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New Dev Blog: Speed Rebalanced by Nozh

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 15 post(s)
whisk The Scope	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:03:00 - [481] Originally by: Stiletto Minmatar Character for Sale LVL 5 RECON HIGH NAV SKILLS 2 x POLY RIGGED RAPIERS 2 X POLY RIGGED VAGA 1 isk or best offer, CCP this is the most lame idea ever, This will become BLOB Online, What fun is that, This kill all Solo and Small Gang warfare which is enjoyable way of combat, Why not boost missles instead of nerfing Minmatar, I like roaming in small gangs now with this being implement that gone out of the window, If this goes ahead then my 5 accounts would be closed, unless you rebalance all time and isk i spent maximised a minmatar character which main bonus reley on speed to survive, Boycott this Dam idea ill take it
Kazuma Saruwatari Caldari	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:03:00 - [482] Originally by: Crumplecorn Originally by: Astria Tiphareth You're not thinking outside the box. A warp scrambler will have zero effect on an afterburner. Propose that ABs get a small increase if you feel they're too slow. This is a joke. I can tell from some of the absurdity and from having seen a lot of jokes in my time. I see what you did there. @ CCP Do not destroy ships that are meant for this kind of speed warfare with this. Else, they lose their point. Similar to what the Pilgrim has turned into. Lets not have another Pilgrim please. -
Pushtan Ministry of Destruction Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:04:00 - [483] Originally by: Stiletto Minmatar Character for Sal If this goes ahead then my 5 accounts would be closed, unless you rebalance all time and isk i spent maximised a minmatar character which main bonus reley on speed to survive, Boycott this Dam idea rofl, again...im gonna start counting the quit threads. The only way you can play eve is with vagas and stuff?? jesus...sad..
Abriana Overlord Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:04:00 - [484] I have seen a few good points raised by peeps in this thread I like the idea of scripts for webbers (range or % velocity decrease) I do agree that changes need to be made to warp disruptors also to easy to stay out of scram range tbh spanking mwd and effectively holding target there, me thinks of vaga
Solid Trust Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:04:00 - [485] As person that enjoys flying in small gangs i don't care if you nerfed speed in half. The only thing that matters to me is that small gangs can continue to exist in nullsec. If you make so it is harder to roam in small gangs then I consider those changes to be an utter failure. However, if you can nerf speed and increase the ability for small gangs to exist then I am all for it. The Solo player has died long ago. Are we now trying to kill the small gang?
Astria Tiphareth Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:04:00 - [486] Originally by: Riho have you ever tryd to AB a megathron ??? have you ??? smaller blaster ships like deimos.... MYBE can do something whit a AB.. but a AB on hype/mega is soo useless its the same as whitout it True, but how about instead of complaining that they're fixing a game-wide problem, focus on the specific issues those fixes cause and how to address them. Of course blaster boats should remain viable. How about doing something constructive and suggesting how, because if you can't be bothered to do that, leave it to CCP because they clearly at least are prepared to think about EVE and its issues. ___ My views may not represent those of my corporation or alliance, which is why I never get invited to those diplomatic parties...
Dissociactive Solar Dragons SOLAR FLEET	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:05:00 - [487] Edited by: Dissociactive on 25/07/2008 15:05:17 CCP suxx leave my vaga alone! i'm sellin' my char and tryin' to leave those stupid game pew pew
Essque Starlancers	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:05:00 - [488] CCP, you are practically ruining the only part that was fun in PvP - guerilla warfare, if only some of the changes make it on TQ. Why every patch encourage people to blob even more? Your cluster doesn't support many ships on the same grid, and you know it better than anyone. Or at least you should. Then why?! I understand that some speeds are over the top, but you simply go much too far. There is absolutely no reason left to fly a Minmatar or Gallente HAC if you can't speed tank, because they can't tank otherwise. Simple as. A Vagabond should still be able to fly 4 Km/s after your nerf (with tech II mods only, no implants) otherwise you practically killed it. I never post in such threads, but this goes way over the top. You are killing the game for thousands of people, which are your long term customers and give in to forum whines. Poor show. I'm not giving up hope yet, but the changes proposed in the dev blog are the worst changes in game in the last 3 years by far. You don't have my support. Any nerf to speed with more than 20% will take away 95% of the fun thousands of us have in PVP. Not to mention the ISK many have spend for expensive speed boosting mods or implants. At least give us some real alternatives, and boost the afterburners. Or just make the MWDs eat more cap and leave the rest unchanged. It's easy to balance what you call ludicrous speeds. You're taking the wrong approach. A boost to ABs and a nerf to the MWDs cap consumption (with Interceptors getting a build-in bonus) will fix all problems you think you have. Very, very bad move.
