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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 20 post(s) |
Ashente
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2013.10.04 16:11:00 -
[871] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Nyancat Audeles wrote:This thing is not overpowered. Very few people will realistically fly the 16k EHP glass cannon fit. The few who do will learn the problem with it quickly. I love how people ignore the lock time delay and the lack of damage application to anything below Battleship-class ships. The reason it is considered OP right now is it is to good of a hunter ship, its intent is a PvE based ship that can defend its self from hunters, a slower lock time would make that possible. If it took about 12~15 total seconds to lock a cruiser it would be less than optimal for a hunter style ship, but if you are already in your site and a ship warps in you can begin to lock it in a reasonable amount of time giving you the advantage.
CCP Rise does say a ship themed around exploration but he also says, "killing anom runners, spying on people, looking super sexy and generally being kind of awesome."
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction
546
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 16:11:00 -
[872] - Quote
Nyancat Audeles wrote:This thing is not overpowered. Very few people will realistically fly the 16k EHP glass cannon fit. The few who do will learn the problem with it quickly. I love how people ignore the lock time delay and the lack of damage application to anything below Battleship-class ships.
The glass cannon one is NOT the overpowered one! The one with pulse lasers armor buffer and 2 drone damage mods IS! |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1635
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 16:16:00 -
[873] - Quote
Ashente wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Nyancat Audeles wrote:This thing is not overpowered. Very few people will realistically fly the 16k EHP glass cannon fit. The few who do will learn the problem with it quickly. I love how people ignore the lock time delay and the lack of damage application to anything below Battleship-class ships. The reason it is considered OP right now is it is to good of a hunter ship, its intent is a PvE based ship that can defend its self from hunters, a slower lock time would make that possible. If it took about 12~15 total seconds to lock a cruiser it would be less than optimal for a hunter style ship, but if you are already in your site and a ship warps in you can begin to lock it in a reasonable amount of time giving you the advantage. CCP Rise does say a ship themed around exploration but he also says, "killing anom runners, spying on people." Which is still possible with a lowered scan resolution, it just wont become "decloak pure PWNAGE" Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
Tragedy
The Creepshow
81
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 16:40:00 -
[874] - Quote
Nyancat Audeles wrote:This thing is not overpowered. Very few people will realistically fly the 16k EHP glass cannon fit. The few who do will learn the problem with it quickly. I love how people ignore the lock time delay and the lack of damage application to anything below Battleship-class ships. You can get 40k ehp on this and still be doing 800+ dps. Have you used ogres lately, or ever? With a dual web fit on this ship they'll hit frigates perfectly. If you can successfully catch a target with the t3s lock time delay you can do it with this ship. This ship is overpwered.
As people have suggested a simple increase to lock time would solve the issue. |
vassarh
Z-13
0
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 16:55:00 -
[875] - Quote
I think adding a secure science cargo container to the ship would make things interesting. It would allow for the contense to survive a ship destruction, event. Maybe make it like a pod for the loot from data sites that takes off to a safe location like a pos, or safe spot in space. |
Sieonigh
United Brothers Of Eve Seventh Sanctum.
12
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Posted - 2013.10.04 17:23:00 -
[876] - Quote
The Stratios looks like a copy of the human ships in Swords Of The Stars
http://25.media.tumblr.com/0c64da33eac14bd5f78ee274ac3205af/tumblr_mu5mwr6nFP1sp6rhco1_1280.jpg |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1314
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 17:30:00 -
[877] - Quote
Quinn Corvez wrote:All this back and forth is pointless. Update the thread already CCP! Yes its pointless no they will not update till after Monday when sisi gets Rubicon features. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |
Tenkene
Washi International Shinra Banshoo
2
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Posted - 2013.10.04 17:33:00 -
[878] - Quote
waaait. . just 2 of them? Rather than making a PROPER faction with all kind of ships and even an interesting looking supercarrier . . .they are giving us just . .2 of them ? huh. . . what a buzzkill. . . . Thats one of the only good ideas in the last 3 expansions, a very very different looking one (i like how ship style isnt much like other races) but. . you guys couldnt even finish it properly? wow |
MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1314
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 17:33:00 -
[879] - Quote
Tragedy wrote:Nyancat Audeles wrote:This thing is not overpowered. Very few people will realistically fly the 16k EHP glass cannon fit. The few who do will learn the problem with it quickly. I love how people ignore the lock time delay and the lack of damage application to anything below Battleship-class ships. You can get 40k ehp on this and still be doing 800+ dps. Have you used ogres lately, or ever? With a dual web fit on this ship they'll hit frigates perfectly. If you can successfully catch a target with the t3s lock time delay you can do it with this ship. This ship is overpwered. As people have suggested a simple increase to lock time would solve the issue.
