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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 39 post(s) |

Isaac Morrie
Gravimetrics Industries Redrum Fleet
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 18:40:00 -
[541] - Quote
From the devblog
The trick is to remember that the Prophecy bonuses are based on the Battlecruiser skill. Thus, if you want to maximize the reimbursement, training Amarr Cruiser past 3 will do you little good. Aim for Battlecruisers 5 instead, as you will then get Amarr Battlecruiser 5.
If I am reading the devblog right if I currently have Battlecruisers 5 I only have to train Amarr Cruiser 3 in order to be given Amarr Battlecruiser 5 If so this doesn't make any sense because with Amarr Cruiser 3 I still wouldn't be able to fly the Amarr Command Ships, but I could afterwords.
Can I get a dev comment on this I need to plan my training for the next few months? |

Karl Hobb
Stellar Ore Refinery and Crematorium
1024
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 18:41:00 -
[542] - Quote
Inkarr Hashur wrote:You also missed how they're adding 4 prereqs for the command ships skill, which you get to skip. I actually didn't, but no worries. The question came up because I was drafting an email to corpmates about what to train before the expansion. Command Ships will be one of them. If you're not already part of a bloc, this is the best guy for CSM8. |

Destoya
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
62
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 19:15:00 -
[543] - Quote
Isaac Morrie wrote:From the devblog
The trick is to remember that the Prophecy bonuses are based on the Battlecruiser skill. Thus, if you want to maximize the reimbursement, training Amarr Cruiser past 3 will do you little good. Aim for Battlecruisers 5 instead, as you will then get Amarr Battlecruiser 5.
If I am reading the devblog right if I currently have Battlecruisers 5 I only have to train Amarr Cruiser 3 in order to be given Amarr Battlecruiser 5 If so this doesn't make any sense because with Amarr Cruiser 3 I still wouldn't be able to fly the Amarr Command Ships, but I could afterwords.
Can I get a dev comment on this I need to plan my training for the next few months?
Here is the skill plan to maximize your SP from the changes
Amarr Frig III Caldari Frig III Gallente Frig III Minmatar Frig III
Destroyers V
Amarr Cruiser III Caldari Cruiser III Gallente Cruiser III Minmatar Cruiser III
Battlecruisers V
If you have racial industrial V you probably want to train racial freighter 1 to avoid training advanced spaceship command V after the changes, and if you are similarly close to Command Ships I you will want to inject that too if you don't have our basic gang bonus skills to V.
After the patch, this will give you:
All frigates III All destroyers V All cruisers III All Battlecruisers to V
After you train command ships I, you will be able to fly every command ship from all 4 races, regardless of your cruiser skill. |

Unkind Omen
Stone circle W-Space
12
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 19:43:00 -
[544] - Quote
Radius Prime wrote:Unkind Omen wrote:The only nasty and really confusing thing in this skill split idea is the fact that racial battlecruiser and destroyer skills would get same ranks as their common counterparts have now. Do you think that command ships alone are that good so people would surely spend 1.5 mil SP for each one of them? I think that they are not that awesome. Most people train commands as a good bonus for having at least two of racial cruisers 5. And even now it would cost only an additional 1.2mil SP to cross-train commands through cruiser skills even if you would ignore the fact that the cruiser 5 skill is a must have skill for any experienced pvp pilot anyway as it provides access to SC, Logistics, Recons, HICs and HACs as weapons of destruction.
I think that you should consider lowering a rank of racial battlecruisers skill at least to rank 5( which cruisers have) or may be even lowering both cruisers and BC skills to rank 4. Personally I already have BC and destroyers V but I still cant forget that damn month I spent training BC V. How do you imagine new players to spend 4 months to get the same result? Nobody ever said you were obligated to train all races. It is a personal choice. Instead of having to train all cruisers to V to fly command ships you will now train all bcs instead. Not having to train racial cruiser V and battlecruisers V for CS makes perfect sense to me. For me there is the added benefit that I preferred BCS over cruisers anyway :).
Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change? |

Chi'Nane T'Kal
Interminatus Aeterna Anima
33
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 19:53:00 -
[545] - Quote
Unkind Omen wrote:
Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
Doesn't look fair, because it isn't. In my experience Eve has always catered towards the existing playerbase, the older the better.
In every patch there is an opportunity for completely unjustified profit which can only be grabbed by those in a position to do so. (Luckily this time I will probably be one of them ;)) |