Kyusoath Orillian Viziam	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:05:00 - [489] "If one then takes a look at the max velocity on missiles and drones, it is readily apparent that our combat system was never designed for such speeds. Even when we did some basic tests on our internal servers, with special high-speed missiles, we quickly noticed Destiny (our physics engine) behaving very strangely." "Polycarbon engine housings are overpowered, both in general and with regard to corresponding modules; this is because the tech1 version is currently more effective than a tech2 nanofiber. Following our changes weÆre looking at them being 30% less effective than their module counterparts, which is more similar to the difference between modules and rigs in other categories." quotes taken from latest dev blog. the bolded text is 2 examples of things the nano cowards have been saying the exact opposite of for a long time. some of them actually convinced themselves that 'nano is fine'. so CCP finally sees sense. all those lovely nano tears will taste sweet. i have read some of the whines already, that CCP is giving in to 'people who can't adapt' , amazing that they will turn their own logic on its head to suit their arguments , its your turn to adapt now. i foresee this making a vast wave of ships that were simply not viable in the nano age have a place. deimos? an ishtar with a tank!, pretty much any ship you could not nano will have a reason to be flown. this is the greatest change eve has witnessed in a long time, finally some balance, finally i think CCP is actually playing the game and seeing what is happening. thank you CCP PS : i will buy your ***abonds at base mineral price in rens, just put the contract.
Lil'Bunneh FoFo Uranus Assault Team	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:05:00 - [490] Originally by: CCP Wrangler For those of you who consider yourself to be Speedy Gonzales and enjoy travelling in Ludicrous speed this blog may come as a bit of a shock. There are ways to travel way too fast in EVE and Nozh has written a blog detailing why that is bad and what we'll do about it, read it all, and check the graphs, in Speed Rebalanced. Dear CCP, How about no. <3 FoFo
Arthmandar Valikari Gallente	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:05:00 - [491] As a mission-running carebear who uses the Ishtar as ship of choice, I have a concern with the web nerf -- there are several missions (World's Collide, Shipyard Theft vs. Angels, etc.) where the following situation holds: 1) the jump in point is camped by multiple web/scram tackler frigs and significant DPS 2) loosing drones gets you lots of bonus aggro and a quick, violent death The only way I have found to handle these is to fit guns and a web, and kill these tacklers without drones before I die, so I can run away and manage drone aggro. I am concerned that the web nerf will make it very hard for larger ships (non-marauders) to deal with these fast, hard-hitting, lockdown style tacklers in PvE. If drones weren't able to draw aggro without firing on a target, this would solve my concern, and would be my recommendation of choice, but I'm open to alternatives. Frankly, it would make a lot of PvE better, if drones were ignored by NPCs until they did something violent.
Stiletto	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:06:00 - [492] Originally by: Pushtan Originally by: Stiletto Minmatar Character for Sal If this goes ahead then my 5 accounts would be closed, unless you rebalance all time and isk i spent maximised a minmatar character which main bonus reley on speed to survive, Boycott this Dam idea rofl, again...im gonna start counting the quit threads. The only way you can play eve is with vagas and stuff?? jesus...sad.. No you f**** idiot, i Spec in what my character is good for, So you nerf what i'm Spec in and i'm as usefull as a two day on Newb, I rather be spec than a ** like yourself
Sakura Nihil Stimulus	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:06:00 - [493] Originally by: CCP Nozh Death to small roaming gangs - Small roaming gangs existed long before polycarbon engine housings and snake sets. Sure we're reducing the maximum speed achievable but you'll still be able to go a lot faster than a standard MWD fit with various speed mods. Nozh, read my post. Small roaming gangs may have existed before polys, but the situation in 0.0 has changed dramatically since then. Click me! You know you want to...
lebrata	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:07:00 - [494] Originally by: Astria Tiphareth Originally by: Dungar Loghoth Originally by: CCP Nozh Death to small roaming gangs - Small roaming gangs existed long before polycarbon engine housings and snake sets. Sure we're reducing the maximum speed achievable but you'll still be able to go a lot faster than a standard MWD fit with various speed mods. What the **** kind of an argument is this? Erm, a valid one? Care to actually counter it? Why is somebody like you who obviously does not pvp so passionate about this nerf wny do you care as it obviously does not effect whatever it is you do in eve?.