Thats a mighty big if there bro. Most frigs will kite the ship... As the soe ship has great ability but lackluster top speed. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |
Trii Seo
Sabotage Incorporated Executive Outcomes
182
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Posted - 2013.10.04 17:34:00 -
[880] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote:Trii Seo wrote:Things used to be easier with gun exploring. You'd need some firepower and tank to go after those sites and nobody complained, it was a no-brainer: there's rats, need firepower for goods. Now rats are one and everyone who can get his hump in an Imicus or Heron thinks he's an explorer with warp stabs in lows. Eh, miss the days when Decryptors sold for ten-twenty times today's price. Now, onto the ships again: What's supposed to be said was said, I guess and is now up to CCP to consider. +1 high slot for the Astero for the sake of fitting variability and viability and another look at the bonuses/layout for the Stratios. Maybe they'll brainstorm up something more than us a bunch of stubborn burros each tugging the cart his own way can cook up. You make a lot of sense, todays imicus drivers in lowsec are tomorrows explorers, they will have to skill up to use the covert ops cloak etc anyway.maybe these ships need the covert ops skill? I agree it is so noisy, hard to find the balance in all this. Points to go forward. There are many who believe the stratios has the potential to be overpowered, CCPplease look at this to ensure it is balanced. There are those who believe the ships fail at being SOE exploration ships due to low virus strength and possibly scanning bonus. Please CCP look at this to ensure it is balanced. There are those who disagree with everything ............
And I'm one of them. But hey - I will complain complain complain. Scanres nerf is far from viable really, if anything it'll turn the tide towards "you have x more seconds to run but you still can't fight it."
Can't fight it means less ships exploded. Less ships exploded means our sacrifice to the depths of Anoikis will be worth much less. The gods demand blood and molten steel! ;)
I like the idea of less sensor power though. It'll make jamming them easier, although it still won't fix anything. At worst force fitting an ECCM.
I don't think they're raw exploration ships. I mean, sure - they're labeled as such and all but if SoE were to design a true covert explorer it would've been the next Cheetah, Buzzard, Anathema or Helios. There's likely to be more behind the decision for armed Sisters vessels, and since nothing in EVE's lore ever came without a cost - I sincerely doubt the reasons behind this grand ship giveaway are purely beneficial ;)
Off the lore subject, onto the ship one. While me saying this won't work and will be drowned by 2 more pages in less than an hour, we should just hold our horses 'till Rise speaks. The proposed changes are getting more and more terribad with each post and half of the thread devolved into mudslinging - so let's ceasefire in the name of having balanced ships before ISD decides to break out the emergency hammers. Is it Hotdrop O'Clock yet?
Covert pilots unite! Safer working conditions, less accidental limb loss due to unfortunate Cyno accidents! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=258986 |
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MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1314
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 17:35:00 -
[881] - Quote
Correct me if I am wrong but does the soe ship have a targeting delay after decloaking? If it does then I dont see the ship as op There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... Winter Expansion new ship request |
XvXTeacherVxV
S.E.N.T.I.N.E.L.
