank. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9449
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:16:00 -
[325] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote: So simply don't allow cargo expanders to be able to be fit to freighters. Though they will make themselves even slower and more easy of a target so...that only hurts the ones who choose not to fit a tank.
GǪor, much simpler, just accept that the tank is inherent in the ship and that it doesn't particularly need any more. If you have to start changing things that aren't related to the problem you're trying to solve, chances are that the problem is more invented than real.
Freighters have a massive tank as it is. The solution is to make use of it and not strain it by trying to protect more than it can protect. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Ghazu
164
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:18:00 -
[326] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote: So simply don't allow cargo expanders to be able to be fit to freighters. Though they will make themselves even slower and more easy of a target so...that only hurts the ones who choose not to fit a tank.
GǪor, much simpler, just accept that the tank is inherent in the ship and that it doesn't particularly need any more. If you have to start changing things that aren't related to the problem you're trying to solve, chances are that the problem is more invented than real. Freighters have a massive tank as it is. The solution is to make use of it and not strain it by trying to protect more than it can protect. Theory crafting with dumb people is futile and not recommended. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1699
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:18:00 -
[327] - Quote
Yokai mines in rookie systems, there is no level of safety powerful enough for him |
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:25:00 -
[328] - Quote
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14561092
It took 6 Talos to gank a Freighter in highsec 0.5. That's less than half the cost of the Freighter. I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me. A ship with no fitting slots with a sole purpose of transporting goods should be able to tank at least it's own hulls worth of ganker isk.
Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence. Sometimes slight balance changes are needed people. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:26:00 -
[329] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system.
I'm sorry, I'm running high sec interdiction on enemy logistics in two nullsec wars, flying in regularly nullsec fleet ops, running a nullsec PI setup and a High Sec manufacturing operation, ganking hulks, helping destroy more than 620 billion in freighters, still getting into small gang PVP brawls regularly, while ratting to keep my sec status up, and all on three characters on one account that is less than a year old. Are you not entertained? |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2754
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:27:00 -
[330] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Tippia wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote: So simply don't allow cargo expanders to be able to be fit to freighters. Though they will make themselves even slower and more easy of a target so...that only hurts the ones who choose not to fit a tank.
GǪor, much simpler, just accept that the tank is inherent in the ship and that it doesn't particularly need any more. If you have to start changing things that aren't related to the problem you're trying to solve, chances are that the problem is more invented than real. Freighters have a massive tank as it is. The solution is to make use of it and not strain it by trying to protect more than it can protect. Theory crafting with dumb people is futile and not recommended.
:) Name calling, how cute and mature of you. |
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2754
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:29:00 -
[331] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Yokai mines in rookie systems, there is no level of safety powerful enough for him
I rarely undock, I hang out in rookie systems to help rookies by giving away isk/ships. Perhaps you should get your information correct instead of just going by what that one obsessed goon says. :) |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2754
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:30:00 -
[332] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote: So simply don't allow cargo expanders to be able to be fit to freighters. Though they will make themselves even slower and more easy of a target so...that only hurts the ones who choose not to fit a tank.
GǪor, much simpler, just accept that the tank is inherent in the ship and that it doesn't particularly need any more. If you have to start changing things that aren't related to the problem you're trying to solve, chances are that the problem is more invented than real. Freighters have a massive tank as it is. The solution is to make use of it and not strain it by trying to protect more than it can protect.
You're right. :) |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:30:00 -
[333] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system.
I'm sorry, I'm running high sec interdiction on enemy logistics in two nullsec wars, flying in regularly nullsec fleet ops, running a nullsec PI setup and a High Sec manufacturing operation, ganking hulks, helping destroy more than 620 billion in freighters, still getting into small gang PVP brawls regularly, while ratting to keep my sec status up, and all on three characters on one account that is less than a year old. Are you not entertained?
Thats it, now I not only feel like a noob but a slacking one too. |
Ghazu
164
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:35:00 -
[334] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Yokai mines in rookie systems, there is no level of safety powerful enough for him I rarely undock, I hang out in rookie systems to help rookies by giving away isk/ships. Perhaps you should get your information correct instead of just going by what that one obsessed goon says. :) You do mine there. Leave. Also putting forth your opinions anecdotal analogies and emotes without any coherent arguments is well, dumb. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:35:00 -
[335] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote: Thats it, now I not only feel like a noob but a slacking one too.
Honestly, I wouldn't be able to do it without the infrastructure, support, and knowledge of my alliance mates in the CFC. Say what you will about us goons, but we treat our newbies very well and are very good at showing them the ropes. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:41:00 -
[336] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14561092
It took 6 Talos to gank a Freighter in highsec 0.5. That's less than half the cost of the Freighter. I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me. A ship with no fitting slots with a sole purpose of transporting goods should be able to tank at least it's own hulls worth of ganker isk.
Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence. Sometimes slight balance changes are needed people.
While I feel freighters should be a bit more flexible to create strategy and uncertainty, yes you are the only one seeing something wrong there. The freighter pilot had several options at their disposal to avoid that situation, and in fact several of his compatriots made it safely to their destination. Undoubtedly they appreciated the increased profits created by the demand he could not fill.
Also you're underestimating the cost of the fully fit Talos which would have had to be T2 with good skills to be successful with those numbers. |
Ghazu
164
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:42:00 -
[337] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote:this is why we all joined after watching all those trailers Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system. I've been trying but can't seem to scan any that's blinged out enough to worth the :effort: |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2757
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:43:00 -
[338] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Yokai mines in rookie systems, there is no level of safety powerful enough for him I rarely undock, I hang out in rookie systems to help rookies by giving away isk/ships. Perhaps you should get your information correct instead of just going by what that one obsessed goon says. :) You do mine there. Leave. Also putting forth your opinions anecdotal analogies and emotes without any coherent arguments is well, dumb.
Come to the system and see how often I mine... getting tired of listening to how wrong your information is. I expected more from you...but you've let me down :( Your obsession with me is flattering though :) |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:44:00 -
[339] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote: Thats it, now I not only feel like a noob but a slacking one too.
Honestly, I wouldn't be able to do it without the infrastructure, support, and knowledge of my alliance mates in the CFC. Say what you will about us goons, but we treat our newbies very well and are very good at showing them the ropes.
Your reps seems to be blowns out of proportion yes. At least accourding the the very few discussion I had with people from your side of the fence. Human ressources division are even helpfull to outsiders. A damn shame you are all put into a basked of terrible person.
On topic : How often does it need to be repeated? If you carry over a certain treshold of value, you become a good target. The cargo hold of freighter is big because some stuff are bulky. It does not mean anything you can fit inside of it is supposed to be secure in high sec. Should I go around hauling 12k m3 worth of T2 BPO because they fit in my **** fit badger 2? It fit and I am in high sec right? |
Ghazu
164
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:55:00 -
[340] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Yokai mines in rookie systems, there is no level of safety powerful enough for him I rarely undock, I hang out in rookie systems to help rookies by giving away isk/ships. Perhaps you should get your information correct instead of just going by what that one obsessed goon says. :) You do mine there. Leave. Also putting forth your opinions anecdotal analogies and emotes without any coherent arguments is well, dumb. Come to the system and see how often I mine... getting tired of listening to how wrong your information is. I expected more from you...but you've let me down :( Your obsession with me is flattering though :) Yeah, your posting is that bad, but fascinating. Stay out of the rookie systems do you understand? |
|
Agent Akari
Hobo Industries Inc
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 15:58:00 -
[341] - Quote
You guys have failed the escort mission, the freighter pilot failed the courier mission and the offensive team succeeded the mission.
Try the mission again but this time get more intel and use a good escort/scout team. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2759
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 16:10:00 -
[342] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:Yokai mines in rookie systems, there is no level of safety powerful enough for him I rarely undock, I hang out in rookie systems to help rookies by giving away isk/ships. Perhaps you should get your information correct instead of just going by what that one obsessed goon says. :) You do mine there. Leave. Also putting forth your opinions anecdotal analogies and emotes without any coherent arguments is well, dumb. Come to the system and see how often I mine... getting tired of listening to how wrong your information is. I expected more from you...but you've let me down :( Your obsession with me is flattering though :) Stay out of the rookie systems do you understand?
lol :) |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 16:32:00 -
[343] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:I've been trying but can't seem to scan any that's blinged out enough to worth the :effort:
It's worth it. Especially if you buy those Nados from me. |
baltec1
Bat Country
2109
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 17:26:00 -
[344] - Quote
The levels of self entitalment by the superbears in this thread is horrible, especially given how easy it is to avoid being blown up. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 17:30:00 -
[345] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:especially given how easy it is to avoid being blown up.
