| Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 30 .. 39 :: one page |
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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |
Lateris
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:04:00 -
[451] - Quote
So the MTS are on the side for now then? Good luck when you release those. |
Brandon Tsero
Lunar Asylum
S I L E N T.
0
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:04:00 -
[452] - Quote
For Faction towers why not just increase the time it takes for it to take in the block instead of having to deal with 2/3 a block?
so the block of a normal one would take an hour to be consumed, and a block of a tier 1 would be a an hour 10 minutes? and a tier 2 an hour 20?
Just the general Idea. |
Kelsi Corynn
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:05:00 -
[453] - Quote
Why not simply scale up the quantity of blocks to allow for the granularity needed to keep the improved faction tower fuel usage? Fuel block manufacture run makes 40 blocks instead of 4, large towers use 40 blocks/hour instead of 4, blocks are 1/10 planned m3, etc. |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp
BricK sQuAD.
134
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:08:00 -
[454] - Quote
Mioelnir wrote:Not to point out the obvious, but why not make 8 blocks per production run (same materials)?
Small tower: 2 blocks / hour
Small pirate tower: 2 blocks / hour, +25% fuel 1 capacity
Small commander tower: 1 block / hour, +50% fuel 1 capacity
Medium tower: 4 blocks / hour
Medium pirate tower: 3 blocks / hour, +25% fuel 1 capacity
Medium commander tower: 2 blocks / hour, +50% fuel 1 capacity
Large tower: 8 blocks / hour
Large pirate tower: 7 blocks / hour, +25% fuel 1 capacity
Large commander tower: 6 blocks / hour, +50% fuel 1 capacity
Sovereignty reduces fuel consumption by 1 block per hour down to a minimum of 1 block per hour (so no free small commander towers in sov systems).
this is what needs to happen. its very simple and sorts out the sov/faction tower issue nice and simply
CCP-áare full of words and no action. We will watch what they are doing, for now
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Neville Smit
EVE University
Ivy League
3
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:10:00 -
[455] - Quote
Thanks, CCP - you are on the right track here, making POS fueling easier to manage. Keep going, please, with this more user-friendly trend!
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex
Cosmic Consortium
269
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:12:00 -
[456] - Quote
Killing off sovereignty fuel savings is not doing null sec industry any favours. Rather than scrapping fuel savings, swap it for increased period of consumption (e.g.: with an active Sov claim, multiply the consumption period by 2). The utility of faction towers in the past wasn't the length of time between refuels, it was the lower cost of operation, to the point that it was worth spending ten times as much on a tower for w-space simply because you wouldn't have to haul in as much fuel.
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Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
70
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:12:00 -
[457] - Quote
Instead of using four blocks per hour, use 16 and building four times as many from each blueprint run?
Quarter the volume, quintuple the quantity used and produced? This is a wonderfully elegant solution! |
Des Jardin
Aperture Harmonics
K162
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:12:00 -
[458] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:faction towers are a solved problem, you multiply the output blocks by 10x or 100x and you have sufficent granularity to do sov and faction towers, presto, no coding changes
Have to agree that this appears to be a simplier solution than what I had proposed. I think 10x or 40 blocks per batch would make sense under this approach.
Only changes that apparently will need to be made would be in how many blocks are pulled per hour by tower type (and the application of sov bonuses).
Of course, the devil is in the code.
"Good against remotes is one thing.-á Good against the living ... that's something else." |
Dirk Smacker
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
8
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:17:00 -
[459] - Quote
Sell Robotics!
SELL!
SELL!
SELL! |
Pesadel0
the muppets
RED.OverLord
20
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:22:00 -
[460] - Quote
Can someone plz in dev team seed POS modules and other stuff in faction rats? or in low plexes. |
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Zaepho
Phoenix Propulsion Labs
RED Citizens
3
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:23:00 -
[461] - Quote
Just wanted to pop in and support some of the recommendations here.