28
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Posted - 2013.10.04 17:41:00 -
[882] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but does the soe ship have a targeting delay after decloaking? If it does then I dont see the ship as op
It doesn't yet so it'll behave more like a force recon than a bomber in this respect. I don't think it should either, that would make ganking things way too easy with these as tackle, not unless they could only use non-covert cloaks. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1080
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 17:46:00 -
[883] - Quote
Nyancat Audeles wrote:This thing is not overpowered. Very few people will realistically fly the 16k EHP glass cannon fit. The few who do will learn the problem with it quickly. I love how people ignore the lock time delay and the lack of damage application to anything below Battleship-class ships.
And you're ignoring the whole "decloak and MWD bump" trick to get past the lock time delay. Even frigates, there are not too many that will be able to align and warp before I can web and scram them after a friendly bump.
As for damage application, it has 5 mids. It's too easy to slap a web or a painter on there, and then you're getting chewed up. I don't care what you think you might be able to do, I can pick my targets, and attack with surprise 95% of the time. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Dehval
Risk Breakers Fidelas Constans
30
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 17:58:00 -
[884] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but does the soe ship have a targeting delay after decloaking? If it does then I dont see the ship as op 6(5) second delay in cloaking isn't that significant. It is certainly not enough time (including lock) to escape if you are in anything but a nano cruiser due to bumping.
A 100% penalty to targeting delay would be enough to appease me. That would give it an average time to lock a cruiser to about 16 seconds. Unlike a scanres nerf it wouldn't adversely affect its PvE potential while nerfing the surprise PvP potential (taking half a minute to lock frigate rats is not an enjoyable experience).
And, we could always reduce the damage, but people are adamant against that idea apparently. I think it is the easiest path to follow and it doesn't involve putting 7-10 different "bonuses" on the ship just to make it work. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1080
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:00:00 -
[885] - Quote
Dehval wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but does the soe ship have a targeting delay after decloaking? If it does then I dont see the ship as op 6(5) second delay in cloaking isn't that significant. It is certainly not enough time (including lock) to escape if you are in anything but a nano cruiser due to bumping. A 100% penalty to targeting delay would be enough to appease me. That would give it an average time to lock a cruiser to about 16 seconds. That way it wouldn't adversely affect its PvE potential while nerfing the surprise PvP potential. And, we could always reduce the damage, but people are adamant against that idea apparently. I think it is the easiest path to follow and it doesn't involve putting 7-10 different "bonuses" on the ship just to make it work.
My suggestion was to roll the 10% into being 5% for drone damage, flight speed, hitpoints, and tracking. Haven't run the numbers yet, however. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1636
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:06:00 -
[886] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Dehval wrote:MeBiatch wrote:Correct me if I am wrong but does the soe ship have a targeting delay after decloaking? If it does then I dont see the ship as op 6(5) second delay in cloaking isn't that significant. It is certainly not enough time (including lock) to escape if you are in anything but a nano cruiser due to bumping. A 100% penalty to targeting delay would be enough to appease me. That would give it an average time to lock a cruiser to about 16 seconds. That way it wouldn't adversely affect its PvE potential while nerfing the surprise PvP potential. And, we could always reduce the damage, but people are adamant against that idea apparently. I think it is the easiest path to follow and it doesn't involve putting 7-10 different "bonuses" on the ship just to make it work. My suggestion was to roll the 10% into being 5% for drone damage, flight speed, hitpoints, and tracking. Haven't run the numbers yet, however. You do realize that applied DPS>raw DPS. Giving the drones tracking, velocity in addition to damage will make the ship more deadly than it already is.
Increasing the targeting delay would work, but I think I am still in favor of reducing the scan resolution. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1080
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:11:00 -
[887] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote: You do realize that applied DPS>raw DPS. Giving the drones tracking, velocity in addition to damage will make the ship more deadly than it already is.
Increasing the targeting delay would work, but I think I am still in favor of reducing the scan resolution.
Applied dps in general does, yes. But think about it as far as fitting goes.
I will already have 3 lowslots dedicated to drone damage. I can't really push that a whole lot farther than it already is.