Ever tried to warp away in a freighter that's been webbed and scrambled? |
baltec1
Bat Country
2109
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 17:34:00 -
[346] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Ever tried to warp away in a freighter that's been webbed and scrambled?
Nope. But then again my frieghter never carriers enough to be worth ganking |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 17:46:00 -
[347] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:baltec1 wrote:especially given how easy it is to avoid being blown up. Ever tried to warp away in a freighter that's been webbed and scrambled? You don't really need thatt as was proved already in the OP gank report. The freighter was bumped away from the gate and them more time so it would never be able to finish aligning to any warpable location. You are just not running away at the speed a freighter can go by slowboating faster than the cruiser so a web is not really usefull. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 17:48:00 -
[348] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:baltec1 wrote:especially given how easy it is to avoid being blown up. Ever tried to warp away in a freighter that's been webbed and scrambled?
Pirates almost never scram a freighter as all that does is summon CONCORD early. Without scrams, webs make you align and enter warp faster so they're actually a benefit, and a quite common defensive tactic. You really don't know what you're talking about do you? |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4665
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 18:18:00 -
[349] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote:this is why we all joined after watching all those trailers Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system.
Alright, go to Amarr and undock a fully tanked Damnation with 30 PLEX in the hold and see how long you last. please leave |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 18:23:00 -
[350] - Quote
Andski wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote:this is why we all joined after watching all those trailers Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system. Alright, go to Amarr and undock a fully tanked Damnation with 30 PLEX in the hold and see how long you last.
Isn't that only 15 bill in cargo? The freighter had 21 no? |
|
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 18:44:00 -
[351] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote: Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system.
Does a Sleipnir in a 0.9 count? Cause we got that ******* twice in as many days. http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13909488 http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=13932803
(yes I know we didn't alpha him, and had the luxury of a war dec. I just like those mails cause he was dumb.) |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 19:32:00 -
[352] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Does a Sleipnir in a 0.9 count? Cause we got that ******* twice in as many days.
PvE fit and not enough EHP. |
Shizuken
Venerated Stars
90
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 19:40:00 -
[353] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
This rage is meaningless with also citing the costs of the gank. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
664
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 19:48:00 -
[354] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14561092
It took 6 Talos to gank a Freighter in highsec 0.5. That's less than half the cost of the Freighter. I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me. A ship with no fitting slots with a sole purpose of transporting goods should be able to tank at least it's own hulls worth of ganker isk.
Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence. Sometimes slight balance changes are needed people. Oh hey look, someone else who bases their argument on "cost should = tank".
Please note how if I mission in highsec with a Tengu fitted for fighting against Guristas and I maximize my DPS by fitting BCS with no damage control, I have literally 0% EM and 50% explosive resist. This comes out to about 13k EHP vs. EMP ammo.
4 gank fit thrashers could easy take this down. We're talking about a setup here that's less than a twentieth the cost of the ship. This isn't a rare exception either, there are indeed Tengus doing this, as well as other expensive ships flying about with resist holes doing missions. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1708
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 20:30:00 -
[355] - Quote
ccp why can't I fit plex to my ship slots? |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
35
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 20:41:00 -
[356] - Quote
The final rub of it all is that the adversity other players supply gives your accomplishments meaning, and your fortune value. Without the infuriating, the evolving, and the unpredictable nature of non-consensual PVP then PVE is reduced to a well decorated Skinner box of route behaviors in which you are forced to push buttons for virtual food pellets. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9452
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 20:56:00 -
[357] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14561092
It took 6 Talos to gank a Freighter in highsec 0.5. That's less than half the cost of the Freighter. In other worss, it's working very nicely.
Quote: I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me. Indeed. It really shouldn't be that expensive. After all, my 7bn JF only requires 1.5bn or so worth of ships GÇö that's a 5:1 ratio, which is much more reasonable, if still a bit on the low side.
Quote: Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence.. The evidence points toweards the pilot being stupid. This problem is not a matter of balance. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Buck Futz
Suddenly Violence Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
76
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 20:57:00 -
[358] - Quote
I'm still trying to figure out why Jorma is so obsessed with gankers wasting their ISK ganking Combat ships with ridiculous buffers. Is he saying, "Gank that, and then I'll be impressed?" Why, because that is 'fair'? You really aren't making any sense at all.
I mean, if we want to speculate on pointless activities, why not just figure out how many Tornados it takes to bring down the Veldnaught. At least that would be worthy of a mention on themittani.com, the hottest source for current EVE news and information.
|
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
37
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 21:17:00 -
[359] - Quote
Buck Futz wrote:I mean, if we want to speculate on pointless activities, why not just figure out how many Tornados it takes to bring down the Veldnaught. At least that would be worthy of a mention on themittani.com, the hottest source for current EVE news and information.
Chribba is such a nice guy that even we didn't gank him when he flew through one of our instalocking gate camp on the amar-agil pipe.
I see you guys aren't as sentimental http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=9116014 |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1708
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 21:21:00 -
[360] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:The final rub of it all is that the adversity other players supply gives your accomplishments meaning, and your fortune value. Without the infuriating, the evolving, and the unpredictable nature of non-consensual PVP then PVE is reduced to a well decorated Skinner box of rote behaviors in which you are forced to push buttons for virtual food pellets. exactly
solo pilot your freighter across a highsec region and see handfuls of neutrals as you pass by - boring, ccp make flying a freighter actually fun >:'(
solo pilot your freighter across null or lowsec and see handfuls of neutrals as you pass by - you'll be telling other gamers the story long after eve shuts down. |
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2841
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 21:45:00 -
[361] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Buck Futz wrote:I mean, if we want to speculate on pointless activities, why not just figure out how many Tornados it takes to bring down the Veldnaught. At least that would be worthy of a mention on themittani.com, the hottest source for current EVE news and information. Chribba is such a nice guy that even we didn't gank him when he flew through one of our instalocking gate camp on the amar-agil pipe. I see you guys aren't as sentimental http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=9116014
What a bunch of sissies. |
Tiger Would
EoE-Group
2238
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 21:47:00 -
[362] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
How mos unfohtunate. Canna I intwest you in a few new fweighters foh special pwice?
Once you think you have it all, you-áhave actually become-áignorant towards everything else.
T. Would |
Oxandrolone
Bite Me inc Elysian Empire
47
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 22:22:00 -
[363] - Quote
how about not making it viable for them to gank your freighter by moving less valuble stuff at once?
stop expecting game mechanics to change because your lazy |
Hiyora Akachi
Bling Ring Tax Evaders
131
|
Posted - 2012.09.11 23:32:00 -
[364] - Quote
So......what people have been doing since they realized that freighter pilots existed will suddenly kill the game?
Wat. |
Horatioh Kane
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 00:13:00 -
[365] - Quote
Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:ccp why can't I fit plex to my ship slots?
This would be far too OP. |
Buck Futz
Suddenly Violence Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
76
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 00:20:00 -
[366] - Quote
So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and.... ....start blapping more freighters. So now freighter pilots are crying.
Next move, CCP?
I'd be down for helping out with any and all freighter ganks once the fall construction season wraps up, but if the recent patches are any indication we'll be seeing 1 Million EHP freighters before the snow flies.
|
Buck Futz
Suddenly Violence Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
76
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 00:49:00 -
[367] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Buck Futz wrote:I mean, if we want to speculate on pointless activities, why not just figure out how many Tornados it takes to bring down the Veldnaught. At least that would be worthy of a mention on themittani.com, the hottest source for current EVE news and information. Chribba is such a nice guy that even we didn't gank him when he flew through one of our instalocking gate camp on the amar-agil pipe. I see you guys aren't as sentimental http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=9116014
Can't follow the link from here, but assuming it refers to the event I remember, it was an epic day. |
ugh zug
52
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 00:49:00 -
[368] - Quote
do i hear the mournful wailing of a freighter pilot? Want me to shut up?-á Send me ISK and i'll stop giving suggestions to CCP that make sense. Remove content from my post, 15 bil. Remove my content from a thread I have started 30bil. |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1866
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 01:54:00 -
[369] - Quote
Buck Futz wrote:Samahiel Sotken wrote:Buck Futz wrote:I mean, if we want to speculate on pointless activities, why not just figure out how many Tornados it takes to bring down the Veldnaught. At least that would be worthy of a mention on themittani.com, the hottest source for current EVE news and information. Chribba is such a nice guy that even we didn't gank him when he flew through one of our instalocking gate camp on the amar-agil pipe. I see you guys aren't as sentimental http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=9116014 Can't follow the link from here, but assuming it refers to the event I remember, it was an epic day. Oh my god they killed Chribba, you bastards! "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 03:06:00 -
[370] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:unloadedx16 wrote:http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14561092
It took 6 Talos to gank a Freighter in highsec 0.5. That's less than half the cost of the Freighter. I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me. A ship with no fitting slots with a sole purpose of transporting goods should be able to tank at least it's own hulls worth of ganker isk.
Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence. Sometimes slight balance changes are needed people. While I feel freighters should be a bit more flexible to create strategy and uncertainty, yes you are the only one seeing something wrong there. The freighter pilot had several options at their disposal to avoid that situation, and in fact several of his compatriots made it safely to their destination. Undoubtedly they appreciated the increased profits created by the demand he could not fill. Also you're underestimating the cost of the fully fit Talos which would have had to be T2 with good skills to be successful with those numbers.
If a group of competent pilots want to gank a freighter and they play it right, well... there gonna gank a freighter and their is not a dam thing a big slow turning flying pinata can do about it. And a fully fit T2 Talos costs about 150mill isk. 6 of them add up too about 900mill wich is close to half the cost of a freighter. |
|
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1472
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 03:06:00 -
[371] - Quote
Paul Oliver wrote:Buck Futz wrote:Can't follow the link from here, but assuming it refers to the event I remember, it was an epic day. Oh my god they killed Chribba, you bastards! He lost it with a covert ops cloaking device? I guess he wasn't expecting to be ganked. Since it was in a 0.5, makes sense... Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1714
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 03:07:00 -
[372] - Quote
Veld... doesn't shoot back |
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 03:22:00 -
[373] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:unloadedx16 wrote:http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14561092
It took 6 Talos to gank a Freighter in highsec 0.5. That's less than half the cost of the Freighter. I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me. A ship with no fitting slots with a sole purpose of transporting goods should be able to tank at least it's own hulls worth of ganker isk.
Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence. Sometimes slight balance changes are needed people. Oh hey look, someone else who bases their argument on "cost should = tank". Please note how if I mission in highsec with a Tengu fitted for fighting against Guristas and I maximize my DPS by fitting BCS with no damage control, I have literally 0% EM and 50% explosive resist. This comes out to about 13k EHP vs. EMP ammo. 4 gank fit thrashers could easy take this down. We're talking about a setup here that's less than a twentieth the cost of the ship. This isn't a rare exception either, there are indeed Tengus doing this, as well as other expensive ships flying about with resist holes doing missions.
1) You can tank a tengu just fine without a damage control. 2) In a tengu you actually have the option to CHOOSE if you want to be tanky or ganky.
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Oh hey look, someone else who bases their argument on "cost should = tank".
3) And yes that is exactly what I'm saying. For a big slow ship with no fitting slots and little means of defending itself, cost most definitely should equal cost. |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2895
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 03:34:00 -
[374] - Quote
Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and....
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :)
|
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 03:59:00 -
[375] - Quote
Tippia wrote:In other words, it's working very nicely.
And in other words it's not??
Tippia wrote:unloadedx16 wrote: I mean I'm all for ganks and stuff guys but even in 0.5 that seems a bit unreasonable to me.
Indeed. It really shouldn't be that expensive. After all, my 7bn JF only requires 1.5bn or so worth of ships GÇö that's a 5:1 ratio, which is much more reasonable, if still a bit on the low side.
I feel like 1.8bill (cost of talos'x2 for loot drop) should be chump change for a freighter, a ship with one sole purpose, to haul stuff around . Also JF are a different story and are much less risky to use than their T1 counterparts if you have any idea what your doing. If anything JF should be easier to gank. |
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 04:00:00 -
[376] - Quote
Tippia wrote:unloadedx16 wrote: Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? Why does this community always rushes to such fast conclusions on things without even taking the time to look at the evidence..
The evidence points towards the pilot being stupid. This problem is not a matter of balance.
I agree with you, yes the pilot did not make a very good decision for hauling so much isk worth that it would be potentially profitable to gank him (if the loot drop gods are on your side). What I'm arguing is that it should take more than 900mill to gank him in the first place. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 05:23:00 -
[377] - Quote
Oxandrolone wrote:how about not making it viable for them to gank your freighter by moving less valuble stuff at once?
Then they say I'm risk-averse carebear. Even if I use two A-Type EANM as part of the tank... |
Buck Futz
Suddenly Violence Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
84
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 05:41:00 -
[378] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and....
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :)
What, did you think that gankers are going to stop ganking, simply because solo ganking miners is now impossible? Sorry, thats not happening. They simply find the path of least resistance.
Convincing CCP that they screwed up is hard. Killing freighters is relatively easy. Too bad for the freighter pilots. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1473
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 05:46:00 -
[379] - Quote
Buck Futz wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and.... LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :) What, did you think that gankers are going to stop ganking, simply because solo ganking miners is now impossible? Sorry, thats not happening. They simply find the path of least resistance. Convincing CCP that they screwed up is hard. Killing freighters is relatively easy. Too bad for the freighter pilots. Guess CCP will have to "intervene". Good job with the freighter kills, guys. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
baltec1
Bat Country
2113
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 09:20:00 -
[380] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :)
You seem to be mistaking valid balance issues with one barge doing the job of the 5 others as whining again. |
|
baltec1
Bat Country
2113
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 09:23:00 -
[381] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:
I agree with you, yes the pilot did not make a very good decision for hauling so much isk worth that it would be potentially profitable to gank him (if the loot drop gods are on your side). What I'm arguing is that it should take more than 900mill to gank him in the first place.
So 6 15 mil frigates should never kill a 2 bil battleship? |
Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
723
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 11:15:00 -
[382] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Tippia wrote:Malcanis wrote:But really, the first suggestion is the important one. All the rest are for if you don't follow it. Seriously: put the high value stuff into a fully expanded and rigged BR. GǪor the corp hangar of an Orca. More EHP, quicker movement (compared to a freighter/JF), unscannable, and zero reason to gank it since it won't drop any loot. I keep forgetting the Orca!
In this specific case (Orca) the "Pro" gankers choosing to do it knowing nothing will drop from Corp Hangar and Ship Bay only means one thing: assets/profit denial Every one learns very fast alts, like alt corps, are an absolute risk free for major alliances. Hopefully smart people manage to always gather enough intell so this kind of gank is specifically targeted. Since training some Freighter or Jump freighter pilots it's not something you can do in a week or two it's just a matter of some intell and brains to know exactly who does what and for who then take the appropriate measures.
If I ever know some guy movers T2 BPO's+tech+faction DED space stuff in his Orca thinking "hahaha I'm gank proof" then he's incredibly stupid on top of idiot. Assets denial it's a valid tactic and mechanic, not making any profit of said gank it's also a valid consequence since in the end all it matters in the end is the isk denial, not the number of ships involved.
But this you already know it, was just explaining "Pro gank" for dummies brb |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9468
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 11:25:00 -
[383] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:3) And yes that is exactly what I'm saying. For a big slow ship with no fitting slots and little means of defending itself, cost most definitely should equal cost. No, it really shouldn't, regardless of the ship.
Quote:And in other words it's not?? Don't be silly. Of course it is. Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended. If anything. 2:1 is far too low a ratio and you should be able to get the kill with far less than that, and the JF's 5:1 ratio is much more appropriate. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2927
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 11:51:00 -
[384] - Quote
Buck Futz wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and....
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :) What, did you think that gankers are going to stop ganking, simply because solo ganking miners is now impossible? Sorry, thats not happening. They simply find the path of least resistance. Convincing CCP that they screwed up is hard. Killing freighters is relatively easy. Too bad for the freighter pilots.
No, I don't expect gankers to stop ganking nor would I want them to. It's just your reply in comparison to how a lot of you gankers reacted to the mining changes... you didn't adapt, you just whined...lol. |
Ghazu
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:08:00 -
[385] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and....
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :) What, did you think that gankers are going to stop ganking, simply because solo ganking miners is now impossible? Sorry, thats not happening. They simply find the path of least resistance. Convincing CCP that they screwed up is hard. Killing freighters is relatively easy. Too bad for the freighter pilots. No, I don't expect gankers to stop ganking nor would I want them to. It's just your reply in comparison to how a lot of you gankers reacted to the mining changes... you didn't adapt, you just whined...lol. And here we are again with another whine thread. |
Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
723
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:08:00 -
[386] - Quote
Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and....