Matrix Skye Caldari	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:07:00 - [495] Originally by: THRASHER23 "For those of you who consider yourself to be Speedy Gonzales and enjoy travelling in Ludicrous speed this blog may come as a bit of a shock." Next time you want feed back on a controversial nerf that you obviously are bias to try not to come off so condescending. Pot meets keetle. Dont't like being condescended upon? You just learned something new, didn'tcha.
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:07:00 - [496] Originally by: CCP Nozh Close range tracking, blasters, webbies, etc. - Disabling the MWD + -60% speed reduction is far more effective than the old -90% webifier. This of course only applies to MWD targets. Afterburner targets will be less vulnerable to close range damage dealing ships, but that's part of the change, the verity. Smaller faster moving targets will have a better chance of evading death, but I'm sure drones on blaster boats will come in handy here. Is this supposed to be a reassurance regarding blasterboats? All it states is: Blasterboats can be stopped dead in the water. Other ships using MWDs can be too, but ships with ABs will happily stay out of range and kill you. That's just part of the change. Perhaps the drones on your blasterboat will be useful. So basically the situation for MWD boats is that there are going to be a group of targets which you can neither catch nor hold in place to kill, so they dictate range and can disengage at will. That sounds familiar... - DesuSigs
Estel Arador Minmatar	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:08:00 - [497] Nice proposal. It'll be interesting to see the effects ingame. Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk!
Sakura Nihil Stimulus	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:08:00 - [498] Originally by: Solid Trust As person that enjoys flying in small gangs i don't care if you nerfed speed in half. The only thing that matters to me is that small gangs can continue to exist in nullsec. If you make so it is harder to roam in small gangs then I consider those changes to be an utter failure. However, if you can nerf speed and increase the ability for small gangs to exist then I am all for it. The Solo player has died long ago. Are we now trying to kill the small gang? This, a thousand times over. Click me! You know you want to...
Astria Tiphareth Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:08:00 - [499] Edited by: Astria Tiphareth on 25/07/2008 15:09:03 Edited by: Astria Tiphareth on 25/07/2008 15:08:31 Originally by: lebrata Why is somebody like you who obviously does not pvp so passionate about this nerf wny do you care as it obviously does not effect whatever it is you do in eve?. Hahahahahah. Oh that made my day. Learn to read. What part of being in the faction militia of the Amarr are you have trouble with? I PvP regularly, including against nano-ships. I do have some vague clue, thank you. Post with your main. ___ My views may not represent those of my corporation or alliance, which is why I never get invited to those diplomatic parties...
Pushtan Ministry of Destruction Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:09:00 - [500] for those claiming 'SOLO PVP IS DEAD, MAN!!!' erm...how? ony for you idiots that only know how to fly minnie recons and hac's....how about say, solo roaming in a BS...I dont see a problem with BS combat, tbqfh, or me, i like to roam in a BC any kind, as i can fly them all, as much as an Arazu...more so now So, learn and TRY NEW METHODS...hell, a tanked vaga works - proof is on the MOD KB's...it tanks gateguns ffs....grow some balls and get some tactics
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:09:00 - [501] I love you ccp, this is a great change! The best part? I'll still be able to hit 8000 m/s which is more than I need with a MWD, why are people super whining about this change? you can still go fast as hell. Also I love you for -X-Instinct boosters cause a reduction in signature radius, rather than an increased base velocity.-omg YES FINALLY! -Marauders will probably get their web bonus boosted -BADASS -interceptors aren't getting any slower woohoo! only bad thing I have to say is feel pity on the blaster boats. maybe replace the tracking bonus the mega has in this new slower world with a 100% boost to afterburner speed? that's what I would do!