I can, however, use the ship's plentiful midslots to improve application of damage. By the time I double web (or single web+paint) you, it doesn't matter if I am using Heavy, Medium, or Small drones, they will hit you, they will deliver damage.
I can't get much more benefit from application already. If application improves, the extra midslot this saves me won't be able to be used for damage. That's my rationale. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1636
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:16:00 -
[888] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote: You do realize that applied DPS>raw DPS. Giving the drones tracking, velocity in addition to damage will make the ship more deadly than it already is.
Increasing the targeting delay would work, but I think I am still in favor of reducing the scan resolution.
Applied dps in general does, yes. But think about it as far as fitting goes. I will already have 3 lowslots dedicated to drone damage. I can't really push that a whole lot farther than it already is. I can, however, use the ship's plentiful midslots to improve application of damage. By the time I double web (or single web+paint) you, it doesn't matter if I am using Heavy, Medium, or Small drones, they will hit you, they will deliver damage. I can't get much more benefit from application already. If application improves, the extra midslot this saves me won't be able to be used for damage. That's my rationale. where will the tank on that ship be, you have 3 of 5 lows for damage mods, 2 of 5 mids for web and painter, you will need a point so that makes 3 of 5 add in a prop mod and there is 4 of 5 mids and 3 of 5 lows and no where for a tank. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1080
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:17:00 -
[889] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote: You do realize that applied DPS>raw DPS. Giving the drones tracking, velocity in addition to damage will make the ship more deadly than it already is.
Increasing the targeting delay would work, but I think I am still in favor of reducing the scan resolution.
Applied dps in general does, yes. But think about it as far as fitting goes. I will already have 3 lowslots dedicated to drone damage. I can't really push that a whole lot farther than it already is. I can, however, use the ship's plentiful midslots to improve application of damage. By the time I double web (or single web+paint) you, it doesn't matter if I am using Heavy, Medium, or Small drones, they will hit you, they will deliver damage. I can't get much more benefit from application already. If application improves, the extra midslot this saves me won't be able to be used for damage. That's my rationale. where will the tank on that ship be, you have 3 of 5 lows for damage mods, 2 of 5 mids for web and painter, you will need a point so that makes 3 of 5 add in a prop mod and there is 4 of 5 mids and 3 of 5 lows and no where for a tank.
It's a gank ship. EANM, DC II. That's about enough for my taste. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1636
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:21:00 -
[890] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote: You do realize that applied DPS>raw DPS. Giving the drones tracking, velocity in addition to damage will make the ship more deadly than it already is.
Increasing the targeting delay would work, but I think I am still in favor of reducing the scan resolution.
Applied dps in general does, yes. But think about it as far as fitting goes. I will already have 3 lowslots dedicated to drone damage. I can't really push that a whole lot farther than it already is. I can, however, use the ship's plentiful midslots to improve application of damage. By the time I double web (or single web+paint) you, it doesn't matter if I am using Heavy, Medium, or Small drones, they will hit you, they will deliver damage. I can't get much more benefit from application already. If application improves, the extra midslot this saves me won't be able to be used for damage. That's my rationale. where will the tank on that ship be, you have 3 of 5 lows for damage mods, 2 of 5 mids for web and painter, you will need a point so that makes 3 of 5 add in a prop mod and there is 4 of 5 mids and 3 of 5 lows and no where for a tank. It's a gank ship. EANM, DC II. That's about enough for my taste. gank setups will happen no matter what, and while needing to be considered they are an exception but not the rule. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1080
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:24:00 -
[891] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote: gank setups will happen no matter what, and while needing to be considered they are an exception but not the rule.
O...k?
Then why did you ask me what my tank would be?
Also, I really doubt it will be the exception. This ship screams gank, and since +5 virus strength makes it useless for relic or data sites, it will be combat fit anyway, and with a cov ops cloak, one particular form of combat leaps to mind... Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1637
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:28:00 -
[892] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote: gank setups will happen no matter what, and while needing to be considered they are an exception but not the rule.