* Fuel Colors - These should match the Racial colors to make it easy to distinguish
* Faction/SOV Fuel Bonuses - These are essential and using a factor of 100 on everything would work perfectly (i.e. produce 400 blocks at 1/100'th the size of current and Towers consume 100 times more cubes than currently proposed) This also brings back fuel as a cargo filler for when you have a little extra space on that jump and nothing to fit in it.
* Rate of Production - These should produce fast. really really fast. We've had 0 time in fuel manufacture previously and now w're adding fuel manufacture (and cost due to production line costs although this is small) the time should be small. Make the time faster or the batch size larger. Possibly bring it up to a full day's worth of fuel for a small tower per batch. The max runs should also be incredibly high. high enough to produce the entire monthly supply for fuel for a standard large tower. |
Rek Esket
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:27:00 -
[462] - Quote
Faction POS don't even drop anymore. Give them a niche secondary benefit and cut your losses. |
Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
70
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:28:00 -
[463] - Quote
Zaepho wrote:Just wanted to pop in and support some of the recommendations here.
* Fuel Colors - These should match the Racial colors to make it easy to distinguish
* Faction/SOV Fuel Bonuses - These are essential and using a factor of 100 on everything would work perfectly (i.e. produce 400 blocks at 1/100'th the size of current and Towers consume 100 times more cubes than currently proposed) This also brings back fuel as a cargo filler for when you have a little extra space on that jump and nothing to fit in it.
* Rate of Production - These should produce fast. really really fast. We've had 0 time in fuel manufacture previously and now w're adding fuel manufacture (and cost due to production line costs although this is small) the time should be small. Make the time faster or the batch size larger. Possibly bring it up to a full day's worth of fuel for a small tower per batch. The max runs should also be incredibly high. high enough to produce the entire monthly supply for fuel for a standard large tower.
100 is a rather large number where four would suffice; four blocks for a small, eight blocks for a medium, sixteen blocks for a large tower per hour.
With faction towers and or a sovereign alliance's fuel consumption reduction, that would be three for a small tower, six for a medium tower, and 12 for a large tower per hour.
On the subject of faction towers, why haven't those been put back into the loot tables yet? |
Palal
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:31:00 -
[464] - Quote
Ummm, I fail to see how this is supposed to make it easier:
I just did the math on the 4 towers that run - cost is basically a wash - but volume is up 10% AND I'm going to have to install some type of manufacturing array to make this fuel.
Is it possible to get 500 more CPU to at least accomodate that additional need? Otherwise - the mind numbing logistics just got a ton more difficult - I now have to move PI fuel to a system with manufacturing and then move it back 
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TorTorden
NorCorp Enterprise
No Holes Barred
2
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:31:00 -
[465] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:faction towers are a solved problem, you multiply the output blocks by 10x or 100x and you have sufficent granularity to do sov and faction towers, presto, no coding changes
I have to sign on this.
For those who suggest a longer cycle time would be rather counterproductive (literally) (without a huge rewrite of how pos's work)
from what I gather from the various data dumps\api feeds etc etc the timer for fuel is also the timer for the pos in general if they would just simply increase the cycle time then they also increase the cycle time for moon miners,reactors etc etc as well.
I also hope the fuel bpo actually will be without ME\PE bonuses (with as low numbers as here you wont see any real benefits for them anyways)
And yet again w-space corps are getting left for an afterthought. (when there realy isn't a type of corp more dependent on starbases) Now we hate hauling as much as the next guy and to minimize hauling we produce as much PI fuel as we possibly can in system, with pellets we are then still going to have to haul the same stuff as before and bake the pellets, or start hauling PI fuel out of system 
CCP: keep in mind, excell (and in my case, MySQL is not afraid of large numbers) |
Sigras
Conglomo
IMPERIAL LEGI0N
28
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:33:00 -
[466] - Quote
#1 i have no idea what people are complaining about as far as their own personal manufacturing is concerned . . . you were perfectly content flying to jita to buy the PI materials . . . why are you now discontent with flying to jita to buy the new fuel cells? Do you think you're the only person who is going to be making them? youll have to pay me 5% but ill put them up in jita for you.