Unkind Omen
Stone circle W-Space
12
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 19:56:00 -
[546] - Quote
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:Unkind Omen wrote:
Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
Doesn't look fair, because it isn't. In my experience Eve has always catered towards the existing playerbase, the older the better. In every patch there is an opportunity for completely unjustified profit which can only be grabbed by those in a position to do so. (Luckily this time I will probably be one of them ;))
It would be just a great opportunity if only it would not affect the accessability of a large class of ships, which is also going to be nerfed down by cutting OGB. This change is going to brake command ships even more.
Upd: And yes, you do have to train multiple command ships to be able to fly in both armor and shield fleets. |

DJWiggles
Eve Radio Corporation
40
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 19:57:00 -
[547] - Quote
Isaac Morrie wrote:From the devblog
The trick is to remember that the Prophecy bonuses are based on the Battlecruiser skill. Thus, if you want to maximize the reimbursement, training Amarr Cruiser past 3 will do you little good. Aim for Battlecruisers 5 instead, as you will then get Amarr Battlecruiser 5.
If I am reading the devblog right if I currently have Battlecruisers 5 I only have to train Amarr Cruiser 3 in order to be given Amarr Battlecruiser 5 If so this doesn't make any sense because with Amarr Cruiser 3 I still wouldn't be able to fly the Amarr Command Ships, but I could afterwords.
Can I get a dev comment on this I need to plan my training for the next few months?
as everyone has been saying, if you can fly it NOW, you WILL be able to fly it after the change Live on Eve Radio Wednesdays 20:00 GMT with me & friends blabbering on about Eve and stuff-áFollow me on twitter http://twitter.com/WigglesGRN, like me on facebook http://facebook.com/wigglesGRN or check out my blog http://wiggles.gamingradio.net/blog
|

Sven Viko VIkolander
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
38
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 20:43:00 -
[548] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote: Clone costs in their current form are not something we as a design department are happy with. Beyond that we can't make commitments on the issue at this time.
Speaking as a newish player (when do I get to stop saying that?) clone costs and penalties need reworking asap. They make vet players risk averse (we need them to lose ships, not more reasons to horde them) and they are a serious harm to new players. Why? Because it is almost inevitable that a new player will forget to upgrade the clone, get podded, and lose some of the few SP they already have. I know I did at least once. I'm sure you can find a better ISK sink...(technically, any reason to PVP more is de facto an isk sink anyhow) |

Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
90
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:01:00 -
[549] - Quote
I have to add in my sentiment here in that requiring jump optimization skills for Carriers does not make any sense whatsoever, especially when viewed for those players who live in wormholes. I know my Carrier will never be able to jump from wormhole to wormhole, so it makes so little sense to require this.
Fighters and Tactical Logistics Configuration make WAY more sense. Hell, make it Fighters V or something if you want a time sink. Then, you can add the jump optimization skills as tertiary requirements on Supers, since we all know they can't even get into wormholes (so that fixes that), and they're about force projection in nullsec (so jump-related skills fit nicely here, too).
edit: clarity |

DancesWithVeldspar
Raven's Toy Production
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:06:00 -
[550] - Quote
CCP Ytterbium wrote:Alrigh folks, good news. We'll change the way training works so that you can still train the skills you have after change, even if you don't meet the prerequisite anymore. Ex: You have Amarr Freighter 1 after the change but not Advanced Spaceship Command 5. You can still fly the Providence and you will now still be able to train Amarr Freighter past 1 as long as you have the skill injected.Hope that's clear - trying my very best 
Thanks. It is much appreciated. After training the unneeded Mining Barges 5, I wasn't looking forward to training the unneeded Ore Industrial 3. |

Callic Veratar
Power of the Phoenix
323
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:29:00 -
[551] - Quote
Unkind Omen wrote:[Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
The "fair" that they get is that it'll be that much easier for them to hop into a logistics or command ship or recon if they want. They'll have to train different skills to get to where we are, and they'll never catch up, but that's completely independent from what skills are trained. It's the side effect of not starting to play in 2003-2012.
And who cares what the prerequisites are for the T2 ships? Why do I care that Cloaking IV is required for Recons? I trained Recons a year ago (and you can too if you don't want to bother with Cloaking IV). DirectX 11, it's not rocket appliance! |

Unkind Omen
Stone circle W-Space
12
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:35:00 -
[552] - Quote
Callic Veratar wrote: The "fair" that they get is that it'll be that much easier for them to hop into a logistics or command ship or recon if they want.
This statement is eventually a false one as the training que is modified for command ships in the way that even training for one of them will take same time as it is now. |