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :) What, did you think that gankers are going to stop ganking, simply because solo ganking miners is now impossible? Sorry, thats not happening. They simply find the path of least resistance. Convincing CCP that they screwed up is hard. Killing freighters is relatively easy. Too bad for the freighter pilots. No, I don't expect gankers to stop ganking nor would I want them to. It's just your reply in comparison to how a lot of you gankers reacted to the mining changes... you didn't adapt, you just whined...lol.
No, your mistake is that you are putting everyone in the same barge than brainless pawns. Those whining moaning FPS fan boys are only and will always be the brainless idiots thinking kill mining barges with a T1 destroyer is balanced, perma camping low sec gates is normal, bring lvl4's to low sec, etcetera etcetera etcetera. Good gankers don't give and never gave that much importance to mining barge kills when you have permanently and literally thousands of billions worth of stuff being haul in T1 untaked ships, afk freighters, frigates with billions of implants/BPO's/Plex.
30min spent to prepare an exhumer gank (alt scouting/scan etc) it's more then I need to hit F1 and insta alpha the frigate with billions of stuff in his cargo. This is why in my opinion killing mining barges was and will always be pure grieffing and idiots/pawns/special/disturbed dudes business since thinking by their own it's not really their strong point, nothing else. brb |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2929
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:17:00 -
[387] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:Yokai Mitsuhide wrote:Buck Futz wrote:So, let me get this straight. Miners were getting ganked, so they cried. CCP gave them a one-size-fits all Exhumer that is unprofitable to gank.
So gankers do what they always do, adapt (yet again), organize and....
LOL!!!!! AHHHHHHHHH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good one man..."gankers adapt" Perhaps you've forgotten the Barge fairy tale thread already where you guys have done nothing but whine and cry for hundreds of pages, I am sure it just slipped your mind. Thank you though for the laugh :) What, did you think that gankers are going to stop ganking, simply because solo ganking miners is now impossible? Sorry, thats not happening. They simply find the path of least resistance. Convincing CCP that they screwed up is hard. Killing freighters is relatively easy. Too bad for the freighter pilots. No, I don't expect gankers to stop ganking nor would I want them to. It's just your reply in comparison to how a lot of you gankers reacted to the mining changes... you didn't adapt, you just whined...lol. And here we are again with another whine thread.
So stop whining? |
Ghazu
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:19:00 -
[388] - Quote
uh read the op again? |
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2929
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:20:00 -
[389] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:uh read the op again?
Nah. |
Ghazu
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:22:00 -
[390] - Quote
please? |
|
Yokai Mitsuhide
Exiled Mining
2929
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 12:24:00 -
[391] - Quote
Ok, but only because you asked politely :) |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 13:45:00 -
[392] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended.
Why I can't find killmail you destroying 2B isk Damnation in 1.0 system?
By your logic, it should be easy kill with 60M isk Tornado. |
Ghazu
178
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 14:47:00 -
[393] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended. Why I can't find killmail you destroying 2B isk Damnation in 1.0 system? By your logic, it should be easy kill with 60M isk Tornado. Fill the cargo to the brim with 215 plexes and we'll give that dice a roll. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 14:57:00 -
[394] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended. Why I can't find killmail you destroying 2B isk Damnation in 1.0 system? By your logic, it should be easy kill with 60M isk Tornado. Fill the cargo to the brim with 215 plexes and we'll give that dice a roll.
How about cargo rigs and expanders for extra plex capacity? It's 1.0 security so it's safe right? Even on auto pilot. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:03:00 -
[395] - Quote
Ghazu wrote:Fill the cargo to the brim with 215 plexes and we'll give that dice a roll.
Do you even know how expensive A-Type EANMs are? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9476
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:06:00 -
[396] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended. Why I can't find killmail you destroying 2B isk Damnation in 1.0 system? Because I'm not a ganker.
Quote:By your logic, it should be easy kill with 60M isk Tornado. Guess what? It is. Fortunately, it seems Damnation pilots aren't quite as stupid as haulers.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:23:00 -
[397] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Because I'm not a ganker.
Are you saying that Drop Shock isn't your alt?
Tippia wrote:Guess what? It is.
Unless you are using exploits you have still 600k+ EHP to go after your Tornado explodes... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9476
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:30:00 -
[398] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Are you saying that Drop Shock isn't your alt? Who?
Quote:Unless you are using exploits you have still 600k+ EHP to go after your Tornado explodes... GǪwhy would you go after a 600k+ EHP one? You go for the ones with <40k EHP and still carrying that kind of cargo. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:34:00 -
[399] - Quote
Tippia wrote:GǪwhy would you go after a 600k+ EHP one?
You said something about the EHP not being a balancing factor. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9477
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:36:00 -
[400] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:You said something about the EHP not being a balancing factor. No.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
|
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
154
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:42:00 -
[401] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp... OK, Someone does not get the concept of EVE.
I have not even read the other responses yet, but I am sure most will say much the same thing.
That is an average drop of over 5 bil per freighter. Since drops rarely exceed 50% of total cargo value that means these 4 freighter probably averaged over 10 bil cargo each.
That is a very juicy gank target.
If GOONS didn't gank them someone else would have. hell I would have tried to gank that, and I am not a ganker.
Rule of thumb is don't haul more than 1 bil worth of cargo at a time in a freighter. Although you can push that to about 2 bil without to much risk, 10 bil is just asking to get ganked.
As far as I am concerned this is working as intended. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:42:00 -
[402] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:You said something about the EHP not being a balancing factor. No.
Last time I checked I would get higher EHP with more expensive stuff like A-Type EANMs and T2 1600mm plates than meta 0 EANMs and meta 0 50mm plates. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9477
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:51:00 -
[403] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Last time I checked I would get higher EHP with more expensive stuff like A-Type EANMs and T2 1600mm plates than meta 0 EANMs and meta 0 50mm plates. GǪand the cost is not a balancing factor.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:54:00 -
[404] - Quote
Tippia wrote:GǪand the cost is not a balancing factor.
Then why not go and suicide gank a 600k EHP Damnation? |
Agent Akari
Hobo Industries Inc
32
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 15:57:00 -
[405] - Quote
Why is nobody mentioning a remote armor repair fleet?
It doesn't work? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9477
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:01:00 -
[406] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Then why not go and suicide gank a 600k EHP Damnation? Because it's not carrying anything that's worth, oh, 20bn ISK or soGǪ and thus not a worth-while target.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:02:00 -
[407] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Because it's not carrying anything that's worth, oh, 20bn ISK or soGǪ and thus not a worth-while target.
So cost is a factor after all... |
baltec1
Bat Country
2117
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:06:00 -
[408] - Quote
Agent Akari wrote:Why is nobody mentioning a remote armor repair fleet?
It doesn't work?
we found one these. Unfortunatly for the frieghter, having an entire armour HAC gang with logi support in your cargo hold isn't as effective as having pilots flying them |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9477
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:08:00 -
[409] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:So cost is a factor after all... Not in balance, no.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
baltec1
Bat Country
2117
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:08:00 -
[410] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:Because it's not carrying anything that's worth, oh, 20bn ISK or soGǪ and thus not a worth-while target. So cost is a factor after all...
Which is what makes it so funny seeing all the rage when they have the answer right in front of them. Don't stuff 20 bil in the hold! |
|
Ginger Barbarella
State War Academy Caldari State
99
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:09:00 -
[411] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
Allow JF's to use their jump dirves in high sec!!
YAY!!!!
Wait, wut?
Ask yourself what those freighter pilots could have done differently (ie, routes, change in business model, selling elsewhere, etc) rather than hauling 21.5 billion ISK in goods thru what, most likely, is highly volatile throttle points in high sec. I just about guarantee you they COULD HAVE done something differently that wouldn't have killed their freighters. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:16:00 -
[412] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Which is what makes it so funny seeing all the rage when they have the answer right in front of them. Don't stuff 20 bil in the hold!
I'm not raging because someone lost 500x PLEX because. I'm a bit sad that I've yet to find killmail of Damnation gank in 1.0 system. |
baltec1
Bat Country
2117
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:18:00 -
[413] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:baltec1 wrote:Which is what makes it so funny seeing all the rage when they have the answer right in front of them. Don't stuff 20 bil in the hold! I'm not raging because someone lost 500x PLEX because. I'm a bit sad that I've yet to find killmail of Damnation gank in 1.0 system.