O...k? Then why did you ask me what my tank would be? Also, I really doubt it will be the exception. This ship screams gank, and since +5 virus strength makes it useless for relic or data sites, it will be combat fit anyway, and with a cov ops cloak, one particular form of combat leaps to mind... +5 is plenty fine for relic and data sites.
My point was, your setup is a glass cannon and those uber gank setups have been being posted since the start. in this entire thread there has been 1 maybe 2 exploration setups.
If the ship is balanced around a glass cannon setup it will be worthless in every other situation. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1080
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:32:00 -
[893] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Omnathious Deninard wrote: gank setups will happen no matter what, and while needing to be considered they are an exception but not the rule.
O...k? Then why did you ask me what my tank would be? Also, I really doubt it will be the exception. This ship screams gank, and since +5 virus strength makes it useless for relic or data sites, it will be combat fit anyway, and with a cov ops cloak, one particular form of combat leaps to mind... +5 is plenty fine for relic and data sites. My point was, your setup is a glass cannon and those uber gank setups have been being posted since the start. in this entire thread there has been 1 maybe 2 exploration setups. If the ship is balanced around a glass cannon setup it will be worthless in every other situation.
Yeah, my point entirely. I honestly don't care what else it's balanced around, however.
But no, +5 is not enough. T2 cov ops gives +10, and since data and relic sites no longer have rats, the improved combat ability of the SoE cruiser adds nothing except it's huge pricetag to people who want to do those sites.
This ship is for DED sites. And ganking. That's about it, as far as exploration goes, unless they add rats back to relic and data sites in low/nullsec.
So yeah, there aren't many exploration fits. So? It's objectively and obviously inferior in every way possible compared to a cov ops frigate. So people won't use it for that. What point are you trying to make, anyway? Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Soko Lsi
SASART Corporation
21
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:33:00 -
[894] - Quote
"Gank setups are the exception not he rule"
THANK YOU
With the decloak targeting delay and the value of the ship... this whole ganking debate is pointless. Can we move to what type of laser bonus it should have? I vote rate of fire. |
Freako X
Doom Inc
108
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:36:00 -
[895] - Quote
I've said this once before and I'll say it again. I love these ships.
As a gaming community, we tend to focus on the pew in the game. After reading this thread and mulling over the ideas listed by players and CCP I've come to a few conclusions:
1. Exploration for all sites should be the focus. Covert Ops allows for high/low sec players to experiment with worm holes and null. Those players will not have the luxury to swap out ships. So I agree with the explorers (I am not one) and think it will be important for these ships to be viable for all exploration tasks. That means scanning AND pew sites.
2. I don't like lasers. But that's the theme. I think the two turret points on the cruiser with a 100% dmg mod will strongly encourage that theme. I think the 5H slots are needed. Salvager/Covert Ops/Improved Scanner/2x Turrets. 5/5/5 works.
3. The Frigate desperately needs 3 high slots. The same 100% laser bonus would work with one turret hard point as well.
Would I like to support a humanitarian theme? Heck yes. But not at the expense of exploration as that career needs more love. The pew/pew should come into play for the DED sites. Add a covert to target delay larger than most un-bonused ships to discourage them for pvp. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1082
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:38:00 -
[896] - Quote
Soko Lsi wrote:"Gank setups are the exception not he rule"
THANK YOU
With the decloak targeting delay and the value of the ship... this whole ganking debate is pointless. Can we move to what type of laser bonus it should have? I vote rate of fire.
Unfamiliar with the Proteus, I see. Oh, and bump tackling. It's not like a targeting delay actually stops people from ganking in any way, shape or form. Burying your head in the sand, will not help you ignore the hurricane.
It needs the laser bonus completely removed, to be honest, and another bonus slapped on. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1637
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:40:00 -
[897] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: But no, +5 is not enough. T2 cov ops gives +10, and since data and relic sites no longer have rats, the improved combat ability of the SoE cruiser adds nothing except it's huge pricetag to people who want to do those sites.