Candente
Navy Veteran Club
30
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:38:00 -
[553] - Quote
Thanks for the very detailed information. Time to get myself an orca... assuming its price doesn't jump up a lot by the time this happens. |

Jonas Sukarala
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
16
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:41:00 -
[554] - Quote
what i found odd about the blog is that all the command ships require training the skills for the 4 main links... when they are only going to be bonused for 2 links so surely they should only require the 2 links skills they will need e.g. vulture will be bonused towards
siege warfare link
information warfare links |

Dersen Lowery
Laurentson INC StructureDamage
424
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 21:42:00 -
[555] - Quote
Destoya wrote:Here is the skill plan to maximize your SP from the changes
Amarr Frig III Caldari Frig III Gallente Frig III Minmatar Frig III
Destroyers V
Amarr Cruiser III Caldari Cruiser III Gallente Cruiser III Minmatar Cruiser III
Battlecruisers V
The frig skills have to be trained to IV in order to train the Cruiser skills. Otherwise, yes. Malcanis for CSM 8 |
|

CCP Fozzie
C C P C C P Alliance
3921

|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:10:00 -
[556] - Quote
Jonas Sukarala wrote:what i found odd about the blog is that all the command ships require training the skills for the 4 main links... when they are only going to be bonused for 2 links so surely they should only require the 2 links skills they will need
e.g. vulture will be bonused towards
siege warfare link
information warfare links
The Command ship skill requires the training of the skills for exactly 0 links. Note that there is a big difference between "Armored Warfare" and "Armored Warfare Specialist".
The skills that are being added to the command ship skill prereqs all give bonuses to your fleet even if you don't fit any warfare links, and are therefore all very valuable for any character that wants to sit in a squad command position, command ship or not. Game Designer | Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie |
|

Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
137
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:13:00 -
[557] - Quote
Unkind Omen wrote:
1) Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
2) There is also too much of profit from training racial cruisers V in comparsion to the profit from racial BC would be. I tell you that most EVE players wont spend 1 month of training to get acess to 2 ships, that would be just a bit better than T3 as bonus ships, would most likely have same firepower and combat potential as T3 ships while having same cost efficiency.
With regards to 1. No you don't. You get your 3 Racial BC skills, but you get 0 free SP. Your current BC skill just gets converted into the 3 racials. Because you have at least one of the racials, you get no refund. The refund only occurs if you have ZERO racials.
And for the other guy who just posted, once again, CS will not need any link skills to fly. it needs the passive boost skills, which anyone in a boosting position should have anyway. Wing Command is not a good alternative as most boosters have no intent to ever command fleets, and the command slot is not actually required to be the booster. |

Unkind Omen
Stone circle W-Space
12
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:31:00 -
[558] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Unkind Omen wrote: 1) Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
With regards to 1. No you don't. You get your 3 Racial BC skills, but you get 0 free SP. Your current BC skill just gets converted into the 3 racials. Because you have at least one of the racials, you get no refund. The refund only occurs if you have ZERO racials.
I would like to see any confirmation from CCP about this point. I doubt because I cant imagine a char that has no racial frigate skills at level 3 but destroyer skill trained. Same goes for battlecuisers skill. Which makes literally no one eligable for skill points refund if your POV is correct. |

Jonas Sukarala
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
16
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:34:00 -
[559] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Jonas Sukarala wrote:what i found odd about the blog is that all the command ships require training the skills for the 4 main links... when they are only going to be bonused for 2 links so surely they should only require the 2 links skills they will need
e.g. vulture will be bonused towards
siege warfare link
information warfare links The Command ship skill requires the training of the skills for exactly 0 links. Note that there is a big difference between "Armored Warfare" and "Armored Warfare Specialist". The skills that are being added to the command ship skill prereqs all give bonuses to your fleet even if you don't fit any warfare links, and are therefore all very valuable for any character that wants to sit in a squad command position, command ship or not.
Well a shield fleet doesn't need the armoured warfare skill or necessarily the bonus from the skirmish and information warfare.
Perhaps since it is a specialist command ship it should need the specialist skill for the links it would make more sense and be more race specific and more relative toward the race's ship. |