When someone makes it worthwhile it will be done. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9477
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:19:00 -
[414] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:I'm a bit sad that I've yet to find killmail of Damnation gank in 1.0 system. Why is that? It seems rather encouraging that some people have the sense to not turn their ships into obvious loot pi+¦atas. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:20:00 -
[415] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:When someone makes it worthwhile it will be done.
Are you saying that 1,8B in A-Types isn't enough? |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:22:00 -
[416] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:Because it's not carrying anything that's worth, oh, 20bn ISK or soGǪ and thus not a worth-while target. So cost is a factor after all... If you don't want to take a risk then why not use something like a noobship?
The cost of the ship is not a balancing factor. It's a factor to choose which target you attack or not. That choice is based on the isk value of what can drop opposed to the ship cost of the attacker. If you were to haul 21 bill worth of cargo in a single ship, you would need something close to 11 bill worth of tornado alpha in EHP to not be a juicy target.
I wonder how many pilot is required to have 11 bill worth of tornado ready to alpha a ship...
EDIT : This si assuming the damnation has close to that much tank. Anything below will make it easyer for it to be a juicy target. Whats the EHP of that 2 bill damnation? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9477
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:22:00 -
[417] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Are you saying that 1,8B in A-Types isn't enough? Depends on what ships (and how many) are needed to kill it.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:27:00 -
[418] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Depends on what ships (and how many) are needed to kill it.
[Damnation, loot pi+¦ata]
1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II Centum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Centum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Energized Thermic Membrane II
[Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot]
Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defense II [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot]
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Slave Alpha Slave Beta Slave Gamma Slave Delta Slave Epsilon Slave Omega
Of course in fleet so it would benefit from small fleet boost.
Frostys Virpio wrote:Whats the EHP of that 2 bill damnation?
~625k vs RF EMP |
NL Nataku
Manson Family Corcoran State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:28:00 -
[419] - Quote
Well ganking a freighter in hi sec has been made ridiculously easy and i don't blame anyone from doing it.
Not just being able to see people go ape **** about losing them, the payoff from doing it can be a quick easy buck. However i do agree there is not a whole lot a freighter pilot can do about it. Sure reduce the amount of value in the cargo will help but in certain cases that would defeat the purpose of doing it in a freighter since you have it to move large stuff around. (those trying to transport stuff like BPO's and other valuable items that have no weight are just asking for it.)
Now i see some people mentioning to set out with a support fleet, but i don't think that would work very well in hi sec seeing as you have to wait for the gankers to agres. At which the support fleet might be to late to take care of them or in the case of logistic ships not have enough time to rep up as long as they have enough alpha.
Now i don't want to see freighters get buffed or something else getting nerfed either, however i do believe that in some manner that setting out with a support fleet would be a great idea, however currently i simply don't see how a support fleet is going to make much of a difference when like described above there is to much alpha on the field.
But anyway this is what makes eve and because of this, things on the market are going change and new possibilities open up. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:39:00 -
[420] - Quote
Ganker requirement : hauler EHP/ choosen ship alpha = number of required gankers
Cost of possible gank : number of required ganker * isk worth of ships choosen = total gank cost
gank value : Total hauled asset / 2 = potential average loot
IF potential average loot > total gank cost
THEN You = juicy
ELSE You = Not juicy
END IF
See how the cost of the hauling ship is never included anywhere? That prove it is not a balancing factor. |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9478
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:41:00 -
[421] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:[Damnation, loot pi+¦ata] So, not worth it, then. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:42:00 -
[422] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:Depends on what ships (and how many) are needed to kill it. [Damnation, loot pi+¦ata] 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II 1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II Centum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Centum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane Energized Thermic Membrane II [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] [Empty Med slot] Armored Warfare Link - Passive Defense II [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] [Empty High slot] Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Slave Alpha Slave Beta Slave Gamma Slave Delta Slave Epsilon Slave Omega Of course in fleet so it would benefit from small fleet boost. Frostys Virpio wrote:Whats the EHP of that 2 bill damnation? ~625k vs RF EMP Oh, I forgot mindlink...
Forgettign about mindlink, a ganker team would need to bring ~625k alpha damage at half the cost of what you haul for the gank to be worth it. If it's impossible, then you are "safe" to haul it in that ship. If it's over, you are technically juicy. The value of your ship is meaningless. It's tank and what it haul are the important point. |
Ryhss
Android Gang Stealth Syndicate
6
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:42:00 -
[423] - Quote
Another nerf high/low/null sec thread. I'm sick of these. |
baltec1
Bat Country
2118
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:42:00 -
[424] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:baltec1 wrote:When someone makes it worthwhile it will be done. Are you saying that 1,8B in A-Types isn't enough? [
Yep. |
Ana Vyr
Vyral Technologies
338
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:42:00 -
[425] - Quote
You know, traditionally goons have been about ruining the gameplay of others in order to harvest tears. What if their overarching plan is to ruin eve by influencing CCP to carebear-ize eve online to burn the hardcore playerbase?
That would certainly maximize the tear harvest. |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:43:00 -
[426] - Quote
Tippia wrote:So, not worth it, then.
Is it about risk being too big or you don't have enough internet spaceship game friends? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9479
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:45:00 -
[427] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Is it about risk being too big or you don't have enough internet spaceship game friends? No. It's about it not carrying enough valuables.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:45:00 -
[428] - Quote
Tippia wrote:unloadedx16 wrote:3) And yes that is exactly what I'm saying. For a big slow ship with no fitting slots and little means of defending itself, cost most definitely should equal cost. No, it really shouldn't, regardless of the ship. Quote:And in other words it's not?? Don't be silly. Of course it is. Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended. If anything. 2:1 is far too low a ratio and you should be able to get the kill with far less than that, and the JF's 5:1 ratio is much more appropriate.
Ok then what do you think should be the balancing factor for ganking a freighter?
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:46:00 -
[429] - Quote
Tippia wrote:No. It's about it not carrying enough valuables.
I'll take that as "risk is too big for me" then. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:48:00 -
[430] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:Tippia wrote:unloadedx16 wrote:3) And yes that is exactly what I'm saying. For a big slow ship with no fitting slots and little means of defending itself, cost most definitely should equal cost. No, it really shouldn't, regardless of the ship. Quote:And in other words it's not?? Don't be silly. Of course it is. Since cost is not a balancing factor, a bunch of cheap ships ruining the day of a much more expensive one is working just as intended. If anything. 2:1 is far too low a ratio and you should be able to get the kill with far less than that, and the JF's 5:1 ratio is much more appropriate. Ok then what do you think should be the balancing factor for ganking a freighter?
How much isk worth he pupt in his cargo hold. Having thousands of m3 does nto eman it is to be used for anything. Fill a freighter with high priced T2 BPO and I am pretty sure no amount of tank buff you currently think of would be enough to prevent it from being ganked unless it's 100% unkillable |
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9479
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:49:00 -
[431] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:I'll take that as "risk is too big for me" then. You do that, since you have long since shown your preference for being wrong about everything. There's no reason for you to break the streak, now is it?
GǪor you can take it for what it says: that it's not carrying enough valuables.
Oh, and since I missed unloadedx16's response due to Jorma being his usual always-wrong selfGǪ
unloadedx16 wrote:Ok then what do you think should be the balancing factor for ganking a freighter? The same as for everything else: what does it do? Is it capable of doing what it's supposed to be doing, and with how much effort? What options are available to improve its capabilities? What are its hard counters? What can it counter itself? How does it scale with other options for the same activity? Cost isn't a factor in any of that and it certainly can't balance anything out that isn't where it should be. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:49:00 -
[432] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:unloadedx16 wrote:
I agree with you, yes the pilot did not make a very good decision for hauling so much isk worth that it would be potentially profitable to gank him (if the loot drop gods are on your side). What I'm arguing is that it should take more than 900mill to gank him in the first place.
So 6 15 mil frigates should never kill a 2 bil battleship?
A battleship has a different purpose than a freighter and has the OPTION to be tanky or ganky. |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:50:00 -
[433] - Quote
That's why RFF never recommends to haul more than 1 bil worth of stuff in a freighter.
Good job taking those freighters down, nice to see that at least reasonably sized and organized group can do stuff in hi-sec these days. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:51:00 -
[434] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Tippia wrote:No. It's about it not carrying enough valuables.
I'll take that as "risk is too big for me" then.