Korinn The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:09:00 - [502] Originally by: Dungar Loghoth Originally by: CCP Nozh Death to small roaming gangs - Small roaming gangs existed long before polycarbon engine housings and snake sets. Sure we're reducing the maximum speed achievable but you'll still be able to go a lot faster than a standard MWD fit with various speed mods. What the **** kind of an argument is this? Edit: Small roaming gangs were effective before snakes and polys because ships had half as much HP, didn't fit 3 plates, and RR wasn't really an effective strategy because logistics ships didn't exist. Don't forget dungar, large bs gangs have _always_ had capitals for remote rep support and alliances have brought 100 people to combat a 20 man roaming gang since the first day of eve
Cpt Cosmic	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:09:00 - [503] giving a module (scrambler) two abilities (stop from warping and using mwd) is way too unbalanced.
Mitsuni Abashadoni Minmatar The Establishment Establishment	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:09:00 - [504] Originally by: CCP Nozh [snippeth] Death to small roaming gangs - Small roaming gangs existed long before polycarbon engine housings and snake sets. Sure we're reducing the maximum speed achievable but you'll still be able to go a lot faster than a standard MWD fit with various speed mods. Yes, they did. Then came the massive blobbing in 0.0, and people changed their tactics. You used to be able to roam around in small gangs with conventional setups (tanking), but these days, you can't. Hit one target, and voila, you're camped in for 5 hours with a blob hanging around. Speed gets you out of these situations. And saying that you're only reducing the maximum speed is fine, but you're still giving any ship carrying a 7.5km scrambler the opportunity of ruining that speed, and there's no counter to that (except staying out of range). And ceptors will be made quicker; let's see how this pans out on Sisi, but seems to me that you'll have quite a few ceptors who's only role will be to be quick, and to disable people's mwds. And then there's the Arazu, which will have a quite large "Zoot zoot, there goes your MWD" -zone. Add up this, and you don't really NEED 90% web anymore, so saying "Well, look, we made webifiers less effective" doesn't really help. Reduce speed across the board, fine. Giving people a "ops, you have no MWD"-button, not fine. There are allready other mechanisms in place that will achieve that without the added benefit of a scrambler aswell. If you think this will be of any positive change for the small gangs, you really haven't done much 0.0 small gang roaming in the last year. If you want 0.0 fleet battles that are laggy at best, and unplayable at worst, then fine, that's ok, but at least have the decency of saying so. Rant off.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:10:00 - [505] Originally by: Arthmandar Valikari As a mission-running carebear who uses the Ishtar as ship of choice, I have a concern with the web nerf -- there are several missions (World's Collide, Shipyard Theft vs. Angels, etc.) where the following situation holds: 1) the jump in point is camped by multiple web/scram tackler frigs and significant DPS 2) loosing drones gets you lots of bonus aggro and a quick, violent death The only way I have found to handle these is to fit guns an get on sis and run the missiuon again this monday, if you can't kill them with the web nerf then complain and ccp will listen. HOwever I don't think PvE is going to change much.d a web, and kill these tacklers without drones before I die, so I can run away and manage drone aggro. I am concerned that the web nerf will make it very hard for larger ships (non-marauders) to deal with these fast, hard-hitting, lockdown style tacklers in PvE. If drones weren't able to draw aggro without firing on a target, this would solve my concern, and would be my recommendation of choice, but I'm open to alternatives. Frankly, it would make a lot of PvE better, if drones were ignored by NPCs until they did something violent.
Bfoster Minmatar Rising Federation	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:11:00 - [506] "Webifiers Currently when youÆre webbed itÆs pretty much game over unless youÆre doing more DPS or have a better tank. The 90% speed reduction makes combat too static and predictable when webifiers have been applied. To address this, webifiers in our proposed changes have been reduced in effectiveness down to between -50% and -60%" That has to be the stupidest thing I have ever read from a DEV team, EVER!!! Ok, I didn't bring the right tools to a fight, I still deserve a chance to win... WTF? Ok my ship doesn't have enough fire power and isn't strong enough, but I deserve a chance to win? I don't do much PVP, but web is the one thing that helps me control the speed ships a little, if you nerf that.. All I can say is im glad I didnt do the 3 month subscription...