Covert ops are specialized ships intended for one role they should be better at what they do than all else.
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: This ship is for DED sites. And ganking. That's about it, as far as exploration goes, unless they add rats back to relic and data sites in low/nullsec.
They are for all around exploration not just DED sites, it they were there would be no need for a scanner probe strength bonus and a virus strength bonus.
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: So yeah, there aren't many exploration fits. So? It's objectively and obviously inferior in every way possible compared to a cov ops frigate. So people won't use it for that. What point are you trying to make, anyway?
Players are focusing on exactly ONE aspect of these ships and disregarding all other aspects. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
Soko Lsi
SASART Corporation
21
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:41:00 -
[898] - Quote
Freako X wrote:I've said this once before and I'll say it again. I love these ships.
As a gaming community, we tend to focus on the pew in the game. After reading this thread and mulling over the ideas listed by players and CCP I've come to a few conclusions:
1. Exploration for all sites should be the focus. Covert Ops allows for high/low sec players to experiment with worm holes and null. Those players will not have the luxury to swap out ships. So I agree with the explorers (I am not one) and think it will be important for these ships to be viable for all exploration tasks. That means scanning AND pew sites.
2. I don't like lasers. But that's the theme. I think the two turret points on the cruiser with a 100% dmg mod will strongly encourage that theme. I think the 5H slots are needed. Salvager/Covert Ops/Improved Scanner/2x Turrets. 5/5/5 works.
3. The Frigate desperately needs 3 high slots. The same 100% laser bonus would work with one turret hard point as well.
Would I like to support a humanitarian theme? Heck yes. But not at the expense of exploration as that career needs more love. The pew/pew should come into play for the DED sites. Add a covert to target delay larger than most un-bonused ships to discourage them for pvp.
Thank you for the unbiased analysis.
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Soko Lsi wrote:"Gank setups are the exception not he rule"
THANK YOU
With the decloak targeting delay and the value of the ship... this whole ganking debate is pointless. Can we move to what type of laser bonus it should have? I vote rate of fire. Unfamiliar with the Proteus, I see. Oh, and bump tackling. It's not like a targeting delay actually stops people from ganking in any way, shape or form. Burying your head in the sand, will not help you ignore the hurricane. It needs the laser bonus completely removed, to be honest, and another bonus slapped on.
It's the theme of the ships in this expansion -part Amarr and Amarr = lasers. It's illogical to replace them with something else. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
1082
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:47:00 -
[899] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote: Covert ops are specialized ships intended for one role they should be better at what they do than all else.
Yep, which means they totally invalidate any other ship competing with them for that aspect. Because in relic and data sites, now that there are no rats, there are absolutely no other concerns besides how fast you can get the site done. Since T2 cov ops is the best at that, everything else may as well not apply, especially in null/lowsec.
Quote:They are for all around exploration not just DED sites, it they were there would be no need for a scanner probe strength bonus and a virus strength bonus.
Except that they are worse at relic and data sites, and VASTLY better at DED sites than exploration ships. Clearly, their use is for DED sites. And probe strength benefits DED site running, and ganking, equally well.
Quote:Players are focusing on exactly ONE aspect of these ships and disregarding all other aspects.
Mostly because all the other aspects of the ship are really half assed. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |
epicurus ataraxia
Unchained Industrial Collective Defiance Enterprises
39
|
Posted - 2013.10.04 18:54:00 -
[900] - Quote
+5 is plenty fine for relic and data sites.
You keep stating this time after time as a fact. It isn't It is your opinion, and in my opinion and everyone i have talked to and seen on the forum it is not correct. The difference between the imicus and helios is not an insignificant one, the numbers seem small, the reality is one works the other is totally and i mean totally useless. Why should an explorer ship be crippled into uselessness, why bother,give up, don't release new ships.
I refuse to make this an ad hominem post. You may have your reasons for not seeing this ship succeed, i cannot imagine what they are but please for the sake of reason why make an explorer ship crippled like a newbie frigate at exploring?
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