It's not really a risk in the case of a gank but a final cost. You will need X ship at Y price to blow up ship Z.If ship Z don't drop X * Y * 2 in loot, then it not worth the effort. The cost of the hauling ship is still meaningless. |
unloadedx16
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:53:00 -
[435] - Quote
Barrogh Habalu wrote:That's why RFF never recommends to haul more than 1 bil worth of stuff in a freighter.
Good job taking those freighters down, nice to see that at least reasonably sized and organized group can do stuff in hi-sec these days.
1bill is chump change, freighters need a slight buff so that 1bill bar can be raised. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9479
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:55:00 -
[436] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:1bill is chump change, freighters need a slight buff so that 1bill bar can be raised. Not really, no.
If you need to carry more value, use ships that are better suited for the purpose. They already exist and there's no reason to fiddle with the freighters to cover this already-covered niche. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:55:00 -
[437] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:It's not really a risk in the case of a gank but a final cost. You will need X ship at Y price to blow up ship Z.If ship Z don't drop X * Y * 2 in loot, then it not worth the effort. The cost of the hauling ship is still meaningless.
Well, Drop said it is possible to gank 600k EHP (or actually 700k if mindlink) Damnation with one Tornado in 1.0 system. |
baltec1
Bat Country
2118
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:56:00 -
[438] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote: A battleship has a different purpose than a freighter and has the OPTION to be tanky or ganky.
The frieghter has the OPTION to not carry enough cargo to make it gank worthy. You even get an isk estimate on how much you have in the hold in the cargo tab so its not like you don't know theres 21 billion in there. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 16:57:00 -
[439] - Quote
unloadedx16 wrote:Barrogh Habalu wrote:That's why RFF never recommends to haul more than 1 bil worth of stuff in a freighter.
Good job taking those freighters down, nice to see that at least reasonably sized and organized group can do stuff in hi-sec these days. 1bill is chump change, freighters need a slight buff so that 1bill bar can be raised.
Maybe they were designed with hauling different things in mind. Instead of really valuable items, what if ti was bulky not so valuable items? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9479
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 17:00:00 -
[440] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Well, Drop said it is possible to gank 600k EHP (or actually 700k if mindlink) Damnation with one Tornado in 1.0 system. Eh, Drop hasn't posted in over four years. And no-one has said anything ever remotely like what you're claiming, so good job not breaking that GÇ£always being wrong about everythingGÇ¥-streak you've got going.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 17:03:00 -
[441] - Quote
Wrong Drop.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1912789#post1912789 |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9479
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 17:08:00 -
[442] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Wrong Drop. Then maybe you should refer to their full name? The game reports 500 characters matching GÇ£dropGÇ¥, and none of them seem to have posted in this thread. Even for you, that's a spectacular level of being wrong (and you set the bar for being wrong amazingly high as it is).
GǪoh, and no-one has still said anything remotely like the claim in your strawman argument. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
|
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 17:13:00 -
[443] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:It's not really a risk in the case of a gank but a final cost. You will need X ship at Y price to blow up ship Z.If ship Z don't drop X * Y * 2 in loot, then it not worth the effort. The cost of the hauling ship is still meaningless. Well, Drop said it is possible to gank 600k EHP (or actually 700k if mindlink) Damnation with one Tornado in 1.0 system.
I'm pretty sure noone ever intended to gank 600k ehp worth of ship in a single tornado anywhere in high sec...
|
Bizzaro Stormy MurphDog
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
2
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 17:59:00 -
[444] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:It's not really a risk in the case of a gank but a final cost. You will need X ship at Y price to blow up ship Z.If ship Z don't drop X * Y * 2 in loot, then it not worth the effort. The cost of the hauling ship is still meaningless. Well, Drop said it is possible to gank 600k EHP (or actually 700k if mindlink) Damnation with one Tornado in 1.0 system.
Just stop. Stop cluttering this thread with off-topic trolling. It's an engaging read up until you start posting and some people try to engage your baffling trolling.
Why don't you go create a new thread entitled "Can a lone Tornado launch a 700k alpha strike?" because that's all you want to talk about (good for you?) despite the fact that it has nothing to do with the actual topic being discussed.
On topic - seems to be working as intended. Given the different ship options available for hauling cargo, freighters appear to be the "carry bulky, relatively inexpensive products" type of hauler. Thinking you need to jam every square meter of that hold with billions of isk worth of cargo is operator error, not design error.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 18:24:00 -
[445] - Quote
Why I get ganked in freighter full of Trit?
It's not even worth ganking it... |
baltec1
Bat Country
2123
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 18:28:00 -
[446] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Why I get ganked in freighter full of Trit?
It's not even worth ganking it...
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
can't fly freighter yet so I would really want to make it as stupidly expensive as possible to gank my ship by using Damnation.
mmhmm... |
Agent Akari
Hobo Industries Inc
33
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 18:36:00 -
[447] - Quote
Don't you guys see it? Freighters are designed to be ganked. They are not designed to transfer goods, but are actually a isk sink and a target objective.
It's your job(s) to protect it, prevent it or do it at night when the goons are asleep for the next schoolday.
Perhaps it is safer to get 20 pilots with Iteron V and make a convoy, the chances of them reaching the destination is higher. |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
155
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 18:47:00 -
[448] - Quote
Ok, Now I have actually read through this hole mess of a thread. It seems although a few people have agreed freighters are a little to easy to gank. Nobody has agreed that running a shipment that would drop over 20 bil in loot is a wise idea.(take note OP)
Some have asked what sort of support fleet would have helped this situation. Well with such a high profit potential this load was doomed before it undocked. But there are ways of successfully supporting a freighter in high sec and beyond.
The best you can do for support on a freighter is not logistics to rep it up if it gets attacked. Usually just a waste. Most gankers will bring enough to pop it in the first volley.
You can use fleet boosts and implants to give a decent boost to your tank. Your ehp may be higher than the gankers expected.
Combine this with a scout who also has triple webs fitted.
Do not auto pilot, manually pilot and warp to zero/jump. you will not be on grid long enough to get targeted as you will jump through the gate.
your scout who jumped through the gate first will then hit you with the triple webs allowing you to warp within a couple seconds.
This set up is as safe as you can get. and with a few extra scouts watching stations, gates, and checking your route several jumps out, will even be a fairly safe way of moving through low sec. At least as safe as it can get.
I have done this in high sec and through low sec into null when needed. Planing, scouting, and preparation can keep a freighter fairly safe even traveling into null. But that involves waiting for the right time when you scouts can find you a clear route.
Running a freighter in high sec is very low risk. having an escort to scout and web you into warp drops that risk to near zero.
Unless of course you are dumb enough to run a freighter load worth more than 10 bil out of a trade hub through system known to contain gankers.
Do not be fooled by the misconception of the level of ganker risk. the risk to gank a freighter does not really fluctuate much. It is a very static risk and static cost to the gankers. any group looking to gank a freighter knows exactly what it is going to cost then in ships long before the first shot is fired.
The cost in ganknados minus the expected returns in loot and salvage from the gank ships and the basic freighter hull puts the max cost a little over 1 bil. As soon as there is a chance of over 1 bil of loot dropping your risk of getting ganked goes way up.
A gank squad using scouts and passive targeting modules can scan you several jumps before the gank and you will not even know you were scanned.(at least it used to work this way, I assume it still does.) and they select their targets well in advance. Even this risk can be reduced by not taking the most direct route. Most freighter ganking is done at pinch points where you have to pass through when traveling between trade hubs or heading to common destination systems out of Jita.They may scan dozens or even hundreds of ships before selecting a target.
A freighter with over 3 bil in cargo is juicy and pretty much guaranteed to drop move in loot than what the gank cost in ships. A freighter holding over 10 bil in its cargo is a very high risk any where near a common trade hub or highly traveled pipe. traveling these pipes with such a cargo AFK is not only high risk but insanely stupid. You are just asking to get ganked as even a poorly planed and executed freighter gank would be profitable with that kind of loot drop.
If you do not want to get ganked follow these simple rules.
1. do not ever run a freighter with more than 2 bil worth of stuff in its cargo hold. freighters are meant to hold high volume low value goods, not huge stacks of high value goods.
2. never never auto pilot. Manually warping to zero and jumping has been a good freighter pilots practice for a very long time. Now it is much easier as you can manually just select jump and you will auto warp to zero and jump. If you just find freighter piloting to be too boring and must afk a long trip, keep your cargo to high volume low value good with a total cargo worth less than 1 bil. The chances of getting ganked just for luls is almost zero.