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
605
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:39:00 -
[560] - Quote
Unkind Omen wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Unkind Omen wrote: 1) Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
With regards to 1. No you don't. You get your 3 Racial BC skills, but you get 0 free SP. Your current BC skill just gets converted into the 3 racials. Because you have at least one of the racials, you get no refund. The refund only occurs if you have ZERO racials. I would like to see any confirmation from CCP about this point. I doubt because I cant imagine a char that has no racial frigate skills at level 3 but destroyer skill trained. Same goes for battlecuisers skill. Which makes literally no one eligable for skill points refund if your POV is correct. This has already been confirmed in the blog as well as other clarifying posts. |

Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
548
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:43:00 -
[561] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:Rommiee wrote:
You are dumbing the game down once again. There should be a requirement to invest time to be able to fly the next level of ships.
This investment of time should be significantly greater before Capital ships become available. Reducing the Battleship requirement to 3 is plain crazy, it should stay at 5. I realise that you are trying to make the progression between T1 ships uniform, but Capital ships should be excluded from this, they are a special case. It SHOULD be hard to get into this ship class.
For capital ships quite a few days of navigation skills were added, which should compensate somewhat, especially since it's on another mapping entirely. Also it makes no sense at all to compare the times used to ENTER a ship. There's a ton of skills required to actually fly a ship and those don't change at all. So what if the lvl 1 skill for Armageddon Navy Issue was reduced from 7 days to 3 days? Only a moron or a desperate person would fly that thing without at least 100-150 days in support and gunnery skills and to fly the ship efficiently you would also need the BS skill at least at IV, better yet V, which takes longer than BS1 in the first place. So you're looking at a change from something like 144-184 days to 140-180. Big deal. Where the new system really shines is if you already have all the support skills and need to change to another race's shis due to guild doctrin, as it severly cuts down on training time. Well actually I can see part of where they're coming from. Whereas part of the skills required to fly the ship have been removed, some of the skills required to fly the ship well have been added to the requirements. So it takes the same amount of time to get into the ship, but it takes less time to train the skills necessary to fly the ship well. So training to fly an Archon now might take 140 days, but I will only have JDO 1. Training to fly an Archon after the patch will take 140 days, but I will have JDO 5, JFC 4, and JDC 3. I'm actually significantly closer to being able to fly the ship at its full potential.
Exactly my point. |

Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
139
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:48:00 -
[562] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:After the expansion, the requirements on Commands Ships drop to {racial} Battlecruiser V and Command Ships I. This means that I can sit in every Command Ship, since Minmatar Cruiser IV, Caldari Cruiser IV, and a lack of Logistics skills are no longer holding me back. Furthermore, since I would have injected and trained Command Ships before the change, I would not have to train the various {type} Warfare skills.
Sounds like quite a deal to me. Assuming you've got all Cruisers to III, which is trivial to get if you haven't . . . yeah, you will clean up. It's arguably more of a bonus that cloning the racial skills, since you get to not train stuff that's required today, and not train stuff that will be required tomorrow, and yet you can still fly all those ships that you couldn't even sit in before. |

Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
139
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:51:00 -
[563] - Quote
Jonas Sukarala wrote:Well a shield fleet doesn't need the armoured warfare skill or necessarily the bonus from the skirmish and information warfare. Shield fleets "don't need" Hull Upgrades, Signature Analysis, or Evasive Maneuvering either. |

Merouk Baas
523
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:55:00 -
[564] - Quote
Command Ship prerequisites made sense to me. You fly Command Ships in order to provide boosts / buffs to your fleet. And to install links. Just like nobody will take your Logi ship to an incursion or PVP fight without good skills for it, nobody will want your command ship unless you have the Leadership skills trained and the appropriate boost modules installed.
Leadership takes a long time and sucks because it's Charisma primary. It wouldn't be so bad if CCP made it Willpower primary. But, that's their choice. |

Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
548
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:56:00 -
[565] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:Rommiee wrote:
Maller > reduced from 2 days to 18 hours Navy Augoror > reduced from 3 days to 21 hours Oracle > reduced from 4 days 3 hours to 1 day 16 hours Abaddon > reduced from 8 days 19 hours to 2 days 19 hours Armageddon Navy Issue > reduced from 7 days 9 hours to 3 days Orca > 49 days to 17 days
Thats funny, none of the times that anybody else comes up with are anything close to yours. In fact many t2 ships actually take a bit longer to train into after this change, and by a bit, some are significantly longer.
Those times were taken from the Dev Blog, and I can't see any T2 ships in that list. Maybe it would be an idea to read that properly before commenting on it here.
Grath Telkin wrote:Rommiee wrote:The support skill requirements you have added are pointless, as any Cap pilot would be training them anyway. Having them as a pre-requisite is completely meaningless. If they need to be trained anyway why do you care if they add them in as prereqs?
I will quote some one else's reply to illustrate the point...
Whereas part of the skills required to fly the ship have been removed, some of the skills required to fly the ship well have been added to the requirements. So it takes the same amount of time to get into the ship, but it takes less time to train the skills necessary to fly the ship well.
So training to fly an Archon now might take 140 days, but I will only have JDO 1. Training to fly an Archon after the patch will take 140 days, but I will have JDO 5, JFC 4, and JDC 3. I'm actually significantly closer to being able to fly the ship at its full potential.
|

Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
548
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 22:57:00 -
[566] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:Rommiee wrote:If you dumb the game down any more you will have a bunch of 3 month old characters flying around in Carriers. Like we need that. Why wouldn't that be good for the game? More young pilots in caps means more isk leaving the game as they explode, theres too much money in the game now, it has almost not point. Anything that sucks it out thats not related to stupid clone costs is a good thing.
From your point of view, there would be no need to aquire skills for anything. Just let players of any age fly whatever they want, that would sort out your ISK sink. Eve has been known for being hard and not pandering to the casual player who wants everything now. Being able to fly caps SHOULD be hard and take time. The changes to Cap requrements are just dumb.
|

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
605
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 23:10:00 -
[567] - Quote
Rommiee wrote:Grath Telkin wrote:Rommiee wrote:If you dumb the game down any more you will have a bunch of 3 month old characters flying around in Carriers. Like we need that. Why wouldn't that be good for the game? More young pilots in caps means more isk leaving the game as they explode, theres too much money in the game now, it has almost not point. Anything that sucks it out thats not related to stupid clone costs is a good thing. From your point of view, there would be no need to aquire skills for anything. Just let players of any age fly whatever they want, that would sort out your ISK sink. Eve has been known for being hard and not pandering to the casual player who wants everything now. Being able to fly caps SHOULD be hard and take time. The changes to Cap requrements are just dumb. What gains are there behind adding strictly non beneficial time, which shouldn't be confused with adding difficulty, to getting into a ship? |

Callor
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 23:11:00 -
[568] - Quote
Assuming that the clone changes that CCP has mentioned in passing aren't included in this patch can we get compensation for the clone upgrades that CCP is making us purchase. I have a perfectly good clone I paid 20M for and after this patch I will have to pay another 30M in order to pay for the next level. This cost is a direct result of game changes and due to the severe consequences of not upgrading I have no choice but to pay the money.
CCP has indicated they will be making the effort to ensure players remain whole from a skillpoint stand point and it is only fair if they also make sure we are not impacted financially. Automatically upgrading everyone to the next clone level during the patch would also be acceptable. |

Unkind Omen
Stone circle W-Space
12
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 23:17:00 -
[569] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:Unkind Omen wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Unkind Omen wrote: 1) Your problem is that I have invested 1.5 mil SP a year ago, and after this change I will just get them back as I dont have gallente cruisers trained. Meanwhile I will still get 3 racial BC's V(4.5mil SP total) literally for free. At which point does that looks fair to those who will come into the game after skill change?
With regards to 1. No you don't. You get your 3 Racial BC skills, but you get 0 free SP. Your current BC skill just gets converted into the 3 racials. Because you have at least one of the racials, you get no refund. The refund only occurs if you have ZERO racials. I would like to see any confirmation from CCP about this point. I doubt because I cant imagine a char that has no racial frigate skills at level 3 but destroyer skill trained. Same goes for battlecuisers skill. Which makes literally no one eligable for skill points refund if your POV is correct. This has already been confirmed in the blog as well as other clarifying posts.
Ok, I found it. Nice idea to post that in a new topic instead of answering here or at least giving a link in OP. However I am even more disappointed now, because the amount of people who will be left behind will only rise with no SP reimbursment. |

Josef Djugashvilis
Acme Mining Corporation
963
|
Posted - 2013.02.08 23:19:00 -
[570] - Quote
Lfod Shi wrote:Think I just slipped off that learning curve cliff again. Gonna have to read that blog 8 or 10 more times. blblblblblblblblblbl 
It will be how it will be.
As someone who teaches basic literacy to adults, what I find really interesting is how hard it is to communicate clearly and effectively just using the written word. This is not a signature. |
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