You realise you then have a 10-40 minute timer depending on indices AFTER the first cycle is finished that you need to keep running your link on that structure for right?

edit: and which can be reversed by a defensive link back to zero if you just run away

If even a few of those timers are successful, it can disrupt a region and require hours of 'grinding' the command nodes back to the original state.

Sov is hard, its suppose to be. I don't agree with the current system, but making it into a laughing stock of "okay during this 4 hours we need 100 Frigates to remove Sov" isn't going to make it fun, its going to make it more of a pain. A game of "okay whoever collects the most nodes the fastest wins". Not to mention ignoring a few of the other unpleasant things in the game that people have been screaming about for years.

I think this is an okay start, but the new changes as is are seriously lacking thought and easily abused by loop-holers. I would prefer to see this held off til a more thought out system has been planned, not a rushed patch fix.

Exactly so who's worse off, the alliance with hundreds of systems and timers to worry about (and manage their fleet distribution and defence over) or the one with just two or three?

Goons know this is gonna bend them over backwards logistically - just one bad day and they then need to deal with potentially hundreds or even thousands of timers to grind down in their own space.

won't take us four hours to RF the entire region, just 30 minutes

Exactly so who's worse off, the alliance with hundreds of systems and timers to worry about (and manage their fleet distribution and defence over) or the one with just two or three?

Goons know this is gonna bend them over backwards logistically - just one bad day and they then need to deal with potentially hundreds or even thousands of timers to grind down in their own space.

edit: And aside from spy intel, they don't know which one's are gonna escalate.

Stop with the mittani trollceptor.

A single ship with a link is enough to counter your ridiculous wing of trollceptor.

We can dump several hundred of them on you for fun. Several thousand if someone kicks the hive.

On a single sov sure, but you cant be everywhere.

Numbers are numbers, if you want to take a specific sov with your armada, i hope you still be able to do it

Stop with the mittani trollceptor.

A single ship with a link is enough to counter your ridiculous wing of trollceptor.

We can dump several hundred of them on you for fun. Several thousand if someone kicks the hive.

The small alliances who get swamped by fleets of 200 interceptors and get their iHubs blown up constantly, that's who loses. This does not hurt goons, they don't care if their unused space is burned. It's easy for people to jump in and take sov, but it's also too easy to completely disrupt an active community in a constellation.

If the changes goes through like they are now, I'm unironically going to take a 200 man interceptor fleet to Provi and reinforce the entire region in 4 hours.

On a single sov sure, but you cant be everywhere.

Why are they going to bother with small alliances when they could be doing it to their main competitors instead? If they don't need the space and it's not a strategic objective?

Sure they'll probably go on a great big rampage across the whole of nullsec at the start and try to flip everything just to throw their weight around and show that the mechanic is broken but ultimately it achieves nothing for them if they're so easily flipped back again once their attention is elsewhere.

Now if their big neighbours who aren't so 4chan memeworthy griefers actually start using it as a strategic way to harrass and subdue the hive then that's where they'll start pouring their own efforts in return.

So yes, you'll occasionally get sand thrown in your face by the playground bully but a week later it'll all be back to normal.

Why would 200 inteceptors bother with small alliances? Because why not! Let's make that 20 man alliance lose their systems because we can. You don't realize the extend of this. If an ihub blows up it requires a FREIGHTER to get a new one. Now, imagine these systems are 15 jumps into null sec. Not every alliance has the ISK for a Titan to shortcut those freighters.

On a single sov sure, but you cant be everywhere.

Exactly, why not, just for lols...then you realise that it's not very much lols orbitting something with a laser for 40 minutes and running away as soon as a defensive fleet shows up and stop doing it. Thanks for confirming.

Exactly, why not, just for lols...then you realise that it's not very much lols orbitting something with a laser for 40 minutes and running away as soon as a defensive fleet shows up and stop doing it. Thanks for confirming.

Exactly, why not, just for lols...then you realise that it's not very much lols orbitting something with a laser for 40 minutes and running away as soon as a defensive fleet shows up and stop doing it. Thanks for confirming.

We rapecaged an entire system for a week to deadzone it. 40 min is nothing to us.

The sovereignty system Fozzie described in the dev blog he wrote is extremely poorly thought and half baked. CCP should just take it back to the drawing board and rethink. Meanwhile, perhaps they would also do well to review their assumptions about EVE players and how they behave and plan their actions in game. I'm going to write more about what I think are the peripheral causes as to why Fozzie and others are constantly failing later. For now, I'd like to elaborate on what I think is the central cause behind the dev team's shortsightedness.

It might be just that the faulty line of thought on the dev team's part is assuming that these poorly designed changes will result in people fighting more. I think they are expecting that they can really change bloc (and individual player) behavior solely through changing rules and mechanics and avoiding touching risk-reward balance.

They are wrong.

For instance, as Arrendis mentioned before, Encounter Surveillance Systems weren't adopted en masse by null residents. They were supposed to create fights. Because they did not see any serious adoption, not many fights were created through them.

Has any developer ever thought about why they weren't adopted by null residents?

More importantly, why is Fozzie's dev blog containing statistics makes him sound like an apologist, or worse, a distressed middle-level executive trying to defend his design through cooking up his numbers, when his plan obviously failed to achieve the intended objectives? If you look at the number carefully, Fozzie is only able to say 'hurray, my plan is doing okay and null sec pvp-related player deaths increased', because Pandemic Legion got bored and decided to farm HERO coalition. I especially laughed out loud and ended up spilling the Turkish coffee I've been sipping when I saw that Deklein region, the place I live in and the revered Goon homeland, has seen PvP related losses decrease by 20% since Phoebe and Jump Fatigue hit. Fozzie isn't just doing a terrible job at re-imagining sovereignty, he is also doing a terrible job at covering his own back so that he and his plan can look good to his immediate superiors who no doubt track his so called progress.

I have said this before when Greyscale announced plans for Phoebe before and I'll say it again;

No amount of change and skewing of sandbox mechanics towards a theme park setting will result in players fighting and causing destruction just for the sake of doing so. People also will not fight and create destruction just so that Fozzie and CCP are appeased and are able to recite statistics without good analysis.

Holding space in null is currently is not worth much for all the effort and resources it takes. Even with these changes, it will still not be worth it.

EVE players will always collaborate, cooperate to minimize risks, and the instances of fights that they do not want to take.

The structures that make up the large entities cannot and will not be dismantled through the change of game play mechanics. You cannot change human behavior and tendency to socialize, cooperate and collude to further mutual goals through introducing ~bright ideas~ like this.

We need developers that are ruthlessly pragmatic and in possesion of first-hand knowledge and experience of life in nullsec to fix nullsec, not developers moonlighting as bright idea fairies that don't know the game and the mechanics they are working on. It's the second type of developers who always end up with introducing Hail Mary plans that are destined to fail like this one.

And you were talking about doing this across the whole of the south, that's 40 minutes for every structure in the south of the map...

What about the other 51 of the year?

And you were talking about doing this across the whole of the south, that's 40 minutes for every structure in the south of the map...

that is because siphons do practically nothing

being able to pop an ihub by using a halitosis module means that you set back the sov index 100 days, wipe out the industrial/military index, and require between one and nine freighters to visit the system, per ihub you pop

this is considerably more significant than making 8m isk/hr with a mandatory twice a day login by siphoning a moon

You really have no feel for just how masochistic we are, have you? :)