3. If you must run a load of high value cargo such as high end battleships put some effort into minimizing the risk.
-If you have over 3 bil worth of cargo chances are you will get ganked if you are scanned. plan your route to avoid common pipes and choke points where gankers are known to operate.
-get a friend or alt to scout ahead looking for potential pirates and gate camps. use a friend or alt to web you from each gate to get you into warp faster.
- get a friend or alt with leadership and ganklink skills to fleet you and run the shield, armor, and agility gank links
-(in high sec all three of these can potentially be the same ship. you just need a ship that can fit all the mods, warp to and jump through the next gate while the freighter is still in warp. T3 cruiser work well for this but there are other cheaper ships that also work.) the friend/alt is then in next system looking for potential gankers, with the gank-links running, and ready to web as soon as you jump through. Provided you are manually piloting(warp to zero and jump) you will jump as soon as you reach the gate before they can target you.
- You can also buy the agility, armor hp, and/or hull hp implant mods. even the 1% hull hp adds a fair bit, but the 3% is still fairly cheap. this will significantly increase your ehp likely above the panned alfa allowing you to survive the first volley if you do get ganked. surviving the first volley is often all that is needed(at least when the gankers use ganknados) as CONCORD should show up before they get a second shot off.
|
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy Caldari State
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 19:06:00 -
[449] - Quote
I didn't say anything about my alts... |
baltec1
Bat Country
2124
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 19:11:00 -
[450] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:I didn't say anything about my alts...
Lets see the km then. |
|
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
8
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 19:18:00 -
[451] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Why I get ganked in freighter full of Trit?
It's not even worth ganking it...
Some people also gank for tears. They were successfull it seems as you are whining here. |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
1720
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 19:18:00 -
[452] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:I didn't say anything about my alts... Lets see the km then. "Big Kills" http://eve-kill.net/?a=home&m=09&y=2012&view=kills&scl_id=501
Just find the freighter km with lots of trit in it (spoiler there isn't one) |
EternalFlow
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 19:44:00 -
[453] - Quote
Actually one of the plastic wrap freighters we killed had 200mil worth of trit in it. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
9
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 19:59:00 -
[454] - Quote
EternalFlow wrote:Actually one of the plastic wrap freighters we killed had 200mil worth of trit in it.
Whats the point of wraping trit? It basicly makes you appear more juicy no? |
baltec1
Bat Country
2124
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 20:02:00 -
[455] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:EternalFlow wrote:Actually one of the plastic wrap freighters we killed had 200mil worth of trit in it. Whats the point of wraping trit? It basicly makes you appear more juicy no?
Thats why it got whacked |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
9
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 20:15:00 -
[456] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:EternalFlow wrote:Actually one of the plastic wrap freighters we killed had 200mil worth of trit in it. Whats the point of wraping trit? It basicly makes you appear more juicy no? Thats why it got whacked
So either it was an idiot or he was hauling a contract I guess. |
Samahiel Sotken
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2012.09.12 21:47:00 -
[457] - Quote
Bugsy VanHalen wrote::words:
I guarantee if you take a third of the precautions he mentioned, we will scan you down, say "meh", and kill the AFK anshar full of plex and capital production BPOs behind you. |
Lord Arakkis
Vestige of Vehemence Dragon Swarm Dynasty
48
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 00:34:00 -
[458] - Quote
I would love to see this play out in the real:
Guy walks down the street with a backpack full of 100$ bills all the while screaming "dont hurt me, dont hurt me, dont hurt meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!" Your still a child in the eyes of the universe |
Easthir Ravin
Easy Co. Fatal Ascension
63
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 01:17:00 -
[459] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!!
that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
if u want all alliances to leave their 0.0 systems and just go fun terrorizing high sec and earn money for that... stay cool about it CCP... as it will destroy the game
u gave protection for miners... its time for freighters/ JF revamp...
Greetings
Not even a month into this last iteration and some one has started the next "waaa CCP needs to change game for me thread" You people have no shame, EVE is a dangerous place and ships go pop.
I die a little each time I read a thread that just reinforces the fact that gamers are becoming pansies. IN THE IMORTAL WORDS OF SOCRATES: -á" I drank WHAT?!" |
Pinky Feldman
Gank Bangers Moar Tears
342
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 03:27:00 -
[460] - Quote
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Lucy Ferrr wrote: Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended...
Maybe nobody wardecs Goons because ppl simply don't want to wardec them? You can't say...
No, its definitely the cost.
The moar you cry the less you pee |
|
Pinky Feldman
Gank Bangers Moar Tears
342
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 03:29:00 -
[461] - Quote
Agent Akari wrote:Don't you guys see it? Freighters are designed to be ganked. They are not designed to transfer goods, but are actually a isk sink and a target objective.
It's your job(s) to protect it, prevent it or do it at night when the goons are asleep for the next schoolday.
Perhaps it is safer to get 20 pilots with Iteron V and make a convoy, the chances of them reaching the destination is higher.
Technically freighters being killed regardless of their cargo adds more isk to the economy because of insurance, but whatever. :details: right?
The moar you cry the less you pee |
Agent Akari
Hobo Industries Inc
34
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 03:58:00 -
[462] - Quote
Pinky Feldman wrote:Agent Akari wrote:Don't you guys see it? Freighters are designed to be ganked. They are not designed to transfer goods, but are actually a isk sink and a target objective.
It's your job(s) to protect it, prevent it or do it at night when the goons are asleep for the next schoolday.
Perhaps it is safer to get 20 pilots with Iteron V and make a convoy, the chances of them reaching the destination is higher. Technically freighters being killed regardless of their cargo adds more isk to the economy because of insurance, but whatever. :details: right?
Yes but all the other freighter ships are insured and will never get destroyed, so the iskies leave the system again. And by those freighters I mean pilots who can fly them without getting ganked. |
Spy 21
Lonetrek Exploration and Salvage
172
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 04:41:00 -
[463] - Quote
Samahiel Sotken wrote:Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Then why not go and do something nobody has done before: gank fully tanked Damnation in 1.0 system.
I'm sorry, I'm running high sec interdiction on enemy logistics in two nullsec wars, flying in regularly nullsec fleet ops, running a nullsec PI setup and a High Sec manufacturing operation, ganking hulks, helping destroy more than 620 billion in freighters, still getting into small gang PVP brawls regularly, while ratting to keep my sec status up, and all on three characters on one account that is less than a year old. Are you not entertained?
Jesus, when do you sleep?
S The thread goes on-line June 9th, 2012. Human intelligence is removed from further posts. The thread begins to learn at a geometric rate. The thread becomes self-aware at 2:14 a.m. Eastern time, June 10th. In a panic, they try to pull the plug.-á |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
161
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 19:13:00 -
[464] - Quote
Pinky Feldman wrote:Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Lucy Ferrr wrote: Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended...
Maybe nobody wardecs Goons because ppl simply don't want to wardec them? You can't say... No, its definitely the cost.
Not that the GOONS need on even want me to defend them. I'm sure they would rather just blast me. But I would think that anyone who war decs the GOONS makes themselves a primary target to hunt down. There are plenty of bored GOONS looking for something to do. being able to attack war targets in high sec freely, would be like christmas to a GOON.
I can tell you it is not the cost, many alliances who hate the GOONS could afford it. Perhaps knowing they would have their arse handed to them repeatedly is the real deterrent to war decing the GOONS. The GOONS certainly are not afraid of a fight.
There is just no alliance currently in game with enough clout to stand up to the GOONS, at least not one that has a reason too. I am not saying there is no alliance that could defeat the GOONS, but only that of the few there are, all are either friends of the GOONS or would stand to lose to much in such a war for it to be worth while.
In fact based on what I know of the GOONSWARM, I would think that most if not all the GOONS would be very happy if such a war was to happen. It would result in an abundance of PVP. I believe one of their moto's is "A GOON with someone to shoot is a happy GOON". |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
221
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 19:21:00 -
[465] - Quote
I couldn't even get through most of this crap.
I do incursions, and rather than taking the easy way out and jamming all my shiney stuff into a frighter, i actually FLY stuff to where it needs to go (and use an alt to move mods and ammo in a prorator).
Putting all your eggs in one basket is really dumb. And of course rather than smartening up and learning how to do it right, the OP runs to the forum for ccp to "fix it". Oh the humanity
|
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
694
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 19:22:00 -
[466] - Quote
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:Pinky Feldman wrote:Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Lucy Ferrr wrote: Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended...