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:11:00 - [507] Originally by: Lorna Loot Originally by: Shadowsword Originally by: Lorna Loot Originally by: Astria Tiphareth Guerilla warfare isn't about small gang facing down big blob. Read up on what it is. Lol are you stupid? That is exactly what guerilla warfare is. You are stupid. Guerilla warfare is about hitting where the enemy isn't in strength. It's NOT a frontal charge against overwhelming numbers. Originally by: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guerrilla_warfare Guerrilla warfare is the unconventional warfare and combat with which a small group of combatants use mobile tactics (ambushes, raids, etc.) to combat a larger and less mobile formal army. The guerrilla army uses ambush (draw enemy forces to terrain unsuited to them) and mobility (advantage and surprise) in attacking vulnerable targets in enemy territory. Nanos v RR BS blob are pretty useless without massive ECM support. STRATEGIC mobility, not tactical one. A guerilleros, oh ignorant one, strike unprotected targets and run away before the army come. He doesn't engage the army in a frontal assault and expect to win by magically being able to run faster than bullets. ------------------------------------------
Lee ChanKa Most Wanted INC G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:11:00 - [508] great job great!!!!! 1. im not nano pilot look mine loses on goods kb 2. **ing macroer on belt or any other person IS HARD 2 CACH EVEN WITH POLYCARBON NANOFIBER SHIP and now with tanked inty r hac or dictor it will be more ED + if he put point on you you are dead in maximum 3 salva SO MACROES PLEASE BUY ALL TOBIAS WARP DISTRUPTOR AND YOU ARE SAFE IF SOMETHING CACH YOU BEFORE YOU LOG OF ON BELT(DIDNT KNOW THET MACROES HAWE SO STRONG LOBY IN CCP) 3. ROAMING I CAN IMAGINE ROMAING GANG OF RR BS OR TANKED HACS COMAND-you come in hostile region large bubble tec 2 on g8 and TITAN CLOAKED IN GRID JUST NEAD 2 PRES DD AND YOUR ALL GANG **ED + if you even reaproch thet titan with some magic or ms or anything till your frends come you are toasted from he or hes snipers 4. SOLO ROAMING-im roaming 90% of time solo or 95%-if i cach anything after 8 hours roaming it will be intresting!!!and if NOT-AFTER I JUMP IN 4 IDIOTS G8 CAMP WITH 1 INTI AND 3 BS IM DEAD THET IS PERFECT OH I LOVE YOU EVE YOU MAKE GAME BETHER!! NOW ALL LETC BUY LARGE BUBBLES TANKED HACS AND SNIPERS AND LETC CAMP SOME G8S THET IS SO FUN!!!!SUPERCAPS ARE COOL TO HAWE ALSO AND NO!!!!IM NOT SARCASTIC!!!
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:11:00 - [509] Originally by: CCP Nozh ...this is what four of us came up with during the course of a mere five hour meeting on the current speed crisis: Sorry to say, but maybe think a bit more before you propose these changes? Especially since more than 90% of your whole playerbase is affected... That is really not well thought out and the quick and evading answers "we will monitor sisi once the changes are implemented there" show clearly that you have no idea and forecast how and what all is affected then. How can you think about a fundamental game change in such a way? And the comment "pvp existed long before snakes and polycarbons" is just ignorant. I thought you would want to IMPROVE Eve. Maybe you just should throw away all the changes of the last 4 years? PvP existed back then also... 5 hours, lol
Daelin Blackleaf The Reclaimed	Posted - 2008.07.25 15:12:00 - [510] A note on the complaints about blobbing: With CCP looking to shift 0.0 warfare towards an FWlike multiple objective affair the huge blobs we see today will be a much rarer sight (though of course they will be found wherever a single significant target presents itself such as a bunker or baby titan). On the whole these look like some very good changes, speed set-ups retain their strategic advantage while it becomes harder for them to kill targets while going untouched themselves. Close range ships will not be at such a huge disadvantage vs ships of a larger class, and frigates especially will be able to fit for sub-10km combat without it being near complete suicide. I do worry about the effect this will have on the Hyena, Rapier, and Huggin though and I can't actually fly any of them.

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