#2 @ CCP, you should definitely look into reducing the time it takes to manufacture, even at perfect skills with good research youre still looking at 6-7 minutes or so of build time which is roughly 5 minutes in a POS array, so which means its going to take a full AAA running for a 24 minutes to fuel a large POS, or you can fuel 5 large POSs running it for 2 hours, but what I suspect most people are going to do is use high sec manufacturing plants and thats going to take up a LOT of manufacturing time . . . just watch the wait time in jita 4-4 go from 1 hour to 1 month over night. |
Callic Veratar
Power of the Phoenix
67
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:35:00 -
[467] - Quote
For those new to the thread who are repeatedly posting the same suggestions, I summarized a lot of them a fair bit earlier here. |
Zaepho
Phoenix Propulsion Labs
RED Citizens
5
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:41:00 -
[468] - Quote
Evelgrivion wrote:
100 is a rather large number where four would suffice; four blocks for a small, eight blocks for a medium, sixteen blocks for a large tower per hour.
I like smaller volume blocks that i can use to fill any empty cargo space on runs/jumps. hence my preference for a large number of blocks. Plus it allows for arbitrary savings percentages down the line which works out nicely. |
Koldri Untham
VOLKODAVY
Order Of The Unforgiving
0
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:42:00 -
[469] - Quote
In order to benefit from faction POS fuel consumption bonus one has to run it for ages, it has already been discussed for thousand times on different forums. I think that the fuel bay bonus is OK. |
Neo Agricola
BLACK-MARK
69
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:44:00 -
[470] - Quote
Koldri Untham wrote:In order to benefit from faction POS fuel consumption bonus one has to run it for ages, it has already been discussed for thousand times on different forums. I think that the fuel bay bonus is OK.
Yeah and a lot of other think they are not OK, even if they dont have a 2 bil Faction Tower...
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Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
301
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:45:00 -
[471] - Quote
1 day of manuf time to create 30 days of fuel for a large tower, would probably be about right. That would be reduced in an AAA. So if you had say (5) large towers, you could generate enough fuel for all of your towers for a month with only 5 days of time using a single slot in a station (or about 3-4 days in an AAA). The current 5 days to make 30 days of fuel is too long for sure.
(If the ratio of days of manuf vs days of consumption is 1:30 or 1:40, I don't think manuf time is going to be a big factor. You just run a few hours of "make fuel pellets" and you have your fuel for the week/month.)
The pellets probably need to be dropped in size about 10% smaller then first proposed rather then make the POS tower fuel bays larger. A 20% compression from source material -> fuel pellet size would work well and would reduce the logistics needed (probably enough to offset the extra moving stuff around to make the pellets). So instead of 50 m3 (or 0.5 m3 if you go the 100x route), go with 40 or 45 m3 (or 0.40-0.45 m3).
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Crias Taylor
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
40
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:45:00 -
[472] - Quote
Longer cycle times is very likely not reasonable request at this point. It is also an incredible dumb idea cause you will have to do math to figure how long the cycle is instead of 1 hour = 1 cycle. Instead going to 40 or 400 leaves it simple and the ability to keep one of the very few benefits to owning sov instead of giving empire yet another advantage over nullsec for production.
TL;DR great ideas but the block amount that does not allow for fuel savings is a huge empire buff. |
Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
34
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:45:00 -
[473] - Quote
20-odd pages (Why?!?!) late to the discussion, but as a fairly experienced POS operator running several POS I have a few comments to make regarding your planned changes:
GÇó I like the new fuel blocks in principle, the icons are quite pretty looking like jelly cubes.
GÇó The transition seems fair enough to me, but ongoing this is yet another manufacturing stage and you're actually complicating the fuel process chain from raw P0 planet material and reprocessed ice cube to a final manufactured item by another production step.