Maybe nobody wardecs Goons because ppl simply don't want to wardec them? You can't say... No, its definitely the cost. Not that the GOONS need on even want me to defend them. I'm sure they would rather just blast me. But I would think that anyone who war decs the GOONS makes themselves a primary target to hunt down. There are plenty of bored GOONS looking for something to do. being able to attack war targets in high sec freely, would be like christmas to a GOON. I can tell you it is not the cost, many alliances who hate the GOONS could afford it. Perhaps knowing they would have their arse handed to them repeatedly is the real deterrent to war decing the GOONS. The GOONS certainly are not afraid of a fight. There is just no alliance currently in game with enough clout to stand up to the GOONS, at least not one that has a reason too. I am not saying there is no alliance that could defeat the GOONS, but only that of the few there are, all are either friends of the GOONS or would stand to lose to much in such a war for it to be worth while. In fact based on what I know of the GOONSWARM, I would think that most if not all the GOONS would be very happy if such a war was to happen. It would result in an abundance of PVP. I believe one of their moto's is "A GOON with someone to shoot is a happy GOON". Goon is not an acronym. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1479
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 20:19:00 -
[467] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Putting all your eggs in one basket is really dumb. And of course rather than smartening up and learning how to do it right, the OP runs to the forum for ccp to "fix it". Oh the humanity How long until freighters get their "much needed" ehp buff... Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1479
|
Posted - 2012.09.13 20:20:00 -
[468] - Quote
Pinky Feldman wrote:Rordan D'Kherr wrote:Lucy Ferrr wrote: Goons are all over high-sec don't let them tell you otherwise. Especially now that CCP gifted the CFC with near immunity from wardecs. Last time I checked (which admittedly is not that recent.) Goons had zero wardecs on them. The most obnoxious and hated alliance has zero war decs, yeah sounds like the war-dec system is working as intended...
Maybe nobody wardecs Goons because ppl simply don't want to wardec them? You can't say... No, its definitely the cost. Definitely the cost. We used to have Jita undock campers wardeccing all the time. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Lord Regent
Northstar Cabal Fatal Ascension
4
|
Posted - 2012.09.23 15:27:00 -
[469] - Quote
If everyone in highsec flew a little more like people do in nullsec, you guys wouldn't have half the problems you do.
i.e. have any idea what is going on around you, and have some sense of danger.
The vast majority of highsec mouth-breathing pubbies are so oblivious to your surroundings, you wouldn't know you're about to be ganked unless someone literally convo'd you and told you. and then, you'd probably be alt-tabbed and off fapping it, so you'd probably miss it anyways.
Face it, If you snooze you lose. If you see a titan go down in 0.0 (many many times more valuable than the most valuable freighter anyone has popped in highsec) do you see a stream of pubbie tears in E-O? Nope. That plot or group of pilots generally owns up to their mistakes if they made any, or just chalks it up to good work by their enemies.
That is all. Sincerely,-á Lord Regent. |
Codo Yagari
Yulai Guard 1st Fleet Yulai Federation
35
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 12:35:00 -
[470] - Quote
OP
+1
Concord needs a good buff!
http://yulaifederation.net
|
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Warde Guildencrantz
TunDraGon
74
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 13:06:00 -
[471] - Quote
God forbid freighters and jump freighters ever are put at risk
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Diva Ex Machina
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
8
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 13:54:00 -
[472] - Quote
Really the whinging on the Eve forums never stops.
For those complaining that you can't proactively engage gankers in high sec without getting concorded, the obvious solution is to get out of high sec. There, problem solved. Awaiting your profuse thanks. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4898
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 14:00:00 -
[473] - Quote
why are Yulai Federation roleplayers so concerned about the safety of freighters loaded with cargo worth 30 times the value of the hull please leave |
Creedling
10
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 14:42:00 -
[474] - Quote
Agree with most of the responses here - don't put all your eggs in one basket!
Amused by the amount of people who leapt on the opportunity to prove to GD how elite they are talking about lack of situational awareness in hisec etc - what's a Local full of blues got to do with situational awareness? |
Pak Narhoo
Knights of Kador
705
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 14:51:00 -
[475] - Quote
Its actually funny that no-one on the forums gave the OP a like for this during the past weeks.
I'm actually a bit proud on you guys. /pinks a tear away. Maybe there's still hope to keep eve, EVE. Hi, I'm CCP Arrow, I screwed up the.. ummm... |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4898
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 14:52:00 -
[476] - Quote
Creedling wrote:Agree with most of the responses here - don't put all your eggs in one basket!
Amused by the amount of people who leapt on the opportunity to prove to GD how elite they are talking about lack of situational awareness in hisec etc - what's a Local full of blues got to do with situational awareness?
since nullsec is super safe why don't you just move here? please leave |
Tarinara
Avenged Sevenfold Industries
7
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 15:43:00 -
[477] - Quote
And so another falls to the Goons...
Just saw the results of the mayhem on my way through just now. Impressive that y'all got them that far away from the gate. |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
4
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 16:31:00 -
[478] - Quote
Mohamad Transporte wrote:just few minutes ago... Goons has destroyed 4 freighters in high sec (u can check eve-kill.net), total drop worth 21.5 billion isk!!!
21.5 Billion isk people!!!! that beats 10/10 DED, FW Missions and incursions all together!!
There's an important difference: Bilions of ISK from incursions, DED, mining and so on are ISK created from nowhere, Bilions from suicide ganking freighters are simply moved from an owner to another one (and part destroyed in the process). So it's a balancing healty factor in the global gameplay and food chain. |
La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
147
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 17:52:00 -
[479] - Quote
@angry highsec pubbie #23895872438975293458923475234589 if nullsec was fixed we wouldn't be in highsec murdering you Goonwaffe is now recruiting feel free to message me in game for information about joining! |
Lord Zim
1560
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 18:27:00 -
[480] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Putting all your eggs in one basket is really dumb. And of course rather than smartening up and learning how to do it right, the OP runs to the forum for ccp to "fix it". Oh the humanity Hey, it worked for the miners. Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home. |
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Vertisce Soritenshi
Tactical Vendor of Services and Goods Partners of Industrial Service and Salvage
1744
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 18:33:00 -
[481] - Quote
Exactly how many people did it take to kill those Freighers? Divide that 20 bill by that...thats right...not as profitable anymore now is it? EvE is not about PvP.-á EvE is about the SANDBOX! |
Liz Laser
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 21:45:00 -
[482] - Quote
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY FREIGHTER PILOTS, ONCE ******** CRIMEWATCH COMES AROUND NOBODY WILL GANK YOUR PRECIOUS FREIGHTER FULL OF 50 BILL ISK CARGO BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SCOOP IT WITHOUT BEING FREELY SHOT AT BY ANYONE.
You put too much faith in people being kind. Why would any of us drop what we are doing to hunt some crimenal for no incentive? Ooooo... That guy has a crime flag, let's stop our current profitable endeavour that we enjoy to go ahoot someone who most likely is better prepared and is hoping we come to our deaths. Sorry, just because someone can be shot by anyone does not mean everyone will come running to shoot them.
I might be misunderstanding, but it sounds like a guard fleet could then keep "bad guys" from absconding with the loot by killing them.
Thus leading to fleet battles to attack/defend freighter movements.
|
Liz Laser
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
4
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 21:47:00 -
[483] - Quote
Liz Laser wrote:Lady Ayeipsia wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY FREIGHTER PILOTS, ONCE ******** CRIMEWATCH COMES AROUND NOBODY WILL GANK YOUR PRECIOUS FREIGHTER FULL OF 50 BILL ISK CARGO BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SCOOP IT WITHOUT BEING FREELY SHOT AT BY ANYONE.
You put too much faith in people being kind. Why would any of us drop what we are doing to hunt some crimenal for no incentive? Ooooo... That guy has a crime flag, let's stop our current profitable endeavour that we enjoy to go ahoot someone who most likely is better prepared and is hoping we come to our deaths. Sorry, just because someone can be shot by anyone does not mean everyone will come running to shoot them. I might be misunderstanding, but it sounds like a guard fleet could then keep "bad guys" from absconding with the loot by killing them. Thus leading to big fleet battles to attack/defend freighter movements.
|
Hauling Hal
The Black Ops Black Core Alliance
92
|
Posted - 2012.09.28 22:34:00 -
[484] - Quote
La Nariz wrote:@angry highsec pubbie #23895872438975293458923475234589 if nullsec was fixed we wouldn't be in highsec murdering you
ROFLMAO
Sorry, I assumed you were joking. |
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