GÇó I hope you will take great care to ensure blueprints for Fuel blocks can't be researched
GÇó Please ensure fuel blocks can be reprocessed as usual into 100% of the constituent components
GÇó Anchoring time changes are great but as was pointed out it makes disabling POS guns rather pointless in POS fight
GÇó I'd suggest increasing the fuel block usage / production by a factor of 10 so that you can actually reduce usage and scale the faction POS to use 10 blocks for a normal Small tower, and 9 for a faction tower for example. The maths is still much easier.
Some other general comments I'd like to make:
GÇó POS functionality really needs splitting up when you do the re-write. Right now the POS is a Swiss army knife of functionality from moon mining, to manufacturing, to refining, to drug production , reacting and strategic defense starbase. Until you divide up the functionality in terms of differing fuel costs, anchor times and critically (hitpoints).... POS will remain a major annoyance for many, many players by being a nuisance to remove, horrible look at and an interface nightmare confusing new players and frustrating old ones.
GÇó Please do something about the nuisance of annoying patch speculators. Already all the Heavy Water has been bought up and is being resold at 5 times the pre-announcement price. I know these things generally take care of themselves, but have you ever considered putting a limit on the amount of 1 product a player can purchase in one day to stop this kind of metagame?
GÇó I am looking forward to seeing plans for the next POS changes. I was a great supporter of the Dead Horse thread, but now believe some Lego modular starbase may not be as elegant imagine all the new art!) or interesting as a range of different structures for the different POS functions. I think diversifying POS functionality could be a good way of promoting/providing smaller targets to attack aswell if done correctly rather than some mammoth tower only Seiged dreads can dent in a reasonable timeframe.
GÇó All in all a good blog. Looking forward to the patch. Cheers. |
Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
31
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:47:00 -
[474] - Quote
Remove faction POS from the game completely. |
Bagehi
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises
Important Internet Spaceship League
13
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:49:00 -
[475] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:Ciar Meara wrote:Most important sentence:
"While we're waiting to do a proper rewrite of the starbase system"
Give us a modular POS, like the great flogger of the dead horse in the sky saw in his dreams! Agree, let's do exactly this.
Soundwave. Causing players to love him one reply at a time. |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp
BricK sQuAD.
134
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Posted - 2011.11.07 21:50:00 -
[476] - Quote
Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Remove faction POS from the game completely.
Remove SOV from the game completely. as there both effected
CCP-áare full of words and no action. We will watch what they are doing, for now
|
Rek Esket
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:00:00 -
[477] - Quote
Neo Agricola wrote:Koldri Untham wrote:In order to benefit from faction POS fuel consumption bonus one has to run it for ages, it has already been discussed for thousand times on different forums. I think that the fuel bay bonus is OK. Yeah and a lot of other think they are not OK, even if they dont have a 2 bil Faction Tower...
Know what else is not okay? Defining the production cost of a very thin market like Fullerides by something that doesn't drop in the game anymore.
It's T2 BPOs again. |
Makari Aeron
The Shadow's Of Eve
TSOE Consortium
0
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:05:00 -
[478] - Quote
THANK YOU T_T
Smoky the Jove Says: Only CCP can ruin EVE. |
Doctor Ungabungas
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
32
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:07:00 -
[479] - Quote
Smoking Blunts wrote:Doctor Ungabungas wrote:Remove faction POS from the game completely. Remove SOV from the game completely. as there both effected
I'm not sure if you're aware, but they removed the POS requirements for sov in a little patch a few years ago. |
AkJon Ferguson
JC Ferguson and Son Ltd
Ferguson Alliance
6
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Posted - 2011.11.07 22:09:00 -
[480] - Quote
This 'fuel blocks' idea is ******* horrible. WTF are you thinking??? Leave POS fuel alone. Stop breaking what works ffs.
Rest is okay. |
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